Wikipedia talk:Articles for deletion/Scene (youth subculture)

Comments about The Scene seperated out for clarity
Going to add this too, all though alot better written article, still a piece of original research and claims the term is in use in computer communities, obviously every 'scene' potentially refers to itself as 'The Scene'. The article Scene (community), whilst being essentially a dic def is the most accurate on wikipedia. :
 * -- neon white talk 20:48, 6 October 2008 (UTC)


 * The Scene should not be deleted, nor even considered in the same AFD as the current article. KellenT 10:20, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Please expand with reasoning. -- neon white talk 15:32, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * The Scene is an awkward article, but describing the "warez scene" (e.g.) could actually be encyclopedic. In any case, the reasons for deleting that article and the reasons for deleting this article would be different, at least from my perspective, so they should be considered in separate AFDs. KellenT 22:42, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * They're both original research. -- neon white talk 13:53, 9 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Comment. I'll abstain from voting on the youth subculture article, though it seems pretty sparse. But, I will raise a huge concern over the tagging of The Scene to be deleted in the same motion. The latter is a decently written article that could benefit from a few more sources and possibly a renaming (possible "The Scene (Warez)"). Rurik (talk) 00:21, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * The problem is there do not seem to be any source to back up even it's existance let alone any of the info, it may be well written but that's not enough to keep what is still a piece of original research. Note also that it has been tagged as OR since April 2008 and little has been done. -- neon white talk 15:40, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * The warez scene is heavily documented and well-known, but not under the specific name of the article. I will begin including links where appropriate in the original. IMO, The Scene could be renamed to Warez Scene, replacing the current redirect to Warez, and leaving 'The Scene' to be a disamb. Rurik (talk) 17:23, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * That looks good to me --Enric Naval (talk) 22:14, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I support that as long as adequate sources can be found. -- neon white talk 13:54, 9 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Redirect and merge The Scene into Scene (community) I can find no reliable sources about the term. I can find a low-quality unpublished paper, and, on a bibliographic list about demoscene I can only find one work that uses that term (search for "davide"). Ídem for searching google scholar for "the scene" demoscene and "the scene" warez, almost all sources don't use "the scene" as a substantive. I can also see that it's not mentioned at other papers and books where it should appear.  --Enric Naval (talk) 13:27, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Demoscene actually has it's own article which is much better sourced, i was unsure whether the two terms where linked. Maybe a redirect to Demoscene? -- neon white talk 15:34, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * The problem is that the warez community also uses that term. Maybe a dab page? --Enric Naval (talk) 16:44, 7 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Question: As Scene (youth subculture) and The Scene are two completely different concepts, why are they both listed here, in the same AfD?  The former article refers typically to teenagers who have some crossover with emo culture.  The latter article uses the term "The Scene" to refer to a culture surrounding computer software development.  They are unrelated! Whatever404 (talk) 02:44, 8 October 2008 (UTC)
 * They are related because they are both using a slang term for subcultures to attempt to describe a particular subculuture that may use the slang term within the said community. Both articles, whilst being about different subjects, have the exact same issue. -- neon white talk 10:04, 8 October 2008 (UTC)

Rename second The scene seems more sourcable and more notable, but using the term for one group is still no good - The Scene should be a redirect to the Scene disambig, and current article should be The Scene (warez). Otherwise i will go and find a load of reliable sources using the words "The Scene" to refer to different communities, and the page will have to take them :/ eg., , NYtime uses "The Scene" to mean gay scene, when UK TV mainstream program made an episode called the Scene, this referred to the gay scene The warez scene is cernainly not notable enough to have monopoly of this term and to be the preffered destination over the disambig page.
 * Don't forget to link to My Scene (lol) --Enric Naval (talk) 00:42, 10 October 2008 (UTC)