Wikipedia talk:Noticeboard for India-related topics/Archive 28

Indian culture
There is a debate in the India talk page on wether an image of a certain tribe's hut is an appropriate rep for Indian culture and wether it should be substituted by more apt images like that of a festival, Indian music, or performing arts like dance etc. This has also now sort of deviated into wether the culture section should be expanded and what should be included in it. Could we have some comments please.Rueben lys 12:53, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

Atul Chitnis / AfD
I wonder if any of you might possibly comment on the most recent (aka third) AfD nomination for Atul Chitnis. There's an awful lot of text there, but only two opinions plus that of the nom. I can't say I know anything much about the subject matter, and I think you might better than I. - Che Nuevara 17:46, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Kashmir Freedom Movement
Hi all. Happened to bump into the above entry. I was surprised to see that a certain POV comments staying there for long time.. Can someone who is an expert in this feild look into this article please? I'm not branding it a POV fork per se. But it certainly looks like one till now. Cheers ώiki Ѕαи Яоzε†αLҝ 21:55, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Expert review: Rasipalayam
As part of the Notability wikiproject, I am trying to sort out whether Rasipalayam is notable enough for an own article. I would appreciate an expert opinion. For details, see the article's talk page. If you can spare some time, please add your comments there. Thanks! --B. Wolterding 17:58, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes it is. Geographic entities are notable. There may be little data at this moment, but it has sufficient scope for decent expansion. =Nichalp   «Talk»=  18:00, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I have cleaned it up a bit and removed the templates. Hope it's okay. Regards, Ganeshk  ( talk ) 03:46, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

A few pages which could use review by someone more familiar with India
Hello,

I spend a fair amount of time in Wikipedia's dead-end pages project, and there are some articles there which appear to be about India-related topics that I'm having difficulty assessing. If someone more familiar with these topics could take a look at them and give some indication on whether the articles should be improved (i.e. they discuss encyclopedic topics and just need some cleanup) or deleted, that would be helpful. Here are just a few that I noticed today when going through the last two pages of the list (there are certainly more, which I can bring to this board's attention as I find them):


 * Eloormadom
 * Santhipuram, Kerala
 * Satyapuram
 * Shashank.M.Kashi
 * Shiekh Muhammed Abdullah Baba-kerala-India
 * Shree Raghotham Peeta (seems notable, but could use major cleanup, and I'm not sure where to start)
 * Sri Parthasarathy Rajagopal Chari
 * Srishti Dynasty
 * Sthanika Brahmins
 * Vijnana Vihara
 * Vraja(Braja) Parikrama
 * Vytla
 * Yanamalakuduru

Any help you can provide is greatly appreciated. JavaTenor 17:05, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Pithapuram
Our article on Pithapuram uses both the spelling Pithapuram and Pitapuram to refer to the city. But which one is to be preferred over the other? A ecis Brievenbus 23:16, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Dear friend Pithapuram is the correct one which is used over there Pingali 08:20, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

Indic text rendering for certain Indic languages
As said in the title, I notice that nowadays, Indic text in certain languages is being rendered as though the text is treated as sub-script. It's been a week and yet nobody's found a solution to this problem? speaks rohith. 19:52, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

Jim Corbett National Park
Greetings, I have rewritten the Jim Corbett National Park article. Since I am now beginning to realize that the article has GA potential it would be of help to me if editors took time to weigh the article and voice their opinion on what more needs to be added to it. I'm seeking opinion in this regard here since the article falls under this Wikiproject and would benefit from attention. With Regards, Havelok  20:44, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

Denotified tribes of India and Notified tribes of India
Hi, I found these articles once as uncategorized and I feel that you need to listen to the post inside one of the articles:

This article is a stub and should be integrated with denotified, from which it was shamelessly copied. Both "notified" and "denotified" should be replaced by an article about the Criminal Tribes Act.

I have little knowledge of your culture so I opted to send it here rather than edit them myself. -- Lenticel ( talk ) 10:39, 14 October 2007 (UTC)


 * The subject of Criminal Tribes Act seems to suggest a law, rather than the list of tribes "notified". =Nichalp   «Talk»=  15:31, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

New template: Indian name
I've created a new template, "Indian name", which can be used at the top of biographical articles to explain that the subject does not have a surname, but that part of his or her name is a patronymic (that is, his or her father's name). Feel free to use and improve it.

As Indian names differ greatly, it may be necessary to create variations of this template – please leave a message on the template talk page if you have any suggestions. For instance, I've noticed that some people use "a/l" instead of "s/o" (son of). I assume that "a/l" means "son of" in Tamil, but don't know what it stands for or the equivalent of "daughter of". Also, someone will need to explain to me how Sikh names work. (Is "Kaur" or "Singh" regarded as a surname?) Cheers, Jacklee 20:56, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

I have another question: when an Indian name consists of a given name and a patronymic, is it always the case that the patronymic is put in front of the given name? In other words, if an Indian person's name is, say, "Shunmugam Jayakumar", would it be safe to assume that the person's given name is "Jayakumar" and that his father's name is "Shunmugam"? I'm wondering whether the order of the parameters in the template should be reversed. At the moment, it is necessary to type " ". If the patronymic is always in front of the given name, perhaps it would be better to change the template so that it can be used like this: " ", as this may be more natural for editors. Do discuss this matter further at "Template talk:Indian name". Cheers, Jacklee 23:22, 14 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Also complicating the issue is the fact that, not all "Indian names" have the patronymic part. For example, none of my ancestors up to 5 generations back share any part of their names. --Ragib 16:09, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Well, in that scenario there wouldn't be any point in using the Indian name template anyway. Cheers, Jacklee 03:51, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

Indian cinema project
Not sure anyone noticed, Indian cinema project has recently been moved to be a sub-page of Films project. It was proposed on the talk page and was moved per consensus (although I was lone-person who objected :). I would like to hear some thoughts how taskforces need to be structured when they fall under multiple parent projects. Examples: Indian cinema, Indian military history, Protected areas of India etc. Regards, Ganeshk  ( talk ) 03:35, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

Poor form at the very least?
I just nominated an image Rama in Tirumala for FPC. A user left these remarks on the review page. I thought it was despicable. Fowler&amp;fowler «Talk»  21:46, 16 October 2007 (UTC)  I know it is a violation of some rule, but I can't figure out which one. Could someone more knowledgeable weigh in here or at WP:FPC? Fowler&amp;fowler «Talk»  22:40, 16 October 2007 (UTC)


 * OK. He has withdrawn his remarks.  Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  09:17, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

TfD nomination of Template:Wildlife of India
Template:Wildlife of India has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for Deletion page. Thank you. — Amartyabag   TALK2ME  05:07, 20 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I will rather call this a discussion. Amartyabag   TALK2ME  05:11, 20 October 2007 (UTC)

Help required at Marathi
Hello i have recently seperated Marathi grammar and Marathi phonology out of main Marathi article. I request help of linguists and experts about deciding subject matter (im confused which article shud have what) and also expanding the same. Im not able to use citation templates too. For eg i referring a book which i will use as source for abt 15 statements how do we do that? (Stateofart 07:08, 20 October 2007 (UTC))

I've bot-populated another batch of these: currently stands at over a listings page. Alai 22:34, 20 October 2007 (UTC)
 * To which add:,  and .  Alai 01:29, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

Chennai
Chennai has been nominated for a featured article review. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. Please leave your comments and help us to return the article to featured quality. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, articles are moved onto the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Remove" the article from featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Reviewers' concerns are here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by DrKiernan (talk • contribs) 08:13, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Munnar a Metropolitan city in India?
Category:Metropolitan cities in India

When i saw the category for metropolitan cities in Indian, i see Munnar, a hill station in Kerala listed there. I've removed that.

—Preceding unsigned comment added by Nubin wiki (talk • contribs) 17:54, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

Expert review: Arupathimoovar Festival
As part of the Notability wikiproject, I am trying to sort out whether Arupathimoovar Festival is notable enough for an own article. I would appreciate an expert opinion. For details, see the article's talk page. If you can spare some time, please add your comments there. Thanks! --B. Wolterding 11:31, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

Template:National Parks of India
Help needed at Template:National Parks of India. Due to some unknown reason the states after Orissa is not showing. Pls. correct the wrong. Amartyabag  TALK2ME  05:51, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Navbox can take only 20 parameters. Since group20 is Orissa, nothing beyond it is displayed. utcursch | talk 13:55, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the correction. Amartyabag   TALK2ME  15:28, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Curry Mile Manchester
I'm not a member of this project but could someone tell me if the article curry mile is within the scope of WikiProject India? It doesn't appear so to me. Richerman 14:42, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
 * No =Nichalp   «Talk»=  11:31, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Wikimedia India Chapter
I'm looking to revitalise the long proposed move to set up a local wikimedia chapter in India http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_India_chapter. Please let me know how many are interested. Regards, =Nichalp   «Talk»=  08:03, 17 September 2007 (UTC)


 * I am interested. Infact I discussed the same with Jimbo Wales when he came down to Chennai in Feb-2007 and he said such chapters are there for few countries including Germany but didn't say when Indian can have one. Vjdchauhan 17:44, 23 September 2007 (UTC).
 * We have to have it set up, and Wikimedia has to approve it. To set it up, we would need a few more members. Including you and me, there are only five of us who have shown interest. I'm hoping to round up more support. Regards, =Nichalp   «Talk»=  17:12, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
 * OK, count me in, even if as a sporadic member — Lost (talk) 03:07, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
 * I am keen to support in any way I can. It would be great to get this going.. Regards 202.88.171.197 13:52, 28 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Are Indian Wikipedians who don't live in India eligible? -- Arvind 22:44, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure. I could find out. =Nichalp   «Talk»=  12:07, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
 * To clarify my question, membership requirements are entirely up to the chapter - for example, the Norwegian chapter (Wikimedia Norge) is open to all who share its goals, regardless of where they live (and a number of members of its board don't actually live in Norway). I was asking what those of you planning to set this up have in mind, because I'm definitely interested, but I don't live in India. -- Arvind 13:31, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't think membership should be restricted in anyways. But to legally set up an organization in India, do members need to fulfil certain residence criteria? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nichalp (talk • contribs) 18:26, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
 * It's been a good while now since I practiced, but I don't think there's a residence requirement as far as I'm aware. Of course, societies are a state subject, so most states have their own Societies Act, but the broad framework is more or less the same everywhere. -- Arvind 21:32, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Count me in too. This has been raised by a few of us during Jimbo's Bangalore visit too, but we haven't proceeded further. -- Sundar \talk \contribs 17:12, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Interested to support in any way I can. I think it is a good to push for a chapter Arunram 13:56, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes, i am intersted to join. Amartyabag   TALK2ME  11:07, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Bhadani is also interested. =Nichalp   «Talk»=  15:27, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
 * So do we have a decent number then? What's next and what would be the chapter's responsibilities? — Lost (talk) 16:05, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes, we seem to have a decent number. I'll try and see what needs to be done next. Regards, =Nichalp   «Talk»=  16:44, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes Nichalp, come up with a nice plan. It will be great to have the India chapter. Have you people contacted who is in the Chapters Committee?--Dwaipayan (talk) 23:42, 11 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes, I'm in contact with HPN via email. I should be less busy this week, so will follow up on the subject. Regards, =Nichalp   «Talk»=  17:34, 13 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Any new update Nichalp. Regards, Vjdchauhan. 06:00, 25 October 2007 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.177.147.225 (talk)
 * Sorry, been busy. Will look into it when I get some time next week.  =Nichalp   «Talk»=  15:10, 25 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Nichalp, can you pls call me up @ 09915585230, I want to discuss the same, else give me your contact number and I will give a call to you. I would like you to check my contributions its primarily related to categorization of pages as I think then we will be in a better context to discuss the same (Wikimedia India Chapter). Also pls don't put too much weightage on my viewpoint there on my User Page else it will be difficult and you would be listening me through a filter, just consider me a as a person who is passionate about Wikipedia. Thanks. Vjdchauhan 05:19, 31 October 2007 (UTC).


 * Wikimedia India chapter is upadated, Hope this update gives some food for thought and encourages further discussion and updates at Wikimedia India chapterMahitgar 16:27, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Hi everyone: Please join this mailing list. wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org. I think it's best we coordinate activities through email rather than multiple posts and private mailing. Regards, =Nichalp   «Talk»=  08:39, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Preity Zinta FA
Hi there. The Preity Zinta article has recently achieved A-class status. Due to the wealth of support I have decided to now nominate for an FA class article which I believe and judging by the comments of others is pretty much up to. In my view it is better than some existing FA actor articles. I would therefore be very grateful if you could give it a final review in your own time and leave your comments and views at Featured article candidates/Preity Zinta. Thankyou, your comments are always valuable. ♦ Sir Blofeld ♦       "Talk"? 10:57, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Chimkhola
This appears to be an article about a region in India. The article appears to be written by a non-native speaker not familiar with Wikipedia conventions. Much clean up by people who are more familiar with the matter in question is probably required. Thanks! Miles Naismith 21:00, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
 * No, its in Nepal. Amartyabag   TALK2ME  06:43, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

Jimmy Wales at IIT Bombay Techfest
The IIT Bombay Techfest will be held from 25 to 27 January, 2008. The Lecture Series will feature Jimmy Wales: http://techfest.org/lectures/ -- those living in Mumbai might be interested. utcursch | talk 05:19, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
 * In case, Jimmy has some extra hours, wikipedians (repeat wikipedians) in Mumbai may try to organize an exclusive meeting (somewhere in Mumbai) of Jimmy with wikipedians located in Mumbai/ other cities of India. --Bhadani (talk) 06:46, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia in ToI
See. Anirudh, Srikeit, Ramit and I were interviewed by ToI a few days back. Much to my surprise the article made the front page of today's Times (Ahmedabad edition). Imagine getting up on Sunday morning and seeing your photo on the front page! Hope this increases the popularity of wikipedia in Gujarat. - Aksi_great (talk) 08:10, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * LOL. of all people, see who manages to squeeze in in that last paragraph.  aksi, are you game for a fight.. so you can mention me when they come calling next.. and I can make it to the headlines too and someone will write an article about me and you try to AfD it and I'll call you for COI and then we can have a real fight. LOL :D  Sarvagnya 08:50, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * That's interesting! Where did they get the 15 Indian administrators figure from? I remember at least 20 Indian admins at one time. And 20% of the Indian admins are from Ahmedabad as they mentioned! There was also a former admin of Gujurati ethnicity so the presence of Gujuratis in the administrative front of Wikipedia is well and truly strong. You could have also used it as an opportunity to promote Gujurati Wikipedia (http://gu.wikipedia.org). GizzaDiscuss  &#169; 08:53, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * of all people, see who manages to squeeze in in that last paragraph.  ROFLcopters!!!! How could you, Anirudh? :-)) --thunderboltz(TALK) 09:03, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * That's great news. This needs to be posted on WP:POST. If possible, could you scan the article and put it up somewhere so we can all read the paper version? Regards, =Nichalp   «Talk»=  12:56, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Congrats to the three musketeers, Anirudh, Srikeit, Ramit. Warm Regards. --Bhadani (talk) 13:08, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Kuntan lives. Baka man  16:39, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * You can see the article at the Times epaper site - . Select Ahmedabad edition and broadband if asked. If the paper has changed by the time you see this, you can view today's paper via the archives link on the left side. - Aksi_great (talk) 17:01, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * David had actually contacted me, and I gave him their phone numbers. Dorks didn't even call to thank me for getting them on the front page. FRONT PAGE MAYN! WTF? I am still in a delirium. xD — Nearly Headless Nick   {C}  17:19, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * AMAZING! And that too over the headlines of Musharaf's Emergency! =Nichalp   «Talk»=  18:34, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Ditto. Really Amazing. --Bhadani (talk) 18:39, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * I suspect they read this ;-) --thunderboltz(TALK) 19:17, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Sunday Times, front page, top! Blessed indeed is Amdavad, Diwali comes a week in advance. And its nice to see so many of the old crowd here today. Congrats to all four of our front-pagers, and Happy Diwali to everyone. ImpuMozhi 21:27, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Wow! Congrats man...superb.--Dwaipayan (talk) 22:48, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks everyone. I just got news that the same article has come in the Baroda edition of the Times today. Same place with pics and all. - Aksi_great (talk) 03:31, 5 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Congratulations guys! I noticed you guys participated in Wikimania Taipei. I am really interested in hearing your experiences from the event. Regards, Ganeshk  ( talk ) 04:47, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
 * This was all over Gujarat, except Surat maybe, I haven't confirmed. — Nearly Headless Nick   {C}  10:20, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Tehelka sting
I started a page on it at Tehelka Gujarat riots sting. Please do help out. Baka man  19:07, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Bollywood articles
An overwhelming number of Bollywood related articles have become piles of garbage. People editing it seem to have no clue about WP:RS. Considering how much attention bw gets from mainstream media, its a shame that every conceivable type of non-RS source is being used on these articles. blogs, geocities, tripod, youtube, random commercial sites.. you name it.. they're all on these articles. Will some admins turn their attention to these articles. And who/what is this boxofficeindia.com? its all over the place. All these articles need to be cleaned up and watched carefully. Sarvagnya 04:37, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
 * I think it's a universal problem. =Nichalp   «Talk»=  12:34, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
 * I do not think that it is as widespread on other articles as on bollywood articles. Also, I can understand if people used less than reliable sources on articles where info is hard to come by.  Or maybe if they were like a couple in a 100 inline refs on the article.  That, however is emphatically not the case here.  If there is one topic on wikipedia, where sources are no problem at all, it is Bollywood.  Almost every Indian mainstream media publication carries bollywood stuff.  It beats me why someone would use santabanta and random fansites and blogs over The Hindu or The Indian Express or Rediff or Times of India.  The only reason I can think of is to push fancruft and POV.  The content on fansites is only of two types - one is blatant fancruft and the other is what we'd term as BLP vios on wikipedia.  That makes these sites a strict no-no on wikipedia.  Here is a small sample of the kind of sources Priety Zinta, currently in FAC uses.  Can somebody convince me that these sites are RS?  Can somebody tell me who runs these sites and what makes them 'experts' in the field.  I have tried looking into many of their "About us" links and I have not found anything which remotely suggests that they are acknowledged experts in the field.  Most of them are sites run by individuals/group of individuals or by nameless/faceless commercial establishments.  If not, I will be removing large chunks of text from the article.  The Sivaji article too was a non-RS/POV cesspool until I waded into it.  Now most of the refs there are from respectable sources like The Hindu, ibnlive, rediff etc.,  though, I notice that quite a few non-RS sources have made their way back into the article.  Ok.. here's the sample I was talking about -

Boxofficeindia hindisong nowrunning asianoutlook apunkachoice Like I said, this is only a small sample and only from the zinta article. There are dozens more like these being used on other articles like Amitabh Bacchan, srkhan etc.,. Dont tell me you cant find good sources for amitabh!! Sarvagnya 23:32, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Imdb is considered to be a credible source. A lot of media publications cite imdb including the Bombay Times However user created content is not credible. =Nichalp   «Talk»=  05:51, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * A) I've found an evidence for boxofficeindia.com being reliable! Please see Indiatimes and TOI mentioned it on several occasions, writing "According to boxofficeindia.com..." - . I think if it is mentioned in reputable sites which use it as a source for themselves, it is definitealy reliable.
 * B) Bollywoodvista is used in a Fa names Lage Raho Munnabhai twice. I believe if it was used on this article (which was featured on Wikipedia's main page.), so it is reliable, for the silmple fact that every source is very well checked.
 * C) See- Rediff mention Apunkachoice.com in their site - . Regards, Shahid  •  Talk 2 me  00:04, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Times of India is not a RS. User:Blnguyen/Times of India.  Blnguyen  ( bananabucket ) 00:19, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
 * The times of India is not less than The New York Times. It is a newspaper and it's not you to decide that this is unreliable. Users on Wikipedia have no authority to imply that TOI is unreliable. Plus, your source refer us only to cricket.indiatimes. Users claim that it is plagiarised there. First of all, these are only biographies and not featured articles or news reports. Secondly, users give the source and say that it was copied from Wikipedia. How can they know that? The site does not give dates of publication so you can't prove what was there before. TOI or Wikipedia (when it is clearly Wikipedia). The Times of India is the largest selling daily in the world. It doesn't plagiarise in print. These incidents are quite isolated (if they exist at all). And again, users and editors on Wikipedia are not authorised enough to invalidate it or decide that it's a non-RS site, especially when it's very well supported by WP:RS policy. Best regards, Shahid  •  Talk 2 me  12:59, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
 * It was plaigiarised, complete with errors. It's junk.  Blnguyen  ( bananabucket ) 23:59, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
 * It wasn't. Again, your page indicates only cricket.indiatimes and only biographies of these cricketers. We don't even know if it is supported by the site at all. Disagree with that. User votes won't determine its reliability. Regards, Shahid  •  Talk 2 me  09:09, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

Shahid, throwaway mentions in a RS cannot be extrapolated to mean that boxofficeindia is RS. The boxofficeindia site itself makes no claim to notability or any mention of who they are. Facts and figures are serious business and we cant have them sourced to suspect sources. And especially in Indian movie industry, box office collection figures are notoriously inaccurate and fudged. There are wide differences between sources(see the discussions on Sivaji, there.. the film budgets varied between 60 and 100 crores between sources!) and non-RS sources like these only add to the woes. All aspects of Bollywood are covered widely in mainstream sources and there really is no need to use suspect sources like these. Even with mainstream sources, it is for editors here to exercise some common sense/discretion and weed out unreliable info. ToI and rediff though reliable sources, are not reliable all the time. A good faith editor should examine them critically before using them. boindia, however is not RS. Sarvagnya 02:29, 5 November 2007 (UTC)


 * I proved already what box office India is, look - I've added another section above to my message. Rediff and TOI are reliable and all the time for all intent and purposes. They always check box office figures, which according to them --- come from reputable sorces etc. There are different mainstream sources, but they are not consistent at all. Many of them don't give away verdicts or indications of the films being hits or flops, successes or failures etc. They don't indicate what the highest grossing film of the year is, or whatever. Plus how can we know if films of the 70s or even of 1999 were successful? Mainstream sources don't provide such information. Box office India makes it all. It is very consistent all the time. It is an active site, which makes its updates EVERY day or two. If it wasn't reliable, I think the net would have provided it shortly or would have been closed. And again, even reputable sources like Indiatimes and TOI use it, so what's the matter? User:Spartaz has supported my sources for it, so I don't find a reason to declare it as unreliable just because y-o-u insist to think so. My really best regards, Shahid  •  Talk 2 me  12:59, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Well if anybody claims that the Times of India isn't reliable then this most certainly is a joke. Isn't it the worlds biggest newspaper or something ? Nobody would question the New York Times or The Times would they? Well if somebody is going to regard that as unreliable then this will never pass and all of the sources will be disregarded anyway however much people try to improve them. All thats missing is an FA in writing, 25 of us can see it is of clear FA quality. I'm not going to fuss and argue over this. Most normal people wouldn't question many of the sources. I bid you all adieu and am now staying well away from this, I've done my part. and hope somebody will do what you all require to make the article "perfect", As for syaing the overall quality of the Bollywood articles has degraded "a pile of garbage" is deeply disrespectful when most people believe they are developing extremely well. Fan sites should be avoided, but your criteria for relaible sources makes writing an encyclopedia which people want to read impossible and it may suffer unfortunately as a result  ♦ Sir Blofeld ♦       "Talk"? 12:58, 5 November 2007 (UTC).

I'll ask it straight. Just what on earth do you guys consider a "reliable source" if The Times if India isn't. I suggest you start trying to do some real work on some of the Indian stubs rather than trying to ruin work under devleopment. I feel that no cited source would ever live up to your expectations. ♦ Sir Blofeld ♦      "Talk"? 13:10, 5 November 2007 (UTC) I do however think that Box Office website needs to be checked out as it is rather peculiar that the home page isn't accessible. It probably isn't a good idea to use so many references to this site if the publisher can't be found as we can't be 100% of who has written it although technically it should be reliable if it is the official statistics site. There must be another site witha full home page that displays the same information? ♦ Sir Blofeld ♦ "Talk"? 13:31, 5 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Shahid, you havent proved anything. For one, I want to know who runs boind and what their credentials are.  Portals like rediff and ToI also make throwaway mentions of individual, random blogs in their reports.. that doesnt mean anything.  And Blofeld, why do you keep saying that boind homepage isnt accesible.  Atleast I have no problems accessing its home page.  And stop delving too much into Blng's comment about ToI.  There are a zillion other "most definitely non-RS" sources on these articles.  You could start by addressing those.


 * As for Blng's comment about ToI, did you care to click on the link to his subpage he provided? ToI has demonstrated on many occasions that it does little fact checking(ask anybody who follows their reporting of American Visa rules) and despite it being "the largest circulating english newspaper in the world", its quality is not very different from the average tabloid.  Believe me, I have seen ToI on more than one occasion repeat one year or two year old news with today's date!  And that is what makes people like Blnguyen(and me) sneer at editors using it without discretion.  As much as I am a fan of the Economic Times(from the ToI stable, I personally do not consider ToI reliable most of the times.  ToI would be my very last resort as a RS.  Anyway, ToI apart, I want you to answer for the following dotcoms.  Demonstrate to me that these are RS or with immediate effect stop your bad faith tirade against me and others who opposed on the FAC.


 * indiaenews, desiparty, boxofficeindia, indiantelevision, apunkachoice, bollyvista, hindisong, nowrunning, indiadaily, planetbollywood, asianoutlook
 * Sarvagnya 00:29, 6 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Again - don't write: "I personally do not consider ToI reliable most of the times." - A speculation which could act against you, because it indicates that you're acting against sites just because of your own opinion, not factual considerations. I personaly don't consider your opinion as valuable enough to invalidate a reference. I read Bingu's page (and even replied to him) and nothing there indicates that its unreliability, especially when it comes to be a vote. None of the editors on Wikipedia has the authority to invalidate a site. A) Apunkachoice appears on rediff. B) boxofficeindia.com appears on TOI and indiatimes.


 * indiaenews and indiadaily are news sites. Indiantelevision is the site which deals with all kinds of notable television and news in India. planetbollywood is an active reviews site, which gives reviews for every coming film released. I don'r know why some people who see the word "Bollywood" in the site's title, instantly project it as non-RS, just coming to their personal conclusions. That's a shame. Regards, Shahid  •  Talk 2 me  01:47, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

Political integration of India FAR
Political integration of India has been nominated for a featured article review. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. Please leave your comments and help us to return the article to featured quality. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, articles are moved onto the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Remove" the article from featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Reviewers' concerns are here. Sarvagnya 08:10, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

Bhashkara Vamsh
Can someone knowledgeable check if there is any validity to this? Is there possibly another way to spell it? I couldn't find any ghits that were not mirrors of Wikipedia.-- Birgitte SB  18:31, 7 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Looked it up. Nope, nothing at all. I also changed the spellings to 'vansh' and various types of 'bhaskar' and what not, but nothing about it. Page doesn't give any sources either, the people noted have no articles, nor refs supporting notability.
 * How about AfD or can this be removed quicker by some other way? xC | ☎  10:42, 9 November 2007 (UTC)


 * You could try a prod instead of AFD. Otherwise I will set-up some AFD's next week.-- Birgitte  SB  19:43, 9 November 2007 (UTC)

Wikiproject Dravidian people
Well ive found that a new Wikiproject has been initiated under the name Dravidian people. The Dravidian race is a controversial subject and is being investigated. Of recent, genetic researches have casted serious doubts over the question of seperate Aryan and Dravidian races and scientists, geneticists, anthropologists and archaeologists tend to avoid the usage of the inappropriate term 'Dravidian people' and use the word 'Draividian' only to refer to the family of languages unique to South India. This being the case, I dont think it is appropriate to have a Wikiproject by the same name. Moreover, having a Wikiproject with racial designations will kindle racism and racial hatred. I propose that this issue be considered and appropriate action be taken, which includes the deletion of this new project -Ravichandar84 03:02, 8 November 2007 (UTC)


 * I agree with the above. Dravidianism is an essentially racist philosophy which does little more than politicize large swaths of wikipedia. Baka man  03:42, 9 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Agreed, although not sure if this is the right page to discuss on this topic. IMO, the term Dravidian race is original research and so is the article Dravidian people appears to be. - KNM Talk 18:18, 9 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Agreed that it's not appropriate for a Wikiproject. But the reasoning does not apply to the article topic Dravidian people. Like Aryan, it is an established concept in the world, it is of equally dubious value, and is equally worth describing in neutral terms, and with references of course. Imc 16:23, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

Happy Diwali
Wishing everyone a very happy Diwali! Regards, =Nichalp   «Talk»=  05:30, 9 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Happy Diwali :)--Dwaipayan (talk) 23:48, 9 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Belated wishes! Hope everyone had a safe and Happy Diwali!! — Lost (talk) 15:38, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

Image Rotation on India page
The last few weeks have seen an experiment with automated image rotation in the Culture section of the India article. Editors are invited to give feedback on each of the images that have been part of the rotation at Talk:India. Thanks, &#2384; Priyanath talk 19:56, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

J&K flag?
see recent edit: I distinctly recall seeing the red J&K flag at government buildings, but is there any source regarding this? --Soman 11:53, 15 November 2007 (UTC)


 * State constitution - . Imc 14:27, 15 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Thanks! --Soman 14:52, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

Stub needed for Bir
We need a stub for the town of Bir, Maharashtra. Thank you. -- Writtenonsand 00:31, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Done. See Bir, Maharashtra. Regards, Ganeshk  ( talk ) 07:45, 14 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Thanks! Have also created 2 disamb pages: General disamb at Bir (disambiguation) and specific for Indian places at Bir (India). -- Writtenonsand 12:04, 14 November 2007 (UTC)


 * I have redirected Bir, Maharashtra to existing correct and well written article Beed pronounciation Beed is more correct spell/pronounciation Bir is of british colonial times and spell bir is not much in use now.

-- Mahitgar (talk) 18:05, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

Image Rotation on India page
The last few weeks have seen an experiment with automated image rotation in the Culture section of the India article. Editors are invited to give feedback on each of the images that have been part of the rotation at Talk:India. Thanks, &#2384; Priyanath talk 19:56, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

J&K flag?
see recent edit: I distinctly recall seeing the red J&K flag at government buildings, but is there any source regarding this? --Soman 11:53, 15 November 2007 (UTC)


 * State constitution - . Imc 14:27, 15 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Thanks! --Soman 14:52, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

Champakaraman Pillai
I am doing some work on the backlogs and came across this article. The person seems important, but the article has been tagged as unsourced/unreferenced for 16 months. Perhaps someone from this group would have the resources to provide some inline references for the article? Pastordavid 20:44, 14 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Sourced. He is quite obscure though. Baka man  05:02, 15 November 2007 (UTC)


 * There was a whole chapter about him in our Class VI Malayalam text book :-) Tintin 15:09, 18 November 2007 (UTC)