Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Miscellaneous/2009 June 30

= June 30 =

Suicide
A lot of questions have been asked here about Suicide, but here goes another one. A few days ago, I read in ,y newspaper that a couple had hanged themselves to death. In another instance, a family had poisoned itself to death. Then, around once a month I read a story about someone who pours Kerosine on oneself, and then Self-Immolates. Then there are the usual reports of falling off a cliff, jumping into a well, shooting oneself, etc.,etc. All of these methods involve rather high amounts of pain and daring. Ok, given that the person has decided to commit suicide, why can't all these people choose a painless way of going away, say sleeping drugs? Doesn't it strike them that at least there are relatively other painless methods of death ? Or is it exceedingly difficult to obtain these drugs, or do method of quick and painless suicide ? Rkr1991 (talk) 05:24, 30 June 2009 (UTC)


 * You should read the rather depressing introduction to the controversial book, Final Exit by Derek Humphry, which discusses the advantages and drawbacks of various methods before advocating its own rather complicated approach. It's just not as easy as it appears, which is perhaps fortunate, because the vast majority of those who've survived jumps off the Golden Gate Bridge say they regretted their move in mid-air. They realized that whatever problems or conflicts drove them to attempt suicide were either soluble or not so important as to justify suicide. —— Shakescene (talk) 05:35, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
 * If you overdose, it's quite possible you'll be found and saved before you die. Violent, messy, painful deaths are often more difficult to recover from. Mind you, I'd still choose something else. Vimescarrot (talk) 09:36, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
 * It should be noted that because of the varying success rates of different forms of suicide, and the varying methods attempted by each gender, women actually attempt suicide more than men, but are successful less. Prokhorovka (talk) 10:08, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
 * If I remember correctly, a statistic that I read once was that women generally opt for overdoses and things of that nature which takes longer and increases the likelyhood that someone will discover them before they actually die. Whereas men statistically go for things like gunshots and such which are quicker and have less of a chance of recovery if/when discovered.  Dismas |(talk) 10:35, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

Do we have an article which gives a list of Painless Suicide methods ? We can then analyze each method easier. Rkr1991 (talk) 11:13, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Don't say Suicide Is Painless unless you've done it. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 11:25, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't understand the point of giving that link here... What's the point ? Rkr1991 (talk) 13:01, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
 * The link is merely to a song but my point is that Rkr1991's suggestion is crass. What exactly would Rkr1991 like us to analyze "easier": how much fun someone's suicide was for them, their relatives and everyone else affected? Suicide is never painless. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 17:04, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

All the world's a stage and to commit suicide is to play one's final rôle of Pathos where an act that would be intolerable in mid-life is a means of touching the audience that will be left behind. While Hamlet hesitated with his dread of something after death and whether To be, or not to be, a poet calls Do not go gentle into that good night, and the suicider in the final drama demands from their stage that we all Rage, rage against the dying of the light. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 11:25, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

Anyone who thinks overdose is painless or might be good because they might be found, can be enlightened by chatting with a reasonably medic with experience of working in emergency medicine - lingering, unpleasant death from multiple organ failure is, sadly, often the fate of those who are 'rescued' from this 'painless' 'easy option'. On a similar theme to this question, Michael Portillo did a documentary a couple of years ago, looking for a humane method of execution, measuring each of a number of techniques against a number of criteria. After considerable research, he concluded there wasn't one. --Dweller (talk) 12:34, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Although his experiment with hypoxia was somewhat more humane than others, with feelings of euphoria and drunkenness IIRC. Fribbulus Xax (talk) 01:09, 1 July 2009 (UTC)

I think there has been a misunderstanding. I'm not talking about being rescued at all, I'm talking about ways of doing suicide. Which means any slow method is either a)a Bad thing or b)We don't talk about rescuing, as the question is about suicide itself. And I'm sorry if I jumped to the conclusion that dying in your sleep would be painless, but I still stand by my statement thaat it would be better to go more painlessly than painfully. Rkr1991 (talk) 12:56, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
 * The point I'm making is that it's a fallacy to think that using an overdose of some medication or other is a 'painless' or 'easy' option. People are often rescued from this type of attempt; of those rescued, a good proportion will go on to die in a quite horrible manner. --Dweller (talk) 13:18, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
 * People often change their minds right after taking the plunge or as the rope jerks tight. Sometimes it is too late. The aftermath may be worse than before. A young may fired a rifle into his mouth, but lived. The doctor told him "And you though your life sucked BEFORE you blew out your jaw bone on one side?" 14:54, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't know about sleeping drugs, but I know overdosing on paracetamol is a very horrible way to die. Depending on how many you take it can take several days for you to die, all the time with agonising stomach cramps. And if you were hoping to use it as a cry for help, even if you are found before you die they may be nothing the doctors can do. If you are found soon enough they can pump your stomach and maybe give you an antidote, but once your liver has been destroyed your body will be inevitably poisoned from the inside out (and there's no way you would be eligible for a transplant even if a suitable donor can be found in time - too great a risk of you doing it again). Horrible way to go. Pretty much any suicide method is better than that. --Tango (talk) 15:11, 30 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Several years ago I read a first-person account written by a man who had been involved in his terminally ill wife's assisted suicide attempt, which put paid to any idea I had that overdosing was a painless way to go. IIRC, he recounted how his wife had taken a fairly staggering amount of painkillers, and then over the course of 12 hours or so was horrifically ill, but did not die. Even if you're not found and treated, there's no guarantee that it won't be painful, or even that it will be successful. (Having had a quick search, the original article is here.-- Kateshort  forbob  16:35, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Overdose seems like a fairly undesirable suicide method anyway. There's an awfully long time span between the point of no return and the occurrence of death.--WaltCip (talk) 16:49, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

WHo is she?
Who is this Muslim woman? || this video —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.14.116.27 (talk) 19:44, 30 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Based on the comments, she's certainly someone who has drawn a lot of anger. Tempshill (talk) 02:52, 1 July 2009 (UTC)


 * She seems to be in Egypt, but she looks a bit like the young lady, Neda Agha-Soltan, who was shot in Iraq. Maybe it's the eye shadow that causes the resemblance. Edison (talk) 05:52, 1 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I believe you mean Iran. Thanks,  gENIUS  101  20:18, 1 July 2009 (UTC)


 * The video and description texts, written in Arabic, seem to be promoting her book, something like "The first smile after taking off her hijab", which appears to be a memoir or novel about a woman who converts from Islam to Christianity. The video seems to be from the "Christian Voices Center of ... " Something ( مركز صوت المسيح والنحر  ) Christian Voices Center of the Christ and the Sacrifice?  Maybe somebody who is more literate than I can translate better.  Nimur (talk) 03:45, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

Karelian question (no, not the Karelian question)
Is there a specific, unambiguous name for the specific part of Karelia that used to belong to Finland between the declaration if independence and the Winter War/Continuation War, but was later ceded to the Soviet Union and still remains part of Russia? All articles I could find seem to either exclude this area, also contain part of present-day Finland, or also contain areas that have been part of Russia all along. J I P | Talk 20:26, 30 June 2009 (UTC)


 * There are some references to Ladoga Karelia, which seems to be defined as the part of Karelia which was Finnish until the Continuation War, but is now Russian? --Saalstin (talk) 01:38, 1 July 2009 (UTC)