Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Science/2020 July 24

= July 24 =

Magnetic generator
This site declares its fuelless generator products for sale. As far as I know this is not possible, violating conservation laws. Do you have any ideas how this can be, or if they are fake pitching? Almuhammedi (talk) 04:47, 24 July 2020 (UTC)
 * I think you answered your own question. Ruslik_ Zero 05:05, 24 July 2020 (UTC)


 * It is indeed possible that this product is for sale. It also has a really cool look, a lot more than an earlier version just a few years ago. I'm afraid that it is even possible some gullible people invest their money in this. This does not violate the law of conservation of money: it just flows from one pocket to another one.  --Lambiam 06:55, 24 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Remark that they are talking of 'preorder', that they don't expect any money so far and that this generator is one of their 'ongoing projects'. But this way they can collect addresses of people from all over the world that presumably have some bucks to spare and are possibly willing to spend them on silver mines. 2003:F5:6F0C:9500:89C7:4269:E468:97B (talk) 15:09, 24 July 2020 (UTC) Marco PB
 * Pre-order may require a small payment. If large number of people pay, they may collect a lot of money! Ruslik_ Zero 12:19, 25 July 2020 (UTC)
 * So the product works as intended? DMacks (talk) 12:22, 25 July 2020 (UTC)

Thank you all for sharing ideas. I have already argued using simple modeling and transformation equations to convince my friends who unfortunately didn't accept my analysis and told me that technology has advanced beyond old "traditional" laws. One of them argued the secret lies in the very strong magnet energy. I tried to explain the difference between magnetic stored energy (which I consider it as latent, can be calculated from Maxwell's equations), and the energy transformation here in which the magnet is just like a mediator between motion and electricity. I failed to explain any further, so I came here to understand if I were missing some new physics. I guess I would encourage them to buy and try. Almuhammedi (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 14:27, 25 July 2020 (UTC)
 * For energy production, the only relevant new physics is nuclear energy, in which mass as input becomes (usable) energy as output. Other than by mass conversion, the energy output that is available for work, if not zero, is always strictly less than the energy input. The difference is lost as (unusable) heat. The advertized magnetic generator contains a motor, so there will be some friction. See Perpetual motion machine. Is your plan to encourage your friends to lose their money in this scam because it will teach them a lesson? --Lambiam 21:58, 25 July 2020 (UTC)