Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/Assessment/Thomas J. Hudner, Jr.


 * The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.  No further edits should be made to this discussion.


 * Promoted. HJ Mitchell  &#124;  Penny for your thoughts?  06:53, 11 February 2012 (UTC)

Thomas J. Hudner, Jr.

 * Nominator(s): — Ed! (talk)

I am nominating this article for A-Class review. — Ed! (talk) 20:08, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

Oppose at this time, regrettably. I'm seeing a fair amount of awkwardness in the prose - as a quick example, "Thomas Jerome Hudner Jr. was born 31 August 1924 in Fall River, Massachusetts his father, Thomas Hudner Sr. was a businessman of Irish descent who ran a chain of grocery stores, Hudner's Markets" is missing either addition words or punctuation. If this article is thoroughly copy-edited I'd be happy to revisit. Nikkimaria (talk) 02:41, 4 January 2012 (UTC)
 * I'll copy edit this in the coming days and get back to you. — Ed! (talk) 15:46, 5 January 2012 (UTC)
 * I've given it a thorough looking over and made quite a few changes. The article definitely needed a major copyedit, particularly in the initial sections. Take a look now and tell me what you think. — Ed! (talk) 12:35, 7 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Much better, but I still think improvement is needed. Some examples:
 * Last sentence of lead begins with lower-case letter
 * "Three younger brothers would later be born" - unless younger brothers can be born before older brothers, there's redundancy here
 * When introducing someone, should use either no commas or two commas - so "His father, Thomas Hudner Sr. was" should be either "His father Thomas Hudner Sr. was" or "His father, Thomas Hudner Sr., was"
 * "which he later said inspired him with an interest in the military" -> "which he later said inspired his interest in the military"
 * Stopping there. There are far fewer grammatical errors, but wordiness and awkward phrasing remains an issue. Nikkimaria (talk) 15:16, 7 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Made the fixes you suggested. I've looked it over for additional things to fix. — Ed! (talk) 18:03, 10 January 2012 (UTC)


 * Support Comments: I've made a couple of tweaks, please check my edits and adjust as you see fit. I also have the following suggestions:
 * query about "years of service" in the infobox. Currently it says "1946-1973". 1946 was when Hudner graduated from Annapolis. Surely he was serving in the navy upon entry? That is how it works for officers in Australia. For instance, one who goes to Duntroon straight off civvie street in 2004 will be appointed into the Army on that date, holding a "temporary commission", accruing long service leave and being subject to the Defence Force Discipline Act from that time, even though they won't graduate as a lieutenant for another 18 (hopefully) or 24 months (if unlucky/injured/or does something silly). I'm not sure about the status of US Naval Academy cadets, but it might be something to consider.
 * I believe American officers are considered in service only upon commissioning, since they aren't trained or assigned a unit yet. — Ed! (talk) 18:17, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Comment This is a policy consistently followed with all articles on West Point and Annapolis officers, except for officers like Chick Hayward who were already in the Navy when they entered Annapolis. Hawkeye7 (talk) 20:46, 10 February 2012 (UTC)
 * probably need a second comma here: "prestigious Phillips Academy in Andover, Massachusetts in 1939" (after "Massachusetts");
 * Fixed. — Ed! (talk) 18:35, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
 * the duplicate link checker reports possible overlink of "Task Force 77", "executive officer", "San Diego, California", "Harry S. Truman", and "Massachusetts". Please check that they are all necessary;
 * Fixed all of them. — Ed! (talk) 18:35, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
 * incorrect capitalisation of ranks: "squadron executive officer lieutenant commander Dick Cevoli, lieutenant George Hudson, lieutenant junior grade Bill Koenig, ensign Ralph McQueen, and ensign Jesse L. Brown, who was Hudner's". These ranks are being used as titles and should therefore be presented in capital letters. E.g. "squadron executive officer Lieutenant Commander Dick Cevoli, Lieutenant George Hudson, Lieutenant Junior Grade Bill Koenig, Ensign Ralph McQueen, and Ensign Jesse L. Brown, who was Hudner's...". The policy link is WP:MilTerms;
 * Fixed. — Ed! (talk) 18:35, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
 * "During this flight, Brown had the call sign "Iroquois 13."" As this article is on Hudner, I'm not sure if this is relevant;
 * Fixed. — Ed! (talk) 18:35, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
 * this seems repetitive: "Brown crashed into a bowl-shaped valley at approximately 40°36′N 127°06′E", followed a couple of sentences later by: "Brown had crash landed near Somong-ni, 15 miles (24 km) behind Chinese lines..." They could probably be consolidated somehow;
 * Fixed. — Ed! (talk) 18:35, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
 * incorrect capitalisation: "lieutenant Charles Ward" (per above WP:MilTerms);
 * Fixed. — Ed! (talk) 18:35, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
 * "likely thanks to the heavy air presence". I suggest tweaking this to: "likely due to the heavy air presence...";
 * Fixed. — Ed! (talk) 18:35, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
 * probably need a second comma here: "ceremony in Boston, Massachusetts were Daisy" (after "Massachusetts");
 * Fixed. — Ed! (talk) 18:35, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
 * in the Notes, I think this should be tweaked: "In 2000 this award was made retroactive to all U.S. military who served in the Korean War." I suggest: "In 2000 this award was made retroactive to all U.S. military personnel who served in the Korean War."
 * Fixed. — Ed! (talk) 18:35, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
 * in the References, should # 3 have "retrieved" date information? AustralianRupert (talk) 22:58, 10 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Fixed. I think that's everything. — Ed! (talk) 18:35, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
 * My comments have been addressed. AustralianRupert (talk) 07:52, 13 January 2012 (UTC)


 * Comments Support
 * No dab links (no action required).
 * External links all check out (no action required).
 * Images lack Alt Text so you might consider adding it (suggestion only).
 * The Citation Check Tool reveals an error with reference consolidation:
 * "Will62" (Multiple references are using the same name)
 * Fixed. — Ed! (talk) 17:21, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * The images used are all PD and seem appropriate to the article (no action required).
 * This seems a little awkward to me: "...Arriving near Korea in October 1950...", perhaps consider "...Arriving in the waters off Korea in October 1950..." or something similar?
 * Fixed. — Ed! (talk) 17:21, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * This is a little repeatitive: "U.S. Navy aboard several ships and with several aviation units...", perhaps "...U.S. Navy aboard several ships and with a number of aviation units..."
 * Fixed. — Ed! (talk) 17:21, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * This also seems awkward: "...including as first officer of the USS Kitty Hawk during a brief tour in the Vietnam War...", consider perhaps: "...including a brief tour as first officer of the USS Kitty Hawk during the Vietnam War..."
 * Fixed. — Ed! (talk) 17:21, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Consider rewording here: "...which was operating off of the coast of...", perhaps: "...which was operating off the coast of..."
 * Fixed. — Ed! (talk) 17:21, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * "The pilots observed his body looked to have...", consider instead "The pilots observed that his body looked to have..." Anotherclown (talk) 11:34, 29 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Fixed. I think that's everything. — Ed! (talk) 17:21, 1 February 2012 (UTC)


 * Image check Done - see above.
 * Support Looks good. Hawkeye7 (talk) 20:46, 10 February 2012 (UTC)


 * The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page, such as the current discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.