Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Miscellaneous/2022 March 10

= March 10 =

Russian oligarchs
Are there any Russian billionaires who are not oligarchs? -- Jack of Oz   [pleasantries]  11:09, 10 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Leonid Nevzlin is about to give up his Russian citizenship, with the words "everything Putin touches dies", so I don't think he's a Russian oligarch any more (arguably not since 2003). Card Zero  (talk) 12:12, 10 March 2022 (UTC)


 * So what you're really asking is if there were Soviet billionaires before the breakup of the Soviet Union or those Russians who didn't make their money from it, but rather from more legitimate means? This amusing, but unreliable animated video mentions Artyom Tarasov, who became a millionaire during Gorbachev's reign, so the answer to the former is almost certainly no; there just wasn't enough time during perestroika to accumulate that much moola. Clarityfiend (talk) 01:32, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Oh, oligarchs, so not Soviet filthy rich. Clarityfiend (talk) 01:42, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Katerina Tikhonova, Putin's second daughter, and her husband were estimated to be worth $2 billion around 2013. (Oddly enough, his eldest daughter, Maria Vorontsova, doesn't seem to be anywhere near that wealthy.) I doubt there are many (any?) legitimate businesspeople because any big success would attract the attention of the oligarchs, who would probably muscle their way in and take over. Clarityfiend (talk) 01:51, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
 * A lot depends on what you mean by oligarch. While Business oligarch has one definition relating to the origins of the word, my experience is that Russian oligarch most commonly refers to those who gained vast amounts of wealth either from acquiring state assets during the privitisation era or from state contracts during the Putin era, rather than simply relating to incredibly wealthy people who as a result have a lot of political power. (As our article notes, people are often referred to as Russian oligarchs but rarely American oligarchs, even people like the Koch brothers.) See e.g. [//theconversation.com/meet-russias-oligarchs-a-group-of-men-who-wont-be-toppling-putin-anytime-soon-178474] or for that matter our article. Probably because of that definition someone like Boris Berezovsky [//www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/stories/moscow/berezovsky.html] [//www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/boris-berezovsky-an-oligarch-dies] [//www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-russian-tycoon-idUSKCN1050X4] was still often considered a Russian oligarch (in exile but not former) at the time of his death despite his extreme falling out with Putin and limited political power in Russia by that stage. Under that definition, I'd argue someone like Arkady Volozh would not be considered an oligarch. While I suspect he did get some benefit during the privitisation era and probably more from state contracts, AFAICT most of his wealth seems to have come from the success of Yandex in Russia in general. (See also [//www.bostonglobe.com/news/world/2018/01/30/releases-putin-list-russian-politicians-oligarchs/PUw8A93TCiXGMMOMNSKTUI/story.html].) The success of Yandex must give Volozh a fair amount of political power, but Yandex and so probably Volozh seems to have at times contentious relationship with the Russian government as per our article and . While some sources e.g. the US government have called Volozh an oligarch this seems a lot less commmon.  That source also suggests Sergei Galitsky, Oleg Tinkov and Ruben Vardanya as other possible candidates. Perhaps Dmitry Grishin and Yuri Milner of VK (company) might be other cases (the latter is called Israeli in our article although I'm not sure if his nationalist situation is really that different from some people called Russian oligarchs).  Note I chose these examples as tech startup has tended to be one of the areas people have been able to get fabulously wealthy in recent times, and Russia doesn't seem to be an exception. You might find more from looking at some more recent examples of Russian tech startups although the small size of the Russian market combined with Russia's economic problems and unpopularity probably means there aren't so many still you could look at things like Qiwi. (E.g. Yandex use to be massive in Ukraine but as per our article got in trouble.)  Nil Einne (talk) 12:21, 11 March 2022 (UTC)


 * ... people are often referred to asd at Russian oligarchs but rarely American oligarchs, even people like the Koch brothers. Exactly. The word "oligarch" seems to have become attached to Russians but to no other humans. They're trying to claim Ukraine, but surely they can't have a monopoly on a word? --   Jack of Oz   [pleasantries]  20:16, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Russian oligarch has a very specific meaning, i.e. those who enriched themselves by buying state assets for a song after the breakup of the Soviet Union. Other than that, "oligarch" is a word that isn't used much, regardless of nationality. Clarityfiend (talk) 08:01, 12 March 2022 (UTC)
 * I see. And at business oligarch we read: The term is commonly used in the Western press to describe Russian businessmen. According to a study by journalist Alan Macleod on its use by the New York Times, CNN and Fox News, 98% of the mentions of countries linked to oligarchs were related to Russia (overwhelmingly) or countries of the former Soviet Union. American businessmen were very rarely referred to as oligarchs in the 150 articles included in the study. Now we know. --  Jack of Oz   [pleasantries]  18:25, 12 March 2022 (UTC)

Ominous Grape-Nuts statement
Our article makes the claim that, "In World War II, Grape-Nuts was a component of the lightweight jungle ration used by some U.S. and Allied Forces in wartime operations before 1944." And it's supported by a reference: Kearny, Cresson H. (Major), Jungle Snafus...And Remedies, Oregon Institute (1996), pp. 290–291. That seems reasonable enough, but our phrasing kind of leaves the reader hanging. What happened in 1944? Anybody know? The book doesn't seem to be available via Google. I was going to ask on the talk page, but if nobody has answered this poor soul in 13 years, I may not live long enough to find out. Matt Deres (talk) 14:26, 10 March 2022 (UTC)
 * In 1944, a single specification for ration preparation and content was produced. Previously, rations were purchased from multiple vendors based on extremely vague specifications. Afterward, the vendors had to meet very exact specifications. 97.82.165.112 (talk) 14:46, 10 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Neat - thank you! Matt Deres (talk) 17:18, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Okay, who else wants to name a band "Ominous Grape-Nuts" after reading this?--User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 20:17, 17 March 2022 (UTC)