Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Kavakdere/Archive

Suspected sockpuppets



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Kavakdere stopped editing on 8 June 2017, as he was reportedly hanging by a thin rope. Georgepodros started editing shortly after, on 12 August 2017.. They both have the same POV (concerned about Turkey/Ottoman Empire, trying to "Europeanize" Turkish-related articles, spreading pro-Turkish/Ottoman content, downplaying other countries). Both also write similar rants and comments in their edit summaries and on talk pages. See also; EIA

Telling that Turkey has no "emblem"
 * Kavakdere: "Whoever you are, this is your last chance. I will report you for vandalism. Turkey has no emblem, no coat of arms and no symbol. This is Turkey's modernity. COME BACK ONCE YOU CHANGED CANADA'S PAGE AND PUT A MAPLE LEAF FOR AN EMBLEM "
 * Georgepodros: "enough. just enough. Turkey has NO emblem."
 * Georgepodros: "I believe i have lost count for the number of times I deleted the "national emblem" of Turkey. there is NO emblem."
 * Kavakdere: "Turkey has NO emblem and no arms and no coat of arms... STOP... it is misguiding."

Bothered about the geographical placement of Turkey and Poland
 * Kavakdere: "(...) Infact in geopolitical terms, Turkey is Western and Poland is Eastern Europe."
 * Georgepodros: "Stop your POV on Turkey. You think its a Middle Eastern country and at the same time you think a country like Poland is in the west."
 * Kavakdere: "removed sentence mentioning poland being the west, the crowing irony is that Turkey is western Europe (...)!"

Trying to label flags of other countries as being influenced by Turkey
 * Kavakdere: "flags are actually influenced by The Turkish Flag"
 * IP 86.22.206.214: "a better title would be flags under direct or partial influence given the sourced influences of each flag on their respective pages"
 * Georgepodros: Amended the same edit

Trying to add the year "1987" as starting year of Turkish internet
 * Kavakdere: "internet was technically introduced in 87 through experimentation at Univerisities"
 * Georgepodros: changed "1990" to "1987"

Bothered why the main articles about Slovenia, Italy and Saudi Arabia (amongst others) don't mention Turkish/Ottoman military activities/rule
 * Georgepodros: "ottomans had occupied parts of present day slovenia."
 * Georgepodros: "Turkish Sieges, rule over otranto, incursions across adriatic and italian islands, pope considering fleeing the vatican, turkish plans for invasion of rome not worthy of mention?"
 * Georgepodros: "ottoman sponsored privateering led to the invasion, must recognise that instead of implying algeria was fully credited for the siege"
 * IP 86.22.206.214: "Someone should definitely put the independence from Turkey as part of the establishment. Highly misleading to not put that in the info box for readers to understand further history of SA"

Telling rants to people who put a halt to his agenda
 * Georgepodros: "(...) The page is being ruined by the lot of you. (...) It’s so obvious that the people who put it here just want to Kurdify the page, they’re hypocrites (...) Don’t be a hypocrite. (...) I’m sick of this hypocrisy and pro Kurdishness."
 * Kavakdere: "Whoever you are, this is your last chance. I will report you for vandalism. Turkey has no emblem, no coat of arms and no symbol. This is Turkey's modernity. COME BACK ONCE YOU CHANGED CANADA'S PAGE AND PUT A MAPLE LEAF FOR AN EMBLEM"

Promoting Turkey
 * Kavakdere: "Let me give you a small history lesson on geopolitics. You seem you need it. Turkey joined NATO before Spain and Germany. Turkey had democracy before Spain, GREECE, Cyprus, Portugal and during WORLD WAR TWO where even British elections were not held. Turkey has a free market economy for centuries. Turkey had democratic institutions even during the Ottoman Empire. Turkey is a country that is secular and Britain is not. Now if I changed the name Turkey to Scotland... what would be the difference? That is is Christian? You are so wrong it is impossible to answer you without insult. Turkey is more bloody western than most of Europe, since most of Europe was EITHER A COMMUNIST DICTATORSHIP (yes now westernised but then again Turkey has always been westernised, building on your point on cultural westernisation) AND THE OTHER HALF MONARCHIES OR WITH FASCIST DIKTATS. Please learn something better if you are interested in it. Noe try to remove my edits again I will have to report you... why? Because everything I said IS FACT...."
 * Georgepodros: "So now we are deleting proper sources are we? shame on you people. I placed the source showing Turkey becoming a world power months ago but someone just had to remove it didnt they? I am so glad that i can put this edit back since wikipedia is on my side with this one."

Threatening other users
 * Georgepodros: "(...) if this gets removed again then you better have a legitimate reason"
 * Kavakdere: "Whoever you are, this is your last chance. I will report you for vandalism."

Using capslock in edit summaries
 * Georgepodros (many diffs)
 * Kavakdere (many diffs)

Last but not least: Today, Georgepodros de facto admitted that he's fully aware of the edits made by Kavakdere/IP in question. - LouisAragon (talk) 15:38, 11 March 2019 (UTC)


 * I heard you guys did a CU check 1-2 years ago on Georgepodros. By any chance; is there any data left in the archives? - LouisAragon (talk) 12:53, 14 March 2019 (UTC)


 * Yeah I was afraid you'd say that. But you're right. Thank you for your reply. - LouisAragon (talk) 13:32, 14 March 2019 (UTC)


 * Naturally:
 * On 17 June 2016, on the Turks in Poland article, "Kavakdere" made an edit where he said that Turkey is a "Western" country and Poland is an "Eastern" country. I reverted this tendentious edit. Kavakdere then reinstated the same edit, accompanied by virtually the same edit summary. I explained that Turkey is Middle Eastern, while Poland is geopolitically part of the West and he needs to bring reliable sources if he wants to state otherwise. On 7 June 2016, I also left "Kavakdere" a note on his talk page, once more explaining that his rationale is patently false/disruptive/POV-loaded, as the overwhelming number of WP:RS sources do consider Turkey a Middle Eastern nation. He never replied to this message.
 * We then fast forward a few years. On 2 March 2019 I reverted a few disruptive edits made by this IP (who was unilaterally trying to "Europeanize" Turkey-related articles while purging it from its Middle Eastern/Asian "ties" without explanation); a few days later, Georgepodros suddenly appeared on my talk page saying that "Stop your POV on Turkey. You think its a Middle Eastern country and at the same time you think a country like Poland is in the west. How silly of you!". Mind you; I had never interacted with Georgepodros before, yet he was somehow aware of the arguments between me and Kavakdere ("Poland and Turkey") dating back to 2016. Combined with the large amounts of editorial overlap, this seemed like a de facto admission of socking to me. - LouisAragon (talk) 18:11, 14 March 2019 (UTC)

Comments by other users
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Clerk, CheckUser, and/or patrolling admin comments
You hear all sorts of things in this place. What difference would it make? Georgepodros is not stale and the alleged master is. I don't see how I can help you.--Bbb23 (talk) 13:19, 14 March 2019 (UTC)
 * I do have a question, though. You say above "Today, Georgepodros de facto admitted that he's fully aware of the edits made by Kavakdere/IP in question." "fully aware" is an odd wording. I think you're trying to say that the statement made by Georgepodros is an implied admission of socking, but I'm having a bit of trouble getting there. Can you please explain?--Bbb23 (talk) 13:39, 14 March 2019 (UTC)


 * When I checked Georgepodros on October 31, 2017, I found that the account was ✅ to . However, Georgepodros was created in August 2017 and their last edit at the time was on October 10, 2017. JimPody was created on October 10, 2017, so I decided to take no action. JimPody edited until April 30, 2018. Georgepodros, though, came back and resumed editing on June 2, 2018. Although the two accounts still do not overlap time-wise, this hopscotch has become too blatant an avoidance of scrutiny to be permitted. In addition, LouisAragorn's evidence presentation shows how disruptive this person is. Therefore I am blocking Georgepodros and tagging the account as a suspected puppet of Kavakdere (the behavioral evidence is sufficient). I am not blocking the master or JimPody as it's been so long since either edited. However, obviously, if either resumes editing, this case should be reopened, or I may be contacted directly on my Talk page. Closing.--Bbb23 (talk) 22:52, 14 March 2019 (UTC)