Wikipedia talk:Scottish Wikipedians' notice board/Archive 2

The first shall be last
There's a peculiarity in the diagram for British Isles (terminology) in that Scotland is dropped below the other nations: I raised this on Image talk:Nations of the UK2.jpg and the response was that this flows better. I've again requested a change as it looks even worse in the new tidied up ping Image:British isles history v2.png. Anyone else share this opinion? ...dave souza 00:22, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

Currach
I have expanded the currach article to include more information on the Scottish craft. --MacRusgail 18:09, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

Father of the Nation
Does Scotland have a Father of the Nation? It is an interesting conundrum. I know that Donald Dewar is sometimes described thus, but he just seems far too recent a figure, in a nation that can trace its roots back at least a couple of millenia. Kenneth MacAlpin?--Mais oui! 11:36, 22 January 2006 (UTC)


 * The nature of "father of the nation" is such a high-profile one that, I'd guess, if you can't name him off the top of your head then there isn't one per se... Shimgray | talk | 12:17, 22 January 2006 (UTC)


 * Donald Dewar should never be called "Father of the Nation", as An Siarach says. As far as I am concerned he was probably the architect's coffee maker, when it came to the parliament. It's a bit of media hype, and Labour spin after the man's death. --MacRusgail 20:47, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

The use of Father of the Nation with reference to Donald Dewar always seemed ridiculously over the top to me and a typical example of tabloid hyperbole. Probably the only two Scots who might have any reasonable claim to be described as such are Cináed mac Ailpín as the founding King of Scotland or Robert the Bruce for obvious reasons. Shimgray makes an excellent point i think and id agree that there isnt really a 'Father of the Nation' figure in the Scottish psyche.

An Siarach


 * Yeah, MacAlpin is a good case... but you couldn't walk into the average Scottish classroom and be told who he was, at least not in my experience! Bruce is more famous, but I'd not have given him that title without prompting.
 * In England, it's a bit easier - there's a couple you could argue for, William the Conqueror or Alfred the Great (first king of modern England, first king of "all England" respectively)... but even though they're famous enough, they don't have quite the undisputed father-status of someone like Washington or Ataturk. Shimgray | talk | 14:40, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

Any geographers?
Please see Talk:List of rivers in Scotland, for discussion of some variations in Wikipedia figures for Scottish rivers. --MacRusgail 20:46, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

Scottish Ale
Can someone with the requisite knowledge please have a look at Talk:Scottish ale. The article underwent a total, and I mean total, rewrite today by a new User, and as far as I can see it is 100% original research and personal opinion. I have requested sources, so we shall see if any are forthcoming. Another editor requested that the opposing viewpoint also be presented, but it hasn't been. Surely someone out there knows their beers? --Mais oui! 22:48, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

Cinema in Scotland
There is a vociferous campaign to delete Category:Cinema of Scotland, which survived a Cfd nomination in December (Categories_for_deletion/Log/2005_December_14).

What particularly concerns me is that there is no cogent argument being put, simply a general hostility to a "non-British" cat. This is not the first example of this type of nomination at Cfd, although the principal campaign has been conducted against English cats rather than Scottish ones. If you care about the value of Scottish categories (and is there any editor of Scotland-related articles who does not?), I urge you to regularly review Categories for deletion, but in particular, please see this nomination: See also the related nomination re the twin English cat.--Mais oui! 04:49, 29 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Categories_for_deletion/Log/2006_January_28

Category:Towns in Scotland
I have completed subcataegorising Towns of Scotland by council area, with a fews exceptions - I havent done Eilean Siar (one town), Shetland (one), Orkney (two towns), or the four city council areas. The only real 'town' in all of these four (that I can see) is South Queensferry. I would contend that places like Broughty Ferry and Portobello are areas of cities, rather than towns in their own right, and maybe shouldnt be in Towns in Scotland? What does anyone think? I plan to continue with Category:Villages in Scotland, if anyone feels like lending a hand... :Supergolden:: 17:13, 2 February 2006 (UTC)


 * What counts as a village in England is often a town in Scotland! Where to draw the line? --MacRusgail 17:55, 25 February 2006 (UTC)


 * Good question... I have gone through both cats now, and sorted by whatever the article says. ie, "Foo is a town in Angus" goes in Towns in Angus, "Bar is a village in Angus" goes in Villages in Angus. I am not sure if there is any consistency in this approach, but i think the difference between a town and a village is an intuitive one based on several things, bit like the difference between a hill and a mountain. Not sure if there is a line that can be drawn :Supergolden:: 15:42, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

Blackford, Scotland
David Williams, who has written a guide to Glasgow and is publishing a Scottish guide (currently incomplete) has sent a narky letter to the Help Desk claiming that Wikipedia is inaccurate because it claims that Blackford is a suburb of Edinburgh.

Our article is on Blackford, Edinburgh. There is apparently a village in Perthshire located on the road between Perth and Stirling and near the Gleneagles golf course. . It seems that we don't as yet have an article on the village.

I would be grateful if someone could confirm that:

(a) there is a suburb in Edinburgh called Blackford:

(b) there is a village in Perthshire called Blackford.

I would be grateful if someone could get back to me so I could reply to Mr Williams. Capitalistroadster 23:28, 5 February 2006 (UTC)


 * There is certainly a Blackford in Edinburgh - it's the area around Blackford Hill. Wouldn't call it a suburb, per se, but it's there. Shimgray | talk | 00:02, 6 February 2006 (UTC)


 * Blackford on the A9 is where Highland Spring mineral water comes from. It most definately does exist! Lianachan 00:04, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Maps: I'd simply tell the guy that's he's more than welcome to write an article on Blackford, Perthshire, since after all we're not claiming to be complete... Thanks/wangi 00:18, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
 * The one in Perthshire: http://www.multimap.com/map/browse.cgi?lat=56.2623&lon=-3.7783&scale=100000&icon=x
 * And in Edinburgh: http://uk.multimap.com/map/browse.cgi?lat=55.9533&lon=-3.1889&scale=25000&icon=x
 * Erm, but you did see this, yeah: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Blackford%2C_Perthshire&oldid=36159312
 * Blackford is located in Perthshire, Scotland. It is reasonably affluent, and contains Blackford Hill, one of the supposed "Seven Hills of Edinburgh"...
 * I'm about to fix it up/wangi 00:21, 6 February 2006 (UTC)


 * Thanks to everyone for your advice. Capitalistroadster 00:57, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Celtic/Pictish/Alternate Names of Scottish Kings
NOTE: This discussion was begun on my talk page. I have copied it here to encourage the participation of a wider audience.''' If you have an opinion on this question, please share it ! Angus McLellan 19:28, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

MOVED: Wikipedia_talk:Naming_conventions_Medieval_Gaels

Unsourced
I have slapped the ugly, intrusive "unsourced" header onto the List of monarchs of Scotland article. It is high time that this key article was kicked up a few academic gears, because I think that a lot of the poor qualitry Scottish royalty articles stem from the mediocre quality of this central article. Sorry for being a pain.--Mais oui! 23:10, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

New World Scot contributing...
I happened across Articles requested for more than a year; on that list was a request for Caerlanrig, which I was able to find a little information on and therefore wrote up.

Might there be someone who'd like to spot-check the article to make sure I've got everything in the right place, please?

Corgi 01:44, 13 February 2006 (UTC)

(Clan MacMillan)

who support the Scotland national rugby team

 * moved here from Announcements by User|Mais oui!

Any wikipedian, Scottish or not, who would like to join me in the new category "Users who support the Scotland national rugby team" which I have created is very welcome. Cheers, --Historian 22:11, 14 February 2006 (UTC)


 * Is there one for the football team too? --MacRusgail 17:11, 18 February 2006 (UTC)

Sure, why not. An Siarach