Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Miscellaneous/2011 August 16

= August 16 =

Am I hearing this correctly?
I've been watching Spooks lately (streaming and therefore no subtitles) and occasionally they use a term that I'm not quite sure I'm hearing correctly with my US American ears. They refer to a team of guys dressed in SWAT gear by a name that sounds like "CO9 team". It almost sounds like "SEAL team" but then that's American. I've poked around and found articles on SO10 but I can't find a reference to CO anything. (and SO-9 searches bring up results about HIV/AIDS research) So, what am I mis-hearing? Dismas |(talk) 02:28, 16 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Does it have anything to do with Spooks: Code 9? -- Jayron  32  02:46, 16 August 2011 (UTC)
 * I doubt it since Code 9 seems to be about a group in training while these guys are trained SWAT-like teams who are called in to break down doors, storm houses, and other such things. Dismas |(talk) 03:24, 16 August 2011 (UTC)


 * Just a hunch, but could it be "senior team" (assuming they don't have a senile team).--Shantavira|feed me 07:43, 16 August 2011 (UTC)
 * The Met's Specialist Firearms Command is also known as CO 19. CS Miller (talk) 08:02, 16 August 2011 (UTC
 * It may well be CO9. There's nothing very strange about scriptwriters coining a descriptor like this, matching the pattern of more familiar units such as MI5. Think CI5 from The Professionals (TV series). --Tagishsimon (talk) 08:05, 16 August 2011 (UTC)
 * I would guess CO19 as well - I think that's a pretty well-known term in the UK. See also Central Operations and Specialist Operations. 130.88.73.71 (talk) 09:20, 16 August 2011 (UTC)


 * And the mishearing in that sense would be "teen" with "team" ("nineteen" vs. "nine team"). --Mr.98 (talk) 14:14, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

Thanks everyone! I'm also in agreement with the "CO19"... version. (better word escapes me as I just woke up) Thanks again! Dismas |(talk) 19:44, 16 August 2011 (UTC)


 * It is worth noting that the reason Spooks mentions CO 19 so casually is that after the 7/7 bombings and shooting of Jean Charles de Menezes the media made CO 19 very well known. Spooks never mentions them before 7/7, but assumes you know what they are afterwards. Prokhorovka (talk) 13:06, 18 August 2011 (UTC)

tristan benjamin
My name is ian benjamin, i used to be a pro footballer and i was wondering why my brother who used to be a pro footballer is not on wikipedia like me. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.173.95.171 (talk) 15:14, 16 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Two ways to answer your question:
 * No one is in charge here. That is, the reason why the article doesn't exist is because no one has written it.  I know that sounds rather simple, but it is basically true; there are many potential subjects for articles which just haven't been written yet, for the only reason that no one has yet done it.  There isn't any deeper reason than that, unless...
 * It wasn't written because your brother isn't an appropriate subject for a Wikipedia article. He may be, or he may not be, I don't really know one way or another.  However, Wikipedia does not include articles about every human to have ever lived.  In order to be taken seriously, Wikipedia needs to ensure that material written in articles is verifiable; and for many people there just isn't a whole lot of publicly availible information about them which is written in reliable sources.  That is, sometimes people have information about them which is availible, but not terribly reliable; and other times people just aren't well documented at all.  This could very well be the case with your brother.  This has nothing to do with his job title; there is no activity one does for a pay check which automatically guarantees that many people will have written about you.  You may want to read Notability for more on this.  And again, your brother may be notable; I have no idea if he is or isn't.  If he isn't, he doesn't have an article about him for that reason.  If he is notable, he doesn't have an article because no one bothered to write it yet.
 * -- Jayron  32  16:04, 16 August 2011 (UTC)


 * Ian, Wikipedia articles are created by volunteers whom find the subject to be significant. If you feel an article about your brother might be useful to others, try suggesting it either on the talk page of the article about you or the Project Football talk page. TheGrimme (talk) 16:07, 16 August 2011 (UTC)


 * if it's the Tristan Benjamin who played for Notts County he would be notable according to Notability_(sports), so there's no reason he couldn't have an Wikipedia page if you have some newspaper articles about him. However, there are a lot of professional footballers in the UK and it's a while since he played, so it's unsurprising nobody has written anything.  The likeliest candidate to write an article would be a fan of a team he played for, and Notts County don't have many fans left. --Colapeninsula (talk) 16:34, 16 August 2011 (UTC)


 * Ian, you could post the request on the Requested articles page. Although you could become one of us and write it yourself &mdash; see Your First Article &mdash; you are not supposed to do so because of our Conflict of Interest guideline.  Comet Tuttle (talk) 21:03, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

@Colapeninsula despite the cheeky comment, I have written an article with sources, I am ONE of those few County fans and in no way related to TB other than a fan of him as a player for my team. Toxicparty (talk) 16:52, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

Copyright tags
Wikipedia uses a set of image copyright tags to indicate the license status of the image, so I have added a tag under as apache which seemed to me as suitable. But, then also, in any way, the red line about the tag being missing doesn't dissapear. Please Help. You may see my contribution for reference to my querry. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Minakshi boruah (talk • contribs) 15:40, 16 August 2011 (UTC)
 * It looks like you figured this out on your own... -- Jayron  32  15:56, 16 August 2011 (UTC)


 * The image in question is File:Star-bestseller.jpg. The best place to ask these questions is Media_copyright_questions. However, I suspect that the license you used is wrong. Only the copy-right holder can state what licence the image is released under. Thus is likely to be either be a public-domain, or fair-use. You should also provide a link to where the image was obtained from. CS Miller (talk) 15:59, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

Milwaukee Jeweler's from 1920's
I am looking for info for a jeweler that was in the Milwaukee area around the depression era. The name is B.W. Thien. I have a pendant watch I want appraised for sale.

Thank you, Darlene — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tym2fly525 (talk • contribs) 18:52, 16 August 2011 (UTC)


 * I googled "b.w. thien" watch and four hits popped up, to my surprise. Two of them say that his address appears to have been 3401 North Avenue, and that first hit, from a 1921 "Jeweler's Circular" on Google Books, mentions he was spending his vacation with his family at a cottage on Phantom Lake, along with another watchmaker's family.  Lucky fellow.  I hope they were all able to avoid the Phantom Lake monster that was active there at the time.  Comet Tuttle (talk) 20:59, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

Novel questions
Hey guys. So, I'm currently co-writing a supernatural/mystery/adventure-type teenage novel that's still in progress. I wish to publish my book through HarperCollins and I understand that they require a literary agent for them to look at the novel, of course that will all happen once the novel is finished.

So, two questions:


 * 1) Is there an upfront fee for them printing and binding a certain amount of actual novels or does that fee come out of the percent of profit the book gets?
 * 2) Approximately how much percent of profits do the four parties (HarperCollins, me, co-author and literary agent) get?

Any help would be greatly appreciated! 64.229.205.242 (talk) 23:00, 16 August 2011 (UTC)


 * The answer to the first question is a very important one&mdash;No, a reputable publisher will never charge an author to print his book. The publishers who will charge you up front (generally for the entire print cost, plus 'editing fees', 'promotional fees', and various other sorts of add-ons) are the so-called vanity presses.  Vanity presses have virtually no real editorial oversight, and will print books for anyone who is willing to give them money.  They have no interest in selling your books to anyone else, because they will have already sold them to you.  See also author mill, for a variation on the theme.
 * A real publisher, in contrast, will actually pay you an advance up front, based on their anticipated sales of your book. (The advance will come out of the subsequent royalties&mdash;but if the book doesn't sell, you don't generally have to give the advance back.) TenOfAllTrades(talk) 23:19, 16 August 2011 (UTC)


 * This article quotes a variety of percentages — from 4% at the low to 8% at the high. As for how you divide it with your co-author and agent, that's up to you to decide with them. The agent will no doubt make it clear to you up front what they're expecting of the royalties. My understanding though is that you don't usually get to pick your publisher ahead of time; the whole reason you get an agent is that they shop you around, hype you up, try to get you the best offer from whomever will offer. --Mr.98 (talk) 00:03, 17 August 2011 (UTC)


 * Yes. Don't pin your hopes and dreams on a particular publisher.  It is usually regarded as a near-miracle to even get an agent to represent you.  Comet Tuttle (talk) 07:40, 17 August 2011 (UTC)
 * That's an important point, you can't just hire an agent. You submit your work and they choose writers who they think will be profitable and offer them a contract. (Although there are plenty of Con artists pretending to be agents who will be happy to take your money.)
 * I think that when/if you do finally find an agent who is willing to represent you, they will be pretty irritated if you turn down deals with other publishers. They're likely to tell you "Look, I know this business, let me do my job and find you the best possible deal for this book."
 * It's a bit out of date now, but the blog of Miss Snark, Literary Agent is a wealth of information on how the novel publishing industry works. APL (talk) 10:11, 17 August 2011 (UTC)