Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/Assessment/SMS Thüringen


 * The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.  No further edits should be made to this discussion.


 * Promoted: AustralianRupert (talk) 21:14, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

SMS Thüringen

 * Nominator(s): Parsecboy (talk)

Yet another German battleship, this is the second to last of the WWI-era dreadnoughts (to go through ACR, that is). This article will eventually go through FAC, so I appreciate all comments and suggestions that will assist the article in meeting Wikipedia's highest standards. For those not in the know, the article is part of this topic. Thanks to all who take the time to review the article, I look forward to working with you. Parsecboy (talk) 16:08, 3 December 2012 (UTC)

Image copyright all fine. I note, though, that there are no actual images of Thüringen, and the only thing that comes close is the class recognition drawing. Is there nothing else we could add? Grandiose (me, talk, contribs) 17:32, 9 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Unfortunately, no, I haven't been able to track down any photos of the ship. I've trawled through contemporary naval annuals and such, all to no avail. There's this postcard on de.wiki, but there is no source information or any details regarding its publication, so we can't use it here. Parsecboy (talk) 19:57, 9 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Is this the right ship? The one labelled "S.M.S. Thüringen ausgeliefert an Frankreich in Cherbourg 1920" would confirm pre-1923 foreign publication. Might be worth considering. Grandiose (me, talk, contribs) 20:07, 9 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes, that's the right ship, but those are just the dates the photos were taken, we'd need proof that they were actually published before 1923. That's the problem with a lot of these photos taken right before the cutoff date - one can reasonably assume they were published before 1923, but it's not as probable as something from, say, the 1860s. Parsecboy (talk) 20:09, 9 December 2012 (UTC)

Comments
 * Construction: "Ostfriesland stored up to 3,200 metric tons (3,100 long tons; 3,500 short tons) of coal, which allowed her to steam for 5,500 nautical miles (10,200 km; 6,300 mi) at a speed of 10 knots (19 km/h; 12 mph). " -- I don't understand the reason another ship is being mentioned here.
 * Battle of Jutland: "The first salvo struck near Black Prince's rear gun turret, which appeared to have been blown overboard. She fired a total of ten 30.5 cm, twenty-seven 15 cm, and twenty-four 8.8 cm shells." -- Which ship do you mean when you say "she"
 * Please be consistent in whether or not you include OCLC numbers in refs.
 * Will follow-up. — Ed! (talk) 04:14, 10 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Everything should be cleared up, thanks for the review. Parsecboy (talk) 12:02, 12 December 2012 (UTC)

Support great work! — Ed! (talk) 20:36, 13 December 2012 (UTC)

Support Comments by MisterBee1966
 * Could you add the footnote regarding Ersatz please?
 * Christened by Herzogin Adelheid von Sachsen-Altenburg and speech by William Ernest, Grand Duke of Saxe-Weimar-Eisenach. HRS volume 7, page 231.
 * William Michaelis was her commander from October 1913 to February 1915. HRS p. 230.
 * The text states "The ship's secondary armament consisted of fourteen 15 cm (5.9 in) SK L/45 guns and sixteen 8.8 cm (3.5 in) SK L/45 guns." the infobox says "14 × 8.8 cm (3.5 in) guns". HRS p. 230 says Initially 14 x 8.8 SK later converted to 12 x 8.8 SK plus 2 x 8.8 Flak. Double check please?
 * Martin Niemöller served on Thüringen
 * Everything should be addressed, thanks for checking HRS for me, MisterBee. Parsecboy (talk) 12:02, 12 December 2012 (UTC)

 Comments Support by Peacemaker67 More to follow. That's me done. Peacemaker67 (send... over) 11:02, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
 * "on 31 May – 1 June 1916" I suggest "from 31 May to 1 June 1916". The preposition "on" is too precise for a date range. You use "on 31 May and 1 June" in the Jutland section, perhaps that would be better?
 * Sounds fine to me.
 * can you clarify why the pontoons were fitted. Perhaps due to the depth of the Weser?
 * Should be clearer now.
 * suggest you add how the torpedo tubes were fitted? broadside?
 * Added.
 * suggest you wikilink Sister ship at first mention
 * Done
 * I believe the correct name for the Cape is Skudesnæs or Skudenes?
 * Yeah, that was a typo.
 * suggest you wikilink Counter admiral for von Hipper
 * Done.
 * suggest you clarify that Scarborough, Hartlepool and Whitby are coastal towns on the east coast of England
 * suggest you use "the Jade Estuary" rather than "The Jade" as most will have no idea
 * The Jade Estuary is linked earlier in the article, and referring to the body of water as "the Jade" is quite common (for instance, we have had a redirect at the Jade since 2008).
 * Thanks for reviewing the article! Parsecboy (talk) 15:58, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
 * no worries. Great article BTW. Moving to support. Peacemaker67 (send... over) 19:58, 16 December 2012 (UTC)

Comments. As always, feel free to revert my copyediting. Please check the edit summaries. - Dank (push to talk)
 * Give some thought to the recent complaint about passive voice ... in particular, if several successive sentences have passive voice or a similar construction, vary the structure. - Dank (push to talk) 04:11, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Will do.
 * "the II Führer der Torpedoboote": Does that mean the Führer der Torpedoboote from II Squadron? - Dank (push to talk) 14:24, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
 * No, it'd be the second commander of the torpedo-boat flotillas - at Jutland, it was Commodore Paul Heinrich. Given that it was just a few months after Jutland, it was presumably still Heinrich, but Staff doesn't say.
 * Done for now. - Dank (push to talk) 14:55, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
 * All your edits look good to me, Dan. Thanks yet again. Parsecboy (talk) 15:47, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
 * My pleasure. - Dank (push to talk) 15:57, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Support on prose per standard disclaimer. These are my edits. - Dank (push to talk) 05:13, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

Comments
 * Do you have a date for when the French sank her?--Sturmvogel 66 (talk) 22:18, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Nothing I've been able to track down, no. Parsecboy (talk) 22:50, 19 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Comments Support
 * No dab links (no action required).
 * External links check out (there are none) (no action required)
 * Images all have Alt Text (no action required).
 * The Citation Check Tool reveals no errors with reference consolidation (no action required).
 * Images are all public domain or licenced and seem appropriate to the article (no action required).
 * The Earwig Tool reveals a possible issue with copyright violation :
 * forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/951-imperial-germanys-sms-ostfriesland (a different ship to be sure)
 * I suspect though that the post in the forum is likely a rip off of the wiki article on SMS Ostfriesland (one of the project's FAs), and not the other way around. Is this the case?
 * Check the date of the forum post ;) Parsecboy (talk) 22:50, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Good point. The forum post is dated 12 October 2012 which is after the final edit to the wiki article (SMS Ostfriesland that is), which indicates to me that there has been no copyright violation (at least on our part!). Anotherclown (talk) 07:08, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Repetitious language here: "They were too late, however, and they failed to locate any British forces."
 * See how it reads now. Parsecboy (talk) 22:50, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
 * "undertook its last major offensive operation under the command of Admiral von Pohl...", should just be: "undertook its last major offensive operation under the command of von Pohl..." rm rank following formal introduction at first use per WP:SURNAME.
 * Fixed, thanks for catching that. Parsecboy (talk) 22:50, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Otherwise this article is in very good shape. Anotherclown (talk) 21:26, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
 * As always, thanks for reviewing the article, AC. Parsecboy (talk) 22:50, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Spting now. Anotherclown (talk) 07:08, 20 December 2012 (UTC)


 * The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page, such as the current discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.