Wikipedia talk:Articles for deletion/Stephen Hogan

Well, I was going to put this on the page, but I don't want to make anyone unhappy and I guess it might. So since I didn't it and don't want just erase it, I'll put it here, where nobody will see it but at least it will exist.


 * Tim Abell:
 * It's just hard to tell, since the article says that for The Marksman he was "Lead role with David Carradine and Wes Studi". But that's not true. In the film infobox, he's not one of the four starring actors listed, and in the body he's listed 16th. At IMDb, he's not listed as one of the 18 main actors. That's the first I checked, and the last. His article has several "lead role" claims, but I suppose they're all lies too. His bio has one paragraph, mostly about his military service, ref'd to "We Are The Mighty", a "military equipment and lifestyle" mag. The rest is un'ref. There are 51 refs total,
 * More notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? Hard to tell since the article's a pack of lies apparently, but my guess is NO.
 * Tim Abell. Deleted at AfD twice before. Massively reference bombed, and most of them are very poor or worse sources. It will take time to check that there are three that are ok. Written by a driveby account, I guess a WP:UPE throwaway account. —SmokeyJoe (talk) 10:35, 22 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Right, not surprised. Was thinking of nominating it myself for deletion, but too busy right now to do proper BEFORE work and figure out if could be fixed instead. If you're up to it, by all means go for it. Deleted twice before, maybe it should even be salted. Herostratus (talk) 20:12, 22 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Robert Bauer (actor)
 * CV? CV is extensive, and he played (secondary) roles in This Is Spinal Tap and Twin Peaks and like that. It says he's the co-title role and director in Dirk and Betty, altho that film is blackinked and is pretty indy.
 * Meets GNG? NO. The article is just his CV, except "He co-created Bauerbrook Films".
 * More notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? YES, maybe. Particularly if you throw in the producer and director credits. About equal, probably.


 * Seth Carr
 * CV? Pretty good, considering he's 14. Lead role in the Netflix movie The Main Event (2020 film). Black Panther (film)''.tiny role but big film, some other stuff.
 * Meets GNG? NO, there's only two sentences except for his CV.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? ABOUT EQUAL assumming you valorize Netflix over the BBC and stuff.


 * Arman Darbo
 * CV? Not long, but he's also a teen it looks like. He was a top lead role, maybet the main protaganist in And Then I Go
 * Meets GNG? YES, if you want to be pretty generous. There's two sentences, but also a quote.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? NO, I don't think so. He's been in seven films... only four are blacklinked, and one is a "Chinese propaganda film" where he plays an unnamed character... IMDb lists him 5th in the blacklinked film Greatland. He's young, but so far, not a lot. Hogan's got more.


 * Lalo Encinas
 * CV? Pretty weak. He's got 16 films (all bluelinked but one), but hes uncredited in nine of them. He's a character actor -- an Apache -- and looks like he never got close to a lead role.
 * Meets GNG? NO, not really.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? NO


 * Bridget Flanery
 * CV? Decent. Only three films, one short and none bluelinked, but plenty TV -- 44 episodes in Sweet Valley High (TV series), so very extensive there. She's not one of the two protaganists, but she's the best friend of one. She's listed 10th at IMDb, 5th in the "starring" section in the article infobox. Nine episodes in Sabrina the Teenage Witch (1996 TV series), so recurring. 4 in Teen Angel (1997 TV series)]. Bunch of single-episode apperances.
 * Meets GNG? NO. Just short bio info -- where she was born, where she went to school, like that.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? EQUAL, to be pretty generous. I personally think it's a NO, but if you squint, maybe. She's got 44 episodes in Sweet Valley High (the show had 88 althogher) and that's a lot, but the show was straight to syndication not a network show, and she doesn't have a lot else.


 * Fred Hechinger (there was no G)
 * CV? Pretty good. He's young, so not super extensive, but he's listed 5th for The White Lotus (TV series), 4th at The Woman in the Window (2021 film). Some other stuff.
 * Meets GNG? YES, there's a full article about him in "The Cinemaholic", which is a People-like site and has a full staff.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? NO, not really. He's had two 4th-or-5th roles, but no title/lead roles, and not near as much bulk as Hogan. Directed a music video for Samia (musician), but hasn't been on legitimate stage.


 * James Jurdi (there was no I)
 * CV? Not super extensive, but 2nd-listed at Danger One, indy film. co-write and co-produced Reaper (film). Protagonist in Pocket Listing (film). 10 episodes in a soap opera, The Bold and the Beautiful.
 * Meets GNG? NO
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? EQUAL, if you want to be generous, based mostly on the #1 role in Pocket Listing (film). 2nd in another indy film, some TV work.


 * Earle Larrimore (there was no K)
 * CV? Pretty good. Stage actor. Broadway, Mostly off-broadway and regional.
 * Meets GNG? Uhhh... let's say YES, based on a paragraph in this article tho it just describes his career... being generous, but sure.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? YES. He originated a 2nd-listed (in the article) role in a Broadway play the later was a Bette Davis movie. That's something. 4th listed (in the article) in [[Mourning Becomes Electra] on Broadway... and there's more.


 * Hugh Maguire (actor)
 * CV? 20 films, but the first 11 he's uncredited, and some of the rest he plays like "Patient" or "Professor". So he's a TV guy, and the keystone here is 15 on Cheers, a very major American show. Other than that, 9 episodes on Live-In, 6 on Dallas (1978 TV series)'' (major show), 12 other TV appearances.
 * Meets GNG? NO, the article is just a CV.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? NO, I don't think so. The capstone is 15 episodes on Cheers, but after all Cheers had 275 episodes. Nothing close to a leading role that I can see.


 * RiRia. He's a Japanese actor, but I'm just going mechanically here. He's liste under "N" for some reason.
 * CV? OK. Five films, three are shorts and only one is bluelinked and he didn't have a major role it looks like Reasonable amount of TV work, and hella work in commercials which are listed.
 * Meets GNG? NO there's nothing.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? NO not really. He was a classical flute player before acting and won a ton of awards such as "The 14th Japan Flute Convention Competition", but none of those are bluelinked so I don't know how to judge those.


 * Broderick O'Farrell
 * CV? Good. 22 films, only one isn't bluelinked.
 * Meets GNG? NO. It just describes his roles.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? NO. "He began his career at age 14, appearing onstage... in his hometown of Portland, Oregon. He subsequently appeared in several locally-produced films... before pursuing a film career in Los Angeles. He appeared in numerous silent films throughout the 1920s, and later had minor roles in several Laurel and Hardy films, including Beau Hunks (1931). O'Farrell had minor bit parts throughout the 1940s, often appearing as conductors, doctors, and coroners in a variety of films."


 * Patricia Patts
 * CV? Length is decent. TV, a little theatre, no films. Lede says "She played the lead role in the 1978 Los Angeles touring production of Annie, and the voice of Peppermint Patty on the show Peanuts, which this Peanuts was an obscure Franco-American production and she played the 7th-listed (in the article) role, a voice role. Annie''s a big deal and the lead is a big deal, but touring companies are a good step below legitimate theatre. The rest looks like filler. She's a singer-songwrite but hasn't published to speak of.
 * Meets GNG? YES, if you want to be a little generous. That's based on this extensive interview in the Nashville Post which is really about her business (it opens with "Patricia Patts is vice president and co-owner of Write Off the Row, a Berry Hill-based service business that caters to songwriters looking for flexible and inexpensive spaces". But, coverage is coverage.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? NO.


 * Luce Rains (there's no Q)
 * CV? It's not given in the article. But IMDb shows a really long one. It's hard to judge of there are leading roles there without digging. Quick look doesn't indicate it.
 * Meets GNG? NO.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? NO, based on my analysis. The article doesn't say, and I'm not going to dig thru sources unaided.


 * Allan Sears
 * CV? Many films, all bluelinked. Silent film actor. Article lede says "played leading roles in the 1910s and 1920s before transitioning into character roles in the 1930s". Random sampling every third file in the 1910-1920 range... Martyrs of the Alamo, 2nd listed, playing Davy Crockett... Hell-to-Pay Austin, 9th... A Sister of Six, 11th... The Desire of the Moth, 6th... Madame Bo-Peep, 2nd... The Kaiser, the Beast of Berlin, 2nd... OK that's enough, they did pop these out, but that's a bunch of leading roles and there are a whole lot more films to look at.
 * Meets GNG? YES, maybe, since there are obits. I can't access them, but obits usually give enough info. Based on what's taken from the obits and put in the article, tho, it's pretty marginal tho. Meets GNG if you squint.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? YES.


 * Bex Taylor-Klaus
 * CV? Four blulinked full-length films... Taylor-Klaus played worthwhile roles in at least two of them... but mostly a TV person. 73 eposides (voice actor) in Voltron: Legendary Defender, 9 appearances in The Killing (American TV series), 9 in Arrow (TV series), 6 in House of Lies, 24 in Scream (TV series), and there's more.
 * Meets GNG? YES, there's quite a bit.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? YES, I suppose. Taylor-Klaus has never been in a lead role in a film or played in theater, but still, major roles in a lot of TV series.


 * Julia Weldon (there is no U or V)
 * CV? Decent. The article doesn't show much, but IMDb does.
 * Meets GNG? YES, there's an interview at Mashable which looks legit and big.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? NO. There're no lead roles or recurring TV roles that I see right off.

That's 16 (I'm not counting Tim Abell) and we're out of letters, so we'll to back to A and pick the second entry.


 * Elizabeth Allen (actress)
 * CV? Extensive.
 * Meets GNG? YES. The articles mostly about her CV and I don't think there's any articles about her an a actor per se, but she ran a dress store later and that's mentioned, and there's a couple other tidbits. Coverage is coverage.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? YES, based on the article lede. Two TONY nominations.


 * Andrew S. Bishop
 * CV? Minimal, for film. It says he was a stage actor, but IDDb only lists two productions. He's listed 3rd in Murder in Harlem. The lede says "He starred in several of ]]Oscar Micheaux]]'s African American films". The CV might be short because his work just wasn't recorded much.
 * Meets GNG? NO. However, making films by and for the African-American community in the early 20th century, you'd expect that, and I think you have allow that for, maybe.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? YES, I think so. There's a book that has "When Andrew S. Bishop and Cleo Desmond starred in one of their many melodramas and mysteries, fans often lined up at the box office to adore their matinee idols". It's just the one line, but you can't say that about Hogan. He was a star in the African American film and theatere culture of his time, I gather.


 * Michael Cavadias
 * CV? Kind of short. He's in ten films, but only five are blulinked, and only one of them has a full name (the others are like "Doctor" and "Wendy"). TV, six episodes total.
 * Meets GNG? YES.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? NO.


 * Jasper Deeter
 * CV? It's not extensive, but he was a theater actor in the erly 20th century, so finding his CV would take some digging an even then would be incomplete/
 * Meets GNG? YES.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? YES, he was close to Eugene O'Niel and was in his plays with the Provincetown Players, and founded the important Hedgerow Theatre.


 * Gary Hershberger (had to go down to H to find a letter with a second article)
 * CV? Extensive. He played Mike Nelson in Twin Peaks, major show, 13 episodes, there were 48 total so more than 25%. Recurring character, 6 episodes, in [Six Feet Under (TV series)]]. Lot more shows, but single episodes. 16 films, 14 bluelinked... 11 of them don't have fill names ("Young officer", "Tommy", like that). He's got a full name in One Man's Hero, but he's listed 17th. Not seeing any evidence of any leading roles right off.
 * Meets GNG? YES I'll say. Actually he really doesn't, but there're a few tidbits besides a list of his roles and where he went to high school. He won an award, he teaches as such-and-such, he has a prodution company. Single sentences, but it adds up to something.
 * As or more notable/important/worthwhile than Hogan? EQUAL lets say, based on 13 episodes of Twin Peaks which was a major show. I don't know as he's equal really as he's only in 1/4 of the shows for that and I think it's not a really major charcter, and he doesn't have a whole lot else I think. Would not meet NACTOR as Hogan does, I don't think. But he co-wrote a movie and all, let's say equal and be done.

Alright. So there you have it. Of 20 random actor articles, we have:
 * Wikinotability: 11 meet the WP:GNG, 9 do not.
 * Real-world, as notable/important/worthwhile/accomplished as Hogan? 7 are, 4 are about equal, 9 are not.

So, Hogan doesn't stick out. He fits comfortably right in the middle of these other actor artices. He neither rises to the top nor sinks to the bottom. To my mind that's a data point -- not the only one, but not nothing either -- that'd make me question why you'd want to single out this article in particular. Herostratus (talk) 05:26, 22 November 2021 (UTC)