Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Miscellaneous/2010 December 2

= December 2 =

What kind of birds are these?
From a picture taken in Pearl Harbor in Hawaii. 67.169.5.125 (talk) 05:52, 2 December 2010 (UTC)


 * Common Myna? ---Sluzzelin talk  06:20, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
 * (Its scientific name, Acridotheres tristis, means sad grasshopper-hunter. In my persistent quest for useless facts, I discovered that this species probably got its triste attribute for wearing a dour plumage, not for singing a sad song. ---Sluzzelin  talk  06:35, 2 December 2010 (UTC))

Venezuelan National Anthem & the Cuban National Anthem
Hello, I'm wondering if all national anthems are in the public domain. I have found that in the US these are in the public domain. But how can I find out if a party owns the copyright outside of the US? Any idea?

Thanks! J.G. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.147.175.203 (talk) 15:49, 2 December 2010 (UTC)


 * Most national anthems are public domain. The link provides a contact who may know of any exceptions. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 22:25, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

I drank what?
Many moons ago in my younger and much more naive days, I purchased an elixir/medicine at a Chinese grocery store. It was over the counter and 5 dollars for a very large bottle. The writings on the box and on the bottle were all in Chinese but the tiny English instructions found on the side of the bottle said to take a tablespoon a day for general health. My friends and I drank an entire bottle each and got f-u-c-k-e-d-u-p. It was a thick, almost cough medicine type of drink that we phonetically pronounced as 'Sah-Wu-Che' or 'Sah-Woo-Chi'. Does anyone know what we drank? --Endlessdan (talk) 16:56, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
 * According to this source, "the Chinese patent medicine Shou Wu Chih has  Polygonum multiflorum as its primary ingredient, as well as Li's other basic ingredient Polygonatum sibiricum".  Polygonum multiflorum, as known of fo-ti, has unclear pharmacology, but is noted to have a laxative effect.  Polygonatum, also known as Solomon's Seal, also has unclear pharmacology. Looie496 (talk) 19:28, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Tonics of that sort sometimes use an alcohol base. Medicinals in Chinese medicine usually don't contain alcohol, but tonics aren't viewed as medicines.  You probably got an Asian version of Jaegermeister.  -- Ludwigs 2  19:38, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Did it suggest to take it with Red Bull? Googlemeister (talk) 19:50, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I see now that we actually have an article, Shou Wu Chih. Since the article says it is 15% alcohol, getting fucked up would be a natural consequence of drinking a large bottle. Looie496 (talk) 20:29, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

Snowy UK weather normal for US?
Over the past few days it has been unusually cold in the UK, with lots of snow. Is this kind of sub-zero (centigrade) weather what you get in most parts of the US for six months of the year please?

I'm wondering if price of the comparatively inexpensive and spacious 'real estate' that you get in the US, compared with the UK, is having constant snow and ice for half a year over most of the country. Thanks. 92.24.186.163 (talk) 17:19, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I can only speak for myself but I live in the North East by New York City and we get snow fall for about 2-3 months a year. Normally January through March. However I'd sooner wanna live in a place that has snow fall year round than ever living in the UK.--Endlessdan (talk) 17:29, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Based on your very poor sentence construction, we'd probably not want you in the UK, old chap. You'd fail the entrance exam ;) --Tagishsimon (talk) 19:53, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
 * The OP's IP is located near Manchester, a city in the UK. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 22:18, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I think Tag was responding to Endlessdan's expression of disinterest in living in the UK...? Wiki Dao  &#9775;  (talk)  22:22, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
 * The trends for US population (including migration patterns) is to the warmer, more temperate areas of the south west and south east. Real estate prices also tend to be higher for these more desirable areas. In general, you can get larger and cheaper houses and property in areas where the weather is more inclement. Comparing the US to the UK in this way is also problematic because of the huge difference in size of the two countries: the land mass of the UK is approximately the size of the state of Oregon (one of the 50 states). --Quartermaster (talk) 17:36, 2 December 2010 (UTC)


 * Our Climate of the United States article has a lot of well-presented weather information for a representative sample of different regions. The closest to having half a year below freezing seems to be Anchorage, Alaska (and just about everywhere else is warmer on average than there...).  Wiki Dao  &#9775;  (talk)  18:32, 2 December 2010 (UTC)


 * Two of the most expensive urban areas in the United States (in terms of real estate) are New York and Boston. These areas both get substantial snowfall every year.  In Boston, snowfall is normal from early December to early April (so for about four months), and average snowfall over the season is about 60 inches (just short of 2 meters).  Of course, we never have more than about 48 inches of snow on the ground at any one time, and seldom more than about 24 inches, because at least every couple of weeks we get a day or a stretch of several days with highs above freezing, and the snow melts.  By late February, the sun is strong enough that any snowfall melts within a few days.  Chicago, with an even colder climate than Boston, is also not an inexpensive city.  As WikiDao has said, the only part of the United States with 6 months of severe winter weather is Alaska, which is thinly populated.  The only areas without snow that are more expensive than Boston or New York are in coastal California.  All of the warm and sunny southeastern states, such as Florida and Georgia, have much lower real estate prices than Boston, despite the lack of snow and serious cold.  It isn't the weather that explains real estate costs in the United States, but, primarily, average salaries (which are highest in the Northeast and California), and, secondarily, a quality something like fashionability, which is hard to measure.  Boston, New York, San Francisco, and Washington are the most expensive U.S. urban areas (except for Honolulu, whose prices are inflated by the demand of wealthy Japanese for vacation homes).  What distinguishes these places is not their weather, but their concentration of high-paying jobs and amenities such as excellent restaurants, museums, live music and theater, and interesting, intelligent people.  Marco polo (talk) 18:40, 2 December 2010 (UTC)


 * Incidentally, average real estate prices in Boston and New York are comparable to those in Southeast England and higher than those in other parts of the UK. Prices in central London compare only to the most expensive districts of Boston and New York, which contain a similar population of people who work in finance or have inherited money.  Marco polo (talk) 18:46, 2 December 2010 (UTC)


 * The only part of the US where there is snow and ice for half the year is Alaska (not counting a few high mountain zones in the Pacific Northwest). Looie496 (talk) 19:14, 2 December 2010 (UTC)


 * I'm Canadian but like most Canadians, I live within a few hundred kilometres of the US border, so I'll call that close enough to be able to help answer your question, as I have heard weather in the northern prairie states is very similar to the southern parts of the prairie provinces (I know nothing about any other parts of the US though). Snow is pretty much unavoidable anywhere from December to March, common from October to April, unsurprising from September to May, and certainly possible (although rare) even in the summer months. (I don't personally remember it ever snowing in July, but I could be wrong.) This has a lot to do with being in a wide-open flat area nowhere near any significant body of water.


 * And as for Boston, I was there for a week last February and everyone was panicking about the weather. (In fairness, there were significant storms elsewhere in the eastern US, particularly Washington DC at the time, so that probably fuelled the panic.) But all it ended up being was a mildly chilly couple of days with a little wind and light sleet. And still all the people there were freaking out and saying what horrible terrible weather it was. So "bad weather" is a fairly relative concept. I don't know about the rest of Canada, but in Alberta, if it's thirty below with two or three feet of snow, we generally still manage to go about our daily lives. It's gotta get a lot worse than that before we start shutting down schools, transportation, and businesses, like they were doing in Boston when I was there. (Although like I said, they were expecting it to get worse than it actually did, so it's not entirely fair to portray them as a bunch of weather wussies :P )


 * As for real estate prices, it is usually cheaper in the US than in Canada. In fact a lot of Canadians are buying property in Florida and Arizona, very warm parts of the US that almost never get anything resembling winter, because it is so dang cheap. So as Marco Polo said, I think it's safe to conclude that climate has almost nothing to do with it. 142.66.102.138 (talk) 19:55, 2 December 2010 (UTC) (Oops, didn't realize I wasn't signed in...) Cherry Red Toenails (talk) 20:16, 2 December 2010 (UTC)


 * Cherry Red (if I may be so informal), I remember that week last year. It was not a typical Boston reaction to the weather.  We were anticipating that the snowstorm that immobilized Washington, DC, was about to arrive.  As you say, it didn't.  But people were anxious because they thought that it was.  Also, some Bostonians' reactions to snowstorms have changed since we had a massive snowstorm (maybe 18 inches) about two years ago.  Employers in the region waited until the heaviest and most rapid snowfall arrived and then simultaneously released their employees.  The sudden mass exodus just as snow had begun to pile up prevented the plows from clearing the roads, and many people were stranded on highways for 6-8 hours.  As a result, many people now arrange to work remotely when snow approaches (though some of us trudge in regardless).  That said, I'll agree that eastern Canadians definitely deal with more severe weather than Bostonians.  (In western Canada apart from coastal B.C., it is colder, but I don't think it snows as much.)  Marco polo (talk) 20:23, 2 December 2010 (UTC)


 * True about east vs. west. I've lived in Nova Scotia and Alberta. I almost never saw it get below -20 in Nova Scotia when I lived there, something that happens on a regular basis in Alberta, but in Nova Scotia I also never saw the ground under the snow for four straight months. (It's also a much more humid cold out east, which as a prairie girl, I was never able to get used to. It was like breathing ice water.) Cherry Red Toenails (talk) 06:39, 6 December 2010 (UTC)


 * In Coastal BC, we are lucky to get 5 days of snow in a year. Last winter, we hosted the Winter Olympics with no snow in the city. It only snowed once the whole season, and melted by morning. Aaronite (talk) 17:49, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

There are plenty of places in the U.S. where they rarely if ever get snow: Miami, Houston, San Diego. But there's something to be said for the change of seasons and for a beautiful coating of white that muffles all the sound. -- Mwalcoff (talk) 01:16, 3 December 2010 (UTC)


 * Because of its size, diverse geography and various distance to large bodies of water, the U.S. weather varies wildly from region to region. The state of Oregon alone has at least 5 distinctive weather zones. The northern prairie states probably have the greatest temperature variation: at or close to 100 on the hottest days of summer, and down to 40 below on some of the coldest days of winter. Meanwhile, south Florida (Miami area) and south Texas (Harlingen/Brownsville area) are sub-tropical and it almost never freezes, never mind snow. (When it does freeze, typically at the wrong times, the citrus crops are threatened in both areas). ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 01:26, 3 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Also, the high plains areas are cold for much of the year. I don't know if it's literally 6 months or not, but Yellowstone National Park is covered with snow for a good portion of the year, and by contrast can get pretty hot at the peak of summer. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 01:29, 3 December 2010 (UTC)


 * Yellowstone and other parts of the northern Rockies will often have snow on the ground for six months of the year or more, and it can snow at any time (I went there in mid-September a few years ago, and had a snowball fight with my parents). The higher peaks will usually be snowcapped year-round. --Carnildo (talk) 02:51, 3 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I see that the tallest mountain on the British Isles is Ben Nevis, at roughly 4,400 feet, which in terms of US mountains is just getting started. In fact, Yellowstone is about twice that altitude, on average. Obviously, warm vs. cold air is a function of both latitude and altitude, plus other factors. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 03:14, 3 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Driving ability in the U.S. varies also. People who grew up never having dealt with snowy roads are a disaster when there's a light dusting of sleet... people in Buffalo laugh hysterically on those days. Shadowjams (talk) 11:02, 3 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Even people used to snow still drive like idiots sometimes. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 19:12, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

presidential cell
Does president Obama have one or more private, unmonitored cell phone for his personal use? Would it be up to him to pay the bill for it, or would it get paid by the government? Googlemeister (talk) 20:35, 2 December 2010 (UTC)


 * There is no such thing as an unmonitorable cell phone though there are encrypted phones that are available to POTUS from a government agency. In 2008, Verizon employees allegedly breached President-elect Obama's cell phone records (video). He no longer uses that phone. However he reportedly has both the US nuclear launch codes and Oprah Winfrey's cell phone number. The closest you can get to phoning Barack Obama is his office (866) 675-2008. (Someone tried to peek at his phone number.) Cuddlyable3 (talk) 22:14, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
 * When I say unmonitored, I am referring to not recorded as a matter of course like the majority of his communications. I can't see how he could live with the utter lack of privacy.  Googlemeister (talk) 22:28, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Just how is he going to pay for it?  If I find it  hard enough to get put through to a blob  of sentient liveware when reaching  my phone provider to sort out a credit card payment, how is Obamar going to get anywhere? “''”Listen, what might be better is if you just bill me for the flowers. I'm sure it'll be okay with your boss. Well, I don't know if you recognize my voice, but this is the President. (beat) The United States. (they've hung up) Hello, hello.....--Aspro (talk) 23:11, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Hollywood has anticipated Aspro. There is a bit very much like that in the 1995 movie The American President. --Anonymous, 01:07 UTC, December 3, 2010.
 * Doesn't the US Presidential Records Act require all calls are logged ? So even if he did us private phones they would presumeably still have to be 'monitored' to the extent necessary for logging and it's likely to be controversial anyway like the Bush White House e-mail controversy. In the same vein I don't see any indication all calls are recorded as a matter of course, in fact the evidence suggests they're not hence why most Presidents and their aides use/d a lot of phone calls instead of email and other methods which are completely documented  (see also the earlier links). Nil Einne (talk) 00:45, 3 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I don't see any indication that the PRA requires "all calls are logged". Shadowjams (talk) 10:57, 3 December 2010 (UTC)
 * The PRA refers to "documentary material" defined as "books, correspondence, memorandums, documents, papers, pamphlets, works of art, models, pictures, photographs, plats, maps, films, and motion pictures, including, but not limited to, audio, audiovisual, or other electronic or mechanical recordations." So e-mail yes, conversations and phone calls, no, unless the conversations or phone calls have already been recorded. But there is no requirement to record them. --Mr.98 (talk) 13:12, 3 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Well the second source claims it does, although it's a forum post so not an RS. The first one which arguably is an RS indicates that it's required by law but not by what law. I spent a while searching for a clearer indication but the forum post was the best I could find at the time (not helped by many websites telling you to login or help logging in). I've found which says a log is kept, but not that is required. I presume if a log is kept, it needs to be preserved ( for example) so perhaps some confusion arises there. This may imply that Obama could maintain a private phone and not need to keep logs of phone calls although he would need may need to make sure neither he nor his staff ever creates nor receives any logs (most phones will automatically log calls for example) unless these are deemed "personal records". In any case, given all the concerns raised at the time of retaining his BlackBerry for official sue (tracking, accidential recording, insecure communication which I'm guessing may be a concern even for private communciation), it seems unlikely he would have been allowed a truly private phone. Nil Einne (talk) 07:56, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

Weighing balls
What is the solution to the problem in the last panel of today's Dinosaur Comics? 12 balls, 1 is either lighter or heavier than the rest. Determine which ball is different with 3 weighings. 149.169.122.142 (talk) 23:43, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
 * This is a well-known puzzle. Here's a solution. Clarityfiend (talk) 00:00, 3 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Of course, you can use a similar method for 27 balls if you are told whether the odd one out is lighter or heavier.   D b f i r s   13:07, 3 December 2010 (UTC)
 * So well-known that it's of course in Wikipedia: Balance puzzle. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:20, 3 December 2010 (UTC)