Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2018 December 5



Big Brother season templates

 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was merge to Template:Infobox Big Brother or some other suitably named template which will be a module for Infobox television season Galobtter (pingó mió) 07:36, 13 December 2018 (UTC) Propose merging Template:Big Brother housemates, Template:Big Brother endgame and Template:Big Brother endgame2&#32; with Template:Infobox television season.
 * Big Brother housemates
 * Big Brother endgame
 * Big Brother endgame2
 * Infobox television season

Proposing that these templates be merged together as a module of Template:Infobox television season because of the recent discussion about Template:Infobox reality show candidates that resulted in its deletion as these templates are very similar to the recently deleted one. The initial discussion about creating a custom model started out at WT:BIGBRO but after a week only two other editors commented on the proposal. The custom modul proposed would have specific feilds relating to Big Brother seasons that are similar to the infoboxes used in other reality articles. The main difference here is the custom module's information would be placed between the starring and country parameters in Template:Infobox television season. With the custom module the fields that would be specifically related to Big Brother wouldn't be part of the main template and wouldn't clutter it up. Examples of how this would look can be found at WT:BIGBRO. If consensus is to merge and create the module it will take some time as Template:Big Brother endgame is used a lot of pages.   Alucard 16  ❯❯❯ chat?    20:01, 5 December 2018 (UTC)


 * I oppose because big brother is one show which says it’s contestants days the have been in the house it’s very much ok and should stay like this. What you are doing is not nice at all so I will ask you to revert this. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.205.198.217 (talk) 21:58, 5 December 2018 (UTC)


 * I also oppose this change. I think the original BB infobox is still useful in that it's a quick way to find out housemates' status on the show, which is what people are more interested to see, I assume. And most Big Brother franchises have a "main" Big Brother Wiki article for which there is an infobox that states the information being proposed here, so why not just revamp the infobox there instead of merging/deleting the housemates and endgame infobox? If we are going to push the changes proposed here, then I think it will be redundant, in that the info shown on the new one, which will be present in all seasons of a franchise, will also be present in the infobox of the "main" Big Brother page for each franchise.


 * I also noticed from the discussion here that the reason this template is being deleted is because contestants' names in infoboxes are discouraged. I want to know why that is. Infoboxes are a way to show certain information. I think there should be no one-size-fits-all infobox as these infoboxes can vary depending on articles. If this proposed merging is all about keeping a clean layout for all Wikipedia pages, I'd say the current housemates and endgame infoboxes do just that across ALL Big Brother articles. Big Brother articles (not just the US and CAN versions, mind you) has a way to present important information in their infoboxes, and I think its better and cleaner that way. Oenix2nd (talk) 01:31, 6 December 2018 (UTC)


 * I'm gonna try to clarify that big discussion here a bit. If you read this discussion about the recent template that was deleted I mentioned that is where the bit about having the housemate's performance being discouraged. With the nominations table all that information is handy inside the articles. Also it would be easy to integrate the "Entered" and "Exited" columns into the Housemates table with a "Results" column that would say "Winner", "Runner-Up", "Evicted", etc. The template that was used for The Apprentice (UK TV series) series articles was almost identical to the Big Brother templates so this discussion was going to happen at some point. Its best that WP:BIGBRO try to resolve this instead of someone else proposing them for outright deletion with no replacement. If the consensus ends up being that we keep these infoboxes or no consensus that is okay as well. We just need to discuss these templates since a very similar template was recently deleted.


 * The custom module that would be created would have Big Brother season specific fields like "Presenters", "No. of days", "No. of Housemates", "Winners", "Runner-ups", "Companion shows" (for that season only) with a custom field that can be defined for each season as editors see fit. With it being a module of Template:Infobox television season we can also list other important information like executive producers, theme song (if known), production company, broadcaster, episode count and dates of airing. There wouldn't be much overlap with the main infoboxes used in the main articles.


 * Where it was just me and another editor discussing the module on the project talk page I can see how the discussion seems to favor the American & Canadian versions over the others but this is not the intention of the module. This module is designed for all Big Brother season articles in mind not just one specific version like the American format. It can be modified as the need arises based on each version. If there is something that Pinoy Big Brother needs we can add it to the module. I hope this clears up some things about the custom module proposal.   Alucard 16  ❯❯❯ chat?    03:02, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
 * If the outcome of this discussion is to replace the Big Brother season templates with the custom module I created some examples on how the information from those templates can be intergrated into the Housemates section in my sandbox. I used Pinoy Big Brother as an example on how they can look. A benefit here is that after a season ends this information won't be hidden anymore and will be visibly displayed in the article. I hope you will take time and review those examples.   Alucard 16  ❯❯❯ chat?    20:28, 6 December 2018 (UTC)


 * I took a look at your sandbox. I admit, this change does make sense. It makes for a cleaner yet detailed layout of the housemates' status, plus its a more flexible way of presenting housemates' status that may not be covered by the current BB infoboxes. I have also tested this myself yesterday, and I would have no problems with this change. I was going to implement the same changes in the previous PBB seasons' pages for uniformity sake.
 * If you're still asking for my vote, I would still oppose to this merge, mainly for personal and "aesthetic" reasons. But if the merge does happen, I wouldn't have any problems with it, and would implement the changes right away. Just make the new infobox usable to all possible Big Brother versions. By that, I urge you to take a look at different Big Brother articles before making this big change. For me, I can only speak to Pinoy Big Brother articles. Oenix2nd (talk) 01:58, 7 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the reply and I respect your reason to oppose the the change. I can assure you I have looked at all Big Brother and Bigg Boss articles and this change wouldn't impact the articles in a negative way in fact this change will help WP:BIGBRO achieve a consistent layout across all season articles. Right now half use the table and half use the older section format as a project we should strive for a consistent layout across all articles. This is beneficial to both readers and editors as a whole. The best example I can give you is to compare the American season articles to the British series and British celebrity series articles. The American adaptation is currently using tables for the Housemates on all season articles including the spin-offs and the Spanish language version. The British version however is using tables for some articles, sections for others while one has them listed in a hard to read prose format (if I remember correctly WP:BIGBRO never discussed using straight prose for this section for any version). This change would actually cause all season articles (like Celebrity Big Brother 22 (UK) for example) to adopt the table format and be consistent with other articles.   Alucard 16  ❯❯❯ chat?    02:52, 7 December 2018 (UTC)

You still don’t understand 2 people are opposing please end it with keeping the templates it really not good this idea. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.205.198.217 (talk) 07:22, 6 December 2018 (UTC)


 * Support merge (it's technically not merging into Infobox television season, but more creating a new nested module to fit inside it). As can be seen at the discussion at WP:BIGBRO and the examples shown here, the proposed infobox merge will fix a few issues:
 * It will enable the Big Brother articles to show the data that every other TV season does - giving our readers (and editors) a more consistent style.
 * By also using Infobox television season and not reinventing the wheel, it will also receive any future template fix/update.
 * Remove duplicated information which was the center of the issue at the Infobox reality show candidates discussion.
 * Also, IP editor, please stop deleting Alucard_16's posts, that could get you banned. --Gonnym (talk) 07:41, 6 December 2018 (UTC)


 * Support merging/creating the nested module. This seems like an eminently sensible proposal. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 14:31, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Support per Gonnym Andy Mabbett ( Pigsonthewing ); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 15:38, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
 * I oppose because the way it is now it template is not a problem and plus this is big brother and Bigg Boss should have the status and not in the table for housemates section. I perfectly think it’s fine where it is. Alucard whatever ur name is this is not a good idea because it shows the days and doesn’t need to have starring or any other thing to it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.205.198.144 (talk) 22:00, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Hey 213.205.198.144, are you also the IP 213.205.198.217 who !voted here earlier? If so, please note you are not allowed to switch IPs and !vote again and should strike this !vote. --Gonnym (talk) 08:42, 7 December 2018 (UTC)
 * No I’m not I don’t know who that is. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.205.198.144 (talk) 09:28, 7 December 2018 (UTC)
 * He shares the same editing patterns as you, never indents his comments, never signs his posts and has a similar IP as you - 213.205.198.*. Also, considering the fact that another IP with a similar address left me comments on my talk page with 3 different IPs - 213.205.198.161, 213.205.198.182 and 89.40.45.122 - all of which were again, never indented or signed, makes me not really believe you. If any admin watches this, please check this IP to see if it is the same user. --Gonnym (talk) 10:28, 7 December 2018 (UTC
 * Firstly it’s not me who is that secondly if I oppose it you can’t change that and thirdly i think that is should change and I explained why. The reason is that I think that it should stay is because the big brother template is fine and has no issues and you are disrupting Wikipedia with ur no good plans and that the last thing is that it is a good thing that the housemates need the status at the top not in a table. comment added by 213.205.198.144 (talk) 10:56, 7 December 2018 (UTC)
 * IP editor(s) as I have mentioned on my talk page and on Gonnym's talk page you really need to come up with a different reasoning for keeping the templates in their current form besides "I don't like it" and "it should stay the way it is". A proposal like this is not disruptive to Wikipedia and I have already explained how it would benefit Wikipedia in this discussion. Also canvassing for !votes is frowned upon as you did here and is considered disruptive. Like I said in my reply to  above I have reviewed all Big Brother and Bigg Boss articles and this change will benefit all season articles not hurt them for the reasons I have stated above. Also if the consensus is in favor of the change then as the nominator I will take responsibility and ensure the change is properly implemented.    Alucard 16  ❯❯❯ chat?    16:50, 7 December 2018 (UTC)
 * The reason why i don’t like it or oppose is because they way it is is okay and is not harming anything the idea you have got is not good at all. For instance Bigg Boss 10 house mates section has decsripiton of what they did and popular for. It’s not nice for it the be in a table. Big brother is a show where there status of how many days and the winner will need to be at the top like it is now. You can change my mind and I beg you please go and edit some other page will you User:Alucard 16. The idea you have got is not good because the template now is perfect and doesn’t have anythong wrong. We should not have starring and all that Because the reason because of this is it looks professional and what you’re trying to do is just trying to copy other reality shows. I have come up with a valid reason right now in this comment — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.205.198.226 (talk) 17:03, 7 December 2018 (UTC)
 * IP editor(s) Bigg Boss is essentially Celebrity Big Brother and if you look at other higher quality Celebrity Big Brother articles like Celebrity Big Brother 1 (U.S.) and Celebrity Big Brother 1 (UK) they already have tables in the main articles and a separate article for the Housemates because the Housemate section made the article too big. In regards to all the Bigg Boss season articles the new table for now will not replace the Housemate section because the articles are not big enough to split that section off into a separate article. Using Bigg Boss (Hindi season 10) I created an example in my sandbox how this would look so you don't have to worry. However the entire article in question needs to be re-written but that is a different discussion for a different day.   Alucard 16  ❯❯❯ chat?    18:54, 7 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Support per above reasoning and discussion I participated in at WT:BIGBRO. The Doctor Who  (talk) 20:33, 7 December 2018 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

Template:Sarah Harding

 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was delete. Galobtter (pingó mió) 04:59, 13 December 2018 (UTC) Not enough links to warrant a navbox. WP:NENAN -- wooden superman  16:02, 27 November 2018 (UTC)  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Sarah Harding

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Primefac (talk) 12:08, 5 December 2018 (UTC)


 * Delete per nom. --Tom (LT) (talk) 00:01, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

Template:Infobox comics genre

 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was Merge. (non-admin closure) &#x222F; WBG converse 12:13, 14 December 2018 (UTC) Propose merging Template:Infobox comics genre with Template:Infobox literary genre.
 * Infobox comics genre
 * Infobox literary genre

One would hope that comics fans would recognise that comics are a literary genre. The 'comics' infobox has some parameters that are not in the more general infobox, but, from a sample, it seems that some are not used, and others are not used well (for example, is Frank Miller really the only only creator of crime comics, and, if not, why is he singled out in the infobox on Crime comics?).

Please discuss, which - if any - parameters should be merged from the 'comics' box into the general one.

The 'comics' infobox has just 17 transclusions. Andy Mabbett ( Pigsonthewing ); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 16:47, 16 November 2018 (UTC)  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus. Relisting comment: Note that there has been a call to delete both rather than merge one into the other.
 * Delete both. Infobox literary genre is used on just 8 pages (including one comics genre, Superhero fiction) and really does not offer anything for those pages beyond reading the lead sentence; other information like "popularity" is arbitrary. And Infobox comics genre is mainly used to list arbitrary comics, publishers, and creators for genres where there are far more comics and creators; any particularly notable comics/creators/publishers need to be explained in prose. Galobtter (pingó mió) 07:32, 24 November 2018 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Primefac (talk) 00:14, 26 November 2018 (UTC)  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus. Relisting comment: Echoing PFac's note. If there is no opposition in a week, I will delete both.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, &#x222F; WBG converse 11:54, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Merge. Agree. Having 'publishers' listed for some of these overarching genres is a bit unusual as they can't possibly be completely representative. --Tom (LT) (talk) 00:05, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
 * I object to deletion. We should merge these, and then use the talk page of the result to develop something that is fit for use on articles about all forms of literary genres. Andy Mabbett ( Pigsonthewing ); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 10:58, 7 December 2018 (UTC)
 * I prefer deletion but am fine with merging. Galobtter (pingó mió) 05:01, 13 December 2018 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

Template:WNBA Playoffs Revised summary

 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was merge to Template:WNBA Playoffs summary. Galobtter (pingó mió) 05:02, 13 December 2018 (UTC) Propose merging Template:WNBA Playoffs Revised summary with Template:WNBA Playoffs summary.
 * WNBA Playoffs Revised summary
 * WNBA Playoffs summary

Essentially the same template  Zack mann  (Talk to me/What I been doing) 05:58, 27 November 2018 (UTC)  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, &#x222F; WBG converse 11:45, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Support per nom. --Tom (LT) (talk) 00:06, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
 * support per nom Hhkohh (talk) 05:47, 9 December 2018 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

Template:Zarif

 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was delete. (non-admin closure) &#x222F; <b style="color:#070">WBG</b> converse 12:27, 5 December 2018 (UTC) Not enough links to provide useful navigation. WP:NENAN -- wooden superman  13:24, 27 November 2018 (UTC) <div class="xfd_relist" style="border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 25px;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Zarif
 * delete, articles are already well-connected through the succession and album links in the infobox. Frietjes (talk) 14:45, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete per nomination not useful. -- Zack mann  (Talk to me/What I been doing) 22:39, 1 December 2018 (UTC)
 * delete per above Hhkohh (talk) 05:57, 2 December 2018 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, &#x222F; <b style="color:#070">WBG</b> converse 11:31, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

Template:Kimberly Wyatt
<div class="boilerplate tfd vfd tfd-closed" style="background-color: #e3f9df; padding: 0 10px 0 10px; border: 1px solid #AAAAAA;">
 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was delete. Galobtter (pingó mió) 18:23, 14 December 2018 (UTC) No songs of her own, so seems a little pointless. -- wooden superman  12:58, 27 November 2018 (UTC) <div class="xfd_relist" style="border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 25px;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Kimberly Wyatt
 * comment, it is currently used on Kimberly Wyatt, The Pussycat Dolls, Candy (Aggro Santos song), Her Majesty & the Wolves, and 111 (Her Majesty & the Wolves album), which makes 5 articles. but, I do see the point that there isn't enough primary content there. Frietjes (talk) 14:49, 27 November 2018 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, &#x222F; <b style="color:#070">WBG</b> converse 11:31, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Support as too small to need a navbox that provides any useful navigational value; articles can use wikilinks. --Tom (LT) (talk) 00:06, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).