Wikipedia:Village pump (technical)/Archive 169

Image sizes, upright
Any idea why these images seem to ignore the upright= parameter? (I'm on Chrome, Windows 10.) EEng 19:47, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * What exactly is wrong with these images? Ruslik_ Zero 19:51, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Oh, wait, I just figured it out. The thumb parameter is missing. Never mind. EEng 19:56, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , fixed, see WP:EIS - "The "upright" option must be used along with the "thumb" or "frameless" parameter." Galobtter (pingó mió) 19:59, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks. It's funny how history bestows on us so much backwards syntax. Quite obviously, if we had to do it again, thumb would be the default and you'd have to say something like fullsize to get what you never want i.e. the full size image at whatever size it was uploaded at. EEng 20:03, 29 August 2018 (UTC)

Display issues with Template:Graphic novel list
This template hasn't been displaying as it usually does when I checked it today. These are the issues I've noticed I've noticed:


 * The default box width compacts to the text instead of automatically maxing out.
 * Chapter columns are split based on the length of the text, rather than down the middle of the box.
 * When bullet lists are used in columns, the text of the left column overlaps slightly with the right column's bullets, which are colored black.

I'm uncertain if this is an issue with the template itself or if it's exclusive to me, but no other templates have any sort of problem as far as I'm concerned. User:SubZeroSilver (talk) 01:07, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * with a revert to Template:Graphic novel list/header. – Jonesey95 (talk) 04:38, 22 August 2018 (UTC)

PJS v News Group Newspapers
For some reason, PJS v News Group Newspapers has acquired an image of the The Middlesex Guildhall in the infobox and I can't work out why. What is causing this? Thanks.-- ♦Ian Ma c M♦  (talk to me) 05:09, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * The image comes from Infobox court case/images and it's displayed based on what court is specified in  parameter. You can override that by filling the   parameter, if there's need. –Ammarpad (talk) 06:01, 22 August 2018 (UTC)

Kaspersky just deleted AutoWikiBrowser!
I was just using AutoWikiBrowser when it suddenly vanished!

Kaspersky (my antivirus) then popped up a window to say it was "Application performing dangerous activity characteristic of malware" and advised a reboot and complete disinfecting of my computer. It said "Detected: PDM:Trojan.Win32.Generic".

Kaspersky has now deleted the AWB program completely, including all shortcuts, etc. Any ideas please? — Hebrides (talk) 14:21, 19 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Run McAfee Stinger to double check. You may have gotten a trojan through some other means that managed to work its way into AWB.  Kaspersky might be dealing with symptoms instead of the root cause.  In fact, I'd even go so far as to:
 * Download Stinger on a different device (one with an optical drive)
 * Rename the file
 * Burn it to a CD or DVD (don't put it on a thumb drive)
 * Copy it to your computer and run it
 * Ian.thomson (talk) 14:27, 19 August 2018 (UTC)
 * A bunch of other good second opinion scanners include HitmanPro, Malwarebytes, Emsisoft Emergency Kit, Noorton Power Eraser (this has more false positives), Trend Micro House Call and Microsoft's Malware Removal tool. They're all good one shots I run every few months, and they don't interfere with regular antivirus or each other. — Alpha3031 (t • c) 14:38, 19 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Yep, I use some of those for stuff short of trojans (or to confirm that I have a trojan). With my browsing habits, if I have a trojan, I need a panic button and Stinger has fit that role pretty well. Ian.thomson (talk) 14:50, 19 August 2018 (UTC)
 * If you can't recover it from whatever quarantine your AV has, you'll probably have to reinstall it. Just add it as an exclusion when you do (or get an AV that doesn't decide to randomly delete your files). You can also keep regular system restore snapshots and backup your files, so if your AV suddenly decides some other file is infected, you can recover it. — Alpha3031 (t • c) 14:32, 19 August 2018 (UTC)

Very grateful to you both for your advice. I've scanned my system with several of these, and also done a complete virus scan (overnight) and nothing reported. I'll try reinstalling AWB. — Hebrides (talk) 06:48, 20 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I've got a similar problem in that AWB hangs on 'Processing page'. I suspect that it's the anti-virus(Carbon Black), but because it's a corporate externally managed thing I have no way of quickly disabling it to check. - X201 (talk) 08:04, 22 August 2018 (UTC)

Article recreated today but with no deletion history
See User talk:Doug Weller and. User:GiantSnowman and I figure this must be a glitch. Doug Weller talk 15:47, 20 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm guessing you first deleted the draft, moved the mainspace page, then restored the history? &mdash; MusikAnimal  talk  21:04, 20 August 2018 (UTC)


 * That would be User:GiantSnowman who handled it. Doug Weller  talk 16:37, 21 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Have I made a boo-boo? GiantSnowman 17:45, 21 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Nope, not a boo-boo! I was just saying that sequence of events would explain why nothing is in the deletion log for Vrishaketu -- because that page wasn't deleted, the draft was. &mdash; MusikAnimal  talk  23:51, 21 August 2018 (UTC)
 * But surely there should be a log about the page move? GiantSnowman 07:38, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * There is: [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Log&page=Vrishaketu]. If you mean a deletion log saying the page was moved without leaving a redirect then no, that doesn't cause an entry in the deletion log. You may have seen red links like Guru Aur Bhole and assumed it shows a deletion log but it shows a move log. PrimeHunter (talk) 08:29, 22 August 2018 (UTC)

Enable/Disable preview functionality is not keyboard accessible
The issue stated below will impact those user groups who interact with wikipedia pages using only keyboard. Description: On hovering on certain links, a popup opens. However the Settings button present within the popup cannot be accessed using only keyboard. Thus the enable or disable functionality of the previews ( on clicking the Settings button Enable/Disable preview popup opens) is un available for the keyboard only users. Also there is no other option for keyboard user to disable the preview.

This is also a violation against WCAG 2.0 (Success Criteria - 2.1.1).

Link: Any links (e.g. ttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harry_Potter_(film_series)) Using Chrome 67.0 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rose685 (talk • contribs) 11:14, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * It's a known issue that is being worked on. If you are a registered user, you can disable from your preferences. —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 11:19, 22 August 2018 (UTC)

Unreviewed articles don't appear on Google search ?
Hi, I have a question regarding Google visibility of Wikipedia articles. I'm used to a very fast visibility on Google when creating articles, a matter of hours, at least when I create new articles on the French language Wikipedia. However, I wrote an article on :en (Terrorist attack against cyclists in Tajikistan) that I published on the 20th. Still not accessible from Google. My guess is that Google doesn't take in account unreviewed pages, am I right ?--Kimdime (talk) 12:40, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * That is correct. Unreviewed pages have , so are not indexed by search engines. --Vexations (talk) 13:15, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks, I can see that there is quite a long list of unreviewed articles some that have staid in the limbo for a surprisingly long time. In my case it seems to me that the article I wrote escaped scrutiny because I created it on my personal space and then renamed it in main space hence it didn't appear at the top of the recent articles list. This seems like a flaw to me.--Kimdime (talk) 13:26, 22 August 2018 (UTC)


 * For more details on this function see Controlling_search_engine_indexing. — xaosflux  Talk 13:28, 22 August 2018 (UTC)

Could someone write me/modify me a small .js script?
Currently User:Headbomb/citations.js is the following It adds a little "Expand citations" option in my toolbar, which is quite useful. What I'd want here is that, when I'm on a Category page, instead of invoking invoke instead. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 16:07, 20 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I think this is what you want? From what I can tell, the Citation Bot url is different for Categories, so instead of   you wanted  :
 * Moreover, I would guess you actually only want this in mainspace and category space, is that right? If so, you can change the bottom   bit to
 * ~ Amory  (u • t • c) 19:00, 20 August 2018 (UTC)
 * ~ Amory  (u • t • c) 19:00, 20 August 2018 (UTC)
 * ~ Amory  (u • t • c) 19:00, 20 August 2018 (UTC)


 * I want the category link to be used on Category:<Foobar> pages, otherwise the regular link. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 19:53, 20 August 2018 (UTC)


 * (e/c)I guess something like this should work:
 * —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 19:01, 20 August 2018 (UTC)


 * I'll give both a try and see where that gets me. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 19:53, 20 August 2018 (UTC)

Neither version work. Both try to run


 * https://tools.wmflabs.org/citations/doibot.php?edit=toolbar&slow=1&user=<USER>&page=<CATEGORY>

in Category space. (Also note that Category: must be stripped from the category). Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 20:01, 20 August 2018 (UTC)
 * It works for me? Try removing   or just changing   to only  .  The   throws an error for me, but this should work fine. ~  Amory <small style="color:#555"> (u • t • c) 20:19, 20 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Wow, yikes, you are right, that's a bad boo boo. Can't believe this ever worked for you at all ? Both examples now corrected. —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 14:13, 21 August 2018 (UTC)

Thanks for the fix, and for taking the time to write and troubleshoot this! I have a bit of a mea culpa to do here, I was mistakenly looking at the link given by WP:Citation expander, so even if things worked, I wouldn't have noticed it. This deserves a newly created multitrout!

Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 14:44, 21 August 2018 (UTC)
 * At least I learned the collective noun term for trout! DMacks (talk) 15:20, 21 August 2018 (UTC)


 * do you know of any way to automatically alphabetize the links in the toolbox? Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 16:23, 21 August 2018 (UTC)
 * This should work, but will vary slightly based on your skin. I think you use monobook?  For Monobook and Modern (the best skin), this works for me:
 * For Vector, you need to use  instead of  .  SO is also cc-by-sa, so if you do use that somewhere make sure to include the attribution. ~  Amory <small style="color:#555"> (u • t • c) 18:45, 21 August 2018 (UTC)
 * For Vector, you need to use  instead of  .  SO is also cc-by-sa, so if you do use that somewhere make sure to include the attribution. ~  Amory <small style="color:#555"> (u • t • c) 18:45, 21 August 2018 (UTC)


 * Something very weird is happening. The order isn't deterministic. Reloading my userpage/bypassing the cache several times gave this: vs  vs . Feel free to poke around in User:Headbomb/monobook.js and subpages. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 01:22, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * You can try replacing  with   but while I think that should help somewhat, it still likely won't work 100% of the time. ~  Amory <small style="color:#555"> (u • t • c) 14:25, 22 August 2018 (UTC)

Password not working but known to be correct
A reader wrote to Wikimedia ticket:2018082010004401 asserting that they know their password is correct but it is not working. Any thoughts? Has this ever happened?

They do not have an email address associated with their account, so they cannot use the option to change it.-- S Philbrick (Talk)  14:01, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , maybe the password was guessable/easy/leaked and the account was stolen by a hacker? Anyway, without registered email address, no real option to recover the account. Advice is to create a new account (and register your email address). —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 14:14, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Additionally, if the account is still active it can be locked if they think it is compromised. — xaosflux  Talk 14:23, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * OK, but maybe I'm missing something. If a hacker managed to guess or find the password, they wouldn't be able to change it given that there is no email attached, I believe.


 * I've pointed the person asking the question to this discussion. I thought there was a slight chance there was some known issuer glitch with passwords not working but absent that, I agree that a new account is in order.-- S Philbrick (Talk)  14:34, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * noone is required to have an email address registered here. If I know your WMF password I can log in as you and change it to whatever I want. —  xaosflux  Talk 15:41, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Whoops, of course. I was thinking about the rather common situation when someone says they forgotten their password but they are logged in. If they try to change the password while logged in they can be successful but only if they know the password. I confused it with this situation.-- S Philbrick (Talk)  15:58, 22 August 2018 (UTC)

Adding a keyboard shortcut in JS
I wish to add a new keyboard shortcut in my user script. How can I accomplish this? (I checked the docs, but I can't seem to find anything on this.) Enterprisey (talk!) 01:18, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * are you trying  functions? —  xaosflux  Talk 01:31, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Which script? Do you already have some key listening occurring? —  xaosflux  Talk 01:33, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , I was just wondering if there's an official API function for doing this. I haven't tried onkeydown yet but suspect that would work just fine. I really would like a cross-browser way to do it, though. Enterprisey (talk!) 01:49, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Can you explain a bit what you want to happen? — xaosflux  Talk 02:57, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I wish to have a function that I can pass "s" to and it'll get called when the user presses the appropriate access key combo - for example, on Firefox on Linux, Alt+Shift+S. Enterprisey (talk!) 04:00, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , you set the accesskey attribute with value 's' on the (focusable) element, and then you can update the tooltip with the corresponding browser specific metakey information using jquery.accessKeyLabel. Like here. —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 05:10, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you both! Enterprisey (talk!) 05:23, 23 August 2018 (UTC)

Notification for unclear reason
I just received the notification shown here. I don’t believe I’ve ever even looked at the page in question before, it isn’t on my watchlist, I’m not at all active on Wikidata, basically I have no clue why I was notified of this. Beeblebrox (talk) 00:20, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Oh really? Anyway, head to the notifications tab of your preferences, and look for "connection to wikidata." ~  Amory <small style="color:#555"> (u • t • c) 00:43, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Ok, I admit I only looked at the last five years or so of the history. So, it notifies everyone whose ever edited a certain page? That seems kind of dumb, like I don’t feel like I should have to opt out of being notified about a change on another website related to a page I edited one time ten years ago. Beeblebrox (talk) 01:07, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * You moved the page in 2008. So you have the first edit, and it recognizes you as the page creator. AFAIK, it only notifies creators...or "creators". If you're not active on WD, it lets you check to make sure someone didn't vandalize a link to your created page to something completely unrelated. It's a little annoying as it sorts through the backlog, but it will make sense once it catches up.  G M G  <sup style="color:#000;font-family:Impact">talk  01:13, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Well ok, thanks for the explanations all. Beeblebrox (talk) 09:09, 23 August 2018 (UTC)

Formatting on talk page editnotice quotebox stopped working
Any idea as to why the quotebox formatting on the editnotice to my user talk page stopped working? It's supposed to, and used to, look like this, but instead looks like this. (Although it looks like it's supposed to when I go to edit the editnotice: ). Beyond My Ken (talk) 14:54, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * quotebox now uses template styles, which applies styling to only inside the  class, which doesn't include edit notices..I think this can be fixed with editing Editnotice load, probably better to get it done in MediaWiki though Galobtter (pingó mió) 15:12, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Indeed, for now you can add a div with the class in question to your edit notice. I think this non-implementation in edit notices was deliberate, but maybe knows better. --Izno (talk) 16:33, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * It was not really intentional, it follows from the way i18n messages from the MediaWiki namespace get used in the interface. Anomie⚔ 11:26, 23 August 2018 (UTC)

User:Equazcion/sysopdetector.js
hasn't been around for a while, so I'm asking here. I don't know how popular this script is so I may be the only one who cares, but I find it very useful. I noticed, however, that the rights that display are not the same as what's listed on user rights. It looks like this was the name prior to 2010 and it hasn't caught up. Can we make these match?

For example, we have "User:TNTPublic [autoreviewer, autoconfirmed] [96 edits]", yet the user rights log says "10:56, 21 August 2018 TonyBallioni (talk | contribs) changed group membership for TNTPublic from (none) to autopatrolled (Since someone was complaining)"

And is it really necessary to display "autoconfirmed" for everyone? It looks a little silly to see "[sysop, autoconfirmed]" all the time. If this isn't a popular script, I'll just deal with these things, but if others use it, it seems worth changing. Natureium (talk) 15:43, 21 August 2018 (UTC) PAGE ]]) 19:12, 21 August 2018 (UTC)
 * What you want is User:PleaseStand/userinfo.js. It's an updated version of the Equazcion script, and doesn't show autoconfirmed.  It does show the rights in a different area and includes extended confirmed, if those are issues.  It also shows the gender of the editor, if selected.  I have a modified version of that at User:Amorymeltzer/userinfo.js which also works on subpages, contributions, and logs, if that's of interest.
 * Regarding the name thing, there are plenty of quirks — edit filter instead of abuse filter, admin instead of sysop. , like   and   are the actual names, but we (well, most of us most of the time) call those users autopatrolled, admin, and edit filter (manager).  Using either the version from PS or me will display "autopatrolled user," which I think is what you're after. ~  Amory <small style="color:#555"> (u • t • c) 17:52, 21 August 2018 (UTC)
 * User:Anomie/useridentifier.js works well too, but uses icons instead of just text. --Ahecht ([[User talk:Ahecht|<span style="color:#FFF;background:#04A;display:inline-block;padding:1px;vertical-align:-.3em;font:bold 50%/1 sans-serif;text-align:center">TALK
 * If people want, we could redirect Equizcion's script to the PleaseStand version (being the closest to the original behaviour). Might save people some time. —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 07:44, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * With <25 people using this I'd rather see it forked then redirected; those 25 people can easily update their settings. — xaosflux  Talk 13:30, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * In essence that's already been done by PleaseStand. Equazcion's still works just fine, right?  These are different enough in display and method (and both listed on the scripts list) that I don't think one should be redirected to the other. ~  Amory <small style="color:#555"> (u • t • c) 14:27, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I would prefer to keep it. I like the way it is displayed better. Natureium (talk) 19:32, 23 August 2018 (UTC)

What is the real history of this photo?
I'm trying to verify that this photo really is Lynda Resnick in 2017, as it says in the caption. It comes from the Flickr account of Mike Gutierrez, who works for Resnick's communications staff as can be seen here.
 * File:Lynda Resnick.jpg

The thing I don't understand is that the image file history says it was created 7 May 2017, or at least that's the oldest version in the file history that I can see. Yet this image file was already in use in 2016, as can be seen here: And the image metadata says the file was created 7 July 2014.

So what image was in use in 2016, and where is the real history for this file? Kendall-K1 (talk) 02:13, 24 August 2018 (UTC)


 * So apparently there was an older file with the same name on Commons that got deleted; and that must have been the version in use in 2016? Kendall-K1 (talk) 02:19, 24 August 2018 (UTC)


 * see File talk:Lynda Resnick.jpg for the deleted history timestamps and summaries, does that help you? — xaosflux  Talk 03:36, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, very much, especially the link to the deletion discussion. Thanks! Kendall-K1 (talk) 03:50, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

Rendering issue with timeline chart (The Roots)
There seems to be something wrong with the band members timeline on "The Roots". From the top of each of the vertical "studio albums" lines, there is another diagonal line which extends off the left side of the graph, obscuring much of the rest of the graph. I don't see anything obviously wrong with the source code of it, but I've never really messed with band timelines much so I wouldn't know what to look for. Could someone more familiar with these charts please take a look? Thanks, Iago Qnsi  (User talk:IagoQnsi) 05:34, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I've seen that before with a bunch of other band articles. I suspect the fix is pretty simple, but I don't recall what exactly it is. Enterprisey (talk!) 05:49, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * It looks like a bad image was cached. I don't know how to purge it but any change like one pixel will generate a new correct image. PrimeHunter (talk) 08:05, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, I've seen this before. I just tried removing a period from one of the band member's names (which wasn't needed anyway) - and it fixed it. Black Kite (talk) 10:14, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * It's the same issue as Village pump (technical)/Archive 167. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 10:49, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

SVG rendering of text labels
I converted another user's PDF image to SVG and uploaded it as File:Regional map of SE Asia with Borneo Highlighted.svg. If you take a look down at the file history, you will see that in my first upload, all of the text labels show up as anchored over to the left side of the image. But if you look at the SVG itself in Firefox or Inkscape, it is rendered correctly. I fixed the problem by converting the text labels to generic paths instead of text labels, but obviously that's not the most desirable choice. Does MediaWiki have any sort of problem rendering text on SVGs at the proper coordinates? --B (talk) 12:09, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes; see phab:T35245. I think is is probably because you created the file using Inkscape and it inserted MediaWiki-unrecognized positioning attributes somewhere. Jc86035 (talk) 12:40, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Duly noted, thanks. --B (talk) 12:49, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Either that, or the fact that a number of <tspan ></tspan> elements have an  attribute which is not a simple value - for example the one for India has   - five values, separated by spaces. Whilst this is valid according to [//www.w3.org/TR/SVG11/text.html#TSpanElementXAttribute the SVG spec], I have had problems with certain kinds of space-separated lists before (such as the   attribute used in File:First angle projection symbol.svg) - try using commas instead, as in  . -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 14:43, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

Broken interwiki links
Hi Guys,

There are many broken links between sister projects. For example, I ran a query to find pages linked from English Wikipedia to Wikisource but don't exist in Wikisource. I got some thousands links, made a list here.


 * 1) Why broken links inside Wikipedia are red but links to sister projects are blue? Is there a chance to change it?
 * 2) Can you help me create similar queries to other sister projects and languages?
 * 3) Can you help me improve the current query (I just ignored anything with : because namespace included in links here and aren't part of the title there.
 * 4) Can you help me fix those links? Some have something in common and might be fixed easily.

Thanks a lot. Uziel302 (talk) 08:15, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * To q. 1: it's always been that way. There are almost certainly change requests at on this matter that have either been rejected or ignored. I think that the main reason for omission of such a feature concerns efficiency: it is easy to test if a page exists on the same Wikimedia project, but not so easy to test if a page exists on a different Wikimedia project. Remember that when a page gets created or deleted, all the links to that page need to have their colours amended. There are several hundred project/language combinations within the Wikimedia umbrella, it's easiest to just concentrate on links within a project. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 10:02, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * It is actually the 11th bug ever filed. --Izno (talk) 11:54, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Because interwiki links are basically the same as external links. The various sister wiki's have no real knowledge of each others state (other than in places where we made significant hacks, like centralauth, commons and wikidata), so they cannot inform each other of link existence. This is something that is on the radar, but is hard to solve because of huge potential performance implications, which are likely hard to solve. Likely this particular feature is not important enough to drive that change (too little return on investment, to go through the trouble). —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 12:06, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I understand coloring all interlinks is hard, but having some sort of bot marking broken links from time to time doesn't sound so hard. Me leaving the list on my page won't fix all links but adding some note beside the link telling it is broken might make random editors fix what they see broken.Uziel302 (talk) 13:57, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Wasn't there a request along those lines at WP:BOTREQ a few weeks back? -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 14:45, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

Scripts not working
I've got a multitude of my own scripts at User:AlexTheWhovian/Scripts, and suddenly, none of them are working. I'm receiving a console error stating, which (for example, this is using User:AlexTheWhovian/script-redlinks.js), I assume is in regards to the lines $.when( mw.loader.using( ['mediawiki.util']), $.ready ).then(function { var portletlink = mw.util.addPortletLink('p-tb', '#', 'Remove redlinks'); Has   become deprecated recently? Cheers. --  Alex TW 03:44, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * it sounds like a load order issue, see here for how to pre-load in userscripts. — xaosflux  Talk 04:00, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Cheers, but no such luck. I updated one of my scripts to use the code given in the link you gave, but it still does not appear. --  Alex TW 07:06, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * They all work fine for me. ~ Amory <small style="color:#555"> (u • t • c) 11:16, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Strange. I logged in on Chrome instead (as I primarily use Firefox), and now that gives me an error of . Has to be something with   on my end, then. --  Alex TW 14:37, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

Worked it out. I was using a  directly in my common.js file. Removed it, common.js continues to load and my scripts appear. All's well here. --  Alex TW 15:10, 24 August 2018 (UTC) PAGE ]]) 15:56, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Have you tried wrapping your common.js in  as described at ResourceLoader/Developing_with_ResourceLoader? --Ahecht ([[User talk:Ahecht|<span style="color:#FFF;background:#04A;display:inline-block;padding:1px;vertical-align:-.3em;font:bold 50%/1 sans-serif;text-align:center">TALK

Server switch coming up
Quick note while I'm here anyway to say that m:Tech/Server switch 2018 has been scheduled for Wednesday, 12 September and Wednesday, 10 October 2018, both rounds starting at 14:00 UTC. Official announcements will be forthcoming, but please mark your calendars, and tell your friends not to schedule anything time-sensitive (like major bot work or an editing workshop) at that moment. Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 17:26, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

Search and replace icon in the toolbar
If I click "Advanced", on either Firefox of Chrome, normally, I see a little icon for the search and replace on the right-hand side of the toolbar. As of this afternoon, that icon is not there on either browser. Of course, the feature still works. I click in the blank area where that icon normally is, and the Search and Replace feature pops up for me to fill out. Chances are, this might fix itself by tomorrow. But I've deleted cookies and deleted cache. I've closed and re-opened both browsers separately. I can only think it must be one of those funky things that will eventually clear. — Maile (talk) 23:59, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Hmm, same for me... Galobtter (pingó mió) 11:19, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * It affects everyone using the 2010 wikitext editor. I've filed a bug report.  Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 17:14, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for finding this. I've hot-deployed a fix despite it being a Friday. Should now be working for you (and everyone else). Thanks for the task, will comment on there. :-) Jdforrester (WMF) (talk) 17:47, 24 August 2018 (UTC)


 * Working for me now. — Maile (talk) 18:54, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

FYI: Automatic mapframe maps in Infobox building
now automatically displays dynamic maps by default, if available. If you are interested in any articles using this infobox, please review how the map displays in those articles: you can adjust the size, frame center point, initial zoom level, and marker icon using various optional parameters; the mapframe map may also be turned off using no.

See Template talk:Infobox building for further information and discussions. - Evad37 &#91;talk] 05:13, 18 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: now similarly displays automatic mapframe maps. - Evad37 &#91;talk] 05:22, 25 August 2018 (UTC)

AT&T DNS Error Assist
Does anyone know of a way to disable AT&T DNS Error Assist on a Windows 10 box? I know about the opt-out, but I am hoping for a solution that works on multiple browsers and doesn't require me to trust the same AT&T that hijacked my browser session. --Guy Macon (talk) 14:58, 25 August 2018 (UTC)
 * unless they actively block it, you could change your computer to use another DNS provider such as: Google Public DNS or OpenDNS (see IP values on those pages). — xaosflux  Talk 15:13, 25 August 2018 (UTC)

File Upload Wizard bug report
I think I spotted a bug in the File Upload Wizard form. In Step 3, when I do the following:


 * 1) Click radio button 2 "This is a copyrighted, non-free work, but I believe it is Fair Use" radio button
 * 2) Click radio button 3 "This is an excerpt from a copyrighted work."
 * 3) Select an item from the select menu "Which of these options describes this item best?"
 * 4) Then change my mind and click radio button 7 "This is some other kind of non-free work"....

... the textarea id="NFPurpose" disappears from the uploadDetails panel id="detailsNFMisc". The result is that all required fields cannot be completed and the Submit button remains disabled. The only fix is to reload the page and start all over again.

I think there's a javascript bug which removes the textarea.

(Note: this is the third attempt at reporting this bug. I've already posted this on the talk page of the Upload Wizard and there has been no response. I also tried posting it on Phabicator, as instructed at the top of this page, and was told that this was wrong. So if anybody out there is reading this and can fix it, please do. Thanks.) Cnbrb (talk) 14:39, 25 August 2018 (UTC)


 * OK, so this does look to be a local .js issue, so it will need to be handled here on-wiki. The main javascript for that page is at MediaWiki:FileUploadWizard.js. , I see you've done a lot of work on that script, can you take a look please? —  xaosflux  Talk 15:24, 25 August 2018 (UTC)

How to align horizontally two adjacent tables?
Hi. I looked for information and failed in aligning horizontally two adjacent tables in my user page, under "Warnings". How is it done? Thinker78 (talk) 05:21, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I see you are using the type of method described in Help:Table. Try using that exactly, and then gradually adjusting to match what you want (to see what syntax/style difference breaks it). DMacks (talk) 05:33, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I just tried that, and it appears to be the  in the   of the cell in first row of each. I tried using   (you have this in the third row of each) and promoting it to the style of the whole table...same results. Does it make sense to set one cell width 200 and a different cell width 130 in the same column? I tried just removing all attempts at width 200 and it seemed to work. But interestingly I tried changing that 130 (which I left as it was) to other values, and it broke again as before. I don't see anything weird in the HTML source, but I don't know the details of   or wikipedia's local CSS. DMacks (talk) 05:48, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for trying to help but I don't think it worked. Thinker78 (talk) 05:54, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Try the 'tables in a table' trick, with the cells of the larger table vertically aligned. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 05:56, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I fixed it by copying what I did on my own userpage to align tables which was to make them both align left. I see Headbomb has given another solution which also works well.. Galobtter (pingó mió) 05:58, 26 August 2018 (UTC)


 * There's certainly many ways to achieve this. Personally I find tables more easily understandable than messing around with divs and spans and CSS. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 06:05, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Yeah that probably is the better/more clear way to do it. Galobtter (pingó mió) 06:45, 26 August 2018 (UTC)

Bad link on the red link page
When I search for e.g. "Frenchman's Bend" using the search page, I get https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?search=Frenchman%27s+Bend&title=Special%3ASearch&fulltext=Search. Search functions normally here, I get a lot of results with "Frenchman's" and "Bend" in them. But if I go to Frenchman's Bend (the red link page) and click on "Search for "Frenchman's Bend" in existing articles.", I end up on https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?search=Frenchman%26%2339%3Bs+Bend&title=Special%3ASearch&fulltext=1, where the first word has been transformed into "Frenchman& #39;s" (without the space) and the results are much less relevant. 78.0.224.194 (talk) 02:55, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Note to anyone looking in to this, that text is from Template:No article text, and it is currently feeding in an encoded string. — xaosflux  Talk 03:20, 26 August 2018 (UTC)


 * The problem is from encoding of  in mw:Manual:PAGENAMEE encoding.
 * Some allowed characters returned by  are HTML-style encoded:


 * (double quote ) is converted to   (34 is the decimal value of hexadecimal 22); in standard HTML/XML style it could also be converted to.
 * (ampersand ) is converted to   (38 is the decimal value of hexadecimal 26); in standard HTML/XML style it could also be converted to
 * (single quote ) is converted to   (39 is the decimal value of hexadecimal 27); in standard HTML/XML style it could also be converted to
 * The current code in Template:No article text gives this search link for IP's at Frenchman's Bend:
 * There is string code by Dinoguy1000 to remove soft hyphens but removing this code makes no difference here:
 * Using PAGENAMEE with double EE will encode for url's but it replaces spaces by underscores with a poor result here:
 * It works to then replace the underscore by %20:
 * If we still want to remove any soft hyphens like before then they are now converted to %C2%AD by PAGENAMEE. Example with a soft hyphen inserted between "French" and "man":
 * Using a string replacement to remove the encoded soft hyphen:
 * It works here but the code is getting complicated and I wonder whether there are bad side effects for other cases. PrimeHunter (talk) 09:52, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * The soft hyphen-related code was meant to be temporary, until T66528 and related tasks are resolved; unfortunately, it seems there were issues with the patch(es) that have to be resolved first. In the meantime, if someone wants to try to simplify the code in No article text, either by working with what's there now, or starting from scratch, that would be great; unfortunately, the best ideas for simplification I could offer are to split a /core subtemplate off and convert the current one to a preprocessor, or to convert the whole template to a Lua module (I can do the former, but the latter is beyond me).
 * The solution for this issue is to use ; I'll make this change after saving this comment. 「 ディノ 奴  千？！ 」? · ☎ Dinoguy1000 15:44, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Aah, no, I'm an idiot; the code already uses . The problem is that   encodes the apostrophe as   (as PrimeHunter noted already). I think the workaround here is, though that's pretty hacky tbh. 「 ディノ 奴  千？！ 」? · ☎ Dinoguy1000 15:59, 26 August 2018 (UTC)

Block misattributed to me
When you view the current block here it looks as though I blocked indefinitely for using multiple accounts. If you view the block log it shows that User:Gogo Dodo did that block and I did an earlier 72 hour block. Doug Weller talk 19:00, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Known bug, been around for a while. The particularly damming bit IMO is that is takes the date and sysop of the original block and mixes in the log reason from the latest block, so it's always incorrect. ~  Amory <small style="color:#555"> (u • t • c) 20:10, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * As I see it, blocked that user for 72 hours, but before that had expired (in fact after just 11 minutes),  extended the block to indef. So Gogo Dodo didn't actually block the user, since they were already blocked; hence the blocking admin is correctly shown as Doug Weller. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 22:28, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, but Doug Weller didn't block them indefinitely, nor for abusing multiple accounts. So Special/BlockList shows the correct current block length and reason, but not the admin who actually set that length or reason. Black Kite (talk) 22:40, 23 August 2018 (UTC)


 * Thanks everyone. Weird. Doug Weller  talk 16:44, 26 August 2018 (UTC)

Lint error in Portal:Wales/Selected picture/Layout
Portal:Wales/Selected picture/Layout is generating lint errors. See Portal talk:Wales/Selected picture/Layout and please discuss it there, not here. —Anomalocaris (talk) 09:45, 22 August 2018 (UTC)


 * Fixed by PrimeHunter just before 10:21, 22 August 2018 (UTC) —Anomalocaris (talk) 01:22, 27 August 2018 (UTC)

Lint error in Infobox language
is causing Lint errors: Miscellaneous Tidy replacement issues: div-span-flip, affecting over 8,000 pages. Please discuss at Template talk:Infobox language. —Anomalocaris (talk) 07:46, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Fixed by Galobtter before 08:26, 23 August 2018 ... but then the issue was expanded to similar templates ... —Anomalocaris (talk) 01:26, 27 August 2018 (UTC)

Similar problem in Template:Science
I don't want to fork this discussion section, but I was just looking at a similar problem in science yesterday. It uses, which puts a div tag (created by hlist) inside of a span tag (created by larger/resize). I am putting this note here because it is a more general technical issue rather than a problem with Infobox language. – Jonesey95 (talk) 09:06, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I have implemented an attempted fix by putting larger inside of hlist. As with the Infobox language fix, I wonder if hlist should use span tags instead of div tags. – Jonesey95 (talk) 09:34, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I don't think hlist should since the div wraps a larger chunk of markup and should be a block level element, but maybe Longitem since it deals with a short piece of text.. Galobtter (pingó mió) 09:52, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * A list is a block item when marked up as a list in HTML, so that's a no-go. My advice when I meet uses like this is simply to remove the size-changing template as they deviate from standard sizing, often without any reason whatsoever. --Izno (talk) 12:04, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Here are a few templates that appear to have similar problems (taken from this list):


 * Template:Ahmadinejad cabinet
 * Template:Culture of Iran
 * Template:History of Hamburg
 * Template:History of the People's Republic of China
 * Template:History of the Soviet Union
 * Template:LifeOnEarth
 * Template:LocationOfEarth
 * Template:Mahathir Mohamad series
 * Template:Politics of Hungary
 * Template:Politics of Kuwait
 * Template:Politics of Kyrgyzstan
 * Template:Politics of Laos
 * Template:Politics of Myanmar
 * Template:Politics of Syria
 * Template:Politics of Ukraine
 * Template:Western Schism

PAGE ]]) 17:29, 23 August 2018 (UTC) PAGE ]]) 18:26, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I am not feeling bold enough to remove all of the small and similar template coding from those templates, but I might go for it later if nobody else has a better solution. – Jonesey95 (talk) 12:39, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * For hlist, one can use style instead of e.g Galobtter (pingó mió) 13:34, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I added a style parameter to align as well, since was causing similar errors. --Ahecht ([[User talk:Ahecht|<span style="color:#FFF;background:#04A;display:inline-block;padding:1px;vertical-align:-.3em;font:bold 50%/1 sans-serif;text-align:center">TALK
 * All of them in that list are fixed now except Western Schism, as I couldn't find an easy way to replace the tags without changing the appearance for the worse. However, there are still many more at Special:LintErrors/misc-tidy-replacement-issues. --Ahecht ([[User talk:Ahecht|<span style="color:#FFF;background:#04A;display:inline-block;padding:1px;vertical-align:-.3em;font:bold 50%/1 sans-serif;text-align:center">TALK
 * I did some web searching and figured out how to fix Western Schism and a bunch of transit-related infobox header templates. "display:block;" works well in span tags as a substitute for plain div tags. – Jonesey95 (talk) 08:23, 26 August 2018 (UTC)

Pages using Template:ISO 3166 code Canada
There's a lot of pages using Template:ISO 3166 code Canada and similar templates and I can't see why. The list can bee seen at Special:WhatLinksHere/Template:ISO_3166_code_Canada, there's is a total of 91 pages. All the pages I've check don't have any transclusion to it and the templates they use don't either. Can someone please tell me where all the transclusion are coming from? – BrandonXLF   (t@lk)  20:16, 26 August 2018 (UTC)

BTW, Please ping me when replying please. – BrandonXLF   (t@lk)  20:17, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * A preview window has "Templates used in this preview" at the bottom. Testing one example Davisville station shows the template is used with this code but not if any of the three parameters are removed:


 * Infobox station calls for these parameters. It produces  with use of ISO 3166 code Canada. PrimeHunter (talk) 21:29, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Mostly they're WP:RDTs that contain a template with CA as the first parameter. This is fed through   twice (once with yes and once without) in order to obtain the country name for that code. I really don't see why it needs to be that complicated. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 21:31, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks – BrandonXLF   (t@lk)  01:36, 27 August 2018 (UTC)

Notifications: "A link was made from" no longer works?
Since about two months, I no longer get any "a link was made from" Article X "to" an Article Y I created. This didn't register at first because this doesn't happen every day, however, none in two months is way, way below what I used to get. I have already untoggled and retoggled the preference (preferences => notifications => page link). is this something which was disabled deliberately (and perhaps announced in Tech) which I just missed, or something which should work but works for no one any longer, or just something on my end only? Fram (talk) 13:54, 20 August 2018 (UTC)


 * This was also reported on the Finnish Wikipedia by 2 users. So I think it's a bug somewhere, not sure is it reported on Phabricator yet, at least I could not find it. Stryn (talk) 14:19, 20 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks. Fram (talk) 07:05, 21 August 2018 (UTC)
 * See the discussion in German: de:Wikipedia:Fragen zur Wikipedia --HHill (talk) 08:24, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

Page link notifications no longer work?
Under the "Notify me about these events" preferences list, I have "page link" enabled. However, I no longer seem to be getting notifications about articles I've created being linked in another article. Is this broken for everyone else or just me? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 01:04, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Tracked in phab already. See also . –Ammarpad (talk) 03:38, 27 August 2018 (UTC)

Help with manually created links on Wiki page
For a long time I had 2 lines of additional code in my User:GermanJoe/common.js to add 2 additional calls for subpage lists: and created additional links on top of a Wiki page to a list of subpages (of the actual page and of my main userpage respectively) - just meant as convenience links to save 1-2 clicks for quicker access. This approach has worked so far, but now the additional links are no longer created (with Firefox 52.9.0 and Vector skin). Any ideas, why these links are no longer created? I am not following every software change, so it's possible I missed some UI changes or a discontinued feature. And as a bonus question: is there maybe a better way to create additional links to such Wiki features without coding an entire new script? GermanJoe (talk) 18:57, 25 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Try this:


 * PrimeHunter (talk) 20:34, 25 August 2018 (UTC)


 * Many thanks, that change fixed it. GermanJoe (talk) 23:14, 25 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , now improved to not rely on the deprecated global variable wgPageName —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 09:57, 27 August 2018 (UTC)

King of Prussia (mall)
A new editor changed the name of the mall (without discussion), and I'm pretty sure the original name was fine. Every time I've reverted a redirect I've messed it up. I would appreciate if an editor could have a look at the new redirect, and revert the name change if they agree it's appropriate. Thanks! Magnolia677 (talk) 12:09, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
 * The infobox-listed website http://www.kingofprussiamall.com redirects to https://www.simon.com/mall/king-of-prussia identifies itself as just "King of Prussia". DMacks (talk) 13:55, 27 August 2018 (UTC)

Tech News: 2018-35
<section begin="technews-2018-W35"/> Latest tech news from the Wikimedia technical community. Please tell other users about these changes. Not all changes will affect you. Translations are available.

Recent changes
 * You can now see moved paragraphs in diffs in the mobile view. It also works on all languages in the desktop view.
 * Bureaucrats on all Wikimedia wikis can now remove the interface admin user right.

Problems
 * Some diffs show lines in the wrong order. The developers are working on fixing it.

Changes later this week
 * The message you see when you thank a user will change. This is to make it easier to understand.
 * AWB will stop adding  in the edit summary.  Instead it will add a tag that says.
 * Octicons-tools.svg Some abuse filter variables have changed. They are now easier to understand for non-experts. The old variables will still work but filter editors are encouraged to replace them with the new ones. You can find the list of changed variables on mediawiki.org. They have a note which says . An example is   which is now.
 * Octicons-tools.svg Abuse filters can now use how old a page is. The variable is.
 * Octicons-sync.svg The new version of MediaWiki will be on test wikis and MediaWiki.org from 28 August. It will be on non-Wikipedia wikis and some Wikipedias from 29 August. It will be on all wikis from 30 August (calendar).

Meetings Future changes
 * Octicons-sync.svg You can join the next meeting with the Editing team. During the meeting, you can tell developers which bugs you think are the most important. The meeting will be on 28 August at 18:30 (UTC). See how to join.
 * Octicons-sync.svg Octicons-tools.svg You can join the technical advice meeting on IRC. During the meeting, volunteer developers can ask for advice. The meeting will be on 29 August at 15:00 (UTC). See how to join.
 * Because of a data centre test you will be able to read but not edit the wikis for up to an hour on 12 September and 10 October. This will start at 14:00 (UTC). You might lose edits if you try to save during this time. The time when you can't edit might be shorter than an hour. You can read more about this.

Tech news prepared by Tech News writers and posted by bot • Contribute • Translate • Get help • Give feedback • Subscribe or unsubscribe. <section end="technews-2018-W35"/> 16:16, 27 August 2018 (UTC)

How is WP:Bots/Spam done?
And how easily could we adapt this to an anti-spam list?

For instance, RonBot once spammed me. Now I put  on my userpage to deny it, and that works. There could be a manually maintained list in User:RonBot/Nospam where things are formatted manually, but it would be much nicer (and noob friendly) if such a list could be handled in the same way WP:Bots/Spam is. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 16:50, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
 * that is a MassMessageList content model. A bot should be able to parse the pages on that type of page and use it for opt-in/opt-out purposes if the operator wanted to. —  xaosflux  Talk 17:46, 27 August 2018 (UTC)


 * So, how do you setup "that type of page"? Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 18:02, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
 * admins can use Special:CreateMassMessageList, anyone else can take an "empty shell" from WT:MMS and move it wherever they need it. — xaosflux  Talk 18:05, 27 August 2018 (UTC)

Link to article name with colon
There is a satellite called "Eu:CROPIS" for which I'd like to create an article. When linking there, wiki software redirects to the "CROPIS" article on eu.wikipedia .org. How do I escape the colon properly in the link? I tried "Eu%3ACROPIS", which gives the same result. — JFG talk 17:51, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
 * this is not currently supported, see Naming_conventions_(technical_restrictions) for the naming convention and titling to use for this type of page. — xaosflux  Talk 18:01, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the tip. I'll just ditch the colon from the title. — JFG talk 18:08, 27 August 2018 (UTC)

Cloud Services purge
Please see Cloud VPS 2018 Purge and make sure that anything you're using is marked as being in use. Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 18:43, 27 August 2018 (UTC)

Template:Transclude list item excerpt causes Bogus file options lint errors
Template:Transclude list item excerpt causes Bogus file options lint errors in probably about 80 articles in the Portal namespace. Please discuss this at Module talk:Excerpt slideshow, not here. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Anomalocaris (talk • contribs) 18:53, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Discussion is now at Module talk:Excerpt - Evad37 &#91;talk] 01:17, 28 August 2018 (UTC)

CURRENTUSER magicword/variable?
Is there a magic word/variable/something that returns the current user? What I'd want is something like  that would return "Headbomb" for me, but "Example" for User:Example, and "YOURUSERNAME" for you.

This would be very useful for scripts and the like. is close, but only returns "Headbomb"/"Example"/"YOURUSERNAME" for a specific revision (or when previewing), and cannot be relied upon to feed scripts and external APIs. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 02:40, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * from Help:Magic_words, "There is no way to show the user viewing the page due to technical issues." - primarily because it would invalidate the cache of every page on every view to have a link waiting with the "currentuser" on it. — xaosflux  Talk 03:12, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * See also T6196. — xaosflux  Talk 03:14, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * could this be something that's LUA-ble? E.g. CURRENTUSERNAME invoking a Module:CURRENTUSERNAME that would return the current user? Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 03:24, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * would you plan on using this to make a link on a page, because that would cause the cache invalidation issue everytime the page is loaded. If you want to access the current username from within a user javascript, you should be able to. —  xaosflux  Talk 03:35, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * the point would be to feed this into an external API. Specifically, something like . Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 03:50, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * OK, how do you want it to be on the page? (e.g. just an HTML link that anyone can click on, or dynamically inserted by someone's personal javascript?) — xaosflux  Talk 04:06, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I don't think Lua can determine the "current user", and I'm not sure what that term means. As mentioned by xaosflux, it is intentional that there is nothing that will automatically update each time a page is viewed. CURRENTTIME can be used, but it will only show the time that the page was last purged. If an automatically generated URL is wanted, someone familiar with JavaScript (not me) could possibly do that with some trick. Johnuniq (talk) 04:12, 26 August 2018 (UTC)

The end goal is to have it in Automated tools, somehow, so that Citation bot knows who activated it. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 04:13, 26 August 2018 (UTC)

Unfortunately that misguided idea already exists: mw:Extension:MyVariables, though it might be acceptable for private wikis. In a public wiki that tool would be the equivalent of giving access to logs of user activity. All one would need to do is to add it to a heavily used template, and the owner of the site would gain access to logs of which users access XXX naughty or politically sensitive page at any time. They can even easily mask it by changing the url on the target site or encode the username on the wiki in any number of ways. That tool server may be run by wikimedia, but it can easily send info to third parties.

Wikimedia would have to be pretty dumb to facilitate violation of its own privacy policy. 17:05, 26 August 2018 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 197.235.52.167 (talk)
 * How would that be the equivalent of 'giving access to logs'. No one but the user would see what  would output. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 17:43, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * As soon as you send  to an external service (via clicking on a URL to that service with the information embedded in the URL), that service has your username and IP address, along with any other information that can be gleaned from referrer stuff. This is a significant privacy violation and, I think, a major objection to any sort of   or   functionality, completely separate from the long-observed caching issues. 「 ディノ 奴  千？！ 」? · ☎ Dinoguy1000 17:59, 26 August 2018 (UTC)


 * If that's the concern, it would would be trivially easy to restrict addition of  to vetted services via edit filters. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 18:07, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I am not really an expert on such privacy sensitive issues, but I am willing to bet that developers will want a MUCH stronger reassurance than an edit filter. I also wonder what this function will do when it's part of a switch - if e.g it is part of a switch that adds stuff to a category, does that mean that a page's categories may change from one minute to the next every time someone reads it and sets off the switch? Would that impact performance? Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 06:06, 28 August 2018 (UTC)

Category redirects populated by templates:
The following are proving evasive to the redirect bot and help in sorting these out is much appreciated:


 * Category:Wikipedia requested images of amphibians - we have two different systems & templates trying to point to the same place
 * Category:Wikipedia requested images of gastropods - ditto
 * Category:Wikipedians in México - this is redirecting to the state but it's the local name for the country and the user infobox struggles
 * Category:Copy to Wikimedia Commons reviewed by Sfan00 IMG - populated by a code page
 * Category:Taxonbar templates using manual IDs - appears empty but shows up in Category:Wikipedia non-empty soft redirected categories
 * Category:Taxonbar templates without from parameter - ditto

There's also still a load of Babel redirect categories where the problem still hasn't been fixed. Timrollpickering 08:57, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
 * The second one is due to the use of with gastropods as the first unnamed parameter. The first one may be due to the same template with amphibians as the first unnamed parameter. The third is due to  with México. The fourth one I could easily have fixed until they took away my interface administrator right a few days ago. The fifth and sixth have me puzzled. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 09:28, 28 August 2018 (UTC)

JavaScript Issue
The code located at User:BrandonXLF/sandbox.js isn't inverting the background of the left side of the page and the very bottom of the page. Can anyone help? – BrandonXLF   (t@lk)  02:54, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Use the function  to add new CSS (you'll probably also want to use ResourceLoader):   Enterprisey (talk!) 03:25, 27 August 2018 (UTC)


 * I'm now using  located at User:BrandonXLF/sandbox.js. And toggled at User:BrandonXLF/sandbox1, the issue still occurs. –  BrandonXLF   (t@lk)  22:02, 28 August 2018 (UTC)

Series overview
Can someone take a look at the code in Module:Series overview, and explain why the table produced when using Series overview appears like this when y is set? The article in question is Nailed It!. It appears to be some sort of column-spanning issue, but it doesn't appear as such on a desktop. Cheers. --  Alex TW 05:32, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
 * This is because tables on mobile need to be scrollable when they are wider than the page. It has this side effect on tables smaller than 100% the width of the page. —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 05:58, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Makes sense. Is there any way to fix this? Do I need to make the table scrollable in Lua in the mobile view? --  Alex TW 04:26, 29 August 2018 (UTC)

Archiving links
Hello,

I am wondering how the link archiving bot works. How often does it archive links? and how do I know if its archived the links on certain pages? Is it so infrequent that i should consider just archiving all my sources on wayback and just using citing the wayback links or does the bot do a sufficient job already? Although i have only had minor issues with links becoming dead or changing, I want to know what steps i should be taking to ensure my citations stay verifiable indefinitely. Thanks, Wikiman5676 (talk) 03:17, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Unsure on specifics of the link archiving bot. I would advise you to immediately archive any url sources you use on wayback. While you can just cite the wayback cite directly, I would recommend you cite the regular url for the, and put the wayback link under  ; it is also helpful if you add the date of archive with  .  Iazyges   Consermonor   Opus meum  04:12, 29 August 2018 (UTC)


 * You can run the bot on individual articles on-demand at history -> fix-dead-links .. it's never going to be 100% so it's worth manually checking links for dead status after running the bot which gets most of them. It can't get them all though like soft404s.  --  Green  C  04:21, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Wow thats the tool I was looking for, thanks! Wikiman5676 (talk) 04:48, 29 August 2018 (UTC)

Strikeouts in Draft:Garalina (Video game company)
Can someone whose technical background is more up-to-date than mine please take a look at Draft:Garalina (Video game company)? Do the black boxes conceal pre-existing text that can be viewed, or are the black boxes simply there in the text as teasers, as if they had overwritten something? Since I think that what I am viewing in the text window is plain ASCII and not any sort of rich text, I am guessing that there isn't anything under the black boxes, and they are just teasers, trying to make one think that there has been censorship, perhaps by the Ministry of Truth. Thank you for a second look. Robert McClenon (talk) 01:56, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * As far as I can tell, it's just a bunch of U+2588 ("Full block", █), and not any kind of formatting. Chris857 (talk) 02:07, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you. Then it appears to be a teaser, implying that there was previous text that has been blotted out, when there never was previous text.  Robert McClenon (talk) 03:02, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Wonder if it was a paste of a scanned document that was redacted.  Ravensfire  (talk) 15:51, 29 August 2018 (UTC)

User name creation frustration
I have expressed my frustration before at our policy regarding username creation and I'll try to come back with something more specific but I'm mentioning this just because it irritates me no end, and is relevant to this request.

Someone tried to edit an article but found they were blocked. I'm fairly sure it's a range block (and to briefly mention another pet peeve, I wish we could figure out how to deliver better messages — I'm tired of having to respond to people at OTRS who right in saying that they've been blocked because of vandalism and they haven't vandalized anything)

I offered to create an account for them.

They asked if I could create an account named: Teetoe

Unfortunately, someone created that account back in 2014 and has zero contributions.

I told him it was unavailable and they asked for: Tkalsta

I check to see if that name was registered: Check And the response tells me it is not (am I misreading it?)

However, when I tried to create the name I get the following message: ''Username entered already in use. Please choose a different name.''

What am I missing?-- S Philbrick (Talk)  15:27, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , Tkalsta exists globally, but not on the english wikipedia. I think we need to update the text for Special:ListUsers "If you are a new user seeking to create an account on Wikipedia, please make sure your desired name is not displayed after searching for it below." for WP:SUL. Galobtter (pingó mió) 15:41, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * IP's have a "Create account" link to Special:CreateAccount. The username field says "(help me choose)" with a link to Username policy. That page does not link to Special:ListUsers so I think few users would come across it before choosing a name. Username policy says "Special:CentralAuth can be used to check for such usernames". It's late in the page and only says it's for similar names. I guess nearly all new users only find out a name is taken when they try to create it. That does work but may be annoying. I think Username policy is the place to say that you can check Special:GlobalUsers for taken names. PrimeHunter (talk) 16:09, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Still, there's no reason for the message to be inaccurate; also while changing that may not help new users but it still may help old users like Sphilbrick :) Galobtter (pingó mió) 16:17, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Special:Listusers only shows accounts registered at the English Wikipedia. The unified login system means a name must not be taken anywhere. Use Special:CentralAuth or Special:GlobalUsers to check that. Special:CentralAuth/Tkalsta shows a Finnish Wikipedia account with no edits. PrimeHunter (talk) 15:44, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Oh crap. I knew that answer but forgot.-- S Philbrick (Talk)  15:47, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the prompt responses, I'll ask them to try again.-- S Philbrick (Talk)  15:48, 29 August 2018 (UTC)

Something strange at Category:Candidates for speedy deletion
Why is it that Category:Candidates for speedy deletion lists Category:Candidates for speedy deletion as abandoned drafts or AfC submissions as containing more than 100 pages, but when you go to the category it is empty? This has been the case for at least the last several days. --MelanieN (talk) 19:26, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * There's T200402 on this, filed a month ago..per previous bug on issues with speedy deletion it seems that category counting is not handled well when a lot of deletion occurs in a category. Maybe can do a manual refresh? Galobtter (pingó mió) 19:53, 29 August 2018 (UTC)

Salted article re-created
I found it odd that Jaiden Animations, which was WP:SALTed by User:Alexf was re-created. According to the logs, the salt lasted until September 2018, but the article was re-created in June.

Also copying the comment by User:ThatMontrealIP at Articles for deletion/Jaiden Animations (2nd nomination)

August 18, 2018: Danielcool123 moved the article, which was declined at AFC, into mainspace, and then removes AFC template. But you are right, it was create protected during this time! Perhaps create protection does not apply to an article already in Draft? Maybe someone tried to do a end run around the admin Alexf? I do not get it either. ThatMontrealIP (talk) 06:49, 26 August 2018 (UTC)

PS please ping if this has been replied as I'm not watching this page. --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 06:54, 26 August 2018 (UTC)

Pinging --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 06:55, 26 August 2018 (UTC)


 * WP:SALT has three levels apparently: "Administrators should choose the appropriate level of create protection – autoconfirmed, extended-confirmed,[2] or full." So it must have been on E-C rather than full. Occam's razor answer :) ThatMontrealIP (talk) 06:58, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * SALT (a.k.a. Create protection) actually has five levels, the same five that all other forms of protection (edit, move, upload etc.) provide: Allow all users; Require autoconfirmed or confirmed access; Require extended confirmed access; Require template editor access; Require administrator access. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 18:20, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * It's because CambridgeBayWeather moved it from JaidenAnimations, which hadn't been protected too. There's no warning when you try to move an article onto a title that's been create-protected, so long as you have sufficient permissions to create it yourself. —Cryptic 07:11, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * The salt was indeed full protection, per the logs. However Danielcool123 moved the draft to "JaidenAnimations", without a space, which wasn't protected, on August 18. Then, an admin, CambridgeBayWeather, overrided the full protection on Jaiden Animations on August 19. Galobtter (pingó mió) 07:11, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Oh that's annoying. You get a warning if a page exists but not if the target is protected. Sorry. CambridgeBayWeather, Uqaqtuq (talk), Sunasuttuq 07:29, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , so he didn't get a warning when he moved it? Don't you think that if the admin is moving into a protected title, he should have get a warning like hey the previous admin had SALTed this title.  Maybe you want to think twice about the move.--<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 08:32, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Per CambridgeBayWeather's above comment, he didn't get a warning.. Galobtter (pingó mió) 08:33, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Bug? --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 08:53, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * There isn't any warning for that I know off, so not a bug. Could be reasonable to have a warning for that though Galobtter (pingó mió) 09:00, 26 August 2018 (UTC)

I agree. I think there should be a warning. Perhaps another admin can chime in their opinion? --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 09:17, 26 August 2018 (UTC)


 * I agree it is a bug (or at least a useful feature-request), and one that has been brought up here multiple times before. DMacks (talk) 09:42, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Stalled on July 3. Bugger. --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 09:50, 26 August 2018 (UTC)

Using edit filter

 * I'm curious if this could be done using an edit filter.. Galobtter (pingó mió) 09:57, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * protection levels of pages are not presented as edit filter variables. — xaosflux  Talk 15:25, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , I was looking at the doc for AbuseFilter earlier and it says that  gets the protection level.. Galobtter (pingó mió) 15:30, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * ec Isn't there ? I don't know whether the set of   are for the move_to or move_from pagename though. DMacks (talk) 15:31, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * / it doesn't look like those variables are actually being populated current, see example of data from a move over a protected page: testwiki:Special:AbuseFilter/examine/398011. —  xaosflux  Talk 17:15, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * See also T173889. — xaosflux  Talk 17:19, 26 August 2018 (UTC)


 * FYI: There is a blocking task, T190653 to considering the edit filter for this right now. Once it is resolved we can revisit if EF might be a good way to work in a warning. —  xaosflux  Talk 20:11, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I feel like if you're trying to move a page to a salted title, even if you're an admin (or really only then, since otherwise moving it wouldn't even be possible), it should show you the deletion logs for the title, just like it does if you're trying to create an article whose title has previously been deleted. IntoThinAir (formerly Everymorning) talk  16:06, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
 * that is exactly what has been requested in T85393. Things like this will probably have to get in to the community wish list discussions to get traction though. —  xaosflux  Talk 17:23, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , shall I post there too? --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 23:14, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * subscribing and posting support to the task can't hurt! — xaosflux  Talk 00:52, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , I've subscribed but how do you post support?
 * And I mean to post in the wishlist. --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 01:30, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
 * the 2018_Community_Wishlist_Survey starts collecting proposals in ~2 months. — xaosflux  Talk 01:33, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , ah gotcha. Remind me when it opens. --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 02:17, 30 August 2018 (UTC)

Non-free file in portal
Can someone figure out why File:The Lion Sleeps Tonight by The Tokens.ogg is listed as being used in Portal:Neil Sedaka? Non-free files are only allowed to be used in the article mainspace per WP:NFCC, but I cannot find the syntaxt for this file anywhere on the portal's page. It might be being transcluded from another article, but none of the articles where the file is currenlty being used seem related to Sedaka. -- Marchjuly (talk) 06:05, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Yep, it was a bit intricate transclusion of the same file from the lead of The Tokens. I fixed it now. –Ammarpad (talk) 09:15, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your help . -- Marchjuly (talk) 21:15, 30 August 2018 (UTC)

Devil May Cry 4
Please see: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Devil_May_Cry_4&action=edit&section=12

Any idea why the date format is not appearing correctly in the article? Reference #89. I fixed them using the Visual Editor but it makes no change in how they display. In the course of my c/e I ran into this several time. I'm using a Dell Inspiron 15 laptop, though I doubt that makes a difference. Thanks for your help. Twofingered Typist (talk) 21:25, 30 August 2018 (UTC)


 * , the cite has df=dmy-all activated which overrides the original date format to DMY for all 3 dates. GermanJoe (talk) 21:32, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks, GermanJoe!! I've never run across this and I was beginning to think I'd lost my mind! Twofingered Typist (talk) 21:37, 30 August 2018 (UTC)

Collapsing template
Could someone please figure out how to make this template not collapse on the Major scale page? Even  didn't seem to force the template into its expanded state (according to Preview, anyway). The problem appears to exist just on this one page. WhatamIdoing (talk) 21:13, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
 * ,  should work now per my change.  Nihlus  21:20, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks, Nihlus. It's working perfectly now.  WhatamIdoing (talk) 21:37, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks to both of you, from the one who was dragging his feet seeking help about it. On a random undocumented key-mashing hunch, I had originally tried which worked in preview, but not after saving the edit. Inn-teresting... Just plain Bill (talk) 22:13, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
 * It had class . This will start out collapsed if there are two or more collapsible tables on the page, and expanded if it's the only one. You made a section edit where it was alone so it previewed expanded but the saved page had another at the bottom so it collapsed. PrimeHunter (talk) 22:25, 30 August 2018 (UTC)

large blank box Commander-in-Chief Fleet article
Hello I recently did some editing on the article Commander-in-Chief Fleet below the references sections a large blank box has appeared and I cant seem to get rid of it would appreciate any help to resolve it and an explanation what I might have done that has caused it to happen many thanks.--Navops47 (talk) 04:39, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , I don't see that blank box. maybe post a screenshot? Galobtter (pingó mió) 04:50, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Hi thanks for getting back to me this is the screen shot from my computer the box extends about 7 inches down the screen.--Navops47 (talk) 05:19, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , trying adding "?safemode=1" at the end of the url and clicking enter - does it still show as a white box? do the navboxes show below? Galobtter (pingó mió) 05:24, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Also its not the navigation templates at the bottom of that page as they appear after I scroll all the way down.--Navops47 (talk) 05:23, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I tried adding that extension at the end of the URL it does not recognise it says wikipedia does not have an article with that name. Can you post the url address with that extension as a link for me sorry for being a bit dumb?, The navboxes are showing as normal before you expand them at the bottom of the box--Navops47 (talk) 05:33, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commander-in-Chief_Fleet?safemode=1. Enterprisey (talk!) 05:37, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Okay that extension works the box is not showing. When I do a fresh google search then click the article link its still showing on this page not on any others is it possibly a glitch? am using Windows 10.--Navops47 (talk) 06:21, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
 * It's not a user script issue, but seems to be related to our site JavaScript that does the collapsing of collapsible objects. It's happening for me in Opera 36.0, it might not affect all browsers. The problem is related to the three sidebars in the sections Fleet structure (1971 to 1981), Fleet structure (1981 to 2002) and Fleet structure (2002 to 2012). If you navigate to the first of those sections, you will see that the sidebars all start off expanded and then collapse. Page content below those should move up into the gap that is created, but this is not happening correctly for the navbox Her Majesty's Naval Service - its top border ends up at the correct position, just below the references, but the pale blue title strip remains where it was (just below the former position of the bottom edge of the third sidebar) causing a large blank space which on my setup is about two screens high. Try going directly to the category box at the bottom and watch what happens. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 09:16, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , Huh, when going directly to the category box at the bottom there is indeed a flash of a white box. Making the layout a bit less horrible appears to fix the problem. ping, anyhow, as having rewritten the js code for collapsible recently.. Galobtter (pingó mió) 09:34, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
 * The problem began with . -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 11:01, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I can confirm that it is browser-dependent. Looking at the problem version in Firefox Quantum 61, there is no problem. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 12:35, 31 August 2018 (UTC)

JavaScript invert script issue
I'm trying to use the code below to invert the color of the page  located at User:BrandonXLF/sandbox.js. And toggled at User:BrandonXLF/E, the code above doesn't invert the BACKGROUND of the bottom bar and the right sidebar, does anyone know why?. – BrandonXLF   (t@lk)  18:47, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , you are appending CSS on each state change, which just results in a lot of conflicting CSS. Instead, you should add the rules to a classname like "inverted-colors", addCSS that unconditionally, and then use the turnon, turnoff handler to $(html).toggleClass('inverted-colors'). This will apply/remove the classname, and the thus put the CSS stylerules into effect, or disable them. —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 14:37, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * also which sidebar of which skin ? Maybe you can post a screenshot ? —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 14:40, 31 August 2018 (UTC)

Request for template help
I've been sporadically working on User:Lepricavark/List of RfA nominators for a while now. The task would be much, much, much easier if there was a version of Template:Recent RfX that included a column for nominators, ideally between the 'Type' and 'Result' headings. It looks like it should be a fairly easy task for a technically-skilled editor, but I can't make heads-or-tails of what needs to be done. I'd be deeply grateful if someone could create the template for me. Lepricavark (talk) 22:40, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
 * First, I hope you know that template (the body) is manually updated after RfA from here. And it draws its header content from here. I have added the nominator column for you in in its sandbox here and draws customized header from my sandbox. Final example can be seen here. I hope that is what you want. –Ammarpad (talk) 02:19, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you very much! That is extremely helpful. I have copied the template structure over to User:Lepricavark/RfX nom template and I have only one more request: can you adjust it so that I can include multiple editor usernames in the nominators column for RfX that had co-noms? You can see the current problem at User:Lepricavark/List of RfA nominators. Lepricavark (talk) 04:26, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I made the changes in your userspace and created doc page. Some few things: If you didn't supply at least one nominator, it will assume it's a self nomination. Maximum number of nominators is 3. –Ammarpad (talk) 14:56, 31 August 2018 (UTC)

Default preferences in en-WP
I keep running into new users who seem to have the setting "Email me when a page or a file on my watchlist is changed" checked in their preferences, which confuses them. They write things like "I received an email saying (blah blah blah)" or "Stop emailing me!". I am dealing with somebody like that now. Before I respond to them, I would like to know if this is checked by default if you provide your email address, or if a person has to check it. Does anybody know? (I checked Help:Preferences and didn't find information there). Thx Jytdog (talk) 18:36, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, it's checked by default for new users. Graham 87 06:51, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for letting me know! I am not sure that should be the default.  Where do folks reckon would be the place to discuss that? Jytdog (talk) 12:34, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * The configuration here is supposed to default that specific preference ("") to off. There are a few that are defaulted on for email, all in "" on the "" tab:
 * I also spot-checked a few of the newest users (using mwrepl) and they seem to have the preference unchecked. BJorsch (WMF) (talk) 13:35, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Hm thanks! I think it is the "user talk" one that confuses people. Here is a copy/paste from the email exchange: Can’t find your message only get the beginning on emails ... Jytdog (talk) 15:52, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I also spot-checked a few of the newest users (using mwrepl) and they seem to have the preference unchecked. BJorsch (WMF) (talk) 13:35, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Hm thanks! I think it is the "user talk" one that confuses people. Here is a copy/paste from the email exchange: Can’t find your message only get the beginning on emails ... Jytdog (talk) 15:52, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I also spot-checked a few of the newest users (using mwrepl) and they seem to have the preference unchecked. BJorsch (WMF) (talk) 13:35, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Hm thanks! I think it is the "user talk" one that confuses people. Here is a copy/paste from the email exchange: Can’t find your message only get the beginning on emails ... Jytdog (talk) 15:52, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I also spot-checked a few of the newest users (using mwrepl) and they seem to have the preference unchecked. BJorsch (WMF) (talk) 13:35, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Hm thanks! I think it is the "user talk" one that confuses people. Here is a copy/paste from the email exchange: Can’t find your message only get the beginning on emails ... Jytdog (talk) 15:52, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I also spot-checked a few of the newest users (using mwrepl) and they seem to have the preference unchecked. BJorsch (WMF) (talk) 13:35, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Hm thanks! I think it is the "user talk" one that confuses people. Here is a copy/paste from the email exchange: Can’t find your message only get the beginning on emails ... Jytdog (talk) 15:52, 31 August 2018 (UTC)

Generate inline popover maps based on KML
Some background: for years we've had support for KML data on Wikipedia with a template, Attached KML, which adds a geo-box (my name for it, same as what coord does) to the top-right of an article with a map generated from KML data uploaded to a subpage, and can also display a box inline without the geo-box, but (formerly) with links to create an overlay map on Google or Bing with the KML data. Unfortunately, it seems Bing shut off their support for KML some time ago, and our wmflabs tool to create the overlay on Google Maps has also stopped working, so the inline form of Attached KML is pretty thoroughly broken. However, there are still more than 10,000 sets of KML data on the project, and it would be a shame not to do something with them. The topicon still works, but generating new maps seems to be buggy.

I had been working on List of Prince Edward Island provincial highways and the highways linked from there for a while when I started to encounter the issues with KML support. What I'd like to be able to do is add a column to the tables with a geo-box that could overlay a linked KML file, similar to how coord overlays a pin on a map when used inline (see examples at List of National Parks of Canada) and similar to the overlay map that Attached KML generates with the topicon. I think this is a simple matter of "borrowing" code from Module:Attached KML, but I wouldn't know even where to start. Does one of you Lua-savvy folk feel like taking this on? Ivanvector (Talk/Edits) 14:14, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * The thing that displays the "geobox" map is WikiMiniAtlas, all Module:Attached KML does is let that software know there's related KML data for the page. The easiest way to basically do what you want would be to switch to geoJSON map data (which is compatible with / (as I mentioned at Template talk:Attached KML), rather than KML. That way you can just insert maplink links into the table, which when clicked will open a dynamic map with the data displayed. I have a script that can help convert from KML to geoJSON if you are interested, see Template talk:Infobox road. At Template talk:Infobox road, we're also looking into automated or semi-automated importing and converting of Wikipedia KML files into map data on Commons (a test case showed it can be done, but manually it's a non-intuitive seven step process, so an admin-bot or script to assist admins would be required). - Evad37 &#91;talk] 16:03, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you! I will look into this over the weekend, I'm a bit busy the rest of today. I'll get in touch with you about your script if I can't figure it out myself. As for existing data, for the list I mentioned there isn't much, Route 1 was already done but needs correction, and I gave up after I couldn't get Route 2 to work, so it would be just as logical for me to learn how to generate a geoJSON map instead and go from there. Thanks for the suggestions, anyway, I will have something to do for a while :) Ivanvector (Talk/Edits) 16:07, 31 August 2018 (UTC)

Blank infoboxes
I don't know why, but I had Multiplexed point-of-care testing on my watchlist. Earlier today added a blank infobox to the page. This seemed a little odd, so I reverted. In looking at their contribs they had added blank copies of Infobox diagnostic to a whole bunch of pages. I inquired about this, and getting what I felt was an insufficient reason for adding them I proceeded to remove any blank uses of the infobox. proceeded to question my actions, reverting all of them (though I will note I stopped removing them after his first post), and since we seem to be at an impasse I figured I would bring the issue here. Additionally, Doc James says it makes it clear that all "medical diagnostics" are part of a category, but my thought is that adding Category would work just as well.

Looking specifically at this template is what brought me here, but I'd like to ask the general question - is it worth adding an entirely blank (minus the "name" field) infobox to an article in the off chance that information can be added in the future? Primefac (talk) 15:57, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * The infobox indicates that the article in question is a "diagnostic" so not entirely blank. Many of them also had images. A number of these articles do not mention that the article is about a diagnostic elsewhere.
 * I keep a number of these topics on my watchlist and found it strange to see the infoboxes being removed. Looked further and found that Primefac had removed like 50 of them.
 * So yes restored the boxes in question. Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 16:01, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I guess that's my question, why not just track with Category:Medical tests, or create Category:Diagnostic tests? If it doesn't say that it's a diagnostic test, why not improve the article to say so? Primefac (talk) 16:07, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * as Doc James indicated, many of them did have images, additionally many will be filled with information related to each test--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 16:18, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * An image that was already there, and an image which I made sure was kept when I removed the infobox (example). Primefac (talk) 16:27, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * The authority control box is programmed to not show up unless there is at least one meaningful parameter value. I suggest the same approach be followed for infoboxes that are placed without parameter values, and until the time such programming of the box has happened it be removed or commented out. --Francis Schonken (talk) 16:22, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Commenting out doesn't seem to work, so removing it is, for the time being. Also, the infobox in question is apparently Wikidata-enabled, which is ill-advised to place without knowing what's going to be in it. At least not without a broad consensus to do so. Which we're here to discuss: I'd suggest a consensus on not placing empty infoboxes of any kind, that's what I'd think the best solution. --Francis Schonken (talk) 16:29, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * The template fetches no data from Wikidata and is not Wikidata-enabled. --RexxS (talk) 17:06, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * My personal preference would be not to have a blank infobox, but I can see some value in having something in the usual place where readers go to get "at-a-glance" information about a topic – even if it is just a link to Medical diagnosis. I suppose it boils down to whether there's any chance that more information may be placed in the infobox, but I'm not sure what else there is to say about many of the articles in question. In the final analysis, I'm pretty sure that the presence or absence of an infobox in those articles doesn't amount to a hill of beans either way. --RexxS (talk) 16:35, 14 August 2018 (UTC)


 * please don't mess with the layout of my talk page comments: what I said above was in direct response to the OP, so should not be indented as if it was a reply to something else. --Francis Schonken (talk) 16:39, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Then please make it clear by using the reply to template on complicated threads, particularly when you fuck-up the page for the visually impaired by switching from description lists to a bulleted list. You've been here long enough: have you never read Manual of Style/Accessibility, or do you just not care about the effect of your edits on those less fortunate than yourself? --RexxS (talk) 16:49, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * A bullet point is clear enough to indicate the start of a new reply to the OP. Indeed, that's how it worked for those that have been around long enough, and for newcomers too. --Francis Schonken (talk) 16:52, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Also, WP:TPG is the applicable guidance: if I object to refactoring my comment, then don't do so for a second time (like you did). Or don't you care about that guidance? --Francis Schonken (talk) 16:56, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * No. There is a clear injunction against switching styles of indentation as I indicated. It makes the page uncomfortable reading for anyone using a screen reader and and so we don't do it. That's one reason why we have the reply to template. WP:TPG: "Some examples of appropriately editing others' comments: ... Fixing format errors that render material difficult to read ... Examples include fixing indentation levels, removing bullets from discussions that are not consensus polls or requests for comment". So, I'll warn you just once and then it's off to ANI: you are now aware of the problem caused by switching styles of indentation, so don't do it again. --RexxS (talk) 17:05, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Don't change the layout of my replies. Period. WP:TPG. --Francis Schonken (talk) 18:33, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Or for clarity, quoting the guideline: "Cautiously editing or removing another editor's comments is sometimes allowed, but normally you should stop if there is any objection." (emphasis added) – so, please act "normal" and stop refactoring my reply after I objected to such refactoring. Thanks. --Francis Schonken (talk) 18:44, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Request denied. The moment that it was explained to you that you were causing problems for the visually impaired, any objections you might have against anyone fixing the problem you caused are overruled. WP:TPOC. --Guy Macon (talk) 20:01, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Also, for clarity, I meant, reply to the original post (for anyone to read), not reply to the original poster – so no use pinging a specific editor. Sorry I wasn't clear about that by using an abbreviation. --Francis Schonken (talk) 18:57, 14 August 2018 (UTC)


 * I've consequently removed the "edit on wikidata" thing Galobtter (pingó mió) 17:26, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Commenting out doesn't seem to work You refer presumably to . Comments cannot be nested, so your   opens a comment which is terminated by the very next instance of , which is at the end of the DiseasesDB parameter. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 16:46, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm generally pro-infobox, but I don't see the value in empty infoboxes. If you want to add them, why not add the corresponding information to make them actually useful for readers? Natureium (talk) 16:36, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * What said. ~  ONUnicorn (Talk&#124;Contribs) problem solving 20:14, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm also in agreement with here, but I'm also not opposed to the infoboxes being hidden by default when there's no parameters defined (not including name). Empty infoboxes simply look broken, and clutter up the page with zero value. If you want an infobox, populate it with some information. stwalkerster (talk) 20:18, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Agree with . Either add an infobox with useful verifiable information or don't add an empty infobox. --Treetear (talk) 20:49, 14 August 2018 (UTC)

Blank infoboxes (obviously) provide no useful data and therefor should be removed. &#123;&#123;3x&#124;p&#125;&#125;ery (talk) 21:07, 14 August 2018 (UTC)

Okay have added some properties to all the infoboxes in question. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 21:31, 14 August 2018 (UTC)

Is there an actual technical question here, or should this discussion be moved out of VPT? One of the stated goals ("trying to find a consensus for common practices") is more appropriate for one of the other village pumps, or at WT:MED, or at the talk page for any of the affected articles. WhatamIdoing (talk) 04:19, 15 August 2018 (UTC)
 * It started out as a technical request, and somewhere along the line I suppose I lost all the "technical" parts of it. I have no issue with it being moved to a more appropriate venue. Primefac (talk) 19:29, 15 August 2018 (UTC)
 * All the infoboxes that started this discuss have had stuff added to them. It would be better practice to add to the infoboxes than to remove them. Is there a tool that lists infoboxes that are empty? Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 00:17, 20 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes. For at least one definition of "empty" there is Category:Articles which use infobox templates with no data rows. For me, the category has been a bit of a hobbyhorse lately. I've been looking to cut back on the huge number of articles in the category by (at least for a while) allowing infoboxes to be used simply for an image or simply for navigation. These seem to be common ways to use infoboxes and not deprecated by the template's documentation. Taking them out of the tracking category will allow us to better focus on the really empty userboxes, the ones that should be fixed first.  — jmcgnh (talk) (contribs) 19:50, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * In my hunt for templates that might be tweaked to decrease the noise count at Category talk:Articles which use infobox templates with no data rows, I'm coming across a lot of "empty" instances of Infobox medical condition (new). Are these also being built out in some systematic way – in their present state they're pretty useless. Can I at least propose pushing them into their own separate tracking category?  — jmcgnh (talk) (contribs) 21:06, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * User:jmcgnh if you give me a list of empty one I will go through it and add information to them. Have added information to over 500 so far. Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 23:08, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I have some other ideas about how I might generate such a list, but I don't have that list or a way to generate it at present. Having the empty ones populate their own category, instead of the big "no data rows" one is my best idea of how to give you a list. But it's template-protected, so I'd need to go through an edit-request process to get there.  — jmcgnh (talk) (contribs) 23:14, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Here is a search of pages with that template also in that category. Have at it. --Izno (talk) 23:34, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Perfect will get on it. Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 23:49, 31 August 2018 (UTC)

Rollback and revdel
University of Chicago Law School was recently full-protected due to an edit war, the subject then came up at WP:AN, and I happened upon it as a result. By that point, there was consensus at the talk page that some bits needed to be removed for copyright reasons, so I edited through full protection to remove things that were identified, and nobody objected. Someone else has since revdeleted the infringing revisions. To my surprise, however, I find that I don't have a rollback link — my latest edit is the latest edit to the page, so I have (current) in my contributions, but no rollback. Is this intentional? It seems to me that when an edit has been revdeleted, there should be a rollback link, and clicking it should have the effect of restoring the last visible edit by someone else. Nyttend (talk) 23:31, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , rollback isn't that smart. It looks at the last revision by someone else, whether or not it was revdel'd. Rollback cannot restore a revdel'd version of the page, so the option is not available. Nihlus  23:38, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , I can confirm the missing rollback link as well; note however that the Twinkle rollback links do appear. Obviously, as I'm not a sysop, triggering them generates an error. I'm not sure what they'd do for you. Home Lander (talk) 00:41, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Tested at test wiki. Trying to use Twinkle to rollback to a rev-delled edit still generates an error even with sysop rights because Twinkle can't find the revision to rollback to. Home Lander (talk) 00:49, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm the one that did the revdelete, I wasn't aware I might be causing a problem. Do you need me to fix something? Ivanvector (Talk/Edits) 14:00, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , I don't see that there is a problem, per se, it just caused a technical side effect that prompted the question. Home Lander (talk) 18:33, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, that's a good description: nothing wrong with the revdel, just a question about an undesirable-to-me aspect of rollback. Nyttend (talk) 11:47, 1 September 2018 (UTC)

Talk page notification not working?
Notification re talking page messages seems to be not working today. In preferences, the web notification option for this is checked, but grayed out. — Maile (talk) 11:36, 1 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It works for me. It's checked and grayed out because it's not optional. Are you saying you were not notified of [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Maile66&diff=857492328&oldid=857231030]? Do you see it at Special:Notifications? PrimeHunter (talk) 13:53, 1 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Oops. I just realized it never notified me this morning ... because, it seems I looked at the last message before signing out last evening.  My oversight.  Disregard this thread, please. — Maile  (talk) 16:26, 1 September 2018 (UTC)

Username or IP removed? Never seen this before
I just saw this on my watchlist: What is it? Never seen anything like that, only the "Renamed user abcdefg123" what comes from Courtesy vanishing. Is this is something the WMF has enforced without consulting the community? --Pudeo (talk) 22:17, 1 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The username or IP was oversighted. —&thinsp;JJMC89&thinsp; (T·C) 22:20, 1 September 2018 (UTC)
 * This can happen for any of three situations: WP:REVDEL, WP:OVERSIGHT, or both (in that order). In this case it was not the first one. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 22:22, 1 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Pretty curious. Thanks, it does mention oversighting usernames. But that makes evaluating the the user's actions as well as the administrative actions impossible for accountability. Reminds of removing "unpersons" from official pictures in the USSR (Censorship of images in the Soviet Union). --Pudeo (talk) 22:28, 1 September 2018 (UTC)
 * IP addresses are often suppressed when someone accidentally edits while logged out and/or did not realize that their IP address would be published. Since IP addresses can reveal things like your location, Internet service provider, employer, etc., I think the oversight team regularly grants these types of requests as "non-public personal information". It does make accountability for the edits difficult, since there's no one we can communicate with about them. If you disagree with the edits, I suppose I would just apply WP:BRD and revert them; whoever it is, I'd imagine they'd create an account in order to discuss the issue if they were so motivated. Mz7 (talk) 23:56, 1 September 2018 (UTC)

Meaning of negative byte count on diff of oldest page edit?
What is the meaning of a negative byte count in the "diff" of the oldest edit of a page? Example: go to White supremacy, History, and click "oldest edit"; I see edit version 332270761 of 01:21, July 1, 2001‎ listed as "(436 bytes) ( -12,385 )": here. Mathglot (talk) 02:18, 2 September 2018 (UTC)‎
 * It means that I imported some edits from the Nostalgia Wikipedia to the article. This doesn't happen with imported edits anymore, but I can't find the Phabricator task about it. Graham 87 02:54, 2 September 2018 (UTC)

Question for non en wiki
In this module, line 1352, is there some way to change date.getUTCMonthName and date.getUTCFullYear to local numerical and month names? For example September 2 should be ٢ی ئەیلوول in that wiki, the day coming before the month. Thanks in advance.--&#9656; ‎<b style="color:purple;font-size:13px;display:inline-block;border:1px solid purple">épine</b> <b style="color:black;font-size:11px">talk</b> &#9836; 16:03, 2 September 2018 (UTC)

RfC: Creating abusefilter-manager global group
There's an RfC in meta about creating a new  group. People are invited to participate in the discussion there. Thanks, Kaartic correct me, if i'm wrong 18:21, 2 September 2018 (UTC)

Lint error in Bot2
is causing Lint errors:Bogus file options. Please discuss at Template talk:Bot2. —Anomalocaris (talk) 01:02, 3 September 2018 (UTC)

Request to set up auto archiving WP:RMT page
Currently editors are simply deleting content from WP:RMT instead of marking as done and archive by bot. This is not normal. Pages like WP:RFPP and WP:PERM etc are archived for historical purposes. We have a consensus in support to do it here at Wikipedia_talk:Requested_moves. So requesting someone to help set up the archive similar to WP:RFPP. -- D Big X ray ᗙ  09:43, 3 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Please put this on hold for now, there has been some oppose from folks recently. -- D Big X ray ᗙ  16:23, 3 September 2018 (UTC)

Tech News: 2018-36
<section begin="technews-2018-W36"/> Latest tech news from the Wikimedia technical community. Please tell other users about these changes. Not all changes will affect you. Translations are available.

Recent changes
 * There is a new user right for users who can edit CSS and JavaScript for the entire wiki. Before this all admins could edit CSS and JavaScript. This was a security risk. This group is called interface administrators. Administrators can delete user CSS and JavaScript pages.
 * There will be an A/B test on the Wikipedia mobile website. It starts this week. It tests how we show templates that show information about an article. The test will last two weeks.
 * You can now use different CSS rules for different skins when you edit templates. This is because of TemplateStyles.
 * in ORES is now called.
 * When you get a new message on your talk page you get a yellow message in the toolbar. The preference to show or not show this has been removed.

Problems
 * UploadWizard had problems with campaigns. Users could not upload files. This has now been fixed.
 * You can get a notification when a link is made to a page you created. This has not worked since June. It was fixed last week.

Changes later this week
 * Octicons-sync.svg The new version of MediaWiki will be on test wikis and MediaWiki.org from 4 September. It will be on non-Wikipedia wikis and some Wikipedias from 5 September. It will be on all wikis from 6 September (calendar).

Meetings
 * Octicons-sync.svg Octicons-tools.svg You can join the technical advice meeting on IRC. During the meeting, volunteer developers can ask for advice. The meeting will be on 5 September at 15:00 (UTC). See how to join.

Future changes
 * The Wikimedia Foundation Readers department will work on advanced mobile editing. You can read more about this and other things they plan to work on over the next year. You can also see the presentation.
 * The RelatedSites extension will be removed from Wikivoyage.
 * Octicons-tools.svg Unused projects on the Wikimedia Cloud virtual private server will be removed. This will happen in October. Projects can be marked if they are being used.

Tech news prepared by Tech News writers and posted by bot • Contribute • Translate • Get help • Give feedback • Subscribe or unsubscribe. <section end="technews-2018-W36"/> 16:47, 3 September 2018 (UTC)

Parser function / module to format number
Is there a parser function or module to call to pad a number like 12 or 9 to 012 or 009 respectively? For use in a template. Shyamal (talk) 10:07, 4 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , there's a parser function for it, see Help:Magic_words. Something like 012 gives what you want Galobtter (pingó mió) 10:12, 4 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks a ton. Shyamal (talk) 10:28, 4 September 2018 (UTC)

WP:INTADMIN
Hi everyone. I'm just sending an FYI to let you know (per the requirements listed) that I've requested temporary interface administrator rights. You're welcome to comment, support, oppose, hate, etc my request by clicking here.  ~Oshwah~  (talk) (contribs)   23:13, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Piggybacking on Oshwah's request, I have also filed one directly below his. Input is requested. :-)— CYBERPOWER  ( Chat ) 23:46, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Piggyback #2 here. Please follow this anchored link to my request if you're interested in commenting. Deryck C. 10:02, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Piggyback #3 here. Please follow this link to my request.  --Dirk Beetstra T  C 15:34, 3 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Please see an additional request from at Wikipedia_talk:Interface_administrators. —  xaosflux  Talk 17:07, 4 September 2018 (UTC)

Multiple [hide] links
The article Palembang Light Rail Transit includes a route map in the infobox. There is a line at the top of it that says System map [hide] and a second [hide] at the bottom. If I click the top one, the map hides properly, and the [show] link can be used to view it again. If I click the bottom one, the map disappears, and there does not appear to be a way to get it back, except by leaving the page and returning to it. Is there any way to disable the bottom [hide] link, or to make it work properly? (I am using the Firefox browser). Bob1960evens (talk) 14:11, 3 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Fixed. Is that OK? –Ammarpad (talk) 20:40, 3 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks, that is great. I notice you have put a collapsible=no switch in the map. I'll remember that for next time. Bob1960evens (talk) 17:41, 4 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, that's because the main infobox has the functionality and likewise the embedded map, which is essentially a template itself. So you just need to disable that one. –Ammarpad (talk) 22:00, 4 September 2018 (UTC)

Gmail "sent mail" goes only through August 30th
When I look at my "sent mail" file in gmail, it shows me what I sent through August 30, and nothing more recent. What's going on? Is there some way to see things I sent more recently? Michael Hardy (talk) 05:00, 4 September 2018 (UTC) PAGE ]]) 15:28, 4 September 2018 (UTC)
 * This page is for discussing technical issues with Wikipedia. For discussing issues with gmail, try https://productforums.google.com/forum/#!forum/gmail. --Ahecht ([[User talk:Ahecht|<span style="color:#FFF;background:#04A;display:inline-block;padding:1px;vertical-align:-.3em;font:bold 50%/1 sans-serif;text-align:center">TALK
 * This can also be asked at Reference desk/Computing. –Ammarpad (talk) 20:10, 4 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I had intended to post this at the "reference desk" and mistakenly put it here instead, so I deleted this section, but somebody restored it. Michael Hardy (talk) 01:02, 5 September 2018 (UTC)

Discussion notice
I have placed an idea at Village pump (idea lab)/Archive 26 which also poses questions of technical feasibility for those that monitor this board. Editors are invited to participate. — Berean Hunter   (talk)  16:44, 5 September 2018 (UTC)

A couple of POTD contains File:Deleted photo.png
These POTD templates is hosting File:Deleted photo.png
 * POTD/March 10, 2005
 * POTD/November 20, 2004
 * POTD column/November 26, 2006
 * Picture of the day/April 2007
 * Picture of the day/April 2010
 * Picture of the day/August 2010
 * Picture of the day/December 2008
 * Picture of the day/January 2007
 * Picture of the day/June 2012
 * Picture of the day/March 2012
 * Picture of the day/May 2006
 * Picture of the day/May 2013
 * Picture of the day/May 9, 2006
 * Picture of the day/November 2006
 * Picture of the day/November 26, 2006
 * Picture of the day/October 20, 2006
 * Picture of the day/October 2006
 * Picture of the day/October 28, 2006
 * Picture of the day/September 2007
 * Picture of the day/September 2013
 * Template:POTD/2007-01-11
 * Template:POTD/2007-01-23
 * Template:POTD/2007-04-14
 * Template:POTD/2007-09-01
 * Template:POTD/2008-12-15
 * Template:POTD/2010-04-30
 * Template:POTD/2010-08-29
 * Template:POTD/2012-03-13
 * Template:POTD/2012-06-04
 * Template:POTD/2013-05-04
 * Template:POTD/2013-09-12
 * Template:POTD protected/2010-04-30

Ps: Please ping me if this gets replied as I'm not watching this page.

--<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 23:20, 5 September 2018 (UTC)


 * Various users have substituted in the deleted photo pic rather than leaving the red link to the deleted file. In this case I think it is more useful to see the redlink so you can see what the file was called before, and why it was deleted. The reasons for delete seem to be for copyright infringement, where someone in the chain of copying has assumed a wrong license, normally public domain for US government, but the image was not actually made by them. for example commons:Commons:Deletion requests/Files in Category:US Antarctic Program photo library images. The POTC templates are transcluded on the Wikipedia:Picture of the day pages so you are double listing. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 04:07, 6 September 2018 (UTC)

Articles for deletion/Log/2018 August 31 is in Category:AfD debates (Fiction and the arts)
Somehow the entire deletion log for August 31 is showing up under the Fiction and the Arts category. Ps: Please ping me if this gets replied as I'm not watching this page. --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 23:20, 5 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It is not there now, but perhaps one of the transcluded AFDs temporarily had that category. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 04:14, 6 September 2018 (UTC)

Broken infobox in Tor (anonymity network)
Hello, could someone have a look at the infobox in Tor (anonymity network) please? It displays raw parameter data like " {LSR| article = Tor
 * latest_release ➔ Back to article "Tor (anonymity network)" ". I am guessing, one of the embedded templates related to release display broke (?), but am not quite sure which one and how. GermanJoe (talk) 09:57, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Fixed..that took quite a bit of time to track down Galobtter (pingó mió) 10:12, 6 September 2018 (UTC)

Edit links not appearing next to section titles in user page
For some reason the edit links are not appearing next to the section titles in my user page (for example there are no "edit" or "edit source" links next to "Basic information"). I tried fiddling with it to try to solve it to no avail. Help! Thinker78 (talk) 07:12, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It's a side-effect of using Portal:Physics/box-header to style your "Progress" box. -- John of Reading (talk) 07:45, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Fixed. By default, section editing is suppressed in Box-header and until now, Portal:Physics/box-header which uses that template didn't contain the parameter that allows overriding that.  –Ammarpad (talk) 10:49, 6 September 2018 (UTC)

Another category/template problem
Template:User WP Mexico City is populating Category:WikiProject Mexico members instead of Category:WikiProject Mexico participants but seems to do so via some convoluted constructions making it hard to find what to change to fix this. Can anyone amend it correctly? Timrollpickering 11:12, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I did some testing (see the last couple of diffs of my user page), and I think I know what the issue is. uir needs to get the parameter  passed to it. I added it in User WP Mexico City/sandbox, but User in Mexico City doesn't pass it on to uir. Either User in Mexico City needs to pass it through if it gets it, or it needs to always add it. I'm not sure how to do either of those things without breaking stuff, but someone more knowledgeable in template editing probably does. rchard2scout (talk) 13:08, 6 September 2018 (UTC)

Commons bleed for a non-commons image?
File:Wonder Woman.jpg is showing Commons:File:Wonder Woman.jpg (some non-notable person dressed up in a Wonder Woman Halloween costume), even though there is a (fair use) image of a comic book cover at that name locally. I have tried purging, refreshing, etc. --B (talk) 15:41, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * , fixed. There was a redirect with the same name on commons. I don't even know the process to delete those, so I nominated it for deletion and removed the redirect. Nihlus  15:47, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * So Wikipedia can't handle Commons having a redirect at the same name of one of our images? That seems like a pretty annoying bug. --B (talk) 16:51, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I just deleted it for you <b style="border:1px solid #dfdfdf;color:green; padding:1px 3px;background:#FFD">Ron h jones </b>(Talk) 23:34, 6 September 2018 (UTC)

Big uh-oh with uw-unsourced1
So I left a warning for a user here via Twinkle which identified me as DPL bot. I tested here on 's talk and it seems to have identified me as Bradv. I suspect this is just taking the last username of the last person to sign an edit on a talk page but I can see no changes to the warning template itself. So...help? CHRISSY MAD ❯❯❯  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯  15:36, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Yup, it's definitely taking the last username from the last same comment. See Bradv's test here. CHRISSY MAD  ❯❯❯  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯  15:42, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The template uses REVISIONUSER - I guess it's picking up the previous revision instead of the new one somehow? -- SarekOfVulcan (talk) 15:43, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * And I left a reciprocal warning for here and it identified me as the last person to edit her page. Is there a problem with  ?  Brad  v  15:43, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm not great with templates but I don't see any changes that are immediately obvious that would be messing this up. Seems like a kind of big issue... CHRISSY MAD  ❯❯❯  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯  15:44, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It's related to T203583 according to the discussion on Wikipedia talk:Twinkle stwalkerster (talk) 15:44, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Everyone, see T203583. Looks like it just got deployed to enwiki (thursday..) since at every fora this is being raised at the same time. I removed that subst:revisionuser from uw-vandalism1 and am working on removing from other templates.. Galobtter (pingó mió) 15:46, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Ok, I've removed uses of subst:REVISIONUSER from all templates listed at Template_messages/User_talk_namespace/Multi-level_templates, until the issue is resolved.. Galobtter (pingó mió) 16:18, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * ( WP:ITSTHURSDAY. --Izno (talk) 20:24, 6 September 2018 (UTC))


 * Just a note, this has been fixed. –Ammarpad (talk) 07:04, 7 September 2018 (UTC)

Panorama shots
I took a pano shot using an iPhone and uploaded the image to Facebook. Much to my surprise, FB has an auto feature that allows panning the pano, and you can do so using a mouse, touch, or tilting your iPhone or iPad while viewing. What are the chances of getting such a feature on WP? <span style="text-shadow:#F8F8FF 0.2em 0.2em 0.4em,#F4BBFF -0.2em -0.3em 0.6em,#BFFF00 0.8em 0.8em 0.6em;color:#A2006D">Atsme 📞📧 04:43, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , It reached 11th in last years community wishlist, so I'd say try again this year and it might have a shot. —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 07:49, 7 September 2018 (UTC)

Template changes do not take effect
Hello.

I just change a template, fixing two redirects: here.

But when I view the template, nothing appears to have changed. When I hover the mouse pointer over the links, they still show, and lead to, the redirects. The history shows the changes, but still no effect.

When I check "What links here" to the articles to which the redirects lead, it also show no changes; articles linked in the template still link to the redirect instead of the "real" article.

I tried clearing the cache by purging, but nothing happened.

What's wrong? Is there something wrong with my eyes?

HandsomeFella (talk) 09:06, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , fixed - there are multiple versions of the navbox, one when yes, one when it is set to no, one when it isn't set at all - and you only changed one Galobtter (pingó mió) 09:13, 7 September 2018 (UTC)


 * Ok, thanks. There was something wrong with my eyes after all. ;-) HandsomeFella (talk) 09:21, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The template had a very poor system where a huge part of the code had to be duplicated but wasn't always. I have changed it to avoid the duplication.[//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template:Hornbostel-Sachs&diff=858457085&oldid=858454257] PrimeHunter (talk) 09:55, 7 September 2018 (UTC)

accessdate v. access-date
It seems that templates like cite news no longer support the accessdate parameter. Instead of changing the parameter to the new one there is a genius bot running around removing accessdate content.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:40, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * No, it's still supported. The bot is only removing it from pages in this category because it's not needed there. –Ammarpad (talk) 05:58, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Sorry about the misunderstanding.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 12:24, 7 September 2018 (UTC)

Page patrolling
When I would click the "mark this page as patrolled" link on new pages, I would get the message " has been marked as patrolled". Now it get the message "This change to has been marked as patrolled". Is this to mean that every change to new articles has to be patrolled? <b style="color:#060">L293D</b> (<b style="color:#000">☎</b> • <b style="color:#000">✎</b>) 13:44, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * it looks like you are getting MediaWiki:Markedaspatrollednotify, we only "patrol" for "new pages" - not for each version (but other projects may) we could tweak that message a little, feel free to leave an edit request with proposed new text on its talk page. — xaosflux  Talk 14:08, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I was going to see if someone changed MediaWiki:Markedaspatrollednotify, but it apparently has no history. Is this normal? <b style="color:#060">L293D</b> (<b style="color:#000">☎</b> • <b style="color:#000">✎</b>) 14:12, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It is using "mediawiki default" so the change would be in the codebases, not here on a project - I think it may be related to work on T10697. — xaosflux  Talk 14:19, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Keep in mind we (enwiki) don't really use "patrol" we use "page triage" - but the interfaces share many components. — xaosflux  Talk 14:21, 7 September 2018 (UTC)

No edit conflict message
See, User_talk:Pkbwcgs, and User_talk:Evad37/XFDcloser.js. I opened Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2018 September 4 for editing, during which time two edits were made by XFDcloser, then when I saved, the edits by XFDcloser were overwritten by my edit, but no edit conflict message came up. SilkTork (talk) 14:11, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Judging by your edit summary, you edited the whole page instead of just the "September 4" section. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 19:34, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * My edit summary indicates I edited in the same manner as others on that page, including Galobtter who used XFDcloser, and whose edits my edit removed. While I do not have a 100% recall of the incident, I do remember following the instructions (Redirects_for_discussion} and clicking on the link offered, because I am not familiar with listing redirects for discussion. I do recall that the link delivered me to the appropriate section, and that at the time I started editing I was below the subtitle September 4, and above the 4-digit redirects entry. SilkTork (talk) 23:43, 6 September 2018 (UTC)


 * See below: "". An edit-merge formerly would combine edits when separated by another line. However, an edit by wp:VE visual editor would overwrite all intermediate edits since the VE session began. Perhaps run "Show changes" before saving a tedious edit, just in case the longer edit might not merge with nearby changes. -Wikid77 (talk) 23:15, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * In this instance I do recall that I used Show preview, because I recall that when I looked at my edit, there was an error of a missing " }} ~ " that I had presumably deleted after copying and pasting ~ from the instruction page, and then deleting the existing text section ("The action you would like...") in order to write my own text.  I do not recall if Galobtter's  XFDcloser edits where then present. SilkTork (talk) 23:43, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The visual editor does not overwrite intermediate changes. If it did, then I wouldn't have had to manually resolve a complicated edit conflict yesterday.  Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 17:47, 7 September 2018 (UTC)

Headers within tables fail on mobile
OK, I understand that placing section headings within tables is discouraged by some style guides, nevertheless it is a useful practice that exists at numerous articles. Examples: 2018 in spaceflight or List of Falcon 9 and Falcon Heavy launches. Our mobile browser (at least the iOS version) can't make sense of these tables, probably because it has a strict interpretation of what a section or subsection is. Could some kind soul point me to the appropriate people willing to discuss the issue and possibly craft a ticket to the relevant developer group? — JFG talk 23:43, 2 September 2018 (UTC)
 * You can fix the problem here simply by ending the table before each section. I'd advise that regardless, since there's not really a reason to have a contiguous table in these cases. The tables are being used as presentation tables rather than as data tables, so you can't sort them, which is the only reason you might want to keep the tables like this. --Izno (talk) 00:19, 3 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Please don't confuse the term heading with header. Headings are the lines of text that go at the top of pages, sections and subsections - in HTML these are constructed using <h1 ></h1> through <h6 ></h6>. Headers are the first row or column of a table - in HTML these are constructed using <th ></th>.

This is a heading

 * Header may also refer to boxes shown below headings, such as the box at the top of this page that contains the text "The technical section of the village pump is used to discuss ...". -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 08:08, 3 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the report JFG. And to the rest for the clarification. I filed a task for this one. I do agree that breaking up the tables per section would be a best practice, but I hope the engineers can take a look at this for us and ponder. CKoerner (WMF) (talk) 18:45, 7 September 2018 (UTC)

A little clean-up on the lede at Special:Tags
The lede there currently reads: This page lists the tags that the software may mark an edit or logged action with, and their meaning. See Tags. Administrators are able to perform different actions in respect to tags, including deleting some of them; please refer to the section on tag management in the documentation for indications.

Bringing over text from Tags and inserting links: This page lists tags automatically placed by the MediaWiki software to mark certain edits (or logged actions), together with their meaning.

Administrators are able to perform different actions with respect to tags, including deleting some of them; please refer to the section on tag management in the documentation for indications. Thoughts? Humanengr (talk) 14:42, 8 September 2018 (UTC)

Article with Class= completed, stuck in Unassessed category
Greetings, Article Talk:John Savage (soldier) has correct class=start. It remains in Category:Unassessed biography (military) articles. I have done "Purge" to both article & category. Added WP MIL HIST, added bannershell. Have now run out of ideas of how to fix, so I'm asking for help here. Regards, <span class="plainlinks" style="background: rgba(0,0,0,.05);">— JoeHebda • (talk) 17:15, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Solved - there was "Unassessed" category coded at bottom of article, which I removed. Cheers! <span class="plainlinks" style="background: rgba(0,0,0,.05);">— JoeHebda • (talk) 17:35, 8 September 2018 (UTC)

Number of Page Watchers
Page/History on any article or user page, generally will have an option about the number of watchers it has. That one feature has a tendency to come and go, and I've never figured out why. Firefox or Chrome, any skin, same thing. For instance, right now, it's missing. And, yet, it's working on Wikisource and Commons. Why does it keep appearing and disappearing on English Wikipedia? — Maile (talk) 16:58, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I was coming here to ask the same question. As Maile points out, it's missing from the list of "external tools" at the top of the page. Anyone know what gives - or who maintains it? --MelanieN (talk) 17:58, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * see below, and note it's not really an "external tool" at all. — xaosflux  Talk 18:47, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Each wiki can choose to add links in MediaWiki:Histlegend. There are no links by default. The message was edited yesterday [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=MediaWiki:Histlegend&diff=858481953&oldid=799756303] after a discussion on the talk page. The "Number of watchers" link was removed. It went to the same page as "Page information" under "Tools" in the left pane. This link is both on wiki, history and edit pages, and it has much other information than watchers. It's an internal page made automatically by MediaWiki so it was both misleading to list it under "External tools" and to only label it "Number of watchers", although it did use an anchor to highlight that field like [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Example&action=info#mw-pageinfo-watchers Example]. PrimeHunter (talk) 18:19, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you for the quick reply, but it looks like only English Wikipedia had it taken away (as far as we know). That page provides a lot of useful information  besides the number of watchers.  So, a handful of whoever gets to decide whether or not we get that option.  Geez Louize. Seems to me things like this should be universal and not subject to the whims of a few.  — Maile  (talk) 18:28, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * the default for "external tools" there is nothing - for example the history views on : ptwiki, dewiki, eswiki. The "number of watchers" is included in the "Page information" link on the sidebar of every page (for example, the link on the left column of this very page) that is available in every view, including history view.  If you want to discuss putting it back on MediaWiki:Histlegend (which only impacts the English Wikipedia) please drop a note and edit request at MediaWiki talk:Histlegend. —  xaosflux  Talk 18:45, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you. — Maile (talk) 18:47, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * (edit conflict) As I said, the page is already linked in the left pane with the more informative name "Page information", also when you view or edit the wiki page. The English Wikipedia decided to stop duplicating the link with another name at the top of history pages. Most wikis make fewer customized MediaWiki messages like MediaWiki:Histlegend than us and the link isn't in page histories by default (except in the left pane as always) so I guess most wikis have never shown the link at top of page histories. You can suggest to restore the duplication at MediaWiki talk:Histlegend. PrimeHunter (talk) 18:48, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you for helping us understand all this. — Maile (talk) 18:54, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you both. Glad to see it is still available. --MelanieN (talk) 19:51, 8 September 2018 (UTC)

script
Are any of you aware of a script that can automatically update all uses of a file after renaming the file? A similar script exist on commons for filemovers & admins but that doesn't work on wiki. আফতাবুজ্জামান (talk) 19:43, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * scripts are normally easy to port over, do you know where the script is? —  xaosflux  Talk 02:01, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Could be one of the abilities of Commons delinker - see c:User:CommonsDelinker/commands. Nthep (talk) 13:19, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * here (Move & Replace function). --আফতাবুজ্জামান (talk) 15:35, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * are you the maintainer for that gadget on commons? — xaosflux  Talk 01:14, 9 September 2018 (UTC)

Template problem
Please click [this] link. In that, how can I make "the civil war" in the next line? I mean the heading of that section?Adithyak1997 (talk) 03:12, 4 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Is this what you wanted to do, . Next time try to find a place to ask over at ml.wikipedia, as this message board is only for en.wikipedia. – Finnusertop (talk ⋅ contribs) 06:47, 4 September 2018 (UTC)
 * this technical village pump is not only for English Wikipedia, it is for all Wikipedias and by extension all WMF projects. The pool of the editors who can readily provide such technical help largely are based here and I am not aware of a rule that forbid people from smaller projects to seek technical help here. –Ammarpad (talk) 20:18, 4 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I disagree, this page in general is for the English Wikipedia. If you have a question about stuff on a different site, your best place to ask is at an equivalent on that site since people there are more likely to know that site's templates and other customizations. This page certainly isn't for general help with wikitext on any site anywhere. That said, questions about how to do make something work elsewhere that work here aren't necessarily out of place here. You're right that there's no rule against asking such questions here, but such questions are less likely to get much attention and I'd expect a backlash (possibly including the creation of such a rule) if there were a massive influx of such questions. Anomie⚔ 17:03, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It's good you acknowledge currently there's no rule against that kind of questions/requests, so the status quo reigns until when the community decides otherwise. Your use of the word "site" creates ambiguity, because it could mean all the 1.9b+ sites in the world, and I didn't mean that. Intentionally, in that stead I used "Wikipedias" and "WMF projects." These WMF wikis have been and will always be dependent on English Wikipedia for many things and don't have any complex templates or intricate customizations that are beyond the knowledge of people who frequent this page (incidentally, including You). In addition, a large number of them still use directly copy-pasted templates and codes from here English Wikipedia. In fact, if the template's problem cannot be fixed or identified here on enwiki I doubt if there's any other place in all WMF wikis where it'll be fixed. A quick search of the archives showed several requests of users from smaller WMF wikis and most of them were happily answered. I don't find deluge of meaningless questions or disruption in all the 22 sample requests that I examined dating back to 2008. So actually, I find it more undesirable to scare away editors requesting harmless technical help from smaller WMF wikis than the act of requesting the help itself. –Ammarpad (talk) 18:22, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Since this was an issue started from my side, I would like to say something. I am a wikipedia user who have started my account in 2016. I am trying to be active in my mother tongue malayalam as well as in English also. I don't have much interest in creating articles instead I am interested in removing backlog. In malayalam wikipedia, a total of 19 admins are present out of which only 9 are active. There is only 1 person(I guess) who used to deal with templates. But he is currently inactive. In such a case, I have started creating modules and templates. He as well as I have been importing modules as well as templates from english wikipedia only and doesn't know coding yet. In such a case, how do you think can our wikipedia move further without any edit in the backlog section and also without the help of this wikipedia?Adithyak1997 (talk) 05:07, 9 September 2018 (UTC)

Thumb attribute
I would like to know the usage of attribute thumb in case of images. Is it supported now-a-days in wikipedia?Adithyak1997 (talk) 05:11, 9 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It's used for most thumbnail images. See Extended image syntax for complete documentation. &#8213; Mandruss  &#9742;  06:02, 9 September 2018 (UTC)

Editnotices in 2017 wikitext editor and VisualEditor
In 2017 wikitext editor and VisualEditor, editnotices are displayed rather like pop-ups - they are shown and hidden using a toggle icon at the top of the edit-window. In the older wikitext editor, they were displayed above the edit-window, and IMO that's how they should be shown.

These pop-up-style editnotices are really annoying, as they open automatically when the editing interface loads, and need to closed the way you close an ad. Also, on pages with lots of editnotices, the lower ones are hidden and you need to scroll down within the element to see them.

Some confusing editnotices cause new editors to freak off due to the way they apppear - like warnings on doing something wrong.

The old way of showing editnotices was hence much better. Is there any software update planned that will fix this issue? SD0001 (talk) 11:20, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Confusing edit notices are tangential to your other comments here.
 * As for where edit notices show up, previews also require a much different workflow for WTE2017, which is frustrating to me. Page-related logs will also show up in that flyout, which is also crap, but it's better than what it was before (which was not at all). OTOH, if it requires you to close it, maybe it is a good thing--that way people are acknowledging that they have seen what is in the flyout (whether they understand the consequences of that action). That's a good thing, IMO, rather than the banner blindness which affects many still with the old editors. (Clicking through something without reading it is of course its own issue....) --Izno (talk) 13:19, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Esc closes the box with edit notices, and Ctrl (using your web browser's meta keys) opens the preview in the 2017WTE. Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 17:51, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I just discovered that clicking anywhere on the edit window dismisses the editnotice, you don't have to click on the close button. So that makes your point about getting people to acknowledge the notice moot. "Confusing edit notices are tangential to your other comments here." - huh? I was saying that confusing editnotices are less likely to be perceived by new editors as warnings if they show up above edit-window rather than as pop-ups. SD0001 (talk) 11:46, 9 September 2018 (UTC)

Do you have small tasks for new contributors? It's Google Code-in time again
Hi everybody! Google Code-in (GCI) will soon take place again - a seven week long contest for 13-17 year old students to contribute to free software projects. Tasks should take an experienced contributed about two-three hours and can be of the categories Code, Documentation/Training, Outreach/Research, Quality Assurance, and User Interface/Design. Do you have an idea for a task and could you imagine mentoring that task? For example, do you have something on mind that needs documentation, research, some gadget or template issues on your "To do" list but you never had the time, and can imagine enjoying mentoring such a task to help a new contributor? If yes, please check out Google Code-in/2018 and become a mentor! Thanks in advance! --AKlapper (WMF) (talk) 13:51, 9 September 2018 (UTC)

Special:Log
I expect this has already been mentioned, but I don't see where: There seems to be a problem with Special:Log, where the "From date (and earlier):" field is pre-filled with "0000-00-00". When I attempt any search, that spontaneously changes to "-0001-11-30", and thus inevitably yields no result. Is this affecting just me? Does this search yield any result for other users? Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 10:38, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I see it too. Created a bug report. —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 11:17, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I have already reported this at T201125, so T203782 has been merged as a duplicate. GeoffreyT2000 (talk) 01:34, 8 September 2018 (UTC)

Seems like an easy fix, both from server or user side. For developers, it is trivial enough to convert it to new date widget used in special:contributions (e.g. phabricator.wikimedia.org/T117737). Users can easily clear that initial text using js. Generally speaking though, it seems more like it is related to a browser issue. Internet explorer <=11 doesn't support the html5 date input, nor do older versions of safari or firefox. So the server shouldn't be setting the default date as 0000 ... 13:59, 9 September 2018 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 197.235.95.127 (talk)

Small typo fix altered other paragraphs
Beware: A glitch-edit, which altered several paragraphs when changing cite "date=" to "author=", has been reverted now in page "Lawyer Milloy" (former U.S. football player), but here is the large diff:. I had no idea all that text was being altered when I replaced cite "|date=" as "|author= Shipnuck, Alan" in revision 858386469 diff. The page has been fixed now, so this is just a log of a bizarre glitch-edit when changing 1 word on a page, as if edit-merge overwrote the entire page, not just the one line I had changed. I think all recent revisions were made via mobile phones (in "desktop" view?). -Wikid77 (talk) 22:11, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * You edited an old version, I suspect that you were on at the time that you clicked the "Edit" tab at the top, since  matches what you describe as your intent. The edit summary that you used has no section name in grey, which indicates that you edited the whole page and not a single section. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 10:52, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks. I maybe got a warning "lost session data" and when I did "Show preview" then perhaps edit-merge applied my entire edit-buffer against the latest revision, rather than merge changes relative to revision I had originally edited. Thanks for finding the old prior revision, and next time I see the warning ("lost session data"), I will consider "Show changes" for re-editing my update into the latest revision. -Wikid77 (talk) 21:12, 9 September 2018 (UTC)

Ordered description lists
I'd sometimes like to make a description list with numbers before each item (eg. at Future proof). This is possible with some simple css: {{syntaxhighlight|lang=css|code= dl {counter-reset: item1; } dt:before { counter-increment: item1; content: counter(item1) ". "; }} However, I don't see a way to add page-specific CSS to an article in Help:Cascading Style Sheets, and I can't use the style attribute for the before pseudo-class. I'm looking for feedback from others on the best way to pursue implementing this: Thoughts? Daask (talk) 22:17, 9 September 2018 (UTC)
 * 1) There is some way to add page-specific CSS to an article that I don't know about. (Wikipedia doesn't use mw:Extension:CSS, and mw:Help:Magic_words won't evade the fact that <style ></style> tags aren't allowed.)
 * 2) Add a new ordered-dl class with this formatting to MediaWiki:Common.css.
 * 3) Write a Lua module to wrap the definition list wiki markup, parse it, and add the appropriate numbers via CSS or directly in the HTML.
 * 4) An ordered description list is a bad idea and I shouldn't be doing this.
 * TemplateStyles. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 22:48, 9 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I don't quite fall into category 4, but I'm close to it: I don't see a reason for numbering here. It's not important for us to capture them as separate numbered concepts. Were it important, I would just mark each line item up as a normal ordered list, like so: "# First thing of interest: Explanation of concept." As for specific answers to each question:
 * There is WP:TemplateStyles, but I am not entirely sure this application is a good one for TemplateStyles, given what I suspect is a rare case (and which can be rewritten with the above in mind).
 * Probably not happening, mostly because we have TemplateStyles now. ;)
 * Could do this, but that seems like a lot of pain. And you'd want to do it in TemplateStyles anyway.
 * Yeah, pretty much this.
 * --Izno (talk) 22:49, 9 September 2018 (UTC)

Tech News: 2018-37
<section begin="technews-2018-W37"/> Latest tech news from the Wikimedia technical community. Please tell other users about these changes. Not all changes will affect you. Translations are available.

Recent changes
 * When you added or edited a template with the visual editor the input boxes were very big. This has been fixed. The input boxes will now be smaller until you click on them. Then they will change size to fit the text.

Problems
 * Some diffs showed lines in the wrong order. This was fixed last week.
 * Marking a cross-wiki notification as read didn't work every time. The other wiki was not updated. This has now been fixed.
 * did not work for a few days. This was because of a bug. This has now been fixed.
 * is used by some templates. For a period edits saved with  would save the previous user's name and not your username. This is now fixed. Edits made before the bug was fixed will still be wrong and need to be corrected.
 * When you move a page the title still shows the old page name. The developers are working on fixing this.

Changes later this week
 * Because of a data centre test you will be able to read but not edit the wikis for up to an hour on 12 September and 10 October. This will start at 14:00 (UTC). You might lose edits if you try to save during this time. The time when you can't edit might be shorter than an hour. You can read more about this.
 * Because of the data centre test there will be no new version of MediaWiki this week. Changes for this week will come next week instead.

Meetings
 * Octicons-sync.svg You can join the next meeting with the Editing team. During the meeting, you can tell developers which bugs you think are the most important. The meeting will be on 11 Septmber at 18:30 (UTC). See how to join.
 * Octicons-sync.svg Octicons-tools.svg You can join the technical advice meeting on IRC. During the meeting, volunteer developers can ask for advice. The meeting will be on 12 September at 15:00 (UTC). See how to join.

Future changes
 * The developers work on making the wikis work better on mobile phones. There is a list of common problems when making content easier to read in the mobile view. You can add things to the page and ask others to help.

Tech news prepared by Tech News writers and posted by bot • Contribute • Translate • Get help • Give feedback • Subscribe or unsubscribe. <section end="technews-2018-W37"/> 22:35, 10 September 2018 (UTC)

Very long infoboxes and mobile version - spoilers always expanded
I was looking at Galápagos tortoise with my phone. In the desktop version it looks fine but with the phone all the species and subspecies synonyms are expanded with no option to collapse them; the infobox is shown strictly before the main text (apart from the first paragraph) so you have to scroll past that to get to the main text. Information that hardly anyone will care about takes up 24 screens (counted on my phone). Is there a better solution for this? It was discussed on the talk page a while ago without conclusion. It could affect other articles as well. If there is no better way we could put the synonyms into the main article text then mobile users can hide it. --168.105.249.124 (talk) 03:49, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I think the WMF engineers are working on making collapsibility work on mobile right now. That aside, this is a case where it might be a good idea to add a section for the synonmyns and for the infobox to link to the section, instead of having 50-100 some odd list items all in the infobox (which look quite silly in desktop too!). --Izno (talk) 03:56, 11 September 2018 (UTC)

Smart way to determine if looking at an IP range?
Do we have a good way of determining if you're looking at the contributions for an IP range? Best I've got is splitting  on /, then checking   with   and   as being between 16-32 (ipv4) or 32-128 (ipv6). ~ Amory <small style="color:#555"> (u • t • c) 15:57, 9 September 2018 (UTC)


 * I'd avoid  entirely, at least. I'd use   to test being on a contributions page (the property is null on non-special pages, and   regardless of language on contribs pages) and   (with   as you've already identified) to check against being an IP. {&#123; Nihiltres &#8202;&#124;talk&#8202;&#124;edits}&#125; 22:55, 10 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Sorry, I should have been clearer — I meant a block of addresses, like 192.168.0.0/24.   isn't defined for a range, on Special:Contributions or elsewhere, and AFAICT   is the only bit on the page that has that information. ~  Amory <small style="color:#555"> (u • t • c) 23:46, 10 September 2018 (UTC)
 * My mistake. In that case, your approach seems fine, though I'd question if checking  is necessary; forward slashes are technically prohibited in usernames and an invalid range makes the page return a descriptive error message on its own. One more suggestion: we might add a clear identifier to MediaWiki:Sp-contributions-footer-anon-range, making things simpler from MediaWiki's end. {&#123; Nihiltres &#8202;&#124;talk&#8202;&#124;edits}&#125; 04:40, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * MediaWiki:Sp-contributions-footer-anon-range is great — the fmbox already has an  so that should be workable.  Nice catch, thanks! ~  Amory <small style="color:#555"> (u • t • c) 11:05, 11 September 2018 (UTC)

Text of tabs in MonoBook skin
If I view a talk page in MonoBook skin, and append  to the URL in order to view the interface message names, the tabs at the top of the page are shown as follows:
 * (nstab-main)(nstab-talk)(monobook-view-edit)(monobook-action-addsection)(monobook-view-history)(monobook-action-delete)(monobook-action-move)(monobook-action-protect)

This to me indicates that the messages should be found at: but all of these, except the first, are redlinks. Where do the messages really come from? In particular, the fourth one. I should be able to write " " in order to emit "new section", but instead I get "". -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 19:12, 4 September 2018 (UTC)
 * MediaWiki:nstab-main
 * MediaWiki:nstab-talk
 * MediaWiki:monobook-view-edit
 * MediaWiki:monobook-action-addsection
 * MediaWiki:monobook-view-history
 * MediaWiki:monobook-action-delete
 * MediaWiki:monobook-action-move
 * MediaWiki:monobook-action-protect
 * The "nstab" ones are special, (see T153867) and can use the associated MediaWiki:Main and MediaWiki:Talk messages; the others are even more special - they are in core and also appear linked to i18n, but they can be overwritten with local messages. See that first phab link for why int doesn't work here. —  xaosflux  Talk 19:43, 4 September 2018 (UTC)
 * In some cases there are multiple messages that can be used, starting with more-specific messages and falling back to more general messages if the specific message doesn't exist. The skin elements you've mentioned here work that way: the talk tab specifies MediaWiki:talk as a fallback after the namespace-specific message (MediaWiki:nstab-talk, MediaWiki:nstab-project_talk, etc.), the view history tab specifies the generic MediaWiki:history_short as a fallback for MediaWiki:monobook-view-history, and so on. I don't know of any way to determine these fallback chains besides finding the PHP code that generates the element. The fallback chains aren't a property of the messages themselves, which is why the  magic word can't fall back. Since the qqx language "defines" all messages, it shows only the first message in the chain. Anomie⚔ 17:17, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The problem that I'm trying to address here is one where I'm advising various users (there have been several) on how to use discussion pages. These users all have a common factor: they are starting new discussions on talk pages in a manner that is not advised by WP:TPG. They add their new posting either (i) at the very top, above the banners; (ii) below the banners but before the first section; (iii) in some random existing discussion part-way down the page (not necessarily at the bottom of that discussion); (iv) at the bottom of the page but without adding a new heading so that the new post appears to be part of an unrelated thread. What I want to do is describe the tab that they should be using to start a new discussion, unfortunately these users could have any skin selected (out of five or six), and any language set (out of well over 100). The language problem is normally sorted by using  but I know of no way for customising for skin. A few years ago (for a few years from mid-2010 on), we could assume that all newbies were using Vector; but with mobile devices on the increase. this is no longer the case. Not all are newbies: indeed, there are also a few long-standing admins (one I could name, but won't, has been an admin for longer than I've been registered, which is nine years) who start new threads by adding to the last existing section (I can tell by the grey part of the edit summary). Accordingly, I want to suggest the internationalised form for two or three of the more common skins - Vector, Monobook, MinervaNeue. So, I find the message names for a given skin by appending   (or whichever skin I wish to inspect) to the URL. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 20:23, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I think it's safe to omit MonoBook, as it is used by very few new editors. If you don't mind handling it manually, you can see from the tags on their contributions if they're using the Mobile Web site.  Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 20:07, 11 September 2018 (UTC)

template:better source not quoting arguments correctly in rendered HTML?
Take a look at Wormholes_in_fiction. I've got this template:

In the In literature section, under His Dark Materials. This was entered using the visual editor. The rendered HTML is:

<span title="&quot;The" about="">better source needed

which results in a tooltip of  when you mouse over it. Somebody's not handling the quotes properly. -- RoySmith (talk) 22:40, 10 September 2018 (UTC)


 * It looks like the problem should be in delink, which the parent metatemplate fix uses to sanitize tooltip text, but a quick test doesn't show that template messing things up on its own. I have a suspicion that this is caused by automatic HTML cleanup; that would suggest that a solution would be to migrate fix to Lua. Scribunto's HTML construction functions are basically always more reliable than writing conditional HTML properties in wikitext. {&#123; Nihiltres &#8202;&#124;talk&#8202;&#124;edits}&#125; 23:17, 10 September 2018 (UTC)

As you can see, we could get around the problem by wrapping the title text in {&#123; Nihiltres &#8202;&#124;talk&#8202;&#124;edits}&#125; 15:10, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Never mind; it's the obvious case of quote marks just not being escaped:
 * <span title="Foo bar baz">Example with no quotes
 * <span title="Foo "bar" baz">Example with quotes
 * <span title="Foo &#34;bar&#34; baz">Example with &amp;#34;
 * <span title="Foo &#34;bar" baz">Example with replace
 * <span title="Foo &#34;bar&#34; baz">Example with &amp;#34;
 * <span title="Foo &#34;bar" baz">Example with replace
 * <span title="Foo &#34;bar" baz">Example with replace
 * <span title="Foo &#34;bar" baz">Example with replace
 * Use single quotes. Much easier.  →  for which the HTML is   The simple expln is that the reason parameter is putr into a   attribute, with delimiting double quotes - hence the enclosed string cannot contain double quotes. Basic rule of HTML. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 18:29, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Doing a string replace of (normal) quotation marks with single quote marks instead of &amp;#34; sounds like it would work, and it's pretty elegant. Will it cause any unexpected side effects like the WP renderer attempting to insert italics if someone uses two quotation marks in a row? Humans screw up in so many creative ways. – Jonesey95 (talk) 19:00, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * You cannot have italics (or markup of any kind, including styling) in [//www.w3.org/TR/html5/dom.html#the-title-attribute a  attribute]. It's a plain text string which is not processed by the browser in any way. Some browsers use the attribute to generate a tooltip, but this must not be relied upon. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 20:24, 11 September 2018 (UTC)

Cross-page diff?
Is it possible to get a diff between two different pages? As far as I can tell, you can only diff between two revisions of the same page. The only workaround I can see is to copy-paste the two pages into my sandbox as two revisions, then diff those. -- RoySmith (talk) 20:11, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * That or Duplication Detector, if that's your goal. If not, then your idea's probably the best (unless there's some reason why you wouldn't want to do that).  Ian.thomson (talk) 20:14, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Actually, you can. Just get a regular diff link, and then get the revision ID of the other page and replace the appropriate ID in the URL. For example, https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Village_pump_(technical)&diff=859113461&oldid=859113462&diffmode=source — Preceding unsigned comment added by SarekOfVulcan (talk • contribs) 20:16, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Ah, cool. Thanks!  -- RoySmith (talk) 20:23, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Or one can use Special:ComparePages Galobtter (pingó mió) 20:25, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * This is what I would have suggested. It's how the edit protected template works for template comparison between live and sandbox. --Izno (talk) 21:08, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, when you make the query string for a diff and you provide the  and   parameters, the   parameter is ignored. This is why a mis-copied URL for a diff (such as where one digit of a parameter is omitted) can produce very odd results - compare [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Village_pump_(technical)&diff=859115088&oldid=859114935 this] (which is correct) with [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Village_pump_(technical)&diff=859115088&oldid=85911493 this] (which lacks the final 5). -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 20:30, 11 September 2018 (UTC)

Template doubt
My doubt is: In this template(called as ഫലകം in malayalam) why does ഫലകം:SHORTDESC appear in red line below the main heading even though the code has been pasted directly from English wikipedia?Adithyak1997 (talk) 03:14, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The SHORTDESC magic word is not enabled on the Malayalam Wikipedia, only the English Wikipedia. —&thinsp;JJMC89&thinsp; (T·C) 04:04, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * How can it be used in Malayalam wikipedia?I mean the place where it can be done.Adithyak1997 (talk) 08:39, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * That's . You've to made a request and if it's approved it'll be enabled. You can read how to made the request here. –Ammarpad (talk) 11:02, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Will there be any condition that the wikipedia has its permission to use it but I don't have access to it?Adithyak1997 (talk) 11:24, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I don't understand what you mean. If you need the to work on Malayalam Wikipedia, file a request at, that's the only place from where it can be enabled. That's it. –Ammarpad (talk) 13:28, 12 September 2018 (UTC)

On wikis other than the English Wikipedia, short descriptions are handled entirely by Wikidata. Earlier this year, there was community consensus on this wiki not to use short descriptions from Wikidata. Jc86035 (talk) 13:59, 12 September 2018 (UTC)

Separate section for categories
Right now for most pages, categories live under a "See also" section, or "References" section. It would be interesting to hear, what people think of possible separation of the categories from last "text" section. This can be now emulated using empty  (section header) as a section header for the separate section of categories. This way an [edit] link appears with empty <h2 ></h2> tag. —⁠andrybak (talk) 23:35, 10 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Why? --Izno (talk) 00:12, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , mainly to be able to easily distinguish (in History tab, Watchlist, etc) the changes to the text section (which just happens to be last=it includes the bottom of the page) and the changes to categories/navboxes/other content at the bottom of the page. —⁠andrybak (talk) 07:15, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Categories are in none of those places. They are in a clearly-outlined box at the bottom ([//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_(technical)?useskin=vector#catlinks Vector], [//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_(technical)?useskin=monobook#catlinks Monobook], [//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_(technical)?useskin=modern#catlinks Modern]); shepherded to the upper right ([//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_(technical)?useskin=cologneblue#catlinks Cologne Blue]) or into the sidebar ([//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_(technical)?useskin=timeless#p-normal-catlinks Timeless]); or just hidden outright ([//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_(technical)?useskin=minerva MinervaNeue]). A heading would be either superfluous or misleading. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 18:46, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , thank you for your reply. I'm sorry if my original question is confusing.  I mean the editing of categories and navboxes, not viewing them. For manual categorization, i.e. not by a template (gadgets, like HotCat and Cat-a-lot are also a bit relevant in this regard), the categories are gathered (usually) at the bottom of the page, meaning that if you want to edit them in a "edit section" mode (and not "edit whole page" mode), you need to click [edit] link for the last section on the page, which results in an edit summary which is only technically true. —⁠andrybak (talk) 19:10, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * That is not a VPT matter, it is something for Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Layout, being the talk page of MOS:LAYOUT. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 20:33, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The reason I'm asking here rather that on Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Layout is because I don't want the layout change which I described in my original message. I would like it to be a separate section created through some technical means. Like preamble is always the zeroth section, I would like to have the last section be a separate thing for categories and/or navboxes. —⁠andrybak (talk) 21:23, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * MOS:LAYOUT describes five optional appendices (Works, See also, References, Further reading, External links) and a number of optional footers, only one of which is the list of categories (although stub templates usually emit a category, sometimes two or even three). The categories need not be last: the recommended order has stub templates after the cats, and in the pre-Wikidata era we then followed the stubs with the interlanguage links (some pages still have them, because of inexact correspondence). However some people prefer to put the navboxes after the stubs (see Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Layout). How would the MediaWiki software know where to put this automatic heading? -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 08:22, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It sounds like User:Andrybak actually wants to have page metadata handled as proper metadata, in which case all of this would be easy: separate tracking in the watchlist, MediaWiki would know exactly where to stick it, etc.  Also, a missing colon in a wikitext interwiki link or when linking to a category wouldn't screw up everything.  There is more information at Requests for comment/Multi-Content Revisions.
 * (While I'm thinking about the differences between communities: This is a tech RFC, which is nothing like either a popular vote, or even an English Wikipedia RFC (although it's closer to the English Wikipedia's RFCs than to the German Wikipedia's).  Anyone should free to contribute relevant examples of specific things you like/dislike about the current or future systems, or particular technical details, but skip anything that sounds like an overall thumbs-up or thumbs-down.  So, for example, someone could say something like "One problem that I'm having with the current system is that category changes are hard to find in the watchlist, and I hope this project could improve that situation" or "I like the fact that right now, I can write an entire article offline, including adding categories, and I hope that this project wouldn't make that impossible".  Those are both actionable use cases:  for the first, someone might add "make it easier to identify category changes in the watchlist" to the project's list of requirements, and for the second, someone might find a way to let you add categories in the wikitext and then automagically convert them to the correct spot in the proposed database structure.  However, "I support this proposal" or "I oppose this proposal", even if followed by a reason, might be ignored or even be irritating.  A tech RFC is mostly about building a good solution for identified problems, instead of deciding whether people like it.)  Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 15:32, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Re-ping: User:Andrybak.  Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 15:33, 12 September 2018 (UTC)

Wikipedia:RefToolbar modification
Is it possible to change RefToolbar so that it can output a sfn template (or relative) along with the citation template, instead of solely the ref tags? Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 20:09, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
 * A couple of questions to clarify: do you want sfn as another template in the "Templates" menu, as another entry in the top-level menu (alongside "Error check"), or something else? And when you say along with the citation template, looking at the sfn docs, it doesn't look like sfn goes with another template. I don't use sfn at all, so should the new menu option add something else besides just the sfn template? Enterprisey (talk!) 07:41, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Currently the output of RefToolbar is basically  or  . I wonder if it's possible to make it do something like   instead. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 14:38, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * That seems like a rather strange usage. Normally (see ) the template goes inline, at a position where the <ref ></ref> pair would have been added, and the long-form  template goes in a section near the bottom of the article. They don't go together, although if properly used they do link together. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 22:52, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * No, that was just a typo. There was an additional "ref" tag that I didn't remove. Yes, the issue is that as is the RefToolbar has no good function for sfn users. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 07:16, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Now you have one unbalanced and one unbalanced . But that wasn't my point: the implication of your 14:38, 7 September 2018 (UTC) post is that you want to put the two separate components side-by-side, which is not how they are intended for use. See a recent TFA for an example of the proper usage of  in conjunction with  templates. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 12:32, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * OK, seems like I did write my post incorrectly. What I wanted to ask for is an output like . Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 12:45, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It won't work. The tool inserts its output at a single place in the edit window, but what you are asking for is the insertion of two templates simultaneously. The problem is that these are intended to be placed at different parts of the article, so somehow we would need all the browser vendors to modify their browsers to allow for a second text cursor and thus a second insertion point. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 15:58, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Huh. Generally when I use the ref toolbar I modify the output so that I can make a list, I don't simply insert the output and leave it. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 20:32, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Jo-Jo, it is possible that you are not entirely normal (in the best possible sense   ).
 * More seriously, few "normal" editors use sfn, and few "normal" editors modify the output from any of the citation filling tools (more's the pity). While this would be popular among a small group of editors who work in certain specific subject areas (e.g., history, but not any of the hard sciences), this is IMO not a feature that would be widely used, and if it were easy to enable, then I worry about people accidentally screwing up the ~99% of articles that don't use sfn templates.  WhatamIdoing (talk) 20:20, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * [citation needed] on that claim of "~99% of articles that don't use sfn templates". Are you including unreferenced articles, sub-stubs and pages that are barely above draft level? To gain a fair measure, we should be looking at the better articles. Let's take a quick check of the thirty articles that are on the TFA list for this month. Of these, the following use to a greater or lesser extent (some use it exclusively):
 * Avenue Range Station massacre (TFA 3 September 2018)
 * Metallurgical Laboratory (TFA 5 September 2018)
 * Vermont Sesquicentennial half dollar (TFA 9 September 2018)
 * D. Djajakusuma (TFA 10 September 2018)
 * Burke and Hare murders (TFA 11 September 2018)
 * Construction of Rockefeller Center (TFA 13 September 2018)
 * William McKinley (TFA 14 September 2018)
 * Bayern-class battleship (TFA 15 September 2018)
 * Thomas F. Bayard (TFA 16 September 2018)
 * Kate Sheppard (TFA 19 September 2018)
 * Guy Burgess (TFA 22 September 2018)
 * Red-billed tropicbird (TFA 23 September 2018)
 * From Russia, with Love (novel) (TFA 27 September 2018)
 * Jean Bolikango (TFA 30 September 2018)
 * So that's 14 out of 30, or %, using to a non-insignificant level. The other 16 use <ref ></ref> tags, in some cases to construct  using  tags or similar.
 * An FA "exemplifies our very best work and is distinguished by professional standards of writing, presentation, and sourcing". So it is clear that is not something to be dismissed. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 10:04, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I don't think it's a good idea to optimize a system that will be used in 100% of pages (NB: not just articles) for the 0.1% of articles (0.01% of pages) that are featured-class, either.  WhatamIdoing (talk) 17:45, 12 September 2018 (UTC)

Any problems if acdate is alias of accessdate?
I am thinking to enhance templates to accept "acdate=" where only "accessdate=" was allowed. I understand cite Bots would need to hunt alias "acdate=", but any other tech issues? About 10% of cite errors are misspellings as "access date=" for "access-date=" or one-ess "accesdate=" or one-cee "acessdate=" or triple-c "acccessdate=" or even "date accessed" (as if Italian "data accesso="). I think some 1-letter variants linger from Spanish versus Portuguese ("acceso" or "acesso"), and so I hope a transition to alias "acdate=" would reduce many errors in future years. Any other technical concerns? -Wikid77 (talk) 22:56, 9 September 2018 (UTC)
 * (1) Bad idea, we have far too many aliases in the templates as it is. (ii) Wrong page, requests for changes to those templates belong at Help talk:Citation Style 1. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 23:02, 9 September 2018 (UTC)
 * And (c) we should always prefer parameters that are intuitive. "acdate" is not. --Izno (talk) 23:08, 9 September 2018 (UTC)
 * And (IV), I think it's bad policy to accommodate editors who hit "Publish changes" and move on without checking their work. If an editor makes any of the errors listed in the OP, this is immediately and clearly apparent when they view the resulting citation. &#8213; Mandruss  &#9742;  03:37, 10 September 2018 (UTC)
 * While pretty much agreeing with the above objections, in the unlikely event that an alias is approved, something like "checkdate" would be more intuitive. 24.151.50.175 (talk) 16:04, 10 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Or "verify-date" .. access-date is basically in support of WP:V and emphasizing "verify" might nudge more verifications. -- Green  C  16:15, 10 September 2018 (UTC)

Bad idea per all above, and per previous discussion. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 18:17, 12 September 2018 (UTC)

Last reminder: read-only mode 14:00 UTC
Hi, the last (Village Pump) reminder for this: Because of a server test, to make sure we're prepared and can keep the wikis alive in case of a catastrophe, it won't be possible to edit the wikis for up to an hour, starting at (or slightly later than) 14:00 UTC. For more information, see Tech/Server switch 2018. /Johan (WMF) (talk) 12:15, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Sure would be nice to be able to dismiss the notice.--Bbb23 (talk) 13:34, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It's in "emergency" priority, so no dismissing for you! We could change it, but you know -- database locked :D —  xaosflux  Talk 13:46, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Checking "Suppress display of CentralNotices" in gadgets disables it Galobtter (pingó mió) 13:50, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Wouldn't that suppress all notices, e.g., some foolish editor has been nominated for RfA?--Bbb23 (talk) 14:37, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * no only "CentralNotices" from meta: (meta:Special:CentralNotice), not things like watchlist notices etc. And correction on my above, it's not that it was "emergency priority", just that a "close button" was not included. —  xaosflux  Talk 14:40, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Clearly a conspiracy to make me suffer. Even my shrink agrees with me (the bill for her services will be sent to the Foundation).--Bbb23 (talk) 15:11, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It looks like this took only 7.5 minutes, compared to the 20+ that we've seen in previous years. Last year, they were previosuly talking about a theoretical minimum time being around five minutes (because there are certain steps that have a built-in time delay for safety), so this may be the best we ever see in practice.  I'm impressed.  (Also, very glad that it all happened while I was still asleep.  ;-)  I haven't seen any reports of editing problems; feel free to ping me or Johan if there are problem reports elsewhere.  Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 18:40, 12 September 2018 (UTC)

Category:Wikipedia type:landmark page with obscure subdivision
Point Hicks is in Category:Wikipedia type:landmark page with obscure subdivision, but I can't work out why. Can anyone enlighten me? TIA. DH85868993 (talk) 04:46, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Related to 's recent edits to Module:ISO 3166, though I can't figure out exactly what is causing this since the code in that module itself doesn't appear to produce this category.. Galobtter (pingó mió) 05:06, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * If anyone has more time, I've replicated this in Special:PermaLink/859195974 (feel free to edit that sandbox) and expand templates is including that string twice:


 * [//tools.wmflabs.org/geohack/geohack.php?pagename=User:Xaosflux/sandbox65&params=37_48_11_S_149_16_32_E_region: <span class="geo-dms" title="Maps, aerial photos, and other data for this location"> 37°48′11″S 149°16′32″E  &#xfeff; / &#xfeff; <span class="geo-dec" title="Maps, aerial photos, and other data for this location">37.80306°S 149.27556°E &#xfeff; / -37.80306; 149.27556   ]  Coordinates: [//tools.wmflabs.org/geohack/geohack.php?pagename=User:Xaosflux/sandbox65&params=37_48_11_S_149_16_32_E_region: <span class="geo-dms" title="Maps, aerial photos, and other data for this location"> 37°48′11″S 149°16′32″E   &#xfeff; / &#xfeff; <span class="geo-dec" title="Maps, aerial photos, and other data for this location">37.80306°S 149.27556°E &#xfeff; / -37.80306; 149.27556   ]
 * — xaosflux  Talk 11:35, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Narrowing it down helped; the problem arises in Geobox2_coor, where the hidden category is passed to Module:Coordinates Galobtter (pingó mió) 11:54, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Note for anyone following, this is still broken. — xaosflux  Talk 15:22, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It looks like the page has a subdivision with a non ISO recognized subdivion, this putting it in that category. I did recently make a catroy called Category:pages with obscure subdivision and Category:Wikipedia type:landmark page with obscure country or subdivision exist. So suspect it's taking the input from Module:ISO 3166 and converting it to this category. I'm going to create the category page, as if this is the case if better to have it as it may get big if the subdivision are wrong. – BrandonXLF   (t@lk)  20:44, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Also, as this seams on topic, I'm wondering if I should make it so if the subdivision in Module:ISO 3166 is wrong it only displays the country and ignore the incorrect subdivision. Please ping me if you have any comments about the idea. – BrandonXLF   (t@lk)  20:47, 12 September 2018 (UTC)

is now adding GB data to Module:ISO 3166/data/National but it is generating damaging errors in articles that use it such as Snowdonia. Can someone else take a look at it as I’m out of reverts, and from past experience I know I won’t be able to persuade him to stop experimenting with live and widely used templates.-- JohnBlackburne words<sub style="margin-left:-2.0ex;">deeds 20:33, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The error are fixed. If there's a error please show me an example so I can fix the issue. I did testing in the sandbox, and I can't see any errors. – BrandonXLF   (t@lk)  20:34, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * See e.g. Punghina. With your rapid fire untested changes errors articles have been coming and going from the category Category:Pages with script errors, faster than I can check them.-- JohnBlackburne words<sub style="margin-left:-2.0ex;">deeds 20:58, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * This discussion doesn't seam relevant here, and the page Punghina has nothing to do with my recent edits. Can you move this to a more relevant talk page or make a new discussion here? – BrandonXLF   (t@lk)  21:25, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The error now seems fixed – it was in Module:ISO 3166 and arose after one of your changes so, yes, it had to do with your recent edits. In the recent ANI discussion it was recommended you test all edits using e.g. template sandbox pages and testcases, and seek consensus before making changes to existing templates. But here you are again, introducing untested/improperly tested changes to templates used on many thousands of pages, without seeking consensus or even explaining your changes.-- JohnBlackburne words<sub style="margin-left:-2.0ex;">deeds 21:55, 12 September 2018 (UTC)

How to disable redirects just for me
Is there a setting or user-script which would I could set to not follow redirects when clicking on links to them? &mdash; Frayæ (Talk/Spjall) 20:48, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * you can use this:


 * Lifted from Wikipedia talk:User scripts/Archive 6 by User:Evad37. — xaosflux  Talk 21:44, 12 September 2018 (UTC)


 * Thanks! &mdash; Frayæ (Talk/Spjall) 22:00, 12 September 2018 (UTC)

Please remind me why I have a read button on my menu
It's just to the left of the edit button. Vector skin. Doug Weller talk 13:19, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I've always figured it was for when you're editing or viewing the history and you decide "nah, I'd rather read it." It's redundant with the "article" or "project page" tab that's to the left of the "talk" button. Ian.thomson (talk) 13:30, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * it's not just you, a "read tab" is default in Vector. If you are in edit mode it may be a handy way to cancel editing and return to reading. — xaosflux  Talk 13:31, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * FWIW some people want to give "edit" precedence for display, see T119871 and T113157. — xaosflux  Talk 13:33, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It's not a button. It's a tab. There are several tabs and their selection is mutual exclusive (you cannot read and edit at the same time). —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 14:02, 12 September 2018 (UTC)


 * Thanks all. Damn, I know they are tabs, brain fart. I can't leave a page I'm editing without clicking on confirm, which is probably why it never made sense to me. 14:20, 13 September 2018 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Doug Weller (talk • contribs)

List modules that "require" a module
I've been looking at Lua modules on WP and I'm wondering how I can find out which modules call a particular module in their code. For example, how do I find out which modules require (if any at all) the List module? "What links here" doesn't appear to help. Thanks.—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 17:04, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , a search works for doing this Galobtter (pingó mió) 17:17, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
 * That looks good. Cheers!—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 17:25, 13 September 2018 (UTC)

Unclosed tags
There seems to have been a change made recently which is causing unclosed formatting tags to remain unclosed in the underlying HTML, instead of how it seems it used to work that the software would close these tags when it found them. The result is that there are many old discussions where, for example, someone didn't close a strikeout tag, and every bit of text below their comment is now struck out, making it difficult to read and follow. I've been editing archives where I find instances of these errors, but I can't edit an old revision. Can this be fixed? Ivanvector (Talk/Edits) 12:29, 13 September 2018 (UTC) PAGE ]]) 19:58, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
 * See this thread in the archives. There is a new replacement for Tidy, which used to hide / clean up bad markup. Some gnomes are working on fixing pages, but there are a few million errors, so it will take a while. – Jonesey95 (talk) 13:20, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
 * There is currently a BRFA running at Bots/Requests_for_approval/Galobot for a bot that will fix errors such as  instead of   (like on the page you linked), but for cases of simply missing end tags its best to just fix them as you find them since it's hard for a bot to judge intent. --Ahecht ([[User talk:Ahecht|<span style="color:#FFF;background:#04A;display:inline-block;padding:1px;vertical-align:-.3em;font:bold 50%/1 sans-serif;text-align:center">TALK
 * in regards to old revisions which appears to be the question by Ivanvector, probably somebody could code a JS script that could fix some of it, apart from that I don't think it can/would be fixed Galobtter (pingó mió) 20:05, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
 * If I get annoyed enough by this, I'm going to write a script where you can click on a location in the text to mark the proper end of a strikeout, without having to dig through many kilobytes worth of archive text. Enterprisey (talk!) 20:22, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Regarding old revisions, I'm also kind of okay with "you'll just have to live with it". At worst it's kind of annoying. Ivanvector (Talk/Edits) 20:37, 13 September 2018 (UTC)

I accidentally removed half my watchlist
Well, yeah, I tried to edit my raw watchlist to trim it a bit but I didn't notice only half of it was loaded. So when I clicked save, 3,000 pages were gone. Is there any way to restore them (aside from remembering the pages and manually readding them)? Regards So  Why  10:56, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately, that's not possible AFAIK. Only Developers can retrieve that kind of data. –Ammarpad (talk) 18:20, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , actually they can't either. Well, in theory some system administrators probably can, by opening the vault with the backups, but I don't think that has ever been done for something as small an issue like this. —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 21:17, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the replies. I'll then and take it as a sign to slim down my Watchlist. Regards  So  Why  06:06, 14 September 2018 (UTC)

Template:Pie chart appearance
See the discussion here. Thank you. --Hddty. (talk) 06:31, 14 September 2018 (UTC)

Thumbnail too dark?
We've got an image, File:Bell Relay Computer.png. It looks reasonably well exposed, if somewhat low contrast. I can see detail in the technician's white shirt, and even a little in his black shoes.

In Model V, we use that as a thumbnail. Here, the image looks highly underexposed. The technician is barely visible in the shadows. Is this loss of dynamic range an inevitable result of the size reduction? Is there anything that can be done to improve this? I can certainly download the image to my box, adjust things there, and upload a new copy, but I'm thinking more of something I can do within the wikimedia system. And something that will work across all image sizes. -- RoySmith (talk) 13:37, 14 September 2018 (UTC) PAGE ]]) 15:06, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Top image is 240px, bottom is 241px. I think this is T68337 . Galobtter (pingó mió) 14:00, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Actually T106516 seems to be it. Galobtter (pingó mió) 14:17, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It's really inexcusable that this bug has gone on for over three years without a fix. --Ahecht ([[User talk:Ahecht|<span style="color:#FFF;background:#04A;display:inline-block;padding:1px;vertical-align:-.3em;font:bold 50%/1 sans-serif;text-align:center">TALK
 * If you think that's bad; the company I last worked for left their private servers wide open to the internet for four years.  ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants   Tell me all about it.  19:08, 14 September 2018 (UTC)

Captcha?
Both my original posting and this simple edit in this thread required a captcha. Is that intended? I wasn't posting any external links, for example. (And I see that this new posting, too, is requiring one.)

(Please reply here, not to this IP address's talk page.) --76.69.47.228 (talk) 20:22, 14 September 2018 (UTC)

Regex editor trespassing
How do I get rid of this and put OhConfucius' Engvar B back please? Keith-264 (talk) 16:08, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * somewhat recently updated User:Ohconfucius/script/EngvarB.js and may be able to help here. — xaosflux  Talk 17:21, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks I've left a message. Keith-264 (talk) 17:59, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I don't understand why this is happening, nor can I offer an explanation at this point. However, I did manage to get the script buttons by importing my monobook script. Perhaps you can try doing that instead of importing the EngvarB script? Please note that you will get maybe five sets of Engvar script buttons. Not ideal, I know, but at least they appear. --  Ohc  ¡digame! 07:55, 15 September 2018 (UTC)

AWB
Is there any difference in operating WP:AWB and WP:PyAWB.-- PATH SLOPU (Talk) 16:23, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * this is one for you. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 14:56, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I doubt PyAWB even works, it's not been touched for 9 years. Reedy (talk) 22:04, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Can I use PyAWB instead of AWB. Please help.-- PATH SLOPU (Talk) 01:35, 14 September 2018 (UTC)

PAGE ]]) 17:07, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Try it, if it works, it works. If it doesn't, it doesn't. However, see the response above: this is pretty much outdated abandonware, and will most likely fail epically in several places, and make edits that no longer have consensus, or which are no longer valid. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 01:41, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your advice. Sir, I queried about this because I would like to use AWB for my bot. But I am using linux. I tried to install wine with software centre and get-apt. But I couldn't install it because of some technical problems. Is there any alternate way for that. Sir, please help. PATH SLOPU (Talk) 15:53, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Just so you know, you don't need to call people 'sir' or 'madam' or whatever every time you post somewhere. We're all equals here. Just call people by their username and talk to them normally. As for what to do with Wine or PyAWB, I suspect the best place to get advice would be at WT:AWB. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 16:58, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * You could try building your bot with Pywikibot instead. --Ahecht ([[User talk:Ahecht|<span style="color:#FFF;background:#04A;display:inline-block;padding:1px;vertical-align:-.3em;font:bold 50%/1 sans-serif;text-align:center">TALK
 * - FYI Bots/Requests for approval/Pathbot — fr&thinsp;<sup style="color:grey;">+  05:50, 15 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I placed my doubt in WT:AWB. I used pywikibot in earlier time. But I understood that AWB is more better than python for doing my bot's task to avoid mistakes. So I tried for AWB. PATH SLOPU (Talk) 09:12, 15 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Hi greetings, I added a request for using JWB for my bot in WP:PERM/AWB. Is it correct? Am I place the request in correct page? Kindly please help.-- PATH SLOPU (Talk) 12:11, 15 September 2018 (UTC)

Using the Search box and limit results to not include redirects
I'm trying to do a search using "intitle:", but I wish to only get actual article titles and not redirects. I tried searching for information at Help:Searching, but couldn't find any. Hope someone here can help me out. Thanks. --Gonnym (talk) 21:09, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * If you are searching for articles beginning with a specific string, you can look at this page which does appear to provide an option to hide redirects. I'm unsure if there's a corresponding page that handles titles containing a specific string.—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 21:30, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm trying to find titles using certain disambiguations. So "intitle" works for that, but then it just gives me all the redirects as well which defeat the purpose of my search. Prefix won't help here. --Gonnym (talk) 21:35, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I was having this problem also, likely for a similar reason. It would be very nice if I could discard results from redirects. I think phab:T73491 probably blocks any similar functionality. --Izno (talk) 22:39, 14 September 2018 (UTC)

There's a script SearchSuite by that can hide redirect results, and make various other improvements/adjustments to search result pages - Evad37 &#91;talk] 12:07, 15 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Amazing! Thank you very much! --Gonnym (talk) 12:17, 15 September 2018 (UTC)
 * You are welcome. :)  &mdash; The Transhumanist   12:25, 15 September 2018 (UTC)


 * From SearchSuite's documentation:


 * SR redirecteds


 * Turning this off doesn't just remove the notes that say "redirect from", it removes the entire entries that include those notes. It also removes entries of items from related categories, and the results that match subheadings.


 * Turning it back on, adds those items back onto the list.


 * This feature helps narrow search results down to the topic entered.


 * I hope you find it useful.  &mdash; The Transhumanist   12:25, 15 September 2018 (UTC)
 * So far it is. The way Wikipedia's system is set-up is mind blowing to me. Instead of creating a system where a title and a disambiguation are two separate entities, they are just another string in the system. This made searching for incorrect usages extremely hard. Thanks again for creating this! --Gonnym (talk) 12:30, 15 September 2018 (UTC)

G with a macron below
Hi, why doesn't the "Special characters" table (or the Latin extended set) in the editor have an underlined G? The template does produce something similar in G, but that is accomplished using CSS. Any alternatives? Thanks.—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 21:02, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Unicode doesn't have a precomposed character of G with a macron below. So you would have to use the combining diacritic, as in "G̱". Nardog (talk) 21:14, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you.—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 21:26, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * More at Macron below. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 20:00, 15 September 2018 (UTC)

Watchlist filter and Twinkle not loading in Chrome
I've experienced several issues in Chrome over the past week. I'm not experiencing these issues in other browsers (Edge and IE). --The1337gamer (talk) 09:52, 16 September 2018 (UTC)
 * 1) The watchlist filter does not load. Just gets stuck on the three loading dots permanently.
 * 2) Twinkle doesn't load when I open a article.
 * 3) I'm unable to open any collapsed navboxes. The "show" links are just not present.
 * It works for me. Google Chrome 69.0.3497.92, Windows 10, Vector. What is your skin at Special:Preferences? Does https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Watchlist?safemode=1 work? Do navboxes work if you log out? PrimeHunter (talk) 10:18, 16 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Also on Chrome 69.0.3497.92, Windows 10, Vector. Had to check the skin on Edge because I can't actually access Special:Preferences on Google Chrome since the tabs on Preferences don't load either when I select them. Watchlist filter is missing from that safe mode link and collapsed navboxes also don't work when I log out. --The1337gamer (talk) 10:35, 16 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It sounds like a browser problem with JavaScript. Does https://www.whatismybrowser.com/detect/is-javascript-enabled say JavaScript is enabled? Try to clear your entire cache. Does JavaScript work at other sites? Do you have Chrome extensions or security settings which may disable or cripple JavaScript at some sites? If you make tests at Wikipedia then I suggest being logged out. If navboxes work when logged out then you can test whether all is well when you log in. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:40, 16 September 2018 (UTC)
 * This happened to me and was caused by uBlock Origin. —&thinsp;JJMC89&thinsp; (T·C) 16:23, 16 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It seems it is the AdBlock extension on Chrome causing it for me. I've added Wikipedia to the whitelist filter and the issues are now resolved. Thanks for the help both of you. --The1337gamer (talk) 16:56, 16 September 2018 (UTC)

Wrong code in infoboxes for languages
Someone in WP:RD/L has reported that the infoboxes on the pages Dutch language, English language, German language, and Korean language all currently show the ISO 639-1 code for the respective languages as "hh". Since the "iso1" codes shown on each page are correct, this has to be a bug in whatever it is that " " invokes. Someone who understands this, please fix. --76.69.47.228 (talk) 09:17, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I just reverted this IP edit to ISO639-1. It has 224 transclusions which isn't a great deal but perhaps an admin would like to add some protection. Johnuniq (talk) 09:27, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks, John! --76.69.47.228 (talk) 20:19, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Airplaneman has protected the redirect against IP. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 00:17, 17 September 2018 (UTC)

Specific Inquiry about Data on Mathematics Portal
On the Portal:Mathematics page (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portal%3AMathematics), there is a claim that "There are approximately 31,444 mathematics articles on Wikipedia. I'm curious about how Wikipedians have gone about estimating this number. Can someone point me in the right direction to find the answer? I looked at WikiData, but did not find enough of a robust dataset that could support this high count reported on the Portal.

Any help would be greatly appreciated. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 001JakubSvec (talk • contribs) 04:12, 17 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I've removed the statement. The count hadn't been updated since 2015. —&thinsp;JJMC89&thinsp; (T·C) 04:34, 17 September 2018 (UTC)


 * JJMC89, thank you for the speedy update, but I was mostly curious about how Wikipedia determined that in the first place, even if it was in 2015 that it determined that statistic. -001JakubSvec  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 001JakubSvec (talk • contribs) 12:26, 17 September 2018 (UTC)
 * This example was kept at WikiProject Mathematics/Count. The page history [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:WikiProject_Mathematics/Count&action=history] shows it was updated by a bot until 16 June 2015‎. The edit summaries only said "daily update from wikilabs". Other examples have used counts of articles tagged by a WikiProject. WikiProject Mathematics uses Maths rating but it only has around 17,000 transclusions. Category:Mathematics articles by quality gives the same total. I don't know where the bot counted the extra articles. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:04, 17 September 2018 (UTC)

Oddity with navigation popups
This has been brought up at WP:ERRORS today. At Template:Did_you_know, the last hook of the day contains a link to Crime Does Not Pay (comics). If I hover over this link, the preview actually shows me the "Spinoffs" paragraph of the article, instead of the lede as you would expect. This happens in Firefox, Edge and Chrome. However, on all three of those browsers, if I log out, it works correctly. I am on Windows Home 10.0.17134. Black Kite (talk) 09:24, 17 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , does it work now? Works for me now after this which I think allows navpopups to detect the bold lead instead of skipping to the bold text in Crime_Does_Not_Pay_(comics) Galobtter (pingó mió) 09:36, 17 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Also, when you're logged out, Page_Previews is used which is different from Tools/Navigation_popups Galobtter (pingó mió) 09:39, 17 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Seems to be working for me now (I am the editor who first raised ths at ERRORS). Thanks all for the help. DuncanHill (talk) 13:39, 17 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, it works for me now as well, thanks. It's still a bug, though, isn't it? Black Kite (talk) 18:15, 17 September 2018 (UTC)

Tech News: 2018-38
<section begin="technews-2018-W38"/> Latest tech news from the Wikimedia technical community. Please tell other users about these changes. Not all changes will affect you. Translations are available.

Recent changes
 * The Wikimedia Commons mobile app has a new version. Images uploaded using Nearby are now automatically added to the associated Wikidata item. You can browse other images on Commons. You can see your achievements and your upload statistics. It has also fixed some bugs.
 * Octicons-tools.svg MediaWiki web requests now have a time limit of 60 seconds for GET requests and 200 seconds for POST requests.

Problems
 * You could not see the menu on the notifications page on the mobile version. This has now been fixed.

Changes later this week
 * Special:AncientPages can hide disambiguation pages.
 * Octicons-sync.svg The new version of MediaWiki will be on test wikis and MediaWiki.org from 18 September. It will be on non-Wikipedia wikis and some Wikipedias from 19 September. It will be on all wikis from 20 September (calendar).

Meetings
 * Octicons-sync.svg Octicons-tools.svg You can join the technical advice meeting on IRC. During the meeting, volunteer developers can ask for advice. The meeting will be on 19 September at 15:00 (UTC). See how to join.

Future changes
 * The developers are testing new mobile web navigation. You can use it and give feedback.

Tech news prepared by Tech News writers and posted by bot • Contribute • Translate • Get help • Give feedback • Subscribe or unsubscribe. <section end="technews-2018-W38"/> 21:57, 17 September 2018 (UTC)

Feedback wanted on mobile web contribution prototype
The Readers web team is working on improving the contribution features on the mobile website. The team is working on showing pages that are currently unavailable on mobile. We are starting by designing improvements to the mobile navigation. We want your feedback on the latest navigation prototype.

Earlier this year, we collected feedback on a previous version of our mobile navigation design in a set of 30 interviews at Wikimania. We worked with the results of the interviews and now have a new version of our prototype.

We would like your feedback on the latest version! In particular, we are curious for your thoughts on the layout of the mobile navigation as well as on the larger number of links available. We appreciate any and all comments.

Right now, we’re researching the navigation for the new feature set. We want to focus on making it feel more familiar and useful for contributors than the current mobile menu. We want it to include pages that contributors are likely to navigate to and will find useful. Please visit the project page and try out the demo on your mobile device. Then help answer a few questions about your experience.

CKoerner (WMF) (talk) 15:34, 18 September 2018 (UTC)

IAdmin access request for User:Pharos
A request for Interface administrator access under the stop-gap process for User:Pharos is currently open at Wikipedia_talk:Interface_administrators. Community commentary on the request is welcome at that page. Best regards, — xaosflux  Talk 18:05, 18 September 2018 (UTC)

Prefs change
OOUI continues its march; see https://en.wikipedia.beta.wmflabs.org/wiki/Special:Preferences for the latest. AFAICT some of the sections look just about the same, and some (especially the first) are more obviously different. Remember that the content isn't changing; it's just things like the size of the buttons and the color of the tabs.

Also, there's at least one feature that's likely to be useful: You can now give people a link to the relevant sub-section, not just the tab. This means that the WP:AFD instructions can be updated to tell people to go to "https://en.wikipedia.beta.wmflabs.org/wiki/Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-gadgets-browsing" to turn on Twinkle (for example), rather than just to the gadgets tab, and then to scroll around until you find it. Later, that team is hoping to change things so that individual items (e.g., the Twinkle button itself) can be linked and highlighted. So there's some good news here. Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 21:06, 18 September 2018 (UTC)
 * You can also test this locally at Special:Preferences and tacking ?ooui=1 to the end of the URL. --Izno (talk) 21:42, 18 September 2018 (UTC)

A technical request
Is there a way to find instances of infobox song where certain fields are not filled in? I sometimes find instances where at least one of the genre, label, writer, or producer is not filled in, and would like to work on filling those in where possible, as I just did on Jump Around. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 23:38, 18 September 2018 (UTC)
 * There's an external tool or two lying around which list parameters which are unused, but I don't know if unused in specific templates... You could use AWB, search for "hastemplate:infobox song", and then set it to skip when it detects | *paraname *= *.* or something like that. --Izno (talk) 23:53, 18 September 2018 (UTC)
 * If those are required (or very nice to have) parameters, it might be worth it to add a tracking category for parameters that are missing. For an example of such a category, see . If you need help, post on the template's talk page and ping me. I'll stop by. – Jonesey95 (talk) 09:19, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , see templates with missing genre and missing writer. One can't find instances missing the other two parameters using this tool because they aren't set as "suggested" parameters in the WP:TemplateData for infobox song (though one could change that and it'll come in next month's report) Galobtter (pingó mió) 09:31, 19 September 2018 (UTC)

Watchlist updating itself
If this a new feature? If so, why was it implemented? I don't want my watchlist updating itself, especially when I'm in the process of catching up on my watchlist. It's annoying having to find the spot I was at time and again. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 23:12, 18 September 2018 (UTC)
 * This could be one of two things:
 * There was a gadget or user script lying around which implemented this. Verify you aren't loading one of those.
 * This is part of the recent (a few months ago) watchlist improvements. You can verify those are turned on if there is no checkmark at Special:Preferences. Either a) you can opt out there entirely for all improvements or b) you can go to the watchlist itself, find the button that says "Live updates", and press it, such that a triangle ("play") displays after, rather than a square ("stop").
 * --Izno (talk) 23:29, 18 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks, Izno. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 00:14, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Flyer, there's a button right above the first date/item. It says "Live updates".  If it's selected/dark blue, then un-select it.  Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 17:22, 19 September 2018 (UTC)

Copying on tablets and smartphones
There’s an unresolved issue about copying content on devices such as tablets (iPads and etc) we need an extension that lets us copy all the content of a page at once without having to scroll through each line for copying, for example you have to sell yourself to Satan to copy a page like this on a tablet, and to people like myself who contribute mostly using tablets, this is annoying as heck. It would be really cool if we had some sort of “select and copy all” tool, developed either by a user or Wikimedia.--&#9656; ‎<b style="color:purple;font-size:13px;display:inline-block;border:1px solid purple">épine</b> <b style="color:black;font-size:11px">talk</b> &#9836; 08:48, 17 September 2018 (UTC)
 * are you using the app/mobile view/desktop view/etc? If not using the app, are you only having this issue with certain browsers? —  xaosflux  Talk 16:15, 17 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I’m using desktop mode on an iPad, Safari browser. I rarely edit using the wiki app. The browser is not an issue, the way the apple products are designed to copy content is. This issue can be easily resolved with a small and quick tool that can either be developed by a user or the wikimedia foundation. I don’t know why this issue keeps getting overlooked.--&#9656; ‎<b style="color:purple;font-size:13px;display:inline-block;border:1px solid purple">épine</b> <b style="color:black;font-size:11px">talk</b> &#9836; 18:36, 17 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The Editing team has been talking about some problems with mobile editing. Épine, would you mind leaving a note at mw:Talk:Mobile editing using the visual editor report about this?  It's not strictly on topic, but I think it'll be the best way to make sure that everyone on the team sees it.  Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 17:38, 18 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I don’t think it’s appropriate to address this issue there. I think they’re talking about the visual editor which I never use, I only use source editor. If you can address it on my behalf I would appreciate it.--&#9656; ‎<b style="color:purple;font-size:13px;display:inline-block;border:1px solid purple">épine</b> <b style="color:black;font-size:11px">talk</b> &#9836; 18:55, 18 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Épine, at the moment, they're mostly talking about basic problems with using mobile devices, including copying and pasting, so I'm sure they'd be interested. (Presumably Safari's copying/pasting system is the same on all of the editing tools on Wikipedia.)  I can certainly talk to them for you, if that's what you prefer.  Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 21:01, 18 September 2018 (UTC)
 * you have a higher chance of being listened to (made some other requests that are left unanswered for some reason) so please do so and warn them about this issue. On PC you can just ctl+a and select everything while on tablets on phones you can’t execute an action like that. Note that copying from protected pages is even worse. Thank you.—&#9656; ‎<b style="color:purple;font-size:13px;display:inline-block;border:1px solid purple">épine</b> <b style="color:black;font-size:11px">talk</b> &#9836; 22:15, 18 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I've started with a note on that page. I pinged you, so you can make sure that I accurately described the problem.  I also pinged Jess, the team's new designer.  I think she'll be particularly interested in this problem.  Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 17:48, 19 September 2018 (UTC)

Sortable side-scrolling table
Hello there: on the suggestion of Waldir, I wish to ask here if anyone can add the ability to sort in Scrolling table? I think adding such functionality may be useful for tables like the one at Škoda Auto § Sales and markets, as well as more sophisticated examples that I not know of yet at this time. Best, --Marianian(talk) 17:27, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * You should now be able to set sortable to any value to add sortability. --Izno (talk) 20:29, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Hi, I think it takes more than adding the parameter to Scrolling table/top. I tested it and I cannot see the functionality to sort the values. For the record, using Firefox 62.0. Best, --Marianian(talk) 21:48, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * So I just took a second look, and what you're requesting cannot be done with the way the templates are implemented. The general point I'm going to make is that the table is fake -- it might look like a single table, but it is actually two tables. I'm half tempted to send the templates to TFD because a) they are not widely used and b) should not be used at all, as I would guess they are inaccessible. --Izno (talk) 22:07, 19 September 2018 (UTC)

How to permanently and globally disable mobile wikitext editor without disabling mobile wiki skin.
Reposting from helpdesk according to suggestion

I have repeatedly encountered the problem and tried to searched and asked for solution but still can't find anything that can help me.

On mobile devices, due to the limited amount of memory, it's easy for browser tabs to be clear out of memory when user opened too much other tabs to look for information when from other sites.

Normally, when browser reload those tabs when user switch into the tab after the tab being cleared out if the memory, it would still be possible for original text in editor field to be loaded back.

However, since that wikitext mobile editor was dynamically pulled in the page, this browser text field recovery process could not work, and thus hours and hours of edits that would have been made via mobile browsers have all go into vain thanks to that completely counterproductive design.

How to permanently disable that?

C933103 (talk) 03:08, 6 September 2018 (UTC)


 * C933103, which of the multiple mobile-editing systems is being used here? Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 17:59, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The one with "#/editor/0" appear in URL when used. C933103 (talk) 18:02, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * C933103, I asked a couple of tech folks about this, and I have sort of bad news and maybe-okay news. There doesn't seem to be a way to change the browser behavior.  The default at "#/editor/0" is the Javascript-based mobile wikitext editor, and there's no way to stop the browser from clearing out the memory, nor is there any autosave.   (The original text in the editing window is only auto-reloaded by some browsers, some times, usually on desktop.)  However – and this is the maybe-okay news – if you can switch to the mobile visual editor, then you'll get a built-in autosave feature which would usually save your work in such cases (although it's not guaranteed).  Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 15:07, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * So that mean I can switch the editor, but I can only switch it to the mobile visual one instead of the traditional desktop one? If editor switching is already possible, can I request the feature pf switching it to the traditional mobile one? 221.127.109.116 (talk) 16:16, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * If the URL says "#/editor/0" at the end, then you aren't using "the traditional desktop one" (of which there are about four, depending upon how you count them, plus multiple other "non-traditional" editors). If you are on the mobile website, regardless of device, then you have only three options for editing:
 * The "traditional" (but not the "original") mobile wikitext editor (You are using this if Javascript is enabled in your browser, and you see wikitext.)
 * An empty HTML box, aka the 2003 wikitext editor (Javascript is disabled. You will see wikitext but no toolbar or buttons.)
 * The visual editor (This is the only option that doesn't show wikitext codes. It is also the only option that has a built-in auto-save feature.)
 * You can already switch between all of the three available options. Unfortunately, what nobody can do right now is:
 * make any of the visual editor's built-in features (its citation filling tool, its auto-save feature, etc.) appear in any of the other editing environments (and vice versa), or
 * make the web browser on your phone auto-save lost work in the same way that the web browser on your laptop auto-saves lost work. Note this key detail:  If you accidentally close a tab in Chrome or Firefox on your Windows laptop, and your changes are restored when you re-open the tab, that recovery is being done directly by Chrome or Firefox on your laptop – not by anything Wikipedia controls.  So far, it appears that the makers of mobile web browsers have not chosen to provide a similar feature on mobile browsers.  You'd have to contact the makers of UC Browser, Opera, Firefox, etc., and ask them to build that (and then it would work for all websites).
 * Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 18:33, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I mean, do you know how can I switch from using "#/editor/0" by default, into using "?action=edit&section=0" by default? Or alternatively, how can I change to use the "2003 wikitext editor" you described while still staying in the mobile skin when reading? I can't find where can I make such a switch option. C933103 (talk) 21:32, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
 * C933103, sorry for the late reply. I don't think that you can switch the URL.  You get the 2003 WTE by turning off Javascript in your web browser, but (a) you might not like the results, since lots of pages will look worse and most tools will disappear, and (b) I don't think it would solve your actual problem.
 * Your actual problem is that your web browser is running out of memory and, as a result, actively throwing away your unsaved changes. Since the problem is "browser out of memory, throwing away all the changes", then it seems to me that it is unlikely that you will, even in the 2003 WTE, get "browser out of memory, throwing away all the changes – also, saving those changes in memory, just case he re-opens this tab".  The reason that a desktop web browser (sometimes) saves your changes when you accidentally close a tab is because your desktop browser is not running out of memory, so it has a place to save those.  If your mobile web browser had memory to save it, it wouldn't have thrown it away in the first place.  But it has no memory to spare, so it throws away your changes permanently, with no hope of recovery.
 * I don't think that there is any change you can make on Wikipedia that will stop your web browser from actively throwing away your changes on Wikipedia when it runs out of memory. If you need Wikipedia to save your changes, so that they can (usually) be recovered when your web browser throws them away (or crashes), then that feature is only available in VisualEditor.  If you want your web browser to save your changes (or just to stop removing them), then you need to upgrade your mobile device, to something with a lot more memory.  In the meantime, it might be a good idea to "Save Early, Save Often".  Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 17:25, 18 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Except I do get my text back if I use the desktop editor and then page get purged due to lack of memory. The reaso is that mobile browser also have something like cache memory that's stored within devices' storage instead of RAM. So, the no-js editor is actually helpful too, but I don't want to disable js for my entire browser just tp use this particular old edit tool. How can I get that no-js editor via setting? Or should I request the implementation of such feature that would allow user to manually switch between different editors?C933103 (talk) 18:56, 18 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Have you tried switching to that editing environment in Special:Preferences, and seeing whether that carries over to the mobile editing environment? Editor probably has the necessary details, but you need to turn off the 2017WTE in Beta Features, turn off the 2010 ("enhanced") toolbar, **and** turn off the 2006 toolbar.  Each newer system secretly overrides all older ones.  (What a confusing mess.  We need to fix this, so you can just pick the one you want, all on the same page.)
 * If that doesn't work, then you might have to disable Javascript in your mobile web browser. (It should be sufficient to do that just for the en.m.wikipedia.org domain, if there's some sort of add-on.)  Also, before you do that, please look at T192018.  It appears that you won't be able to edit the introduction of any article on the mobile site with Javascript disabled.  Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 17:36, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I have tried turning off both the 2007/2010/2006 editors but they only affect the desktop editing environment and the mobile editing environment is still the 2013 one without changes. And I don't want to turn off javascript for the entire browser just for a single site and Chrome Android browser support turning off js for individual site nor support plugin (Strangely it support turning on js just for a few site while blocking all other sites from using js). And no, it seems like I can edit lead section using the js-less editor. C933103 (talk) 02:41, 20 September 2018 (UTC)

Is tools.wmflabs down?
Greetings, for several days now when attempting to run  tools.wmflabs.org/enwp10/cgi-bin/update.fcgi  and getting "504 Gateway Time-out" instead. Not sure who to contact so I thought to start here at VPT. Regards, <span class="plainlinks" style="background: rgba(0,0,0,.05);">— JoeHebda • (talk) 13:25, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * is a platform for developers to host their programs. So no, not all the tools.wmflabs.org platform is down, only the enwp10 tool :)
 * , project maintainers of https://tools.wmflabs.org/enwp10 tool. --Framawiki (please notify) (talk) 16:42, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I reported at Phabricator, open task T204844 is "504 Gateway Time-out on enwp10 tool". <span class="plainlinks" style="background: rgba(0,0,0,.05);">— JoeHebda • (talk) 16:45, 19 September 2018 (UTC)


 * Pings to maintainers:, , and . — xaosflux  Talk 17:12, 19 September 2018 (UTC)

--

I have restarted the Web service manually and it is back. Kelson (talk) 10:06, 20 September 2018 (UTC)

Strike tag odd behaviour
I've been cleaning out some mis-matched tags in old WP:FAC nomination pages, and ran into an odd situation, which I've reproduced in this sandbox. The closing tag does not work there. Is there a non-printing character stuck in there somewhere that is screwing up the parsing? The original page which has the problem is here, now fixed with this edit, though I don't know why that worked. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 10:52, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * This is expected behavior according to the lengthy discussion on T199057. I'd just skip to Matma's comment at phab:T199057. --Izno (talk) 12:26, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * That's a surprise, but I see why they declined it. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 13:46, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I see a glaring problem at Featured article candidates/Banded sugar ant/archive1: there are some bad violations of WP:INDENTGAP which might aggravate that problem described at phab:. But regardless of that, there are a number of cases where <s ></s> is used to enclose a list, which is not valid - lists are [//www.w3.org/TR/html5/dom.html#flow-content-2 flow content], and <s ></s> may only enclose [//www.w3.org/TR/html5/dom.html#phrasing-content-2 phrasing content]. Markup like this is valid:  but markup like this   is invalid for the reason that I just described. Even worse is   since the absence of a newline before the  tag means that it is inside a list item, whereas the matching opening tag is not just outside the item, it is outside the whole list which is a nesting error. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 20:58, 20 September 2018 (UTC)

Problems with Template:Hidden begin/Template:Hidden end and sortable headers in collapsible tables.
EDIT: The problem appears to have resolved itself, at least on my end, although User:Woodlot was able to confirm it for me earlier. I'm going to strike this comment. Here's the [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Village_pump_(technical)&oldid=860467267#Problems_with_Template:Hidden_begin/Template:Hidden_end_and_sortable_headers_in_collapsible_tables. unstruck] version for readability. Hi, I'm going to paste here what I wrote on User:Woodlot's talk page about a technical problem I found with the use of Template:Hidden begin and Template:Hidden end: On Webkit/Blink browsers (tested in Safari and Chrome and Mac OS X, and Chrome on Windows), if Template:Hidden begin and Template:Hidden end are on the page, all of the sortable column headers in other collapsible tables on the page disappear. For a comparison, see the Santa Barbara County voter registration tables before and after the templates were added. The same thing happens on Contra Costa County, Sacramento County , etc.

The tables render normally in Firefox on OSX and Edge on Windows (the only other browsers I tested). I’ve checked the diffs and nothing changes in the tables themselves. It’s also worth noting that this is not restricted to tables in the same section, and it affects tables both above and below the templates. See the "Crime" sections of the linked comparisons for the same effect. Some additional information: When I checked my comparison links in Chrome (I primarily use Safari), I opened the “before” links first, and the “after” pages then appeared to render properly. I believe this is due to some rather aggressive caching on Chrome's part. To see what the revision actually looks like be sure to bypass the cache.

I'm sorry I don't have more information on this. User:Woodlot suggested I post it here – as you can no doubt see by my lack of an account, I don't spend much time behind the scenes on Wikipedia. I prefer to just make small copyedits and formatting fixes. Still, hopefully this information can be of some use. 50.1.108.138 (talk) 21:08, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Collapsibility should be removed in main space per MOS:COLLAPSE. --Izno (talk) 21:22, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm aware of that (in fact I mentioned it in my linked comment on Woodlot's talk page). I wasn't the one making the edits. However, it seems that all of the editors on those county pages and similar articles are either unaware of that part of the MOS or are certain that the collapsible content is excepted. Regardless, the technical problem remains. It's too big for me to fix myself – I've no idea how many articles have the problem, and I'm not comfortable using scripts to make bulk edits.


 * Anyway, it may be a moot point since I've just checked the live examples again and they seem to be working. The behavior has been too inconsistent for me to really find a reduced test case. User:Woodlot was able to confirm the same behavior when they replied to me before, but now I can't replicate it. I'm going to strike my above comment for now. 50.1.108.138 (talk) 22:03, 20 September 2018 (UTC)

Broken template
Something is causing the template to be broken. See Articles for deletion/Jean-Philippe Susilovic, where the is displayed as User:. PS please ping me if this is replied. I'm not watching this page. I have also posted at Template_talk:User_link but redirected replies here. --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 20:24, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Fixed. Ruslik_ Zero 20:27, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , erm still not working https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia%3AArticles_for_deletion%2FJean-Philippe_Susilovic&type=revision&diff=860316837&oldid=860316800 --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 20:45, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I don't think that is the best way of doing it, although it does work in certain circumstances. A better way would be to explicitly number the parameter, as in  . -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 20:48, 19 September 2018 (UTC)

Pinging as his widget uses this template. --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 20:46, 19 September 2018 (UTC) PAGE ]]) 16:24, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The explanation of the original problem is that since 's login name contains an equals sign, whenever it is used in what is intended to be a positional parameter of a template, it is instead treated as a named parameter - the name being  and the value being  . -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 20:48, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * You can always contact me by using User:7&6-thirteen. <b style="color:#060">7&amp;6=thirteen</b> (<b style="color:#000">☎</b>) 20:51, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , thanks. Yeah I was trying to ping you.  Plus Enterprisey's reply gadget uses that template. --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 20:54, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * no we can't. User=7&6-thirteen is a redlink to a non-existent article. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 21:13, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , is there a possible fix to the bug for users with "=" in their name? Also maybe user:Enterprisey can fix his reply gadget to use the 1= template to make it more resilient. --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 20:52, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * One can make reply-link do that by setting replyLinkPreloadPingTpl to ", " . Not sure if i'd want "1=" everywhere for the very rare cases of breakage.. Galobtter (pingó mió) 20:56, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * There is no possible fix, other than the 1 method that I already described, because there is no bug. It is a design feature of the MediaWiki template parser that in every template, every parameter that contains an equals sign is interpreted as a named parameter. See H:T. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 21:18, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , ah right. I guess the only fix is probably a rename but I doubt 7&6 would want to do that. --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 22:19, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * There is a possible workaround in the template; if implemented in Lua the template could automatically interpret unrecognized parameters as usernames containing equals; something like  would let usernames containing equals be "escaped" automatically. {&#123; Nihiltres &#8202;&#124;talk&#8202;&#124;edits}&#125; 13:57, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Other than checking to see if the user page exists (which only works if the user has a user page, which is not a given), how would the lua script interpret ? Is it User:1=one or User:one ? --Ahecht ([[User talk:Ahecht|<span style="color:#FFF;background:#04A;display:inline-block;padding:1px;vertical-align:-.3em;font:bold 50%/1 sans-serif;text-align:center">TALK
 * It would handle your example as " User:one "; the logic  I mentioned checks for any non-numerical characters (" ") before the equals sign; normally those are "lost" as unrecognized parameters, but the example code would recapture those cases. A user " User:1=one " would still be a problem; there's no safe way of checking one that would match a purely-numeric named parameter. I'd recommend such users either a) be renamed or b) included as narrow special cases, where (b) only applies if they register the conflicting account themselves to ensure it isn't used. {&#123; Nihiltres &#8202;&#124;talk&#8202;&#124;edits}&#125; 17:18, 20 September 2018 (UTC)

Found another issue. The user's name broke the and []. --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 21:08, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * No, those broke because you used unencoded braces. Totally different issue. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 21:20, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , how to properly link then? With other usernames posting diffs usually work. --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 21:46, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It is nothing to do with the user name, it is the unencoded braces. This is one of the reasons that we request people not to use templates in section headings. To link to that section, either of the following work in Opera: User talk:7&6=thirteen; User talk:7&6=thirteen, although the second one might not work in all browsers. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 22:03, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , the first one worked. User_talk:Enterprisey/reply-link --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 22:18, 19 September 2018 (UTC)

Please post comments about Enterprisey's gadget here --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 21:05, 19 September 2018 (UTC) PAGE ]]) 16:34, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Sorry for my error. User:7&6-thirteen.  <b style="color:#060">7&amp;6=thirteen</b> (<b style="color:#000">☎</b>) 21:16, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * User:7&6-thirteen no such user. Please stick to the method that I described, which is proven to work. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 21:21, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * User:7&6=thirteen works. -- Green  C  21:30, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Duh!. I just use four tildes. Sorry for the repeated errors. Thanks.  <b style="color:#060">7&amp;6=thirteen</b> (<b style="color:#000">☎</b>) 21:33, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I was trying to link to his page.... how to do that? The talk page link to the specific thread breaks so as direct linking using the long URL> --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 21:45, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * You link to the page in the way that I described already - make sure that you use 1 in order that the next equals sign is taken literally, and not as the separator of a  pair. If it helps, you can do this for all users, like this:   → . -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 22:12, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I once proposed to disallow equals signs in new Wikimedia accounts: meta:Talk:Title blacklist/Archives/2015. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:47, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * ^ this seems like it would be the real solution. Killiondude (talk) 01:00, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , I support this proposal. Can you re-submit? --<i style="font-family:'Rock salt','Comic Sans MS'; color: Green;">Tyw7</i> (🗣️ Talk) — If (reply) then (ping me) 01:25, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * An archive search shows it was also proposed at meta:Talk:Title blacklist/Archives/2018 where it was rejected by Billinghurst. PrimeHunter (talk) 09:41, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * 1) We already have usernames with equal signs. 2) Users can be renamed. 3) If it that problematic, get it fixed properly by opening a phabricator ticket, not a jerry-built job in the title blacklist. — billinghurst  sDrewth  11:22, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * 1) Blacklisting new "=" would reduce future problems without annoying existing users. 2) It's easier to blacklist "=" than to rename users who chose a name in good faith. 3) Many Wikimedia wikis have templates with usernames as unnamed parameters. Many other wikis may have no issue with "=" in usernames. It could be a MediaWiki configuration option but then it would be similar to just blacklisting it. Requested MediaWiki features are often declined or take years. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:00, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * 1) Yes, though doesn't resolve our problem of use, just limits the cases into the future. 2) Sure, see 1) though it removes the problem into the future. 3) The issues of positional parameter and an equals sign is not limited to usernames alone, there are many times that it has an impact. It is not a new phenomenon, nor needs new solutions. We can and should educate our users, and write good templates, write good documentation, and utilise lua as required, not necessarily rely on lazy templating. What if other wikis want their users to have an equals sign? What if users want to have an equals sign. We just forbid it so it makes it easier for user positional parameters at the gorilla wiki as it doesn't like it where it is a very occasional problem? If it is truly problematic, start a phabricator ticket and see what ensues in the conversation, as ideally technical issues should have technical solutions, whereas social issues belong in blacklists. If it is seen as a crosswiki issue that needs resolution, then start your conversation at meta and invite the other communities to have an opinion, and if there is a consensus it will be undertaken. However, please just don't sit here and opine that it makes our use of a small set of templates here at enwiki harder for you when there is a pretty simple solution of   or   and some updates to documentation. — billinghurst  sDrewth  23:20, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm not familiar with title blacklist additions. Is there a process on meta for gaining consensus for additions, or are proposals simply up to meta-admin/steward discretion? --Ahecht ([[User talk:Ahecht|<span style="color:#FFF;background:#04A;display:inline-block;padding:1px;vertical-align:-.3em;font:bold 50%/1 sans-serif;text-align:center">TALK
 * Sure, meta is a consensus wiki like all WMF, and this discussion it would take place at m:talk:Title blacklist. Depending on the complexity and the impact of decisions that have a crosswiki impact, meta administrators may do it easily and quickly, or we may ask for a broader consensus, or we may ask for post to many/numbers of wikis to ensure that someone is open for many language, many sister wikis decision-making. The two previous occasions have had little input from users, and on both occasions the feedback was that it is probably a mediawiki-level determiner (so phabricator) if it is that problematic. If it came to my making a decision, I doubt that I would do that without broader xwiki input identifying the risks, the solutions, and that many wikis thought that it was appropriate. — billinghurst  sDrewth  22:55, 20 September 2018 (UTC)

WikiProject request for technical assistance
I have a request on behalf of WikiProject Newspapers for somebody with programming abilities. I think it's not terribly difficult, and it's something that could be useful not just to us, but to any number of cross-article collaboration projects or "sprints."

Our project aims to add 1,000 stubs about U.S. newspapers by mid-December of this year, as well as adding infoboxen to existing stubs. What we need is a straightforward way to measure our progress.

I imagine it working like this:
 * 1) Start with the results of a SPARQL query like this (thank you )
 * 2) For each item returned, test for the following (and perhaps a few other things as well; this would be the bare minimum)
 * 3) Did it exist on June 1, 2018?
 * 4) Is it a redirect now?
 * 5) Was it a redirect on June 1?
 * 6) Does it have an infobox now?
 * 7) Did it have an infobox as of June 1?
 * 8) The output, I think, would ideally be a spreadsheet or a wikitable containing all that info.

Is there anybody who might be willing to help us create such a script? (Note, I inquired about this previously on Wikidata, but I have a clearer idea about what is needed now.)

Suggestions for better venues to seek help are most welcome as well. -Pete Forsyth (talk) 23:32, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Just to keep track, here are some other characteristics it would be nice to track before-and-after. None of these is necessary, but all would be nice to have:
 * number of footnotes; what maintenance banners, if any, at the top of the article; how many categories; does its talk page have the WikiProject Newspapers template; what quality rating(s) does it have; how many character in the article; how many sections on the talk page. -Pete Forsyth (talk) 00:17, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

Does mw.config need to be loaded?
When writing a user script that uses values in mw.config, do I need to explicitly load mw.config using ResourceLoader? Enterprisey (talk!) 02:21, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
 * No, is part of the base  module, which does not need to be loaded per ResourceLoader/Core modules. - Evad37 &#91;talk] 05:26, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks! Enterprisey (talk!) 05:51, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

Email pings
I do not have email checked as notification of pings, not on Englilsh Wikipedia, nowhere. I just got 3 emails that I've been pinged on Wikipedia. One of them in non-English language (I'm guessing French, but I don't know for sure). As I have received no ping notices on my Wikipedia page itself, I'm deleting the emails without opening them. — Maile (talk) 19:40, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Hi, without looking at the emails, we're not really going to be able to tell if they came from us or not. You may want to check Special:GlobalPreferences to see if you have any email notifications on by default, where someone could email you from any of the other projects. —  xaosflux  Talk 19:49, 20 September 2018 (UTC)


 * Thanks. Checked Global Preferences.  No email checked for notifications. — Maile  (talk) 20:02, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The reason is that you just received a silly attack at fr:User talk:Maile66 from an WP:LTA. I blanked the nonsense so I am afraid you will get another email. You can fix the emails at fr:Special:Preferences. The LTA has been dropping crap like that for a decade and has resumed activity recently. Johnuniq (talk) 23:08, 20 September 2018 (UTC)


 * Well, I figured out what is triggering it. Every one has happened within seconds of my blocking a user at WP:AIV.  The last one came just seconds after my original block of 209.239.97.188.  Well, it did make me change my password.  Which is probably a good idea once in a while, anyhow.  Thanks. — Maile  (talk) 23:37, 20 September 2018 (UTC)


 * Also, I don't read French. So, I'm guessing that by unchecking the same two boxes that are unchecked in English WP has done the trick. — Maile  (talk) 23:40, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * When I have set my preferences at another language site, the first step is to set the language to English and save that. That makes everything in preferences a lot clearer. It looks as though you can do that at the global preferences linked above and then it will apply by default to all sites. Johnuniq (talk) 03:41, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
 * For related cases, see ANI. Johnuniq (talk) 03:45, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the global preferences info. It worked.  Re the ANI link ... yep, I blocked two lightening round-robin doppelganger socks of the yahweh vandal. — Maile  (talk) 11:05, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

Help with problem loading linkclassifier
I've been using User:Anomie/linkclassifier for a long time. Ihave it as link in my toolbiox in vector skin. Some time ago I noticed it occasionally wouldn't display, and I figured there was some timing issue on what was getting loaded in page. Refreshing usually fixed it. Lately it has gotten to where it would not load at all. Then looking at the instructions I updated my jss to use a suggested new script to load



instead of what I had before


 * mw.util.addPortletLink('p-tb', 'javascript:LinkClassifier.onDemand', 'Link classifier');

But now, every time I click on it, it reloads the page and the highlighting only briefly flashes before the page reloads. older ≠ wiser 09:44, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , those instructions were incorrect. I've amended them now. I think i'm even to blame for the incorrect instructions. So sorry. —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 11:01, 21 September 2018 (UTC)� —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 11:01, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks User:TheDJ, everything looks to be good now. older ≠ wiser 11:07, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

Tracking down a heavy memory leak
A few weeks ago, I volunteered for new page review and I tweaked some configs accordingly. Since then, every Wikipedia open tab leaks large amounts of memory, so that I have to kill the relevant processes in Chrome every few hours. I am trying to track down what the pages are doing, but had no luck so far. The Wikipedia pages typically accumulate memory allocation while in the background, sometimes up to gigabytes, while consuming a tiny fraction of CPU. Then when I switch to display such a page, memory usage goes back to a reasonable value. I am positive that this phenomenon only applies to the Wikipedia site. I have tried removing all my user scripts, to no effect. I also tried to disable many gadgets in Preferences, but had no luck isolating the issue. Is it possible to check the history of my preferences, especially in the gadgets section? Then I could restore them to a known working state prior to the memory leaks appearing. My next attempt would be to request removal of the NPR user right, although I don't understand how that would affect memory usage. Any help appreciated. — JFG talk 08:54, 20 September 2018 (UTC)


 * User:JFG, I'm sorry to hear that you are having problems with this. I wonder whether the "safemode" trick would help you figure this out.  See mw:Help:Locating broken scripts.
 * Did you turn off NAVPOPS? I've seen something similar in Safari on another wiki (one whose tabs I tend to open because I'll get back to it "soon", and days later I still haven't read them...), and I think that NAVPOPS might be one of the few commonalities.  Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 16:42, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the tips. Loading a page with 1 still leaks memory. NAVPOPS is disabled. Any other ideas? — JFG talk 23:18, 20 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , any browser extensions enabled ? —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 07:49, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, I've got a few. Did not change any of them prior to this issue, though. I could try disabling them. Also, I made a snapshot of memory use in debug mode, would that help if I upload it somewhere? — JFG talk 08:24, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
 * All extensions disabled this morning; still leaking like a sieve on idle pages. An article page that has been loaded, minimized, left untouched, and shares its process with no other page, grows to over a gigabyte of memory usage over a couple hours. I'm really puzzled. — JFG talk 10:34, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I've filed T205127 and liberally tagged some devs who might be interested. Please feel free to drag-and-drop your picture into a comment on the Phab task.  Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 18:00, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Great. Let's continue there. — JFG talk 21:12, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

Proposal for bot-synced geonotices
A proposal to sync geonotices with a bot, which will allow all admins to edit geonotices again, is being discussed. Enterprisey (talk!) 19:04, 22 September 2018 (UTC)

Justified text in edit boxes
The justified text option, as a gadget in user preferences, seems to enable text justification in edit boxes with source editing. While text justification is obviously useful in reading, it's frankly a pain when trying to edit pages, as the syntax and the like often leave large, unwelcome gaps between "words". If it's possible, please fix this so that justified text doesn't work in this case. Thanks. <span style="font-family:'Trajan Pro','Perpetua Titling MT',Perpetua,serif"> RAVEN PVFF  &#124; talk ~ 10:38, 22 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It doesn't justify source editing for me in Firefox, Vector. What is your browser? Your skin at Special:Preferences? Your Edit area font style at Special:Preferences? Does it stop justifying when you disable the gadget? Please link an example page where source editing is justified on the Edit tab. The gadget uses MediaWiki:Gadget-JustifyParagraphs.css. What happens if you log out and click [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Example_(musician)&action=edit&editintro=Template:BLP_editintro&withCSS=MediaWiki:Gadget-JustifyParagraphs.css]? I get justified text in the "Notice about sources" box but not in the edit area. PrimeHunter (talk) 21:36, 22 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I believe that I've discovered the culprit: the syntax highlighting tool, in the edit bar above the source editing box. Toggling it alters the edit text from justified and highlighted to left-aligned and plain. I use Google Chrome (version 69.0.3497.100), with the default Vector skin and monospaced edit font. Disabling the gadget prevents justification everywhere. Following your link, I get the same result as you did – justified text in the notice boxes and other text but left-aligned text in the editing box – but only because the syntax highlight is deactivated by default. Turning it on produces the same problem. It's a pity, really, as the syntax highlighting tool is quite useful to me; I've resorted to turning off text justification for now. <span style="font-family:'Trajan Pro','Perpetua Titling MT',Perpetua,serif"> RAVEN PVFF  &#124; talk ~ 01:09, 23 September 2018 (UTC)

Flag codes
So I'm doing some work with a new template Medals table and have been running into some issues with the flag icon templates. I have virtually made List of IOC country codes my homepage, but I'm curious if someone can direct me to THE page that is the be-all end-all for the 3 letter codes. I assume that there is a template somewhere with a massive switch/case statement or a module that has them all listed out or something. Can anyone point me to such a page? Many thanks!! -- Zackmann08 (Talk to me/What I been doing) 00:25, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
 * IOC code? —&thinsp;JJMC89&thinsp; (T·C) 00:57, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
 * that's a good one, but there are some templates that work with non IOC codes. For example -> . ENG is not an IOC code. thanks though! -- Zack mann  (Talk to me/What I been doing) 01:02, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Module:Country alias? – Jonesey95 (talk) 04:05, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
 * DING DING DING!!!! WINNER! That is exactly what I was looking for! Thank you! -- Zack mann  (Talk to me/What I been doing) 04:23, 23 September 2018 (UTC)

Updating template causes lots of big red warnings
I recently updated the two refs at Template:Ohio class ballistic missile submarine displacement. One had moved so I updated the url, the other is dead and I marked it as such.

The problem is that these are both named refs, and those names are re-used in other places. Those other places apparently had the same bad url as the template I fixed. But now the content is different, so I get the big red warnings.

I don't know how to fix this, and I don't really want to revert the template. What should I do?

You can see the big red warnings for example at USS Wyoming (SSBN-742). Kendall-K1 (talk) 13:07, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , basically other templates in Category:Ohio_class_ballistic_missile_submarine_infobox_templates also use the same refs, so they should also be changed to fix the URL. The refs should probably be another template so that all the Ohio class templates are updated at the same time. Galobtter (pingó mió) 13:13, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the quick reply. I didn't know how to track down the other templates, so that's very useful. Kendall-K1 (talk) 13:17, 23 September 2018 (UTC)

Tech News: 2018-39
<section begin="technews-2018-W39"/> Latest tech news from the Wikimedia technical community. Please tell other users about these changes. Not all changes will affect you. Translations are available.

Changes later this week
 * The preferences form will change to use the standard look. If you see any problems please report them on Phabricator.
 * Octicons-sync.svg The new version of MediaWiki will be on test wikis and MediaWiki.org from 25 September. It will be on non-Wikipedia wikis and some Wikipedias from 26 September. It will be on all wikis from 27 September (calendar).

Meetings
 * Octicons-sync.svg Octicons-tools.svg You can join the technical advice meeting on IRC. During the meeting, volunteer developers can ask for advice. The meeting will be on 26 September at 15:00 (UTC). See how to join.

Tech news prepared by Tech News writers and posted by bot • Contribute • Translate • Get help • Give feedback • Subscribe or unsubscribe. <section end="technews-2018-W39"/> 15:22, 24 September 2018 (UTC)

Central javascript library for tools idea
Not sure if this is the best place for this discussion, but figured it might as well start here.

I'm sure that many of you have been bitten over the years by how different tools handle seemingly identical operations (see NPP toolbar vs Twinkle in creating AfDs for pages that have had a previous AfD discussion). What I would like to propose is the creation of a centralized javascript library that would contain the code required for common tasks, talk page messages, AfD and CSD processing, etc, that could in turn be used by tools like NPP and Twinkle so that code doing the technical actions wouldn't need to be duplicated across tools. This should reduce the number of errors, both technical and human. I don't have a clear thought out plan on how to accomplish this, but I wanted to broach the topic and see if anyone thought it sounded like a good idea other than me. Part of the challenge will obviously be getting the developers of the individual tools to be on board. 03:32, 22 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I think you might be looking for Gadget kitchen although perhaps you know about that already and you mean another set of different libraries? Quiddity (talk) 19:07, 24 September 2018 (UTC)
 * thanks for the link, but no, that isn't what I'm looking for. I was more thinking about creating a centralized library/function that handles creating an AfD page for an article, or handles applying templates, etc. Basically things that many different scripts do, but each has their own slightly different code to handle. And some of these tools handle these function more elegantly than others. So I was thinking it would use useful to establish a single shared function/library that handles common tasks which than tools could use whichever parts are needed while providing their own custom UI on top of the functionality. Not sure if I'm explaining what I'm thinking well.   19:21, 24 September 2018 (UTC)

Category issue
Category:Wisconsin state senators has 954 members, any idea what should be done? GrahamHardy (talk) 20:34, 24 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , this is due to a rename of Category:Wisconsin_State_Senators conducted by after Cfd, probably move that cat here Galobtter (pingó mió) 20:39, 24 September 2018 (UTC)
 * All OK now thx GrahamHardy (talk) 20:47, 24 September 2018 (UTC)

Anyone else noticing watchlists loading very slowly lately?
I edit WP and Commons and have about 1500 pages on each watchlist. For the past few weeks watchlist loading has been significantly slower. (I use Chrome and Firefox, if that matters.) Is anyone else calling attention to this? If so, is an improvement in the works? Thanks -- WikiPedant (talk) 03:00, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
 * My solution is to have my watchlist display a couple of days of history after I have been away for a while. Then wait for it to display. But when I want to refresh the watchlist I change it to show just the last, say, six hours. That is much faster. After doing that once, I can press F5 to quickly refresh. Johnuniq (talk) 03:33, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks. Helpful info. -- WikiPedant (talk) 01:02, 25 September 2018 (UTC)

parsing MW template without the whole shebang
If I have an MW template and I want to bust it into a hash map, is there a way to do that other than some DIY broken regex hell? --76.122.98.253 (talk) 23:36, 24 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I guess it's not really possible to just "parse" because the MW runtime depends on knowing the valid template parameters at parse time --76.122.98.253 (talk) 00:55, 25 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Do you have a particular template/use case of interest? You could plausibly parse the HTML out of the DOM structure rather than try to figure out the wikitext instead in the general case. --Izno (talk) 01:59, 25 September 2018 (UTC)

Referral data / what search terms get people to wiki pages
Is it possible to find out what search terms lead people to particular wiki pages? (In particular, en.Wiktionarians are curious to know what brings people to wikt:Wiktionary:Translation requests.) -sche (talk) 21:56, 24 September 2018 (UTC)
 * your bailwick I think since you're the comms engagement at mediawikiwiki:Wikimedia Search Platform. --Izno (talk) 21:59, 24 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I don't know if the 'search platform' means just the on-wiki search bar, but FWIW we'd be interested in what 'external' sites (e.g. particular Google searches using certain terms) users reach the page from if that is available, as well as what people might type into the on-wiki search bar. :) -sche (talk) 22:20, 24 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , I doubt this kind of information can be made available. The privacy policy probably prevents it and the systems are probably engineered specifically to avoid collecting this. Maybe there is some info at a category level (search/internal/external links) but even that seems doubtful to me. —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 08:27, 25 September 2018 (UTC)

MoreMenu not appearing
I have been noticing this for some time that the MoreMenu gadget (which adds the really helpful Page and User links beside TW) seems to have stopped working for me. This occurs both in Chrome for Android and Chrome(with Windows)Canybody look into this problem? Regards — fr&thinsp;<sup style="color:grey;">+  09:19, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It works for me. Chrome 69.0.3497.100, Windows 10, Vector. Is MoreMenu still enabled at Special:Preferences? What is your skin at Special:Preferences? Does it work if you preview a blank version of User:FR30799386/common.js? Does it work at [//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Example?withJS=MediaWiki:Gadget-dropdown-menus.js&withCSS=MediaWiki:Gadget-dropdown-menus-vector.css] if you log out? PrimeHunter (talk) 09:39, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I fixed it. JWB was somehow interfering with the script. — fr&thinsp;<sup style="color:grey;">+  11:15, 26 September 2018 (UTC)

IAdmin access request for Ritchie333
A request for Interface administrator access under the stop-gap process for User:Ritchie333 is currently open at Wikipedia_talk:Interface_administrators. Community commentary on the request is welcome at that page. Best regards, — xaosflux  Talk 13:38, 26 September 2018 (UTC)

Infobox Whitespace issue
Hi, Back in August of last year, I had the issue of when I wanted to select whitespace in an infobox from the cursor/I thingy to the equal sign it would select the whole whitespace line (from a letter to the equal sign) instead of just from the cursor/I thingy to the equal sign, The issue last year only lasted for an hour or so and then went back to normal but it's now returned, I've included a picture to try and better explain what I mean, It's the exact same on Firefox so I don't know whether this is now normal or whether a button's been pressed somewhere on my keyboard that's causing it, Thanks, – Davey 2010 Talk 16:34, 25 September 2018 (UTC)
 * When you wanted to select the whitespace how? Nardog (talk) 14:11, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Clicking the whitespace a bunch of times, I guess? Enterprisey (talk!) 18:38, 26 September 2018 (UTC)

Systematic change of images
I would like to create a placeholder for images at the top of my user TP where I can change the image once a week (or month, etc) - example here - and wanted to use a static link to a an image pool that can be changed -  example here - (1)  is it possible and if so, (2) is there anyone who can help me get it done? I'm thinking it might be something like the code used for Today's featured picture on user pages (I copied the code from my user page): Thanks in advance.... <span style="text-shadow:#F8F8FF 0.2em 0.2em 0.4em,#F4BBFF -0.2em -0.3em 0.6em,#BFFF00 0.8em 0.8em 0.6em;color:#A2006D">Atsme ✍🏻📧 18:16, 26 September 2018 (UTC) PAGE ]]) 18:37, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Maybe you would like 's Module:Carousel? (Pinging so they can help with setup if so). — Paleo  Neonate  – 18:33, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It is possible, although the image won't update until the page is edited or purged. At the simplist, you would create a page such as User:Atsme/Talk image whose content is the image you want to include (with any desired markup), and then just add User:Atsme/Talk image to the top of your talk page. You would update User:Atsme/Talk image every time you want to update the image. It would also be possible, with a little more advanced template coding, to have it rotate through a series of images based on the date (let me know if you want to do something like that and I can work up a mockup of how that would work.), or to choose one at random using something like . --Ahecht ([[User talk:Ahecht|<span style="color:#FFF;background:#04A;display:inline-block;padding:1px;vertical-align:-.3em;font:bold 50%/1 sans-serif;text-align:center">TALK
 * Or for your own list using the aforementioned module: It seems that you could create a list like Module:Carousel/54129 (say Module:Carousel/Astme) and specify Astme when using the module. — Paleo  Neonate  – 18:40, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * You could indeed. I've just made a carousel for, so you can look at (1) Module:Carousel/Komodobish, which holds the filenames, and (2) User talk:Komodobish for an example of how to get the carousel running. More instructions, if needed, are at Module:Carousel. --RexxS (talk) 18:57, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Perfect!! Thank you so much to all - <span style="text-shadow:#F8F8FF 0.2em 0.2em 0.4em,#F4BBFF -0.2em -0.3em 0.6em,#BFFF00 0.8em 0.8em 0.6em;color:#A2006D">Atsme ✍🏻📧 01:16, 27 September 2018 (UTC)

automatic non-breaking spaces?
Hey all, in this edit made a minor change to a template and a bunch of &amp;nbsp&#59; tags were added to the page. He then reverted his edit, but the formatting didn't get pulled back out. Is this anything to look at? Regards, Cyphoidbomb (talk) 21:19, 26 September 2018 (UTC) Update: When I reverted past him, the non-breaking spaces were removed. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 21:27, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It is possible that the previous version contained actual non-breaking spaces rather than the  entity that represents them. Some browsers/addons will replace the former with the latter when saving, this is transparent to the user who will not realise that they are altering other people's posts. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 22:14, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, they were actual non-breaking spaces, U+00A0 in Unicode. Some browsers copy-paste them to normal spaces so it can be difficult to check. I don't know whether Gonnym's edit converted them with a browser, addon or Wikipedia tool but MOS:NBSP supports to convert them. There is no reason for non-breaking spaces in those locations so they should be changed to normal spaces. PrimeHunter (talk) 22:30, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * This is WP:WIKEDNBSP. --Izno (talk) 03:00, 27 September 2018 (UTC)

Zombie category
Can anyone figure out how Eugenics is being placed in Category:Commons category with page title same as on Wikidata?

The categ was deleted at WP:CFD 2017 January 25, and Template:Commons category was updated accordingly by.

So why is some template putting Eugenics in there? -- Brown <span style="display:inline-block;transform:rotate(-3deg)">Haired Girl (talk) • (contribs) 03:17, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It is related to Wikisourcecat inline - checking more. — xaosflux  Talk 03:23, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Wikisourcecat inline is the only place where I found it as well. It looks like the cat needs to be commented out of that template, which is used only in Eugenics, for some reason. – Jonesey95 (talk) 03:25, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Since the CFD said to delete that it should just be removed from that template. — xaosflux  Talk 03:26, 27 September 2018 (UTC)

Many thanks,. I have commented it out in Wikisourcecat inline, and that has solved the problem. Brown <span style="display:inline-block;transform:rotate(-3deg)">Haired Girl (talk) • (contribs) 04:41, 27 September 2018 (UTC)

Speedy delete module test sandbox
How would I go about requesting a speedy delete of one of my module sandboxes? Twinkle's CSD option as well as manually adding a delete template to the page does not work as it leads to a "Failed to save edit: Lua error at line 1: unexpected symbol near '{'" error. Is there a workaround for this or will I need to manually request a delete somewhere? Thanks.—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 15:34, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
 * easiest way: put a CSD on its talk page with a note to also kill the module page. — xaosflux  Talk 15:49, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Ah! That seems obvious in hindsight. Cheers!—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 15:58, 27 September 2018 (UTC)

Templates linking to No
WhatLinksHere indicates that the following templates:


 * Template:WikiProject C/C++
 * Template:WikiProject Songs
 * Template:WikiProject Pipe Organ
 * Template:WP1.0
 * Template:Maths banner
 * Template:WikiProject Festivals
 * Template:WikiProject Scuba diving
 * Template:WikiProject Articles for creation (admin)
 * Template:WikiProject Home Living
 * Template:WikiProject Igbo
 * Template:WikiProject Genealogy
 * Template:WikiProject Requested articles (admin)
 * Template:WikiProject Poultry
 * Template:Alphabet Task Force

link to No, but I can't work out why. Can anyone enlighten me? Thanks. DH85868993 (talk) 06:32, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Likely something to do with how a possible value for the "importance" field in the WikiProject banner is "no". And if a category isn't specified for importance sorting, a wikilink to the importance article (Top, High, Mid, etc) is generated, which in this case would be No. Enterprisey (talk!) 06:45, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The pages don't actually have the link so the WhatLinksHere entry is probably caused by  in a used template. The parser function #ifexist: causes a listing in "What links here" among the normal links even though no link is produced. PrimeHunter (talk) 08:52, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Possibly related: 2017 Community Wishlist Survey entry, and . This looks like it is a ten-year-old bug. – Jonesey95 (talk) 09:07, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The common factor here is that all of these WikiProject banners use the template having the parameter no. This does indeed get put into an   test, inside . -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 12:53, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I've traced through the code of and  (something that I would not be able to do if these were converted to Lua) and I'm pretty certain that the no parameter may be blanked without harm  Maybe not . -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 13:44, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks all for the responses. DH85868993 (talk) 06:06, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I've updated so that this no longer happens. -- WOSlinker (talk) 21:19, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks WOSlinker! DH85868993 (talk) 22:25, 27 September 2018 (UTC)

Special:Log question
I don't know if its just me, but the two last entries from 2013 in the deletion log for "Encyclopedia" look bizarre. Is this a bug or is it just me? <b style="color:#060">L293D</b> (<b style="color:#000">☎</b> • <b style="color:#000">✎</b>) 02:19, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
 * They're remnants of the now-removed Article Feedback Tool. Graham 87 07:42, 28 September 2018 (UTC)

Checking email addresses associated to accounts
Hi, I've been an idiot and forgotten both the password and email address I used for my old account: MrPenguin20. Is there any way I can find out what the email address associated to my old account was, so I can log into it and reset my password? Would anyone (eg admins) have access to that information? Thanks! MrPenguin21 (talk) 17:42, 25 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Go to Special:EmailUser/MrPenguin20, send an email with an easily-recognisable subject line. Then check the inboxes of all of your various mailers, to see if a mail has arrived from wiki@undefinedwikimedia.org - examine the email header details (the method for doing this varies between mailers) to locate the "to" line. This shows the email address associated with the User:MrPenguin20 account. You should then be able to visit Help:Reset password for further directions. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 22:13, 25 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The account doesn't have email address. You either once set and removed it or never set one in the first place. –Ammarpad (talk) 07:15, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks both that's really useful.
 * @Ammarpad - I definitely had an email address pinned to the account, but then I thought I changed it, but it looks like you're right and rather than changing it I just removed it and never gave a replacement... *bangs head off wall*. I assume that's likely me out of options because an admin likely couldn't just change the password for me due to a lack of authentication (although I suppose I do have emails I received from Wikipedia to my old account at the email) MrPenguin21 (talk) 19:16, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia admins don't have access. Some developers can set or change an email address for an account so Special:PasswordReset can be used. They only consider it in special cases like accounts with high user rights or edit counts, and they require authentication. T201280 is an example request from a user who was still logged in at the English Wikipedia. PrimeHunter (talk) 19:43, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * "Access Denied: Restricted Task". -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 20:04, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * What PrimeHunter said. Ammarpad can't tell the difference between "you have no email set" and "you have an email set but it's not confirmed". If you do have an unconfirmed email set, entering the username on Special:PasswordReset will work to generate an email where Special:EmailUser would fail. You'd still have to have access to the email account in question to receive the email, of course. Anomie⚔ 20:07, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you Anomie. I was of course thinking of that line about the effect of confirmation, but the difference was not explained in any help pages here and on MediaWiki. –Ammarpad (talk) 20:13, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks all for your ongoing help with this. The Special Password reset says "A password reminder has already been sent within the last 24 hours. To prevent abuse, only one password reminder will be sent per 24 hours." So perhaps there is an email address connected to the account afterall? Maybe therefore it's just unconfirmed. Sadly I don't seem to have the right privileges to view T201280 on phabricator ("You do not have permission to view this object."). Would it be worth trying to raise a tick there? MrPenguin21 (talk) 20:42, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Special:EmailUser/MrPenguin20 says "This user has not specified a valid email address." That message is both shown if the user has set no address and if the user has set an address but never confirmed it by clicking a link in a mail sent to the address. The message at Special:PasswordReset sounds like MrPenguin20 is in the latter situation. I didn't know T201280 was restricted. I don't have any special Phabricator access but after I had already posted, the visibility was changed with existing subscribers allowed. The user was logged in and made edits from the account itself for authentication so it was a simple case. It's not like your case but it's the only request I have helped with. I don't know what is normally required. PrimeHunter (talk) 10:49, 28 September 2018 (UTC)

Syntax highlighter and spell checker
Hello team, I am not sure, most probably I have installed some script (or something). Now when I am editing, syntac is highlighted like this. I want to disable it, a big problem is with this spell checker (browser, Grammarly) is not working at all. Another problem is Autocomplete of links, templates script is also not working. However I am unable to do it, as I don't remember what exactly I did to enable it. I tried by commenting out several scripts at User:Titodutta/common.js. Suggestion please how can I turn it off? --Titodutta (talk)13:37, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
 * click the highlighter icon to the direct left of "Advanced" in the top toolbar of the editor to disable syntax highlighting Galobtter (pingó mió) 13:39, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Wow, (my bad), many thanks. --Titodutta (talk) 13:47, 28 September 2018 (UTC)

XFDcloser bug
See also User talk:Evad37/XFDcloser.js/Archive 3

AFD closer
Hi, I'm having some problems with closing the AfDs with either of the two tools - I get "API error: aborted: possible edit conflict (found section heading ..." Any idea what the issue is? Thanks :) --Tone 11:24, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
 * This was a bug that has been fixed now - Evad37 &#91;talk] 02:04, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

XFDcloser error?
When I try to close Articles for deletion/Mark Molesworth, I get:

Closing discussion: Aborted.API error: aborted: possible edit conflict (found section heading `:Mark Molesworth`) – Could not edit page Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Mark Molesworth; could not close discussion Deleting page: Aborted. Deleting talk page: Aborted. Deleting redirects: Aborted. Unlinking backlinks: Aborted.

I assume this is some mis-formatting of the header, but I can't see it. Anybody know what the problem is? -- RoySmith (talk) 23:46, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
 * This was a bug in the script's edit conflict detection system, fixed now. (WT:XFDC is the best place to report XFDcloser bugs, by the way.) - Evad37 &#91;talk] 01:59, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

Recursive navbox
Can navboxes be recursive? I recently reworked Doctor Who companions, so that if you call it as just, it displays everything:

Whereas if you call, it'll display just the group for the Ninth Doctor's companions (for the articles for the Ninth Doctor and his companions):

Now, I'm wanting to make it be able to be call the template like, so that it will display the groups for both the Ninth and Tenth Doctor's companions. However, this isn't possible with the switch function currently being used. What I attempted to do was include the following at the bottom of the template:

This was so that if the navbox was called recursively that second time (without a second parameter itself, so it wouldn't be called again), the template wouldn't be a navbox, but rather a child navbox. However, I'm getting a "Template loop" error, and it won't work. Am I doing this wrong, or is there a way to do this? Thanks. --  Alex TW 08:22, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It's not a navbox problem - templates cannot transclude themselves, this is a design feature of MediaWiki. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 11:21, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

Thank you to for the fix! Works just as required now.

--  Alex TW 11:27, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks. WP:TEMPLATE LOOP says: "A template can call itself but will stop after one iteration to prevent an infinite loop." It appears this only applies when the template page itself is rendered. It means that examples in <noinclude ></noinclude> work, e.g. transcluded from a documentation subpage. If another page calls a template then the template is apparently not allowed to call itself a single time. Your attempt had other issues. I made a different implementation which allows up to five selected groups.[//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template:Doctor_Who_companions&diff=861704131&oldid=861704056] A switch is usually applied to a variable expression but it also works fine on a constant. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:29, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

How could I get a page that times out to load
The page WikiProject_Portal/List_of_all_portals/Archive/4-22-2018/Page_1 times out due to the time it is taking to load the page being over 60 seconds. Usually this is not the case, but because there is a large number of links which have become redlinks, I presume the calculations for that are pushing it over the 60 seconds limit. Is there a way to force the page to continue working over 60 seconds? Dreamy <i style="color:#d01e1e">Jazz</i> 🎷 talk to me &#124; my contributions 20:54, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
 * No, 60 seconds is the limit and won't be increased for various good reasons. The page has 42,876 lines like this:


 * Portal:1920s
 * With just the first 5,000 lines it takes 2.4 real time seconds to display a preview. I guess this is MediaWiki's way of saying that a list like that is too long. Johnuniq (talk) 23:57, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, split it down into multiple pages - it was created as page 1 of 4, maybe pages 1-4 of 16 would have been a better approach. On a side matter, the page name containing 4-22-2018 is not a good idea; 2018-04-22 would have been better. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 11:27, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * If you cannot reach an edit link then manually add  to the url. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:34, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

Fixing bad mobile layout
Lagrangian point looks fine in desktop view, but in [//en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lagrangian_point mobile view] the lead images obscure the text. Any recommendations for troubleshooting this? Thanks, 28bytes (talk) 02:08, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Looks fine to me in mobile domain. What do you mean by "obscures the text"? Obscure would be a word I would use to say "in front of"--what I see is "moves the text down", as is reasonable. --Izno (talk) 02:31, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I have uploaded a screenshot of what I am seeing here. 28bytes (talk) 02:59, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Obscure indeed. What operating system, browser, and version is that in? --Izno (talk) 04:41, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
 * iPhone 6, iOS 10.3.3, Safari. 28bytes (talk) 11:03, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It might be due to the 400 px fixed image size of the lead image, which is above MOS:IMGSIZE recommendations for fixed image size for the lead image. I've reduced it - does it look fine now? Galobtter (pingó mió) 10:00, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately the text is still hidden behind the images, even at the reduced size. 28bytes (talk) 11:03, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

Anyone else have any suggestions? 28bytes (talk) 03:46, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * please check again. —⁠andrybak (talk) 09:33, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately the text is still hidden in my browser. 28bytes (talk) 12:44, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

Link formatting
This isn't a major issue, but I think I should mention it. At WP:RM, about half of the "Discuss" links have the "scu" underlined on my system (that is, they appear as "Di scu ss"). I'm using FireFox 62.0.2 with Monobook, and haven't made any changes to my system recently. What might be causing this? Tevildo (talk) 23:41, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Same for me, Win10, Edge, Monobook. DuncanHill (talk) 23:42, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It's in the actual wikitext, not a fault at the reader's end. DuncanHill (talk) 23:44, 29 September 2018 (UTC)


 * See the "Relisting" section for background information. Apparently this formatting is intended to mark bot-relisted discussions. GermanJoe (talk) 23:49, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks, I didn't notice that. Not, perhaps, the most obvious of UI elements, but it appears to be working as designed. Tevildo (talk) 23:54, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It of course signifies relisted discussion, but not by bot. A bot cannot relist discussion. The bot only underlines that part after the discussion has been relisted by human. –Ammarpad (talk) 05:29, 30 September 2018 (UTC)

Hard to scroll down in lower right corner of edit window
If I want to scroll down and I move the cursor to the lower right corner of the edit window, the cursor has turned into two arrows, one pointing toward the upper left, and one pointing toward the lower right. In geometry we called this a line, while an arrow pointing in one direction, the way the cursor normally looks, was a ray. As long as the arrows are pointing in two directions I can't scroll down without being very precise in positioning the cursor. This is has been a problem for weeks but I just keep forgetting to report it.— Vchimpanzee  •  talk  •  contributions  •  19:28, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
 * This is a feature in many programs to resize the window by dragging a corner in any direction with the mouse when a two-way arrow is displayed. At the top right your window may have an icon to maximize the window to use the whole screen. If you do this then the resize option probably disappears. None of this is Wikipedia related and we wouldn't disable it if we could. PrimeHunter (talk) 22:17, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It is new, so if it isn't Wikipedia related it's an update in Windows. But it is only the Wikipedia edit window and it's not in the upper right corner.— Vchimpanzee  •  talk  •  contributions  •  15:08, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
 * What is your browser? I guess it has an icon with a square or two overlapping squares at the top right, to the left of X. This toggles between a maximized fixed window and a non-maximized window which can be resized by dragging a corner with the two-way arrow. Maybe you accidentally clicked the icon weeks ago and the current behaviour started. I suspect you can get the two-way arrow at all four corners if they are visible on the screen and the window is not in the maximized mode. This all assumes you refer to the corner of the whole window and not the edit area. PrimeHunter (talk) 16:36, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It doesn't matter. It happens at home with Edge and at the library with Chrome. The two-way arrow does not happen except in the lower right corner of the edit window, and I always maximize windows. The lower right corner of the edit window in Wikipedia has a very small triangle or maybe a series of very short lines moving from upper right to lower left.— Vchimpanzee  •  talk  •  contributions  •  19:54, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
 * For me, the lower right corner of the edit box shows six little dots (arranged in a triangle) in Firefox, but two diagonal lines in Opera. These decorations mean the same thing: that the edit window is resizable, by using the mouse to drag that decoration around. This has been the case for several years; it was certainly present some time before the preferences options to set the window size (in terms of number of lines and characters) were removed. Other aspects vary between browsers too: when hovering over that tiny region, the mouse pointer is also different - in Firefox, it's the north west/south east arrow &#x2921;, in Opera it becomes a normal arrow pointer Cursor.svg; in Firefox you can resize right down to four lines by one character, in Opera you can increase beyond the default on both axes, but cannot reduce dimensions below the defaults. Google Chrome: as Opera except that you cannot alter the width.
 * I'm guessing that has recently upgraded their browser (or switched to a different one) where the aspects of the user interface are different from their previous experience. As  notes, this is outside our control. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 12:31, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * As I said, this is independent of whether I am at home or at the library and not browser-related. This is something that started happening a few weeks ago and it's annoying because if I need to use the down arrow to scroll down, it is hard to put the cursor in exactly the right place.— Vchimpanzee  •  talk  •  contributions  •  15:30, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The sensitive part of the mouse pointer is either the exact centre (for symmetric pointers) or the very end (for asymmetric pointers such as the arrow). Get that anywhere within a region that is approximately 12x12 pixels and click. Or click in the shaded greay area above it. Or drag the slider that partially obscures the grey. Or roll the mouse wheel. Or use the keyboard - and the down-arrow key both work. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 18:26, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

If they work.— Vchimpanzee  •  talk  •  contributions  •  18:20, 30 September 2018 (UTC)

Password Reset Request on Meta ?
I received the following email from WMF:

Someone (probably you, from IP address 2601:5C1:8200:BFA2:E11E:2EDD:9D4E:BF2C) requested a reset of your password for Meta (<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:MyLanguage/Main_Page>). The following user account is associated with this email address:

Username: Robert McClenon

Temporary password: ********

This temporary password will expire in 7 days. You should log in and choose a new password now. If someone else made this request, or if you have remembered your original password, and you no longer wish to change it, you may ignore this message and continue using your old password.

I wasn't on Meta yesterday and didn't request a password reset. Was someone trying unsuccessfully to hack my account, unsuccessful because the email went to my registered email address? Should I do anything further, such as reporting the hack?

Robert McClenon (talk) 19:43, 30 September 2018 (UTC)


 * Hey - this is caused by someone visiting Special:PasswordReset and putting your username in. I get a few every now and then, as do many other users - it's nothing to worry about, though maybe take this opportunity to have a look through these guidelines on account security, and perhaps consider enabling two-factor authentication - TNT 💖 19:51, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Am I correct that this was a useless attempt to capture my password, and not something due to good faith? I am satisfied with my password.  It was not breached.   I have read the guidelines.  I do not think that I am eligible for two-factor, because I am not an administrator.  It appears that it sends a one-time number to my cell phone if I try to log on, which is essentially unbreakable.  (Using an ATM card is true two-factor security, because it relies both on the card and the PIN.)  I don't think I need two-factor anyway.  I very seldom log on because I never log out on my own devices, but stay logged on for up to 30 days, and have the password saved on them besides.  So I do have a problem if someone steals my cell phone or steals my laptop, but I have bigger problems than Wikipedia then.  Robert McClenon (talk) 23:53, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
 * It was just someone fooling around and it happens regularly. Ignore it. Any reasonable password cannot be guessed using Wikipedia's slow log in system and Special:PasswordReset can be used by anyone, anywhere. Just make sure you do not use the same password as used on any other account associated with your name on the internet. Johnuniq (talk) 00:00, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * if you didn't do this, it is safe to just ignore. — xaosflux  Talk 00:02, 1 October 2018 (UTC)

Lua editor issues
I'm running into some issues with the Lua editor's ability to handle some unicode characters. Compare this module page and this article sandbox page with the same text. Now if you edit the module and try to edit something after say, the words "Komal Gandhara", it does not function the way you'd expect it to as it seems to be "off by 1". This is very likely because of the presence of the character G̱ on the same line. You can see it happening elsewhere too, for example, on lines with M̄. You won't see this behaviour if you edit the same text in the linked article sandbox. I'm running into other Lua issues too because of the use of these characters as table keys. But I'd like to sort this out first. I'm using Google Chrome. Cheers.—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 19:46, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * As far as I know there is no sorting this out short of fixing the editor. Upper left corner of the code editor has   click that to toggle in and out of the code editor.
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 19:57, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks. Is there a bug report for this somewhere?—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 21:04, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * This is because the editor doesn't support non-regular spaced fonts very well. It's a long standing issue with the library that is used to create the editor. —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 07:37, 1 October 2018 (UTC)

Mysterious text in mobile view
When I view Australia at the 2018 Winter Olympics on my mobile device (Wikipedia app, Android OS), the infobox and medalist table are shown collapsed by default. The infobox shows as: which is fine, but the medalists table shows as: My question is: Where does the text "Disasters, Africa" come from? Neither word appears in the article. Thanks. DH85868993 (talk) 11:27, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I just removed some stray formatting tags. Is it better? I do not see what you see in either revision, even when I switch to mobile view on my computer and make the window very small. (Forking the discussion: shouldn't mobile view be mobile view, regardless of the viewing device?) – Jonesey95 (talk) 11:33, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * "Wikipedia app, Android OS" indicates he is using Help:Mobile access and not using a browser to view the mobile version https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australia_at_the_2018_Winter_Olympics. I don't have an Android device for testing. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:47, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, that's better - the medalists table now shows:
 * {|class=wikitable


 * More information: Medal, Name ...  v
 * }
 * Thanks. DH85868993 (talk) 11:55, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * You're welcome. FYI to the gnomes watching this page, the problem was a missing end tag caused by a stray col-begin template with no matching closing template. This error was one of 585,000 "missing end tag" Linter errors that  still need to be fixed in article space. Most errors don't cause this much trouble, but there is plenty of ugliness still out there to be fixed. You are welcome to find out how to help; the best place to ask how to help is probably Wikipedia talk:Linter. – Jonesey95 (talk) 13:08, 1 October 2018 (UTC)

Lua: attempt to index field '?' (a nil value)

 * Test module
 * Test template (This might have been reverted by a bot. If so, please revert back.)
 * Sandbox

If you look in the sandbox, you will see an error: "Lua error in Module:Sandbox/Cpt.a.haddock/test at line 17: attempt to index field '?' (a nil value)." You will however not see the error if you call the same function from the debug console where it runs successfully. Any idea why this might be happening? A scope issue? Thanks.—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 12:31, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * several things:
 * first: abandon the general purpose sandboxes for one that you own and control
 * second: template and module parameters are passed to lua function as part of frame objects so  not
 * third: it is convenient to make a pointer to the frame.args table (easier to type) so:
 * fourth: you don't need a template to test an  but you do have to provide parameters.  Your test template has this which doesn't pass parameters:
 * I've tweaked your module:
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 13:53, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you! The lack of the frame parameter was my copy-and-paste error as I am using the Arguments module in my module. Anyhow, your edit made me realise that the error was about accessing the table using an invalid key (which was created because what I thought was a copy of a table was just a pointer to the original). Cheers.—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 17:29, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 13:53, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you! The lack of the frame parameter was my copy-and-paste error as I am using the Arguments module in my module. Anyhow, your edit made me realise that the error was about accessing the table using an invalid key (which was created because what I thought was a copy of a table was just a pointer to the original). Cheers.—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 17:29, 1 October 2018 (UTC)

Tech News: 2018-40
<section begin="technews-2018-W40"/> Latest tech news from the Wikimedia technical community. Please tell other users about these changes. Not all changes will affect you. Translations are available.

Recent changes
 * Ordinary pages can no longer be loaded as javascript. You could do this using  in the URL. Only fully protected pages in the MediaWiki: namespace or user javascript subpages can be loaded as javascript now. This is for better security.

Problems
 * New and updated translations from translatewiki.net will not reach the wikis for a while. You can still translate messages on translatewiki.net. The Wikimedia wikis will be updated with the new translations later. This is because of work on the translation system.

Changes later this week
 * Octicons-sync.svg The new version of MediaWiki will be on test wikis and MediaWiki.org from 2 October. It will be on non-Wikipedia wikis and some Wikipedias from 3 October. It will be on all wikis from 4 October (calendar).

Meetings
 * Octicons-sync.svg Octicons-tools.svg You can join the technical advice meeting on IRC. During the meeting, volunteer developers can ask for advice. The meeting will be on 3 October at 15:00 (UTC). See how to join.
 * You can join the meeting with the Wikimedia Foundation Search Platform team. The meeting will be on 3 October at 15:00 UTC. See how to join if you want to know how the search function works or have questions.

Future changes
 * Because of a data centre test you will be able to read but not edit the wikis for up to an hour on 10 October. This will start at 14:00 (UTC). You might lose edits if you try to save during this time. The time when you can't edit might be shorter than an hour. You can read more about this.

Tech news prepared by Tech News writers and posted by bot • Contribute • Translate • Get help • Give feedback • Subscribe or unsubscribe. <section end="technews-2018-W40"/> 17:34, 1 October 2018 (UTC)

Hundreds of artilces now have duplicate reference name errors
I've been working through Category:Pages with duplicate reference names to try to eliminate duplicate reference name errors from the corpus. Over the last couple of days, I've noticed a large increase in the number of articles with duplicate reference name errors. I could use some help in understanding why so many articles are newly included in this category. Two groups of articles seem to have appeared. One comes from Inflation/fn invocations, and another from using Certification Table Entry for the "Finland" region.

These problems affect more than 500 articles in total. I've asked after the problems at Template talk:Certification Table Entry and Template talk:Inflation/fn. I'm asking here to see if I can get some help in diagnosing and maybe fixing the problem. Thanks :) -- Mikeblas (talk) 14:49, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I have no solution because I think that the problem lies with MediaWiki and how it handles TemplateStyles as stripmarkers, the sequence of when duplicate-ref-different-text errors are detected/flagged and when stripmarkers are replaced with content. I explained my belief at Template talk:Inflation/fn.
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 15:10, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Just for the record, the cause in Certification Table Entry was certification cite ref which is aimed at creating identical references, which was the source of the whole issue, as pointed out in . --Muhandes (talk) 18:16, 1 October 2018 (UTC)

No longer allowed to load normal pages as Javascript
This is the kind of thing that shouldn't be a problem for anyone, but just in case: If you've been reading normal pages with   in the URL, it's not going to work any longer. You'll get an error message that says "Forbidden ⧼unprotected-js⧽" instead.

It will still work for Javascript pages (and a few other cases). Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 16:44, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
 * , this breaks gadget "sandboxes" (e.g. MediaWiki talk:Gadget-popups.js/sandbox) that users were using to collaborate on "demo" versions of gadgets before they went live. What is the current recommended way to accomplish this? Enterprisey (talk!) 22:30, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
 * can you elaborate on this? That page is still in js format and can be edited withe js editor, how were you loading it exactly and where is it failing now? —  xaosflux  Talk 10:36, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I am loading it with an importScript call to 'MediaWiki talk:Gadget-popups.js/sandbox', from my common.js, and I get a console message saying "Loading failed for the with source “https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=MediaWiki_talk:Gadget-popups.js/sandbox&action=raw&ctype=text/javascript”.". Navigating directly to that source URL shows the error message Whatamidoing mentioned above. Enterprisey (talk!) 23:38, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Pinging User:BWolff (WMF) for help with alternatives. Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 19:23, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * That's a use case I wasn't aware of. However I don't think it is something that should be allowed - that page is open to editing by anyone (even anons) and is being loaded in User:enterprisey/common.js. A malicious person could insert code into that page to take over your account (across all wikimedia wikis). From there they could notice you have interface-admin rights on test.wikipedia.org and use that to take over other accounts and eventually gain admin rights (or higher) over here. For the security of everyone's accounts we really need to make sure that only trusted people can edit js of other trusted people. BWolff (WMF) (talk) 22:35, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Fair point, agreed. Enterprisey (talk!) 00:33, 2 October 2018 (UTC)

Technical Advice IRC Meeting
We'd like to invite you to the weekly Technical Advice IRC meeting. The Technical Advice IRC Meeting is a weekly support event for volunteer developers. Every Wednesday, two full-time developers are available to help you with all your questions about Mediawiki, gadgets, tools and more! This can be anything from "how to get started" over "who would be the best contact for X" to specific questions on your project.

The Technical Advice IRC meeting is every Wednesday 3-4 pm UTC as well as on every first Wednesday of the month 11-12 pm UTC.

If you know already what you would like to discuss or ask, please add your topic to the page of the next meeting. Cheers, -- Michael Schönitzer (WMDE) (talk) 16:11, 2 October 2018 (UTC)

My team is hiring
If you are interested in talking to communities, then please see the new job posting at https://boards.greenhouse.io/wikimedia/jobs/1380820

In the past, I've had a pretty clear idea of what the first assignment would be. This time, I don't know. I can tell you in general that there is a focus on mobile users and that we are always (always always always) looking for someone who speaks English as a second (or third) language rather than mostly monolingual folks (like me), but beyond that, I don't have a lot of "inside advice" to give you.

For those who are already looking at the details: If you meet *almost* all of the official requirements, then it's okay to apply anyway. My team is always looking for the right person overall, and if you are a strong candidate in some areas but not quite in one or two, then please give us a chance to consider you anyway. I strongly recommend that all Wikipedians include their usernames in all job applications.

Finally, when it comes to hiring, the Wikimedia Foundation is the slowest organization I've ever worked for. The goal is to have this new person hired before January 2019. Iff they manage to hire on schedule, then the new staff member would probably get a free trip to San Francisco in mid-January. Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 17:03, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
 * (Speaking as someone on the opposite side of the world from the WMF so with no horse in this race) I know it's not as uncommon in the US as it is in the rest of the world, but you (plural) do realise that to pretty much everyone not in the US, a job ad with no indication of the pay scale is probably the single biggest red flag (other than "subject of widely publicised lawsuit from current employees") when it comes to "potential employer to avoid"? Aside from all the ethical and legal stuff around discrimination (since not stating the salary is typically a sign the employer is going to ask the "what is your current salary?" question), it means anyone who thinks the job looks interesting has no way of judging whether it's worth their while to apply or whether they'd be taking a huge pay cut. It's not like your pay scales are some kind of deeply-held trade secret. &#8209; Iridescent 18:08, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
 * It's not just "not uncommon", I'd say it's the default MO. Part of our issue of real US wages not increasing since the 80s, no doubt.... --Izno (talk) 19:02, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
 * In fact, the more I look at this the more questionable it appears. Where is this job based—are you looking for people around the world to broaden your geographical spread, or will the hiree be expected to relocate to SF? If you are looking for people outside the US, why are you making such a big deal of Fully paid medical, dental and vision coverage, and will non-US people get an increased wage in recognition of the fact they won't need this? How many hours is the job—is this a couple-of-hours-a-week part time position or a 60-hour work-till-you-drop week? Does "Please sign in to apply with LinkedIn" mean that anyone with a potential interest in the job is expected to join LinkedIn—part of a particularly voracious multinational with the ethics of a sewer rat, whose ethos is pretty much diametrically opposite to that of Wikimedia—or is this just an option for those who want it? Is this job as part of a team with the support networks and responsibilities that entails, or an at-arms-length person largely operating alone? What sort of signal do you think it sends that an advert for an organisation that's purportedly all about education contains day-one-basics howlers like in the country with which you reside? What specific qualifications and experience are you looking for—going strictly by your 'requirements' section, I'm your perfect employee, yet I somehow doubt you want me. &#8209; Iridescent 20:21, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
 * As far as I can see from that interface, LinkedIn login is optional, it just allows you to use LI to fill in some of the information in that form. Max Semenik (talk) 20:52, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Quick answers:
 * The link says "Remote" at the top, which indicates that relocation to SF is not expected. Non-SF but still in the US is still remote.
 * Full time is 40 hours per week, and in my team, 40 means 40, not 60. It is possible to negotiate fewer hours (I did), but the current intention is full time.
 * Pay depends upon your location (as well as education, experience, etc.). People who are located in a high-cost market (e.g., London or Hong Kong) will get paid somewhat more than people who are located in lower-cost markets (e.g., Johannesburg or Mumbai).
 * I understand that, in California, it has been illegal to ask about previous pay since 2017. That was also not a question asked when I was hired (five years and two managers ago) or at any interview I have attended since then.
 * Benefits depend upon your country. Non-US people get non-US benefits.  As an example, if you live in a country with a taxpayer-funded universal healthcare system, then you get your paycheck and they pay taxes into the national healthcare system.  If you live in a country with private healthcare, then you get your paycheck and health insurance (just not the particular plan that's available to residents of California).  At least as of two years ago (the last time I checked), independent contractors are normally paid 15% more than an employee would be, to offset the loss of all benefits.
 * I don't actually know whether using LinkedIn is necessary, but I doubt it. It looks like you can skip the "apply with LinkedIn" button and just fill in the form manually.
 * You'd be joining my team (which is awesome – best in the WMF, AFAICT). Iridescent, I always want you on my team, or at least on my side.  ;-)
 * BTW, if anyone wants to see other positions that are open, you can find the list at https://wikimediafoundation.org/about/jobs/  Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 21:01, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
 * You'd be joining my team (which is awesome – best in the WMF, AFAICT). Iridescent, I always want you on my team, or at least on my side.  ;-)
 * BTW, if anyone wants to see other positions that are open, you can find the list at https://wikimediafoundation.org/about/jobs/  Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 21:01, 2 October 2018 (UTC)

New brief Interface Admin RfC regarding allowing non-admin access
Hi guys!! With the policy RfC now closed, I'm starting a brief 7 day straw poll on whether or not to let non-admins request access to interface-admin. All comments are welcome. Refer to Wikipedia_talk:Interface_administrators to discuss.— CYBERPOWER  ( Chat ) 23:18, 2 October 2018 (UTC)

TV articles breaking the post-expand include size limit
I was hoping to get some outside input into a problem that is becoming more common with TV articles, i.e. that of "List of episodes" articles breaking the post-expand include size limit. This appears to have been first noticed at List of The Simpsons episodes in March 2014 (see this discussion) but has since spread to more articles. For background, TV programs with multiple seasons typically have a "List of episodes" (LoE) article linked from Infobox television in the main TV program article. The LoE page typically includes a lede, series overview table, lists of episodes for each season, references, maybe a navbox and categories. Once that page becomes too large, or if substantial content for a season is available, a season article (e.g. The Simpsons (season 1) is created for each season. Within the season article an episode table, made from episode table and several instances of episode list (one for each episode), are transcluded to the LoE page where episode summaries are stripped out leaving a bare episode table. However, with some series now having upwards of 30 seasons, this is causing the LoE page to break the post-expand include size limit.

At List of The Simpsons episodes this happened before season 25 started airing. After two years of trying various fixes, implemented what I believe is a rather good resolution. He created List of The Simpsons episodes* (the "*" was chosen to indicate that the page wasn't a separate page per se) as a (for want of a better word) cache page and moved several of the transcluded seasons into that. The lede, series overview table, notes, references, external links, navboxes and categories were all transcluded to their correct spots in the article using labeled section transclusion and links in the TOC and series overview were edited so that, regardless of whether a reader was looking at List of The Simpsons episodes or List of The Simpsons episodes*, clicking a link would result in the reader being directed to the correct spot in the correct article. I later duplicated this effort with List of Casualty episodes when it broke the post-expand include size limit. Since then, other editors have used the same process at other articles with no problems in the past 2.5+ years. However, at List of The Simpsons episodes* exception was taken to the asterisk in the title and it was moved to List of The Simpsons episodes (seasons 1–20). This alone was enough to break the limit again, because of the way that episode list works. There are now two more RM discussions at Talk:List of Casualty episodes* and Talk:List of Holby City episodes* as well as a discussion at Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (television) which may result in the same problems occurring as happened after the List of The Simpsons episodes* move. There are also some suggestions as to how to "fix" these problems, none of which have been proposed by people familiar with this issue, and some of these are what I will politely call "silly". What I'd appreciate is some input here, including suggestions, with the aim of resolving this problem forever without inconveniencing our readers any more than is necessary. Ideally, I'd like to get back to having just one LoE page for a TV program but I don't know if that's possible. -- Aussie Legend  ( ✉ ) 05:03, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I haven't investigated the details but a quick look at List of The Simpsons episodes makes me think that a lot of text is transcluded multiple times. For example, one section is:

Season 21 (2009–10)

 * The Simpsons (season 21) has  around Episode table which calls Episode list/sublist many times, each calling  . The same text is counted for the template expansion size multiple times. A solution would be a little ugly, namely that the templates would be replaced with #invoke of a module, and the module should do all the work to generate a single episode table. Johnuniq (talk) 05:26, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Invoking the modules directly, just at The Simpsons (season 21) did save 23,216 bytes. -- Aussie Legend  ( ✉ ) 06:06, 3 October 2018 (UTC)

Category count wrong
Category:Proposed deletion is telling me that there are six pages in the subcategory Category:Expired proposed deletions of unsourced BLPs but the category is currently actually empty. I don't know how long that error has been there, but it is at least a few days when I first noticed it. <b style="background:#FAFAD2;color:#C08000">Spinning</b><b style="color:#4840A0">Spark</b> 11:23, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * See Village pump (technical)/Archive 169 and T200402 for previous reports. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:27, 3 October 2018 (UTC)

Problem with Translation from another wiki
Hi,

Today, I have translated successfully a part of the German page Liedertafel to a French page Liedertafel.

I also want to put it into a corresponding English page, but I did not succeed, because, when starting the translation from either French to English or from German to English, I got in the translation part a copy of the original French or German text and an error message saying that the translated page already exists. Is it because there is already a disambiguation page Liedertafel?

Please let me know how this issue can be solved, --Réginald alias Meneerke bloem (To reply) 15:50, 2 October 2018 (UTC) PAGE ]]) 17:30, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I get "A page with the title Liedertafel exists in the target wiki. Consider giving the page a different title." I can click the English title and change it. This removes the message. PrimeHunter (talk) 16:10, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
 * When I put "Liedertafel History" as English title the message is indeed removed. But something remains wrong... when I then click in the right part on "Add translation" I get a copy of the French text instead of a translation of it. See translation in progress. Please solve it. --Réginald alias Meneerke bloem (To reply) 04:44, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I thought that we'd turned it off beause of the high proportion of bad content that was created? See WP:CXT. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 08:00, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * , no, just blocked to non-extendedconfirmed users - see Special:AbuseFilter/782 and WP:AN/CXT Galobtter (pingó mió) 08:28, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * and, I am an extendedconfirmed user and it does not work... Please solve it. --Réginald alias Meneerke bloem (To reply) 15:34, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * WP:CXT says machine translation is disabled. When trying to use the tool, I sometimes see MediaWiki:Cx-mt-abuse-warning-text: "Machine translation is disabled in the English Wikipedia (see WP:CXT). You need to make sure that the content is accurate and reads naturally in English.". PrimeHunter (talk) 15:56, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Automatic machine translation is intentionally disabled per WP:CXT. You can turn on the GoogleTrans gadget to assist in translation if you'd like. --Ahecht ([[User talk:Ahecht|<span style="color:#FFF;background:#04A;display:inline-block;padding:1px;vertical-align:-.3em;font:bold 50%/1 sans-serif;text-align:center">TALK

Handling "Warning: Template include size is too large. Some templates will not be included."
So this list article craps out thanks to 1959 calls to the svaraC template. Besides splitting the list, what are the other alternatives that I should look into?—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 14:06, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * , I haven't looked too much into it, but what may help is using  in Module:Svara to load svaraDesc and other pieces of data; using    means that the piece of data will only be loaded once instead of 1959 times. Galobtter (pingó mió) 14:28, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * This looks very promising. Thanks!—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 14:38, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I would also recommend against calling abbr; instead, write what you need into the module directly. The call to Template:Bulleted list probably should go as well; instead invoke Module:List directly. --Izno (talk) 15:07, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Given how simple Template:Efn is, you might also avoid calling the template there and instead write that in Lua. You'll still need to expandTag for the ref tag, but you can bypass the template itself. --Izno (talk) 15:08, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks, . The abbr looks like the culprit. Rather than rework it and efn, I've simply added an option to turn abbr off.—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 17:57, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I think the line can be rewritten trivially as, which is why I suggested it. That way you shouldn't need to hide it behind a user option. --Izno (talk) 18:05, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * That definitely makes a huge difference. But it is not enough for that massive table. While the use of the expanded abbr template only gets to around the "Dheerashankarabharanam" entry (29) in the table, avoiding the template expansion and using the markup directly gets us to around the 66 (Chitrāmbari) mark. Considering that the table could see more entries, it might be best to avoid the abbr altogether. I suspect that this is the only page where it will be used. Cheers.—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 18:25, 3 October 2018 (UTC)

Redirect review
Hi. I got a notification regarding a redirect I created via Articles for creation/Redirects was reviewed. However, the reviewer seemed to be an IP. Can anyone explain what is happening? Here is the screenshot. —AE  ( talk  •  contributions )12:44, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Hmm? Yeah, that does seem quite strange. Looks like the IP legit added a log entry marking the page as reviewed. I don't believe that is supposed to be technically possible, and I can image that it may have potential for abuse. You may want to raise the issue at WP:VPT.  G M G  <sup style="color:#000;font-family:Impact">talk  12:48, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * The IP reviewed more than one article: See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Log/2606:A000:83C5:7200:556E:7DD2:BCA6:57AD. --Vexations (talk) 13:17, 3 October 2018 (UTC)


 * T206130 opened for this issue. — xaosflux  Talk 13:36, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * This has been confirmed to be a bug, a patch has been written and is pending deployment. See the phab ticket for more information. —  xaosflux  Talk 21:28, 3 October 2018 (UTC)

How to measure if there is a gender bias in the articles nominated for deletion and deleted?
Hi all

I'd like to try and understand if there is a gender bias in the article deletion process (which could come from the lack of available sources etc), both in nominations and actual deletions. Is there some way that this could be defined automatically with a bot or other automatic process? My assumption is that Wikidata could be helpful in understanding this.

Thanks

John Cummings (talk) 23:22, 3 October 2018 (UTC)


 * The deletion log is public information. Anecdotally, I'd be very surprised if there's any gender bias; more articles on men than women are deleted, but that's because there are generally more men than women who appear to feel the need to write poorly-sourced autobiographies or who form non-notable bands, rather than because Wikipedia has any kind of anti-male agenda. If you want permission to view deleted revisions so you can assess the sourcing on the deleted articles, your only route to that is via RFA—that only people who have passed RFA can view deleted content is a requirement made by WMF Legal so unfortunately isn't negotiable. &#8209; Iridescent 23:35, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I presume that this relates to the recent publicity around the late appearance of an article on Donna Strickland; nothing until she won her Nobel Prize. News media appear to have many misunderstandings of the process which led to the previous rejection of a poor draft article on her ... but if we step back from the details, they do have a good point about the consequences of en.wp's well-documented systemic bias. WP:WOMRED does great work trying to close the gap, but there is a mountain to climb.
 * From my own experience, I make an unscientific judgement that there appears to be an unconscious gender bias in multiple respects. For example, it seems to me that biogs on women are more likely to be given leeway when judged against the same criteria on which male biogs are judged; that women are less likely to fall within the massively generous special notabilty guidelines such as WP:NSPORT; and I have a hunch that biogs of women are less likely to receive an intensive response from the Article Rescue Squadron.
 * Most of this is probably unconscious, but some such bias is an inevitable consequence of the huge gender imbalance in the pool of editors. It is long overdue for some scholarly research. -- Brown <span style="display:inline-block;transform:rotate(-3deg)">Haired Girl (talk) • (contribs) 00:06, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
 * There's a similar discussion at WT:N (well before the Strickland issue) that resulted from the WMF observing that history's documentation is unfortunately biased towards white males, which is something we can't change but can try to fix today. But at the same time, with current living and active people we have to watch for those people to try to use WP in a promotional mode when they really don't have any notability, and this happens often within academics too. Its the type of gap that Strickland's prior state (before winning the Nobel) fell into - she might possibly have been considered notable given the draft article's state, but it also has signs it was promotional in nature, considering that a previously deleted version of her article was 100% copyvio. There's no clear answer outside of trying to make editors creating new article on any person be as effective as possible in sourcing to show notability, and those reviewing those articles to be less judgemental about edge cases that don't seem to reek of self-promotion. --M asem (t) 00:41, 4 October 2018 (UTC)


 * One of the difficulties of this is having an 'unbiased' baseline. If Wikipedia has say, a 80%-20% breakdown of male/female biographies, and the AFD nominations are 70%-30% male/female, does that '10%' difference show that women biographies are held to (unfairly) higher standard at AFD, or does that show that female biographies are likelier to be about less notable women and are unfairly common. Or does that show there's a per-field inherent bias (e.g. physics is better covered, thus more men are covered since physics is historically speaking very male-dominated), or does that show there's a per-field writer bias (e.g. people with a physics background are better at writing an article that sticks, so physicists get more coverage, which in turn mean more coverage of men), etc...


 * It's not something that's easily answered, but it's something any researchers will have to think about when analyzing data. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 00:42, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

watchlist or Recent Changes showing too few changes, kludge to URL
Both the watchlist and the Recent Changes when filtered for my watchlist only were today listing too few changes. When set for 500 changes, the watchlist showed 50; when set for 50, it showed 5. Repeatedly changing settings in the on-page controls to less and more, for number of days and number of changes, did not solve the problem. Recent Changes set for watchlist only, 30 days, and 1,000 changes showed 6 days and 56 changes. What did apparently solve it was editing either URL's limit parameter's value from 500 to 5000 or from 1000 to 10000. The edit disappears but still has the desired effect. However, most people won't know to try that. I discovered the problem today; the previous time I logged in was a week ago, the watchlist was okay then, and I probably haven't used Recent Changes in years, if ever. Nick Levinson (talk) 23:44, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

New info: Essentially the above behavior, in Firefox (62.0 (64-bit) (firefox - 1.0)), is in Chromium (69.0.3497.92 (Developer Build) Fedora Project (64-bit)). (Addition: 23:59, 29 September 2018 (UTC))
 * Hello Nick Levinson, do you have that issue with the following links (they will disable possible conflicts): RC and watchlist? Thanks, Trizek (WMF) (talk) 16:06, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Here are the test results, Trizek (WMF):
 * For an up-to-date baseline a few minutes before beginning the test on Oct. 2, I logged in and reran access to my watchlist through the top navbar and Recent Changes through the left navbar and got essentially the old problem. For the watchlist, I got 248 or more (but probably only a few more) changes over 9 days, not 1,000 or 30, but then I edited the URL and got what I should have gotten the first time. For Recent Changes, virtually the same things happened, including that editing the URL fixed it; the main difference was in getting 252 changes, not 248. Then I logged out, quit the browser (Firefox (not updated since my opening post)), restarted the same browser, and logged into Wikipedia.
 * I followed your RC link. The Recent Changes page displayed, ready for 50 changes, 7 days, and default filters. The resulting list was okay, yielding 50 changes all in one day. Then I changed to 1,000 changes and 7 days, which yielded "[d]ue to a technical error, no results could be loaded. Please try refreshing the page." I refreshed, using the browser button to refresh, and the resulting list was okay. Then I deleted all of the filters and added only the filter for On Watchlist. The result was okay. But then I changed to 30 days (keeping to 1,000 changes) and that yielded only 252 changes for 9 days. Then I edited the URL (1000 to 10000) and then the results were okay.
 * I followed your Watchlist link. The default of 250 changes and 3 days was okay. Then setting to 30 days was okay. Then setting to 1000 changes was okay. But then I removed all filters and that failed, yielding only 252 changes and 9 days. Then I edited the URL (1000 to 10000) and the result was okay.
 * Today, I accessed my watchlist. It's set to 1,000 changes and 30 days (I forgot what filters were in place), but it listed only 296 changes over only 10 days. Later today, I accessed it again, got 320 changes, edited the URL, saw filters were in place, took all filters out, and got >30 days.
 * However, today's earlier failed access showed that the earliest date was September 24. That's what it was yesterday, too, when I didn't fix it. So, did something happen at your servers on September 24 to cause this problem? My earliest change was time-stamped 15:07 (3:07p), I think in my local time zone (New York EDT), so the problem may have happened on that day but before that time.
 * I originally counted changes either by eyeballing if not many or else by using Find for "(diff | hist)" (without quotation marks) and, lately, " log)" (without quotation marks but with a leading space). Firefox displayed how many matches it found. Doing "(diff | hist)" alone meant I probably missed a few but not many.
 * I treat changes and days as either-or, i.e., if either condition is satisfied then the results are okay as both conditions do not have to be satisfied.
 * I don't know what conflicts might apply. My Watchlist defaults of 1,000 changes and 30 days date from the introduction of the current watchlist design (the design storing my preferences of 1,000 and 30 so I no longer have to opt for 30 every time I come to the watchlist), but the above problem is only a few days old, not more than a week older than that. Since I edited on September 18 and opened this thread on Sep. 29 and, almost certainly, saw the watchlist on those days, the fault must have come in between those dates.
 * Nick Levinson (talk) 20:08, 3 October 2018 (UTC) (Corrected & clarified: 20:25, 3 October 2018 (UTC))
 * Thank you for that details report, Nick Levinson. We are investigating. Trizek (WMF) (talk) 15:25, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

Audio recording software
Anybody have any recommendations for a (preferably) free open source software for recording/editing spoken audio recordings of articles? I would have posted this at WikiProject Spoken Wikipedia, but it seems pretty dagum dead there. G M G <sup style="color:#000;font-family:Impact">talk  18:57, 18 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Audacity is quite popular lately and simple to use (it's not necessarily for voice recordings only, however). — Paleo  Neonate  – 19:37, 18 September 2018 (UTC)
 * If I'm not mistaken I think I used Audacity some ten-odd years ago in college, but I don't remember it having any kind of editing functionality. My intuition was to do two takes and splice the paragraphs together for which ever was the better take. But the last time I messed with audio editing I was (again) in college, and I don't own any fancy pants software anymore.  G M G  <sup style="color:#000;font-family:Impact">talk  19:41, 18 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Audacity does allow editing audio, and it should allow doing what you want re splicing pretty easily Galobtter (pingó mió) 21:47, 18 September 2018 (UTC)
 * . Second Audacity. Standard tool used by the LibriVox community. A helpful page. -- Green  C  13:34, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I downloaded it last night and did a couple of test runs. But I'm going to have to dig through the stacks of boxes that are the remnants of my music room to find one of my old USB mics. The mic on my laptop bottoms out on any subtle inflection and basically records nothing.  G M G  <sup style="color:#000;font-family:Impact">talk  13:41, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I'd also recommend Audacity. I use it several times a month, at least. As for the mic, if you have to buy one I'd recommend a Blue Yet as a relatively cheap mic that's very popular with youtubers. Don't forget the pop filter. I have one and while it's not quite studio quality, it's close enough to produce professional-sounding audio with the right post-processing. I also have a bunch of tips for processing vocal audio, if you're interested. Let me know at my talk page. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants   Tell me all about it.  14:23, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Take a look at Ocenaudio. It's not open source but it's free.   — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mbrou (talk • contribs) 16:46, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Another option, if you don't mind using command lines, is SoX. It is cross-platform, but is pretty standard in Linux. The upside is that it works very well if you know how to use it; the downside is that it is a bit arcane to learn how to use, especially since there is no GUI. Other than SoX, and especially if a GUI is a must, I concur with the Audacity recommendations. —Nøkkenbuer (talk • contribs) 16:30, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

Revision deleted history of article
I'm trying to look at the rev del'd history of Space fountain. I'm seeing the usual message saying "As an administrator, you can still view this revision if you wish to proceed" with a link on the "view this revision" bit, but when I click on it I don't get the revision. All I get is another similar message telling me I can view it, but without the link. Any ideas what's going on here? Doesn't seem to be an office action as far as I can tell from the log. <b style="background:#FAFAD2;color:#C08000">Spinning</b><b style="color:#4840A0">Spark</b> 15:08, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Had the same problem the other day - deleted revisions seem to come up blank (it confused an oversighter as well). To view it, click on "view this revision", then "edit this page", then "Show preview".  I have no idea what change prompted this; I presume it's a bug. Black Kite (talk) 15:15, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Seems to be a bug, we should get a phab ticket open, I'll try to later if no one else does. Note, if you compare versions (view this diff) it appears to work fine as well. — xaosflux  Talk 15:29, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I filed T205578. Anomie⚔ 20:23, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you, I made a note within MediaWiki:Rev-deleted-text-unhide in case any admins are wondering what is going on. — xaosflux  Talk 14:43, 29 September 2018 (UTC)


 * Note, this is expected to be fixed on WP:ITSTHURSDAY. — xaosflux  Talk 01:43, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * this is now fixed, thanks for letting us know! — xaosflux  Talk 22:46, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

Unicode help with macrons and dots
This module uses macrons and dots to denote pitch and octave. There are cases where I need to use both diacritics on the same character and I'm unable to find clean solutions for some instances. For example,  looks quite legible. However, '̱Ṛ',,  ,  , etc. do not. Are there alternate diacritics that can be used? Something which is at least as legible as this precomposed character,  (although the dot should be above the macron)? Thanks.—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 14:48, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
 * The examples you give have the combining marks places before the letter and I think that causes the problem (effectively, the combining mark is applies to the apostrophe before the letter). They should be after the letter ("In Unicode, diacritics are always added after the main character"). Here are the examples you give, corrected:,  ,  ,   (although I'm not sure what is the intended order of the combining marks here). Matma Rex talk 15:47, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you. Do the characters you've typed render correctly in your browser? They (2 of the 4) don't in mine (Chrome, FF). I'm seeing the macrons and dots below/above the subsequent single quote. Also, the ideal order is for the dots to be below the "macron below" and above the "macron above".—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 16:33, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, they render fine. The monospace font may be less well supported, so let's try them in the normal font too. Here they are again for side-by-side comparison:


 * This table renders like this on my machine (Windows 10, Chromium 69): https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/F26308540 and at 300% zoom: https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/F26308537 Matma Rex talk 17:18, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Firefox 63 has trouble with the monospace font: https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/F26308570 Matma Rex talk 17:20, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you. I see that I've been misled by the monospace code font. But I'm afraid that your correct version (which is a great improvement) doesn't render on Chrome/Linux and FF/Linux exactly as in your images. This is what I see at 100% and 300% zoom. What do you recommend be done here? Could other editors please let me know how these characters render in their browsers + OS? Thanks.—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 19:03, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Opera 36. I get little squares that float above or below by the height of one text line, as a result of which they obscure unrelated characters on adjacent lines. This makes text difficult to read, and is consequently an accessibility issue. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 22:32, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you. It looks as good as Matma Rex's screenshots on Opera 55/Windows 7. It looks virtually identical to my Chrome/Linux screenshots on Opera 56/Linux.—Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 06:45, 5 October 2018 (UTC)

Links to Harry Potter wiki
Can some one please fix the links to the Harry Potter wiki? They're handled usinf Template:HarryPotterWiki. 89.139.69.176 (talk) 20:12, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * What's wrong with them? Someguy1221 (talk) 20:14, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
 * They're supposed to link to wikia's Harry Potter wiki; they don't. For example, the link on Hermione Granger points to http://www.wikia.com/wiki/c:harrypotter:Hermione_Granger in stead of http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Hermione_Granger where it should. 89.139.69.176 (talk) 19:20, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Works for me. Perhaps something was fixed. Killiondude (talk) 19:24, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Wikia has it set up so that you will be redirected to the right place. No change is needed. --Izno (talk) 19:33, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Yep. This is how it has worked for at least 10 years. Someguy1221 (talk) 02:29, 5 October 2018 (UTC)
 * On my smart phone, it doesn't work - I get a 404 page. 89.139.69.176 (talk) 12:13, 5 October 2018 (UTC)
 * It works for me in Safari on an iPad. What is your smartphone? Are you using the builtin browser or another app? PrimeHunter (talk) 12:26, 5 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I tried http://www.redirect-checker.org/index.php on http://www.wikia.com/wiki/c:harrypotter:Hermione_Granger with many different options in the "Set User-Agent" field. iPad gave a working redirect 301 Moved Permanently but many other mobile devices reported 404 Not Found, e.g. iPhone 5. Can somebody with an iPhone confirm it is broken with the default user agent? PrimeHunter (talk) 12:39, 5 October 2018 (UTC)
 * PrimeHunter, I get a 404 Error on my iPhone using Chrome and Safari, but it's from Wikia itself and not a general browser error. To be more clear, the Wikia/Fandom skin is loading with "Error 404 [new line] Sorry, we can't find the page you are looking for." Killiondude (talk) 15:52, 5 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks. HarryPotterWiki uses Wikia which currently makes a url with . This uses the entry   in meta:Interwiki map. I haven't found a working replacement for user agent iPhone when $1 contains both wiki name and page name, e.g. when $1 is  . Wikia could be recoded to split it into http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Hermione_Granger but I don't know a general solution for the interwiki map. As far as I know, the whole $1 has to be inserted in one position of the url. Are  broken redirects on some mobile devices a new problem we can expect Wikia to fix? PrimeHunter (talk) 16:57, 5 October 2018 (UTC)

Template request
&#123;&#123;3x&#124;p&#125;&#125;ery (talk) 14:56, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

InternetArchiveBot still bar in titles
The nifty user:InternetArchiveBot (IABot) is still leaving vertical bars "|" in expanded cite titles (rather than put "|" ) when generating the full cite web (plus adding retro access-date). Some titles even have a newline+space before the bar "|" so the problem is either newlines or pipe-bars (or both) in generated titles. Otherwise, the generated web-archive links are fantastic to fix dead-url links & IABot does add correct "archivedate=". These bars in titles have been retained in hundreds of pages, when rescuing deadlinks for several months (see numerous pages among: "Category:Pages with citations using unnamed parameters"). Please help fix IABot, because it might be harder than it seems. -Wikid77 (talk) 00:03, 6 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Have you raised this as an issue at the links on User talk:InternetArchiveBot before coming here? --Izno (talk) 00:41, 6 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I reported it on October 3 using the recommended phabricator bug-reporting interface. – Jonesey95 (talk) 04:06, 6 October 2018 (UTC)


 * Known bugs previously reported. It's two issues. There are reserved characters in URLs that should be urlencoded (%7C). There are reserved characters in CS1|2 templates that should be HTML encoded (or, using the wiki template shortcuts). -- Green  C  15:04, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

Lucy Li
Should the age for "October 1, 2002" at Lucy Li not read age 16 instead of 15? Please ping me when you reply. --Jax 0677 (talk) 16:56, 6 October 2018 (UTC)
 * The page was cached. A WP:PURGE took care of it. --Izno (talk) 16:58, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

Horizontal scrolling box?
I want to paste some long lines of pre-formatted text. Is there some way to give the browser a hint that I want these to scroll horizontally rather than be folded? Yeah, I know, I've got several toes over the "semantic vs display markup" line. -- RoySmith (talk) 16:51, 6 October 2018 (UTC) Hmmm. Well, I spent a bit of time futzing with this. The end result is I didn't make things any worse than it was before, which I consider a victory when it comes to CSS :-) If anybody wants to poke at it more, be my guest.  -- RoySmith (talk) 21:35, 6 October 2018 (UTC)
 * CSS overflow + direct use of <pre ></pre> rather than the wikitext version (which uses spaces before each line). --Izno (talk) 16:53, 6 October 2018 (UTC)
 * And you might need to set whitespace: nowrap on the pre as well. --Izno (talk) 16:57, 6 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks. I was kind of hoping, however, for something that didn't require trading in several toes for both feet :-)  -- RoySmith (talk) 17:33, 6 October 2018 (UTC)
 * w3schools can be misleading and confusing at the same time. You don't need to mess with style sheets, just remove the space from the start of each line, wrap the block in a  element and add a   attribute containing the appropriate declaration:   You don't need to worry about the   property, that's set by the   element. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 20:38, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

External links in edit summaries
Is there something technical precluding edit summaries from correctly formatting external links that are in single square brackets, such as this one and <--this one? If not, I'll be creating a proposal at WP:VPR. &#8213; Mandruss  &#9742;  00:38, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Are you asking about making " click here " work as a link in an edit summary? I have no idea about the background but allowing clickable links in edit summaries would be a bad idea as it would invite an avalanche of spam that was hard to remove. Johnuniq (talk) 01:07, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Interesting. I've often wished external links worked in edit summaries, so I could include diffs, permalinks, and the like.  I hadn't thought of the spam issue.  I assume most of the things I wanted to link to as bare URLs are actually accessible as Special: links, if only I put in the effort to find the right incantation :-)  -- RoySmith (talk) 01:30, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * There should be a script available here to turn a bare URL of a diff/permalink into a Special:Diff or permalink. I use a script run locally to do that but I can't make it work when a diff is more than "prev" or "permalink" URLs because I can't see a reliable way to know which of the others has been chosen. Johnuniq (talk) 01:53, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Special:Diff/862839225 (for diff-from-previous), Special:Diff/862834630/862839225 (for comparing two non-consecutive versions), Special:Permalink/862839225. All may be piped. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 07:47, 7 October 2018 (UTC)

Changing access-date attribute language
In the template Template:Cite Web, I would like to know the method by which I can use Malayalam month name for the attribute access-date.Adithyak1997 (talk) 19:11, 6 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I guess you are referring to the version at the Malayalam Wikipedia. If you have the same templates and modules then Module:Citation/CS1/Configuration can be translated at ml:Module:Citation/CS1/Configuration. There is a comment at  saying "replace these English date names with the local language equivalents". PrimeHunter (talk) 19:18, 6 October 2018 (UTC)
 * @PrimeHunter, Please do read the I S _ V A L I D _ A C C E S S D A T E section in Module:Citation/CS1/Date validation. I have doubt regarding that.Adithyak1997 (talk) 19:29, 6 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I didn't code the modules and haven't tried to configure them at other languages but I suggest you just try and see if it works. Maybe the modules are smart enough to first convert month names defined in ml:Module:Citation/CS1/Configuration. PrimeHunter (talk) 19:37, 6 October 2018 (UTC)
 * For you ~ --Izno (talk) 20:06, 6 October 2018 (UTC)
 * The problem was solved but not completely. I have changed as directed by you, the names into malayalam. The current problem is that the date 2013 February 14 is not supported. It supports only 14 February 2013.Adithyak1997 (talk) 20:18, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

Adithyak1997: I have tweaked ml:ഘടകം:Citation/CS1/Date validation to support YYYY mmmmm DD date formats and also added same to Module:Citation/CS1/Date validation/sandbox though at en.wiki, this format is disabled. Are there any other en.wiki-disallowed formats that should be supported at ml.wiki? Are there en.wiki formats that should not be supported at ml.wiki?

—Trappist the monk (talk) 22:16, 6 October 2018 (UTC) @Trappist the monk, now the errors have come down. But the format 2013 ഫെബ്രുവരി 14 is not yet supported. You can check in [this] document Adithyak1997 (talk) 08:02, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * The string "ഫെബ്രുവരി" does not occur in the linked page. The page has many "Check date values in: |accessdate=" but those I examined were all for the month string "മേയ്" which does not occur in ml:Module:Citation/CS1/Configuration. I don't know whether this is about some variation of how to write months in Malayalam but please post real examples when you report issues. PrimeHunter (talk) 08:40, 7 October 2018 (UTC)

I am sorry. It was a problem caused from my side.I will correct it soon.Adithyak1997 (talk) 08:50, 7 October 2018 (UTC)

adding personal sandbox link at upper right
At en.wiki I have a link to my personal sandbox between the links to my talk page and preferences at upper right. Some wikis don't have that. I noticed this while tweaking stuff at ml.wiki. I have looked in preferences for a switch but no joy there. I looked in an ml.wiki page source for something resembling  but that doesn't exist so it would appear that I can't use css to display something that is normally hidden. So, he asked, how do I get MediaWiki to give me a link to my own sandbox on wikis that don't normally provide it? Can I?

—Trappist the monk (talk) 14:55, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * The link is added by mw:Extension:SandboxLink. If there is consensus to add the link for all users at mlwiki, a request can be made on Phabricator. Otherwise, users can use something like  in their common.js to add a link. —&thinsp;JJMC89&thinsp; (T·C) 16:13, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * That works, thank you.
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 16:39, 7 October 2018 (UTC)

Ref tag error message but not using ref tags....
Sup, Techpumpers. See, this new article is composed solely of footnotes and referencing, and yet, if you look at the #Indictment section, there's that " tags? And, of course—more importantly  :)  —how do I get rid of it; I've done multiple ctrl+f searches and can't find anything to remove. Any advice gratefully received!  ——'''  SerialNumber  54129  16:51, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * == empty <ref ></ref>
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 16:55, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks, I was being a little too literal I see; I assumed it meant just those tags, rather than the note tag too. Many thanks for such quick help! Happy Sunday! ——  SerialNumber  54129  17:00, 7 October 2018 (UTC)

Page not found message search link not searching in non-article namespaces
For example, going to Category:Halogen oxyacids results in this message:
 * Some users may not see the shown message at red links but at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Halogen_oxyacids. The namespace was removed from the search in [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template:No_article_text&diff=856631699&oldid=856564402 this] edit to No article text by Dinoguy1000. PrimeHunter (talk) 20:19, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * The namespace has been excluded for longer than that, though there's a pretty good chance I'm still the one responsible for it . It looks like the namespace has been excluded for years, and/or handled inconsistently between different search links in the template. In any case, the removal was accidental. I've "fixed" it by adding the namespace to the search term, though a better fix might be to exclude the namespace as it did before, and instead automatically select that namespace to be searched in. 「 ディノ 奴 千？！ 」☎ Dinoguy1000 20:45, 7 October 2018 (UTC)

changing image in portal box
Hello. On April 7, at Portal talk:Espionage I requested to change the image of. Currently the image is File:Fbi duquesne.jpg. A few minutes ago, I was going to change it boldly to another neutral, and "global" image. But I couldnt find where the source code of. Could someone please point me in the right direction? Also pinging who might know about it. Regards, — <span class="monospaced" style="font-family: monospace, monospace;">usernamekiran (talk)  22:41, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * that image is controlled at: Module:Portal/images/i. — xaosflux  Talk 23:08, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I thought so! But I wasnt sure when I saw it for the first time. Could you please change the current image with File:Spy silhouette document.svg? Or should i make a formal request on the talkpage? — <span class="monospaced" style="font-family: monospace, monospace;">usernamekiran (talk)  23:14, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I activated an edit request for you at Portal_talk:Espionage. — xaosflux  Talk 23:31, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * thanks a lot! — <span class="monospaced" style="font-family: monospace, monospace;">usernamekiran (talk)  00:08, 8 October 2018 (UTC)

Citoid issue
While writing a source list on User:Jo-Jo Eumerus/Horizon Guyot I've noticed that Citoid sometimes fails to expand DOIs, specifically 10.2973/dsdp.proc.17.103.1973, 10.2973/dsdp.proc.17.110.1973, 10.2973/dsdp.proc.17.121.1973, 10.2973/dsdp.proc.30.107.1975, 10.2973/dsdp.proc.55.117.1980, 10.2973/dsdp.proc.55.115.1980, 10.2973/dsdp.proc.34.128.1976, 10.2973/dsdp.proc.34.128.1976 and 10.2973/dsdp.proc.17.118.1973. What is odd is that Citoid handles the other DOIs of this series just fine, and that DxDOI works on these identifiers. JoJo Eumerus mobile (talk) 10:03, 3 October 2018 (UTC)


 * Calling User:Mvolz (WMF)... Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 18:43, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
 * These do seem to work in the api https://en.wikipedia.org/api/rest_v1/#!/Citation/getCitation, i.e. https://en.wikipedia.org/api/rest_v1/data/citation/mediawiki/10.2973%2Fdsdp.proc.17.103.1973 ... but they are very slow so plausibly it's timing out in the front end before the data is sent. This should have been fixed by T165105 though :/. Mvolz (WMF) (talk) 09:43, 8 October 2018 (UTC)

Pop-ups oddity - does not display lead but instead a following section
When I hover over a link to Operation Hope Not, the pop-up shows the text of the section "Plan", and not the text of the lead. What causes this and how can it be fixed? Thank you, DuncanHill (talk) 10:09, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * This fixed it. For some reason the software doesn't pick up the bolded lead where the image syntax is not on its own line.  I reported this a few weeks ago and it was fixed in the same way. As I said at the time, it's still a bug, though. Black Kite (talk) 10:18, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you. DuncanHill (talk) 10:19, 8 October 2018 (UTC)

Bot edits may appear in Recent Changes when they shouldn't
I've noticed several times that the Recent Changes filter to exclude bot edits doesn't always work, and bot edits may show up anyway. It's happened to me about three times so far; however, I managed to take a screenshot of it happening only right now. Can it be fixed? It's not a major problem, but it's odd. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Diamond Blizzard (talk • contribs) 23:33, 7 October 2018 (UTC) I don't know how to increase the image size, so click on it to see it clearly. Diamond Blizzard  talk  23:37, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * If you're talking about ClueBot NG's edits in Recent Changes, I think ClueBot NG edits are not marked as bot edits because these edits might need human review. <b style="color:#090">Semi</b><b style="color:#099">Hypercube</b> ✎ 23:38, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * This - the filter is slightly misleading, it doesn't exclude "bot accounts" but "bot flagged edits". Some bots make certain edits without this flag on purpose. —  xaosflux  Talk 23:39, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Now I remember that! However, I think (although I'm not sure) that I've seen other bot edits which should be marked as bot edits show up even with the filter as well. If I see any of those, I will take a screenshot. Diamond Blizzard   talk  23:42, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I just found an example with AnomieBOT showing up. Are its edits also not flagged as bot edits, and if so, why? AnomieBOT edits showing up even with no bot edit filter.png — Preceding unsigned comment added by Diamond Blizzard (talk • contribs) 23:56, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * You would see a b next to where the m usually is were the edit expected to be hidden by the filter. --Izno (talk) 00:17, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * That is Bots/Requests for approval/AnomieBOT 21. Basically, if a bot is making a "content" type edit, or making an edit that would otherwise be useful for humans to know about (like publishing a report) it doesn't use the "bot flag" - specifically so it does show up on watch lists and recent changes. When making edits that would mostly waste people time to check (like fixing a syntax error on many pages, executing a CFD closure, etc) it uses a bot flag. — xaosflux  Talk 00:19, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * In that specific task, whether to use a bot flag or not is actually taken from the options of the User:AnomieBOT/RandomPage template. &#123;&#123;3x&#124;p&#125;&#125;ery (talk) 18:05, 8 October 2018 (UTC)

Prevent categories from transcluding?
Please see Administrators' noticeboard for background. Is it possible to construct a page so that it does not transclude categories from other pages it transcludes? For example, can Template:Admin dashboard be set up so that it will never transclude a category from its child pages? This appears to be an open route to unconstructive silliness. Ivanvector (Talk/Edits) 14:29, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Interpreted strictly, the answer is no, but you can some pretty close by using Strip categories. &#123;&#123;3x&#124;p&#125;&#125;ery (talk) 14:33, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * , would " " prevent transclusion of the page's categories? Home Lander (talk) 16:44, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * No, it would have to be   &#123;&#123;3x&#124;p&#125;&#125;ery (talk) 18:04, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * , ✅. Ping me if I did it wrong. Home Lander (talk) 19:00, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * , for clarity's sake, the thread is at WP:ANI; above link does not work. Home Lander (talk) 16:41, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks, silly mistake on my part. Ivanvector (Talk/Edits) 16:42, 8 October 2018 (UTC)

Wikiproject page
What happened to the "Categories and other projects section" of main page? I think ending is missing but I don't know what code is needed. Why it is not classified by "Category" class ("class=Category")? "Category:Category-Class Basshunter articles" is also missing. Eurohunter (talk) 18:08, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * A WikiProject for only around 30 articles sounds like a very poor idea. The main article Basshunter only has around 600 daily page views. That also hints too little interest. PrimeHunter (talk) 19:59, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * This is not what this topic refers to but I don't expect big interest anyway now so I'm okey with it. I think some people are around, let's give it time (it's few hours after creation of the project). I know it can take longer time to find active users (few months or even years). I like WikiProject page because it clearly shows what is to do and it shows direction. Eurohunter (talk) 21:03, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * You originally asked this at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Council (where I have replied). Please observe WP:MULTI. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 22:13, 8 October 2018 (UTC)

Tech News: 2018-41
<section begin="technews-2018-W41"/> Latest tech news from the Wikimedia technical community. Please tell other users about these changes. Not all changes will affect you. Translations are available.

Recent changes
 * The Education Program extension was removed from all Wikimedia projects. You can use the Programs and Events Dashboard or the Fountain instead.

Problems
 * There was a problem when you copied and pasted from a table with the visual editor. It could add  where it shouldn't be. This has now been fixed.

Changes later this week
 * Because of a data centre test you will be able to read but not edit the wikis for up to an hour on 10 October. This will start at 14:00 (UTC). You might lose edits if you try to save during this time. The time when you can't edit might be shorter than an hour. You can read more about this.
 * Because of the data centre test there will be no new version of MediaWiki this week. Changes for this week will come next week instead.

Meetings
 * Octicons-sync.svg Octicons-tools.svg You can join the technical advice meeting on IRC. During the meeting, volunteer developers can ask for advice. The meeting will be on 10 October at 15:00 (UTC). See how to join.

Tech news prepared by Tech News writers and posted by bot • Contribute • Translate • Get help • Give feedback • Subscribe or unsubscribe. <section end="technews-2018-W41"/> 23:37, 8 October 2018 (UTC)

Incorrect error message displayed by
The home_town parameter was added to Infobox academic several months ago. On articles in which the parameter is used (e.g., Aaron Riches), the following error message appears in the preview when editing: "" It also adds the articles to Category:Pages using infobox academic with unknown parameters. Does anyone know what might be causing this? 142.160.89.97 (talk) 00:52, 9 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Fixed. The parameter needed to be added to a separate list at the bottom. &#123;&#123;3x&#124;p&#125;&#125;ery (talk) 01:02, 9 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks!! 142.160.89.97 (talk) 01:16, 9 October 2018 (UTC)

Category: Modify talk page links to go to the article instead
I know it can be done, I just don't know how. Category:Unknown-importance A1 Grand Prix articles for example lists Talk pages (since the WP banner is there) but clicking on a link leads to the article instead. Can someone tell me how to do that with another category, specifically Category:Video game articles requesting identifying art? Regards So  Why  18:11, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * You are probably loading a script related to the assessment scheme which does that for the former. --Izno (talk) 18:25, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Interesting. I didn't know that one of my scripts did that. You are right of course. Shame, would have been great if there was another way. Regards So  Why  19:14, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * , you might be interested in User:Equazcion/CatListMainTalkLinks.js, it shows the corresponding item to a talk or article in a category in a parenthetica linkl. I think that should offer what you like?  I've got a version at User:Amorymeltzer/CatListMainTalkLinks.js which shows a history link as well. ~  Amory <small style="color:#555"> (u • t • c) 21:54, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Nice, thanks for the tip! That will make strolling through the category faster. Regards So  Why  07:06, 9 October 2018 (UTC)

File locked in Russian Wiki?
This file seems to be locked up in the Russian Wiki. It appears in in the Russian version of Crimean-Nogai Raids (ru:Крымско-ногайские набеги на Русь), third image from top, but will not display in the English Wikipedia.

Am I doing something wrong? Do some files need a switch to use in other languages(??)Benjamin Trovato (talk) 18:20, 9 October 2018 (UTC)
 * The image needs to be either on Commons or on the English Wikipedia. You cannot use an image from another language's Wikipedia.  RudolfRed (talk) 18:24, 9 October 2018 (UTC)


 * ✅ Should work fine now.  G M G  <sup style="color:#000;font-family:Impact">talk  18:27, 9 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you. Works in my sandbox. Please close. Benjamin Trovato (talk) 19:47, 9 October 2018 (UTC)

Easier links to Special pages
Forking the discussion in, above, it would be nice if the Special links were included as text in the pages they generate. For example, if I go to my watchlist and click in the diff link for The Bronx, I get to a page which is titled, The Bronx: Difference between revisions, with a URL of https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=The_Bronx&curid=3338&diff=862891580&oldid=862848213. If I want to generate the corresponding Special link, i.e. Special:Diff/862891580/862848213, I need to hand-construct that by copy-pasting bits out of the URL bar. Even if I know the syntax, it's still a pain. Multiply-so on mobile. But, if the text Special:Diff/862891580/862848213 appeared on the page itself, I could just copy that entire string, just like I would copy the title of a normal article. See attached screenshot for example. Similarly, any page which was (or could be) generated via a Special link should include, as text, the properly constructed self-link. -- RoySmith (talk) 14:04, 7 October 2018 (UTC) Anyway, this belongs at WP:VPI or WP:VPRdepending on whether you consider your proposal fully formed and VPR-readynot here. &#8213; Mandruss  &#9742;  18:56, 7 October 2018 (UTC) PAGE ]]) 22:05, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Support in principle. Should not be a clickable link, as it's not particularly easy to copy a clickable link without clicking it (I can usually pull it off, but I would consider that an "advanced" skill). If you click it, the string you want to copy does not occur anywhere on the resulting page. If there is a way to facilitate the copy operation (like how Firefox automatically selects/highlights the URL field when you click anywhere within it) that would be a good thing.
 * Could belong here if all is desired is a userscript to do it Galobtter (pingó mió) 18:59, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Oppose scripts for features that benefit virtually everybody, for reasons I've articulated elsewhere. &#8213; Mandruss  &#9742;  19:01, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Side note : Just FYI, you can copy a clickable link by holding ALT and selecting text. (not something I expect many people to know, but a useful trick nonetheless) rchard2scout (talk) 19:13, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * That saves you the, but you still have to select, so it does nothing about the aforementioned "not-particularly-easiness" of selecting without clicking. &#8213; Mandruss  &#9742;  19:17, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Retract the preceding, which I would just remove if I hadn't pinged you. It appears that the prevents a click, so my comment doesn't apply. It's still quite cumbersome to do, especially when using a laptop without a mouse. For me it requires two hands and three fingers, and every bit of my manual dexterity. &#8213; Mandruss   &#9742;  19:26, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Actually, I hadn't actually intended it to be clickable. That was just a side-effect of my crudely hacking up the generated HTML in a browser window.  I'll play around with some other wireframes and see if I can get something that looks useful.  -- RoySmith (talk) 20:45, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
 * All the browsers that I've used on a desktop make it easy to copy clickable links using a mouse. In each one, you hover over the link, right-click, and select an option from the menu. The name of the option varies though; in Firefox it is "Copy link location"; in Chrome and Opera it is "Copy link address"; in IE it's "Copy Shortcut"; in Safari it's "Copy link". -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 07:06, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Firefox "Copy link location" copies the link's target, not its text. For example, using it on Special:Diff/862891580/862848213 gives . Sure, you can strip off the   after the paste, but the extra step makes it a wash between that and just trying to select without clicking. Either way is too much to ask of the average Wikipedia editor (never mind the below-average Wikipedia editor!). &#8213; Mandruss   &#9742;  17:27, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * It's what you asked for in your post of 18:56, 7 October 2018 (UTC) - it's not particularly easy to copy a clickable link without clicking it -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 21:57, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * No, it isn't. Anyway, it's moot because it's been stated that a clickable link wasn't intended in the first place, and there would be no point in a link that would take you to the page on which it occurs. &#8213; Mandruss  &#9742;  22:12, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Chrome for Android has a "Copy link text" feature -- it's a shame that desktop browsers don't without a plugin or add-on. --Ahecht ([[User talk:Ahecht|<span style="color:#FFF;background:#04A;display:inline-block;padding:1px;vertical-align:-.3em;font:bold 50%/1 sans-serif;text-align:center">TALK
 * I can probably put together a user script for this pretty quickly, and I've wanted this for some time - I just never got around to it. I guess there's some demand now, so I'll probably have this up soonish. Enterprisey (talk!) 07:34, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Oppose scripts for features that benefit virtually everybody, for reasons I've articulated elsewhere. &#8213; Mandruss  &#9742;  17:27, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
 * , done (for the link case) at User:Enterprisey/diff-permalink.js. As a bonus, clicking on the text field copies it to your clipboard. For the Special:Log case where you want to link to a single log entry, there's User:Enterprisey/links-in-logs.js. For the other special pages, you can usually find a Special:____ version in the address bar; let me know if there's a special page that's not like that. Mandruss, you can still propose that this be added to the diff page on the MediaWiki side, but I think it's a bit of a power-user feature, especially since readers wouldn't see a reason not to use the address bar link. Enterprisey (talk!) 01:58, 10 October 2018 (UTC)

Large obstructing banner on mobile
Does anyone know how to get rid of that banner on mobile Safari without just deleting the Wikipedia app off my phone. If there’s some obvious way that I’ve missed please forgive me Thanks,L3X1 ◊distænt write◊  03:08, 10 October 2018 (UTC)


 * I think that User:CKoerner (WMF) will know who to talk to about that problem. Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 05:15, 10 October 2018 (UTC)
 * , this is an iOS feature of Universal Links. You cannot get rid of it without deleting the app. —Th e DJ (talk • contribs) 07:26, 10 October 2018 (UTC)
 * , thanks for the info. Thanks,L3X1 ◊distænt write◊  14:52, 10 October 2018 (UTC)