Wikipedia:Teahouse/Questions/Archive 565

Article should be deleted
Hello, I would like to point out that the article Víctor M. Marroquín should be deleted. I don't have the knowledge nor the time to do it, but the subject is not notable and several edits seem to have been made by the author or someone close to him. 140.247.0.129 (talk) 04:26, 13 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Hello IP User and welcome to the Teahouse.


 * I agree that the page is a bit odd, but it does seem to establish notability of a sort. You would need to provide more evidence for anyone at WP to think about taking action.  &#8212;jmcgnh  (talk) (contribs)  06:17, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

[(link to) mathematical proof needed]
https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Bretschneider%27s_formula&type=revision&diff=759871315&oldid=759868893

Is the [citation needed] tag to be used here or something else that I don't know about?

Jacob&#39;s Crackers (talk) 16:51, 13 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Greetings Jacob, welcome to the Teahouse. That is the right tag to use when something requires a citation. However, it seems odd to me to put a citation requirement in the middle of a proof. I don't know this particular formula though and I couldn't follow the proof so perhaps there is something specific about that note that makes it stand out and require additional citation. I think that article could be improved by adding a reference at the end of the whole Proof section. The only specific references are in the latter section which is about Related Formulas. If I were editing it, I would put the citation needed at the end of that whole section, to indicate we need a specific reference for the proof, and that reference would probably cover the Note. But the math there is over my head so I'll defer to you and the other editors. Also, FYI, if you want to refer to an article you can use the wiki code: Bretschneider's formula and it will look like this in the comment:  Bretschneider's formula  Hope that was helpful.   --MadScientistX11 (talk) 19:27, 13 January 2017 (UTC)


 * The note was added in this edit in August last year. You were quite right to challenge it because it wasn't even true, but a simple trig identity was intended.  I've corrected the typo and clarified the statement. [User:Dbfirs|  D b f i r s  ]] 09:37, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

Would like to have a chat with someone & figure out whether & how I can best serve Wiki.
I'm pretty well new to Wiki and have not yet gone through help or tutorials. I'd like to contribute, but would firstly like a sort of informal chat with someone with more experience to see whether what I can offer, the effort I'm prepared to put into it, and the best way to approach if it's worthwhile. Can someone advise how best to have a chat, and who with?

Ravvel (talk) 00:54, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Welcome to the Teahouse, . I recommend that new editors looking for something useful to do take a look at Community portal, which lists a massive number of tasks that need to be completed. As for a "chat", there are IRC channels and Facebook groups frequented by Wikipedia editors, but I recommend that you keep discussion of Wikipedia right here on Wikipedia. The Teahouse is a great resource. Ask a specific question here,  and you should receive a specific answer. Cullen328   Let's discuss it  05:55, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Cullen is right; you've come to the right place for a friendly informal discussion. You can also post your questions on my talk page (and I presume Cullen would not mind if you used his either). Information on the IRC channels, if you want to try those out, can be ofund here: IRC – Finnusertop (talk ⋅ contribs) 12:21, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

Thank you for the invitation
Happy New Year Thank you for the invitation Eleutherius1 (talk) 16:13, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Hello, and welcome to the Teahouse, . I've posted some useful links on your talk page to get you started with editing Wikipedia. Please enjoy your stay here! – Finnusertop (talk ⋅ contribs) 16:46, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

Links to other pages
This may be an ignorant question, but when should a link (to another wikipedia page) be made? If it has already been made in the article, is it unneeded?

Different articles seem to be different, some have multiple links to the same page throughout, but other only link once. Is there a rule (for example, you can link a second time if the first link is in the lead section) that I'm missing?

Thanks!

Bhavik333 (talk) 17:08, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Hello,, and welcome to the Teahouse. It's a great question, actually. There is some guidance at Manual of Style/Linking. – Finnusertop (talk ⋅ contribs) 17:31, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

As stated at WP:REPEATLINK
 * Hi Bhavik333
 * Generally, a link should appear only once in an article, but if helpful for readers, a link may be repeated in infoboxes, tables, image captions, footnotes, hatnotes, and at the first occurrence after the lead
 * There are lots of other things that are often linked incorrectly; common words, major cities and countries, religions etc. - please see Manual of Style/Linking for the full guidance - Arjayay (talk) 17:27, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

2nd time my article has remowed.
Dear Wikipedia,

I truly do not know what to write for establishing my company in Wikipedia. I 've been removed twie and I wonder if this automated or someone true reads my article.

Thank you

Athanasios AlexandrouA.alexandrou (talk) 17:01, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Hi A.alexandrou
 * You need to read and understand the notices on your talk page, all the blue text links to important information. In particular you need to cite extensive coverage in reliable, independent, sources to show that your company is notable, in Wikipedia's sense of the word.  It is unlikely that a company employing just six people will meet our Notability requirements. - Arjayay (talk) 17:37, 14 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Hello, . I'm guessing that this is about Parvolen. The basic answer is that "establishing my company" is not one of the purposes of Wikipedia, and in fact is fundamentally inconsistent with those purposes. Wikipedia does not allow promotion of any kind. If Wikipedia has an article about your company, the article should be close to 100% based on what people who have no connection with you or the company have published about it: Wikipedia has essentially no interest in what the company or its employees or associates have said about it, or want to say about it. Since you describe it as your company, you have a conflict of interest, so you are strongly discouraged from working on or editing any article about it.
 * If you can find several reliable pubished sources (such as major newspapers, or books from reputable publishers) which discuss your company in some depth, and are written by people who have no connection with the company (and that rules out anything based on an interview or press release) then that would establish that the company is notable in Wikipedia's special sense, and there could be an article about it. If there are no such sources, then no article on the company will be accepted. however it is written.
 * If you can establish notabiity in that way, you could request that somebody else write an article, by posting at requested articles: there is a long backlog there, so the better the references you find, the more likely it is that a volunteer will decide to take your request. Alternatively, you may try writing the article yourself, using the article wizard: if you do this, be sure to declare your conflict of interest, and expect your draft to be reviewed severely when you submit it for review. --ColinFine (talk) 17:49, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

Flag on "Macedonians (ethnic group)" page not current
Within the "Macedonians (ethnic group)" page, there is a flag titled "The Flag of the Republic of Macedonia between 1992 and 1995". This is not the current flag or coat of arms of the 'Republic of Macedonia'. This was removed as the countries flag after a dispute with Greek (pertaining to the symbol used; the Vergina Sun).

The Vergina Sun symbol/emblem is a World Intellectual Property Organization (WIPO) registered state emblem of Greece. Three variants are registered with WIPO 6ter (GR1, GR2 and GR3 variants, under Vienna classification 01.01.01, 01.01.02, 01.01.10, 01.01.17, 01.03.02, 01.03.15, 24.11.25, 29.01.02, 29.01.11).

WIPO is a self-funded agency of the United Nations, which the (Former Yugoslav) Republic of Macedonia is a member (since 1991). IP is protected by law, and as such the flag posted is in breach of WIPO IP laws, which each member country is required to abide by (unless permission is given by the owner country; in this case Greece/Hellenic Republic). This flag is also politically contested between Greece and (FYR) Macedonia and is considered provocative by people of Greek heritage.

As such, can I ask that the flag be replaced with the current flag FYROM Flag?

Thank you for your time.HistoryIsMyWingman (talk) 00:24, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Welcome to the Teahouse, . Wikipedia is not censored and countless articles contain material considered "provocative" by one group or another. We do not limit flag images to current flags or flags "approved" by legal authorities. We summarize what the full range of reliable sources say. As you have pointed out, there are intense disputes between Macedonia and Greece, which have spilled over into Wikipedia editing. Accordingly,  Wikipedia's Arbitration committee has imposed serious restrictions called "discretionary sanctions" on all editors working in this broad topic area. Please read Requests for arbitration/Macedonia for complete details. Read and study these restrictions carefully. Many people have been blocked from editing for failure to comply. Cullen328   Let's discuss it  04:10, 14 January 2017 (UTC)


 * HistoryIsMyWingman, you can start that discussion on the WikiProject talk page as well, Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Republic of Macedonia, where you might find some more takers. In the meantime, I don't see any legal reasons here, but perhaps can explain this better. Drmies (talk) 18:12, 14 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Drmies Thank you for the assistance; I guess my argument was based around the fact that the flag used is portraying the national symbol of another nations (a protected symbol).


 * Cullen328 Thank you for the assistance; I will give that a try also!

How to delete a draft article?
I created a draft of an article. Later I decided to incorporate that content into an existing article as a subsection. How can I delete the draft article, rather than just letting it sit there for eternity? Thanks, DennisPietras (talk) 20:00, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * If you are the only one who worked on the draft, you may place db-g7 on the article to request deletion. RudolfRed (talk) 20:32, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Thanks!I just added it to the draft. DennisPietras (talk) 21:15, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

Is it OK to edit articles nominated for GA?
Hi. I've been intending to add a couple cool (IMHO) images and a discussion of them to the article convergent evolution, but got involved in editing another article, so convergent evolution edits got pushed to the back burner. Now that I've turned my attention to it, I see that it has been nominated as a GA. Is it acceptable to edit an article that has been nominated? Thanks, DennisPietras (talk) 19:43, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Welcome back to the encyclopedia, . Editing of articles undergoing a Good article review is commonplace. I suggest that you coordinate your additions with the main contributors and the GA reviewer as a courtesy. Cullen328  Let's discuss it  20:43, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Thanks! DennisPietras (talk) 21:18, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

need help with article
Hello, made my first contribution to Eric Brian Hughes- filmmaker article, there are issues with it, can someone help me. I've only made several edits, and I need help. Thanks. Films1921 (talk) 02:51, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Welcome to the Teahouse, . The article in question is Eric Brian Hughes. You added substantive content to the article in late December but did not cite any reliable sources. Another editor has challenged your additions by reverting them as unreferenced. Once that happens, it is your obligation to add references to reliable sources if you want to add that content again. Please read Referencing for beginners and follow its useful instructions. Cullen328  Let's discuss it  05:48, 14 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Thanks, I have other links that I can add, however it looks like the format has changed when the last person helped with the format. I don't want to ruin it, because I am new- but I am a little confused as to how to add the new links without messing it up. Can someone assist me? Thanks kindly Films1921 (talk) 21:23, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

Moving a page i created to mainspace from user space
Hello,

I wrote a biography about Kenwood Dennard (musician) and it is in my user space. How do I get it to the main space? The article is cited properly and it should be all set to be in the mainspace, I just can't figure out how to get it there.

Someone in Germany figured out how to make an article about him in mainspace. It's a little embarassing that I can't figure out how to get his biography I put together (all properly sourced) into mainspace in english.

Any help would be appreciated.

Willoughcraft (talk) 18:47, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Hi,, and welcome to the Teahouse. The article seems to be at User:Kenwood dennard rather than in your user space. I'll move it for you, but to User:Willoughcraft/Sandbox, because it's not sufficiently supported by sources to be a published article yet. Cordless Larry (talk) 18:52, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Right, I've moved it. On the need for referencing, see Verifiability, which explains where and why you need to cite sources, and Help:Referencing for beginners for a guide to the mechanics of adding the citations. You seem to have a few down in the references section of the article, but that is only for the reference list that is automatically generated when you add citations to an article. The citations themselves should come in the text, directly after the material that they support. Cordless Larry (talk) 18:59, 14 January 2017 (UTC)


 * What additional citations do I need to provide? I thought there needed to be 4 external sources which I did reference?

There's a german article that got up and I am not sure how that is better sourced than mine? https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenwood_Dennard Willoughcraft (talk) 19:00, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Each language Wikipedia has its own rules, so either the sourcing requirements are laxer at the German Wikipedia or no one has noticed how poorly sourced it is. As I explain above, you need to cite sources in the text of the article. Anything apart from basic facts (the usual example is that the sky is blue) really needs to be sourced. I should also have checked the history of the article more thoroughly, as I now see that the reason it was at User:Kenwood dennard is because it was created by an editor called . Is that account also yours? Cordless Larry (talk) 19:04, 14 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Thanks in advance for your help.

Willoughcraft (talk) 19:03, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * the German Wikipedia may well have different sourcing standards then this one so how well or not the German version is isn't relevant. What is relevant is Notability (biographies) which sets the standard for the English Wikipedia.  I haven't looked at the draft to comment so I'll leave it to you to consider whether or not the draft meets the required threshold of sourcing. Nthep (talk) 19:07, 14 January 2017 (UTC)


 * oh i see, that helps. I'll do that. Once I get the citations in the article, what do I do to get this published in mainspace?

Willoughcraft (talk) 19:04, 14 January 2017 (UTC)


 * I started adding citations but before I get too far, can you look and tell me if I am doing it right?

Willoughcraft (talk) 19:29, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Could you answer my question about the other account before I check that, ? Cordless Larry (talk) 19:31, 14 January 2017 (UTC)


 * its been a long time trying to get this page set up so forgive me if my memory is vague. I think initially I set it up under his wiki account with the help of one of his musical peers stanley jordan. But once it was set up, I felt more comfortable editing it with my own account. Is that ok? He's an esteemed musician and I am just trying to get the english version of his biography up on wiki...

Willoughcraft (talk) 20:25, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Thanks for clarifying, . There are a couple of issues that we need to deal with. The first is that you appear to have some sort of relationship with Dennard. You should declare this potential conflict of interest by following the guidelines at WP:DISCLOSE. Second, I have realised that large parts of the draft article are copied word-for-word from a source that is subject to copyright. You can see a comparison of the material here. I will deal with this second problem, but it will have to involve the deletion of parts of the draft, I'm afraid. You can then rewrite this material in your own words. Cordless Larry (talk) 20:34, 14 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the info. I hope that if I source the article, then it shouldn't have to be deleted? If you check it out, you can see where I am adding the citations and hopefully I am doing this right.

In terms of my relationship with Dennard, it's interesting. When I wrote the article, we were friends and I was a fan but since then we fell in love and I am now his wife. I have not changed anything in the article and, as I have a background in journalism, I am keeping objective, that's why I am making sure to source other references.

Can I still help with this being his wife now? It was my project to begin with so I'd love to see it through but if that's not possible due to the changed status of our relationship, then how can we proceed to get his biography into wiki? He's sources all over the place in wiki so I'd just like to see him represented. Willoughcraft (talk) 20:49, 14 January 2017 (UTC)


 * I was in the process of quoting and citing the copy and now it's all been removed. Can you put it back in my sandbox to give me the opportunity to properly cite the article? If I quote it and cite it, then it should be ok right?

I could also pursue getting permission from them if citing them isn't enough. Willoughcraft (talk) 21:02, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * You can access past versions of the page using the history tab at the top,, but please don't reintroduce any material without rewording it. You don't need permission from the copyright holder to cite material, but you can't just copy it word-for-word as that is both plagiarism and a copyright violation. You can include short quotes as long as they are inside quote marks. As for your relationship with Dennard, this doesn't prevent you from being allowed to edit the article, though WP:COI does discourage it. Most important is that you follow the advice there on declaring your conflict of interest. Cordless Larry (talk) 21:08, 14 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Ok thank you. I am happy to rewrite the article but then how do I get it back into the page once I have rewritten it? I'm not clear on that.

I am glad that I am allowed to finish this and I will declare the COI without a problem.

Thanks again for your help. Willoughcraft (talk) 21:26, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Just edit the article as usual to add the material,, taking care not to remove the copyright violation template in the biography section. Cordless Larry (talk) 21:30, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

I'd like my entire user history to be erased.
this is the link- https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User:DRAGOMIROV&action=history

I'd like all of my past edits and history to be completely erased for privacy reasons as I added my email address to my profile back in 2007 and it is now publicly visible via a google search. DRAGOMIROV (talk) 20:34, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Welcome to the Teahouse, . You cannot delete your edits to the encyclopedia but if you follow the procedures described at WP:Courtesy vanishing, your edit history will be much less visible through a Google search. An administrator may be able to delete the specific edit where you disclosed your email address. Cullen328  Let's discuss it  20:40, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

Someone deleted my user history for me, but my "contributions" page seems to still be visible here -

http://wikivisually.com/wiki/Special:Contributions/DRAGOMIROV

I'd like that erased also. DRAGOMIROV (talk) 20:44, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * has deleted your user page for you,, but it is not technically possible to delete your contribution history, as all edits to articles and other pages need to be attributed to an editor. Cordless Larry (talk) 20:48, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

Okay thanks. I think that might be enough anyway. I'll wait and see if my email clears from google.DRAGOMIROV (talk) 20:51, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * , that page you link to (

http://wikivisually.com/wiki/Special:Contributions/DRAGOMIROV) is a Wikipedia mirror outside of our control. – Finnusertop (talk ⋅ contribs) 22:52, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

Page protection
How does one protect a page from anonnymous vandals? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Crybbluvyduby (talk • contribs) 21:50, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Hello,, and welcome to the Teahouse. Protection is done on request, and only on pages where persistent vandalism has taken place, not pre-emptively. You can read more here: Protection policy – Finnusertop (talk ⋅ contribs) 22:54, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

Does work?
Looking over recent changes I noticed edit, which looks like it should have changed the title to say 'hovercraft' in place of 'spacecraft' (looking also at Template:DISPLAYTITLE), but it's still showing as 'spacecraft' for me. The word 'Matrix' also isn't italicized in the title, which both the previous and current versions seem to be trying to achieve. What's going on there? Mortee (talk) 01:20, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Apologies, I may have answered my own question. It looks like you can't change the wording this way, only the formatting. So when the wording changed, that broke the italicization without replacing 'spacecraft'. I'll edit the page with an explanatory edit summary. Mortee (talk) 01:24, 15 January 2017 (UTC)

is there a way to get thumbnail images on the left side?
Hi. When I add a thumbnail, it always appears on the right side of the page. Is there a way to force it to appear on the left side? Thanks, DennisPietras (talk) 01:31, 15 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Hello Dennis


 * It is simple just add word "left" between the pipes e.g. |left|


 * By default images are placed at right, but you can force to place them on left or in center by adding word |center| or |left|.


 * Aftab Banoori (Talk) 02:46, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Thanks! It worked and looks just like I wanted it to! DennisPietras (talk) 03:22, 15 January 2017 (UTC)

How to search within revision history
Looking into some bad recent changes, I started reading Harold C. Lyon, Jr.. The claim that he developed Sesame Street seems implausible (among other problems with the article). I can't figure out how to find out who added that claim and when. Could you help with that? If it's a recent edit, perhaps I can restore the original. If it's older, perhaps I can ask the editor to source it. Mortee (talk) 04:38, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Hello, Mortee. Under the "View History" tab of the page, there is a click-able "Revision History Search" utility that will assist in finding that information.  In this case, the reference to Sesame Street was in the earliest version of the page.  I hope this response is helpful.  NewYorkActuary (talk) 04:50, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Welcome to the Teahouse, . Thank you for bringing forward this issue. I am extremely dubious of the claim that Lyon "developed" Sesame Street although he may have played a small part for all I know. I did a Google search for "harold lyon sesame street" and all I found, including a book search, were promotional mentions in his own books and material promoting his own speaking engagements. Our article History of Sesame Street is very thorough and is a Featured article which has gone through an extensive peer review,  and that article does not mention Lyon. As a matter of fact,  no Sesame Street related article mentions him. I intend to remove this unverified claim from the article. You are correct that the article has other problems as well, including an over-reliance on self published sources,  but this is among the most glaring problems. Cullen</b><sup style="color:#707">328   Let's discuss it  05:38, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Thank you very much to both of you. This helps a lot. Mortee (talk) 05:41, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * The subject himself created this article (there's also a copy of it currently on his user page), and nearly all of his edits on Wikipedia appear to be self-promotional. Funcrunch (talk) 08:05, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Thanks for taking a closer look, . I suspected as much. By the way, I posted at the Biographies of living persons noticeboard, asking for other editors to take a closer look at this article. <b style="color:#070">Cullen</b><sup style="color:#707">328   Let's discuss it  08:54, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * I have nominated the user page copy for speedy deletion. Cordless Larry (talk) 08:58, 15 January 2017 (UTC)

Problem with DYK nomination
Template:Did_you_know_nominations/Deseret_alphabet Not sure what I did wrong here Psiĥedelisto (talk) 06:14, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Hi Psiĥedelisto. All fixed. It would be good if you added a caption to the image, next to the caption parameter. There were two issues: a wikilink missed a second bracket: Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 13:47, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Thank you very much for your help! For some reason my eyes seem to glaze over when looking at source code mode...I couldn't figure out for the life of me what was wrong. That's why I usually stick to the VisualEditor. Thanks again! I'll rectify those issues now. Psiĥedelisto (talk) 13:50, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Anytime! Using Wikipedia's name and motto for the caption, as written in in the alphabet, is a very neat twist.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 13:56, 15 January 2017 (UTC)

Two sources in one citation
I have a reference that I found in two places, a book and a newspaper article that uses exactly the same article, as kind of a reprint. I would like to use both citations to aid the researcher. What do you think, and how should I do it — if I do. I always enjoy the tea here in the teahouse, and the good company, and I have BeenAroundAWhile (talk) 05:15, 15 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Hey BeenAroundAWhile. It is possible to include more than one citation in a single ref. For example:

This claim is supported by multiple sources.


 * ...which should give you this:


 * Hope this helps. Timothy Joseph Wood  14:32, 15 January 2017 (UTC)


 * I'm going to take a slightly different tack from Timothyjosephwood and suggest that you just use one of the two identical sources - see Citation overkill. It's easier to present and easier to read. Nthep (talk) 14:45, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Either one works, as does simply citing both sources independently. The approach I present is admittedly more useful when there are several, and not just two or three references, and mainly to avoid WP:OVERCITE formatting problems that may make articles difficult to read, especially on mobile. Timothy Joseph Wood  14:48, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Possibly but I still prefer separation because I prefer to see the use of citation templates and in this case BeenAroundAWhile is asking, as I read it, about the use of the same article appearing in multiple publications. Nthep (talk) 15:15, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * The method above still supports citation templates, in the same way that citation templates may still be used without ref tags in further reading and external links sections. Timothy Joseph Wood  15:17, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * For example

This claim is supported by multiple sources.

why is an hours work deleted
LeoH.7L (talk) 15:19, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Welcome to the Teahouse, . An article or material within an article could have been deleted for many different reasons, so you're going to have to give us some more details for us to be able to answer that question. Cordless Larry (talk) 16:09, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * It probably relates to User talk:LeoH.7L. --Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 16:17, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Or it could be about How the trojan war began. Cordless Larry (talk) 16:24, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * It is related to this edit semiprotected request which was deleted in error. I have since replied to a similar request by the same user. Dr.   K.  16:36, 15 January 2017 (UTC)

Police commander of somalia
Hey guys i want to add a wiki page of the assisinated police commander of Somalia.Most of his life was throughout the sixities, 70's and was widely known within Somalia society.However somalias newspaper agencies have long been destroyed after the country was plunged into civil war as such sources are low , what shall I do?Mokillem (talk) 10:33, 12 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Is this the same person that you've tried at User:Mokillem/sandbox? You asked (and have been answered) twice already on this page: at  and in a continuation of another editor's question at .  You have also received feedback on your user talk page.  You have made it clear that you are unable to find verifiable sources so sadly the answer is simply that you shouldn't try to write a Wkipedia article on that subject unless and until such sources become available.  If you want to write about him based on unpublished or unverifiable sources then you would need to do so on another website, but not Wikipedia. --David Biddulph (talk) 10:59, 12 January 2017 (UTC)


 * I don't want to sound daft, because I really do not know, but I thought perhaps it might help you to get an opinion from someone else from a non-Western country (in my case Philippines) also. Many American and European Westerners are very blessed to have large free libraries where they can read anything from basically any journal in the (Western) world, and should the library not have it, it probably has it via an online subscription like JSTOR, or they can even request it from another library which does have it and receive it for free ("inter library request"). Well, we may not be so blessed in that our libraries are not free, and they sometimes take quite a big process to get membership to (in my case, if I want to write about Filipino topics which I have many times, for example Philippine history and law topics are very poorly covered here on Wikipedia, I have to badger one of my friends who is an alumnus of UP Diliman to let me go to the library with him), but if your country has a library they probably do have old newspapers on microfilm. I have done research in the Philippine STAR at Manila libraries for example, and also Marcos-era newspapers no longer published. I hope that there is some archive of the newspaper somewhere, good luck in finding it. When a country loses their history it is a terrible thing indeed. Psiĥedelisto (talk) 11:15, 12 January 2017 (UTC)


 * I don't know what to do ? non-western history is really hard to fine especially in a wartorn country like Somalia.Is there any person I can contact to assist me since your "advice" is clearly not aiding me.Mokillem (talk) 12:21, 12 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Look for libraries, public records offices, etc. Try to contact university professors and see if they know how you can find newspaper archives or other archives of Somali history. Not many Wikipedians are from Somalia -- the best person to find the reliable sources in this case is you, a local. If you can't find them, there's nothing you can do. Wikipedia unfortunately cannot accept oral testimony, or things you remember being in the newspaper, as sources, unless that oral testimony is corroborated by many people and published in a journal or something. Look for books about Somali history - if this guy was very notable, he'll have been mentioned, probably. You know how we know basically nothing about pre-literate societies, compared to literate ones? It's like that - without someone being there to record history and archives of it being made and publicly available, there can be no history and therefore no Wikipedia articles about that history. Psiĥedelisto (talk) 12:38, 12 January 2017 (UTC)


 * How confident are you in the name and date you have given? Although there are no obvious sources regarding "Yusuf Ahmed Mohamed", shot on 25 January 2005, (and the one URL you gave as a reference doesn't help, as it leads just to the top of the BBC news pages), there are a number of sources regarding a "Yusuf Ahmed Sarinle", shot on 23 January 2005.  Even if this is the person you are trying to write about, unfortunately at first glance the reports all seem to be about his death, so don't help much with verifying most of the text in the draft. David Biddulph (talk) 12:52, 12 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Hello, . I am assuming that you are talking about Yusuf Ahmed Sarinle, and if so, I believe that the BBC articles and the Voice of America article are sufficient to support a brief stub about this person, which can be expanded as time goes by and the details of the history of Somalia are recreated by scholars. He meets our notability guideline for politicians as the senior security official for the government of Somalia before his assassination. He also meets WP:SOLDIER as a military general. Although that is not a formal notability guideline,  it is widely respected among editors working on military topics. <b style="color:#070">Cullen</b><sup style="color:#707">328   Let's discuss it  04:19, 13 January 2017 (UTC)
 * I have written an article, Yusuf Ahmed Sarinle, and would appreciate feedback from or any other editor. <b style="color:#070">Cullen</b><sup style="color:#707">328   Let's discuss it  01:05, 15 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Hi Cullen.I am the Grandson of this fine gentlemen and my dad constantly mentions him.

I'm entering University soon and love history of all sorts.My father asked me to write this article so i am pretty sure of the dates.In fact i have a picture of him and will try to edit your article.I am trying to find sources as we speak to help with his early life however i would like help from you.I need to know is their any exceptions to war heros from war torn countries i cannot go to Mogadishu right now for both security and convienience reason and i do not think the library is still functioning.None the less if there are any exceptions please inform me on it.

Furthermore he has worked for Interpol in the 1980's, if you can find any Interpol archival information it would be thankfull. I myself never knew my grandfather and had a 5 second conversation when i was around 6 years of age.Mokillem (talk) 19:06, 15 January 2017 (UTC)

Cross referencing or duplicating of a previous entry at Wikipedia
In my project there are persons who have died and that is noted in the description. The principals have individual entries at Wikipedia and their obits are included from New York Times in those entries.

Is there a way to grab an entries made by another Wiki editor for instance in a template for newspaper information and add that to my entry?

Or must it be done from scratch?

Another way to ask this is can I view the template?Loninappleton (talk) 19:32, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Welcome to the Teahouse, . Yes, as long as you have actually read the reference in the other article, you can copy and paste that reference from there to your work in progress. When viewing the source code,  the reference will most commonly appear right after the statement being referenced.  It will appear in the form . The part between the ref tags will be the bibliographic information,  either as part of a template or entered manually.  There can be some complications, especially if the specific reference is used multiple times. Referencing for beginners is a good resource,  and if you mention the specific article and reference,  we can give you a very specific answer. <b style="color:#070">Cullen</b><sup style="color:#707">328   Let's discuss it  20:12, 15 January 2017 (UTC)

Add a new page in different language?
How can I add very simple a new page? I want to add an English version of the Turkish wikipedia site sadaka tasi...Esacan (talk) 17:20, 14 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Hello, . Thank you for wanting to contribute to Wikipedia. Even if the article you want to write is a translation of an article from another Wikipedia, what you are doing is creating a new article in English Wikipedia, and that is a difficult activity. Each Wikipedia has its own rules and policies, and just because there is an article in another language does not automatically mean that one will be acceptable in English. And there is no such thing as a "simple new page" - English Wikipedia has many thousands of inadequate articles, but we are much more careful now about what we accept, and new articles which are not satisfactory are usually rejected or deleted. I suggest you read Your first article; but in this case, also look at Translation. --ColinFine (talk) 17:54, 14 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Thank you for your answer. It's clear! I will do my best. Esacan (talk) 21:11, 15 January 2017 (UTC)

Sources from JSTOR which are unavailable
My project turned up information on google such as pdf documents or magazine articles which are restricted by the control of JSTOR. JSTOR and the like require an academic credential and usually printing fees and other restrictions on their content. The magazine specifically is called The Drama Review which moved from Tulane University to MIT publications many years ago.

If the simple link to a pdf is shown, does that constitute a reference?Loninappleton (talk) 20:34, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Welcome to the Teahouse, . Let me begin with the general principle: There is no requirement that a reference be available online, or that it be available for free. If reliable sources supporting a specific assertion are plentiful, and if high quality sources are freely available online, then the best free online sources should be included as references. However,  when researching certain narrower topics in a library (or a used book store,  for that matter), you may find information suitable for the encyclopedia that is not available online. You should provide full bibliographic information about the source in your reference.


 * More specifically, I think that you are talking about TDR (journal), which is certainly a reliable source about theater. You can include articles from that journal as long as you have read the relevant sections of the article. JSTOR is, in effect, a digital library. You should link to the JSTOR listing for the article for the reader's convenience, but it is the journal article itself which is the source,  not JSTOR. <b style="color:#070">Cullen</b><sup style="color:#707">328   Let's discuss it  22:33, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * is right, . Please also format the reference so that it's not just "the simple link" to the resource. Include at least the name of the name of the author, title of the journal article, date (and volume and issue) and name of the journal, and the page or range of pages you cite. Help:Referencing for beginners should get you started and you can optionally use Cite journal to help you with the formatting. – Finnusertop (talk ⋅ contribs) 01:46, 16 January 2017 (UTC)

article related
What can I do if i don't have any newspaper source about my article on my village and wikipedia ask me for newspaper source?IASamit (talk) 05:44, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Books, government sources, magazines, academic journals, census results, etc, are all acceptable alternatives. --Psiĥedelisto (talk) 06:03, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Welcome to the Teahouse, . The relevant guideline that applies to villages is Notability (geographic features). In my opinion, oversimplified by saying that newspaper references are needed. What we need are reliable sources as described above. We are looking for more than a census entry. <b style="color:#070">Cullen</b><sup style="color:#707">328   Let's discuss it  06:08, 16 January 2017 (UTC)

Submiting userboxes
I know, that most of the user boxes are marked as User: something/name. I Have made a userbox, but how do you make them into a template??? Friy Man talk 19:25, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Hi FriyMan. Place the code on its own page like User:FriyMan/Shiba inu. Then you and others can display it with . Note Userboxes/Dogs already displays both User:Liance/Userboxes/Doge and User:Max Density/Userboxes/Shiba Inu. PrimeHunter (talk) 20:57, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Thanks, but there is not a userbox about owning a shiba. Friy Man  talk 06:51, 16 January 2017 (UTC)

User Page Creation
Helper, How can I create a user page on wikipedia? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Shadow2017 (talk • contribs) 11:37, 16 January 2017 (UTC)


 * I've also replied at your user talk page. Your user page is at User:Shadow2017. You can create it by clicking on that red link, writing something in the textbox that comes up, and clicking the "Save page" button below the textbox, just as you edit any other Wikipedia page. Maybe you'd like to take a look at WP:User pages first? Huon (talk) 11:57, 16 January 2017 (UTC)

Help me at Keshavrao Sonavane wiki's talk page? anyone plz?
Help me at Keshavrao Sonavane wiki's talk page? anyone plz? 202.135.238.200 (talk) 12:11, 16 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Convenience link: Talk:Keshavrao Sonawane. Hello, IP editor, and thanks for your interest in improving this article.  There are two sections there which you have named "Help Me" - I assume this is about the second one, where you want to remove the "overly detailed" tag.  You already asked the editor who placed that tag  - perhaps you should give them a chance to reply.  However, I notice that the changes you made have not done anything to reduce the amount of minor detail there so it would be best to fix that before trying to have the tag removed. --Gronk Oz (talk) 12:53, 16 January 2017 (UTC)

Published article
Hello,

How can i know if my article is published to the public? Thank you for your help AyaJoumaa (talk) 09:15, 16 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Do you mean Transmed Holding? If so, then that article is currently published.    D b f i r s   10:04, 16 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Though it is published, you need to look at the maintenance notices at the top of the article, and at the wikilinks from there to further detail. --David Biddulph (talk) 13:17, 16 January 2017 (UTC)


 * It has now been deleted as "Unambiguous advertising or promotion" - Arjayay (talk) 13:30, 16 January 2017 (UTC)

Draft page: Received a message "specifically needs major reviews"
How do I contact the user that left me this comment to find out what the "major reviews" are?

Also, how do I publish my draft once it has been reviewed and approved? Emma Bosch (talk) 15:03, 16 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Hi Emma and welcome to the Teahouse. I assume you mean your Draft:Hitting Town (1975). The reviewer meant you need reviews of the play in major publications to use as references. I've added the links in the reference section of your draft to two such reviews for you to use. I also added a link to the actual book Stephen Poliakoff on Stage and Screen which allows much of the information to be verified and also shows significant coverage of this play in a high quality academic book. Your had simply linked to an advert/précis for the book on the publisher's website—always best to use the actual book, with page numbers. Anyhow, the subject is clearly notable and I suggest you now incorporate the reviews as inline citations in your draft. I'll then accept it myself. It will be published for you when the reviewer (me or someone else at AfC) moves it into article space. I see you've now contacted the original reviewer, so I guess your first question is answered. Best, Voceditenore (talk) 16:29, 16 January 2017 (UTC)

WHITE PAWN
WHY CAN ONLY MOVE FOWARD 2 SPACES ON OUR FIRST MOVE ?10:42, 16 January 2017 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:C7D:C829:3700:69D4:F86A:BE1:DA8F (talk)
 * IP editor, this page is about help in editing Wikipedia. General questions like this should be raised at Reference desk or in this case you might try asking at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Chess.  And please don't "shout" by writing in CAPITALS all the time. Nthep (talk) 11:46, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * If however you are asking why the rules only permit the pawn to be moved two spaces on its first move and not a later move, the answer that you will get is probably: "That's just the way it is."  Some of the rules of chess have the purpose of making the game complicated, and the game is supposed to be complicated.  In the future, you know where to ask.  Robert McClenon (talk) 16:53, 16 January 2017 (UTC)

How and when does a Wikipedia page get published?
Greetings! Just finished creating and editing a page, saved it, but it does not show up. How and when does it get published? Jaureguino (talk) 16:39, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Hello, welcome . Your article is only on your own user page right now. In order to publish it, you have to copy what you have to a new page, perhaps TheFaustFlick. Your article, however, has several problems - the largest of which is that it cites no reliable sources (see WP:CITEIMDB), so it may not last long in article space before being deleted. I recommend adding sources before you publish it. Psiĥedelisto (talk) 16:58, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Welcome to the Teahouse. You had saved it as your user page, which isn't where it belonged, so I've moved it to User:Jaureguino/TheFaustFlick and added a userspace draft tag to allow you to submit it for review when it is ready.  It isn't ready yet, though, as it has no references to reliable sources to demonstrate notability.  The first thing you need to do is to read the advice at WP:Your first article. --David Biddulph (talk) 17:02, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Are new users required to go through the Draft/AFC process now? If so I'm sorry for my bad advice, it wasn't like that when I registered... Psiĥedelisto (talk) 17:10, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * It's not mandatory to use AFC, but it's highly recommended. I'd say well over half the articles I've reviewed that didn't use it were deletion worthy. <b style="color:#CCCC00">Joseph</b><b style="color:#00FF00">2302</b> (talk) 17:21, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * I will remember that when replying here in the future. I agree that it's a good idea. Psiĥedelisto (talk) 17:23, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * A new user can't move a page until they are autoconfirmed. Although in principle a new user could create an article, I would never advise them to do so.  If they get it drastically wrong it would be likely to be deleted, as you suggested, whereas if a draft is declined they have the chance to rework and improve it.  Looking at this user's draft it obviously wasn't fit for publication, so it made sense to move it to a userspace draft and give them advice as to what they needed to do to get it fit for review. --David Biddulph (talk) 17:27, 16 January 2017 (UTC)

You are both very kind. Thanks a lot. I will work on the reliable sources. JaureguinoJaureguino (talk) 17:59, 16 January 2017 (UTC)

I recieved a notice that my page has been reviewed but it still has a tag at the top
The page is here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chi_Sigma_Xi and the tag states "This article, Chi Sigma Xi, has recently been created via the Articles for creation process. The reviewer is in the process of closing the request, and this tag should be removed soon."

I received a notice that it has been reviewed 5 hours ago, but there doesn't appear to be anything on the talk page or any suggestions. Also, the tag still remains.

Does it still need revision? How do I get it revised?

Erin Pantone (talk) 18:12, 16 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Welcome to the Teahouse. It was you that added the tag.  It was in the first version of the page when you created it.  That isn't the way that an AFC creation would normally look.  Did you perhaps copy and paste from Draft:Chi Sigma Xi Multicultural Sorority?  If so, that is what will have caused the confusion.  That draft has a "Submit" button to allow you to submit it for review, but you apparently didn't do that. --David Biddulph (talk) 18:39, 16 January 2017 (UTC)

Looking up recent changes that haven't been undone/superceded
When I look at recent changes, the bad ones have already been undone at least half the time. Is it possible to filter the results to only those edits that are the latest to the articles they affect, i.e. those that haven't been undone or superceded by a newer version of the page? Mortee (talk) 07:10, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * (editing the phrasing of my question, because it might not have been clear enough Mortee (talk) 18:44, 16 January 2017 (UTC))

how to submit draft article
I have created the proof, added references and proofed it. Now I wish to submit but cannot find where/how to do this.Ringosumegi (talk) 21:17, 16 January 2017 (UTC) Assuming you are referring to Draft:Country Meats Direct, this appears to be blatant, promotional, advertising, which would be inappropriate to move to Wikipedia main-space. Unless you can provide significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject, and remove the promotional content, your draft is likely to be deleted. - Arjayay (talk) 21:26, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Hi Ringosumegi


 * The thing to realise,, is that Wikipedia has essentially no interest whatever in what Country Meats Direct, or their employees, agents or associates, say or wish to say about themselves. Nothing. It is only interested in what people who have no connection with them have published about them, in reliable places such as major newspapers, or books from reputable publishers. If such independent sources exist, then an article can be written, which should be based close to 100% on what those independent sources have said about the company. (A few bits uncontroversial factual information like places and dates may come from non-independent sources, but every single piece of information in the article must come from a reliable published source). If there is not sufficient independent published material about the business, then the business is not currently notable in Wikipedia's special sense, and no article will be accepted however it is written. If the sources do exist, then an article can be written based on them: it must be neutral in tone, and contain no evaluative language except in a cited direct quotation from a reliable source. --ColinFine (talk) 21:44, 16 January 2017 (UTC)

Question about blocking user
User Richard Gooi has been systematically removing or distorting approved cited edits from the John de Ruiter living person's page. I have appealed to this person through the talk page to no avail. I suspect the individual may be one of the litigants in the case against Mr. de Ruiter before the courts which would be a serious conflict of interest. Is it possible to find this person's ip address and block them for vandalizing the article? Thank you. Planktonium (talk) 19:05, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Hello, and welcome to the Teahouse, . If you think that an editor should be blocked, please raise the case at Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents. Finding out an IP address only becomes topical if you have evidence to suggest that the editor is misusing multiple accounts, i.e. what we call sockpuppetry. – Finnusertop (talk ⋅ contribs) 19:39, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * But before raising the issue at Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents you need to be aware that your own conduct too will be scrutinised; beware of the boomerang. --David Biddulph (talk) 20:07, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Welcome to the Teahouse. Looking just at the most recent reversion, the text which you had added in  was not properly sourced.  I don't know whether the numbers in square brackets ([6], [7], [8]) were intended to be references, but that is not how Wikipedia references work.  You need to read Help:Referencing for beginners.  It was therefore correct for the other editor to revert your edit.  When you have learned how to format an edit correctly, if you can't reach agreement with the other editor on the article talk page, and if there aren't other editors watching the page and expressing an opinion to form a consensus, then an option is for you to request a third opinion.  --David Biddulph (talk) 19:39, 16 January 2017 (UTC)

I've put the topic John de Ruiter forward on the Administrators'_noticeboard. Richard Gooi (talk) 22:55, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * You presumably mean WP:ANI, rather than WP:AN? If so, the thread is presumably WP:ANI. --David Biddulph (talk) 23:12, 16 January 2017 (UTC)

Draft:Sovereign Order of Saint John of Jerusalem
I reviewed User:Sebastian60/sandbox, moved it to Draft:Sovereign Order of Saint John of Jerusalem, and neither accepted nor declined it. I was frankly puzzled by it because it is such a mess and had trouble understanding what its subject is. I said it had no footnotes, and that it appeared to be written to advance a questionable claim of a micro-state. User:Sebastian60 then wrote:

Micro-state? No, I do not think so! Excuse me Mr. Robert, the Sovereignty of the Order was given in 1113 by Pope Paschal II, the four judgments of the International Courts only recognize the rights of inheritance, not a microstate. If, however, the part of the donation of the island and the communication to the United Nations of its independence could create a questionable situation, for the time you could omit, waiting for final positions. Thanks and best regards. User:Flat Out then reviewed it and declined it, saying: This draft has been pasted for a previous version and as such is a mess. It has no footnotes, the structure doesn't meet WP:MOS, has a list of External Links that are actually other Wikipedia articles. The topic appears to be covered at Knights Hospitaller. I'm happy to discuss at my talk page but since the article was previously deleted I don't see that any improvement has been made.

Do any other editors want to comment? Is there any hope for pulling this into a reasonable article, or should it be taken to miscellany for deletion? Robert McClenon (talk) 06:29, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * By the way, the article on Knights Hospitaller doesn't mention any claim that this organization is the government of Antarctic ice island. Robert McClenon (talk) 06:34, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Draft:Sovereign Order of Saint John of Jerusalem is, as you say, about the same subject as Knights Hospitaller. It therefore has no useful purpose, and should be deleted or moved back to userspace. Maproom (talk) 07:54, 16 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Robert McClenon thanks for raising this here, I agree it should be taken to MFD. Flat Out (talk) 22:37, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * I have requested Miscellany for deletion. If User:Sebastian60 or anyone else thinks that they can pull together a reasonable article, they have seven days.  Robert McClenon (talk) 23:19, 16 January 2017 (UTC)