Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Miscellaneous/2009 December 2

= December 2 =

Hg
HOw do you clean up a mercury spill (like, from a mercury thermometer)? And how do you make sure there's none left, or any that would be dangerous? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.249.0.200 (talk) 02:03, 2 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Read this ASAP: http://www.epa.gov/mercury/spills/index.htm  SteveBaker (talk) 02:27, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * OK - first turn off the heating and A/C - open all the doors and windows - keep everyone away from the spill and be careful not to track it through the area on your shoes. Children are especially vulnerable keep them well out of the way...THEN read http://www.epa.gov/mercury/spills/index.htm SteveBaker (talk) 02:33, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Sounds drastic. What about the mercury that the dentist put in my teeth 40 years ago? Cuddlyable3 (talk) 15:09, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Just a question, but what good does ventilating the area do? Mercury is very heavy and does not boil at temperatures below 350C, so it is not like there would be a cloud of mercury gas formed.  Googlemeister (talk) 15:23, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * There would still be mercury vapour. Water boils at 100C, but we are pretty familiar with the fact that there is substantial water vapour in the air at temperatures below that.  --Phil Holmes (talk) 15:26, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * So then the question is whether mercury is more like water, or vegetable oil, because one readily evaporates at room temperature, and the other does not. The boiling point of the vegetable oil seems more similar to that of mercury then water.  Even in such a case, the vapor would be denser then air as opposed to water vapor and would sink  Googlemeister (talk) 16:36, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Cuddly - I've not read it but that sounds like the questions asked in the dental amalgam controversy. Googlemeister, mercury is a bit more dangrous than oil - you really wouldn't want to take the risk...I'm not sure how evaporatey it is. (Oil does evaporate, albeit more slowly.) Vimescarrot (talk) 17:51, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Many families went into [utter panics fueled by scare headlines because they learned that the gas company had spilled a bit of mercury in their basements in the process of changing out gas meters. The old meters contained about 136 grams (2 teaspoons) of mercury. Reports said that the spillage of this on the basement floor caused "elevated levels of mercury vapor" in the home. Children tested had elevated mercury levels in their blood (had they played with the pool of mercury or just breathed the air?). A few years earlier, no one panicked when children in high school chem and physics labs played with mercury, or when the fever thermometer broke and there was a blob of mercury to push around on the floor until it disappeared in the crack between floorboards, or when the dentist put mercury amalgam in holes in children's teeth and bits of the stuff inevitably got swallowed. Certainly habitual consumption of fish tainted with mercury can be unhealthful, and hatters and Daguerrotypists went "mad" from mercury exposure. The health effects of exposure to low concentration of mercury vapor require reliable sourcing. Governments worldwide are hell-bent on placing a mercury-containing compact fluorescent bulb in every light fixture, many of which will get broken or wind up in the trash can. [[User:Edison|Edison]] (talk) 19:00, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

Well the vapour is only absorbed slowly, so the worst is when the mercury gets into some accessible place, like a crack, and then evaporates for years, with people breathing it in. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 19:44, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * But if you've spilt it in an aeroplane, don't bother cleaning it up - they'll just scrap the whole plane anyway . Ka renjc 20:40, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

Playstation
What is the correct name for the X-shaped button on a Playstation controller: X or Cross? jc iindyysgvxc  (my contributions) 06:55, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

Given that the rest are shapes - I would assme it is cross. (Square, Triangle, Circle and Cross) - but it's not like it matters in the slightest whether you call it an 'x' or a 'cross'. 194.221.133.226 (talk) 09:08, 2 December 2009 (UTC)


 * (I think we're being asked about the + shaped button - not the button with an 'X' printed onto it).


 * The + shaped button is called the D-pad - and (of course) we have an article about that! SteveBaker (talk) 12:56, 2 December 2009 (UTC)


 * I don't think s/he's talking about the D-pad. The four buttons on the right side of the controller are identified by three shapes and a letter, so he or she's asking whether that letter gets referred to by the letter (x) or by the shape (cross). I've only heard it being called "x", but I'm not a PS gamer. Matt Deres (talk) 17:45, 2 December 2009 (UTC)


 * I've never heard anyone call it anything except "X." Games just say "Press X" and since it is an X shape... ~ Amory ( u  •  t  •  c ) 15:39, 2 December 2009 (UTC)


 * In print, I suspect the button is only referred to by its × symbol, so it depends on your personal preference (or a consensus among the PlayStation gamers you communicate with) if you pronounce it "x" or "cross". I think many Americans use the word cross exclusively for a † shape, and call a × shape an X ("eks"). So if you're communicating with Americans, they might be confused if you talk about the "cross button".


 * Interesting tidbit I noticed: The PlayStation article briefly mentions the names for the circle and cross buttons in Japan are the Japanese words for "right" and "wrong". So you might say the correct name for the × button is wrong :) . --Bavi H (talk) 04:35, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
 * The symbols ○ and × do (ubiquitously) mean "correct" and "incorrect" in Japan, but "maru" and "batsu" are just the names of the symbols, not the associated concepts. "Maru" means "circle" and "batsu" derives from "batten", literally "penalty mark". -- BenRG (talk) 18:10, 4 December 2009 (UTC)


 * That makes more sense. I was wondering how you would communicate the concept of "correct" and the symbol for "correct" if they were the same word. (I imagined confusing converstaions like "Did I press the right button?" "Actually, for that action, the right button is the wrong button.") Perhaps the article should be revised to say the symbols are universally used in Japan to mean "correct" and "incorrect", and remove the unclear parentheticals that try to shoehorn that concept next to Japanese names for the symbols. --Bavi H (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 05:11, 5 December 2009 (UTC).


 * I wonder why the OP thinks that there is a 'correct' name for it. By what standard? --ColinFine (talk) 01:37, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

I know Sony used to suggest you call it an X if you need to refer to it in tutorials and similar, with the others being triangle, circle, square, but that was for the PS2. Maybe it has changed since then with the PS3 although I don't see why it would. Gunrun (talk) 09:19, 7 December 2009 (UTC)

Purpose and consequences of blood tests before marriage
I've been reading about blood tests before marriage, which are still required by law in some US states, and was trying to work out their purpose. Some websites claim that the blood tests check for STDs such as syphilis, while others say that it's to check for Rh compatibility. Both seem feasible, but I'm wondering what happens if you fail the test? Are you barred from marrying, or is it just to make the couple aware of any issues that may arise?Snorgle (talk) 16:40, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Before modern drugs were developed which could cure venereal diseases such as syphilis and gonorrhea, it was abhorrent that an infected person would marry and infect the spouse, possibly causing their blindness or death, and the infection and death of any offspring. VD caused about 1/4 of infant mortality in 1916. By 1938, 26 of the then 48 states had enacted requirements for a blood test before a license was issued. If you failed the test, no license was issued.Unfortunately, like any test, the Wasseerman generated false positives, with 1/4 of the "has syphilis" results being incorrect, leading to cancelled marriages, and an innocent person having "some 'splaining to do." Earlier, many states had required that the wedding couple either attest or have a note from their doctor that they were free of venereal disease. This was practically worthless. There were also many quack doctors who falsely claimed their elixer could cure VD, so a prospective spouse might think the clap had gone away. Some states required HIV tests before a marriage license was issued, but citizens got angry at the suggestion they might have engaged in hanky-panky which gave them Aids, and drove to a neighboring state without the testing requirement, costing the local economy due to a 22.5% drop in license issuance in Illinois when the testing for HIV started, so the HIV test requirements were withdrawn, and some states apparently removed the requirement for any blood test along with it. This was also due to the belated recognition that sexual activities without condoms often begin before marriage. In the first 6 months of HIV testing in Illinois, 6 infected persons were found, while 70,846 tests came back negative. Maybe those who thought they might be infected were the ones who went to other states to get married. The HIV testing law in some states did not prohibit marriage, but required notification of the other party.  Edison (talk) 18:35, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * (ec) Google finds lots of pages saying it is to check for STDs. Some say they also check for congenital diseases that could be inherited by children. What happens if you fail apparently varies depending on the state. --Tango (talk) 18:37, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks! That's a lot of very interesting info.  I checked some of the google links (I had googled previously but not using the right search), and it seems that they can refuse the marriage licence in some states.  I guess you could still get married elsewhere though, so I wonder why they still bother?82.11.239.67 (talk) 20:03, 2 December 2009 (UTC)Oops, that was me! Snorgle (talk) 20:04, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't know if they do still bother - they can, but that doesn't mean they do. The law exists for outdated reasons, so it may well not be enforced. --Tango (talk) 20:16, 2 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Cecil Adams covers it briefly in his column What's the purpose of premarital blood testing?] It's from 1996, so I suppose it's a bit out of date. APL (talk) 22:16, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * What?! It's not to see if your intended is a genie? Clarityfiend (talk) 23:33, 3 December 2009 (UTC)

Another money question
I went to the bank today, to deposit a number of 5 and 10 Euro cent coins I'd been saving up. The device I had them in is probably called a "piggy bank" in English, even though it is not actually shaped like a pig, but rather like the Earth. I think I've had it for almost two and a half decades now. The actual bank has undergone two mergers in that time. Now, to my actual question: This act returns the physical coins to circulation, even though their monetary value remains my property. How does this actually happen? How are the coins physically transported from the bank back to circulation? J I P | Talk 20:18, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * When a business comes into the bank to exchange paper money for coins to give out as change to customers, the coins will move from the bank to individuals again through change for cash transactions. Thus while the amount of money remains constant, individual pieces can move around, sort of like water in a large lake.  The lake stays pretty much the same but an individual water molecule moves around over time.  Has the Euro really been around for 25 years?  Googlemeister (talk) 21:14, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * No. I think he meant the piggy bank was 25 years old, not necessarily the money in it. Possibly he'd been saving in it since before the Euro and simply converted the money inside after the change. Vimescarrot (talk) 21:23, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * If that is the case, the pre-Euro coinage will most likely not have a large amount of circulation and would most likely end up getting sold to a collector or melted at some point. Googlemeister (talk) 21:45, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * I have been saving up money in that piggy bank for almost 25 years, yes, but it's not like it has been the same money all the time, and I only just deposited the money I originally saved there when the Berlin wall was still around. I empty the piggy bank roughly every nine to ten months. Since the introduction of Euro cash, Finnish banks have a rule that pre-Euro coinage is accepted, but won't get credited - the bank will give it away to charity. J I P  | Talk 19:26, 3 December 2009 (UTC)


 * The bank sorts the received cash. Worn or outdated items are returned to the central bank for destruction. The rest is aggregated into stacks, rolls, or bags (and sometimes into larger containers for wholesale use). Cash-intensive businesses like shops buy cash from the bank. Small businesses have to go to the bank and withdraw cash from their current account (really they're "buying" above rather than "changing", because they need to spend 1 or 2% cash handling charge); large businesses (department stores, casinos) get cash delivered wholesale by security van (and again they pay a charge). If there are marked asymetries between cash withdrawals and deposits at a given branch (and to handle the replacement of old items with new) the bank runs security vans from its branches to a central cash-handling centre.  I know someone who worked at such a centre in Edinburgh, which he reports was an awful job: there were always tens of millions in the room (reminding everyone how badly paid they were), there was special lighting and massive surveillance, and reportedly large staff turnover. He tells me that, in industrial quantities, used bank notes smell like armpit. -- Finlay McWalter • Talk 01:12, 3 December 2009 (UTC)


 * You hand over a pile of coins to a bank teller, who counts them and gives you the equivalent in paper money (or, deposits it into your account). At the end of his/her shift, the teller you gave the money to will count all his/her cash and other instruments (e.g., checks) and “balance” against the computer record. When he/she has too much of one denomination, say €0.05 coins, he/she with "wrap" them. That involves either hand- or machine counting, and then packaging a specific amount (say €5 worth of €0.05 coins) in paper tubes or plastic bags. In this way, large amounts of coin can be moved into and out of a teller’s drawer without the need to count every coin (although, good tellers will still count it all). Next, a retailer sends a cashier around to the bank with €5 to buy €0.05 coins. He/She receives the coins, and begins to use them to make change as customers require. Finally, you receive one of these coins when you buy something, and place the coin into your globe-shaped piggy bank and the process begins again. DOR (HK) (talk) 08:28, 3 December 2009 (UTC)


 * There is a rule in some places that coins are only acceptable up to a certain amount. IIRC, in the UK banks will only accept 1p and 2p coins up to £20 or some other surprisingly small amount.  If you have one of those large jars of change, it might be better to take it to the banks in several smaller runs.  Astronaut (talk) 08:11, 4 December 2009 (UTC)
 * According to our Legal tender article: "In the United Kingdom, only coins valued 1 pound Sterling, 2 pounds, and 5 pounds Sterling are legal tender in unlimited amounts throughout the territory of the United Kingdom . . . . Currently, 20 pence pieces, 25-pence coins and 50-pence pieces are legal tender in amounts up to 10 pounds; 5-pence pieces and 10-pence pieces are legal tender in amounts up to 5 pounds; and 1-penny pieces and 2-pence pieces are legal tender in amounts up to 20 pence." However, I believe that this applies only to non-bank transactions, and that banks themselves will accept any coins to any amount, although they might well charge a small fee if the coins have not been sorted and bagged into precise amounts using the standard plastic coinage bags (which can then be checked quickly by weighing rather than being emptied and recounted). 87.81.230.195 (talk) 18:05, 4 December 2009 (UTC)