Wikipedia talk:Requests for adminship/NeilN

User:NeilN's edit stats using X!'s edit counter as of 20:58, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

User ID:	409043 User groups:	autoreviewer, ipblock-exempt, reviewer, rollbacker, user, autoconfirmed First edit:	Aug 30, 2005, 4:11 AM Latest edit:	May 31, 2015, 8:48 PM Live edits:	76,287 Deleted edits:	4,370 Total edits: 	80,657 Edits in the past 24 hours:	43 Edits in the past 7 days:	537 Edits in the past 30 days:	2,100 Edits in the past 365 days:	21,706 Ø number of edits per day:	22.7

Live edits: Unique pages edited:	30,046 Pages created:	10,417 Pages moved:	92 Ø edits per page:	2.5 Ø change per page (bytes):	extended Files uploaded:	4 Files uploaded (Commons):	10 (Semi-)automated edits:	46,892 Reverted edits:	443 Edits with summary:	75,645 Number of minor edits (tagged):	26,855 Number of edits (<20 bytes):	extended Number of edits (>1000 bytes):	extended Actions: Thank:	245 x Approve:	742 x Patrol:	1,585 x Admin actions Block:	0 x Protect:	1 x Delete:	0 x Import:	0 x Errors: (Re)blocked:	2 x Longest block: 1 weeks Current block: – SUL editcounter (approximate):	latest ► enwiki 	80,208 	+5 minutes commonswiki 	202 	+10 days wikidatawiki 	18 	> 30 days metawiki 	12 	> 30 days dewiki 	3 	> 30 days mediawikiwiki 	1 	> 30 days eswiki 	1 	> 30 days 38 others	0	> 30 days Total edits	80,445

bla bla Namespace Totals [hide] Article 	36,834 	48.3% Talk 	6,796 	8.9% User 	547 	0.7% User talk 	27,359 	35.9% Wikipedia 	3,973 	5.2% Wikipedia talk 	534 	0.7% File 	21 	0% File talk 	7 	0% Template 	69 	0.1% Template talk 	42 	0.1% Help 	22 	0% Help talk 	7 	0% Category 	21 	0% Category talk 	9 	0% Portal 	28 	0% Portal talk 	2 	0% Book 	1 	0% Book talk 	1 	0% Draft 	9 	0% Draft talk 	5 	0% Year counts [hide] 2005 	193	2007 	7,052	2008 	10,381	2009 	7,815	2010 	6,990	2011 	3,029	2012 	4,107	2013 	8,642	2014 	17,665	2015 	10,413

Time card [hide] Timecard Latest edit (global) - Edits in the past 30 days, max. 10 / Wiki [hide] Date ↓ 	Wiki  ↓ 	Links  ↓ 	Page title  ↓ 	Comment  ↓ 2015-05-31, 20:48 	enwiki 	( diff · log · top ) 	Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/NeilN 	/* Questions for the candidate */ 2015-05-31, 20:31 	enwiki 	( diff · log · top ) 	User talk:NeilN 	/* Adminship? */ done 2015-05-31, 20:27 	enwiki 	( diff · log · top ) 	Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/NeilN 	last step 2015-05-31, 20:22 	enwiki 	( diff · log · top ) 	Wikipedia:Requests for adminship 	transclude and comment out "no current noms" 2015-05-31, 20:07 	enwiki 	( diff · log · top ) 	Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/NeilN 	accept 2015-05-31, 20:04 	enwiki 	( diff · log · top ) 	Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/NeilN 	/* Questions for the candidate */ 2015-05-31, 18:42 	enwiki 	( diff · log · top ) 	User talk:174.225.242.142 	General note: Editing tests on Psychopathy. ([[WP:TW|... 2015-05-31, 18:42 	enwiki 	( diff · log · top ) 	Psychopathy 	Reverted 1 edit by [[Special:Contributions/174.225.242.14... 2015-05-31, 18:38 	enwiki 	( diff · log · top ) 	J. P. Cormier 	/* top */ add refs 2015-05-31, 18:28 	enwiki 	( diff · log · top ) 	J. P. Cormier 	/* top */ expand 2015-05-21, 16:42 	commonswiki 	( diff · log · top ) 	User talk:Saudiexp 	note

Month counts [hide] 2005-08 	15	2005-09 	154	2005-10 	23	2005-12 	1	2007-07 	605	2007-08 	678	2007-09 	670	2007-10 	1,586	2007-11 	2,021	2007-12 	1,492	2008-01 	1,253	2008-02 	1,864	2008-03 	2,583	2008-04 	1,870	2008-05 	1,470	2008-06 	1,228	2008-07 	113	2009-01 	235	2009-02 	3	2009-03 	2	2009-04 	6	2009-08 	655	2009-09 	1,972	2009-10 	705	2009-11 	1,971	2009-12 	2,266	2010-01 	1,929	2010-02 	1,673	2010-03 	1,177	2010-04 	1,486	2010-05 	602	2010-06 	15	2010-09 	2	2010-12 	106	2011-02 	1	2011-03 	73	2011-04 	1,088	2011-05 	1,654	2011-06 	212	2011-08 	1	2012-04 	12	2012-05 	1,961	2012-06 	1,244	2012-07 	883	2012-08 	5	2012-11 	2	2013-01 	2	2013-02 	1	2013-03 	2	2013-04 	2	2013-05 	69	2013-06 	946	2013-07 	1,259	2013-08 	1,881	2013-09 	1,328	2013-10 	996	2013-11 	1,037	2013-12 	1,119	2014-01 	1,210	2014-02 	1,657	2014-03 	1,058	2014-04 	880	2014-05 	1,567	2014-06 	1,561	2014-07 	1,584	2014-08 	1,687	2014-09 	1,719	2014-10 	1,998	2014-11 	1,730	2014-12 	1,014	2015-01 	2,264	2015-02 	2,400	2015-03 	1,226	2015-04 	2,344	2015-05 	2,179

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history · topedits 74 	Talk:Gay 	log · page history · topedits 67 	Talk:Anita Sarkeesian 	log · page history · topedits 63 	Talk:Miley Cyrus 	log · page history · topedits 60 	Talk:Millennials 	log · page history · topedits 58 	Talk:Lester Coleman 	log · page history · topedits 56 	Talk:Wendy Davis (politician) 	log · page history · topedits 55 	Talk:Kent Hovind 	log · page history · topedits 54 	Talk:Hridayeshwar Singh Bhati 	log · page history · topedits 53 	Talk:Slavery 	log · page history · topedits 51 	Talk:Suzannah Lipscomb 	log · page history · topedits 50 	Talk:Muhammad/images 	log · page history · topedits -More- User 67 	User:NeilN 	log · page history · topedits 44 	User:NeilN/sandbox 	log · page history · topedits 26 	User:NeilN/monobook.js 	log · page history · topedits 17 	User:NeilN/common.js 	log · page history · topedits 15 	User:NeilN/sandbox2 	log · page history · topedits 11 	User:Jimbo Wales 	log · page history · topedits 7 	User:Tnxman307 	log · page history · topedits 6 	User:Orangemike 	log · page history · topedits 5 	User:Gogo Dodo 	log · page history · topedits 5 	User:NeilN/huggle.css 	log · page history · topedits 4 	User:SummerPhD 	log · page history · topedits 4 	User:SonOfThornhill 	log · page history · topedits 4 	User:C.Fred 	log · page history · topedits 4 	User:Salinsde 	log · page history · topedits 3 	User:Particleman3333 	log · page history · topedits -More- User talk 2381 	User talk:NeilN 	log · page history · topedits 163 	User talk:Jimbo Wales 	log · page history · topedits 60 	User talk:Bbb23 	log · page history · topedits 44 	User talk:Flyer22 	log · page history · topedits 44 	User talk:Sitush 	log · page history · topedits 35 	User talk:Bishonen 	log · page history · topedits 31 	User talk:Wllm 	log · page history · topedits 30 	User talk:Drmies 	log · page history · topedits 28 	User talk:TheRedPenOfDoom 	log · page history · topedits 27 	User talk:Cullen328 	log · page history · topedits 27 	User talk:C.Fred 	log · page history · topedits 24 	User talk:Doug Weller 	log · page history · topedits 23 	User talk:Moonriddengirl 	log · page history · topedits 22 	User talk:Wiki-expert-edit 	log · page history · topedits 19 	User talk:IHateYouTyrannousAddies 	log · page history · topedits -More- Wikipedia 691 	Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents 	log · page history · topedits 555 	Wikipedia:Administrator intervention against vandalism 	log · page history · topedits 279 	Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard 	log · page history · topedits 237 	Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring 	log · page history · topedits 233 	Wikipedia:Help desk 	log · page history · topedits 161 	Wikipedia:Requests for page protection 	log · page history · topedits 148 	Wikipedia:Teahouse/Questions 	log · page history · topedits 98 	Wikipedia:Usernames for administrator attention 	log · page history · topedits 92 	Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard 	log · page history · topedits 74 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Kalyanasundaram 	log · page history · topedits

(Semi-)automated edits (approximate) [hide] 45,425 	Twinkle 993 	Popups 366 	NPWatcher 76 	Huggle 20 	Articles For Creation tool 12 	HotCat 0 	Igloo 0 	AutoWikiBrowser 0 	STiki 0 	WPCleaner 0 	FurMe

Live?
I don't see this transcluded on the main WP:RFA page... Is this nomination official already? -  Cwobeel   (talk)  20:13, 31 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Yes. Epic Genius (talk) 20:42, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

Oppose by Collect

 * I've never really understood why we'd want prolific content creators to morph into janitors. On average, administrators need to be level-headed, have a good understanding of policy and guidelines and a fair technical understanding, and be able to assess consensus. They don't need to have contributed swathes of content. Then again, this might not be the most appropriate place to argue about this. Alakzi (talk) 00:00, 1 June 2015 (UTC)
 * How would NeilN becoming an admin negatively impact Wikipedia? Certainly keeping articles that could become quality articles would benefit Wikipedia but adminship is not something that affects how someone !votes or the weight of any of those !votes. P HANTOM T ECH  (talk) 00:05, 1 June 2015 (UTC)
 * It is his AfD work which pushes me from being neutral here. The tools confusingly show the area he edited in as "일반 문서" which I specifically found confusing. Trying to "debate" reasons here is not productive.  NeilN did not actually start SRT, and  I do not find NetMarket to be an explicitly notable company - it likely belongs in the CUC article as its independent existence was very short indeed (apparently about three months  from the "first purchase" to November 1994 when CUC acquired it).  We do not require that a person be found to "negatively affect Wikipedia."   I find his AfD positions to not a criterion I have used a few times now.     Collect (talk) 00:41, 1 June 2015 (UTC)
 * "일반 문서" is a bug in the edit count tool is a Korean word for "Articles" (don't ask me why) Check yours...  -   Cwobeel   (talk)  01:07, 1 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Except for one spot, my own result has no Korean in it. Again - this is a very side issue - the AfD issue is the one which I find concerning.  Sure sounds like a bug though. Cheers. Collect (talk) 01:18, 1 June 2015 (UTC)
 * For some reason, in the Edit Count breakdown, "Articles" is appearing in Korean. It's a known bug but I'm not sure how soon it will be fixed. Liz  Read! Talk! 01:24, 1 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Yeah, Korean is not really an improvement over German, which it used to be. ;-) Softlavender (talk) 02:04, 1 June 2015 (UTC)
 * There are no requirements for !votes, but that doesn't mean people shouldn't reply to them. Without the possibility of discussion, !votes start to become votes. If someone becoming an admin would not negatively affect Wikipedia, I don't see the point of opposing their adminship. P HANTOM T ECH  (talk) 01:34, 1 June 2015 (UTC)
 * I guess, while content creation would be an asset, it is not required; previous adminships have passed without the candidate having made more than a few major article creation edits. Epic Genius (talk) 16:04, 1 June 2015 (UTC)
 * I don't want to stir the pot and name names, but admins without content experience sometimes block editors that are GA / FA stalwarts, seemingly without realising the damage it causes to the encyclopedia and the drama that erupts. Hang around certain talk pages long enough and you'll see it. I don't think Neil is one of these and I seriously hope I'm right. Ritchie333 (talk) <sup style="color:#7F007F">(cont)  08:14, 2 June 2015 (UTC)
 * If you hang around the India pages and see NeilN's contributions to the discussions, you'll see that NeilN is actually a content focused editor. Not in the sense of one who adds content directly but rather one who helps other editors add content. While that may not lead to FAs and GAs it is a content skill and I don't agree with the opposers that say "NeilN has done very little content work". I agree that we have block happy admins with limited experience of the often contentious give and take that goes into building what is often our best content, Unfortunately, we've also had a few arbs with similar issues. However, that's another entire discussion! --regentspark (comment) 13:19, 2 June 2015 (UTC)
 * I just would like to remind everybody that the perceived minimal content work was only a side issue in Collect's vote. Hi smain objection was his interpretation of the candidate's AfD work, and his fears what the candidate would, or would not, do with the deletion button. That's actually a long-standing and well-accepted oppose rationale, albeit based on the subjective view of the !voter. Kraxler (talk) 13:35, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

I find a lot of this hand-wringing over Collect's "oppose" vote and rationale to be a little silly. Content creation is a long-cited reason for supporting or opposing an RfA candidate, and there are various perfectly valid reasons that it can be described as one basis among several for judging a candidate's admin qualifications. In this case, however, I happen to disagree with Collect's conclusion, and accept that the candidate's many other strong qualities more than compensate for any downside associated with a lack of new content creation. That said, I think it's time to let this go -- NeilN is clearly going to be an admin in five days' time, and getting worked up over one "oppose" vote is both pointy and pointless. Collect is entitled to his opinion. That's all. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 14:42, 2 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Well said. Thanks, . ​—DoRD (talk)​ 18:03, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

Response to Zad68
I note that NeilN curates your talk page. It would be better if this matter was handled by someone completely independent. If you are not prepared to explain which of my comments you find fault with editors may infer that fair and open discussion is being impeded. 87.81.147.76 (talk) 14:48, 3 June 2015 (UTC)
 * I'm completely independent, besides evaluating NeilN and casting a vote, I've not interacted with him (to the best of my knowledge). I've semi protected the page. If you have comments then feel free to share them here. That said, if you are making false accusations, I will be removing them. If you are commenting on the contributor, but not the content, I will be removing them. Remember, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. <span style='text-shadow:0 -1px #DDD,1px 0 #DDD,0 1px #DDD,-1px 0 #DDD; color:#000;'>Worm TT( talk ) 14:53, 3 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Since the beginning of time, Neil has made exactly one edit to my User Talk page, where he removed a disruptive edit from an IP spammer. In no way can that be reasonably interpreted as that he "curates" my User Talk.   15:02, 3 June 2015 (UTC)


 * Can you clarify what you mean by "commenting on the contributor, but not the content"?  When people put themselves up for RfA they expect people to delve into their past and make judgment calls depending on what they come up with.   I don't see what is wrong with linking to this history.   My comments are now in history.   If you feel I have abused this process in any way please point to the links you find objectionable and I will review my comments. 87.81.147.76 (talk) 15:41, 3 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Having printed out and studied the post to the nomination page I can see that something was pasted from Neil's talk which should not have been - the part which begins "You enjoy the company" and ends "should be NailN."  The rest appears to be good faith comment.   If you think I am mistaken in that view please start a discussion here. 87.81.147.76 (talk) 16:21, 3 June 2015 (UTC)
 * If you're checking the diffs on the 14:33, 3 June version of the nomination page, link 31 should be . 87.81.147.76 (talk) 18:56, 4 June 2015 (UTC)

Comment

 * I would point out that although Collect's oppose discussion was moved to the discussion page "so that it can be discussed at length without dominating the oppose section" Andrew D.'s oppose discussion was not, although it is twice as long.  The reason is that in the interim another oppose discussion started on the discussion page which Neil's supporters don't want !voters to know about. 87.81.147.76 (talk) 12:54 pm, Today (UTC−4)

— Berean Hunter   (talk)  11:50, 7 June 2015 (UTC)
 * We're done with folks that disrupt RfA and are too cowardly to get an account or are avoiding scrutiny.

Discussion concerning Cassianto's position

 * 1) Oppose -- running before he can walk. This editor has as much to do with article content creation as I do with open heart surgery on the Preying Mantis .  Still, we seem to hand admin tools to just about anybody now so what would adding one more matter.  WP:ADMIN is 70% full of bad-eggs. I just hope this user doesn't join their ranks.   Cassianto <sup style="font-family:Papyrus;">Talk   17:52, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
 * I don't usually challenge those who oppose a candidate, but bad egg? Do you really have that little faith in this candidate? —DoRD (talk)​ 18:30, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
 * I saw how that read and I apologise, I didn't mean for it to come out like that. What I meant was that he will be joining a load of bad-eggs already there.    Cassianto <sup style="font-family:Papyrus;">Talk   18:39, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
 * So you oppose a good egg joining the admin corps because only 30% of the current lot are good eggs? Funny reasoning. --Stfg (talk) 19:50, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
 * In your opinion he may be a good egg.  Cassianto <sup style="font-family:Papyrus;">Talk   20:07, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
 * This is your !vote, so perhaps you should state clearly what is your opinion, instead of this ambiguity. --Stfg (talk) 20:27, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
 * My !vote is not up for discussion and I would request that you mind your own business.  Cassianto <sup style="font-family:Papyrus;">Talk   20:41, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Welcome to Wikipedia where when you post something people will discuss it. RfA is no different. <b style="color:DarkTurquoise">Chillum</b> 20:44, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
 * You can discuss things in your flippant tone until the cows come home Chillum, but I shall be taking no further part in it. My views have been made so you can draw your own conclusions.   Cassianto <sup style="font-family:Papyrus;">Talk   20:49, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
 * A wise move. It's always a good idea to stop digging when you're in a hole. Nick (talk) 21:41, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
 * digging? I'm simply not being baited into a block by commenting on another editor. Not everybody falls under the blanket of sycophancy you know.   Cassianto <sup style="font-family:Papyrus;">Talk   08:25, 6 June 2015 (UTC)
 * User:Cassianto I see you said that "we seem to hand admin tools to just about anybody now". If you truly believe that then you should go back and look at a time when any Tom, Dick or CambridgeBayWeather could become an admin. Four months and 4,000 edits were all it took. Things were so bad then that nobody knew how to count correctly. Even if all the supports and opposes were numbered. CambridgeBayWeather, Uqaqtuq (talk), Sunasuttuq 11:58, 7 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Is you linking to your name supposed to make me want to retract my statement? It doesn't.   Cassianto <sup style="font-family:Papyrus;">Talk   13:11, 7 June 2015 (UTC)
 * User:Cassianto I was not asking you to change anything. The link was to Requests for adminship/CambridgeBayWeather. I was just pointing out that it is far more difficult to become an admin today than in the past. CambridgeBayWeather, Uqaqtuq (talk), Sunasuttuq 23:02, 7 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Moved to talk page

Thanks everyone
Thanks to everyone who nudged me to run and thanks to everyone who participated in my RFA. I honestly wasn't expecting that level of support, given that I usually just keep my head down and try to fix what needs fixing or help where needed. I'll be starting off slowly and carefully with the admin tools so please don't expect any magical declines in the backlogs :-) Any advice from admins regarding their particular best practices or scripts/tools they use will be gratefully received. --<b style="color:navy">Neil N </b> <i style="color:blue">talk to me</i> 20:55, 7 June 2015 (UTC)