Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Macedonia

In order to remain listed at Requests for comment, at least two people need to show that they tried to resolve a dispute with this user and have failed. This must involve the same dispute with a single user, not different disputes or multiple users. The persons complaining must provide evidence of their efforts, and each of them must certify it by signing this page with &#126;&#126;&#126;&#126;. If this does not happen within 48 hours of the creation of this dispute page (which was: 13:03, 13 February 2007 (UTC)), the page will be deleted. The current date and time is:, 29 July 2024 (UTC).



Users should only edit one summary or view, other than to endorse.

Desired outcome

 * For Macedonia to cease using his userpage as a soapbox
 * For Macedonia to return to constructive editing in article space
 * For Macedonia to apply more care about image copyrights
 * Preferably, for Macedonia to change his username

Description
is a user strongly identifying with and promoting an ethnic Macedonian national point of view. His contributions to article name space have focussed on articles dealing with the politics and ideologies of his country (e.g. Macedonians (ethnic group), Macedonian language etc.) and have often been controversial. However, this is not the focus of the present dispute.

For several months now, Macedonia has ceased almost all constructive editing in article name space. His latest period of sustained article activity was in August 2006 ; since then, he has only occasionally come back for short bouts of edit-warring and move-warring.

However, during all these months he has continually been present working on his userpage, which he uses as a political soapbox promoting nationalist ideas. His first userpage, to which he had made > 300 edits between November 2005 and June 2006, was deleted for containing inappropriate political material in June 2006 by Francis Tyers. Since then, he has accumulated another 130 or so edits on new versions, always with explicit propagandistic content.

There have also been concerns that the problem of his page is exacerbated by his user name. Usage of the term "Macedonia" is a highly charged political topic between several nations on the Balkans. Employed as a username it may be seen as "inflammatory" and hence against our user-name policy. It may also be argued that the heading "Macedonia" over a user page containing political content about "Macedonia" may give the casual reader the misleading impression of it being a Wikipedia article.

There have been numerous attempts at persuading him to change his user name and/or to change his user page, and on several occasions admins have seen fit to forcibly remove content from his page. He has consistently refused to comply with these requests beyond what was immediately forced on him.

In addition to all this, Macedonia has also made a lot of problematic image uploads with unsourced or wrongly tagged non-free images, many of them for the purpose of decorating his user page.

Evidence of disputed behavior

 * Edit-warring in article space during December/January:, ,


 * Characteristic stages of his user page:
 * Current version, 13 February: Rant about Alexander the Great
 * 9 February: Rant about Greek Prime Minister (after being warned, Mac. removed this bit from his user page but copied it on his user talk: )
 * 30 January: Historical revolutionary quotes, huge list of irridentist place names, image gallery containing several wrongly tagged images.
 * June 2006: Irridentist inflammatory map
 * Before deletion, 4 June 2006: Huge article-like text about Macedonia
 * Before deletion, 22 April 2006: Same huge article, with additional irridentist list of placenames


 * Revert-warring about fair-use images on his user page:
 * Most recent problematic image uploads, after numerous warnings:

Applicable policies and guidelines

 * WP:NOT (soapbox, battleground, free web host)
 * WP:USER
 * WP:USERNAME ("inflammatory")
 * WP:COPYRIGHT

Evidence of trying and failing to resolve the dispute

 * Several admins agreeing that country names ought not to be used as user names: April 2006
 * Admin Pschemp asking Mac. to change his username: April 2006
 * Warnings and requests about content on user page:
 * by FrancisTyers, May 2006
 * by NikoSilver, December 2006
 * by FlavrSavr, June 2006
 * by Politis, December 2006
 * by Fut.Perf, January 2007, February 2007


 * Forcible removal of content from user page:
 * Page deletion by FrancisTyers (twice, 3rd/4th June 2006):
 * Removal of content:, ,
 * Removal of images:, , , ,


 * Warnings about image uploads:
 * By Fut.Perf.: 15 January, 25 January, 9 February.
 * plus numerous Orphanbot and similar templated messages by various users.


 * Reaction:
 * Refusal to discuss user name (page blanking):
 * Refusals to change user page: ,
 * Other: lying about image source, page blanking, page blanking,

Users certifying the basis for this dispute

 * Fut.Perf. ☼ 13:09, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Incidentally, it should be noted that a fellow Macedonian, FlavrSavr also tried to explain the situation here. Francis Tyers · 13:24, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
 * It is virtually impossible for this list to be comprehensive, yet Fut.Perf. has done a remarkable summary. I'd like to add that my warning and request about content on user page is also seconding admin Pschemp asking Mac. to change his username. NikoSilver 13:33, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
 * I count myself as certifying this. In a deleted edit (only admins can verify this), I blanked Macedonia's userpage (2nd June 2006) because I was sick of the soapboxing. The relevant talk page edit for this is here; I stated that I blanked his page. Therefore, I count myself as certifying the basis for this dispute as I was involved, even if it was a while ago. --Deskana (request backup)  21:13, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Other users who endorse this summary

 * This seems to be accurate and troublesome. Jkelly 18:57, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Response
''This is a summary written by the user whose conduct is disputed, or by other users who think that the dispute is unjustified and that the above summary is biased or incomplete. Users signing other sections ("Statement of the dispute" and "Outside Views") should not edit the "Response" section.'' ''

{Add summary here, but you must use the endorsement section below to sign. Users who edit or endorse this summary should not edit the other summaries.}

Users who endorse this summary:

Outside view
''This is a summary written by users not directly involved with the dispute but who would like to add an outside view of the dispute. Users editing other sections ("Statement of the dispute" and "Response") should not edit the "Outside Views" section, except to endorse an outside view.''

Outside view from Francis Tyers
This user, along with User:Asteraki and User:Vergina should be indef banned. Their inflammatory pages, trolling and wilful failure to comprehend copyright does not help the project in any way.

Users who endorse this summary

 * 1) Francis Tyers · 13:27, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
 * 2) I'll give him the benefit for trying to be reasonable at  Fut. Perf's talk page. Users like Macedonia, Asteraki and Vergina should leave this project, along with Makedonas because their behaviour and/or user pages are fundamentally contrary to all Wikipedia principles for the reasons I've already explained here.  Nationalism is not to be welcomed on Wikipedia, regardless from where it comes. --FlavrSavr 14:30, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
 * 3) I agree about Vergina, but not about Makedonas, who seems to be making useful contributions.   /FunkyFly.talk_  16:06, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
 * 4) I Agree. Macedonia, along with Asteraki and Vergina, has exhausted the community's patience. As for Makedonas, we can't ban him only because he's a nationalist, even if we should consider asking him to tone down his userpage.--Aldux 15:15, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

Outside view from KazakhPol
The users who have complained say they want to ban this user on the grounds that they did not like the content on his userpage, his violation of image copywright, and his username... Methinks this is harassment. Unfortunately, since an administrator decided to delete Macedonia's userpage and not simply blank it, there is no way to verify what was on his page. The complaints about his username really cuts at the credibility of the users who are complaining here. I do not see grounds for banning this user, I do not see incivility - at least none presented and I suggest that you all leave him alone. If he's violating copywright then delete what he uploads until he gets the point. KazakhPol 20:49, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Users who endorse this view:

Discussion
All signed comments and talk not related to an endorsement should be directed to this page's discussion page. Discussion should not be added below. Discussion should be posted on the talk page. Threaded replies to another user's vote, endorsement, evidence, response, or comment should be posted to the talk page.