Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/Assessment/Siege of Guînes (1352)

Article promoted by Vami IV (talk) via MilHistBot (talk) 21:20, 16 October 2021 (UTC) &laquo; Return to A-Class review list

Siege of Guînes (1352)
Instructions for nominators and reviewers
 * Nominator(s): 

Part of the incessant fighting between the French and English after the Truce of Calais was agreed in 1347 and the cause of full-scale war breaking out again. Fresh from GAN and hopefully up to ACR. Let me know. Gog the Mild (talk) 16:14, 18 September 2021 (UTC)
 * Image licensing looks ok (t &#183; c)  buidhe  18:39, 18 September 2021 (UTC)

Support Comments from Iazyges

 * The GAN review for this article was viciously stolen from me, so I'll have to review it here. Iazyges   Consermonor   Opus meum  18:13, 20 September 2021 (UTC)
 * It seems that I can't run and I can't hide.

Lede

 * after six years of uneasy and ill-kept truce suggest after six years of an uneasy and ill-kept truce
 * Done.

Background

 * After nine years of inconclusive but expensive warfare, suggest After nine years of inconclusive but expensive warfare across France,; perhaps mention some of the regions if it is conducive.
 * Er. What about English Channel naval campaign, 1338–1339 or the largest battle of the period, fought in Flanders, or the campaigning in the territory of the Holy Roman Empire?


 * The English turned to fight Philip's much larger army at the Battle of Crécy, perhaps change turned to manoeuvred
 * They didn't. They dug into a prepared position, let the French come at them and conspicuously didn't manoeuvre.


 * English possession would go a long way to securing Calais against more surprise assaults. suggest changing more to further
 * Done.

English attack

 * who was back in France suggest who had returned to France
 * Done.


 * He ordered the English occupants to hand Guînes back suggest He therefore ordered the English occupants to hand Guînes back
 * Done.

French attack

 * and positioned catapults and cannon there. while cannon can be an irregular plural, I think because the catapults directly before it is pluralized, using cannons might flow better.
 * Ok.

Iazyges  Consermonor   Opus meum  18:47, 20 September 2021 (UTC)

Aftermath

 * until recaptured by the French in 1558 suggest until it was recaptured by the French in 1558
 * Done.


 * That is all of my suggestions. Iazyges   Consermonor   Opus meum  18:49, 20 September 2021 (UTC)
 * Thanks, helpful as ever. Responses above. Gog the Mild (talk) 20:56, 20 September 2021 (UTC)

Source review by AustralianRupert – pass
G'day, Gog, I trust you are well. I have a few minor comments by way of a source review, with one minor suggestion WRT the lead. Regards, AustralianRupert (talk) 12:55, 29 September 2021 (UTC)
 * in the lead, suggest mentioning the months that the siege took place and when Guines had been captured by the English
 * Good point. Done.


 * there are no duplicate links, or dab links (no action required)
 * Wagner, John A. (2006g) -- Wagner 2006f?
 * Whoops. Fixed.


 * there is a minor inconsistency in the hyphenation of the ISBN for Jaques (compare with Kaeuper)
 * Fixed.
 * Please see my comment below; I think you self reverted your changes. Regards, AustralianRupert (talk) 11:03, 8 October 2021 (UTC)
 * (re-)Done.


 * publisher for Ayloffe? (Worldcat doesn't list one, unfortunately)
 * Added.
 * G'day, can you please check this again -- I still can't see a publisher listed. I think you self reverted your changes, here: Regards, AustralianRupert (talk) 11:03, 8 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Gah! old age is a terrible thing. If you get a choice, don't go for it. Fixed. Check it quick, before I have another fit of idiocy.


 * sources appear to be reliable based on author or publisher reputations and reviews (please note, I am limited to what I can find on Google only in a location that blocks some sites, so I may have missed something)
 * spotchecks not done (I was not able to access Kaeuper or Rogers from my connection, sorry)
 * ext links all appear to work (no action required)


 * Hi AR, Not so bad thanks. You still locked down where you are? Thanks for the review. Your comments responded to above. Gog the Mild (talk) 14:57, 30 September 2021 (UTC)
 * Afternoon/morning, how is this looking now? Gog the Mild (talk) 13:07, 7 October 2021 (UTC)
 * G'day, just a couple of follow-ups above. Sorry for the delay -- I do not have reliable or secure internet here always. Lockdowns continue at home, but at the moment I am away for work. No lockdowns here, but they have other concerns. Regards, AustralianRupert (talk) 11:03, 8 October 2021 (UTC)
 * I didn't mean to harass you, there is no rush. The two self-reverted edits, reinstated. Gog the Mild (talk) 17:08, 9 October 2021 (UTC)
 * All good, no worries. Thanks for your efforts. Regards, AustralianRupert (talk) 12:36, 10 October 2021 (UTC)

Comments Support by Zawed
Background
 * the French commander Geoffrey de Charny what was he the commander of?
 * Good point. An introductory sentence added.


 * In the background perhaps state explicitly that Raoul's ransom payment of Guînes did not proceed.
 * Done.

English attack
 * Perhaps seized the French-held town of Guînes. The text i have struck out seems unnecessary.
 * I have removed "French-held".

French attack
 * In the French attack section: Geoffrey de Charny was again put in charge of all French forces; the "again" implies there is antecedence for what de Charny was in command of. This may go towards my comment on de Charny in the background.
 * Yes. I think that the introduction of CHarny in the Background now allows a reader to make sense of this. Gog the Mild (talk) 12:47, 13 October 2021 (UTC)

That's it for me, this is in pretty good order. Zawed (talk) 09:03, 12 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Hi and thanks for the review. Your comments all addressed. Gog the Mild (talk) 12:47, 13 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Looks good, am happy to support. Zawed (talk) 01:13, 15 October 2021 (UTC)

HF
Will review this over the weekend. Hog Farm Talk 20:06, 15 October 2021 (UTC)


 * "When the French approached on New Year's Day 1350 they were routed by this smaller force, with significant losses and all their leaders captured or killed" - Was this when Charny was captured?
 * Well, he was one of the French leaders. Expanded to "and all their leaders captured or killed; Charny was among the captured."


 * "By coincidence, the English parliament was scheduled to meet" - would it be better to link directly to Parliament of England and also, I thought Parliament was generally capitalized?
 * Link changed. I am not sure that I agree, but capitalised.


 * Sourcing looks good, and image licensing looks fine

As these are only minor quibbles, I am supporting. Hog Farm Talk 19:52, 16 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Thanks Hog Farm, tweaked per your suggestions. Gog the Mild (talk) 20:27, 16 October 2021 (UTC)

Coordinator note
Howdy, pards. Consensus has been reached to promote this article to A-Class, so it is now my pleasure to do so. – ♠Vami _IV†♠  21:06, 16 October 2021 (UTC)