Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Sq178pv/Archive

Suspected sockpuppets



 * Tools: Editor interaction utility • Interaction Timeline • User compare report Auto-generated every hour.

There are multiple accounts who edit the same obscure page, Grover Furr, have a similar and very unusual ideological bias, make similar edits and apparently have the same WP:COI problem. Note that the Grover Furr is barely notable (that page was nominated for AfD), few people know about him.

1. I listed Sq178pv as master account because of this disclosure: ,. Their edits:, ,  (last one is adding references to page Furr - compare with editing pattern by user Ismail below). These edits are definitely a self-promotion.

2. Ismail. Here is editing pattern on the page Furr: Reverting an edit by DGG to restore a long list of publications by Grover Furr, and then sustained edit warring to restore it again over objections by multiple contributors, , ,. Same before , . This looks like self-promotion spamming.

In addition, the editing pattern by Sq178pv on page D. W. Robertson Jr (restoring reference spam on a BLP page, starting from this revert ) is very similar to editing by Ismail on page Grover Furr (above). This is either same person or two "colleagues" supporting each other. Note that Ismail was well aware of editing by Sq178pv on the page D._W._Robertson_Jr. .

3. HappiCow69 -edit

4. 24.185.84.80 - edit

5. F.V.K.1917 - edits: ,

6. Anonmwm. F.V.K.1917 is definitely the same account as Anonmwm (their edits:, , and it is the same as 31.187.2.81, 31.187.2.14, and 80.111.165.52 (edits like that , note also edit summary)]

7. Anonmwm is same as floating IP 31.187...: ,,,. Note this edit - the crimes by Stalin are in "..." - this is main bias of the alleged sockmaster.

8. Speaking of the IP 31.187...,, note that he repeatedly restored a section about Grover Furr in these reverts , , without taking part in discussion on article talk page. He also made a series of "revenge reverts" here:.

, similar edits by user Guto200 on page Furr

A couple of suspicious accounts on the same page with same bias (not included in list above):

8. that one is probably User:Jacob Peters. Note however very similar edits by Guto2003 and the IP in question, so maybe Guto2003 is a sock of Jacob Peters.

9. -  -  this is Jorge1777, already blocked for sockpuppetry.

If, for any reason, Ismail and Sq178pv are different people, then it is possible that some of the secondary accounts actually belong to Ismail, and he is the sockmaster. My very best wishes (talk) 18:28, 18 June 2020 (UTC)


 * Additional comments
 * Sq178pv versus Ismail. Here is clear indication this is same person or at least a highly coordinated editing:
 * 1) Edit by Ismail - soon reverted by another contributor, Xx236
 * 2) in a few hours reverted back by Sq178pv,  16:47, 30 March 2015‎
 * 3) These reverts lead to discussion where Ismail tells this at 15:28, 31 March 2015. Ismail explains edit made by Sq178pv and speaks about him as if he knows him personally (or he is in fact the same person): "He's a professor, naturally enough any historical endeavors he engages in are going to be done in his spare time, not while he's in a classroom or busy grading reports or whatever. The bigger point is that his article was published in an academic journal, and you are objecting to the inclusion of that article for no apparent reason other than because you don't seem to agree with Furr's views". My very best wishes (talk) 22:21, 21 June 2020 (UTC)


 * Also look at the list of Furr bibliography by Ismail he edit war about so persistently (see diffs at the top), especially in other languages, such as,
 * 苏共二十大. “秘密报告” 与 赫鲁晓夫的谎言 (Su-Gong Ershi Da: "Mimi Baogao" yu Heluxiaofu de huangyan).
 * (குரோவர் ஃபர்). ஸ்டாலின் பற்றிய குருச்சேவின் பொய்கள் / Sṭāliṉ paṟṟiya kuruccēviṉ poykaḷ [Tamil translation of Khrushchev Lied].
 * (గ్రోవర్ ఫర్). ప్రజాస్వామ్యవాది స్టాలిన్ / Prajaswamyawadi Stalin. [Telugu translation of Stalin and the Struggle for Democratic Reform
 * খ্রুশ্চেভের মিথ্যাভাষণ / Khruścēbhēra mithyābhāṣaṇa. Kolkata,

and so on. This is something only Furr himself could know. My very best wishes (talk) 22:39, 21 June 2020 (UTC)

Comments by other users
''Accused parties may also comment/discuss in this section below. See Defending yourself against claims.''

I'm the so called floating IP editor and I've nothing to do with any of the accounts listed here. Im seeing accusations but no elaboration of supposed evidence. You'll need to be clearer if Im able to address any of this. You say I'm revenge reverting you, this is innacurate. I'm reverting you because you are serial edit warring by trying to bludgeon your preferred version of the article into place and deleting sourced material. Other editors have already spoken to you about this on the relevant talk pages. 31.187.0.144 (talk) 14:20, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Speaking about this your edit, do you really believe that Stalin did not commit any crimes? My very best wishes (talk) 14:52, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
 * This is a sock puppet investigation, not a talk page. 31.187.0.144 (talk) 14:53, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Oh no, my question is directly related to the SPI. Very few people share such strange ideas as you are. For example, you said (diff above) "There's a reason why nobody has ever been prosecuted for any "crimes" committed during the Stalin era." Do not you know that Lavrentiy Beria and Viktor Abakumov, for example, were prosecuted by the Soviet authorities for their crimes as a matter of fact? My very best wishes (talk) 14:59, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Is being a Leninist a crime? Anyway Beria was arrested on false pretenses and Stalin had nothing to do with the Doctors Plot. 31.187.0.144 (talk) 15:02, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Are you saying that Beria and Abakumov were simply Leninists, and this is not a crime? And again, the idea that "Stalin had nothing to do with the Doctors Plot" is super-"fringe", it is only shared by the subject of this SPI request. My very best wishes (talk) 15:06, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
 * You say "very few people share these ideas". Among Marxists it's not "very few people", hence my question.31.187.0.117 (talk) 16:39, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Actually, you are the first and the only WP user I met around here who holds specifically such views. I saw many people with left-wing or fringe views, but no one who would deny that Stalin committed any crimes, who would say that "nobody has ever been prosecuted for any "crimes" committed during the Stalin era", or that "Stalin had nothing to do with the Doctors Plot". Absurd, absurd. My very best wishes (talk) 16:57, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

Could someone also take a look at 31.187.2.160 and Clack of the Gallows and include these users in the list of suspected sockpuppets? I reverted the edits of the IP user because the content that it was trying to add was not supported by a reliable source. Then, Clack of the Gallows reverted my edits after a few hours. LSGH (talk) (contributions) 08:24, 20 June 2020 (UTC)
 * I do not think Clack of the Gallows is him. However 80.111.44.144 (currently blocked by checkuser) is probably the same as IP 31.187... - based on geographic location and editing . My very best wishes (talk) 13:55, 20 June 2020 (UTC)
 * I wonder why 31.187.2.160 would leave a message on Talk:Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn, since 31.187.2.168 also left a message there. Could it be coincidental? Thanks anyway. LSGH (talk) (contributions) 15:37, 20 June 2020 (UTC)
 * I am indeed Clack of the Gallows. Who cares? 31.187.0.174 (talk) 15:59, 20 June 2020 (UTC)
 * That means you are using multiple accounts, possibly to avoid detection and accountability. Would you please agree to use only your named account, i.e. Clack of the Gallows and do not use multiple IP addresses? Another question: do you have other named accounts, in addition to Clack of the Gallows? My very best wishes (talk) 22:22, 20 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Multiple accounts? No that's my only account. If I'm trying to avoid detection then I'm doing a terrible job given I just said I'm that person lmao. 31.187.0.151 (talk) 07:28, 21 June 2020 (UTC)
 * You are using multiple IPs to edit war ,,, while having a personal named account. This is a violation of WP:SOCK. Why did not you make these reverts from your named account? My very best wishes (talk) 15:16, 21 June 2020 (UTC)
 * The IP range 31.187.0.0/22 was already blocked. Thanks a lot, Berean Hunter. LSGH (talk) (contributions) 17:17, 21 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Yes, this is great, but the question remains if other named accounts in this request are related. Even looking at the top row of the "user interaction utility" it seems they are all related, and especially taking into account that their edits were similar and made on the page about an obscure subject few people know about. My very best wishes (talk) 17:49, 21 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Apparently, this SPI is part of a much larger SPI. While this supports the argument that Sq178pv is located within a particular region, we could not probably say the same yet with this. There is some connection here if Ismail is not editing at roughly the same time when Sq178pv would make his edits. LSGH (talk) (contributions) 03:56, 22 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Given that both accounts are located in the same geographic area (as CU said), the Sq178pv pattern is consistent with someone editing in the strictly limited hours, i.e. from work, while the second distribution (across the entire 24 hours) means that either someone is editing from home and has a problem with sleep, or that several people are using the same account. My very best wishes (talk) 20:21, 22 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Ismail's editing pattern is somewhat questionable, since he has only a few thousand edits. Users who fill up all possible circles there usually have much more edits and have been active for much longer. Perhaps another CU could check from which IP addresses Ismail logged in? LSGH (talk) (contributions) 05:01, 23 June 2020 (UTC)
 * I agree, probably more CU attention is needed to look if Ismail and Sq178pv are the same person. See my "additional comments" above. At the very least, they openly act as a team. For example here (at the top) Ismail tells: I am in contact with the subject of the article, and he has stated that he considers the putting up of both categories as slanderous and, potentially, libelous. As such I've removed them for possible BLP violations.. That was done after Sq178pv did report his objections at BLPNB, but they were not regarded by anyone as BLP violations. My very best wishes (talk) 16:18, 24 June 2020 (UTC)
 * There is a high chance that they are the same person, Grover Furr, or they could have off-wiki connections with each other. The one-hour interval between their edits at that article raises some eyebrows. Ismail could have been trying to show an illusion of support by repeatedly promoting the works of Furr. That is a clear sign of COI, and yet at least one other user has ruled it out. LSGH (talk) (contributions) 17:52, 24 June 2020 (UTC)
 * If we assume that they are different people and Ismail was telling the truth (link above), i.e. "I don't have a "conflict of interest." He isn't a relative, I don't work at the University, I'm not a student and I don't know him personally." that only leaves a possibility of WP:PAID I guess, given his repeated reverts against consensus on page Furr to restore a clearly inappropriate list. Or perhaps they are the same person, I have seen a lot of false claims around here. My very best wishes (talk) 14:45, 25 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Whether that claim is true or not, there should still be any kind of connection between the two of them. The repeated denial of such could actually imply that the opposite is true. If there really is no connection, then why would Ismail be so involved in the talk page and trying to defend Furr? Also, Sq178pv has never edited that talk page, which means that his role would be to give support to Ismail and pose as if he was not involved. LSGH (talk) (contributions) 15:18, 25 June 2020 (UTC)
 * I agree. Now, speaking about User:Apollo The Logician who is already blocked by CU, this is apparently a case of WP:MEAT. Based on geographic location and views, this relates to Irish Republican Socialist Party, here is connection: . My very best wishes (talk) 23:44, 25 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Apologism? The beliefs are very similar. LSGH (talk) (contributions) 04:43, 26 June 2020 (UTC)
 * Indeed, their views are exactly the same. Apollo The Logician said above those are views of Marxists. No, this is absolutely not the case (I came from the country of Marxists where they forced everyone to learn it in the Soviet version). One could say that the total denial of any crimes by Stalin is typical for Stalinists, but again, this is not the case. A typical Stalinist in Russia admits there were crimes and a lot of innocent people were killed (the number is a matter of debate) because the basic facts are undeniable. However, the Stalinist say all of that was necessary for the common good and therefore justified, hence Stalin was a "great manager". This a different view. My very best wishes (talk) 16:37, 26 June 2020 (UTC)
 * I see. You mean to say, he was denying their classification as crimes, or the very fact that they ever happened? If such a view is not shared by as much as the Stalinists, and is defended by very few people here on enwiki, then the chances of paid or otherwise influenced editing is much higher. We could then be able to trace a more definite connection between Ismail and Apollo The Logician. LSGH (talk) (contributions) 15:32, 27 June 2020 (UTC)

Clerk, CheckUser, and/or patrolling admin comments
— Berean Hunter   (talk)  18:13, 21 June 2020 (UTC) — Berean Hunter   (talk)  17:35, 15 August 2020 (UTC) — Berean Hunter   (talk)  18:24, 15 August 2020 (UTC) — Berean Hunter   (talk)  22:36, 31 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Clack of the Gallows admitted to 31.187.0.0/22 and they are along with  and they are  to  who is Apollo The Logician. I blocked and tagged both accounts. None of the other socks checked in this case are in his region. Would a clerk please file the ATL report since the last are stale.
 * Sq178pv is likely who he says he is.
 * F.V.K.1917 is ❌.
 * Ismail is to Sq178pv and the only other account in Sq178pv's region. I haven't looked at timing to see if home/work scenario is possible.
 * Anonmwm is stale. Guto2003 and HappiCow69 have not been checked.
 * I have filed Ismail under Sockpuppet investigations/Apollo The Logician. Unless anybody sees that there's more to be done here, my plan is to close this. -- RoySmith (talk) 17:29, 15 August 2020 (UTC)
 * RoySmith, no. First bullet point concerns ATL socks and not Ismail who is possible in this case. You must have misread this case I'm guessing.
 * , OK, I'm unclear on what you intended. Did you want to pro-forma file  DubPics and  Jorge1777 under ATL, even though they're already blocked, just to get them recorded there?  I was going off LSGH's statement, ' We could then be able to trace a more definite connection between Ismail and Apollo The Logician', thinking that's what you wanted to follow up on. -- RoySmith (talk) 17:43, 15 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Yes to DubPics, Jorge1777 and being filed under ATL for the record. My comments were six days before LSGH's statement.
 * Done. -- RoySmith (talk) 18:46, 15 August 2020 (UTC)
 * , Just want to confirm that I've got everything as you intended? If so, I'll go ahead and close this. -- RoySmith (talk) 18:19, 31 August 2020 (UTC)
 * RoySmith, no objection to closing.

---
 * Closing -- RoySmith (talk) 23:18, 31 August 2020 (UTC)