Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Miscellaneous/2007 May 16

= May 16 =

"Direct Descendant"???
This question has been moved to the appropriate desk i.e. Humanities which deals with society. You can find it here: Reference_desk/Humanities. --Eptypes 06:49, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Year 12 Jumpers
Hi, I'm wondering if anyone can recommend a good company (must be in Australia, preferably Vic) to order custom Year 12 jumpers - you know the type, with all your names on the back and stuff. Thanks! --124.181.74.161 07:53, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * yeah go to www.mbarq.com.au, they do great custom made jumpers, not the usual boring ones!


 * As usual, I am of no help. I was just wondering if someone could explain to this Yankee what a Year 12 jumper is.  I'm guessing it's some sort of clothing...?  Dismas |(talk) 08:33, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * It is indeed some sort of clothing. It's a recent tradition in Australian state high schools that year 12 students (ie, Seniors) get a Rugby Jersey-style jumper with their name or nickname, the year, the name of the school, and possibly the entire class list for that year printed on it. FiggyBee 08:55, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Okay, thanks. That helped a lot.  It also helps that I looked up jumper and saw that the word has different definitions outside the U.S. I couldn't comprehend a co-ed class full of students wearing what I think of as a jumper.  :-)  Dismas |(talk) 09:19, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * "Two countries separated by a common language" indeed. :P FiggyBee 12:14, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

After that little exercise in Yankee enlightenment, we might get back to the question. I don't think recommendation of particular companies is appropriate here, but you will find dozens of listings under "Screen Printers" in the Melbourne Yellow Pages, either hard copy or online, many with web sites. --Prophys 12:53, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I got one for my year 6 graduation, too. Froglars the frog 15:30, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * It's a tradition in Brazil as well, but with T-shirts instead. A.Z. 01:44, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

race change
i've heard of sex changes, but is there such thing as a race change? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 75.111.190.135 (talk) 08:47, 16 May 2007 (UTC).


 * Michael Jackson certainly isn't as black as he used to be. On a less dramatic scale, there is skin whitening and the conk.  However, I believe most modern biologists and anthropologists would say that you cannot literally change what race you are, because there's no objective meaning of race in the first place. FiggyBee 09:04, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * It depends on your definition of race. Is it the objective standard of skin colour and body features, or is it the social construct of different customs, beliefs, and attitudes? Either way, I believe it would be possible to "change race". - 2-16 12:14, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Those who believe in some kind of genetically determined race would also believe you can't change it. There are probably also those who believe that having cosmetic surgery can't really change your sex, which is determined by the chromosomes. So you could change your appearance (like Jackson) and change your actions (like a wigger) but I don't think you can change your genes (although who knows where technology will lead us?). Cyta 12:26, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I change my genes every day. V-Man - T/C 00:55, 17 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Michael Jackson had a skin disorder, and despite people calling him "white", he's black. There was a triplet of albino children in the UK, and they were of African descent. Mr. Raptor 13:22, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * A skin disorder and a lot of plastic surgery... FiggyBee 14:29, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * If Micheal Jackson had a skin disorder, then I'm going to proclaim laziness a disease and collect disability on it -- Phoeba WrightOBJECTION! 01:50, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
 * To clarify that, they weren't born black and mysteriously started becoming albino when they were getting themselves plastic surgery and trying to become peter pan -- Phoeba WrightOBJECTION! 01:52, 17 May 2007 (UTC)


 * And albinism has nothing to do with vitiligo, which is what Jackson claims to suffer from. (Whether he has had tons of plastic surgery is itself not disputable; whether this is responsible for his skin turning pasty white is. It doesn't look much like vitiligo to me — he seems to have gradually lightened over the years — but I'm no dermotologist.) --24.147.86.187 03:42, 17 May 2007 (UTC)


 * That's what I was saying. They didn't just lose color, they were born with it, so it's unrelated, and from what i've seen, vitiligo is supposed to be in 'patches', not over your entire body, and not all at once -- Phoeba WrightOBJECTION! 07:48, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

You might want to see our article about the book Black Like Me. There's also Passing (racial identity).

Atlant 12:18, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Yes Michael Jackson has vitiligo and in one of the documenaries about him they interviewed his makeup artist who explained that in the beginning she was spending all her time covering up white patches to make Michael black, and over the years as the disease progressed she ended up doing the opposite: covering up the black patches to make Michael white. Certainly we can add a long list of oddeties about Michael Jackson, and we can even be inclined to believe he made himself white, but, with this vitiligo in the mix it seems to me that should be giving him the benefit of the doubt. Personally I believe that if he had to take a shower and not have his clothes on you would find he has a lot of 'black' patches and would look more like a black person. Rfwoolf 14:53, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
 * *shudder* V-Man - T/C 01:44, 19 May 2007 (UTC)

Circa 1967 I read a brief article about a South African White girl who, after some kinda surgery, grew darker enough that she was reclassified as Coloured (i guess) and needed special approval to go on living with her family. &mdash;Tamfang 19:52, 19 May 2007 (UTC)


 * It's really surprising that people believe the stupidest excuse I've ever heard of: Michael Jackson has vitiligo. He may even have another disorder: one that turns "African" factions, such as round nose, into "European" ones. *laughs out loud* --Taraborn 15:08, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

solar system
please help me to find the following. thank you in advance. what i want is all planets, their distance from the sun, diameter, period of revolution, period of rotation, moons and other special characters.124.43.247.222 12:57, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
 * You could try our article on Solar system, also our article on Astronomical unit-- VectorPotential Talk 12:58, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
 * You might also find Mercury, Venus, Earth, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, and Neptune useful. We also have an article on Pluto, Ceres, and Eris-- VectorPotential Talk 13:02, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Table of planets and dwarf planets in the Solar System might be useful as well. Allow to me to, once again, point out one of Wikipedia's beautiful portals, Portal:Solar System in this case. ---Sluzzelin talk  14:39, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

What about Sedna
 * What about her? The information you seek can be seen in the article you linked to yourself. For comparative tables and diagrams, see the article on Trans-Neptunian object. ---Sluzzelin talk  16:00, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * ....and other "special characters".--Shantavira 17:13, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Uranus even says who was the first person to see the ring around Uranus. Edison 18:28, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Oh the temptation to add some sort of witty punchline there :) I'll be good and resist... Lemon martini 15:53, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Census Report for Palm Harbor, Florida
I work for a children's museum and need the following information: where can I find a list of households with children in Palm Harbor, Florida? Is there a Census report that I can purchase? I would appreciate any help you can give me. Thank you. Lbergeest 17:47, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * The census does not release information about specific households (at least not for 100 years or so) - it only releases broad statistical abstracts. Some mail-order marketing companies have lists of people, households, etc., built from other data sources, which they claim can show all kinds of demographic information about specific addresses.  -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 17:58, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
 * The last census released with personal data is the 1930 census. It's every 75-80 years, I think.  The 1940 census will probably be released sometime after 2010.  Corvus cornix 18:02, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
 * The 1930 census lists 531 individuals in Palm Harbor by name, specifying their address, where they and their parents were born, what language they spoke, whether they went to school during the year, the parents occupation and military service, whether there is a radio in the house, the value of the property, and other interesting variables. Many of the younger person then are doubtless still living now. A "then and now" exhibit might be interesting in your children's museum. Edison 18:26, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Edgeless City
I am looking for the definition of an "edgeless city", which I've been told is a small scale and scattered form of commercial development. Perhaps even an example would do... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 75.69.100.190 (talk) 19:10, 16 May 2007 (UTC).


 * Google search for "edgeless city". Also, compare with Edge city.  -- LarryMac  | Talk  19:20, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Possibly look at Urban_rural_fringe and Urban_sprawl, too. If this is for homework then your geography book will have a much better definition than looking through Wikipedia articles, unless someone here gives you a good definition. Josh Holloway  17:40, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
 * The Google search I linked gave several definitions, many which were visible right on the results page. I didn't feel a need to copy and paste them here.  -- LarryMac  | Talk  18:00, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Identification required: Nissan pickup truck


While on holiday recently, I took a number of photos of old, rare cars and vans (well, the sort of thing you don't see on Britain's roads very often!). However, I can't positively identify all of them (make and model info, year etc). Last time I uploaded a "mystery car photo" to the Reference Desk, it was correctly identified very quickly, so I'm hoping these won't be too obscure!

Here's the first, then: photographed in Palaiokastritsa, Corfu, it is obviously a Nissan pickup truck of some description; but if anybody could provide a model name/number, an approximate year of manufacture and any other relevant info, I would be most grateful. (I would like to add the image to relevant article/s.) It looks to be late-1970s, at a guess...? Hassocks5489 20:38, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I believe it's an early model Datsun 720, although obviously badged as a Nissan. Dismas |(talk) 22:33, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I also seem to recall Nissan having a economy compact pick up that was called the B2000 or something similar which your photo reminds me of. My mistake, it was Mazda that had the B series of trucks. On a side note, I didn't think that in searching for the name of a pick up truck that I'd so easily stumble across porn...  Dismas |(talk) 22:37, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * That was naive;teh iintarwebz iz 4 prOn.hotclaws 11:11, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
 * That's why I don't do any image-searching at work!! :)  Thanks for your advice, Dismas; using that as a starting point, I did some searching and found that the Datsun B120 series may well be the one.  It certainly shares styling characteristics with the B110 and 120Y cars.  Thanks again!  Hassocks5489 18:44, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Looking for a caricature
Greetings. A year ago or so I came across a caricature depicting a white male whipping some black (?) children with a whip that looked like the Nike logo, and yelling "Just do it!" It was on one of the many "funny image" sites. I would love to find it again, and I was just wondering if anyone might know where to look for it? –mysid☎ 21:11, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Searching Google images for "Just do it" immediately brought up this page.--Shantavira 07:34, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
 * CAUTION! McAfee Security Center issued a warning about that site when I clicked on it, and locked it out.Edison 14:35, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
 * It's an SSL site which offers you a certificate which is not certified by a known certification authority. I'm guessing that freaked McAffee, but AFAIK it's an entirely benign thing. --Tagishsimon (talk)


 * Great! Thank you very very much. Google Images seems to have updated since.. :-) –mysid☎ 08:14, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

A question I like to ask...
I was thinking about creating my concept of Anime, called "Amerime". Well, some anime series have children getting attacked. Is it okay to have the same thing in amerime, at least without blood?


 * According to our articles, Amerime is in effect non-Japanese Anime. According to the Amine article, Anime has many genres typically found in any mass media form. Such genres include action, adventure, children's stories, comedy, drama, erotica (hentai), medieval fantasy, occult/horror, romance, and science fiction. This being the case, then attacking children, with or without blood, seems to be entirely okay. --Tagishsimon (talk)

Drum Shells
Im wondering if some of your readers may be able to help me. I have a project that requires the use of 12" of prefereably 14" dia drum shells of at least 6 ply (1cm) thickness. I dont need any special finish or holes or anything: just the shells. I live in uk and wondered if there was any supplier of raw drum shells here. Thanks for any info. Drummer boy


 * Is there any chance that Sonotubes (very rigid cardboard concrete forms) will do?


 * Atlant 12:20, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

n/a (Wikipedia history)
Where do i find who made this site for my bibliography?
 * See the article on Wikipedia. it has some info on the early days. Adam2288  T  C  23:51, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * See Citing Wikipedia, or just go to the article you're using and click "Cite this article" in the toolbox at the bottom of the sidebar. Algebraist 00:00, 17 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Just a suggestion. Don't cite Wikipedia.  Good articles should have any important facts cited by reliable sources.  Follow those references and cite them rather than Wikipedia.  It's usually considered bad practice to use any encyclopedia as a citation in an academic work. -- mattb 01:08, 17 May 2007 (UTC)


 * There are circumstances where it's acceptable to cite Wikipedia, for instance to provide succinct introductions to area where the writer is an expert in the topic area and wants to provide an accessible summary for non-experts. --Robert Merkel 13:59, 17 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Perhaps, though I would never cite Wikipedia in anything intended for academic publication. -- mattb 04:44, 18 May 2007 (UTC)