Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/AcidSnow/Archive

30 July 2014

 * Suspected sockpuppets




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I believe these three users are the one and the same persons who are intent on editing here from their personal point of views, that is they all seem to harbor the unionist view of Greater Somalia's domination and are bent on ensuring that Somalilands articles are kept up to their versions. They almost edit in the same wavelegnth.

Evidences:
 * AcidSnow first reverted this edit on July 27 at 0619 hrs (UTC) which was immediately followed by 26oo's revert at 0722 [within 1 hour and 3 minutes!].


 * On the same day, these were followed by further edits: 26oo at 0911 and AcidSnow at 1033 and 1039.


 * By this time then, their accomplice Middayexpress intruded as expected at his convenient time so as to give an illusion that he resides in a different time zone [ie. PM as per UTC time]; at 1411 hrs.


 * On 26 July, in the Hargeisa talkpage - Acidsnow commented within two minutes of him being asked to by MiddayExpress, who, it goes without saying, edited from his convenient timezone. As expected, 26oo butted in and was there to ensure that they gain consensus asap and maintain the status quo that fits according to their doctrine! You may be wondering; why then go through all this lenght of writing on each others talkpages? Well, It is just a ruse! that is bent on by-passing the eyes of the moderators here on wikipedia.


 * The reeason they are doing this is because they want to avoid getting blocked from violating the 3 revert rule. This ensures they go on with their practice of ensuring that articles here are written from Mogadishu's historic version and that they shouldnt get caught.


 * If there was a mechanism that would allow the provision that all suspected article that is edited from one side only, then i would have asked the webmasters to check all of them specifically by these three users who continue to maintain a united front against Somaliland. Its a pity that there arent many people actually from our place that edit wikipedia. Whatever our differences are, should remain on the ground and not here; i understand this encyclipedia is neutral. I hope my request is accepted. Thank you. No More Mogadishu (talk) 22:40, 2 August 2014 (UTC)

Comments by other users
''Accused parties may also comment/discuss in this section below. See Defending yourself against claims.''

I won't even bother trying to explain how I have nothing to do with Midday and 26oo. I am not supposed that you have chosen to sock Theyuusuf143. this edit really did blow it for you. Anyways, I will let the admins deal with this instead. AcidSnow (talk) 23:00, 2 August 2014 (UTC)
 * @Theyuusuf143, no one forced you to do anything. In fact, you were told to stop edit waring on a number of pages. You, however, chose to response with this: "you are just making me more experienced. i will desyroy all somalia especially punrland if dont stop "edit warring" ! i just learned from you! ". In fact, you choose to sock immediately after your first block with this ip. When that ip was blocked you still continued to sock with another ip. And now your socking again making a false Sockpuppet investigation against me and other users. As we can all see, your not here to contribute to this project but rather here only to be disruptive. AcidSnow (talk) 00:47, 3 August 2014 (UTC)


 * Well first i agree what my fellow somalilander said. the usernames 26oo   Middayexpress  and AcidSnow are the same person or atleast have common interest to descredit somaliland pages.  i never edited wekipedia before late june this year when i realised that there is something wrong with somaliland pages,  its all edited from Somalia's point of view.  the name Somaliland is allmost wiped out of wekipedia. and when you look at behind every anti somaliland edits there is atleast  one or all of the above 3 usernames. when i joined here they bullied me and forced me to violate the 3 rules. i didnt know and still dont know much about here.  if i knew how to report them i would already do that.  its always  them who reports neutral or pro-somaliland new comers. they won to block or discourage many somalilanders.  no more mogadishu is not me as AcidSnow is trying to present. because i live small country with less somaliladers for that reasong whe is probably patriot brother from an other place.  by the way i will contact all the  three usernames tommorow to see if we could solve this in a very somali way, i am still not a hardliner!   Theyuusuf143 (talk) 00:28, 3 August 2014 (UTC)


 * Thats fact you are actually making me more experienced when ever you try to bull or blackmail me, thanks that i learned a lot from you/ye in a short period of time, now i came back to announce that i have nothing to do with this flags of my country under the userboxes in here  yes i am  proud from somaliland but i did not put the flags and details under that "userboxes" infact you informed me first  and said " *sigh*, this edit really blow it for you. AcidSnow (talk ) 00:23, 3 August 2014 (UTC)"   in this page     you or somebody else  did it without my pemission.   i still want to deal with you guys and solve this problem in best possible way with out escalating,  i really feel weak to beg you not to spoil our country history/info in wikipedia.  its better to accept my request,  i am sure we can solve a lot if we talk. Theyuusuf143 (talk) 02:29, 3 August 2014 (UTC)

User:AcidSnow, User:26oo and myself are some of the main contributors to the WikiProject Somalia pages. Hence, our frequent edits on Somalia-related articles, including the Hargeisa page. The Hargeisa discussion is also not something new, but is actually a dialogue that has been going on since at least February. As Somalia's second largest city, it's a page that we all have watchlisted, so any changes to it (including on the talk page) will be noticed. This deletion discussion from several years ago started by 26oo also readily dispels the absurd claims above regarding myself and him/her, as do these edits  with regard to AcidSnow.

That said, the No More Mogadishu account and Theyuusuf143 appear to be meatpuppets of the recently banned User:Reer Woqooyi. Reer Woqooyi had been abusing ips to add secessionist pov to various Somalia-related articles, notably the Puntland–Somaliland dispute. The latter page was eventually protected on June 28th due to the disruption. The following day, a letter was published on a partisan blog urging others to edit that wikipage and several other associated ones ("I encourage you to deal with this issue and dispatch a special team of your respected journalist to deal with this urgent matter" ). A user identified as "Mustafa" wrote in the blog's comments section that he "just started people![...] I currentlly editing Sanaag region, found amazing infos about Sanaag in the old days[...] Come and help, my name is "Reer Woqooyi"[...] Any one people have any information about his home town in SSC step up and contiburite with what you can[...] Same thing to all other landers, use non Somaliland articles (on other websites) as there is a guy callef medaexpress erasing my hard work cos its source is "non-nutural" however you Could use Somaliland articles that is puplished on other non-Somaliland websites[...] Looking forward yo meet you on the talk pages". Reer Woqooyi was eventually blocked as a meatpuppeteer on July 1st. After unsuccessfully feigning incredulity for a while, he later admitted that he had indeed written the letter ("And yes I asked people on a blog to come and edit some pages" ). This post by the newly created No More Mogadishu account -- his first edit on Wikipedia -- appears to be an attempt at revenge by either Reer Woqooyi himself or one of his blog cohorts. Probably the former given the user's familiarity with Wikipedia. As his second edit, No More Mogadishu added a large Somaliland flag to his userpage and a note on the "nationhood of Somaliland". He then added corresponding templates to Theyuusuf143's userpage, which indicate that "this user comes from Somaliland" and that "this user recognizes the independence of Somaliland". Quite telling considering the fact that they have ostensibly never had contact. Middayexpress (talk) 19:30, 3 August 2014 (UTC)

Clerk, CheckUser, and/or patrolling admin comments
I blocked indefinitely the creator of this SPI. Closing.--Bbb23 (talk) 14:42, 4 August 2014 (UTC)
 * I've reopened this in case something more needs to be done and/or explained here about the creator.--Bbb23 (talk) 14:48, 4 August 2014 (UTC)

. Although it was a reasonable conclusion that No More Mogadishu was a sock of Theyuusuf143, it turns out that is not true. However, the indefinite block imposed on No More Mogadishu remains for probable meat puppetry and/or disruption. In the meantime, I am declining this report as retaliatory, agenda-driven, and without prima facie evidence of sock puppetry.--Bbb23 (talk) 17:38, 4 August 2014 (UTC)

Suspected sockpuppets



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Back in January, AcidSnow tried to nominate Isaaq genocide for deletion, but bungled the AfD nomination process (Articles for deletion/Isaaq Genocide was deleted, but admins will be able to see the history - see also my post at User_talk:AcidSnow). Last week, also bungled an attempt to nominate the article for deletion. At first, I thought that this was just a coincidence, but comparing the editing histories of the two accounts has raised my suspicions. Compare this edit by Somajeeste with this by AcidSnow (e.g. the passage starting For those that did use the term "genocide", such as AlJazzera appears, slightly modified, in both). Cordless Larry (talk) 12:12, 19 May 2017 (UTC) Cordless Larry (talk) 12:12, 19 May 2017 (UTC)
 * Both users are also pretty insistent that the article should be redirected to the article on the Somali Rebellion, with suspiciously similar use of words: compare this ("As mentioned before, the Isaaq weren't the only clan persecuted. The Somali Rebellion article already mentions some of the conflict") with this ("what this guy is referring is kind of duplicate from Somali Rebellion, these events are already partly mentioned on the Somali Rebellion article along with those of other clans"). Not necessarily damning on its own, maybe, but combined with the evidence above... Cordless Larry (talk) 12:26, 19 May 2017 (UTC)
 * Similar situation with this and this. Cordless Larry (talk) 12:51, 19 May 2017 (UTC)
 * I'm also suspicious that there's a link with here, and that there are potentially other sock- or meatpuppets. See Administrators' noticeboard/IncidentArchive888 for some of the background. Cordless Larry (talk) 12:35, 19 May 2017 (UTC)
 * On this point, after Middayexpress was topic banned and quit the site, they posted at User talk:AcidSnow that "There will be many new Horn editors joining soon, so please be sure to welcome them and show them the ropes. It's been nice working with you bro; we'll keep in touch". If Somajeeste is one of these new editors, an alternative explanation for them using AcidSnow's wording in comments could be that the latter is somehow coaching them along the lines of Middayexpress's suggestion. Cordless Larry (talk) 18:59, 19 May 2017 (UTC)

Hello everyone. I have been out the loop due to personal matters. Nonetheless, I would like to take the time to state that this user is not me. I have plenty of experience with reporting people for socking to know what actions not to take when doing so. If follow up information is needed, then l'll try my best to respond to all of them. AcidSnow (talk) 04:13, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
 * Comments by AcidSnow


 * Some of the texts and links of are identical to those by you, but the gap of many months or year is unusual. This could have happened because of copying without disclosure, by either Somajeeste or you or both. Would either of you admit copying?, or offer another explanation? This may be relevant to the behavioral review and the due consideration of any attenuating factors. Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 13:50, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
 * I didn't copy any other user. A pervious user was also blocked for a failed attempted at copying my username in the past (see here: ). I am not particular sure what either users motives were for doing so. In regards to the possibility of meta-puppeting, I never instructed any individual to come to Wikipedia. It has been almost two years since these accusations first surfaced. For the most part the Somalia project has as usual remained underpopulated. AcidSnow (talk) 15:36, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
 * To be honest, I only returned due to being notified by CordlessLarry that there was socking accusations against me. I responded a few hours after his notification (see here: ). As is stated previously I have my own personal matters that I have been attendeing to. Awale-Abdi's edits are nothing more than a coincidence. AcidSnow (talk) 17:00, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
 * Okay, but the blocked @AcidSnoww is not relevant here, and that account never seems to have edited any article. I note you did not offer an alternate explanation to the multiple unusual instances of identical texts/links separated by gaps of many months. Perhaps, Somajeeste may. Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 02:04, 21 May 2017 (UTC)
 * Tagging in case they did not see  query above. Kzl55 (talk) 08:43, 24 May 2017 (UTC)

Comments by other users
''Accused parties may also comment/discuss in this section below. See Defending yourself against claims.''
 * This is ridiculous, and it is just harassment against me (by taking groundless accusation of someone with disruptive editing who drives his POV-agenda). i genuinely thought you were neutral editor but now i see where you coming from, and now to accuse me of sockpuppeteering is beyond my thinking, Good lucky with that.Somajeeste (talk) 12:41, 19 May 2017 (UTC)
 * It's hardly groundless, - as demonstrated above, you have made comments worded identically to those made by AcidSnow. If there is an innocent explanation for that, you would be well advised to give it here. Cordless Larry (talk) 12:44, 19 May 2017 (UTC)

It appears both accounts (AcidSnow, Somajeeste) have canvassed the same editor for their respective AfD nominations: AcidSnow,. Somajeeste .Kzl55 (talk) 13:07, 19 May 2017 (UTC)


 * Support a checkuser for Somajeeste and AcidSnow. Additional evidence: both champion a redirect (1, 2, 3) wherein both allege Isaaq genocide is covered by Somali Rebellion when it doesn't. More evidence is the identical source links by both, four months apart: (4, 5): https://books.google.com/books?id=0lXJ6nHj5HIC&dq=%22Hawiye+were+considered+comparable+in+scale%22&focus=searchwithinvolume&q=%22Government+atrocities+inflicted+on+the+Hawiye+were+considered+comparable+in+scale+to+those+against+the+Majeerteen+and+Isaaq.%22 ; Parse that and other embedded google search terms by the two users in the provided links. Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 15:59, 19 May 2017 (UTC)
 * Additional evidence: both accounts used this same exact string "which is not accepted here. Therefore, I strongly advise you to stop that or risk being topic banned", this exact string does not appear anywhere else online, AcidSnow, Somajeeste . Also this string "Don't shout at me and calm down" is only ever used on WP by the same two accounts and does not appear anywhere else online except for one single Google books search result, AcidSnow , Somajeeste . Kzl55 (talk) 23:57, 19 May 2017 (UTC)


 * ,, , et al: please consider the behavioral evidence since you all have issued cautions to the accounts in question, in light of the unusual repeated instances of identical text evidences above. See e.g. 6, 7 by AcidSnow and Somajeeste, posted nearly one year apart. AcidSnow is a dormant account, its last activity during an January 2017 ANI proceeding. This is beyond the CU request, Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 03:03, 20 May 2017 (UTC)


 * Both editors AcidSnow and Awale-Abdi have been absent from Wikipedia for an extended period of time, four months in the case of AcidSnow and one month for Awale-Abdi. Yet both of them came back to Wikipedia on the exact same day, (20 May), and both of their posts (AcidSnow on this SPI, and Awale-Abdi in an AfD the first incarnation of which was started by AcidSnow) happened within minutes of one another (AcidSnow, 05:13, ), (Awale-Abdi, 05:59) . This strongly suggests collusion outside of Wikipedia and meat-puppetry, especially since Awale-Abdi has already admitted being an acquaintance of AcidSnow . It is worthy of note that Awale-Abdi's vote in the AfD went in support of the deletion nomination, just like AcidSnow in his previous attempt (Awale-Abdi also voted in that attempt in support of deletion, found here Talk:Isaaq genocide/Archive 1 click to expand content). Kzl55 (talk) 16:32, 20 May 2017 (UTC)

Thank you for the back-up, Bbb23 (see below). I don't know anyone on Wikipedia outside of it. And, unlike Acidsnow, I'm quite transparent about who I am and don't like using pseudonyms online. I'm either "Awale Abdi" or "Awale Ismail" or simply "Awale" practically everywhere on the internet (see here and here, for instance) where all these usernames contain parts of my real full-name (Awale Ismail Abdi) or that's at least been the case since I turned 18 several years ago. Anyone claiming Acidsnow and I are the same person (if that is what is being implied here) doesn't know what they're talking about. He's an acquaintance to me because I've known him on Wikipedia for years now, right back to when Middayexpress used to post profusely but otherwise... There's nothing else between us. I also don't edit much nowadays because why would I? Other than the recent propagandist activities of user Kzl55; I've seen nothing worth addressing on Wikipedia. I only get active when I notice something is "off" like when a now banned member (ironically for having socks) named Kiziotherapy used to keep editing away the fact that the Harla possibly spoke a Cushitic language. I'll leave it at that. If there's anyway for the admins to check IPs like Acidsnows then here's my public IP address as per google and please do compare it to his if you want: (5.107.128.129) and, if it's any consolation, it makes no sense to me as someone who's observed him edit for years that Acidsnow would have sock-puppet accounts, after what happened with Kiziotherapy (a user we both had unpleasant run-ins with); he should know better.

To add to the above, I don't know if you can find it but I think there's a conversation somewhere between me and Acidsnow on Wikipedia where I asked him what he was ethnically (I wanted to know if he was Somali like me) then Middayexpress chimed in and told Acidsnow not to disclose his private information or at least feel obligated to do so. I think it was in the "Somalis" talk page (archived now, I think by Midday) and was, and I'm not entirely sure about this, a conversation between me and Midday about Somali genomics where Acidsnow chimed in. It was years ago now so forgive the haziness. Anyway, what a strange question for a supposed sock to ask it's supposed originator in an off-handed manner... Regards, Awale-Abdi (talk) 15:08, 21 May 2017 (UTC)

Ah, I found the archived conversation between myself and Midday:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Somalis/Archive_6

Unfortunately, I was mistaken and I didn't talk to Acidsnow there. Can't remember where I asked him what he was ethnically if it's not in that instance. Anyway... Regards, Awale-Abdi (talk) 15:27, 21 May 2017 (UTC)


 * You have not addressed the central point raised on this page regarding your the timing of edits for yourself and editor AcidSnow. No one here suggested that you and AcidSnow are the same person, the point raised was regarding collusion outside of WP and meat-puppetry. Both yourself and AcidSnow have been on hiatus for an extended amount of time, one month and four months respectively, yet both of you returned to Wikipedia on the exact same day and your posts were separated by minutes (AcidSnow, 05:13), (Awale-Abdi, 05:59). Incidentally, both of you also posted on topics related to AcidSnow upon return. I am tagging to clarify I did not suggest Awale and AcidSnow were the same person. Kzl55 (talk) 09:45, 22 May 2017 (UTC)

"You have not addressed the central point raised on this page regarding your the timing of edits for yourself and editor AcidSnow."

I really have no interest in further engaging this tangent. I don't know why on Earth Acidsnow and I posted within close time-frames of each other, I just posted around then because I finally got some free-time from revising for my final exams and was keeping up with the discussions as a lurker prior. I don't know Acidsnow outside of Wikipedia. I don't know anyone on here, other than James Dahl (goes by a username I'm forgetting right now), outside of Wikipedia and I knew James (think his username is "Runehelmet", not sure) before I joined Wiki. Midday, Acidsnow, Soupforone... I've encountered these people for a while now and spoken to them on Wikipedia a lot but that's about it. You can spin this nonsense however you like... I've done nothing wrong and you have no real proof that I have. Take care, Awale-Abdi (talk) 22:06, 3 June 2017 (UTC)

I would like to state clearly here that i don't know any editors here in real life and i am not intend to know some random wikipedia editor, and I don't use any pseudonyms on WP, NO ONE, NO ONE INSTRUCT to me to do it, i voluntarily nominated the article deletion which i thought its inconsistent and incoherent to be in wikipedia, and i found out it was nominated but not probably and i feel to do it ( the books and links above as i found it on talk page and use it as shortcut ) anything other than that is coincident, I Hope this rest to bed. Cheers. Somajeeste (talk) 01:32, 26 May 2017 (UTC)
 * It is highly unlikely for such clear repetition of identical text and links as evidenced above to be just a coincidence. Do you have any other explanation? Kzl55 (talk) 11:28, 26 May 2017 (UTC)


 * Additional behavioural evidence: A fixation on replacement of Somaliland's flag with Somalia's flag across multiple pages, examples include: (AcidSnow, Somajeeste , (AcidSnow , Somajeeste ), (AcidSnow , Somajeeste ).
 * There is also unusual activity on Somajeeste's talkpage, for instance on 11 May an editor by the name of Blaj0923 with no prior editing history posted on Somajeeste's talkpage to ask them to start an SPI, this is that editor's only post ever Special:Contributions/Blaj0923, yet they seemed aware of WP policy (3RR) and very WP specific guidelines (sockpuppetry). Another editor, Blujknf32, only registered to ask Somajeeste to perform an edit , Blujknf32 was performing edits minutes after asking Somajeeste to perform said edit Special:Contributions/Blujknf32, so it is not clear exactly why they posted on Somajeeste's talkpage. Kzl55 (talk) 11:28, 26 May 2017 (UTC)

Clerk, CheckUser, and/or patrolling admin comments

 * Recommend running CU. El_C 03:36, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
 * ❌.--Bbb23 (talk) 02:31, 21 May 2017 (UTC)
 * Just to be clear, AcidSnow is also ❌ to, and based on the technical details, I seriously doubt that AcidSnow and Awale-Abdi know each other in real life. My guess is when Awale-Adbi said "acquaintance", he didn't mean that; more likely, he meant he knew of the editor on Wikipedia. The three users edit from three different continents.--Bbb23 (talk) 02:40, 21 May 2017 (UTC)--Bbb23 (talk) 02:40, 21 May 2017 (UTC)


 * I'm looking for a second opinion here, if your able to provide one. For me while the technical evidence doesn't line up, there are many situations where it's almost like direct copy paste has been used, which has gotten to the point where I feel they harbour a lot of the same opinions without differentiating enough as is required by WP:MEAT. I haven't looked into Awale-Abdi as they were not part of the original claim. At this point i'm looking for an opinion from an administrator about the idea of blocking AcidSnow and Somajeeste per MEAT. I may ask another admin or two to look at this. -- Amanda  (aka DQ) 20:00, 25 May 2017 (UTC)
 * , just a reminder about this. I don't know if you're able or willing to give an opinion, but it would be good to get this case resolved either way. Cordless Larry (talk) 11:51, 2 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Unrelated to this, I've blocked the user for a week for breaching 3RR for a 2nd time. *** Indeed, the evidence looks compelling, I have to admit, Amanda, Cordless Larry—even with the CU being unrelated. El_C 14:15, 2 June 2017 (UTC)
 * I've looked over this and I'm unable to get past differences in speech between the two editors. For an idea of what I mean by the language differences, check out this . Yes, they contain the same phrase ("I strongly advise you to stop that or risk being topic banned."), but AcidSnow's speech is consistent with that phrase whereas the phrase feels very out of place in the usually broken English of Somajeeste. Further, what do the identical phrases do to support sockpuppetry? One does not copy/paste identical phrases while trying to evade scrutiny with multiple accounts, and the phrase is too large and specific to just attribute it to the consistent speech pattern of a single individual. An actual copy/paste seems more likely. There are also substantial differences behaviorally; AcidSnow has not had the edit-warring problems that Somajeeste has, and that's one of those things editors generally either do or don't do with little change in behavior over time. In my opinion, the copy/pasting of AcidSnow's language (and then refusing to admit it) demonstrates one more behavioral problem from Somajeeste and justifies a WP:NOTHERE block. I think AcidSnow is a bystander in this. ~ Rob 13 Talk 01:36, 30 June 2017 (UTC)
 * I would support that course of action, . I was initially suspicious that the AfD actions were very similar, but perhaps that could also have been a case of Somajeeste attempting to copy AcidSnow, in a different way to the copying of comments. Cordless Larry (talk) 06:12, 30 June 2017 (UTC)


 * I have to agree with BU Rob13's assessment that AcidSnow is just a bystander in this. One explanation is that Somajeeste isn't confident enough in their English proficiency to express themselves using their own words, so they directly copy from others. AcidSnow is a well-known editor involved in SOMALIA, so that could be why they were chosen. Taking into account the fact that Somajeeste received edit-warring blocks, which is uncharacteristic for AcidSnow, as well as the technical evidence, I'm closing with no action. Sro23 (talk) 02:20, 20 July 2017 (UTC)
 * Please reconsider closing with no action. AcidSnow may well be a bystander, but the behavioural aspect on the part of Somajeeste is very compelling, they were given ample chance to admit it (two months) and they've refused to do so. As it stands, there is agreement by three admins on the behavioural aspect of this SPI, , . Would appreciate some input , , , . --Kzl55 (talk) 07:39, 20 July 2017 (UTC)
 * I gave my view (for what it's worth) above, which was to support BU Rob13's suggestion of a NOTHERE block for Somajeeste. Cordless Larry (talk) 08:02, 20 July 2017 (UTC)