Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Jethwarp/Archive

25 November 2011

 * Suspected sockpuppets


 * User compare report Auto-generated every hour.

The users User:Jethwarp and User:Hardyraj seem to be sockpuppets.Firstly, to clarify all doubts I a party to the deletion discussion of Articles for deletion/Jyotikalash and I hold opposing views to User:Jethwarp and User:Hardyraj.But,their opposition is not criteria for my suspicion.The reasons why I think they are both same accounts are as follows:- I know that accusation is a grave one and that I am accusing editors far more experienced and productive than I am.If my fears turn out to be wrong then my apologies to all of the people who were directly/indirectly affected by my false accusation.I am sorry  Vivekananda De  --tAlK 10:17, 25 November 2011 (UTC)
 * 1) they both write "Removed" as "rmvd unref and notabliity tag"(see this for User:Jethwarp) and "rmvd tag bombing"(See this for User:Hardyraj).
 * 2) They have done similar edits. See this for edits to Kutch Gurjar Kashtriya.If anybody goes through the edit history of Kutch Gurjar Kashtriya he/she may notice that these two users have edited almost one after the another.As in here.Here.Here.
 * 3) Their edit summaries are starkly similar See this.One person's edit summary is "(fixed some type errors)" while the other person's is "(fixed some typo errors etc.)".Another instance is for User:Jethwarp who writes "(added further works from books mentioned Nanji Bapa ni Nondhpoth & others)" and for User:Hardyraj who writes "added some more information from book ''Nanji Bapa ni Nondh-pothi" published in 1999 from Baroda)".
 * 4) Another instance is from Kadia kshatriyas.See this.Notice the similarity in the lines they edit.It is as if a single person is correcting his own work.From Devaria, Kachchh See this for similarity.From Sinugra see this&this.From Dhaneti.See this for the similarity of the lines both are editing.From Mistri (caste) See this for similarity.Its not in one or two articles,please check the edit history of User:Hardyraj to see the coincidence of pages between these two editors.In all of the above cases both users have edited almost one after the other.Even if its a coincidence then how can two persons edit at a similar interval and that too to similar lines even without even knowing each other.
 * Now, there can a case that the two talked about these on their talk pages and discussed among themselves regarding all the above articles.Strangely they both only talked only twice with each other See this for the case when User:Jethwarp talked to User:Hardyraj about Bachal.And the 2nd time "Can you please help translate a few article to Gujarati laguage. If, yes, if will copy pase the material on you page. Thanks!!Hardyraj (talk) 12:08, 28 November 2010 (UTC)--Although, my mother tounge is Gujarati, I am not an expert in translation. I prefer to write in English. Thanks.R P Jethwa (talk) 16:25, 28 November 2010 (UTC)".No other conversation took place.
 * Adding to my evidence:This matter is not just related to Kutch Gurjar Kshatriya community and eighteen villages of Kutch Gurjar Kshatriyas like Sinugra, Khambhra, Devaliya, Kumbharia.See this for further evidences:

Moreover the userboxes of User:Hardyraj are same to that of User:Jethwarp.If somebody notices they can see that whenever these two have edited their edits have always been separated.Sometimes,one user has edited 10-12 times without the other user intervening in between and then the other editor edits for 10-12 times without intervention or without mix match between the two and this goes on periodic alternate dates / sessions.Care has been taken so that both these accounts are not logged in in a same session. Vivekananda De  --tAlK 16:47, 25 November 2011 (UTC)
 * 1) Sinugra-->http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Sinugra&action=historysubmit&diff=407106847&oldid=398410053
 * 2) Khengarji_III-->http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Khengarji_III&action=historysubmit&diff=400998647&oldid=383673942
 * 3) Kutch_Gurjar_Kashtriya-->http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Kutch_Gurjar_Kashtriya&action=historysubmit&diff=434516511&oldid=433496397
 * 4) Jadeja-->http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Jadeja&action=historysubmit&diff=400825222&oldid=398239624
 * 5) Jharia-->http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Jharia&action=historysubmit&diff=399525383&oldid=392961054
 * 6) Hajapar-->http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Hajapar&action=historysubmit&diff=401245809&oldid=392035174
 * 7) Nagor-->http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Nagor&action=historysubmit&diff=399170478&oldid=391826485
 *  Refuting:The below gives this following argument--"As one only proof of my not any connection with Hardyraj I can cite the AfD discussion he participated in, where he openly said that he has been other major contributor apart from me. Please note that as during that time as I was sick so I could not participate in that AfD debate. ".Lets take this as a hypothetical true case.


 * 1) User:Hardyraj comments in the AfD on 23:43, 18 January 2011 (UTC)(copied from timestamp of AfD).
 * 2) User:Jethwarp says he is sick.Yet check this and you will see that the same editor makes contributions on 18 January 2011 for 2 hours from "2:31 to 4:35 and on 7:32 7:34".I ask if a person has undergone surgery then how can he work on a computer that too for 2 long hours.
 * 3) If User history of User:Hardyraj is seen as in here, we will see that he edits from "5:07 to 6:46 and 16:46 to 23:53".Again we see that the user edits are for sessions and their time edits never match.How is it even mathematically possible?  Vivekananda De  --tAlK 04:06, 26 November 2011 (UTC)
 *  User Box Argument: I am surprised that only my minor arguments are getting refuted.Ok.Lets only talk about userboxes.When I said userboxes were same I meant all the user boxes of User:Hardyraj.His userboxes are  All of them copypasted from Userbox of User:Jethwarp.I could not find any other user whose all userboxes are copy pasted in such a similar way.Only some of the userboxes of User:Saurabhkolte match to those of User:Jethwarp,not all.Even both have worked on same userbox User:Jethwarp/Userboxes/loves Thums Up and see this again for the similarity of edits(and yet "they" have only talked twice).Their user compare report says that "total combined edits : 5229 ".This is more than coincidence. Vivekananda De  --tAlK  08:07, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Comments by other users
''Accused parties may also comment/discuss in this section below. See Defending yourself against claims.''


 * Reply : I do not know how to defend this. But yes, Hardyraj had been following up some of the articles created by me especially related to Kutch Gurjar Kshatriya community and eighteen villages of Kutch Gurjar Kshatriyas like Sinugra, Khambhra, Devaliya, Kumbharia etc where I would always find his edits. As one only proof of my not any connection with Hardyraj I can cite the AfD discussion he participated in, where he openly said that he has been other major contributor apart from me. Please note that as during that time as I was sick so I could not participate in that AfD debate. Please see my talk page with another editor for this on whom I was very upset at that time , It seemed that he (Hardyraj) was also having a copy of the book Gujarati book Nanji bapa ni nondpathi  and used to edit articles connected with the KGK Community. It seemed he was aware of the topic. So that was it, I never felt like talking on this subject with him, except one talk about translation offer from Gujarati, which he gave me  as I was wary of translating things from Gujarati - I declined the offer. Once I asked for his help  when I was going thorough edit war with another editor in Bachal case as he had done some edit but afterwards he did not come back to make any further edit and help in this matter.  That is all I want to say as for now, as my fair reply looking into arguments forward by nominator in his comments above. Please Assume Good Faith  Jethwarp (talk) 16:28, 25 November 2011 (UTC)

Further comment:


 * The Userbox similarity argument between User:Hardyraj and myself is baseless. For example I can cite another user who I had noted User:Saurabhkolte had copied userboxes from my page. That does not mean User:Saurabhkolte is also my puppet. I would rather hope User:Hardyraj comes back to give his point of view on this whole matter, as he had been the one who had taken part in AfD and KGK articles regularly on earlier dates.

Also as far as argument regarding edits on ''Yet check this and you will see that the same editor makes contributions on 18 January 2011 for 2 hours from "2:31 to 4:35 and on 7:32 7:34". I ask if a person has undergone surgery then how can he work on a computer that too for 2 long hours. given by Mr Vivekananda De, I would like to say to De Babu that as on 18 January 2011 I was in my home only by just informing that I am in for a surgery does not mean I was going for surgery on 18 January, in fact I left for Mumbai other day on 19 November for my surgery there. It was one of the reasons I did not participate in AfD, as I was aware I would not be able to follow up on the case Jethwarp (talk) 06:23, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Clerk, CheckUser, and/or patrolling admin comments

 * - Both of these accounts were created in 2009, so if it is socking, it's pretty longterm. Endorsing to find out. —  Hello Annyong  (say whaaat?!) 14:49, 25 November 2011 (UTC)
 * Concur that there are grounds to investigate these accounts.  AGK  [&bull; ] 20:16, 25 November 2011 (UTC)
 * Both accounts are editing from the same locality, but this is a metropolis so it is not inconceivable that they are discrete individuals. However, other technical indicators, including ISP, are suggestive of a link. As a mitigating factor, there was limited data available from my checks of Hardyraj, because that account edits infrequently and is inactive for long periods. On balance, technical evidence (compounded by behavioural indicators) suggests that it is more than not that these accounts are owned by the same individual.   AGK  [&bull; ] 20:25, 25 November 2011 (UTC)


 * Based on the checkuser findings, along with behavioral evidence, I've blocked and tagged Hardyraj as a sock of Jethwarp. —  Hello Annyong  (say whaaat?!) 15:21, 26 November 2011 (UTC)