Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Miscellaneous/2015 March 29

= March 29 =

Underground Storage Device
What in heaven's name is that? KägeTorä - (影虎) ( もしもし！ ) 07:22, 29 March 2015 (UTC)


 * Probably a rather British usage of the word "device" to mean a storage room. (When it comes to language, the British should be left to their own devices.)  Although with a more mainstream meaning of "device" it could be something like a dumbwaiter was used to raise and lower them to the storage area. StuRat (talk) 07:36, 29 March 2015 (UTC)


 * I expect it's a typo. Alansplodge (talk) 09:32, 29 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Presumably it's a buried weapons cache, but I wouldn't call that standard usage. And Stu, there's a reason the language is called English.... 82.21.7.184 (talk) 10:54, 29 March 2015 (UTC)
 * I suspect 'device' means a 'complex container', which in this case has been buried underground. LongHairedFop (talk) 11:04, 29 March 2015 (UTC)
 * I wouldn't be entirely surprised if this is carefully vague legal jargon that could refer to a manual device, a powered device or an old device. Nanonic (talk) 16:54, 29 March 2015 (UTC)


 * It is just a euphemism or jargon to cover containers that prevent the ingress of moisture when buried. They can be as simple as a iron pipe of the right dimensions to contain (say) a single rife, a silica gel capsule and caped off at each end. I have never seen photographs published in the public domain so I will not offer further descriptions. Below a certain depth, they are 'thought' to  beyond the range of metal detectors but modern magnetic field detectors have no problem.--Aspro (talk) 18:26, 29 March 2015 (UTC)
 * I'd go with, except that (as a Brit) the use of the word "device" implies to me that it's not merely a receptacle, but some kind of work has been done to it, for example, a mechanism to drain water or some such. --Dweller (talk) 11:42, 2 April 2015 (UTC)


 * Although 'device' is most often used when speaking of something that 'performs' a mechanical, electric or nuclear action, etc. . In the broader sense it means anything 'made' for a specified  purpose. Therefore, a coat-hook is a 'device' for hanging one's coat on. Old water fire-extinguishers where very popular because they had a wide neck, allowing large objects (such as revolvers) to be placed inside. With an addition of a smear of pipe dope around the thread; moister could not penetrate. They could be left in the ground for years and years and many are probably still out there. P.S. Better buried at least ten inches down so that atmospheric oxygen doesn't corrode them.--Aspro (talk) 13:40, 2 April 2015 (UTC)

African American development in the US
First off, I make no assumptions here. I'm going by what I heard. The anecdote went along the lines of individuals who racially identify as AA still lag behind in capabilities and development even when raised in white households. As opposed to normal white adopted individuals.

Highly controversial but is this an urban legend or what. Any studies in this area to refer to? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.126.36.246 (talk) 13:22, 29 March 2015 (UTC)


 * Nope "Studies of mixed-race children and black children adopted by white parents suggest, however, that racial differences in test performance are largely if not entirely environmental in origin." In otherwords, African-American students raised by White parents don't show any achievement gap.  -- Jayron 32 23:46, 29 March 2015 (UTC)


 * The issue is more that of poverty (environment) than race. Black children in white homes in poverty areas will perform as others in poverty areas. It is not a U.S. issue (which is why I am not limiting it to African Americans, but blacks as a whole). Similarly, white children in black homes in a poverty area will perform as others in a poverty area. In the U.S. blacks disproportionately are poor compared to whites and, therefore, live in poor environments. If you explore the causes of black poverty in the United States, you will find a vast field of opinions. 209.149.113.207 (talk) 14:50, 31 March 2015 (UTC)


 * There are a whole host of unpacked assumptions here. First, the test group are "individuals who racially Identify as African American".  It's an open question whether that would apply to Redfoo or Chinua Achebe or even Eminem.  Second is the statement "still" which implies an assumed "already".  Then, of course, there's the comparison to "normal white" people, which could mean one assumes many whites are abnormal, or that all non-whites are not normal.  Perhaps the OP could clarify? μηδείς (talk) 17:13, 31 March 2015 (UTC)


 * I made my own assumption that the OP was American. Use of "African American" implies the OP is American since only an American would use a phrase that implies a continent of origin and a nationality to make reference to skin tone. In America, the media abuses the public with a daily onslaught of the "plight of the black race." The OP's question is obviously influenced and directed at this heavily slanted media influence. Therefore, the OP is not making assumptions. The OP is merely regurgitating the media. (Just today, I saw an article detailing the "hidden racism" exhibited by all white youth.) 209.149.113.207 (talk) 18:01, 31 March 2015 (UTC)


 * The assumptions I noted are all implicit in the way the question was asked. Whether or not the OP was conscious of the hidden premises or not I don't know, but when people start off their questions with a disclaimer it usually means they realize something is going on. μηδείς (talk) 19:41, 31 March 2015 (UTC)


 * I read it that whites adopting blacks was abnormal. Whether that meant "doesn't happen as often" or "not as so-and-so intended", I won't guess. InedibleHulk (talk) 04:58, 1 April 2015 (UTC)


 * The OP geolocates to some ways east of Moscow. (Russia, not Idaho.) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 20:00, 31 March 2015 (UTC)


 * Already checked that before Jayron even answered. We have lots of American editors who actually live in Nizhny Novogorod, and who don't use servers there as a proxy, so I don't know why we should suspect the user is from Idaho. μηδείς (talk) 00:48, 1 April 2015 (UTC)


 * Right. That was just for clarification. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 01:48, 1 April 2015 (UTC)


 * There are two, and only two possibilities, . Either the OP is Vladimir Zhirinovsky, or he isn't. μηδείς (talk) 02:01, 1 April 2015 (UTC)


 * The other possibility is that US black culture has an an anti-education bias. Successful blacks portrayed in the media often seem to be athletes, rap stars, or actors.  You rarely see much attention paid to academic success in the black community.  And this includes black-owned media.  (While the same is somewhat true of the portrayal of whites, there are some positive academic portrayals of whites in the media, like "The Future's So Bright, I Gotta Wear Shades" and numerous scientists in movies, etc.). StuRat (talk) 14:09, 2 April 2015 (UTC)

Ford car ID


I'm guessing a Ford Taurus, but Commons has different categories for different generations (see Commons:Category:Ford Taurus), and I'm not sure which one is the best fit. Nyttend (talk) 13:57, 29 March 2015 (UTC)


 * It's a Fusion, not a Taurus. This page shows a 2012 Fusion rear end that looks just the same. -- Finlay McWalterᚠTalk 14:11, 29 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Is it possible to say more specifically? Commons:Category:Ford Fusion (Americas) has several subcategories; I've checked all of them (except "in competition") without being able to decide.  Nyttend (talk) 14:40, 29 March 2015 (UTC)


 * I think it's a first generation (but futzing around with lighting cluster design is the kind of thing designers do on a model year basis, so I can't be sure). It's not a Mondeo (because it's in North America). I don't know how to tell if it's a hybrid; the hybrid normally comes with a badge to that effect, so it probably isn't one. -- Finlay McWalterᚠTalk 15:08, 29 March 2015 (UTC)


 * Seems to be a first generation Fusion with the (model year) 2010 facelift. Rgds ✦  hugarheimur 15:30, 29 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Commons:Category:Ford Fusion (1st generation) now applied. Thanks for the help!  Nyttend (talk) 17:32, 29 March 2015 (UTC)


 * Whoever uploaded that bank photo should have obscured the license plate. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 20:59, 30 March 2015 (UTC)


 * I agree, and dunnit. &#8213; Mandruss   &#9742;  23:18, 30 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Any friendly admin that happens by could delete the original image, and then Nyttend could tend to uploading a revision. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 01:07, 31 March 2015 (UTC)
 * I have obscured the plate. &#8213; Mandruss  &#9742;  04:24, 31 March 2015 (UTC)

Alice in Wonderland, John Tenniel and crap drawings
Ok folks. This review of last Monday's episode of University Challenge says that one of the teams identified "an illustration from Alice in Wonderland as the work of John Tenniel", going on to comment that "the Captain’s drawings were crap. Younger readers might like to ask their parents to explain that reference." Well, I've read the article on Tenniel and I'm none the wiser; so, in the absence of my parents, would anyone care to explain? - Cucumber Mike (talk) 20:58, 29 March 2015 (UTC)


 * My best guess is that it's a reference to Captain & Tennille, do I don't quite get it either (and nor are my parents here to ask right now). ---Sluzzelin talk  21:08, 29 March 2015 (UTC) ---Sluzzelin  talk  21:54, 29 March 2015 (UTC)
 * (Never mind, I don't think that's it. I thought maybe the participant had mispronounced "Tenniel" (though guessed correctly), and Jeremy Paxman had made one of his dry and slightly scornful remarks, but I just watched the segment, and there is no mispronunciation and no remark). ---Sluzzelin talk  21:54, 29 March 2015 (UTC)
 * A subsidiary comment - Tyrannosaurus Rex? Tevildo (talk) 21:58, 29 March 2015 (UTC)
 * (I do actually think he adores the contestants, but, yes, he remains a formidable predator. :-) ---Sluzzelin talk  22:22, 29 March 2015 (UTC)


 * Tenniel's article indicates that the first print run of 2,000 had flawed plates and was shipped to America, rather than being sold in Britain. But the pun and reference to the Captain make it certain the allusion was to this duo. μηδείς (talk) 22:06, 29 March 2015 (UTC)
 * The only problem with that "certainty" is that the writer referred to "the Captain", while the singer's name is "Captain", not "The Captain". To put this into perspective: Would you not find it rather odd if someone were to refer to you as "The Medeis"?  There may well be someone called "The Medeis", but that's not you.  I rest my case.  --   Jack of Oz   [pleasantries]  04:42, 30 March 2015 (UTC)
 * "The Captain and Tennille" may be an error but I did hear them credited on radio that way. Note that the duo's article uses the form "Captain" Daryl Dragon rather than the more common Daryl "Captain" Dragon, suggesting that the nickname was understood as a notional rank. —Tamfang (talk) 05:21, 30 March 2015 (UTC)
 * The duo was originally called The Captain and Tenille, as it shows on the jacket of their first and biggest hit, "Love Will Keep Us Together." Looks like they dropped the The in later years, but like you I've always heard them announced with The. This is one of those silly debates that arises here from time to time. Like whether Adventures of Superman is supposed to have The in front of it. As to the original question, the writer was just being funny. And there was nothing wrong with the drawings in the Alice books, either. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 05:35, 30 March 2015 (UTC)
 * And presumably the joke was that the Captain's drawings were crap, so they got Tennille (Tenniel) to do them instead. --65.94.50.15 (talk) 06:42, 30 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Thus making the joke even more obscure. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 20:57, 30 March 2015 (UTC)
 * I don't understand what you're saying. That was the joke, so how can it make it more obscure? That, together with your earlier comment "the writer was just being funny" implies that you haven't understood the joke at all. --Viennese Waltz 20:03, 31 March 2015 (UTC)
 * I understood the source of the quote was making a funny about the two similar names. And having re-read this a few times, I think I do get it now - as if "Captain" Daryl Dragon (who was not himself named Tennille) had done the drawings originally. If I made a joke that lame at home, I would get a serious eye-roll from my wife. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 20:18, 31 March 2015 (UTC)
 * What? The Captain and Tennille obscure?  I don't think love will keep you together, then! --65.95.176.148 (talk) 04:20, 31 March 2015 (UTC)


 * I just saw a muskrat yesterday, a species which presumably would have gone extinct without C&T getting their libido going. :-) StuRat (talk) 04:45, 31 March 2015 (UTC)
 * I wonder if your typical muskrat goes with the first one it finds, or if it shops around. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 20:20, 31 March 2015 (UTC)


 * Yup, that definitely explains it. Thanks everyone! - Cucumber Mike (talk) 12:59, 30 March 2015 (UTC)


 * So is the illustrator's name /ʼtɛniɛl/ and the singer /tɛʼni:l/? —Tamfang (talk) 01:13, 2 April 2015 (UTC)
 * You have the singer's name correct, Tamfag, but the second e would normally be reduced to a schwa if the name of the illustrator had initial stress. If it had final stress, both e's could be /ɛ/: /tɛni'ɛl/.μηδείς (talk) 01:51, 2 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Given that unstressed /ɛ/ predictably becomes schwa in some dialects, and never in some others, I favor a “deeper” notation. That's one of my gripes about the second OED's use of IPA: by dropping distinctions among reduced vowels, it dismisses all non-reducing dialects, becoming a narrower Dictionary of Oxford English. —Tamfang (talk) 06:48, 3 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Oh, don't get me started. I can think of at least a dozen ways to transcribe "high and mighty" and the divergence between British and Americanist practice č=/t͡ʃ/ and y=/j/, "high" = /haj/ v /hɒɪ/ is bad enough.  The other night they had a "rhyme time" clue on Wheel of Fortune and managed to rhyme the equivalent of Mary, marry and merry. I almost went postal. μηδείς (talk) 18:27, 3 April 2015 (UTC)