Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Miscellaneous/2011 December 15

= December 15 =

get rid of creosote smell?
I brought a bookcase from my parent's house to my house. Inside it smells of creosote. Is there a way to get rid of that smell, without introducing another permanent smell? Bubba73 You talkin' to me? 01:49, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Febreeze? -- Jayron  32  03:37, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Baking soda? Dismas |(talk) 03:47, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * I don't want to spray Febreeze on it, but I will try baking soda. Bubba73 You talkin' to me? 04:31, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I don't think baking soda works. The smell is persistent. Air the bookcase in the sun for weeks. Oda Mari (talk) 06:29, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * A quick google search yield these results: (Well ehow been blacklisted so) www.ehow.com/how_5770711_rid-creosote-smell.html Royor (talk) 07:56, 15 December 2011 (UTC)

I've had success with coffee grounds absorbing nasty niffs, but I suspect your problem is that whatever it is that stinks is absorbed into the stuff the bookcase is made of. Worth a try though - it's easy and cheap. --Dweller (talk) 11:21, 15 December 2011 (UTC)

The bookcase is an antique and it took three people to get it in the house, so airing it out in the sun is not an option. I'm trying leaving the doors open to let it air out. Bubba73 You talkin' to me? 16:05, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * I'm afraid there may not be an easy solution. Some ideas:


 * 1) I agree with "let it air out", but increasing the temperature may help it outgas more quickly. If you move it to a garage or shed and leave it there for a year, maybe that will help.


 * 2) Some nice-smelling oil might help to dilute the creosote. Lemon oil, for example.


 * 3) You can try to mask the odor with other scents, but only once you reduce the stench somewhat.


 * 4) Is it too late to return it ? It may never smell right.  Can you live with this ?


 * 5) If you can't return it, perhaps it could be sold to a family of smokers, who wouldn't notice the stench.


 * 6) If you're dead set on keeping it and can't get rid of the stench, the only other option is to enclose it in a glass or plastic container, so you can view your acquisition without having to smell it. StuRat (talk) 16:22, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the feedback. I could return it to my parent's house, but we want to keep it and use it (we got it to use it, not just to have it).  Enclosing it isn't a solution because that would prevent it from being used.  I didn't smell it until I opened it, so the smell is on the inside.  I only smell it when I'm close to it with the doors open (I forgot to mention that it has doors).  But I also don't want the things inside the bookcase to acquire the smell.  Bubba73 You talkin' to me? 17:48, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * I would expect that they will acquire the smell. Perhaps you can store things inside which are easily washed, or where you don't care about the smell ?  Outside Christmas decorations, for example.  Or you could put a sealed storage bag around items you place inside.StuRat (talk) 17:53, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * If it has doors that could be a plus because that could confine treatment to the interior. They talk about the topic at Air freshener. Bus stop (talk) 18:08, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Forgive me if this seems over-obvious, but have you tried discreetly enquiring of your parents or other relatives from their house what may have caused the smell? You needn't describe it as a problem if that might cause offense, you could merely remark on a "distinctive" odour that you can't quite put a name to.
 * If you can find out the smell's origin, we/you might be able to think of ways to tackle it. I'm assuming it isn't something deliberately introduced, such as scented varnish or polish, or inherent to the wood (some aromatic woods, such as camphorwood, are deliberately used to make chests for clothes, etc) to which you're having an idiosyncratic reaction. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 90.193.78.51 (talk) 18:35, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * I know what caused the smell. When the house was built in 1963/64, my father insisted on using creosoted lumber for the subfloor (the boards on top of the frame and below the floor boards you walk on), against everyone's advice. There has never been a problem with termites, but the house has always had the creosote smell.  About the early 1980s they sealed the floor with polyeurothane (sp?) and that cut out the great majority of the smell.  However, the bookcase has been in the house 40+ years. Bubba73 You talkin' to me? 18:51, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * There's your answer then. If it won't ruin the appearance, use polyeurothane or another sealant on the inside of the bookcase. once you have applied two coats and it's dried you should eb good to go. Beeblebrox (talk) 19:09, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * It is an antique, 110-130 years old. I don't want to ruin its value as an antique (which that might).  Bubba73 You talkin' to me? 20:27, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * In time the smell should dissipate. Keeping the doors open should facilitate this. When out of the house, perhaps the doors should be left open. Cedar is very nice-smelling. A few blocks of cedar wood in the bookcase might help. Bus stop (talk) 23:04, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Well, 32 hours after getting it in my house, the smell is diminishing from the furniture (but not from the books that came out of it). Bubba73 You talkin' to me? 02:53, 16 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Yes, the absorbent surface area of books makes them able to hold far more stench. You might want to just seal those up in storage bags or store them away. StuRat (talk) 19:48, 20 December 2011 (UTC)


 * For the books: Open a large garbage bag. Put in 1 bag of clay kitty litter. Stack in the books. Pour in 1 more bag of clay kitty litter. Close the bag. Pull out a book and check in 1 week. If still smelly, bag it back up for 1 more week. Continue until all books have been de-scented. (had a ton of books from an aunt that believed heavily in burning really icky incense...now I have a functional library)68.32.251.73 (talk) 14:11, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

Bubba73 You talkin' to me? 00:12, 18 December 2011 (UTC)

"4G": when did it become an advertising mantra, what does it mean really, is it as empty as it appears? Where's my 5G phone?
It seems in the last few years for every hour of television there is two hours of commercials for electronic devices screaming they are 4G! ; because they are 4G we will swoon at the wonderfulness of their product, which is 367 times faster than grandmas phone or whatever, and will make you chicken soup when you're sick. I understand it means fourth generation but how/when/why did this phrase, which means nothing at me, become their banner call. I asked my co-workers yesterday if anyone really knew what the hell it meant other than "fourth generation" and everyone shrugged. When will we have 5G (that I expect will tuck our kids in and take out the garbage) and what will it entail?--108.46.103.88 (talk) 13:43, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * 4G --Viennese Waltz 14:12, 15 December 2011 (UTC)

Confusion has been caused by some mobile carriers who have launched products advertised as 4G but which are actually current technologies, commonly referred to as '3.9G', which do not follow the ITU-R defined principles for 4G standards. 5G has been established but I don't believe any public phones have implemented it. TheGrimme (talk) 15:26, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * As mentioned several times in th 4G article, most of the '4G' phones you hear about are not actually 4G. It has become a buzz word.


 * A lack of enforcement of deceptive advertising laws is to blame here. This has also led to rental cars all advertised as being one size class larger than they are, and "LED TVs" which are just LCD TVs with LED backlights. StuRat (talk) 16:32, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * You mean the deceptive advertisers themselves are blameless just because they're not being properly held to account?  --   Jack of Oz   [your turn]  18:44, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Not at all, their guilt is obvious, just as it would be for muggers, if cops didn't bother arresting them, and they subsequently ran wild. StuRat (talk) 03:35, 16 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Similarly, the Atari Jaguar was marketed as the first 64-bit game console, though the "64-bit" claim is dubious, as the article discusses. Atari apparently made "64-bit" a central marketing argument as to why consumers should lust after the object.  Comet Tuttle (talk) 20:15, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Relax. Take two Gigis and call me in the morning. Clarityfiend (talk) 21:45, 15 December 2011 (UTC)

I'm old enough to remember when programming languages were described as 2nd or 3rd Generation, and 4th Generation was the arriving, next great thing. The numbering all seemed to stop after that. HiLo48 (talk) 23:24, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * And when Microsoft Word jumped from 2.0 to 6.0 to keep up with WordPerfect. ---— Gadget850 (Ed)  talk 03:20, 16 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Ha ha. Yes. HiLo48 (talk) 04:08, 16 December 2011 (UTC)


 * That's nothing, Windows went from version 3.1 to 95. Mitch Ames (talk) 11:50, 16 December 2011 (UTC)
 * And then to 2000! APL (talk) 01:20, 18 December 2011 (UTC)
 * And is XP = 999,999,999,999,990 in extended Roman numerals? -- ToE 07:16, 19 December 2011 (UTC)


 * What about Chrome OS - it started at version Googol. Mitch Ames (talk) 11:52, 19 December 2011 (UTC)

Calculating average utilization of equipments
What is the correct method of calculating the average utilization of equipment over a period of time. I am just confused between the two methods that can be used for calculation:

Total number of hours available for:                    17 (May-11),		9 (Jun-11)

Total number of hours actually used for:                13 (May-11),		6 (Jun-11)

Method 1:

Utilization calculated for each month and then averaged:	0.764705882(=13/17 for May-11), 	0.666666667(=6/9 for Jun-11)

Average utilization:						72% (average of 0.764705882 & 0.666666667) and then % Method 2: Total number of hours available for (May+Jun):			26 (=17+9 for May-11 & Jun-11)

Total number of hours actually used for (May+Jun):		19 (=13+6 for May-11 & Jun-11) Taken the sum of both numerator and denominator and then calculated the utilization:		73% (=19/26 and then %) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 115.249.53.242 (talk) 14:58, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Both are valid, depending on what you want to show.
 * Method 2 seems more logical to me and gives you a real average utilisation: the average total usage time over availablilty. It shows that 73% of the time is used.
 * Method 1 seems to give you the "average monthly usage", rather than the real average utilisation time, but in some cases you want to show that every month, you have only a 71.5% ustilisation (using the average of the monthly averages). --Lgriot (talk) 15:34, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Yes, method 1 is the average of the monthly averages. Method 2 is the average over the 2-month period, and is considered the "mathematically correct" method, especially when combining periods of different lengths (31 days and 30 days).    D b f i r s   16:50, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * The phenomenon that with appropriately chosen numbers averages of averages can be somewhat misleading (at least if comparisons are involved) is Simpson's Paradox. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.232.241.211 (talk) 17:56, 15 December 2011 (UTC)

What's my ideal job?
I'm currently unemployed. This is, frankly, a bit of a bummer, but it does give me the chance to think a little about where I want my life to go. Trouble is, I'm not sure what I want to do when I grow up (which I keep expecting to happen one day), and so I hoped I might be able to crowd-source a career path.

Some info about me: I'm 27, male and from the UK. I'm currently living in London, but prepared to move elsewhere in the country, Scandinavia, Western Europe or somewhere else (in descending order of appeal) should the right job be available. I'm educated to A-Level, and spent 3 years at university studying mechanical engineering. I didn't really enjoy the subject, and so didn't graduate.

Since then, I've worked in the motor trade, both as a salesman and as an administrator. I spent the last 18 months or so living and working in Sweden on the 22nd World Scout Jamboree. I've been a member of The Scout Association for over 20 years, and have received a fair bit of training through them, so I'm happy working as a volunteer, in a team or alone, and with children.

My areas of strength seem to be in project management, particularly organising events, and I enjoy getting 'down and dirty' with the organisation of things - I'd rather get stuck in to a project than simply issuing directions to other people, although I can do the latter as well.

My work experience has taught me that I am happiest when working to achieve some sort of benefit to others, rather than simply to make someone rich. This doesn't necessarily mean working for a charity - it could be in customer service where you aim to solve people's problems.

Skills: I'm pretty good with computers, skilled user of MS Office, and I can pick up most software very easily. I consider myself to communicate well in written and spoken English, I speak pretty average Swedish, bad German and awful French. I'm fairly mathematically aware, and have a healthy scepticism that comes in handy when assessing information I've been given.

So, given all of that, what should I be looking for in a job? I've been trying to find something in the field of project management/event organisation for a charity, but having been knocked back from a few jobs I wonder if my skills would fit something else better. I'd love to hear suggestions, and I'd be happy to provide more info if it's needed. Thanks in advance for helping me with this rather indulgent request. - 2.25.98.245 (talk) 15:47, 15 December 2011 (UTC) (I am actually a registered user but I'm logged out right now since I've posted a little more personal info than may be entirely healthy)

Why not try the Services, you already have the skills that any of the three would need. I know they are cutting back, but they still have to recruit new labour anyway. Good luck in your hunt! (By the way, at 27 you could consider yourself grown-up already!)85.211.148.143 (talk) 16:31, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Hmm, interesting thought. However, unfortunately, I think a couple of seizures I had about 5 years ago (possible epilepsy, although they haven't recurred) would preclude me from that. Also, I'm not really sure I'm the right sort of person for a military life. I am, to coin a phrase, a lover, not a fighter. Thanks for the thought though. 2.25.98.245 (talk) 17:06, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * See http://www.personalitytype.com/.
 * —Wavelength (talk) 17:20, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * http://www.selectsmart.com/topjobs.html
 * Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 > haneʼ 17:23, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Thanks for these links. From the first, I am 'Introvert, Sensor, Thinker, Perceiver'. The second I felt was not too useful, since most of the questions I would answer as 'meh' (e.g. do you want to work inside or outside, do you feel happier wearing a suit or a uniform). However, for what it's worth the top result was Farm and home management advisors. Honestly, I'm not sure what one of those is. I'll investigate... - 2.25.98.245 (talk) 17:57, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * You get paid for telling people how to milk their cows properly LOL Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 > haneʼ 18:12, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I think that would quite quickly result in me being told exactly where I could stick my advice on milking practice... ;-) - 2.25.98.245 (talk) 19:46, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * How about a Meeting and convention planner? Your ambiguous stance on topics of interests would suggest to me anyway that you would fit in well with the task of facilitating other people's required conventions and meetings and events that punctuate their career activities. Bus stop (talk) 18:31, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * This is rather interesting. I shall look further. Thank you! By the way, I noticed that the article is quite US-centric. Anyone know if the same job exists in the UK? (I'm sure it does, but maybe has a different name which I can't think of right now...) - 2.25.98.245 (talk) 19:46, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * I'd rather get stuck in to a project than simply issuing directions to other people - I doubt there's any job in the modern world that is just "issuing directions to other people". Dickensian archetypes die hard in our collective memories, it seems.  Management roles include an element of decision making impacting on others, but it's far better to work as a team and have frequent workplace discussions that leave people feeling they've made as much of the decision as you have that they are now going to be doing some task or other.  Your background and experience equip you for many types of jobs, and your problem is whittling all the possibilities down.  Whatever you do, please never grow up.  --   Jack of Oz   [your turn]  18:35, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Don't worry, current evidence is that growing up won't happen just yet. I agree with what you say about giving directions, I just meant to say that I'm not necessarily looking for a purely management role, I do enjoy doing actual work as well. Have you noticed that almost every single job nowadays is 'such-and-such manager' or 'this-and-that coordinator'; if every employee is a manager, who are they managing? - 2.25.98.245 (talk) 19:46, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Don't think of it in those binary terms of the bosses vs. the bossed. Think of it as a circle, with everyone around the perimeter having a certain role to play, and with everyone interacting and communicating with everyone else.  Some roles will include guiding others or directing others, that's all.  Titles by themselves are just frippery, but if they serve an ego-purpose, they have their place. --   Jack of Oz   [your turn]  20:47, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * I'm an American, so pardon my ignorance of the UK; but what about joining the UK equivalent of America's Peace Corps? (The links at the bottom of that article include one to the European Voluntary Service, though I don't know anything about that.)  This might be a place to get more project management experience and subsequently not get "knocked back" from PM jobs at charities, if that's what you're interested in.  Where I live, it seems that software companies always have open positions for PMs; maybe you should hit up every company you can in order to get a PM job, with the aim of doing that for a few years and mastering the craft, in order to increase your desirability as an employee, so you can have greater freedom to pick where you would like to work five years from now.  Good luck - Comet Tuttle (talk) 19:09, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * It's funny you should say that - the European Voluntary Scheme was how I got to working in Sweden. I spent 4 months volunteering, and they liked me so much that they asked me to come back and get paid! Unfortunately it was only a short project, so that's now over, but it was good while it lasted. To be honest I had kinda hoped that now, having got the first bit of experience, it might be easier to find the right job, but I'm starting to think that's not so. But maybe I should just keep perservering - 2.25.98.245 (talk) 19:46, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Teaching? Particularly Outdoor Education? But maybe any other teaching field that appeals as well? HiLo48 (talk) 19:44, 15 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Following on from other comments above. Event management is the area you might wish to consider. You're in London: maybe you could contact the venues such as Earls Court and Olympia, the O2, Excel, to see if there are any vacancies. For example, a couple of weeks ago Earls Court were recruiting for an event manager. This is the link person between the venue and the people running the event. Maybe worth a phone call? Whatever, you could contact them for advice as to how to get into the field. And it has the plus point you get to see some pretty good gigs too. I'd love to have been the event manager for the Pink Floyd gigs at Earls court... and the Great British Beer Festival is at Olympia next year... If you really want to get into working for a charity, maybe talking to Community Service Volunteers or your local Volunteering Centre would help. But bear in mind that this sector has been hit particularly hard by the recession (at the precise time that their services are more in demand than ever) and the only positions on offer may be purely unpaid. --TammyMoet (talk) 10:25, 16 December 2011 (UTC)


 * What about a move to beautiful Scotland for a much more laid back life style, (and cheaper), than London and maybe use your engineering skills in the oil or renewable industries which are expanding there.85.211.148.143 (talk) 13:17, 16 December 2011 (UTC)


 * I have some experience of the UK charity sector. To break in to those kinds of roles you mention, you need experience. One way you can get the experience is to (initially) volunteer. Pick a 'brand name' charity, whose aims you like - there are loads in London to choose from. Ring them up and ask to speak to someone in HR. It's quite a normal pipeline into working in this kind of field... and your dole officer might go easy on you too. --Dweller (talk) 14:45, 16 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Other people have told me I should do this, but I've never quite found the confidence. I think I'm not really sure what I would say - do you mean I should enquire whether there are any jobs available, or are you thinking I can ring them for advice? I think I'd probably feel a bit guilty ringing someone and doing that - 2.25.78.108 (talk) 17:42, 16 December 2011 (UTC)


 * How about a party planner or wedding planner ? BTW, a "hands-on manager" is the way we describe a manager who does more than just giving orders, here in the US (although admittedly it sounds like a manager who gets a bit too friendly with the secretaries). StuRat (talk) 15:42, 16 December 2011 (UTC)

I'd just like to say thank you to everyone for these great responses. They have been a massive help. To be honest, I think I had got into a little bit of a rut - every time I looked at a job description I was finding one or two skills I didn't have, and so rejecting the job. However, following all the kind words above, I have spent today knocking out applications like a madman - having come to the conclusion that if there's one or two skills on the spec that I don't have, that generally means that I do have the other 95%. In particular, I've found a job to apply for working in event organisation in motorsport (didn't mention - big fan!) so all in all, a successful day, in large part thanks to the support of you guys up there. Thank you. - 2.25.78.108 (talk) 17:42, 16 December 2011 (UTC)


 * If you are a registered Wikipedian who's staying logged-out for privacy, you may be interested in this events organiser post just advertised by Wikimedia UK... Shimgray | talk | 20:06, 16 December 2011 (UTC)


 * I'm sure that we all wish you luck in your search and will be interested to know which road map that you follow!85.211.148.143 (talk) 08:00, 17 December 2011 (UTC)

Glasses lenses
I had to get some new lenses for my glasses and I already had 2 pairs with the same prescription but different frames. I told them to just get new lenses for one of the frames but after they arrived and were supposedly fitted I realised that I think I took in the wrong frame so I think they may have not actually given me the new lenses. If I went to another optician, is there a way they could check the prescription of my lenses? --178.208.197.76 (talk) 19:10, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Yes, opticians have instruments that can measure the diopters of spectacle lenses. I have seen one used to determine my lenses, no citations, but I believe my eyes, even when I wasn't wearing my specs. I think that the lenses also have the dioptres on the surface of the lens and visible at certain angles. Whoa, just found lensmeter, see what you think. Richard Avery (talk) 19:32, 15 December 2011 (UTC)

And on further looking, it's a vertometer that measures the dioptres of a lens. Richard Avery (talk) 22:42, 15 December 2011 (UTC)

wut is the user names of the various ppl who are in the wikipedia fundraiser banners
Sometimes it tell me their real name but i would like to know the WIKIPEDIA USER NAME of EVERY ONE of those ppl who are in the banners. if it is top secret you do not ahve to tell for privacy reason, but if it is not secret i would like to know these things — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.228.90.14 (talk) 23:42, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
 * One such person is User:Jorm (WMF), mentioned here. StAnselm (talk) 01:07, 16 December 2011 (UTC)
 * And User:Jimbo Wales pops up quite often. --Colapeninsula (talk) 10:04, 16 December 2011 (UTC)
 * The people are all listed in the table at, although that doesn't include their usernames. Warofdreams talk 16:24, 16 December 2011 (UTC)
 * It's entirely possible that the users don't want their user ID's known. Wales is an obvious exception, of course. But what about the pictures used in those announcements? Are they accessible somewhere in commons? ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:17, 16 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I don't think so. The pictures are drawn from a category on Meta-Wiki, although they are licensed as CC-BY-SA-3.0, so could be included on Commons if they were useful. Warofdreams talk 10:26, 17 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Good grief man, it's "What are", not "wut is". Please, have a care for standardized spelling when you come here. Vranak (talk) 16:12, 18 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I think it is standardized spelling. The standard in question is txtspk. Card Zero  (talk) 17:53, 18 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Was the meaning of the question unclear to a native English speaker? ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:54, 18 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Of course not -- but such miserable spelling offends my sensibilities. Vranak (talk) 18:06, 20 December 2011 (UTC)