Wikipedia:Teahouse/Questions/Archive 1001

Need Help publishing first article
Hi all! I am a student researcher who is new to posting on Wikipedia (long time user). I posted an article about a notable private company I've come across multiple times in my research. When I tried to look them up I was surprised to find they aren't mentioned anywhere on Wikipedia, despite regularly seeing them on TV and in the news. I decided to write my first article about them because it seemed fairly straight forward and easy. I wrote basic biographical info and listed a few notable accomplishments (see below). My article, however, was deleted almost immediately due to "conflict of interest" rules. I do not, in no uncertain terms, work for the company in question, or provide any services to the security industry, as has been suggested. I want to get started publishing on Wikipedia, however I'm apparently in need of some guidance. I have read a variety of similar pages, the Wikipedia guidelines, and the terms of use but I'm not sure where to go from here. I will paste my article below, and would greatly appreciate any guidance or feedback.
 * First, sign your signature here and on article Talk pages by typing four of ~ at the end. This allows other editors to see your contributions. When you add content to your User page, a good idea would be to declare there that you have no conflict of interest with Chesley Brown International. As to your content (hidden, but available, below), you can try again to create a draft at Articles for creation. See WP:Referencing for beginners, as referencing is not by inserting URLs into the text. You also need to work on neutral point of view. David notMD (talk) 17:36, 20 August 2019 (UTC)

LINK: []

Chesley Brown International is a privately owned Risk Consulting, and Security Management firm based in Atlanta, GA. It was established in 1990 as Chesley Brown Associates.

History

Chesley Brown International was founded in 1990 by Brent C. Brown as a consultant to retail, Class A office complexes, warehouses, and hotels (https://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/stories/1997/06/09/focus15.html). The company focused on helping businesses manage security risk by uncovering gaps in their security systems.

Chesley Brown obtained its first large consulting client in Atlanta, Georgia in 1991 (https://www.mdjonline.com/cobb_business_journal/ceo_profiles/safe-and-secure---chesley-brown-ceo-goes-from/article_f4d636aa-d737-5757-9c50-cac0cf1767b2.html). Developer Blaine Kelly’s Landmarks Group hired Chesley Brown to audit the Promenade II building. During this time the company began to develop the Chesley Brown Report (CBR) which became the industry-standard for security auditing (https://www.georgiatrend.com/2003/10/01/the-best-and-brightest/).

Starting in 1993 Chesley Brown expanded their relationship with Charles Rice, founder of Barton Protective Service, which allowed Chesley Brown to grow operations nationally (https://www.mdjonline.com/cobb_business_journal/ceo_profiles/safe-and-secure---chesley-brown-ceo-goes-from/article_f4d636aa-d737-5757-9c50-cac0cf1767b2.html).

Throughout 1995 and 1996 Chesley Brown consulted and supported more than 70% of Atlanta’s downtown skyline (https://www.georgiatrend.com/2003/10/01/the-best-and-brightest/) prior to the summer olympics. In the wake of the Olympic park bombing Chesley Brown provided expert analysis to national media outlets such as CNN, Fox News, MSNBC (https://www.mdjonline.com/cobb_business_journal/ceo_profiles/safe-and-secure---chesley-brown-ceo-goes-from/article_f4d636aa-d737-5757-9c50-cac0cf1767b2.html) and were quoted in the Wall Street Journal article titled “Buildings Can Be Safer but Never Totally Safe” in the April 25th, 1995 issue.

In 1997, Chesley Brown became the first security company to offer both consulting and uniformed security services (https://chesleybrown.com/our-history/). They were the first to provide security management as a critical component of property management, which later became known as “Total Security Management,” considered an innovation at the time (https://www.mdjonline.com/cobb_business_journal/ceo_profiles/safe-and-secure---chesley-brown-ceo-goes-from/article_f4d636aa-d737-5757-9c50-cac0cf1767b2.html).

In January of 1999, Chesley Brown International assumed security management of the nation’s first and largest mixed-use development: Country Club Plaza (https://www.thepitchkc.com/when-westport-gets-wild-security-guards-ban-the-unruly-but-critics-say-the-blackballing-goes-too-far/) which encompasses 18 city blocks in Kansas City, Missouri. Developed in the early 1920’s this project had previously operated their own private public safety agency.

By 2003, Chesley Brown had grown from an organization of just one, to a multimillion dollar company with over 500 employees in 27 states and three countries (https://www.georgiatrend.com/2003/10/01/the-best-and-brightest/).

In 2004, Chesley Brown expanded their corporate offices (https://chesleybrown.com/our-history/).

In 2006, Chesley Brown once again set an industry standard by being the first private security firm to launch their own event-driven worldwide remote monitoring system known as InCommand Worldwide (https://www.mdjonline.com/cobb_business_journal/ceo_profiles/safe-and-secure---chesley-brown-ceo-goes-from/article_f4d636aa-d737-5757-9c50-cac0cf1767b2.html) which was modelled after the United Kingdom’s own state-of-the-art system.

Geographic Locations

Chesley Brown is headquartered in Atlanta and Kansas City and has offices in Houston, Lexington, Nashville, Orlando, Pittsburgh, and Tampa

Suggest edit to protected content?
How do I suggest edit to protected content? I have noticed an incorrect birth date in the summary data about an individual which is in conflict with a later entry in the text which is known to be correct. — Preceding unsigned comment added by StarofDavidCox (talk • contribs) 03:04, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Assuming the page is semi protected, which most protected articles are, you can either wait until you have 10 edits over 4 days, or post a request on the talk page, by adding this to the top of your message.


 * Some pages have more strict protection, such as Extended confirmed, 500 edits over 30 days, where you can use, or full protection, which allows editing by only admins: use  . It should be remembered though that any protection above semi is rather rare, and is only used where strictly necessary.


 * OxonAlex   - talk  03:45, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Thus far, the problem seems to be that the dates given in the article's various parts (none of which cites a source) do not agree with one another. Wikipedia is not based on what anyone "knows", rather, it is based on WP:Reliable sources. If you have a reliable source for the date of birth, you may propose a change to the article on its Talk page, giving a link to the source of your information.--Quisqualis (talk) 03:54, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * I've changed the birth month to April for consistency, but we really need a reference, otherwise the date might get deleted.   Dbfirs 06:51, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * If the subject is a living person all the unreferenced dates must be removed, per WP:BLP. This is not optional, BLP rules are mandatory. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 18:17, 20 August 2019 (UTC)

Copyright question for STS-87
I want to add an image that is copyright-free but I cannot do that... I can only label it as 'my work'... But it is related to the topic at hand...

Here's the article telling the story of the image.

https://elfquest.com/elfquest-takes-a-ride-on-the-space-shuttle/

--Vikinghammer1979 (talk) 18:18, 20 August 2019 (UTC)

List of countries by vehicles per capita
The list has no sources for many numbers. I updated the sources with numbers from Eurostat with the most recent numbers from them see: https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php/Passenger_cars_in_the_EU

But some anonymous user is constantly deleting my edit. I don't know what to do. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Heinz3734 (talk • contribs) 16:03, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * - they have given a reason for reverting you ("Eurostat data are old and give no absolute number, already discussed earlier") so you need to now follow the WP:BRD cycle and discuss this change on the article talk page rather than continue to attempt to make the change, otherwise you are edit-warring. IP users may or may not discuss the change with you but, even if they don't, other editors will give their view and if you can get consensus there for your change, you can safely reinsert it. Until then, it is best not to keep trying. Hugsyrup 16:34, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * - Eurostat has current data for the amount of cars and no the data is pretty good/updated/not old. I will create an article in the talk page — Preceding unsigned comment added by Heinz3734 (talk • contribs) 18:36, 20 August 2019 (UTC)

Regarding creating a biography article of a political figure on Wikipedia
Hello, I am an official parliamentary secretary of Republic of Moldova, I was recently assigned to create the (unbiased) biography in three languages on wikipedia of Moldova's current vice-speaker, Mihail Popsoi.

I have just obtained a message from Drm310 stating "I noticed that one of the first articles you created or edited was User:Mihail Popșoi/sandbox, which appears to be an article about yourself. Creating an autobiography is a common mistake made by new Wikipedians—as this is an encyclopedia, we wouldn't expect to have an article about every contributor. Your user page, however, is a great place to write about yourself, making sure to stay within user page guidelines. Just click your user name at the top of the screen when you are logged in, and edit it normally. The page you created about yourself may well be deleted from the encyclopedia. If it is deleted and you wish to retrieve its contents, don't hesitate to ask anyone from this list and they will copy it to your user page. If your contributions to an existing article about yourself are undone and you wish to add to it, please propose the changes on its talk page.".

With this in mind, however, I am intending to write the biography of Mihail Popsoi, hence it is NOT an autobiography since it is not written by the person in matter.The current high political position of Mihail Popsoi is of paramount importance for digital resources (including Wikipedia) available for the society, hence, I am expecting the articles not to be taken down.

Thank you!

Kind Regards

Victor Agrici — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mihail Popșoi (talk • contribs) 19:20, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. The reason Drm310 thought it was an autobiography is that your username matches the person you are writing about. Since you state that you are not Mihail Popșoi, you will need to change your username immediately. Please visit either Special:GlobalRenameRequest or WP:CHUS to make a request. After your name is changed, you will need to review conflict of interest and paid editing as there are some required disclosures you need to make. 331dot (talk) 20:00, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Members of a national parliament are considered notable per the notability guidelines for politicians, so that is not an issue. 331dot (talk) 20:03, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi, Victor Agrici, once you have changed your username to your real name or to a pseudonym of your choice, you need to read WP:Referencing for beginners, and find WP:Reliable sources for the information that you know, then use these as in-line citations.  D<i style="color: #0cf;">b</i><i style="color: #4fc;">f</i><i style="color: #6f6;">i</i><i style="color: #4e4;">r</i><i style="color: #4a4">s</i>  20:08, 20 August 2019 (UTC)

The necessity of images for a page.
Salutations, new user here, I was wondering if it was necessary for a page to have an image? I ask because I am writing a draft page and the image I want to attribute to this topic is a copyrighted logo, which I have read is a big no-no for Wikipedia commons. Will my draft be rejected for having no images when I submit it?

Thanks, LycurgusOfTahiti. — Preceding unsigned comment added by LycurgusOfTahiti (talk • contribs) 18:25, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * You don't need images. It is good to have them, but is by no means a necessity. Jeb3  Talk at me here  18:28, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Please see WP:IMAGE for more information. Regards, Willbb234Talk (please &#123;&#123;ping&#125;&#125; me in replies) 19:01, 20 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Once your article is published, a low-resolution copy of the logo can be uploaded to Wikipedia (not Commons) using a WP:Fair use argument.  <i style="color: blue;">D</i><i style="color: #0cf;">b</i><i style="color: #4fc;">f</i><i style="color: #6f6;">i</i><i style="color: #4e4;">r</i><i style="color: #4a4">s</i>  20:12, 20 August 2019 (UTC)

Updating SeaChange International's "About" Section
Hello,

I am the Marketing Manager for SeaChange International, Inc.

I need to update the "About" section of our company - but there does not seem to be an option to do so. I can edit other sections like "History" but not the blurb at the top.

How do I go about doing this?

Best, Catie Algiere Marketing Communications Manager SeaChange International, Inc. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Marsoc6 (talk • contribs) 19:10, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * , are you on about the Short description? -- Emir of Wikipedia (talk) 19:15, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Or the introduction? Cordless Larry (talk) 19:16, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * "Edit" in the very top menu bar allows editing of the Lead (stuff before History), and in fact, the entire article. HOWEVER, as a paid employee, you are not supposed to directly edit the article at all. Instead, you are required to comply with WP:PAID, which means declaring paid status on your User page, and requesting changes on the Talk page of the article. An editor not affiliated with SeaChange will decide whether to incorporate your proposed changes. Yes, this is annoying. David notMD (talk) 20:54, 20 August 2019 (UTC)

Added editing of site.
Add in Wikipedia Site, under Novels: The Appointment: The Tale of Adaline Carson, Lynx House Press, 2019. ISBN 978-0-89924-163-9. — Preceding unsigned comment added by John Keeble44 (talk • contribs) 18:40, August 20, 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi, welcome to the Teahouse. If you're proposing a new article about The Appointment, and you're the same John Keeble who wrote that book, your best course is to add a request to Requested articles/Arts and entertainment/Literature/Books. It wouldn't be a great idea to try to write the article yourself, both because writing a new article is a difficult thing to do, so you'd want to get some other editing experience first, and because you would have a conflict of interest as the author, which would need to be worked around as well. Check the notes at the top of the requests page, particularly Be sure the subject meets Wikipedia's inclusion criteria. The particular guidelines about which books should have articles about them are at WP:NBOOK. If you'd like to start editing Wikipedia yourself, I'd suggest editing some existing articles, and asking questions here at the Teahouse if you need help. I've always found it a friendly and helpful place. I'll leave some links on your talk page, too. All the best, &rsaquo; Mortee  talk 23:22, 20 August 2019 (UTC)

Kuringgai Aboriginal word
Please read this report was funded by Government / councils

There was a story published in the Daily telegraph “Misunderstanding: The historical fiction of the word Guringai that has filled a void in our knowledge of the original inhabitants by John Morcombe, Manly Daily February 20, 2015 2:41pm.”

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/newslocal/northern-beaches/misunderstanding-the-historical-fiction-of-the-word-guringai-that-has-filled-a-void-in-our-knowledge-of-the-original-inhabitants/news-story/b1aec152c74220c535883621081a2fd2

In a new document, Filling A Void, by the Aboriginal heritage office http://www.aboriginalheritage.org/news/2015/filling-a-void/

The Aboriginal heritage office also states “there is no record of the word Guringai /Guringay or any of its derivatives, including Ku-ring-gai, in any of the early accounts of the colony after white settlement and no hint that the Aborigines of the northern beaches or any other part of Sydney had ever heard the word”.

Regards Gringai — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gringai Man (talk • contribs) 21:10, 20 August 2019 (UTC)

Please read this story the research was funded by Government and Councils and the Aboriginal heritage office

There was a story published in the Daily telegraph “Misunderstanding: The historical fiction of the word Guringai that has filled a void in our knowledge of the original inhabitants by John Morcombe, Manly Daily February 20, 2015 2:41pm.”

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/newslocal/northern-beaches/misunderstanding-the-historical-fiction-of-the-word-guringai-that-has-filled-a-void-in-our-knowledge-of-the-original-inhabitants/news-story/b1aec152c74220c535883621081a2fd2

In a new document, Filling A Void, by the Aboriginal heritage office http://www.aboriginalheritage.org/news/2015/filling-a-void/

The Aboriginal heritage office also states “there is no record of the word Guringai /Guringay or any of its derivatives, including Ku-ring-gai, in any of the early accounts of the colony after white settlement and no hint that the Aborigines of the northern beaches or any other part of Sydney had ever heard the word”. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gringai Man (talk • contribs) 21:14, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi, I have read the story. Do you have a question about editing Wikipedia? That's really what the Teahouse is for. If you think, for example, that our article Kuringgai should be changed based on what's in the story, you could be bold and make the changes yourself, or you could start a discussion on the talk page for that article, or if there's a change you want to make but you're not sure how, you could ask again here, explaining the issue you've run into. I hope this helps. &rsaquo; Mortee  talk 23:26, 20 August 2019 (UTC)

Wikipedia Page Not showing up in search results
Hi!

I wrote a Wikipedia entry several months ago which is not showing up in the Google search results for the individual. I read that new pages typically have a robot.txt on them to prevent them from being indexed in search results until they are either 1) approved or 2) 90 days have passed. I believe both of these thresholds have been met however I still do not see it! Can someone please look at the page and let me know what I did incorrectly? or what I can do to get the page to show up on Google when you look at his name? the page is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forrest_Galante

Thank you! Drsammyjohnson (talk) 21:52, 20 August 2019 (UTC)DrSammyJohnson
 * , it looks like the article was approved by a new page patroller in July, so the robots.txt should have been removed. Additionally, while it doesn't show up as a search result for me on Google, it does show up for me on DuckDuckGo. This may be a problem on Google's end. signed,Rosguill talk 22:01, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * It takes time for search engines to index articles once they are marked as reviewed. They can do so at different rates; Wikipedia has no control over it.  Google will likely index it soon. 331dot (talk) 00:01, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Hello, . I just completed a Google seach on my Android smartphone for Forrest Galante. The Google Knowledge Graph at the top includes a link to the Wikipedia article that you wrote, and that Wikipedia article is #7 in the natural search results, after two of his own web pages, and his Instagram, Twitter, Facebook and IMDb pages. Since he has such a robust social media presence, that seems like the correct search result to me. <b style="color:#070">Cullen</b><sup style="color:#707">328  Let's discuss it  00:25, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * I think this might have fixed itself very recently. When I looked a couple of hours ago, after Rosguill's reply but before Cullen328's, I didn't see mention of the the particular article, even if I added "wikipedia" to the search. Perhaps we have some friendly Google fairies nearby, or perhaps this was just fortuitous timing. &rsaquo; Mortee  talk 02:00, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Iowa Straw Poll is now Iowa State Fair Straw Poll
Should it be 'moved' or ? Thx, Humanengr (talk) 23:56, 20 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Are you asking if the Iowa Straw Poll should be moved to a new page. Then I would suggest not, you can always request a name change for the page using this template Requested move BigRed606 (talk) 00:34, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * That template looks like a request to change the name of a section rather a page. Why are you thinking the page shouldn't be given a new name? While it started off as a Republican-only affair, the "results were non-binding" (per the Significance §). When the Iowa State Fair took over in 2015 and made it Dem as well as Repub, it was still 'non-binding'. Aside from renaming the page, it looks like all that would be needed is minor edits to the intro para. I'm thinking it might be better to me to do that than create a "Iowa State Fair Straw Poll" page separate from the "Iowa Straw Poll" page. That's a distinction without much of a difference. Thoughts? Humanengr (talk) 01:02, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * , I'm also not certain why suggested Rename section. There is Requested move if you're not able to move the page yourself or if you think someone might reasonably disagree with the move. You can see that a requested move was used here in 2015 when the page moved from Ames Straw Poll. The instructions for that template explain how to use it (on the talk page, using "subst"). I've not looked deeply but moving it seems reasonable to me. The only question is whether it's still mostly referred to in sources as the "Iowa Straw Poll", regardless of its official title (WP:COMMONNAME; WP:TITLE) &rsaquo;  Mortee  talk 01:54, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Thx — it does seem that, for now, it's still largely referred to as "Iowa Straw Poll". I guess that means I should do a redirect(?) so people searching for "Iowa State Fair Straw Poll" get rerouted to the former. How is that done? Humanengr (talk) 02:10, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * To make a redirect, go to the page you want to make a redirect from, in this case Iowa State Fair Straw Poll, and make a new page there that consists of the wikicode  (More instructions at Redirect if you want them) &rsaquo;  Mortee  talk 02:58, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Thx much — done. Humanengr (talk) 03:05, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Humanengr You were very vague on what your questions was. And I was just trying to help. And I still don’t think you need to create a separate page for the same event BigRed606 (talk), 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * @ — Are you referring to @'s edit? Thx for your help; At this point all I need is an answer to my question here. TIA, Humanengr (talk) 02:57, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * I think it was a misunderstanding. You linked to a template about renaming a section when the question was instead about moving an article. You've since to link to a different template. Would you mind not doing that, after there have been replies? It changes the meaning of what people replying to you said, without them necessarily being aware of it, and without it being clear to anyone else reading what they were replying to. In any case, it's great that you tried to help. Misunderstandings happen; no need to feel bad. &rsaquo;  Mortee  talk 03:09, 21 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Thx again to you both. Humanengr (talk) 05:38, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

article translation from English-to-German.
At 70 years of age, I would like to learn German, especially for Reading Knowledge of German. I speak and write American English. If I looked up an article written in English, and go to the same subject article written in German will the German article be a exact translation of the English article into German? That it to say, may I use the German article to learn German, and the compare my translation accuracy by comparing it with the same article written in English? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Autodidact7 (talk • contribs) 06:33, 21 August 2019 (UTC)


 * In general, no, there will be large differences because the projects are independent and the articles are independently written. Occasionally, an article might be a direct translation, but this will be rare and will be noted in the history of the translated article.   <i style="color: blue;">D</i><i style="color: #0cf;">b</i><i style="color: #4fc;">f</i><i style="color: #6f6;">i</i><i style="color: #4e4;">r</i><i style="color: #4a4">s</i>  06:38, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

New article: Alfred James Collister
Hi, I've created my first article on Alfred James Collister, a Manx artist.

It says it is published but when I search live on Wiki, nothing comes up.

Is there a delay in publishing first articles? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Svanhear (talk • contribs) 07:28, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

I've just find the below, so I've answered my own question...….

This page in a nutshell: We can help you write an article if it is about a notable topic and it does not violate copyright law. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a personal home page or a business list. An article topic must be notable: covered in detail in good references from independent sources. Do not copy-paste content from other websites even if you, your school, or your boss owns them. To create an article, try the Article Wizard. To create articles directly, your account must be at least 4 days (96 hours) old, and have made more than 10 edits. For information on how to request a new article that can be created by someone else, see Wikipedia:Requested articles. If the topic is not notable, or contains copyrighted material, the article will be rejected or deleted. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Svanhear (talk • contribs) 07:34, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Welcome to the Teahouse, . You have not written an article. Instead, at User:Svanhear, you have written something that resembles an article but is in the wrong place. Your user page is not for article drafts. That page is for you to describe yourself as a Wikipedia editor, and what your plans are on Wikipedia. Please read Your first article for excellent advice about writing actual encylopedia articles. <b style="color:#070">Cullen</b><sup style="color:#707">328  Let's discuss it  07:49, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

where to put scanned documents to cite as references
For an article I created Suzy Williams I had several documents in hard-copy (paper) form only, not available on The Web to my knowledge, that I wish to cite as references. Most of them are clippings from reputable newspapers that would normally be considered to be good secondary sources under other circumstances. I electronically scanned all these documents and had them archived in a photo album for the FaceBook page of the article's subject, so that I could cite them in the article. An editor labeled all these citations (and no others) as "[non-primary source needed]". Apparently, the scanned documents were not put into an appropriate place. Where IS an appropriate place? --Dr.bobbs (talk) 12:58, 18 August 2019 (UTC)


 * To publish newspaper clippings here on Wikipedia would almost certainly be a copyright violation. If you have sufficient details to satisfy verification (such as newspaper name and date) you can cite them using cite news;  they don't need to be available on the web.  --David Biddulph (talk) 13:04, 18 August 2019 (UTC)


 * You cite the publication, not the individual piece of paper you happen to have in your collection. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 18:12, 18 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi . As pointed out above and as also stated in WP:PUBLISHED, source cited in articles don't have to be available online; you can find out more about how to cite such sources in WP:SAYWHERE and WP:CITEHOW. As long as the source is considered to be reliable (per WP:RS) and used in context (WP:RSCONTEXT) it should be OK to use; not being available online may make verification a bit harder, but it should be OK as long as there's a reasonable way for someone to access the source if necessary (i.e. it's not something in someone's private personal archives). You should, however, be willing to clarify the source to others if it's challenged for some reason because it cannot be found online.As for being a primary source, it could still possibly be used, but primary sources needs to be used carefully and only in certain contexts, particularly if the source is about a living person. Being a primary source and being unavailable online are really too different issues which need to be addressed separately. There are plenty of primary sources available online, but not all of them are appropriate for citing as sources for a Wikipedia article; similarly, there are plenty of secondary sources which are not online which probably could be cited as sources to an article. In this context, "primary" doesn't mean "not online", but rather refers to the relationship of the source and the subject matter. -- Marchjuly (talk) 00:43, 19 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Thank you for your replies--Dr.bobbs (talk) 08:32, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Wikilinks for Journals, Newspapers etc... in article citations
Hello:

I know the MOS suggests that when adding a wiki link to a topic in an article it be linked once at the first instance. Does the same rule apply to linking newspapers, journals etc... in citations. I have been told the same rule applies, but I have also been told that for the convenience of the reader every citation should be linked. I have come across both "styles" as I copy edit articles for the GOCE. I can find nothing in the MOS to clarify this. Can you help?

Thanks!

Twofingered Typist (talk) 22:06, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi, that's an interesting question. I've usually not seen works themselves linked to in citations. When citing an online news article, for example, you'd always link to the article itself, but it's pretty unusual to also link to the Wikipedia article about the publication, though I have seen it done. The examples given at Cite news don't include links, and there's no parameter work-link as there is an author-link.
 * Personally, I think links can be useful if the publication is interesting but a bit obscure, especially if its own history is related to what the main article is about, but for publications you'd expect most readers to know of, it can be, if anything, slightly unhelpful because they might click that link thinking it'll take them to the particular story. I wonder if anyone else has stronger views about this, or knows of relevant guidelines. For now, I'd say don't worry about it and leave links as they are while copyediting; it'll move you on to the next article faster and whatever you fix there will probably be more important. All the best, &rsaquo; Mortee  talk 23:48, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Welcome to the Teahouse, . There is no firmly established policy on this, but personally, I tend to lean toward more linking in references rather than less linking. I have written about a hundred articles and have substantively expanded hundreds more. I use citation templates. I routinely link to articles about newspapers, magazines, book publishers and authors in my references because I believe that this makes it easier for interested readers to evaluate the reliability of a given source and therefore the reliability of  assertions it makes. Anyone who does not care can easily ignore the blue link. As for only linking once, I use named references for multiple uses of a reference. Problem solved. <b style="color:#070">Cullen</b><sup style="color:#707">328   Let's discuss it  05:35, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Thank you both for yur prompt reply. Twofingered Typist (talk) 11:25, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Sandbox
What happen if I blank the sandbox page? - 139.194.23.247 (talk) 14:16, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * If you are referring to the main Wikipedia sandbox (rather than one under your own username) then you are free to blank it, with the exception of the content above (and including) 'Feel free to try your editing skills below'. If you remove that, then not much will happen except that someone will revert it and, if you persist, you will probably get blocked. <i style="background-color: Blue; color:#FFE">Hug</i>syrup 14:19, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Looking at your contributions, I see that you have indeed been removing the header. Yeah, please stop doing that as it provides useful information to other users. Generally you can do whatever you like in the sandbox, but persistently blanking it might be seen as disruptive and could lead to a block. <i style="background-color: Blue; color:#FFE">Hug</i>syrup 14:21, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Paid-contribution disclosure
Hi I'm new to wikipedia and i'd like to get paid by editing articles but i don't know how to disclose with employer. Although I read the "How to disclose" section but I still don't understand. Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by Behnam1808 (talk • contribs) 14:22, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * . You should go to your userpage (you can get there by clicking on your username) and paste in this text, editing this to change 'ACME' to the name of your employer and 'example' to the article you are being paid to edit. When you say 'you'd like to get paid for editing articles', though - can I check that you are aware that Wikipedia does not pay for articles, and no one on Wikipedia will pay you for editing. On the contrary, we strongly frown on paid editing and 99% of edits are done by unpaid volunteers. I suggest you read WP:PAID for more info. <i style="background-color: Blue; color:#FFE">Hug</i>syrup 14:26, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * I did the contribution project on my user page/talk page
 * What should I do now?
 * Wait for an employer's request or what? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Behnam1808 (talk • contribs)
 * I think you've misunderstood this. As I said, no one is going to just offer to pay you because you have inserted the disclaimer into your userpage. The disclaimer is for people who are already being paid to edit Wikipedia, for example because they work for a company and wish to update the page about that company. If you are not currently being paid to edit Wikipedia, then you do not require this disclaimer, and you should not attempt to find a paid writing job through Wikipedia or you risk being blocked. <i style="background-color: Blue; color:#FFE">Hug</i>syrup 14:50, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Paid-contribution disclosure
Hi, Sorry I wanted to know how are the conditions to edit articles for Wikipedia and get paid. Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.178.143.107 (talk) 13:34, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Hello, and welcome to the Teahouse. You should see WP:PAID and WP:COI. If you read the articles I mentioned, paid editing is a conflict of interest. Editing with a COI is discouraged, but allowed as long as it’s disclosed. You must disclose who is paying you to edit, or you will be blocked. To disclose who is paying you, put the following on your user page/talk page: I hope this helps. <b style="font-family:Comic Sans MS; background-color: #420a6fff; color: #e062d8ff;">LPS and MLP Fan</b> (LittlestPetShop) (MyLittlePony) 13:37, 21 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Hello, IP editor. Just in case there's a misunderstanding, 99.99% of all users who edit Wikipedia do it for free and for the love of improving the world's greatest online encyclopaedia. Don't look to this site to make you money. But should someone ever ask you to create or edit an article about them, you would have to read and follow the policy links given to you by above, and there is absolutely no guarantee that anything you add will be accepted. If anything you contribute fails to meet these or all our other policies and guidelines, it will be removed by another volunteer editor. That said, do try out The Wikipedia Adventure to get a sense of how things work. Cheers, Nick Moyes (talk) 14:56, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

My revised draft has vanished
Hi,

I wrote a draft wikipedia entry for Sue Heilbronner in my sandbox and asked for it to be reviewed. The draft was declined on July 13 but I was allowed to try to revise it. I did revise and resubmit it. Last time I checked on August 5 the second review was still pending. When I checked yesterday the revised draft had vanished and there was no indication what had happened. I looked in the history and there was nothing indicated after July 13. How can I find out what happened to my revised draft? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bklein61 (talk • contribs)


 * Your contributions are listed at Special:Contributions/Bklein61. Draft:Sue Heilbronner is still there, and its history confirms that it hasn't been edited since 13 July.  If you had edited it subsequently it would be shown in the history.  Perhaps you failed to save ("publish", in WMF's wording) your changes.  - David Biddulph (talk) 15:01, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

New profile
How do you create a new profile for a public figure or celebrity? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Niinoinarh (talk • contribs) 16:12, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * There is no such thing as a ‘profile’ of a person. Instead, we create articles. To learn how to create an article see Your First Article. You need to make sure it meets the Notability guidelines and is suitably Verified by Reliable sources. If you have anymore questions, feel free to ask. Regards, Willbb234Talk (please &#123;&#123;ping&#125;&#125; me in replies) 16:18, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Reference
How should I refer a reliable source...?? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Raiyan Ibrahim (talk • contribs) 15:39, 21 August 2019 (UTC)


 * There are links in the feedback on your user talk page, and on the draft itself. - David Biddulph (talk) 16:09, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi, in case you haven't seen the link to Help:Referencing for beginners yet, that might be the best place to start. All the best &rsaquo; Mortee  talk 16:41, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Some Queries!!
Hi Team- Glad to connect. It was my first page on wiki. I have some doubts. As of now, i can see the keyword "user" & "sandbox" on the page title. I am unable to remove. Also, i wanted to use biography template but unable to do so. Need help in this regard. Also, please let me know if any recommendation/suggestion to improve the page. Thank you! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rajaram Jain (talk • contribs) 16:44, 21 August 2019 (UTC)


 * When it is ready, you can submit your sandbox draft for review. There is, however, no point in submitting it yet as you have included no references.  You'll find advice at WP:Your first article.  - David Biddulph (talk) 16:50, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Content dispute over many articles
I am involved in a content dispute that spans many articles and templates. The dispute initially involved three editors. One of them was blocked for block evasion, but other than that, it has remained civil from all sides, so there is no conduct problem. However, the nature of the dispute involves quite a few navigation templates and articles, so the discussion is scattered and hard to follow. Other users got involved in some of the talk pages but are probably unaware of the broader dispute which involves mainly two editors, including me. What would be the next best action? Should I open a centralized discussion in an article's talk page that represents the central topic and reference all other discussions? Or ask for a third opinion? Any advice will be appreciated. Thank you! --MarioGom (talk) 09:51, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi, welcome to the Teahouse. Centralizing discussion sounds eminently sensible; discussion forks can be a pain. You could do that at WikiProject Socialism if there isn't one article that's the real core of the issue. Alternatively, choose one existing discussion to keep, perhaps Portal:Communism. The debate doesn't belong at the portal because it's not about the content of the portal, but you mentioned that discussion was coalescing there regardless, and at least it's talking about the broad issue. WP:TALKFORK suggests using FYI and sometimes Moved discussion to to add links from anywhere else the same discussion has been happening.
 * If the particular question is still about when to say "Marxist-Leninist" rather than "[C/c]ommunist" then the third opinion process probably doesn't fit because it's for disagreements between two people. Even leaving aside the blocked editor (I understand they're appealing), there are the !voters here, here and here (slightly separate as those were about titles, where WP:COMMONNAME applies), and the first non-IP respondent here. Alternatively, you could consider starting an RfC as a way to get more editors involved and, in time, a definitive result. Perhaps try the centralized discussion first. I hope this helps. All the best &rsaquo; Mortee  talk 16:35, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your advice! Note that the dispute is not the naming one you mention (it is related though). That one is already covered by RfC and after listing it at WikiProjects there are other editors involved and we are somewhat advancing. The dispute I was referring to involves Template:Communism and Template:Marxism_sidebar, with some ramifications elsewhere. I'll check how to centralize in a meaningful way and then possibly prepare an RfC once the options are clearer. Thank you. --MarioGom (talk) 16:51, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * ah! Sorry, I should have asked instead of assuming. I saw the image issue at Template:Communism but I didn't see it being discussed anywhere else (the discussion at Template talk:Communism sidebar was moved there last night), which is why I got this wrong. Good luck! &rsaquo; Mortee  talk 17:00, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Actually I was not fully accurate with the characterization either. Since there are a few different disputes related to communism and Marxism-Leninism, with very similar arguments being used for them, I'm starting to mix things. --MarioGom (talk) 17:06, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Writing about a topic
Dear Sir/Madam. I would like to know if i can write about a particular topic and contribute to wikipedia, what are the requirements for one to be an Active contributing writer on this platform. I thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Abdikadir Noor Aaran (talk • contribs)
 * There are no formal requirements to edit Wikipedia: As the encyclopedia that anyone can edit, as long as you cite your sources and write from a neutral point of view, everyone is more than welcome to edit.


 * As for a particular topic, the criteria for inclusion in the encyclopedia are detailed under the General Notability Guideline. In short, if a subject has received non trivial coverage in reliable, independent sources, it is deemed notable for inclusion in the encyclopedia.  OxonAlex    - talk  17:53, 21 August 2019 (UTC)


 * (edit conflict) Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Thanks for being willing to participate. There aren't really any formal requirements other than a desire to contribute. You may find it helpful to use the new user tutorial to learn more about Wikipedia and how it works.  If you want to write a completely new article(which is more difficult than most people think it is), you should read Your First Article as well. You may wish to search Wikipedia to see if the topic you want to write about does not already have an article. 331dot (talk) 17:54, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Citing sources
I am citing sources only with link between usual ref lines. But I am seeing some more elaborate citations with lot more description, for example: "Barnes, Bart (March 11, 1999). "CIA Official Sidney Gottlieb, 80, Dies". The Washington Post. Retrieved August 15, 2015." There is even link inside that description. Does this happen automatically over time, what is going on? How can I get those big description sources? Polyison (talk) 18:01, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Polyison, I'll tell you a hack if you promise to keep it a secret. After you copy a link, instead of writing the ref tags, just put your cursor at the place the cite is supposed to go and press "Ctrl+Shitft+K". When the window appears, press "Ctrl+V" to paste and press "Enter" to generate citation. Easy peasy! If the shortcut doesn't work, the "Cite" option at the top of the edit window does the same thing. Cheers! Usedtobecool  ✉ ✨ 18:09, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Changing title name
Hi,

This page is of my father https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thuc_Tuan_Thai, he passed away a few months ago and I would like correct the title of his page/name since it is incorrect. I'm a casual/beginner of Wikipedia and was wondering if anyone can help me change the title of the corrected name. "Thái Thúc Thuần"

Thank you for your help. — Preceding unsigned comment added by DaoistThai (talk • contribs) 05:36, 21 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Hi and welcome to the Teahouse.  Is the change just from Tuan to Thuan?  If so, then we can move the article for you.  Does the Olympics site use a wrong spelling?  If you want to change the order of names, then please find a WP:Reliable source in English that uses the correct order.  We tend to omit diacritics.  See WP:Commonname.   <i style="color: blue;">D</i><i style="color: #0cf;">b</i><i style="color: #4fc;">f</i><i style="color: #6f6;">i</i><i style="color: #4e4;">r</i><i style="color: #4a4">s</i>  06:48, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Is this how to reply? I feel so out of my depth, the order of the title/URL? Is incorrect, the last name is Thai, middle Thuc, first Thuan, it would be great if the it can be in the order ex; Thái Thúc Thuần in the page title since I don't think URL can have those special letter symbols, many thanks for replying. — Preceding unsigned comment added by DaoistThai (talk • contribs) 08:36, 21 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Hi there, we can change the title of the article by moving the page to a different title. However, as mentioned, you will need to provide a reliable source for verifiability one of our core policies. If you are still confused or have anymore questions, please feel free to ask here or leave a message on my talk page. Best wishes, Willbb234Talk (please &#123;&#123;ping&#125;&#125; me in replies) 08:42, 21 August 2019 (UTC)


 * The order of names is different in different countries. This is the English Wikipedia, so we use English order.  If the olympic website has got it wrong, then please point out a website written in English that gets the order right.  We are trying to help you here, so please don't be offended by Wikipedia rules.  Would you like us to move the page to Thuan Thuc Thai (English order)? <i style="color: blue;">D</i><i style="color: #0cf;">b</i><i style="color: #4fc;">f</i><i style="color: #6f6;">i</i><i style="color: #4e4;">r</i><i style="color: #4a4">s</i>  14:42, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Hello Dbfirs,

Thank you, that is fine since it is english version website and so it follows the standard of english naming order.

As toward user Willbb234, I would like to keep some sort of semblance of privacy to verify, is there a way to give a proof/verify that's not public? I understand that the upkeep of wikipedia is on the good graces of volunteers and there isn't any 'official' capacity that represent Wikipedia right? I can provide proof that if I can do it with a modicum or privacy 1 to 1. — Preceding unsigned comment added by DaoistThai (talk • contribs) 21:10, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Any source you provide need to be accessible to the public so they can be verified if desired. Private sources aren't acceptable and shouldn't be used. 331dot (talk) 21:14, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Citing/Copywrite Question
Hello! I was wondering, if I'm adding multiple sentences from another source, should I rephrase it and put a foot note after each sentence? Or is it better to cite it with quotes and have one citation at the end?

Thanks! Laurendevera (talk) 17:12, 20 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Hello,, and welcome to the Teahouse. You can upload it to Commons as Public Domain: see WP:Uploading images. --ColinFine (talk) 18:34, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Did you accidentally reply to the wrong post? Your answer currently seems rather impertinent to the question at hand... Moaz786 (talk to me or see what I've been doing) 00:02, 22 August 2019 (UTC)

Getting a jpg undeleted?
I am updating a profile for one of our global leaders and added a PR photo. It was there when I left off work yesterday but since then it was deleted -- I think because I don't have attribution for the photo? It's a publicity photo taken by my company and as a marketing person I have the right to use it. I've tried to get it undeleted but I can't quite figure out if I was able to do it. I also can't figure out how to post if it is undeleted (or where to access it). I used the upload wizard to upload it the first time -- is this where I would go to see if it's been undeleted?

Separately, I wanted to re-upload this photo as I added a caption in the uploading wizard tool not realizing that the person's name is already displayed above the box. I'd like to delete the caption as it looks kind of stupid to have it below and above the photo. Thanks! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Elizhenry (talk • contribs) 21:17, 21 August 2019 (UTC)


 * commons:File:Wade Warren 2.jpg shows that the file was deleted as a copyright violation. If the copyright holder wishes to donate copyrighted material, look at WP:Donating copyrighted material. --David Biddulph (talk) 21:42, 21 August 2019 (UTC)


 * More importantly, if you are editing on behalf of your employers you need to read about conflict of interest and you need to make the mandatory declaration of paid editing. --David Biddulph (talk) 21:45, 21 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Hi . You uploaded File:Wade Warren 2.jpg to Wikimedia Commons (or Commons for short). Commons and Wikipedia are both operated by the Wikimedia Foundation, but they are separate WMF projects with their own policies and guidelines. Commons only hosts content which can be verified to be in compliance with c:Commons:Licensing; so, when a file is deleted from Commons it's almost always because there was a problem with its copyright license. Deleted files aren't gone forever; they are just hidden from public view and can be restored once the issue(s) which led to their deletion has been resolved. Commons files, however, can only be resolved on Commons so there's not much more that anyone on Wikipedia can do other than to give you some general information. You can find out why the file was tagged/nominated for deletion and who tagged/nominated it for deletion by looking at the notification posted on your Commons user talk page (c:User talk:Elizhenry). You can also ask for clarification from the Commons administrator who deleted the file by clicking on the red link above (i.e. the name of the file) and then clicking on the talk page link of the administrator who deleted the file (c:User talk:Didym). Didym deleted the file per Commons speedy deletion criterion F1 and if you think that was done in error, then you should explain why to Didym. In any case, please don't re-upload the same file again because most likely it will only end up being deleted for the same reason. It's OK to make mistakes, but repeating the same mistakes may lead to a Commons adminstrator formally warning you about repeatedly uploading files with problems. The best thing to do is discuss things with Didym; Didym will either restore the file or explain what you need to do to get the file restored. -- Marchjuly (talk) 00:53, 22 August 2019 (UTC)

Best way to add footnotes/inline sources to a table
What is the best way to indicate an inline source is related to a table? For, let's say sport competition results.

I have seen various variants:

Source in headline[3]
This one is ugly and shows up next to the headline in the TOC! Also complicates linking to a section.

Lone source floating under headline
[3]

Source crammed somewhere into the table
All of these seem kind of subpar. Is there a better way? --Hecato (talk) 15:04, 21 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Third one is what I say is best. You could also have a separate column named ‘reference’. Regards, Willbb234Talk (please &#123;&#123;ping&#125;&#125; me in replies) 15:19, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * My gut reaction is to agree to some extent with what says. However, if you're using the same source for each row in a table, it'd look messy repeatedly adding the same one again and again. I'd use that approach if different sources in a table were being used. In no situations should any level of headings or sub-headings ever contain a hyperlink or a reference, so you could either introduce your table with a single line of explanation (immediately followed by the reference), or you could caption your table and include the reference within that caption. Assuming the data in your table relies solely on one reference, I'd say the latter way is by far the best approach. See example 4, below. For more information on captions within tables see this. Hope this helps, Nick Moyes (talk) 15:53, 21 August 2019 (UTC)


 * The first is certainly wrong, see MOS:HEADINGS. I agree with Willbb234 in preferring either your 3rd option or a separate column.  - David Biddulph (talk) 15:44, 21 August 2019 (UTC)


 * The third option is preferred if the entire table is based on that source. If there are seperate sources for different lines then a column for refs makes sense. If the columns have different sources put the refs in the column headings. In any case the references should be in the table and never in a section heading as that "breaks" the heading for screen readers. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 15:57, 21 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Thanks everyone! --Hecato (talk) 20:53, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi . You shouldn't add citations to section headings per MOS:HEAD (even MOS:PSEUDOHEADings); so, that eliminates Option 1 right off the bat. As for the other two options, a floating citation (i.e. a citation citing "white space") is never really a good idea; you should either add a short explanatory sentence before the table and then add the citation to it, or add the citation directly to the table itself. You might want to also consider whether its necessary to use MOS:FLAG in the table; I understand lots of articles use them, but most of the time they seem to be just clutter to me (especially for country names). After all, Japan provides the reader with the same essential information as 🇯🇵 Japan; in fact, but the both icon and Japan are links to the article about Japan which means the table entry is basically no different from Japan Japan or 🇯🇵🇯🇵. If you really think it's encyclopedically relevant to for the reader to see the flags, then perhaps it might be better to use flag instead of flagicon. Finally, Australia and New Zealand are different countries with different flags which makes  look like an error. -- Marchjuly (talk) 01:12, 22 August 2019 (UTC)