Wikipedia:WikiProject Stub sorting/Discoveries/Log/2007/January

Rasta-stub /

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The result of the debate was taken to sfd for further discussion

Never proposed, only about ten stubs, no clear indication as to whether this is for biographies of rastafarians (not a good idea, since we split people by nationality and occupation, not beliefs0 or for things connected with rastafarianism 9in which case the template is badly named). Currently contains a mix of the two. No indication this would reach threshold - gut feeling is that this is SFD material. Grutness...wha?  02:31, 3 January 2007 (UTC)


 * I have to ask permission to make a new stub type? What a shame. This is for stub articles related to Rastafari (the way of life), not articles on individual practitioners. I thought it would be only fair since every other kind of religions and lifestyles are allowed to have a stub, but I guess this means there is still a long way to go before ALL religions and lifestyles find acceptance in this world. I included a few practitioners who are notable in the study of the Rastafari movement, but other articles on people who just happen to be Rastas were not included. I patterned the name rasta-stub after reli-stub; I think it is a good name, as rastafari-stub would be too long and 'rastafarianism' is considered pejorative by those who are rasta themselves. This would have helped the users who have knowledge or expertise in the area to quickly locate the topics that need expansion.  Sorry if I was too presumptuous, sir. ፈቃደ (ውይይት) 03:27, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I think given there is a Christian-denomination-stub there should also be a Rastafari stub, it certainly strikes me as more valid than almost the others if not all of those listed here right now and would rapidly expand once it had been identified and made of use of more substantially, SqueakBox 04:09, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
 * The point isn't "all the others have, so this one should have" (which isn't true anyway) - there's simply no point in creating stub templates and categories unless they are fairly heavily populated, which is why there is a threshold level set before new types are consideed. if this one can be shown to have 60 stubs that will take the template, then fair enough (though, as I said before, it shouldn't be for people who are rastafarian unless their occupation is directly connected to the faith). If it's not going to reach 60, then - like other faiths where this is the case (and here are many) - it shouldn't really have a separate stub type. As for rastafari-stub being too long a name, I shudder to think what you'd make of things like WesternAustralia-geo-stub or Archbishop-of-Canterbury-stub! Grutness...wha?  07:27, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Well if reggae musicians can be considered to have Rastafari in their job description (and if they are singing about Rastafari then they should). I can work on this creating 60 stubs but practuically it would be difficult before the weekend. I dont care what the name is, ie Rasta-Stub woul;d be fine by me, SqueakBox 16:54, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
 * No, they clearly cannot. Reggae singers are primarily reggae musicians and stubbed as such. Note that christian bio-stubs are only used for people who are officers in or saints of the christian church - similar standards should be used on bios of other faiths. And rasta-stub is clearly also too ambiguous because there is no way of thelling from it whether it is for rastas - i.e., rastafarians - or rasta - i.e., the rastafarian faith. Grutness...wha?  04:37, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I confess I do not understand the reasons for having such a rigid policy of requiring 60 stubs for a dedicated stub template category. As long as its purpose is to help editors with expertise in a given subject locate all the articles for expansion in that area, why should it matter if there are 50, 20, or 10?  It can't be to save bandwidth, as this procedure uses up more just talking about it, than it would if you let people freely create stub templates.  The only criterion should be that it is a valid field or area of expertise, and not duplicating another type; the 60 article rule just seems purely arbitrary to me.  ፈቃደ (ውይይት) 19:36, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
 * The reason for the limit is to keep the stub sorting manageable for those who sort articles into the individual stub types. There are thousands of stub types now and the limit is intended as a means to keep the number of stub types down to a manageable size.  A stub type is useless for its intended purpose of having others bring stub articles to the attention of knowledgeable editors if only those editors know that it exists.  If what you are looking for is a way to keep track of Rastafari articles, there are other ways besides stub templates for doing so.  As for your "non-duplication" argument,  Rasta-stub is a sub type of reli-stub and as such is only useful to the stub sorting project if it will have enough articles in it to justify the effort of having to keep track of yet another bin. Caerwine Caer’s whines  21:32, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Also -as explained frequently (and as explained on quite a few stub related pages around Wikipedia), there is a difference between stub categories and standard categories in their usage. Standard "permcats" are for readers looking for one specific article. Stub categories are used by editors looking for any article they can expand. As such, there is an optimum size for stub categories. Too large, and they are of little use to editors, since there's simply too many articles on too broad a subject to wade through. too small, and editors have to search through a large number of finely-tuned categories before finding a few articles they may be able to enlarge. The optimum size is a couple of hundred articles - enough that any editor looking into a fairly general topic will be able to find some articles to expand, but nt so many as for them to be overwhelmed. it is for this reason and for the one Caerwine mentions above that we use optimum sizes for stub categories. ven with these thresholds, there are some 4000 categories -  more than enough for editors to be able to home in onn a specialist subject, and enough that it is a virtually full-time job keeping them correctly sorted. Even dropping the threshold slightly would see an increase in work for editors looking for articles and a considerable increase in work keeping the categories correctly sorted. Having no limits at all on size would see the whole stub-sorting system collapse, and would be worthless from an editorial point of view even if it could be kept under control (which it couldn't). Grutness...wha?  04:54, 4 January 2007 (UTC)


 * We are 29 so far, I would certainly appreciate a week's grace to get that number up to 60 (work commitments and all that) but I am convinced that I can, SqueakBox 01:58, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
 * We now have 61, so it should stay, am I correct? or wrong? I believe I can get this to a couple of hundred and the stubs are either people working in disseminating Rastafari or articles about Rastafari or articles abouit items that promote or strongly contain Rastafari, eg albums with a definite Rastafari message. The number of rastafarian stubs where the individual isnt promoting Rastafari are zero, in my considered opinion, you dont get an article for embracing Rastafari, SqueakBox 19:34, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * 61 is enough, but the remaining issue (which I suspect would tend to be exacerbated if you continued to populate along the lines you suggest) is whether all the articles therein are actually primarily related to Rasta. In particular, if their relevance to Rasta is entirely via reggae, it would be much more appropriate to tag it as the latter.  (A reggae-stub was proposed, and I think there was broad agreement in favour of it, but it never seems to have been created.)  There's something profoundly amiss when several articles have reggae permcats, and a rasta stub tag; but contrarily no Rastafari permcat, and no reggae stub type.  Stub tags should be used more restrictively than permcats, not more liberally.  (If what you want is a resource for "things marginally related to rasta that we're working on", a talk-page template and category (associated with a wikiproject or otherwise) would be more appropriate, I think.)  Alai 23:10, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * There isnt a single article that I have stub tagged that is, IMO, "marginally related to rasta", and while there is an argument for tagging these primarily as reggae I think the argument is wrong. Would you describe religious Christian books as book stubs or Christian stubs? Raggae containsd Rasta and non Rasta music and the intention of this stub has nothing directly to do with reggae or music but with Rastafari, something I could source on a case by case basis, SqueakBox 00:14, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
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Canada-org-stub / Canadian organization stubs

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The result of the debate was keep


 * Template:Canada-org-stub
 * Category:Canadian organization stubs

Not proposed, but sounds like a sensible idea, assuming there are 60 stubs. The cat now has parent categories, both perm and stub (which it didn't have at creation). Grutness...wha?  08:06, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
 * My apologies. There are plenty of stubs that would fit into this stub category, and I just went forward. I ask you to Keep. Just H 17:59, 4 January 2007 (UTC)


 * I'm not entirely convinced this stub is necessary, but am open to persuation. In looking for stub articles to populate this category of stubs, I've found that the existing stub templates are more than sufficient. Most articles that would bear this template are already listed under the appropriate province or federal stub category, and again by the type of organization (i.e. company stub, charity stub, youth stub, etc.). This new stub would in many cases become a third or fourth stub placed on an article. Agent 86 19:24, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
 * It seems uneven that some places have substubs while others don't. I'd prefer if there were a standardized formula(there are the same geographic parameters before all "double hyphen" stubs like the org-stubs). In the meantime though, there are plenty of Canada related org-stubs. Just H 02:52, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Carry that thought through to its logical conclusion - do you think we really need, say, a Pitcairn-org-stub, or a Nauru-struct-stub? How about a VaticanCity-geo-stub? Admittedly Canada is large enough that it might be worthwhile, but - as pointed out - a lot of it is split by individual provinces anyway, so it simply adds another level of sorting. Grutness...wha?  04:29, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Considering the size of the organization stubs category I definately think this stub is a good idea.--Carabinieri 20:17, 11 January 2007 (UTC)
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Various -football-bio-stubs

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The result of the debate was keep

Having proposed and then created the templates for 5 countries and categories for 3 of these some one came along and created not only the categories for the remaining two DRCongo and South africa and also template and category for Algeria. All seem well formed and contain over 60 articles. Waacstats 23:53, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
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Other stubs from Hesperian

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The result of the debate was list on WP:STUBS

Just received the following at my usertalk page... Grutness...wha?  09:53, 6 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I had a bit of a think about our previous discussion. Before our chat I didn't know that WP:STUB was endeavouring to track all stubs in existence. I still don't like the idea of having to ask permission to create a stub, but in future I will at least let the project know of my intentions/actions, so you can maintain your lists. In that spirit I thought I should mention the two other stubs that I am guilty of creating:
 * I created Proteaceae-stub and Category:Proteaceae stubs. The category currently has 152 entries, which compares favourably to the other plant family stubs.
 * I created Banksia-stub and Category:Banksia stubs on behalf of WP:BANKSIA, a very active WikiProject of which I am a member. It currently contains 61 articles, and has not much potential to grow, as we've only identified about 50 Banksia articles yet to be created. At one point it have about 100 articles, but the trend has been for the population to shrink, as we are improving our stubs at a greater rate than we create new ones. Seeing as there is no precedent for the creation of plant stubs at genus level, and WP:BANKSIA has the capacity to monitor our stubs through the talk page tag, I won't object if WP:STUB sentences it to be cast into the belly of Proteaceae-stub.
 * Hesperian 05:08, 6 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Update: proteaceae now has 81 stubs, banksia 145. Her Pegship  (tis herself) 18:02, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
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MN-LRT-stub (redirect: MSP-LRT-stub) /

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The result of the debate was send to WP:CFD

Terrible name and only used on 18 articles. Looks like SFD. Valentinian (talk) / (contribs) 11:03, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
 * More than ffaintly ridiculous name, you're right. SFD looks like a likely destination for this light rail. 05:28, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
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RhodeIsland-struct-stub

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The result of the debate was list on WP:STUBS

Used on 18 articles. Feeds into both Category:Northeastern United States building and structure stubs (91 articles) and Category:Rhode Island stubs (59 articles). Not referenced by any WSS page. --TheParanoidOne 17:17, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
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This now has 40+ articles and a WPJ; I'll list it on STUBS. Her Pegship  (tis herself) 23:21, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

Greece-sports-venue-stub/
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The result of the debate was keep; category renamed

Horribly named category. This one at the very least needs to go to SFD for renaming, if not deletion or upmerging. Not close to threshold. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  06:40, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
 * This was actually on the approved list, small size notwithstanding: WikiProject_Stub_sorting/Proposals/Archive/November_2006.  Rename would be speediable, really.  Alai 06:50, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Yeah - I just found that out. Looks like the editor who created this (who isn't part of WP:WSS) saw it on the "To do" list and went ahead with it without knowing about the naming guidelines. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  07:00, 8 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Update: Now used on 40 articles. Her Pegship <small style="color:green;"> (tis herself) 18:04, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
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UK-drummer-stub
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The result of the debate was list on WP:STUBS

Upmerged but unproposed template, used on just one article. Suspect it will be useful, though. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  03:31, 9 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Should be useful just from the Ringo wannabes from the '60's { Caerwine <small style="font-family:sans-serif;color:darkred">Caer’s whines 08:53, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I started to create this to be similar to the UK-guitarist-stub. Firstly, sorry for transgressing any protocol (this is the first stub I've created), and secondly, the English/British/UK categories can just confuse. I have no problem in this being deleted, and to use the English-drummer-stub instead. Drwhawkfan 18:32, 11 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Please don't create an English-drummer-stub template too! This seems OK though, I'd support de-upmerging this if and when it hits 60.  Alai 02:29, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
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This one has grown to 120+. Listing on WP:WSS/ST. Valentinian T / C 20:42, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

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The result of the debate was discussion taken to sfd

Small, unproposed, the usual... Seems to have been and gone from SFD without ever acquiring a category, which seems entirely strange... Alai 02:29, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Update: Currently used on 21 articles and now has a cat. Her Pegship <small style="color:green;"> (tis herself) 18:06, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Now has 26 articles and belongs to WikiProject Moral Philosophy. Keep or upmerge? Her Pegship <small style="color:green;"> (tis herself) 16:34, 10 October 2007 (UTC)
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Slovakia-footy-bio-stub /
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The result of the debate was list on WP:STUBS

...and User Poulsen continues on his merry way creating stub types and categories without proposal. At least he makes sure that they are more or less well formed and populated before he does so, but it's still a pain in the arse. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  00:43, 13 January 2007 (UTC) If you saw the conversation the two of us have been haviong about this on user talk pages, it might make a little more sense. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  00:45, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Rude, but effective. At least it's a well-established pattern and axis on which to split.  Alai 01:40, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * The template at least was proposed on 2 January along with a few others. looks to me like support for upmerged templates was the outcome. Waacstats 11:56, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
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design-stub /
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The result of the debate was list on WP:STUBS

Created 12 Dec 2006. Not proposed. Used on 8 articles. Potentially useful parent to newly renamed, but it's awfully vague. Populate/list or SFD? <b style="color:maroon;">~ Amalas</b> rawr  <sup style="color:navy;">=^_^=  15:03, 16 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Try to populate. Eli Falk 18:33, 18 January 2007 (UTC)
 * OOPS I submitted it below, separate, I would say its too vague, see my discussion at bottom of page. Goldenrowley 18:09, 24 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Keep & populate. I Changed my mind after speaking with designer of design stub. Goldenrowley 05:37, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
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Aviation-terminology-stub and associated cat
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The result of the debate was rename

Created without proposal - looks reasonable in terms of its scope, and already has over 30 stubs. But normally such a stub would be named Aviation-term-stub, not Aviation-terminology-stub. Suggest keep but rename. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  23:57, 16 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I have no problem with a rename. I however am very activley involved with WP:AIRCRAFT and felt this stub type appropriate. The stub aviation-stub and associated category are fairly large and diverse.  Over the next few weeks I will probably be doing more work on sorting out this category.  I do not know what the procedure is but I am much more comfterable running stub types by the project paricipants instead of throwing it on a list to be approved by somebody.(no offense, I am sure it is very important and i have seem some fairly bizzare probably worthless stub types out there).  -- Chrislk02 (Chris Kreider) 00:12, 17 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Proposing's a very simple process and if a stub type's sensible (like this one) it's extremely un likely it'll be rejected. And it does reduce the possibility that - like this one - more work will be needed in restubbing things if a template name is changed. Basically, the amount of work would have been halved if this had been proposed first, and for a delay of only a handful of days. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  01:04, 17 January 2007 (UTC)
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Mixoploidy-stub
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The result of the debate was send to WP:CFD

Created 9 November 2006. Apparently created for use in just one article (mixoploidy). This seems a very narrow topic area as far as I can tell. --David Edgar 16:49, 17 January 2007 (UTC)
 * ...and since that article now has a genetics-stub, this is definitely SFD-able. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  04:28, 18 January 2007 (UTC)
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Baltic tv-stubs
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The result of the debate was list on WP:STUBS

Don't remember these ever being proposed... three upmerged templates: Latvia-tv-stub, Lithuania-tv-stub, and Estonia-tv-stub. Probably keepable, since they're upmerged. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  06:04, 18 January 2007 (UTC)
 * This seems similar to this discussion regarding Asian tv stubs. As long as they're upmerged, I don't see a problem with them.  <b style="color:maroon;">~ Amalas</b>  rawr  <sup style="color:navy;">=^_^=  14:33, 18 January 2007 (UTC)
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Category:Caucasia-stubs
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The result of the debate was send to WP:CFD

Malformed category, name with a dash, created end of December with no discussion. Eli Falk 12:50, 18 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I checked out Caucasia-stub's history, and I just can't figure it out. It's had all sorts of mis-named categories, including this one.  Also, I'm pretty sure it's redundant to Caucasus-stub / .  Probably SFD-able.  <b style="color:maroon;">~ Amalas</b>  rawr  <sup style="color:navy;">=^_^=  14:36, 18 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Strong Delete. Poorly named since the correct English name is "Caucasus", and I don't see the point of this one at all. For a very long time, Caucasus-stub has been used on exactly 1 article, about a leading politician from Nagorno-Karabakh. We already have generic, -bio and -geo templates for both Georgia, Armenia and Azerbaijan. The old Caucasus-stub should probably be deleted as well. This creation should be removed asap. Valentinian (talk) / (contribs) 21:02, 18 January 2007 (UTC)
 * It looks like it was proposed in Nov 05, but at that time there weren't specific stubs for Georgia, etc. Caucasus-stub is currently being used on exactly 2 articles.  <b style="color:maroon;">~ Amalas</b>  rawr  <sup style="color:navy;">=^_^=  21:24, 18 January 2007 (UTC)
 * That number sounds right. Since then, I've sorted this material several times and proposed the missing templates, so I could empty Caucasus-stub and Caucasus-bio-stub into national categories. The material this template is used on is something of a grab-bag. An article about a bear should be tagged with something biological. Valentinian (talk) / (contribs) 12:01, 19 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I doubt we really need either of those stub types - and we certainly don't need this one. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  00:10, 19 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Btw, the proposal was in November 04, and it was related to the original Caucasus-stub and Caucasus-bio-stub, not to this one which has been made by WikiProject Caucasia. Valentinian (talk) / (contribs) 15:47, 19 January 2007 (UTC)
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Category:College basketball stubs
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The result of the debate was list on WP:STUBS

An other malformed stub category, created with no discussion. This one doesn't seem to have a template to go with it. Eli Falk 12:53, 18 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Sped as empty. Alai 05:54, 19 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Seems to have risen from the grave. The template is collegebasketball-stub and it is used on 37 articles. Valentinian T / C 20:46, 18 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Update: But wait, there's more! It's now up to 40. Her Pegship <small style="color:green;"> (tis herself) 18:07, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
 * And it has a WPJ. I'm listing. Her Pegship <small style="color:green;"> (tis herself) 23:29, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
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Pr-stub, Pr-company-stub, plus redirects and categories
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The result of the debate was send to WP:CFD

Pr-stub, PR-stub, Pr-company-stub and PR-company-stub all feed into, and have a mere six stubs between them. While a public relations stub type might be viable, there's yet to be any evidence of that, and certainly the names of these templates is pretty horrible, especially given that Pr is a fairly sizable dab page. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  00:40, 19 January 2007 (UTC)
 * That's probably at least the primary sense of "PR", but at the very least it should be capitalised. And populated.  Alai 05:53, 19 January 2007 (UTC)
 * All points taken. For the record, the stubs were created to make the distinction between advertising agencies from PR firms. Of course, PR may be seen as a subset of advertising; however, I also considered lobbying – an activity not readily connected to advertising – as a subset of PR. While I assume that there are plenty of stub articles on PR which would warrant this category, having the tags deleted because the facts prove otherwise would be fine with me. --Cheers, Folajimi (leave a note) 20:52, 19 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Update: used on just 1 article, and pr-stub has only 11. Her Pegship <small style="color:green;"> (tis herself) 18:08, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
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Musician stub categories
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The result of the debate was keep Chinese, send Korea to sfd for upmerge

Proposed but no consensus, upmerged boldly, so I guess listing boldly as per de facto consensus about having stub for all country musicians. Monni 17:28, 19 January 2007 (UTC)
 * What such consensus? We upmerge 'em if they're too small, as two of these are in acute danger of being.  One has a sane-sized subcat, admittedly.  Alai 04:54, 1 February 2007 (UTC)


 * If you upmerge stubs which have sub-templates, it clutters the articles using them. Some articles did have 4 different stub templates and categories before me and a few others started making upmerged templates for musicians and singers (by nationality). This gets pretty messy especially if parent stub is upmerged and child stub isn't... With "de facto" consensus in this case I meant that people outside WP:WSS decided that it's better to boldly create categories out of process if it really helps cleaning up stub clutter in articles. Monni 08:58, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Update: Currently 7 articles in Korea-musician-stub, 70 in Chinese. Taiwanese seems to have disappeared. Her Pegship <small style="color:green;"> (tis herself) 18:09, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
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Radio-comm-stub
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The result of the debate was keep

Unproposed, vaguely defined (very few things about radio are not to do with communications), feeds directly into the. Is this needed? Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  22:45, 20 January 2007 (UTC)
 * This stub type has to do with the use of radio for communications between parties, which is entirely different from its use in broadcasting. In broadcasting, radio is transmitted in a single direction and is intended to be received by a large audience. In contrast, in communications, two or more parties send radio signals back and forth, such as in ship-to-shore communications, airline transmissions, two-ways, etc. In addition, these communications may use special voice protocols, etc. Furthermore, in response to the post above, radio goes far beyond just communications, as can be seen by the radio article and by the hierarchy of stubs at WP:RADIO. The base radio-stub would need to cover a huge range of radio-related topics with communications only being one of them; therefore, I saw a communications-specific stub as necessary.


 * I checked through all of the radio stubs, and I did not find a single stub type dealing with radio communications. In fact, the main radio-stub had to deal with 'radio broadcasting'. Therefore, I also moved the old radio-stub to radio-broadcast-stub and made the new radio-stub as generic as possible.


 * I did not realize that I needed to propose new stubs beforehand, but, as can be seen from my post, the stub will cover an area that did not have adequate coverage, at least as far as I've been able to find. However, if an existing stub can be found that can properly cover the same material, I'll speedy delete this one. In addition, I have posted notes to both WP:RADIO and WP:WPRS, in order to dissuade other members of those projects from adding stub types without proposing them first. --PhantomS 02:55, 21 January 2007 (UTC)


 * After looking at the list of stub types, there is a wireless-stub. However, it claims to be for wireless technologies, wireless service providers, and cell phones. Subsequently, all the articles that have been tagged with it have been about WiFI, cell phones, and wireless service providers. Articles about CB radios, two-ways, etc., since they do not really fall under this scope, have usually been tagged with radio-stub, originally a radio broadcasting stub. Therefore, by making the radio-stub tag generic to all of radio, all of these articles have become properly tagged, while stubs about radio broadcasting are still properly tagged.


 * As for the radio communications stub, it has a broader scope than the wireless-stub's scope, while having much less of a scope than the telecomm-stub's scope. Therefore, it covers a middle ground that was previously not well-covered.


 * As for the confusion pertaining to radio vs. wireless communications, it comes from the fact that the radio wikiproject is only about a month or so old. Originally, the only projects covering these types of articles were for amateur radio, telecommunications, and amateur radio, leaving a large number of radio articles without an associated wikiproject. With the founding of the radio project, the goal is to lessen the load on telecommunications, while also filling in the areas that the radio station and amateur radio projects can not cover because of their limited scope. As a result, radio categories need to be more than just broadcasting. --PhantomS 05:26, 21 January 2007 (UTC)


 * There's no, so it's not entirely how this is to be scoped. OTOH, no deep reason there shouldn't be one...  Alai 04:58, 1 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Update: Now used on 26 articles and has a proper category. And I agree with PhantomS. Her Pegship <small style="color:green;"> (tis herself) 18:10, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
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Strange goings-on at Uttaranchal/Uttarakhand
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The result of the debate was keep

Uttaranchal-geo-stub now leads to, and there is also a new Uttarakhand-geo-stub. Seems the state changed its name, and reather than going through the sensible process of renaming the stub type and deleting thed old category, someone decided to simply create a parallel stub type and depopulate and delete the old category. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  02:14, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Mea culpa. WP:SFD says it is for deleting, not renaming.  Maybe the description for WP:SFD should be changed to explicitly say something about renaming.   It was debated in  and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:Village_pump#New_category_speedy_rename_criterion --- Safemariner 02:16, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Mmm. Good point. The sfd templates say "deletion or renaming" - the page should as well. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  02:27, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Well, I did the deleting part, since I didn't have the energy for the complaining at people part. However, if people keep re-adding wikiproject links to these templates, I'll find some from somewhere...  Alai 05:07, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
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Hungary-history-stub
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The result of the debate was renamed

There is a brand new Hungary-history-stub and associated category. While the category is a reasonable idea and already has 30 stubs, the template has been incorrectly named (by the NGs it should be at Hungary-hist-stub. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  02:14, 22 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Hi! I created the aforementioned stub type because there were a large number of history stubs in the Hungary stub category. I'm sorry, I didn't know there was a rule and a whole wikiproject about this. I did it mostly because now that we finally got the Hungarian community together here in enwiki, I was planning to propose a de-stubbing month, to empty the stub categories by improving all of their articles to worthy ones. Sorting the stubs is only the first step in this. When the stub template was already created I realized that other countries have it in the "countryname-hist-stub" format, and was going to ask someone's bot to rename it but it was already late at night here so thought I'd do it later :) I was planning to have a Hungarian culture stub too, can we have that? – Alensha   talk  15:29, 22 January 2007 (UTC)


 * We don't usually have "X-culture-stub" types, because there's a pretty vague definition of exactly what culture is and it crosses several other stub types like art, music, history, food and so on. Given that the main has fewer than 200 stubs, a further split probably isn't that practical at the moment, especially since there's a bit of under-sorting of that into its subcategories. If it grows then other stub cats may well be worthwhiole, but probably not at the moment - especially if it's likely to shrink over the next month! Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  21:40, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Having a further look at that main stub cat, I'd say that quite a few of the stubs will go into the new history stubcat (it should reduce the main stubcat to about 160). Nothing really leaps out as a next split, though there are a surprising number of traditional Hungarian foods in there - just not enough for a really sensible split. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  22:05, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Okay, thanks :) – Alensha   talk  12:48, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

I've taken this over to SFD for renaming. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  23:26, 24 January 2007 (UTC)
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Townsville-stub / no category
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The result of the debate was deleted with author's consent.

Never proposed, ill defined region listed as coverage, and no category, plus the usual problems of creating individual stub tyhpes for anywehere other than main centres (which Townsville ain't, with a population of only 1/6 of Brisbane's. If it wasn't for the WP Townsville, this one would have probably gone straight to SFD. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  03:00, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Ahhh. If only it was always this simple! I had a chat with the creator of this, and he agreed that a talk page template would be more useful, then blanked the stub template. So this is a template we don't need to worry about! Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  06:59, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
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Mtsu-stub /
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The result of the debate was deleted with author's consent. Any Idea? I had to look up the template to find out. It's for Middle Tennessee State University. ISTR the current plan is using university stub templates on a state by state basis rather than for individulal universities, and even if it isn't, the five articles currently using this are more than a third of the 14 articles in total which exist about this university. Even if this was viable, the name of both the template and the category are horrible and need a serious overhaul. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  03:00, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
 * wow! two in a row blanked for speedying... don't tell me the message is finally getting through... Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  21:55, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
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Zimbabwe-ethno-group-stub / (upmerged)
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The result of the debate was keep

This one was created less than an hour ago. I don't remember a proposal for this one, but it is nicely formed, correctly named and even upmerged correctly, so I don't see any problems with it except that it has not yet been used. Valentinian (talk) / (contribs) 17:16, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Update: Still only used on 2 articles, despite there being a WikiProject Africa and WikiProject Zimbabwe.Her Pegship <small style="color:green;"> (tis herself) 19:06, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Update: No change. I'll post it at WPSS:To do and see if anyone bites. Her Pegship <small style="color:green;"> (tis herself) 20:44, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Hi. I am working with WikiProject Zimbabwe and we are currently going through all Zimbabwe related articles and assessing them still. As I'm sure you can appreciate, this is a slow, long and arduous process and so if you were to bear with us we shall find the relevant articles in time to be used with this stub. We are a relevantly new WikiProject and have only really established our ground and things aren't as complete as we would like. Thank you in your understanding of the situation. Mangwanani 17:10, 15 September 2007 (UTC)
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Design-stub and
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The result of the debate was list on WP:STUBS

I was called attention to this one created last month, very few in it. My trouble would be "designer" can be in many fields, there are graphic design, auto design, fashion design, engineering type mechanical design, interior design, architects....not to mention their own terminology in each field and products they design. I can imagine there MIGHT be a need to stub graphic designers as there are probably LOTS of graphic designers to be stubbed, but then we need to propose that as a occupatonal stub category. Goldenrowley 03:29, 24 January 2007 (UTC)
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Sumo-bio-stub (and redirect Sumo-wrestler-stub)
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The result of the debate was keep

A sensible enough split, and well formed, but the category hs no parents, stub or permcat. The only question really being as to the size of the category. Probably a keeper, but if it remains small (it currently has four stubs) it may need to be upmerged somewhere. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  23:12, 24 January 2007 (UTC)


 * I've created parent categories of Sportspeople stubs, Stub categories and Sumo wrestlers. I anticipate several additions to this category as I and others add more sumo stubs. The template Sumo-wrestler-stub was a mistake and could be deleted if anyone knows how to do this. --Auximines 23:53, 24 January 2007 (UTC)
 * That makes the wrestler redirect speediable (deletion requested by sole editor), so I can do that easily enough. Those are reasonable parent cats - as I said,that makes the size the main concern. It definitely seems to be a keeper for now, but if it remains small it may need looking at later. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  05:06, 25 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Populated to 55 now, so I suggest we adopt and list. And then persuade some people to stop making these the only articles on wikipedia using "Lastname firstname", especially when rikishi only ever use the "last name" of their shikona.  Alai 04:52, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
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Australia-tv-bio-stub /
This one was added to the official list without going trough the proper proces for listing it there. Moved here for discussion. TheDJ (talk • contribs • WikiProject Television) 21:10, 26 January 2007 (UTC)


 * See August 2006 proposals. Monni 21:26, 26 January 2007 (UTC)
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Pixar-stub (no category)
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The result of the debate was send to WP:CFD

Never proposed, no category, used on six articles. Permcat is pretty large, though, so it might be possible to get it up to threshold. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  07:47, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Update: Currently used on 9 articles. Pixar permcat has 11, Pixar characters 6, Pixar films 3. Her Pegship <small style="color:green;"> (tis herself) 19:09, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Update: Status has not changed; upmerge or delete? Her Pegship <small style="color:green;"> (tis herself) 20:41, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
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ZA-telecoms-stub, redlinked category
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The result of the debate was send to WP:CFD

very badly named and never proposed. Category is a redlink. AFAIK we have never split telecoms by individual country before, and the chances of finding 60 stubs on South African telecoms is fairly remote, to say the least. Currently used on two articles. There is no such permcat as, either, neither is there a similar permcat with any variant on that title that i could find. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  07:47, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Finally found an equivalent permcat: . It has five articles. What chance for there being 60 stubs? Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  08:02, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
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UFOs
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The result of the debate was send to WP:CFD

We seem to have just acquired these two: Neither was proposed, and there are no such permcats as and. A combined UFO-stub might be reasonable (the main cat is at, and only then if there are enough stubs, but I doubt either of these is. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  07:51, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Ufologist-stub / (used on one article)
 * Ufo-org-stub / (used on one article)


 * Hi, sorry bout that, I was the one who started both (I didnt not know about the registration part though) ... as for combining them, I would love the idea, unless we can keep them separate? I just feel its a really good stub that helps clarify the subject of the articles and that they can be expanded, thats all (:O)... cya -nima baghaei 15:08, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Given the capitalisation, the usage, and the whacky mini-essay coding, delete and do-over if required. Alai 05:04, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
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India-protected-area-stub and category
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The result of the debate was send to WP:CFD

Never proposed. Reasonable scope, but incorrectly named as Indian-xxx (should be "India-xxx") Category has no parents and has two stubs. If it grows significantly then this might be a keeper. If it grows significantly. Mind you, it looks like there is a WikiProject. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  00:59, 30 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I've preemptively moved it to the correct name and fixed the cat. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  01:02, 30 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Sorry, i was not aware about the fact that for creating a stub it has to fist be proposed. Infact this stub will have lot of taker as there are more than 600 protected areas in India and mostly they are stub (almost 350-400). This stub category should be given permission for formal use. Amartyabag   (Talk)  09:01, 30 January 2007 (UTC)
 * But it's harder to sort redlinks than it is to sort stubs. How many actual articles would take this?  Currently seems to be used on zero.  Alai 04:31, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
 * I removed the two which were marked with this, since both were much larger than could really be considered stubs. Might be worth looking through the India-geos to see what can be found. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  05:20, 1 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Update: Now used on 20 articles, has its own cat. Her Pegship <small style="color:green;"> (tis herself) 19:10, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
 * And now shrinking again, if anything. Very small, even given the alleged Wikiproject.  I suggest upmerging to a new, if that would be viable, or to the existing parent, if not.  Alai 12:10, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
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GPS-stub (no cat)
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The result of the debate was send to WP:CFD

Doesn't look much like a stub template. In fact, it has a template within it. Created by the same person who, a month or so back, brought you the since-deleted domotics-stub. Doubt this will get close to threshold - tempted to take it straight to SFD. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  00:59, 30 January 2007 (UTC)
 * This could be somewhat broadened to satnav in general, perhaps. Parent is certainly large.  Otherwise, upmerge.  Alai 04:39, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
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BishopofDurham-stub
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The result of the debate was upmerged to "Church of England bishop stubs"

Not certain if this was proposed, if so I didn't find it. Only 46 stubs and at the least it needs its category, sent to SFD for a rename to. Caerwine <small style="font-family:sans-serif;color:darkred">Caer’s whines 01:56, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
 * IIRC it wasn't proposed, but was brought here before with a variant name, then taken to SFD where at least the name was standardised. Not sure how useful it would be though. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  02:28, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Rename would be speediable, or else I'd be about as happy with an upmerge at SFD. Alai 04:32, 1 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Update: Still 46 articles, no rename in progress for the cat. Her Pegship <small style="color:green;"> (tis herself) 19:12, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
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WestVirginia-radio-station-stub
Someone seems to have noticed that we overlooked this one when all the other state-specific upmerged templates were made. No apparent problems with it. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  03:06, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Dunno how I forgot that, it's the only one I have an uncle in. I may have skipped Alaska and Hawaii for less absent-minded reasons.  Alai 04:36, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Update: Now applied to 37 articles, still upmerged. Her Pegship <small style="color:green;"> (tis herself) 19:13, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Update: Now has over 80 articles. Category proposed at WPSS/P. Her Pegship <small style="color:green;"> (tis herself) 19:57, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
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Pr-US-bio-stub
<div class="boilerplate metadata mw-archivedtalk archived mw-archivedtalk" style="background: #F99; margin: 0 auto; padding: 0 10px 0 10px; border: 1px solid #AAAAAA;">
 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the discovery of the stub template and/or category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the template's or category's talk page (if any).  No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the debate was send to WP:CFD

Unused redirect of US-bio-stub with the following comment in the redirect: "presumably American but no verifying source known". Speediable as unused and unproposed, but might a stub type for people of unknown or uncertain nationality be worth considering? Caerwine <small style="font-family:sans-serif;color:darkred">Caer’s whines 21:47, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the template's or category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this section.