Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Miscellaneous/2015 June 14

= June 14 =

How do restaurants get their recipes?
So many Chinese, Indian etc etc places to eat on my local high street.

I know this sounds dumb, but how do they all get their recipes? In my life I know very very few people that could cook or memorize the whole menu purely off the top of their head. Surely they must all be using some sort of cook books? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.208.177.118 (talk) 17:39, 14 June 2015 (UTC)


 * The Curry Club has the answer in one of their recipe books, at least for Indian restaurants. They do have crib sheets hanging up for new chefs, but after a while you do memorise the recipes. What speeds things up is that they have some pots of ready-made basic sauces and stocks on the stove. So a typical recipe for, say, chicken jalfrezi might look like "1 spoon sauce, 1 spoon chicken, 1/2 spoon green peppers, 1/4 spoon chilies". --TammyMoet (talk) 18:13, 14 June 2015 (UTC)


 * Chains and high-end restaurants hire chefs and consultants to design and test market menu items for them. Many high-end restaurants are opened by experienced chefs with the capital to do so.  Chains are a little bit more governed by consultants and MBA's, see McDonald's plan to simplify menus.  Denny's used to change it's menus every time it got sold (twice while I worked there) or there was a management shakeup, although the underlying burger patties, chicken filets and so forth almost never changed, just the combinations and presentation.  (This was always presented to the staff, who laughed, by mangers who tried to keep straight factes.)  TGI Friday's and Bennigan's added novelty items developed by experts in order to copy and compete with each other.  These were regimented recipes meant to insure uniformity and cost efficiency as well as pleasing the customer.
 * But family owned restaurants (my family included) and two other businesses I know of were opened up by people who were raised in or had significant experience in the restaurant business--they didn't just spring into being. It was more like an associate doctor or lawyer opening up his own practice once he got the experience and saved up the capital.  They already knew how to cook the meal, it was just a choice of specifics and writing down a standardized recipe new cooks could learn and follow.  Items might be seasonal or go on special according to availability of recipe items more than on a desire to change a recipe.  This also applies for the Chinese restaurant I most often frequent--although the food there can differ radically depending on which head cook is on duty.  One interesting thing about chains is they have a "bible" with their recipes which is considered a trade secret and which they will defend with lawsuits and/or criminal charges if it is copied or stolen. μηδείς (talk) 00:21, 15 June 2015 (UTC)


 * A number of Chinese restaurants where I live actually buy their food from companies that assemble kits for different dishes. Not as easy as a TV dinner, but still not as complicated as buying ingredients from Sodexo or Sysco and figuring out the meal yourself.  There's enough actual cooking required that you could go to two restaurants that buy from the same company and think they're different -- but once you catch on to this you'll realize their eggrolls are are completely identical.  It'd almost be franchising if most of them didn't try to hide this and play up the "local restaurant" angle.  Still, a few of them don't bother hiding the company's address on their menus, and you can usually see the food company's truck showing up on certain nights (especially the larger buffets).  Ian.thomson (talk) 00:44, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
 * I regret to report fortune cookies do not come from wise blind Chinamen, lucky guessing dragons or ancestral old wives. They mainly come from Brooklyn and say whatever they're paid to say. If there's only one prediction, it is literally worthless. The second one costs five bucks, so that's the one to heed.
 * Originally, they came from Japanese American restaurants. When those went out of business, Chinese American restaurants yoinked them, and Japan has been "about" sushi ever since. Long, long before, Japan had yoinked that from China. InedibleHulk (talk) 05:23, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
 * I regret to have to report to you that "Chinaman" is considered an ethnic slur nowadays. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 06:16, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Isn't every word used to refer to a person considered offensive by someone? They way I use the word "human," even that is very offensive. 209.149.113.240 (talk) 13:34, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
 * No, there are non-perjorative terms to refer to cultural groups that people associate with. The simple term Chinese people or Chinese person works fine in gender-neutral contexts.  "Chinese man" or "Chinese male" would also work, depending on context and register.  -- Jayron 32 14:12, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Unless you play cricket. I suspect Bugs doesn't.  Ghmyrtle (talk) 14:06, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
 * But Medeis was using a figure of speech. There are actually no lucky guessing dragons so that's another group that doesn't need to be insulted. Or ancestral old wives, which by the way could be taken as offensively sexist were you to wish to. Itsmejudith (talk) 14:22, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
 * I assume InedibleHulk will be quite surprised to learn that he is my sock, . The Chinamen thing is an aberration out of California, in the east it's unknown out of universities and corporate and media grievance centers. I'll start wrrying about it once we stop saying Englishmen, Irishmen, Frenchmen, etc., μηδείς (talk) 18:25, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
 * The analogy would be with the non-existent words 'Englandmen', 'Irelandmen', 'Francemen' etc. --   Jack of Oz   [pleasantries]  21:24, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Even if that were true it would be irrelevant to any offense, and it's not true, since China, as in chinaware was the adjectival form at the time the word was coined. The offensiveness of the word has to do with identity politics and began in California Universities in the 70's where there was strong past history of anti-chinese prejudice because of cheap labor in the 1800's, along with highly discriminatory racist California laws.  See the article Chinaman (term). It's a shame we don't have the word Chinan, which would make perfect sense, but to me, saying "a Chinese" sounds like say "a Pekingese" or "a Pomeranian". It's virtually impossible to find an example of someone saying "You Chinaman!" as an insult, or any dictionary entry from the 50's or before indicating it is offensive.  I am sure we all know actually insulting names used for that purpose. μηδείς (talk) 03:45, 16 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Of all the lives I could be damned to lead, Medeis' sock is near the bottom.
 * Sorry for any offense. When I say "Chinaman", I mean the specific dated sterotypical Chinese man surrounded by an air of arcane knowledge and a wealth of assorted trinkets. This guy, basically. Not trying to imply that's all billion or so men from China. That'd be foolish. If I wanted to talk about them generally, I'd say "Chinese men". I'm politically incorrect, but even when I'm drunk, I only slur my words, not with my words. InedibleHulk (talk) 19:39, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
 * The actual guy behind the cookies (and Ian.thomson's eggrolls), Norman Wong, is not a "Chinaman". But he is a Chinese man, at least ethnically. InedibleHulk (talk) 19:47, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
 * "Wong" implies that he is from Hong Kong - which at that time did not consider themselves Chinese. Further, the Wongs are reputably from Taiwan, spread to Hong Kong as Wong and mainland China as Wang. So, ethnically, he is Taiwanese. Therefore, to be politically correct, we must refer to him as a Taiwanese-Hong Kongese-Chinese-American. But, that would imply that we should refer to Charlize Theron as an African-American. 209.149.113.240 (talk) 16:36, 16 June 2015 (UTC)

The above comment on Wong is utter nonsense. DOR (HK) (talk) 15:49, 19 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the clarity. Though for conciseness, I think we can also safely call him a "Brooklynite". Or "Mr. Wong".
 * Probably not cool to call him "Norman the Cookie Monster", for at least four reasons. InedibleHulk (talk) 17:11, 18 June 2015 (UTC)


 * Back to the original question. A restaurant's menu is typically determined by a chef, depending on the size of the cooking staff, this is often the person known as the executive chef, chef de cuisine, or someone else.  Individual recipes and cooking techniques may be documented in books, passed down via tradition or direct instruction, or any other of a number of methods used to preserve lore and knowledge, but the actual decision as to which recipes and dishes to offer is done by the executive chef, or the equivalent person at a particular restaurant.  -- Jayron 32 14:29, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
 * You are talking about haute cuisine, high-end residential hotels, and fancy chains and such, Jayron. It's a difference in pay, prestige and accreditation, and the use of a french word chef to replace the original English "head cook".  Most family restaurants simply have a head cook, as do the actual branches of chains. My favorite restaurant, Fritzy's of Old Bridge and then Freehold, NJ was run by the owner who was the head cook.  He'd grown up restauranteering in Switzerland and offered Steak au poivre, Chicken Marsala, and Schitzel mit Spaetzle, but he was not called the chef, and had no degree.  My father's grandmother was the head cook at our family restaurant before the war, which at one point had three locations and no chefs.
 * A rose by any other name... Changing the name of the thing does not change the nature of the thing. The human who is in charge of the kitchen by whatever name they choose to go by is the person who sets the menu.  You and or they and or any one else may use any name that they wish to describe that job in less letters than " the human who is in charge of the kitchen ".  It wouldn't change the nature of the job.   Jayron 32 03:29, 16 June 2015 (UTC)
 * It's somewhat contradictory to propose a proper name for a role and then say a rose by any other name back to back. In any case, I did mention this in my first bulleted point above ("Chains and high-end restaurants hire chefs and consultants to design and test market menu items for them") and I doubt you disagree with my explanation. One other thing I will mention is the odd situation in NYC.  When the publishing company I worked for went bankrupt, I immediately started looking for a cook's position (as well as other jobs for which I was qualified), but could not get hired in a kitchen anywhere.  If you were white you could get a job only if you had been an apprenticed chef or had a degree from a culinary institute.  But for lesser positions, restaurants simply would not hire white people, which I was told outright several times. The reasoning was that a white cook would be overqualified and liable to quit, while illegals (Dominicans and Mexican) were more loyal. μηδείς (talk) 18:13, 17 June 2015 (UTC)

Re using a blown fuse.
I have a blade type automotive fuse, it's only a 32v one rated at 5 amps. I managed to blow the fuse when a loose wire fell out of a terminal resulting in a melted fuse on the positive lead to the battery.

Now, inside the fuse there's a tiny metal wire that has obviously burnt at the very end. With a needle, I can push two tiny wires back together to re bridge them.

Is it safe now to re use this fuse? Or because the internal wire is a bit shorter does that mean it's no longer a 5 amp? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.116.245.228 (talk) 18:57, 14 June 2015 (UTC)
 * See fuse (automotive). It's _safe_, but, as the wire is mechanically broken, any vibration (such as one might experience in a moving car) will make the ends of the wire come apart and break the circuit.  If you can't get a replacement fuse, you might be able to cut open the blown fuse and attach the ends of the wire more permanently (by soldering, for instance), but getting a new fuse will almost certainly be less work.  The capacity of the fuse depends on the thickness of the wire, not the length, so it'll still be a 5A fuse if you repair it. Tevildo (talk) 19:31, 14 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Would it still be 5A though? Could the solder be of a different resistance and therefore make it maybe a 2A fuse, for instance? Dismas |(talk) 02:34, 15 June 2015 (UTC)


 * This is a question for a licensed electrician or a certified mechanic. We can't tell you what sort of accident, damage, or fire might be caused in your specific case.  Start by going to a trusted mechanic or automotive store with a help desk and ask them the best recourse. μηδείς (talk) 04:43, 15 June 2015 (UTC)


 * Yes, the safest procedure is to replace the fuse with one of the same rating (though why is it 32v?) I've repaired fuses in the same way that you did, but I would regard this as a temporary measure.  "licensed electrician or a certified mechanic" sounds a bit over the top to replace a fuse costing a few cents, but if safety is your main concern, then get an expert.    D b f i r s   09:10, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Apparently you stopped reading before I said ask at the help desk automotive store. I had a 15 year-old dodge dart in high school for which the parts were no longer made, and did the repairs myself (e.g., replacing a burst radiator hose with a jury-rigged hose from another model) by asking first at the Manny, Moe & Jack's help counter. Assuming the OP just wants a working car, that's the first step. If he wants to know if reusing a repaired fuse is "safe", that's a question for an expert. We can't see the fuse, don't know the state of the car, any advice we were to give would be blind speculation. μηδείς (talk) 18:15, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Since the IP geo-locates to Mississippi, I don't see why this person is trying to mend a broken fuse. Surely there are auto parts stores within a 10-15 minute drive of most everywhere in the state.  And a fuse will only cost a couple dollars for a pack of a dozen assorted sizes.  I agree that getting anyone more qualified or trained than the person behind the counter at said store is likely overkill.  That is, if this is for an automobile.  32v does seem odd...  Dismas |(talk) 10:13, 15 June 2015 (UTC)


 * Regarding the 32v, the rated voltage is the maximum voltage for which the fuse is designed to reliably interrupt, and thus should not match the nominal voltage of the circuit but should instead be greater than the maximum expected voltage. Per Fuse (electrical): Most automotive fuses rated at 32 volts are used on circuits rated 24 volts DC and below.  Some vehicles use a dual 12/42 V DC electrical system that will require a fuse rated at 58 V DC.  Per Fuse (automotive): North-American built automobiles up to 1981 had electrical systems protected by cylindrical glass cartridge fuses rated 32 volts DC and current ratings from 4 amperes to 30 amperes. These are known as "SFE" fuses, ... .  Fuse (automotive) does not state common rated voltages, but a quick search of online catalogs (such as this Jameco page: Standard Automotive Blade Fuse Voltage Rating: 32VDC) reveals 32v to be a common blade fuse rating as well. -- ToE 13:26, 15 June 2015 (UTC)