Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Miscellaneous/2013 October 1

= October 1 =

Ubersexual
I've heard about this term but don't know quite well what does it mean? Men who are ugly but good persons?  Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  17:26, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * There's an explanation of sorts at Metrosexual. Stylish, well groomed, socially and politically aware, and unambiguously heterosexual, apparently. - Ka renjc (talk) 18:01, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Who else can be added to that list apart from Beckham, possibly George Clooney? What'sin the apparently link? I have no Internet access so I cannot follow it.  Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  18:05, 1 October 2013 (UTC)


 * Star Trek and Hobbit villain, Bandersnatch Cumberbund, certainly. μηδείς (talk) 18:40, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Still photos don't do him justice, so see him here in Star Trek: Into Darkness. μηδείς (talk) 18:48, 1 October 2013 (UTC)


 * The "apparently" link above is to a puff piece at The Guardian that begins: It's good news for traditional American men. The metrosexual is dead: long live the übersexual. After dominating US style and fashion for several years, the ideal of the modern male as someone who cared about fashion and skin care as much as a woman did is about to be swept aside by a return to old-fashioned, masculine values: fine wines, cigars and red-blooded heterosexuality.... 'Ubersexuals are confident, masculine and stylish, and committed to uncompromising quality in all areas of life,' said Marian Salzman, co-author of a new book, The Future of Men" μηδείς (talk) 18:52, 1 October 2013 (UTC)


 * Oh, so do Bono and Daniel Craig fit in the category? Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  18:51, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * I would say so, but others may have a different idea of male sexuality. --TammyMoet (talk) 20:09, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Tammy, I don't understand this but others may have a different idea of male sexuality. Sorry, it's because of my English.  Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  20:14, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * People may not all agree on how to define masculinity or attractiveness. I like Bono's singing voice, but don't find his speaking voice attractive. μηδείς (talk) 20:35, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Oh, I get it now. I must add that I do find sexy and attractive Bono's speaking voice. Not because I like him or he is my favourite singer, but because he has this certain accent and a rasping voice. I don't know how is it now. I haven't heard him speaking since 2009, but I liked that voice.  Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  12:15, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Hehe, raspy, low-class accented, and high pitched are my objections. The really sexy U2 video is Numb.  I suppose I shouldn't say Irish accents are low-class, but they are not posh.  I much prefer Fiona Shaw and Tilda Swinton to Bono as men.  I am curious what you think of the young Boy George? μηδείς (talk) 21:07, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * μηδείς, I must confess I haven't heard about Boy George ever.
 * I find Larry Mullen Jr.'s Irish accent different to Bono's, I've never known why, but I do.
 * As for the video, when I see Bono singing, I just wish I was Ali Hewson, as well as when I watch the video for Stay (Faraway, So Close!). He really looked great at his 30s :P.
 * And what do you mean by  I much prefer Fiona Shaw and Tilda Swinton to Bono as men. -- Aren't they women?  Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  15:19, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Fiona Shaw played the role of Richard II in a 1990's adaptation of the shakespeare play. It is almost impossible to obtain.  Tilda Swinton played the title character Orlando of a sex-changing immortal in the story by Virginia Woolfe. μηδείς (talk) 17:43, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
 * So μηδείς are you saying that those women look more masculine than Bono??  Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  17:53, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
 * I don't want to keep going on about my opinions, I would just say they are very charismatic. See also Jodie Foster and Angela Basset. μηδείς (talk) 18:02, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
 * There's no accounting for taste. To me, this guy looks like a European version of Greg Marmalard. Who, by the way, was impotent. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 04:30, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
 * What do you mean Baseball Bugs??  Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  15:19, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
 * One of the characters in the movie Animal House. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 16:31, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Baseball Bugs I haven't seen that movie, so I don't know the character, therefore I don't understand your comment very well. Can you explain? Pleaseee.  Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  16:33, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
 * I suspect Bugs is comparing Mr. Cumberbund above to the Animal House character, not Bono. μηδείς (talk) 18:02, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
 * I suspected it too, after searching in Wikipedia's pages. I found this picture File:Jack_Tate,_James_Daughton.jpg.   Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  18:12, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes, and I'm strictly talking about appearances. I know nothing about Bandersnatch otherwise, besides the fact that the name is from "Jabberwocky". Marmalard was a highly self-important member of a snobbish fraternity, which of course was right next door to the fraternity nicknamed "Animal House" (actually Delta House) in the movie. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 21:46, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
 * You really should see Star Trek: Into Darkness, it's almost as fun as the first reboot. μηδείς (talk) 18:20, 4 October 2013 (UTC)
 * The movie has been in my external HDD for weeks μηδείς, but I haven't seen it yet, I was telling JethroBT that I was going to start watching Star Trek (the original).

Oh, and I started reading Cyrano. The only copy I could get was in English, so it is going to take longer until I finish it.  Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  17:50, 7 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Cool. We read it in fourth-year French. μηδείς (talk) 17:55, 7 October 2013 (UTC)

Breathing masks for cold weather
I was surprised that they don't sell breathing masks in shops for winter gear. Searching the net, I only found a few items, but if you buy online you run the risk that it won't fit well, or that there are problems (e.g. that your glasses will fog over). So, where can you buy breathing masks that allow you to breath warm humid air when it's below -20 C outside? I need to be able to do hard exercise outside, below -20 C you risk damaging your airways and lungs. Count Iblis (talk) 17:31, 1 October 2013 (UTC)


 * Do you mean balaclavas? --TammyMoet (talk) 20:07, 1 October 2013 (UTC)


 * Or a scarf covering the mouth has the same effect of slowing the rate at which air enters the mouth, and mixing it with exhaled air, so it's warmer and moister. That approach might not be good while doing heavy exercise, though, as then you need more fresh air.  I'm not sure it's wise to do heavy exercise outside in such weather, as that would really require carrying a heater/humidifier with you.  StuRat (talk) 22:35, 1 October 2013 (UTC)


 * I have some experience with running at -20C and below. I find a buff (headgear) a lot more comfortable than a scarf. The problem with both at low temperatures is that the humidity in the air you exhale freezes immediately in the scarf/buff, making it really unpleasant to wear. So when it's really cold, I prefer wearing a mask which protects the skin of my face, and keep a slow pace which allows me to both inhale and exhale through the nose. --NorwegianBluetalk 23:09, 1 October 2013 (UTC)


 * The advantage of a buff/scarf over a balaclava/ski mask is that you can reposition it when it freezes up, to find a clear spot to breath through. And yes, that was my point on not doing heavy exercise outside when it's that cold, as that would require unrestricted access to fresh air in order to get enough oxygen, or extraordinary measures, like wearing a portable heat exchanger. StuRat (talk) 09:23, 2 October 2013 (UTC)


 * This one appears to use a counter-current principle for warming the air you inhale. I haven't tried it myself, so I can't vouch for it. --NorwegianBluetalk 20:52, 1 October 2013 (UTC)


 * Who says -4 F is damaging? Rmhermen (talk) 21:30, 1 October 2013 (UTC)


 * ,, . --NorwegianBluetalk 22:08, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * None of those mention -20 C and only one mentions damage. 75.41.109.190 (talk) 01:44, 3 October 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, the one from the Swedish webshop looks worthwhile to try out. Count Iblis (talk) 23:46, 2 October 2013 (UTC)

Cheap touch phone

 * I’ll be needing a cheap android phone, and looking at amazon it seems that they all are plastics and besides it’s almost impossible to find one model that also sell a metallic case or at least a rough hard case that fit it…
 * I’m thinking in getting this or something like it:

http://www.amazon.com/BLU-Unlocked-Quad-Core-Processor-4-5-inch/dp/B00DMI9N32/ref=sr_1_7?s=wireless&ie=UTF8&qid=1380564535&sr=1-7
 * Is there any metal carcass for it? Or maybe another model with similar specs but with more accessories like… a metallic carcass!?
 * It not have to be shiny nor aluminum nor anything fancy nor last forever, just some hard shell that could take a hit or two for a couple of months… and, if possible, decent: black, gray, or white…
 * Thanks
 * Iskánder Vigoa Pérez (talk) 17:41, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * It sounds like you're interested in durability. Bear in mind having a metal case doesn't really guarantee the phone will be more durable. Having a metal case is not going to help you if your screen shatters or cracks, nor is it going to help you if the case breaks apart, nor is it going to help you if your phone simply stops working without the externals showing that much signs of damage. Personally I would trust a plastic phone in a (properly fitting) OtterBox Defender or Griffin Survivor  or probably any case listed here  ]   more than I will a cheap phone with a metal case and you will note that while impact resistance of these cases is a a bit important, more important is their ability to absorb impacts. In fact, rugged Android and other smart phones do exist      , not surprisingly they tend to use similar design principles. Of course such cases and phones are not cheap, but I think it does illustrate the point you're likely approaching this from the wrong direction unless you have some other reason why you want a metal case. Nil Einne (talk) 18:21, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * What do you want to protect, the case or the insides? I would have thought that a plastic case would protect the insides better as it would absorb more of the impact energy, rather like a bumper on a car is designed to crumple and save the occupant. I think one would need to do some experiments or see some statistics to decide on this. Anyway some padding outside is bound to help I guess. Dmcq (talk) 18:33, 1 October 2013 (UTC)


 * You can get rubber or similar cases for phones, if you search using the word "rugged" on Ebay you will find hundreds. --TammyMoet (talk) 20:06, 1 October 2013 (UTC)


 * No, no… seems like I’m having a hard time with the English here… I’m not looking for durability… I’m looking for a cheap cheap plastic phone that doesn’t have to last… well, if it last, then better, but that’s not required, what I really need is a fast phone, multi-touch, capacitive… and important, dual sim is a most, the case is intended to help the little guy to make it at least 2 months in a hostile environment…
 * Dmcq, the absorbing behavior sound logic but in my personal experience I had observed a lot of things beating the ground and the metallic ones live for another day… not the same good luck with plastics
 * If you get a galaxy (pretty expensive and anyway… plastic) you always can buy a separate metallic carcass, is this a bad thing? A good thing? Well it doesn’t matters but you can do it… what I need is a phone relatively fast and inexpensive 100-150 and with two SIM and with the same possibilities of buy a metallic carcass for it
 * The links for the water drops protection and the griffin are very useful… the griffin is listed at amazon at only 12 usd, thank you very much
 * I know I can find hundreds of phone cases… but I only need one, one for the model that linked at the beginning… I’m not saying that there is none one for it… I’m saying I don’t find it
 * When I said “case” what I really wanted to say was shell, or protector, bumper, carcass…
 * Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by Iskander HFC (talk • contribs) 00:25, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * It sounds like you're saying you don't care about durability but then you go on to say you do care about durability. In particular, you keep saying you want a metal case, but the only reason you have given for wanting one is for durability reasons. If I may take a guess, I think what you're trying to say is you do care about durability, but it doesn't have to be as rugged as to survive a 50 metre drop or being run over by a jeep or something.
 * If that's the case, I don't think anyone is suggesting you need or want or need such a phone. Rather what's we're suggesting is that if you want a more durable phone, that is one that can survive drops, impacts etc, looking for a phone with a metal case because you think it will better survive is a mistake.
 * The design of highly rugged phones shows this. If you actually look carefully at phone breakages, I think you will also find similar results from reports. Meaning a phone with a metal case is not inherently more durable than one without, and in fact it may be less durable on average.
 * Of course most phones with metal cases are expensive ones and an expensive phone even if not designed for extremely durablity will usually give some thought to durability. So such a phone may very well be more durable than an ultra cheap phone. That doesn't mean if you can find a ultra cheap metal phone it's going to be highly durable. In fact there's good reason to think it will be less durable.
 * Note that I would say from my limited experience, the biggest point of weakness in touch screen smart phones is the screen (it obviously depends how the phone is dropped or hit). You can't of course have a metal screen.
 * As for metal cases for Galaxy, I think you will find most of these cases are sold and bought primarily for aesthetic reasons (looks) rather than for durability (they will frequently add some protection but that's not the reason they're metal). Most cases, even cheap ones, which primarily advertise protective ability are not metal ones.
 * Nil Einne (talk) 06:00, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * I checked the 5 brands mentioned here, but none of them seem to offer cases for BLU devices. Maybe they figure the market is too small. Ssscienccce (talk) 09:58, 2 October 2013 (UTC)


 * The HTC One is marketed in Europe on its all-metal body. The article says "The HTC One uses a unibody aluminum frame sourced from custom-grade aluminum; the choice of material was intended to give the device a solid, premium feel in comparison to smartphones made with a plastic shell."  However, it is currently HTC top model and is therefore quite expensive, and I doubt the large area of glass on the front will be any tougher than its competitors.
 * The harder thing might be the requirement for a Dual SIM (certainly a rarity in my country) which might severely restrict your choice of phone. Astronaut (talk) 18:14, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Ignore all that - I totally misread the question. I see now you are specifically looking for a case for the BLU phone you mention at the top.  According to their website there is no "BLU Dash 4.5", though there is a BLU Tank 4.5 which looks pretty similar, is pretty rugged and supports Dual SIM.  The full specifications (really a brochure) give the device's dimensions and compare it to a competing Samsung model.  There might not be a specific case for the BLU phone, but there could be one that will fit a very similar sized competitor and provide the protection you require.  Astronaut (talk) 18:43, 2 October 2013 (UTC)


 * That’s odd… yesterday I checked it in gsmarena.com against a Lenovo and a Samsung… everything around blue is weird… the same amazon page have a description in the title and a different one in the page’s content
 * and again it’s not about durability, if it finally brake in pieces I don’t care, that’s why I’m looking for a cheap phone, my sd is a SanDisk shockproof and waterproof, so I’m ok… the hard shield is for helping the phone to last around one or two months (more probably one or one and a halve) in an uncontrolled environment, that short period of time is certainly not “durability”
 * I haven’t buy it yet, and probably will get another brand…
 * well all the links have been very helpful, thank you very much, the griffing stuff could be handy even for my real phone
 * Thanks again for your time
 * Iskánder Vigoa Pérez (talk) 03:34, 3 October 2013 (UTC)


 * I doubt that Amazon will deliver to Cuba, BTW, just saying. OsmanRF34 (talk) 00:12, 4 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Hahaha… no man it doesn’t… this is another history, but thanks god I have that covered
 * Here again… what about this one ?
 * It’s not a quad core but I guess it’ll do it just fine… some idea if somebody is making a carcass for it? If not metal, at least a strong and solid looking one?
 * Iskánder Vigoa Pérez (talk) 01:45, 5 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Just so you know, "case" is the word you should probably be using. "Carcass" is usually used to refer to the body of a dead animal in English, although I can understand how a dictionary could have offered it as an option. K ati e R  (talk) 19:51, 7 October 2013 (UTC)

Name for a restaurant
What could be a good name for a fictional restaurant. Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  19:53, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * You need to tell us where it is and what type of food it serves. μηδείς (talk) 20:36, 1 October 2013 (UTC)


 * If it spans many cultures, you could call it The Melting Pot. --  Jack of Oz   [pleasantries]  20:39, 1 October 2013 (UTC)


 * The Dew Drop Inn. Bus stop (talk) 20:43, 1 October 2013 (UTC)


 * "You talkin' to me?" Tell Miss Bono too.  --   Jack of Oz   [pleasantries]  20:45, 1 October 2013 (UTC)


 * That was the indentation of sequence, not address. μηδείς (talk) 20:50, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Where do you come up with crap like that? --   Jack of Oz   [pleasantries]  22:07, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * I think of a man, and I take away reason and accountability? μηδείς (talk) 22:38, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Per the guidelines at the top: "We don't answer requests for opinions". RudolfRed (talk) 21:23, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * If she gave a place and menu we could easily give her the names of extant restaurants to work from. μηδείς (talk) 22:34, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * At the very least, the menu would need to be known. For example, I doubt you would call an ice cream parlor "Joe's Steakhouse". ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 22:05, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Oh, sorry it was midnight and night for me. Italian cooking, fancy restaurant, New York.  Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  12:20, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * How about "Cosa Nostra"? {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 212.95.237.92 (talk) 12:51, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * That sounds a little bit of mafia.  Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  13:01, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Maybe "Casa Nostra". Or "Casa di Pasta". Or if it's expensive, "Costa Lotta Pasta". It depends on the tone of your story. A name like "Vito's" might keep the patrons well-behaved. Let your imagination rome roam. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 13:30, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Context would probably matter to. That is, if you want the restaurant, or someone from the restaurant, to affect the main plot. If you're just writing about the protagonist having dinner there and nothing else happening there, what's the point? Or, the restaurant might not even require a name. If your fictional world had top drawer restaurants with no name. ☯ Bonkers The Clown  \(^_^)/  Nonsensical Babble  ☯ 13:33, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * I thought about some scene that Steve pointed out a few days ago about a restaurant and some crazy fan. But, even if I were to write a simple scene about the main characters having dinner, I have to name the restaurant, right? Or just say: David and Samantha had dinner at some restaurant.  Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  14:01, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * "Gertrude and Heathcliff went to Paolo's, their favorite upscale Italian restaurant." That's nice and Italian sounding, and it's also a subliminal message, as Bono's birth name is Paul. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 14:21, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * ;D. Paolo's sounds good. No comments about Bono :D. Which part of New York are the best restaurant? 5th Ave?. Also, I have another question but I don't think it deserves another section. I was thinking about a proposal, but I only can think of a bottle with the declaration printed in the label. Is that a good way or too common? Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  14:41, 2 October 2013 (UTC)


 * How about if "Marry me ?" is spelled out with food ? Spaghetti can form nice letters (or spaghetti sauce, for that matter).  The dot at the bottom of the question mark could be the ring. And you could do some foreshadowing with the name of the restaurant, and call it "La Torta di Nozze", which, if Google Translate is to be believed, means "The Wedding Cake". StuRat (talk) 15:50, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Good idea, StuRat. <span style="font-family:'Arial',cursive"> Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  16:33, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Having been asked to comment, I will say that expensive restaurants serve several courses of very small dishes, and holding the pasta in place to spell anything would be near impossible, even if you did have a huge plate to do it in. You could do it with fettucini on top of something, but it would look like an "art" project for second-graders.  You could do it with a few strands of linguini or vermicelli on top of nothing, but it wouldn't be a meal and the ring would slide or be mired in sauce.  You could get away with "Marry Me?" on top of a chocolate torte for two.  (The added benefit of that is that by dessert she is pretty much obligated.)  I could see this going on at Asia de Cuba which had courses at $30-$60 a piece when I used to go there before 9-11. Their Manhattan store is closed now, but they still have one or two on the left coast. μηδείς (talk) 20:59, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Just tangentially, fettucine and linguine are the preferable spellings for those two pasta shapes, because they are grammatically feminine. --Trovatore (talk) 21:01, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * I suppose it would be VERY naughty to suggest that you might be lucky enough to get some form of cunnalinguine... :) Lemon martini (talk) 22:51, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * You know, I was wondering about that, as I have got some of both in the closet, and I can visualize the "e" on the boxes, but I say the names with a final /i/, and the spellcheck didn't object either. What matters is that the links work, I think. μηδείς (talk) 21:11, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * It's very wrong to out others, not even if it's pasta. --  Jack of Oz   [pleasantries]  21:24, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * I am not sure what you mean by that, Jack.
 * Something about it being in the closet. --   Jack of Oz   [pleasantries]  00:29, 3 October 2013 (UTC)


 * You writing a book or something, Miss Bono? Remember to credit me if you use my idea, hurhur... I think "Luccios' Lumache" sounds posh. Don't explain the name; dedicated readers will figure it out on their own. ☯ Bonkers The Clown  \(^_^)/  Nonsensical Babble  ☯ 13:20, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * If I ever have my book published I will credit everyone here that have helped me :) Friends at the RefDesk. or give all the usernames? (O_o) <span style="font-family:'Arial',cursive">  Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  14:01, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Skip the credits, just send money. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 14:23, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * How much? <span style="font-family:'Arial',cursive"> Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  14:41, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * How much ya got? >:) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:07, 2 October 2013 (UTC)


 * It could be called The Mona Lisa. Bus stop (talk) 16:03, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Da + Italian Name - Da Leonardo, Da Toni, Da Giuseppe, Da Francesco, etc. Effovex (talk) 17:49, 2 October 2013 (UTC)


 * Okay, I'll have to admit I am totally clueless on this one, since in over 20 years of living in NYC I have never once gone to an italian restaurant--Italian is something that I cook at home. Given there's a French restaurant, The Frog and The Peach, whose name I have always liked, maybe an Italian version could be The Eel and the Artichoke. Or Lampreda. μηδείς (talk) 18:34, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * "Pastafazoola." It could have an advertising sign above the restaurant with a bowl of pasta with fake steam rising from it, and the slogan "Don't be a fool-a, eat atPastafazoola." (From a 1920's novelty song. Edison (talk) 20:45, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * If Pastafazoola is your notion of a fancy restaurant, you must be terrified by the prospect of eating at Olive Garden. :)  μηδείς (talk) 21:17, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Is that someone's subliminal way of saying "pasta for losers"? ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:07, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * How is this still open? This isn't a ref desk question. If Medeis is going to answer a question like this, then they shouldn't ever shut down any discussion. Bugs, you too. --Onorem (talk) 23:18, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * So box it up already. Pasta... to go! ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:38, 2 October 2013 (UTC)

你好 Count Iblis (talk) 23:39, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Why her thread should be closed because of personal hostility against someone else is beyond me, but I am quite sure Miss Bono knows "show" means muestra. μηδείς (talk) 00:21, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
 * I don't understand what's going on??!! What did I do wrong? <span style="font-family:'Arial',cursive"> Miss Bono  [hello, hello!]  19:32, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
 * You haven't done anything wrong. Just try to be more specific in asking for advice so we can give you answers such as this list of the ten most fancy Italian restaurants in the Village according to Yelp:

Charles Hanson's 169 Soul Jazz Oyster Bar 182 reviews American (Traditional), Dive Bars Lower East Side 169 E Broadway New York, NY 10002 Phone number (212) 641-0357 at hands) Ack! I did! I'm missing two rings..." Any bar who patrons and employees return a very expensive camera (and two not so expensive rings) back to this drunken girl is definitely a 1. Babbo Ristorante e Enoteca 1264 reviews $$$$ Italian Greenwich Village 110 Waverly Pl New York, NY 10011 Phone number (212) 777-0303 Um.  I think everyone who knows me knows that I'm cheap and broke most of the time...so I usually don't go to a ridiculously expensive restaurant...unless someone else is treating 2. Carbone 79 reviews $$$$ Italian Greenwich Village 181 Thompson St New York, NY 10012 Phone number (212) 254-3000 with their prices, they might end up being what they have "Widely Publicized" themselves as being an Old-School Downtown New York Italian Restaurant of The 1950's, instead of a super-expensive 3. Perla 142 reviews $$$ Italian Greenwich Village 24 Minetta Ln New York, NY 10012 Phone number (212) 933-1824 in the back of the restaurant. As with most NYC restaurants, the space is small, but it wasn't cramped and was actually quite cozy. I enjoyed sitting in the back and enjoyed watching 4. Lupa 798 reviews $$$ Italian, American (New) Greenwich Village 170 Thompson St New York, NY 10012 Phone number (212) 982-5089 This is celebrity chef Mario Batali's restaurant located in the West Village. We were unable to get a reservation at his most popular restaurant, Babbo so we settled for a strong alternate 5. Volare Restaurant 39 reviews $$$ Italian Greenwich Village 147 W 4th St Frnt New York, NY 10012 Phone number (212) 777-2849 is the bathrooms. 1 urinal in the men's room and toilet that is as old as the building the restaurant resides in. 6. State Room 15 reviews $$$ Italian, Gastropubs Greenwich Village 47 W 8th St New York, NY 10011 Phone number (212) 473-2800 Upon entering, the State Room has a great ambiance and sets your expectations high for a wonderful meal. However, as the meal went on, the food was really no better than most other Greenwich 7. Valbella 75 reviews $$$$ Italian West Village, Meatpacking District 421 W 13th St New York City, NY 10014 Phone number (212) 645-7777 district-style - a modern space shooting for the hip look. The prices were a little high for what we got, but I suppose that's what you get going to the "trendiest" restaurant in 8. Cipriani Downtown 124 reviews $$$$ Italian South Village 376 W Broadway New York, NY 10012 Phone number (212) 343-0999 Like most expensive restaurants, this place is great so long as you're not the one paying the bill. I started off with the famous bellini after hearing so much about it. It was pretty much 9. L'Artusi 553 reviews $$$ Italian West Village 228 W 10th St New York, NY 10014 Phone number (212) 255-5757 the glass to suit my tastes, he did not automatically recommend the most expensive choice on the menu. I will most definitely be back and I'll also have to try their sister restaurant… 10. Dieci 174 reviews $$$ Italian, Japanese East Village 228 E 10th St New York, NY 10003 Phone number (212) 387-9545 This is one of the most interesting restaurants I've eaten at in a long time. I've been over-exposed to Asian fusion, so am not usually expecting anything too original. Sometimes they don't


 * μηδείς (talk) 22:23, 3 October 2013 (UTC)


 * There is no hostility. This is just a completely inappropriate thread for the ref desk. --Onorem (talk) 00:23, 3 October 2013 (UTC)

مطعم الخنزير الذهبي Count Iblis (talk) 01:18, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Are there many Arabic restaurants with that name? μηδείς (talk) 19:12, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
 * As many as there are in Norway with the name "Restaurant råtten sild". Count Iblis (talk) 02:02, 4 October 2013 (UTC)

Apartheid in S.Africa and visitors
The articles on apartheid doesn't really cover this,so I thought I'd bring it here.How did apartheid practically work in the case of foreign visitors to S.Africa? For instance,a conference is being held in South Africa-would non-whites wishing to attend be refused or separated from other delegates-or for say a company that was sending a delegation to one of its South African offices-would they have to make sure the party was all-white or they would be split up? What about say for cruise ships docking at Cape Town-would someone be there to segregate people as they got off?I'm sure there are other similar examples that could be used Lemon martini (talk) 23:17, 1 October 2013 (UTC)
 * When the All Blacks toured South Africa in the early years Māori and any other non white players just didn't tour (NZ wasn't exactly free of racism at the time) . In the later years they were declare Honorary whites I think after South Africa decided in 1966 not to dictate who could be included in foreign teams Foreign relations of South Africa during apartheid Apartheid in South Africa. (The tours were still of course controversial.) Other sports has similar problems, e.g. in cricket generally only white teams from New Zealand, Australia and England toured, in the early days it was perhaps uncommon for there to be any non white players anyway for those teams, I think the D'Oliveira affair was the first case where it was a substanial issue. That was after South Africa had theoretically started to allow non white players from other teams but they alleged his inclusion was intentionally provocative so still refused his participation. Later when they began to allow non white players perhaps even wanting tours from places like the Carribean/West Indies or the South Asian nations, these country generally didn't want to tour anyway (and others also didn't think they should tour) so only South African rebel tours happened although when they did, I think non white players were generally treated as honorary whites. <Small>Not really relevant to your question but in a number of cases they of course went as far as theoretically allowing or promising selection by meritoracy regardless of race or at least allowing all races for their own teams e.g. South African Cricket Union & International cricket in South Africa from 1971 to 1981 or Apartheid South Africa and the Olympics . Anyway as our article notes, the concept or honorary white was also applied to others visiting or living in South Africa, particularly East Asians, in some cases partially due to trade relations. Nil Einne (talk) 05:01, 2 October 2013 (UTC)


 * The D'Oliveira affair tells a relevant story. South Africa would not allow Basil D'Oliveira, a "coloured" person selected in the English cricket team, into the country. England cancelled the tour. Our article notes "The D'Oliveira affair was widely seen as the defining action which led to South Africa's expulsion from international cricket." HiLo48 (talk) 05:33, 2 October 2013 (UTC)

Ah thanks so much-the Honorary whites pretty much seems to cover it-I hadn't heard of them before. So the strategic solution would be that if the XYZ Mining Corporation were bringing their Board of Directors to visit their South African mine,and some of them happened to be non-white,the country would just treat them as if they were white. And everybody is...'satisfied'. That clears up a lot of scenarios. Lemon martini (talk) 22:57, 2 October 2013 (UTC)