Wikipedia talk:WikiProject China/Archive 21

Chinese language information to two articles...
Hi all, I've started two articles, Shanghai Botanical Garden and Fraxinus hubeiensis, but have found adding information slow going. Any chinese-speakers are welcome to add material on the net to them from chinese websites (which I cant read). The first one is expanded enough for a DYK, the second has a way to go. Anyone chipping in will be much appreciated. Cheers, Casliber (talk · contribs) 13:53, 25 September 2012 (UTC)

GA nomination for China, assistance in article improvement welcome
I've just nominated China for a GA assessment. It's been 3 years since the article was delisted as a good article, and the article has had a significant revamp in the past few months since the PRC to China move. The problems that caused the article to be delisted back in 2009 have pretty much all been solved. If there is anything the article needs in regards to improvement, feel free to lend a hand. --  李博杰  &#124; —Talk contribs email 16:53, 28 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Not that you can or should do anything about it, but the article is not accessible in China, so I can't really offer any thoughts on it. Of course, that is probably proof of its neutrality.--Danaman5 (talk) 12:33, 30 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Would this archive fork that I made 2 minutes ago help? Or does the PRC block WebCite too? --  李博杰  &#124; —Talk contribs email 12:52, 30 September 2012 (UTC)

image ident?
Can someone tell me what File:IMG 0275Sg.JPG and File:IMG 0277Korea.JPG are? I think they might be Buddhist passages. Would these particular photos be images of important texts? -- 70.24.247.121 (talk) 23:45, 6 October 2012 (UTC)

Articles for deletion/Tenzin Wangchuck
Does anyone know what Tenzin Wangchuck's name is in Tibetan or Chinese script? The article has been nominated for deletion, and knowing his name in one of these scripts would be very useful to help find sources about him. Of course, if anyone is aware of any sources we could use for the article, that would be a great help too. Best regards — Mr. Stradivarius  (have a chat) 13:02, 10 October 2012 (UTC)

New portal
I started Portal:Beijing. Would anyone be interested in contributing to it? Portal:Shanghai may have some gaps, but I'm not sure... WhisperToMe (talk) 03:01, 13 October 2012 (UTC)

Where is 左安东路1号 in Beijing?
In Which district is 左安东路1号 located in Beijing? I found a historical address ("No. 1, Zuoan Donglu, Zuoanmenwai, 100021, Beijing, China") and want to know which district it's in. Thanks WhisperToMe (talk) 17:56, 12 October 2012 (UTC)


 * A web search on 北京市左安东路 gives a page at a postal code directory site, which claims it is in Chaoyang District. (北京市朝阳区左安东路). Google Maps search on 北京市朝阳区左安东路 gives indeed the location: https://maps.google.com/maps?q=%E5%8C%97%E4%BA%AC%E5%B8%82%E6%9C%9D%E9%98%B3%E5%8C%BA%E5%B7%A6%E5%AE%89%E4%B8%9C%E8%B7%AF&hl=en&ie=UTF8&ll=39.867225,116.454306&spn=0.018051,0.042272&sll=39.871244,116.471901&sspn=0.018049,0.042272&hq=%E5%B7%A6%E5%AE%89%E4%B8%9C%E8%B7%AF&hnear=Chaoyang,+Beijing,+China&t=m&fll=39.867851,116.443233&fspn=0.01805,0.058622&z=15， about a mile south-east of the Temple of Heaven. You can verify that this is indeed within Chaoyang District by typing 中国北京市朝阳区 in Google Maps search box; Google Maps will then draw the borders of the district on a map. -- Vmenkov (talk) 17:30, 13 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Thank you so much! So China Xinhua Airlines had its HQ in Chaoyang... WhisperToMe (talk) 01:14, 14 October 2012 (UTC)

File:Bun festival bun.jpg
File:Bun festival bun.jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 70.24.247.66 (talk) 03:14, 14 October 2012 (UTC)

What are the official English names of these buildings?
What are the official English names of these buildings? I'm having trouble finding them... Thanks WhisperToMe (talk) 08:37, 14 October 2012 (UTC)
 * 津蒙大厦 (北京市顺义区天竺空广工业区A区津蒙大厦) - It houses two hotels (Hilarity Hotel 海云天酒店 and Jubilant Hotel 嘉伦特酒店)
 * 国航信息大楼 (北京市顺义区天竺空港工业区A区天柱中路16号)

Religious symbol for Chinese folk religion
At Talk:Religion, we're trying to come up a new chart of religious symbols, and we're hoping for one for Chinese folk religion. Currently, the only guess is the symbol for Tian, but that's honestly a bit of WP:OR on my part. Ian.thomson (talk) 13:22, 24 September 2012 (UTC)


 * If space allowed, I'd go for something like an immortal riding a crane, and holding a peach; those seem to be particularly ubiquitous motifs in various roadside shrines etc. But since you obviously are looking for something simpler and smaller, and black-and-white, I would consider using some design based on the character 壽 (simplified form, 寿; shou), "longevity". See its decorative use e.g. at commons:Category:寿. I once even saw a rural temple (ancestral hall) with a 寿-based design on top, much like Christian churches' steeples are topped with crosses, and Hindu temples, with trishulas!  Other possible candidates are the shuang xi (double happiness) design, or the upside-down character 福 (fu, "happiness") design. While these two are not religious per se, they are at least common decorative motifs associated with good wishes (particularly in the wedding and Chinese New Year contexts, respectively), instantly recognizable to anyone who's lived in China. A non-Chinese reader would at least figure that the symbols refer to something Chinese. -- Vmenkov (talk) 17:50, 13 October 2012 (UTC)


 * Thank you very much. I'm really not sure we could fit a Xian on a crane, but Shou should work. Ian.thomson (talk) 19:52, 13 October 2012 (UTC)


 * Yes; thank you, indeed. Incidentally, the immortals were the first to my mind as well, but I couldn't think of a singularly distinctive, recognizable, and simple representation to use. You make a good point suggesting those characters. I didn't consider them simply because I didn't think of them as equivalent to the Christian cross or Magen David, but I guess this is a difference in culture. Most old traditions of the world originally lacked such identifiers. I accept your argument that they are as close as we can get. I would prefer the representation be chosen by consensus here. There doesn't seem to be many knowledgeable in Chinese spirituality on Talk:Religion at the moment. — Sowlos (talk) 05:47, 14 October 2012 (UTC)


 * If we recieve no more input, I'll assume everyone agrees with and that 壽/寿 is the preferred choice. — Sowlos (talk) 09:42, 15 October 2012 (UTC)

Source problems for Hidden character stone
I've raised some sourcing issues for this fringe article about 270 million year old Chinese writing at WP:RSN. Dougweller (talk) 10:15, 15 October 2012 (UTC)

Who is this Communist leader?
I noticed that a name of a Communist leader was "Jao Shu-shih" but Wikipedia has no article at this title. I'm having trouble finding alternate romanizations of this name. Would someone please figure out what the Pinyin of this person is? Thanks WhisperToMe (talk) 14:13, 15 October 2012 (UTC)


 * It's Rao Shushi. The R in pinyin was formerly romanized as J.  I've created a redirect. -Zanhe (talk) 15:39, 15 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Thank you! WhisperToMe (talk) 02:41, 16 October 2012 (UTC)

Writing an article about the Vienna Hotel
I found that there is a Chinese hotel chain based in Shenzhen called the "Vienna Hotel." (维也纳酒店) - The company website is at http://www.wyn88.com/ - However there don't seem to be any English sources describing the chain. What are the most well known Chinese language business newspapers? Which ones do you think would be good to use so I could make a stub on EN and ZH (and then request one from ZH-YUE because the HQ is in Guangdong) WhisperToMe (talk) 21:07, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

Jacky Xue
Does anyone know where I can find more info about the books and albums of Jacky Xue? User:Lonelydarksky had suggested I look into that WhisperToMe (talk) 21:23, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

New copyright laws in Taiwan to be reviewed March 2013 relating to aboriginal symbols and motifs
Refer to: In Taiwan, it is expected that in March 2013, the Indigenous Peoples Intellectual Property Act is to be reviewed, so that:
 * Yang Chiu-ying and Jake Chung, 2012-10-21, Aboriginal copyrights to be reviewed next year, Taipei Times
 * "All ownership rights connected with the items, names, symbols and other intellectual property that pass the review next year would be returned to the applicable Aboriginal tribes... Companies or people that use names or items that originally belonged to Aboriginal tribes could potentially be restricted from using that item, product or name, should the tribe’s application pass the review... Netizens should also avoid posting pictures and symbols of particular Aboriginal signs online. If such signs have to be posted on the Internet for a particular reason, permission from the relevant tribes should be obtained to prevent future problems".

How will this affect both Wikimedia Commons and the English Wikipedia? It seems that the use of Taiwanese aboriginal symbols, motifs and the like will require permission from aboriginal tribes, if the law is altered. I've also asked Commons here. --  李博杰  &#124; —Talk contribs email 02:55, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

Beijing task force
On the Chinese Wikipedia there seems to be a WikiProject on Beijing: zh:维基百科:北京专题 Should we make a Beijing task force? WhisperToMe (talk) 16:38, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
 * It's been proposed before, and supported, but no one got around to creating one. See Wikipedia talk:WikiProject China/Archive 12, where you proposed it last time. Personally, I think there should be a Yangtze Delta TF, Pearl Delta TF, Tianjin-Beijing TF; for the three major economic zones of PRC. A PRC task force, for modern China issues, an ROC TF for non-Taiwan ROC and Taiwan as well if the WPCHINA banner and WPTAIWAN banner coexist on articles, a Diaspora TF for the Chinese communities overseas. -- 65.92.181.190 (talk) 07:49, 22 October 2012 (UTC)
 * I can quickly just make one on Beijing if you want and it could be expanded later. I helped make a Detroit task force for WP Michigan WhisperToMe (talk) 01:09, 23 October 2012 (UTC)
 * I made a draft page at User:WhisperToMe/Beijing - US WikiProjects do tend to go by metro area, but in China it seems like the Beijing metro area is defined as Beijing itself, while Tianjin is seen as its own city...? WhisperToMe (talk) 01:15, 23 October 2012 (UTC)


 * It'd be easier to just create it as the "Beijing-Tianjin TF" at the beginning. Since the port of Tianjin is closely linked with the capital. -- 65.92.181.190 (talk) 06:50, 23 October 2012 (UTC)

Year-by-year provincial history
I found a useful collection of webpages which details a "year in review" for the economic history of each of China's provinces and autonomous regions. Here's one random region (Ningxia) in years 2004 and 2005 from which you can navigate to other provinces. Maybe somebody with better Google-fu than me could find pages for the years 2006 and later, or 2003 and earlier, so that we could build history articles that are less biased towards political events. In a similar vein, Asian Survey publishes articles like "China in 2009", "China in 2010" (and for other Asian countries as well), which project members could use to turn list articles like 2010 in the People's Republic of China into something more analytical. Shrigley (talk) 18:09, 29 October 2012 (UTC)

2012 Chinese American infobox representatives open nomination period
You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:Asian_American. RightCowLeftCoast (talk) 23:23, 29 October 2012 (UTC)

Talk:Special municipality (Republic of China)
Special municipality (Republic of China) has been requested to be renamed -- 65.92.181.190 (talk) 06:37, 1 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Also Provincial city (Republic of China), see Talk:Provincial city (Republic of China) -- 65.92.181.190 (talk) 06:48, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

Help tracking down protest images
I've been trying to find free use images to illustrate the article Shifang protest, but so far haven't had any luck. Hundreds of photos of the protests circulated on Weibo—one photo in particular became widely parodied—and these were reprinted in news coverage. But I can't sort out what kind of license Weibo images are released under, or how I might formulate a free or fair use rationale to incorporate them. Any help would be appreciated. Homunculus (duihua) 21:13, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

Meet China's new provincial Party chiefs
Article in China Daily, Meet China's new provincial Party chiefs. User:Fred Bauder Talk 12:29, 2 November 2012 (UTC)

Category:Political prisoners and detainees of China
Category:Political prisoners and detainees of China, which is within the scope of this WikiProject, has been nominated for deletion. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the Categories for discussion page. Thank you.. -- Brown HairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 02:34, 6 November 2012 (UTC)

China category renaming
See Categories for discussion/Log/2012 November 1 for several -- 65.92.181.190 (talk) 07:21, 2 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Lots more at CFD 2012 November 8. --21:12, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

Chinese chives (kow choi)
The naming of Garlic chives is up for discussion, see talk:Garlic chives -- 65.92.181.190 (talk) 09:39, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

仝
currently redirects to a Japanese article... seems like it might do to do something else with it? -- 70.24.186.245 (talk) 15:14, 10 November 2012 (UTC)

China Academy of Civil Aviation Science and Technology - accident reports?
Hi! Does the China Academy of Civil Aviation Science and Technology have accident reports?

See http://www.castc.org.cn/ and check the Chinese - Please see if they have those reports. The Aviation Safety Council of Taiwan and the Civil Aviation Department (Hong Kong) have accident reports for their respective territories WhisperToMe (talk) 03:23, 11 November 2012 (UTC)

Lady Zhen
There's a file File:ZhenJiart DW5.jpg which needs an FUR to use. Should we use this in the Lady Zhen article in the portion about the video game for Zhen Ji (if so, some commentary about the accuracy of videogame characterizations should be added)? -- 70.24.186.245 (talk) 07:12, 11 November 2012 (UTC)

template:Pretenders to the Manchu throne
Pretenders to the Manchu throne has been nominated for deletion -- 70.24.250.26 (talk) 07:26, 12 November 2012 (UTC)

2012 Asian American representative approval period (Now until 18 December)
You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:Asian American. RightCowLeftCoast (talk) 06:22, 18 November 2012 (UTC)

Request for Comment: Regarding WP:NC-TW
I have opened a Request for Comment regarding WP:NC-TW, which was part of the policy regarding naming conventions related to Taiwan and Republic of China, but since been removed and marked inactive. There is no current policy placed in place of WP:NC-TW, so the request for comment seeks a replacement for it. - Penwhale &#124; dance in the air and follow his steps 07:22, 18 November 2012 (UTC)

"Later Han Dynasty"
The usage of Later Han Dynasty is up for discussion, see Talk:Later Han dynasty (Five Dynasties) -- 70.24.250.26 (talk) 07:58, 18 November 2012 (UTC)

Problems defining sinosphere
See this discussion over recent Language Log criticisms of the Sinosphere article. Help is needed to verify the semantics of Sinosphere, Sinophone, Greater China, and the 漢字文化圏 interwikis. For instance, both Sinophone world and Chinese-speaking world currently redirect to Greater China. Keahapana (talk) 02:09, 19 November 2012 (UTC)

Cricket fighting
We actually have no image of this. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 03:04, 22 November 2012 (UTC)

Boxer Rebellion citations
There is an edit war over "Boxer Rebellion" and its citations. Please comment here. Thanks. Axl ¤  [Talk]  05:37, 26 November 2012 (UTC)

Ba Ren/Lu Xun
Lu Xun used the name "Ba Ren" ("crude fellow") for Ah Q. What would this be in Chinese characters? WhisperToMe (talk) 09:22, 16 November 2012 (UTC)

It's "巴人" in Chinese. -Devin Ronis (d.s.ronis) (talk) 12:40, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

Shaoxing article
I went to read the Shaoxing article this morning and was rather appalled at how such an important city had such a lousy article (and I don't use this vocabulary very liberally). I updated it with the common list of praises for Shaoxing I hear all the time from Chinese people, but they may not very well be so accurate, and I've had some difficulty finding sources for some of their claims (mainly how progressive its environmental protection is). I also couldn't find simple stuff like yearly rainfall, average monthly temperatures which any minor city has info for. Where do people get that info?

This article should really be improved, it's of too great importance not to be, and I'm hoping someone else can also work on it and add some information to it. Thanks for any additional help! -Devin Ronis (d.s.ronis) (talk) 22:59, 1 December 2012 (UTC)

Help with links to places in china
Hi! I need some help fixing the links to places in china at List of Global Boundary Stratotype Sections and Points. Here is a list of the places I have trouble with:


 * Penglaitan Section, Guangxi, China
 * 23.6953°N, 109.3211°W
 * GSSP for Wuchiapingian stage


 * Nashui Section, Luodian, Guizhou, China (http://www.geosocindia.org/episodes/www/backissues/313/319-325%20.pdf)


 * GSSP candiate for Gzhelian, Kasimovian, Moscovian, Serpukhovian


 * Pengchong Section, Pengchong (probably not noteworthy), Guangxi, China
 * 24.4333°N, 109.45°W


 * GSSP for Visean stage


 * Wangjiawan Section, Wangjiawan, Yichang, China


 * GSSP for Hirnantian


 * Huanghuachang Section, Huanghuachang, Yichang, China


 * GSSP for Dapingian


 * Duibian Section, Duibian (probably not noteworthy), Zhejiang, China
 * 28.81597°N, 118.61493°W


 * GSSP for Jiangshanian and candidate for Cambrian Stage 10


 * Luoyixi Section (but there is a Louyixi article which should maybe be moved to Luoyixi Section to meet the notability standards) Guzhang, Hunan, China
 * 28.72°N, 109.9647°W


 * GSSP for Guzhangian


 * Wuliu-Zengjiayan Section, Guizhou, China


 * GSSP candidate for Cambrian Stage 5

If the articles don't exist could somebody make some geography stubs? Thank you all for your help. --Tobias1984 (talk) 10:55, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

I would double check the spelling of these names and what exactly they are referring to. Are you sure they are cities, villages...? They are all correct pinyin syllables, but they are rather impossible to find. I can't find Chinese characters for any of them. I even went and looked up the complete administration subdivisions going down to townships and found absolutely nothing. I'm assuming they are very local geographic things like rivers, mountains, or maybe even parks, but I'm just guessing here. If you have more info, that would be helpful.

Some helpful hints for you. "Tan" at the end of Penglaitan is probably 滩 which means shore/beach, so it may be semantic rather than part of the name, but Penglai is in Shandong not Guangxi, so that's no help there. The same may be true of Louyixi, "xi" is probably 溪 which means creek, but this is also used a lot in place names. In Zengjiayan, yan is probably 岩 which means cliff. Hope this may be of some help. -Devin Ronis (d.s.ronis) (talk) 12:22, 28 November 2012 (UTC)


 * I guess some of those names are not villages after all. Thank you for explaining the syllables. That actually helps a lot in looking for those places. I could find out that Peglaitan lies next to a place called "Xin Penglai". That might be the village? I added some coordinates to the GSSP sites where available and if you choose google maps as the viewer it has a lot of those little places mapped. --Tobias1984 (talk) 22:47, 28 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Penglaitan is 蓬莱滩 as per this list of GSSP points: 地质学上的“金钉子”实际上是全球年代地层单位界线层型剖面和点位（GSSP）的俗称. Sogou Maps ( http://map.sogou.com/ ) show a few more objects in this area (within a kilometer radius) besides what's seen on Google Maps: "Penglai" (蓬莱) (apparently a village), "Xin Penglai" 新蓬莱 （i.e. New Penglai) next to it, Penglai Island (蓬莱洲) in the Red River just to the west, and Penglai Electric [Water-]Pumping Station (蓬莱电灌站) a bit to the east. Penglaitan (i.e. "Penglai Beach") is probably the name of some waterside location in that general area. -- Vmenkov (talk) 00:55, 29 November 2012 (UTC)


 * P.S. The article by Jin, Shen et al, linked from the handy table at http://www.stratigraphy.org/GSSP/index.html, has all the gory details on this place: "Penglaitan is the name of a rocky islet of the Hongshui (Red-water) River, some 20 km east of Laibin." Their maps are not detailed enough to be sure, but I reckon that it well may be the same 600-meter-long island that Sogou Maps label 蓬莱洲 (Penglai zhou = Penglai Island). As the authors explain, "The Maokouan-Lopingian strata of the Penglaitan Section was measured on the eastern slope of the syncline along the southern bank of the Hongshui River nearby this rocky islet (23° 41' 43"N, 109° 19' 16"E)". I suppose one can write an article about the islet, but it probably has very little notability aside of the geological point. If you are actually interested in stratigraphy, you can probably write a more sensible article Penglaitan Section about the geology involved, as described on the 10 pages of the paper by Jin, Shen et al. -- Vmenkov (talk) 01:50, 29 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Louyixi is an actual town, and has a reference (in the same bulletin). Duibian (碓边) actually is shown on Google Maps, about half a mile to the SW from the coordinate point in your article, as a tiny village. (Note that in China Google Maps map view and satellite view are often shifted by a few hundred meters relative to each other, so its often not clear which coordinates are really correct). -- Vmenkov (talk) 02:29, 29 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Thank you for being so helpful. I saw that you even fixed some stuff in the stage articles! I updated the list at the top of this section and hope that this scheme looks good to everyone. I'm going to try to implement all this information into the various "Naming" sections of the stratigraphy articles. --Tobias1984 (talk) 09:54, 29 November 2012 (UTC)

Now that you've renamed the main links like that, any articles that you're going to create (Penglaitan Section, Nashui Section etc) will be pretty much purely about the geology of each spot. You probably can base each such article on the respective paper in the Episodes. By the way, Nashui is 纳水, and is SW of Luodian County's county seat, as per the map in Qi and Wang's paper here: http://www.rivistaitalianadipaleontologia.it/111-1_15.html Google Maps shows plenty of placenames on "纳" in the area (within a few miles' radius from 25.26667°N, 106.51667°W), so 纳水 may be the name of the river that flows there. Some papers explain that Nashui Section is near the village of Naqing, and Naqing (纳庆) is actually shown on Google Maps at 25.265°N, 106.49056°W.

And a general warning: many village, river, or locality names (such as various "(Wang/Wu/Ma/...)jia(ping/wan/tan/yan/...)" or even "Nashui") are likely to occur multiple times throughout China, or sometimes even throughout the same province (especially if you look at them in a Romanized transcription). So one should not claim that e.g. some random "Wenquan" or "Longshan" found with a Google Maps search is the Wenquan or Longshan meant in a particular paper, unless one has verified that it's in the same county (or county-level unit). It seems most papers in the Episodes actually have maps, so ambiguities are resolvable. -- Vmenkov (talk) 17:55, 29 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Glad you guys are sorting this out. Louyixi then is clearly a spelling mistake. Lou and luo are two different syllables though easily confused if you're not so familiar with Chinese. I would recommend you contact the GSSP people and ask them to correct the spelling. -Devin Ronis (d.s.ronis) (talk) 02:39, 2 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Thank you for catching that. I did a google result comparison and Luoyixi has more results. There is an article which is currently misspelled (Louyixi). Should we move it "Luoyixi" (I don't think that it meets the notability standards alone), or move it to Luoyixi Section (then the article could discuss the GSSP section in more detail), or delete it? --Tobias1984 (talk) 07:48, 2 December 2012 (UTC)

China-North Korea border article
Hi! I notice there's no article on the China-North Korea border. Interestingly the French, Portuguese, and Polish Wikipedias have articles, but EN doesn't. WhisperToMe (talk) 01:11, 23 October 2012 (UTC)
 * I started a stub. Somebody needs to start a stub on this in Chinese. WhisperToMe (talk) 15:36, 23 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Though there is no 中朝边境 article, there is a series by this name which lists the bridges and towns on the border. Look at the bottom of the 丹东市 page. This would be a good place to start. -Devin Ronis (d.s.ronis) (talk) 14:59, 3 December 2012 (UTC)

Pre-work assembly
It's a new stub. I'm looking for a better name, if there is one. I'm also looking for the Chinese term so I can find some references. Please help if you can. Thank you, Anna Frodesiak (talk) 17:28, 2 December 2012 (UTC)


 * 工前会 in Chinese is rather common, though there may be other words too. You might add info on the New Life Movement to the article or Yuanda/"Broad," a Chinese solar energy company, both of which have similar activities. James Kynge's China Shakes the World mentions this about Broad somewhere. The idea seems to have originated in Japanese companies, so I would be sure to include that in your article too. Just a head's up, the topic seems iffy enough that someone will probably tag it with a notability tag if not nominate it for deletion so you should work on making your article as unique as possible and differentiate it from other potentially similar ones like Morale which in any case you probably want to add to See also or integrate info about into the article. -Devin Ronis (d.s.ronis) (talk) 14:23, 3 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Thank you for the thoughtful reply.


 * I will check out that term. It's new to me.


 * The articles you suggest should certainly be linked together. Good suggestion.


 * I still don't know what term to search at google.


 * This is the first time I created an article with no references. I did so because I know that if it is challenged, I can find millions of references. The real bugger is finding the search term. So, I would welcome an AfD.


 * I considered adding the topic as a section within an existing article, but it is very distinct, and begged to have its own article, and be added to "see also" sections at existing articles.


 * Again, thanks for the feedback, and if you can find any reference using a term for this topic, I would be grateful. Best, Anna Frodesiak (talk) 14:52, 3 December 2012 (UTC)


 * I agree with you about it being distinct enough, but I can easily see how it could be considered original research. Also, the article is somewhat incorrect in saying it's especially typical of the service industry. They are simply the most visible, but lots of progressive factories, work units, and even some local communist party groups have a similar gathering (I know I wake up to the sound of communists jogging, chanting, and clapping at precisely 7:25 every morning).


 * I didn't think to google 工前会, apparently 班前会 is also used, since it comes up in half the search results right next to 工前会. You might try that one too. Also Workplace wellness just occurred to me as a relevant topic. I don't think you can get much better than pre-work assembly, though there may be a term used in business or sociology I'm unaware of (areas you might try searching in). Anyway, I'll keep an eye out for a better term, good luck with your article. -Devin Ronis (d.s.ronis) (talk) 16:37, 3 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Thank you for the terms. I'm starting to find links. I will get one of my assistants to dig. I got a virus once while pouring through Chinese websites. My assistants' computers have all been infected ages ago, so what's one more? :) :) :)


 * And sure, it's original research, but boy is it ever true. I will make the "service industry" change you recommend. Thanks for that. I figure the first thing that may happen is that someone would add an "OR" tag. That would give me a chance to run for references before the content is it removed. Many thanks again. :) Anna Frodesiak (talk) 04:46, 4 December 2012 (UTC)

Hell bank note
Hell bank note has been nominated to be renamed, see talk:Hell bank note - 65.94.77.181 (talk) 22:43, 3 December 2012 (UTC)

Infobox East Asian name
Infobox East Asian name has been nominated for deletion -- 70.24.245.16 (talk) 04:16, 4 December 2012 (UTC)

Sky city
Hello,

I hope those here who can read Chinese can help me. I am trying to take Skycity to DYK, considering what an interesting hook it will make. For which, I intend to expand the article as much as I can (to meet the DYK expansion standards). For this I request your help to expanding the article and making it a truly great hook. If there is anyone who can help in adding some Chinese sources, and translating them to add more information to the article, please do so. It would be great to see the world's proposed tallest building on the main page.

I am trying to keep all edits at User:TheOriginalSoni/Sky city so that we have more than the traditional 7 days to finish this hook. Hope you shall help!!!

Thanks and cheers!! TheOriginalSoni (talk) 04:36, 4 December 2012 (UTC)

Describe "Participation" on WikiProject China Main Page
Several times over the last few years, I have checked and found that my name had disappeared from the list of Participants. No big deal, I just put it back on, but couldn't figure out what had happened. I thought that "participation" was simply making edits on relevant China pages.

So on the chance that I'm not the only one, maybe someone who knows could put a brief explanation of what is meant by "participation" at WP:WikiProject China. Cheers. ch (talk) 04:27, 6 December 2012 (UTC)

Yan'an Talks on Literature and Art
I have requested a name change of this article. Any comments welcome: Talk:Yan'an Talks on Literature and Art. -Devin Ronis (d.s.ronis) (talk) 04:14, 8 December 2012 (UTC)

Assassination of Tomomitsu Taminato
This Second Sino-Japanese War related article needs attention from editors familiar with the topic: it needs to be revamped with reference to better and neutral sources. I have raised my concerns on the article talk page. --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 17:25, 14 December 2012 (UTC)

Chenpeng Village Primary School stabbing
Help needed. :-( Is there more detail in local Chinese language sources? John Vandenberg (chat) 03:22, 15 December 2012 (UTC)


 * I've left some questions at Talk:Chenpeng Village Primary School stabbing. -- John Vandenberg (chat) 00:32, 16 December 2012 (UTC)


 * I've started Firearm ownership law in China so that the Chinese approach to gun politics, and the 'China' vs USA "debate", can be placed somewhere other than on the article about the stabbing. John Vandenberg (chat) 02:02, 16 December 2012 (UTC)

The English page received 30,000 pageviews yesterday, and is on the front page of English Wikipedia and zh:2012年光山县小学生被砍伤事件 is on the front page of Chinese Wikipedia. The details have been very sketchy, especially in English news sources. Someone has just now add http://money.jrj.com.cn/2012/12/17093614829777.shtml, which appears to be good investigative journalism and provides a lot of very useful information that is missing, and claims that the wrong person was initially named as the suspect. John Vandenberg (chat) 06:38, 17 December 2012 (UTC)

Chinese-language newspapers in LA/Orange counties in the 1990s
Hi! What are some Chinese-language newspapers active in LA and Orange counties in the 1990s?

At Talk:Murder_of_Stuart_Tay I'm trying to find the Chinese names of two of the perpetrators but can't find anything online - Perhaps a Chinese-language newspaper in California has written an article about the case, but the article isn't online? WhisperToMe (talk) 04:59, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

Depopulation
It is strange that 12 ethnics depopulated in 2000-2010. Why? Mistake in census? Demographics_of_China --Kaiyr (talk) 09:27, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Perhaps people die and not enough children are born? It's the same situation in Russia and Eastern Europe. --  李博杰  &#124; —Talk contribs email 09:29, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

I doubt this has anything to do with actual low birth rates (i.e., birth rates being lower than the death rates) in any of the groups involved. After all, even the Han numbers in the same table are going up, and the One child policy rules are usually less restrictive for ethnic minorities.

I believe that what goes on with several of the groups involved is that for many of those ethnic groups children of interethnic marriages (e.g., one parent Manchu, another Han) choose to identify with the "other" ethnic group more often with the first one. In other cases, it is a matter of identification. Let's look at the actual list of these 12 ethnic groups.


 * 1) Manchu: Today's Manchu are one of the most "assimilated" ethnic groups in China, especially in more urban areas. (Hardly any Manchu language is spoken anymore). No wonder intermarriage rates are high. (See the numbers for the NE provinces in tables 2,3 in this paper: http://Fmiddlab.middlebury.edu/files/2010/05/RBUTERA-Chinese-Interethnic-Marriage-5-7.pdf ). Of course, in many interethnic marriages elsewhere it may be actually beneficial for the children to choose a "minority" affiliation rather than Han, due to various affirmative action benefits (high school admission, etc); but I guess it is not such a major factor with Manchu for some reason; maybe people don't want to emphasize one's (partial) Manchu ancestry because of the memories of the Qing rule... (See Anti-Manchuism).
 * 2) According to the article on the She people of Fujian, they are also a fairly assimilated group, with the She language practically lost. So probably the same interethnic marriage situation.
 * 3) The Gaoshan are a tiny group (4,000) of people - supposedly, some Taiwanese aborigines who happened to be in the mainland in 1949 and their descendants. The actual numbers actually increased greatly from 1982 to 2000, so perhaps it suddenly became more politically acceptable to identify oneself as Gaoshan... but, anyway, after 2-3 generation in the mainland (and, probably, marriages mostly with the Han) the link with the "high mountains" of Taiwan becomes increasingly tenuous.
 * 4) The ethnic-Russian Chinese citizens may still celebrate Easter (巴斯克节), but the certainly look pretty assimilated...
 * 5) The similarly small Uzebk and Tatar groups probably gradually "merge" into the Uyghur (and maybe Kazakh) environment.
 * 6) I have no idea about the Daurs, but perhaps  intermarriage plays a role too.
 * 7) The Koreans - a large group with a distinct identity - shows a comparatively huge drop (from  1,923,842 down to 1,830,929 in 10 years). Perhaps migration to South Korea plays a role?
 * 8) And then there are a few decreasing groups in the southwest: Buyei, Dong, Gelao, Maonan, Derung. I have no real idea about them, but perhaps what may go on (besides intermarriage) is some kind of reclassification, with certain villages claiming that are really a different ethnic group from how they were registered before, etc. In this connection, see an interesting list under Guizhou. -- Vmenkov (talk) 17:49, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

Three cases of mass murder and a request for translation
First of all, I know this Wikiproject has a separate translation section, but there doesn't seem to be an awful lot of activity there, so I post my questions here, since I fear they might be overlooked otherwise.

What I need is confirmation that I have understood the basics of the following mass murder cases correctly, since Google Translate doesn't work too well with Chinese, and I suspect I may have gotten the facts wrong.

The first case apparently occurred on June 24, 1981, and a detailed description can be found here. What I can make out of the gibberish Google provides me with is that a bus exploded in Xiamen, killing a total of 40 people and wounding 84 others, and among the dead was a 27-year-old man named Huang Kefen, who had been arrested previously for illegal fishing and trading with explosives, and had escaped from prison on September 17, 1979. And as far as I can see, the explosion was intentionally caused by him. Is this summary correct? Does the article say anything about Huang deliberately bombing the bus (if so, does it say why), or was it an accident?

The second case also happened in 1981, on July 22 it seems, and a description can be found here. What I get is, that there was an explosion at a cinema in Yangquan with 32 killed and a total of 127 wounded. The rest is pretty murky to me, because Google Translate tells me something about an Ukrainian National, and I really have no clue what that's supposed to mean, but what I can dicern from the text is, that some guy bombed the cinema, killing himself in the process, his name may be Gao Haiping, and he did it, because his girlfriend had dumped him. Is this correct, or were others involved in the bombing?

The final case occurred on November 18, 1995, as described here. From what I can make out of it, it seems that two men, Feng Wanhai, 26-years-old, and Jiang Liming, 22-years-old, drove through Zhaodong, armed with a shotgun and a rifle and shot a total of 48 people, 32 of them fatally, because they wanted to create a "grand event" and "let the world know" (according to Googles translation). While Feng was killed by police, Jiang was only wounded, sentenced to death and executed. Is this correct? Does the article say anything about the motive behind the shooting? Or how it was committed? Did they rob their victims?

I really need to get the facts straight on those cases to know if I can add them to the List of rampage killers, or not. Thank's in advance. (Lord Gøn (talk) 16:57, 19 December 2012 (UTC))

and other radicals redirects
I noticed that many radicals have recently been tagged with R from unicode. Shouldn't these also be tagged with ? -- 70.24.247.127 (talk) 22:22, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

A-料
,,   point to different locations... should these exist? And shouldn't there be a disambiguation page, if they should exist? WP:REDLINK seems to indicate these should be redlinked. -- 70.24.247.127 (talk) 22:29, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

4179 Toutatis
There's a query at talk:4179 Toutatis about the copyright status of images from Chang'e 2 ; also, would this article fall under WPCHINA? -- 70.24.247.127 (talk) 07:50, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

Deletion debate for Assassination of Tomomitsu Taminato
Hi! There is a discussion going on at Articles for deletion/Assassination of Tomomitsu Taminato. The debate was initially over whether the article's POV is tilted toward Japan too much, but no one seems to be able to come up with Chinese reliable sources to balance it out. I noticed that the author of the Japanese Wikipedia page (from which this is a translation) proclaimed that he had based it on the (far-right, anti-Chinese) writings of Shōichi Watanabe. There seems to be a complete lack of sources for this event in English, and the Japanese sources are all either extremely old (1936-37) or somewhat dodgy. My Chinese is limited, but if there are any sources that might possibly be able to balance the article out they are probably in Chinese. Any help in finding such sources would be appreciated. Otherwise, it seems the article is terminally biased, and I am not sure how to deal with that, since apparently "POV isn't grounds enough for deletion"... elvenscout742 (talk) 07:04, 21 December 2012 (UTC)

Northeast Project (Gaogouli/Goguryeo) controversy
There's a controversy about the article Northeast Project of the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences. In July, I started soliciting opinions on a possible merger to Goguryeo controversies, since I considered the article a POVFORK and a COATRACK dedicated to framing the dispute from a certain point of view. I got some support from User:Rincewind42, but User:Cydevil38 disagreed with me, citing "articles mentioning the word". Since he didn't address my main arguments, from October to today I have tried to execute the merge, but he has repeatedly reverted me. There's a related ANI thread on his conduct during the dispute, which might expire. But we need more participation in the discussion from editors familiar with Chinese perspectives, since Cydevil has already solicited the opinions of Korean editors on this border dispute in a biased manner. Shrigley (talk) 05:12, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

Tofu skin
Tofu skin is up for renaming to "yuba" -- 70.24.247.127 (talk) 00:55, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
 * I believe Tofu skin is better. -- Chengshuotian (talk) 17:48, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
 * you need to lodge your opinion at talk:Tofu skin -- 70.24.247.127 (talk) 20:10, 24 December 2012 (UTC)

"Tofu skin" is rated as "mid-importance", is that correct according to the project? -- 70.24.247.127 (talk) 20:10, 24 December 2012 (UTC)

Help needed
Hi there! Can anyone fluent in Chinese please help me with this translation? I'm needing it to provide the English translation of an article included as a source at TAAG Angola Airlines. Thanks!--Jetstreamer Talk 22:01, 2 January 2013 (UTC)
 * It seems to be an incomplete sentence, but John of Reading (and Google Translate) is right. 安哥拉航空公司 means Angola Airlines or the national airline company of Angola, 北京代表处 means Beijing Representative Office, 正式 means in this case officially, 落成 means complete/completed.  Heights (Want to talk?) 00:03, 3 January 2013 (UTC)

Chinese expressway article titles - proposed name change
I have made a proposal to drop the numbered prefix from Chinese expressway articles, e.g. G2 Beijing–Shanghai Expressway --> Beijing–Shanghai Expressway. My rationale is at Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (Chinese). Discussion is welcome.  Heights (Want to talk?) 00:03, 3 January 2013 (UTC)

Category:Islands in Fujian Province, Taiwan up for renaming
Category:Islands in Fujian Province, Taiwan has been nominated for renaming, so give your input here. GotR Talk 01:28, 4 January 2013 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Pages needing translation into English
There are two articles listed at the above page which have small amounts of content written in Chinese. I have been able to find few sources to help me translate them (relying entirely on machine translation), and I think it would be relatively easy and quick job for a Chinese speaker, hence I am putting a note here. The articles are Timi Zhuo and Low Wormwood, details of the problems can be found at the above link. Thanks. -- Patchy1 03:37, 7 January 2013 (UTC)

Min Chinese people
The article was moved from  on 24 December 2012. The article that replaced it at "Min peoples", was moved to on 7 January 2013. Someone might want to verify links -- 76.65.128.43 (talk) 06:59, 7 January 2013 (UTC)

Rice that goes "BOOM!"
This is it: Is this the right name: "爆米香"? I want to write about it, but I need the name in Chinese to find sources. Cheers, Anna Frodesiak (talk) 12:28, 29 December 2012 (UTC)
 * I think an article for that already exists, under puffed rice. _dk (talk) 13:48, 29 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes. That's where I ended up (actually Puffed grain). There's just a mention of it, but I want to expand it. It's such a well known bit of culture here. I can get photos I think. It deserves way more coverage, maybe a section, and maybe even an article. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 14:03, 29 December 2012 (UTC)

Boom!:

But does it deserve a standalone article? Anna Frodesiak (talk) 10:43, 15 January 2013 (UTC)

Suileng County
According to article on Baidu.com, the correct name for county is Suiling, not Suileng. Could anybody check this? --Slb nsk (talk) 19:06, 21 January 2013 (UTC)
 * You're right. I moved the article to Suiling County because the government website is http://www.suiling.gov.cn. Thanks! Madalibi (talk) 02:39, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Fall of Tibet
Was the fall of Tibet and incorporation into the PRC a Debellatio? Should the term debellation be used at List of wars involving the People's Republic of China to describe the PLA/CPC's victory over Tibet? See discussion at Talk:List of wars involving the People's Republic of China and User talk:XavierGreen. --  李博杰  &#124; —Talk contribs email 00:59, 1 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Wouldn't that depend on whether Tibet is considered a state, or a rebellious part of the Qing Empire? -- 70.24.248.246 (talk) 03:51, 1 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Here's not the place to debate the question. However, the whole question of whether or not Tibet was "a state" was introduced by pro-secessionist polemicists like the Dalai Lama's Dutch lawyer and a pseudolegal CIA front group. There was no question in the community of states of Tibet's sovereignty under China in the period under question, except by imperial powers who had their own designs on the territory: most notably Britain. Since this heavily charged anachronism is seldom considered by those who do not consider it to have been a state&mdash;i.e., serious scholars of international law, it may be compared to pseudoscience (more relevantly to us, WP:FRINGE) that respectable journals do not consider in order not to give a bunk line of inquiry undue legitimacy. Shrigley (talk) 00:56, 2 January 2013 (UTC)
 * It's relevant that XavierGreen is known for his persistent efforts to rename an article currently titled "1961 Indian annexation of Goa" to "Invasion of Goa", an effort which I supported (you can see the arguments in the talk archives). Shrigley (talk) 00:56, 2 January 2013 (UTC)

Going by the debllatio article, I would say no. The military conflict was limited to a small region in the west of Tibet, and at the time of incorporation the Tibetan government, economic, and social structures remained intact. This was very different from the complete destruction of Carthage in the Third Punic War and the unconditional surrender of the Third Reich, which are the examples of deballatio given in the article.--Wikimedes (talk) 21:17, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Tiangong-2
According to this report Tiangong-2 has been cancelled, and will instead be repurposed as the cargo transport it's descendents were supposed to become, and instead Tiangong-3 has become Tiangong-2, the station whose descendents were supposed to become modules of the large multimodule station.

-- 76.65.128.43 (talk) 12:51, 23 January 2013 (UTC)


 * For more discussions on the matter, see WT:SPACEFLIGHT -- 76.65.128.43 (talk) 01:05, 24 January 2013 (UTC)

Making a good article about Linfen, Shanxi
I recently discovered the article about Linfen, a small city in Shanxi province. It's a prefecture level city with about 4 million people. Linfen city has a little less than a million. It's big enough, important enough, and interesting enough to merit a legitimately good article. When I found it, it was little more than a bunch of statistics and some slightly exagerated talk of polution. I've worked to improve the article, but it needs some more attention. Most of the English-language sources are pollution related articles from 2007 or there-abouts. I am not good at reading Chinese and I feel that the article could be greatly expanded with the help of folks who can read Chinese easily. In particular, the History section is lacking. Linfen has seriously ancient roots, but wikipedia doesn't have much to say about it, yet.

Even if you can't read Chinese, the article could be improved by copy-editing my recent contributions. Anyone want to have a look. Even an honest review of the article would be useful. - Metal lunchbox (talk) 15:36, 24 January 2013 (UTC)
 * There's a rather decent Vice documentary about that city and its pollution problem, just in case you wanted to know. --  李博杰  &#124; —Talk contribs email 21:52, 24 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Also the pollution section needs to be updated with more recent cites...I have heard that the situation there has improved substantially since 2007. _dk (talk) 01:23, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

Baotou
According to "Administrative divisions", there exists "Binhe New District" in Baotou. Unfortunately, I cannot find any reliable information about it. Article on baike.baidu.com has information about only 9 district-level parts of Baotou. Does it really exist? --Slb nsk (talk) 17:01, 2 February 2013 (UTC)

Boxer Rebellion "Taku" ships
See WT:SHIPS for a discussion about this topic. -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 23:27, 3 February 2013 (UTC)

Former Ethnic townships of the People's Republic of China
Where I find list of Former Ethnic townships of the People's Republic of China?--Kaiyr (talk) 08:04, 5 February 2013 (UTC)

Deng Wei
Can someone please check that this Chinese language reference days that he is dead. The automatic translation does not make sense.著名摄影师邓伟辞世 明日八宝山为其送行

--Racklever (talk) 10:27, 5 February 2013 (UTC)


 * Yes the source says he is dead, but doesn't say on what date. -Zanhe (talk) 12:15, 5 February 2013 (UTC)

XingXiu(2).png
file:XingXiu(2).png has been nominated for deletion -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 07:51, 6 February 2013 (UTC)

Jingjiang Lonely Hill
Please help save this article. Does anyone know the correct Chinese name so we can find references? Many thanks. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 00:54, 12 February 2013 (UTC)

Resolved, thanks to Vmenkov. :) Anna Frodesiak (talk) 02:11, 12 February 2013 (UTC)

1912 in the Republic of China
1912 in the Republic of China has been proposed to be renamed 1912 in Taiwan, see talk:2011 in the Republic of China for the discussion -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 22:48, 11 February 2013 (UTC)
 * It's not just 1912, all the years are under discussion.--Ninthabout (talk) 13:58, 15 February 2013 (UTC)

Nextstepchina
Are these references too spammy to be used? Please advise. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 02:10, 12 February 2013 (UTC)
 * nextstepchina.org does appear to be a promotional web site. (Looking at the first 2 articles in the link you provided, our article on Hefei University of Technology also appears to be a promotional web site.)--Wikimedes (talk) 15:58, 12 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Okay. Well the same spam ref dropping continues. I searched for "sarah" and the org name, and found no obvious confict of interest, but I think that's probably what's happening. I don't want to bite if it's a good faith editor. How to procede? Anna Frodesiak (talk) 02:15, 13 February 2013 (UTC)


 * Oops. And now I'm seeing copyvios starting. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 02:16, 13 February 2013 (UTC)

My position now is this: The references added are spammy, and support very basic facts, facts which can be found at the university webpages. Considering the nature of the facts, I think it would be okay to use the university websites for references and consider those sites reliable sources. I've asked the contributor to stop and comment here first.

Is this okay with others? Anna Frodesiak (talk) 10:41, 13 February 2013 (UTC)


 * This seems reasonable per Rs. Watch out for "so long as ... 5. the article is not based primarily on such sources."--Wikimedes (talk) 17:06, 13 February 2013 (UTC)


 * Fair enough. I'm going to remove them all as the best course of action. Thanks for the feedback. :) Anna Frodesiak (talk) 19:50, 13 February 2013 (UTC)


 * I just removed them from about 60 articles. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 20:24, 13 February 2013 (UTC)


 * Good work. The site definitely looks promotional.--Ninthabout (talk) 13:30, 15 February 2013 (UTC)

Robert Temple cleanup
See User:Ninthabout/Robert Temple cleanup. I'm involved in an ongoing effort at removing or replacing an unreliable source used in some history of China articles. I'm posting a notification here in case anyone wants to help.--Ninthabout (talk) 22:15, 15 February 2013 (UTC)

Liujiang man
has been nominated for deletion -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 22:32, 15 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Needs an article, not a redirect. I've started a stub.--Ninthabout (talk) 00:22, 16 February 2013 (UTC)

One school – two articles?
Based on the articles, Xinghua High School and Xinghua Middle School have a remarkable amount in common. Being unable to read the references, I can't tell if the two articles are about the same school. Both articles were started as part of the Nanjing Normal University Class Project, but by different editors. If they are the same school, I can take care of the merge. Thank you. SchreiberBike (talk) 18:12, 18 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes, they are the same school. (The external links go to the same site.) _dk (talk) 01:28, 19 February 2013 (UTC)

4179 Toutatis (Chang'e 2).jpg
image:4179 Toutatis (Chang'e 2).jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 00:02, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

Xanadu
The usage of Xanadu is under discussion, see talk:Xanadu (disambiguation) -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 23:15, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

Xifan (稀饭)
The places I've been in China call the breakfast dish "xifan" and not "zhou". It's got whole bits of soggy rice in it, is watery, and always made with yesterday's leftover rice. Zhou is smoother, purpose made, and not just for breakfast. Is this right?

Please see Congee and please comment at: Talk:Congee.

Many thanks, Anna Frodesiak (talk) 08:36, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

File:Laonankainiao.jpg
File:Laonankainiao.jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 04:39, 4 March 2013 (UTC)

Republic of China / Taiwan
Did you notice that Republic of China now has no article? It is re-directed to Taiwan, which is an article about, well, Taiwan the island/province/colony/self-governing entity/country, not Republic of China the state.

I think the re-naming and re-direct was done without sufficient canvassing by the community. If you have an opinion on the issue either way, please participate at Talk:Taiwan. --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 19:36, 19 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Please see this: Talk:Taiwan/Archive 20--FutureTrillionaire (talk) 20:45, 19 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the link Ft, having skimmed it, I don't see a consensus, and reading the closing opinion it seems like the matter was closed by three people who don't appear to be familiar with the subject matter. Having left the matter for a couple of days, well, I really don't care about Wikipedia enough to get all worked up about it, so I'll leave it. But I think this underscores one of the most cogent criticism of the way Wikipedia operates: expertise and familiarity with the subject matter of an article gets beaten by familiarity with Wikipedia politics. --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 15:54, 21 February 2013 (UTC)


 * Wow, that was a long discussion! I didn't read it all, but it seems to me nobody suggested to make both Taiwan and ROC disambiguation pages; I at least feel Republic of China (1912–1949) should be linked from such a disamb page. But it's probably too late for that now. &mdash; Sebastian 01:35, 6 March 2013 (UTC)

Government of ROC
Someone moved the Government of the Republic of China article to Government of Taiwan, but it covers the entire period from 1911 onwards... -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 11:42, 5 March 2013 (UTC)

List of wars involving the People's Republic of China, Mk II
Regarding the article List of wars involving the People's Republic of China: Editors are invited to participate in consensus-finding and discussion at Talk:List of wars involving the People's Republic of China. --  李博杰  &#124; —Talk contribs email 11:54, 5 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Should the Tiananmen Square events of 1989 be considered a "war"?
 * Are minor armed conflicts and skirmishes, such as the Chola incident, some with fewer than 15 deaths, considered "wars"?
 * What meets the definition of "war"?
 * Is calling the Chola incident anything but a stalemate (e.g. in this edit) considered WP:OR, given the literature that is presently available?

Chinese fire arrow.gif
image:Chinese fire arrow.gif has been nominated for speedy deletion -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 23:14, 5 March 2013 (UTC)

Jdoulas
I will be editing an cleaning up the wiki page Women's Healthcare in China. I will be focusing on the reorganization of the the article will situate healthcare in China an how economic reform in China has effect healthcare specifically for women with regards to access, supply, and quality. I am currently collecting research and would appreciate any contribution or suggestions that any members may have. Thank you. Jdoulas (talk) 06:57, 6 March 2013 (UTC)

Category:AAAAA-rated tourist attractions and others are proposed for deletion
Please join the discussion at Categories for discussion/Log/2013 March 3. -Zanhe (talk) 21:26, 7 March 2013 (UTC)

Years in China pre-1949
We have some redundancy in the "Year X in China" articles: We have 1912 in the Republic of China, but 1924 in China - compare Template:China year nav and Template:ROC year nav. Articles for the era when all of China fell under the "Republic of China" heading can probably be consolidated. What's the preferred title for such articles? How about moving 1912 to 1912 in China? Huon (talk) 03:36, 7 March 2013 (UTC)
 * In 1912, there was also Qing China, so if this is a by government article, then there should be a companion Qing article. Compare to 1949 in China. -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 04:30, 8 March 2013 (UTC)


 * No there shouldn't. According to Template:China year nav, all years in Qing China are just "Year X in China" (not that we actually have any such articles). This naming scheme is "by country", not "by government". In 1949 China splits into the PRC and the ROC; thus from that year onward we have separate articles for each. That's not comparable to the 1912 regime change. Huon (talk) 14:32, 8 March 2013 (UTC)

Hsu Mo
Hsu Mo is a Chinese figure in international law, and I created his page from a translation of the German Wikipedia page on him because of his involvement in international law. I'm not a member of this WikiProject, but Hsu Mo clearly falls within it, even if he was a representative of the RoC after the civil war, so I placed this project's banner on the talk page and hope some members will have a chance to review the page. IMHO (talk) 22:28, 9 March 2013 (UTC)

慈禧西逃.jpg
image:慈禧西逃.jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 01:30, 10 March 2013 (UTC)

CfD Category:History of China in operas
This category and its 4 sub categories have been nominated for deletion. The discussion is here. Voceditenore (talk) 10:28, 13 March 2013 (UTC)

Susong.jpg
file:Susong.jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 23:10, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

Several files up for deletion
See Possibly unfree files/2013 March 16 where several China related files are up for deletion -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 23:59, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

East Sea
The usage of East Sea is under discussion, see talk:East Sea -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 00:13, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

Economy of China
The usage of Economy of China is up for discussion, see Talk:Economy of the People's Republic of China -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 06:56, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

New State Council: many pages on ministries, former and new ministers,..need major updating!
Hello,

I was looking at State_Council_of_the_People's_Republic_of_China. I noticed that many articles on Ministries still refer to the wrong minister, that in the articles on former ministes, they are still referred to as the current minister, that infoboxes are not yet updated or missing,.... I also noticed that some dates are simply wrong (for instance, Li Shenglin did not start in 2008 but in 2005, he was not removed in 2013 but in 2012....).

These are the ministers of the biggest country on earth, so the info should at least be in line with what official media releases. I already edited quite a few, but since I do not speak Chinese, it's almost impossible for me to do it all by myself, so I humbly ask others to consider this as well. Evilbu (talk) 12:03, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

Republic of China–United States relations
Republic of China–United States relations has been requested to be renamed, see talk:Republic of China–United States relations -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 03:43, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Republic of China and weapons of mass destruction
Republic of China and weapons of mass destruction has been requested to be renamed, see talk:Republic of China and weapons of mass destruction -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 04:13, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Ministry of Economic Affairs (Republic of China)
Ministry of Economic Affairs (Republic of China) has been requested to be renamed, see talk:Ministry of Economic Affairs (Republic of China) -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 04:17, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Category:People's Republic of China singers
There is a proposal her [Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2013 March 22] also linked to from Category:People's Republic of China singers to merge that category with Category:Chinese singers. There has also been a counter proposal to rename that caegory to Category:Singers from China. I figure this project should be notified of these proposals.John Pack Lambert (talk) 02:59, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

Guang Bing.jpg
file:Guang Bing.jpg has been nominated for deletion. This is apparently a Kompyang, but that article says it comes from China, though the way it is written, seems to imply that it is not found in China... can someone familiar with this show if it is found in China or not? -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 09:34, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Assistance from Chinese-speaking user needed
Could a user who understands Chinese please review the sources listed on this page and the coverage listed here? It would help a lot in determining the notability of the award. Zaminamina Eh Eh Waka Waka Eh Eh 18:13, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

has been nominated for deletion -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 05:41, 29 March 2013 (UTC)
 * The discussion at WP:RFD has now also included,  ,  ; -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 19:32, 29 March 2013 (UTC)

ROC external relations categories
and has been requested to be renamed -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 05:23, 29 March 2013 (UTC)
 * discussion at Categories_for_discussion/Log/2013_March_27 -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 03:38, 31 March 2013 (UTC)

Infobox Chinese film
Infobox Chinese film has been proposed to be eliminated, see WP:TFD -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 07:58, 30 March 2013 (UTC)

Daikon (lo bak; Chinese radish)
Daikon has been proposed to be renamed, see talk:Daikon -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 21:32, 31 March 2013 (UTC)

File:Meijiawu.jpg
File:Meijiawu.jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 05:02, 2 April 2013 (UTC)

File:Liangpi.jpg
File:Liangpi.jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 16:34, 3 April 2013 (UTC)

ROC year nav ; Taiwan year nav ; Years in Taiwan navbox
These are up for discussion, see Templates for discussion/Log/2013 April 5 -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 01:33, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Fu Lu Shou statue images up for deletion
Several images used at Fu Lu Shou are up for deletion.

-- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 03:41, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Number of ethnic by county of PRC
Hi! Could you find Number of yao, dong and yi people by county of PRC like there: Miao_people ?--Kaiyr (talk) 14:32, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Help with an article?
I could use some serious help with an article that I'm not quite sure passes notability guidelines or not. The article in question is Fei gei lam-aeroplane olive. I'm not finding any reliable sources in English, but the article claims that it's a popular snack in China. Can anyone fluent in the language find some RS to back any of this up? The article would need to be pretty much completely re-written and renamed to just "Airplane Olive" since that seems to be one of the popular names for it, but I'd hate to delete this outright without at least trying to get some help establishing notability. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡)   05:51, 7 April 2013 (UTC)

Templates
On WikiProject China-related templates such as this one, WikiProject China, there is no Chinese flag, which is inconsistent with templates for other projects. 069952497aComments and complaintsStuff I've done 19:07, 7 April 2013 (UTC)

Asian film Infoboxes Merging
As per a discussion the three Asian film Templates will be merging with the general film template. I'd appreciate as many editors get a chance to look over this and contribute their thoughts as to how the four film infoboxes will be merged together. Thank you. ₪Rick n Asia₪ 16:44, 8 April 2013 (UTC)

Appeal for sources
Could someone who reads Chinese look for sources for Silk Route Museum? Unfortunately I am unable to as I only read European languages :/ Thanks -- Gilderien Chat&#124;List of good deeds 16:08, 9 April 2013 (UTC)

"Wu Dang"
The usage of is up for discussion, see Talk:Wu Dang (film) -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 06:18, 10 April 2013 (UTC)

Wokou
There's a dispute at and Talk:Wokou, that was brought up at WT:JAPAN. -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 06:48, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

ROC foreign relations
Several Republic of China foreign relations articles are up for renaming, see Talk:Belize–Republic of China relations -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 05:55, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

Help with an article?
I recently came across an article for Fang Zong-ao that was up for PROD. I translated it as best I could with Google Translate, but the remaining issue is that we still need sources for the article. Since it's almost certain that the sources will be in Chinese and my translation program can only go so far, I thought it'd be best to see if anyone here can look for sources. I'd hate for someone to nominate this for AfD without my trying to improve it first. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡)   04:29, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

Faye Wong albums
A large number of Faye Wong albums have been nominated for renaming. See WP:RM -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 04:35, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

File:Kao Lin-wei.jpg
File:Kao Lin-wei.jpg (Kao Ling Wei) has been nominated for deletion. This is the basis of the commons file (a modified version of this one), so, if this is deleted, then the commons file is also in danger. Gao Lingwei uses the modified version. -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 09:42, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

Chinese royalty portraits up for deletion
Several Imperial Chinese royalty portraits have been nominated for speedy deletion: -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 09:44, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

File:Laonankainiao.jpg
File:Laonankainiao.jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 16:47, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

has been nominated for deletion. Do we have a valid topic for this? -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 00:10, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

File:SunYatSen.jpg
File:SunYatSen.jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 00:43, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

File:Wang Zi Ping2.jpg
File:Wang Zi Ping2.jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 01:04, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

File:Emperor Qianlong.jpg
File:Emperor Qianlong.jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 02:41, 23 April 2013 (UTC)

Laonankai.jpg
image:Laonankai.jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 03:40, 23 April 2013 (UTC)

Huang wenyong.jpg
file:Huang wenyong.jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 02:45, 24 April 2013 (UTC)

Bắc thuộc (Chinese imperial period in Vietnam)
Bắc thuộc has been requested to be renamed, see talk:Bắc thuộc -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 03:50, 24 April 2013 (UTC)

Template Change
A vote on merging the Asian film infobox templates went through and a discussion on how to merge them is completed. Please refrain from using the old Chinese film template and use the default film template + Template:Film name to write the name in the original Chinese. Thanks. ₪Rick n Asia₪ 06:42, 24 April 2013 (UTC)

An Tu
An Tu, princess of the Yuan Dynasty is up for renaming. See Talk:An Tu -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 09:26, 24 April 2013 (UTC)

more Faye Wong albums
More Faye Wong albums are up for renaming at WP:RM -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 08:40, 26 April 2013 (UTC)

Faye Wong
many albums of Faye Wong have been put up for renaming, see Talk:No Regrets (Faye Wong album) -- 65.94.76.126 (talk) 19:42, 28 April 2013 (UTC)

Chinese Emperor renames (and possible NCZH change?)
See Talk:Emperor Gaozu of Later Jin where a large number of Chinese emperors are proposed for renaming. It also appears to be an adjustment in the Chinese emperor naming scheme is proposed (and not on WP:NC-ZH, where it should be) -- 65.94.76.126 (talk) 21:06, 29 April 2013 (UTC)

"most Chinese" and pinyin
Further to the RM note by 70.24.250.103, Talk:No Regrets (Faye Wong album) has just had the issue raised "If these titles were given in pinyin they would all look about same -- certainly to English speakers, and probably to most Chinese as well." - any non-laowai editors here able to confirm that? Thanks In ictu oculi (talk) 17:30, 1 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Depends. As far as Faye's albums, those familiar with her (probably 80% of those going to those pages) AND Mandarin should recognize the titles somewhat easily, especially the shorter ones. However pinyin will be quite difficult for Hong Kong natives to recognize, and vice versa in terms of Cantonese Yale for China/Taiwan/Singapore natives.Timmyshin (talk) 06:18, 2 May 2013 (UTC)
 * What that comment is saying, is for example, something like "Yuyan" could mean　寓言 (fable), 語言　(language),　預言　(prediction), 預演 (rehearsal), 雨燕 (rain swallow), and probably 80 other terms possible as album titles.　Without context, a Chinese won't have a clue, if a foreigner comes to him and asks for an album called "Yuyan". Now "Fuzao" or "Changyou" is probably more recognizable, but I'm just speaking as a biased Fayenatic.Timmyshin (talk) 06:29, 2 May 2013 (UTC)
 * writing Hanyu pinyin from sinograms is easy, it's universally taught in schools; but the reverse (pinyin to Sinograms) takes a lot of parsing. In practice it's never used. I also mentioned there's no such thing as standard Cantonese pinyin – there's one way (not always uniform) in HK, another in Macao, and nobody studies these to any level. In the PRC, I don't think they even bother with Cantonese pinyin even if they knew how to. Another reason why the use of pinyin for these items isn't always a good idea: being artistic works, they often wordplay using homophones; and Cantonese homophones are not always homophones in Mandarin. In both cases, the wordplay will get lost in a pinyin translation. --  Ohconfucius  ping / poke 06:39, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

China–India relations#2013 Chinese Intrusion into Ladakh
I'm being reverted over this addition despite my attempt at talking about it on the talk page. The same editor created 2013 Daulat Beg Oldi Incident. According to this Times of India article the event is minor, and border incidents occur frequently. This seemingly infringes on WP:NOTNEWS and the section is given undue balance. Would like to seek another opinion on the matter. Mkdw talk 20:18, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

About China–India relations#2013 Chinese Intrusion into Ladakh
I am the editor that created the 2013 Daulat Beg Oldi Incident. In my opinion I have provided numerous reliable sources from mainstream media that show that the article is notable and neutral. According to the following articles from major publications - DNA India article, Indian Express article, Deccan Herald article, Economic Times article the matter is not a minor incident. Especially see this Firstpost.com article that clearly states that this is the first time since 1986 that Chinese troops have infiltrated into Indian territory and stayed put. Can provide numerous more examples from mainstream media. I therefore feel, with due respect to Mkdw, that (s)he is unduly flagging the article as "disputed", "non-notable", etc. despite ample evidence to the contrary. Would therefore seek another opinion on the matter. Danke. Nightbattalk —Preceding undated comment added 11:04, 2 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Discussion of the article's content belong on the article's talk page, so I've copied Nightbat's above comments to both the China-India realtions and 2013 Daulat Beg Oldi Incident.--Wikimedes (talk) 17:33, 3 May 2013 (UTC)

Li Jing.jpg
file:Li Jing.jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 65.94.76.126 (talk) 07:01, 6 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Sure, guy can't even distinguish Li Jing vs. Ji Ling. Fail. Timmyshin (talk) 05:32, 7 May 2013 (UTC)

HKeDOIcover.PNG
file:HKeDOIcover.PNG has been nominated for deletion -- 65.94.76.126 (talk) 23:30, 7 May 2013 (UTC)

Adoption of Chinese literary culture name discussion
Check out Talk:Adoption of Chinese literary culture, which is about the dispute over the concept's WP:COMMON name.--Ross Monroe (talk) 21:32, 10 May 2013 (UTC)

Ethnic Villages
How many Ethnic Villages in China?--Kaiyr (talk) 18:28, 4 May 2013 (UTC)
 * You have been asking this question for a really long time! The best academic study that I have found related to your question is this. Most of it is text, but there are a few interesting tables and graphs starting on page 23 that may be of special interest to you. On page 24 the paper states that the total number of all 55 ethnic minorities is 80 million people.Ferox Seneca (talk) 08:52, 12 May 2013 (UTC)

Manchu people: Revision history
Manchu people: Revision history http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Manchu_people&curid=153021&action=history --Kaiyr (talk) 07:48, 12 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Can you tell us what we are supposed to be looking at here? Perhaps you are not looking for help in the right place, or in the right way?Ferox Seneca (talk) 08:17, 12 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Bodinmagosson http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Manchu_people&diff=554679235&oldid=554679148 without reason. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kaiyr (talk • contribs) 10:52, 12 May 2013 (UTC)
 * It looks like you are having an edit war with an IP who is not making an effort to discuss the reason behind their edits. My advice is to attempt to discuss the issue on the article's talk page, and on the IP's talk page. If they do not respond after a few days, apply for semi-protection. If, after semi-protection has expired, the IP still edit wars and refuses to discuss the issue, apply to have him blocked.Ferox Seneca (talk) 05:16, 13 May 2013 (UTC)

Two move requests
I've initiated two (unrelated) move requests at Talk:Kumul, Xinjiang and Talk:Rusticated Youth of China. Your opinion will be appreciated. Best regards, -Zanhe (talk) 08:27, 12 May 2013 (UTC)

International relations of the Republic of China
See WP:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2013_May_12 where the category tree for the ROC is under discussion -- 65.94.76.126 (talk) 00:46, 13 May 2013 (UTC)

Picture map is hard to read
I am unfamiliar on how to edit .svg files, sorry. Thanks, Marasama (talk) 20:03, 13 May 2013 (UTC)
 * The words bleed over each other.
 * The light green is hardly visible in the cyan color. Possibly change the color.
 * which colors? Can you indicate by what it stands for in the legend? (color picker eyedropper will also give you the colorvalue of which colors you mean)
 * The word bleed is caused by Wikipedia itself, it is not a problem inherent to the SVG. If you look at the original SVG image, instead of Wikipedia's rendering of the file, you see no overlapping text. Wikipedia uses a rendering engine to render the SVG into a rasterized PNG file that is used to display on webpages. That rendering engine is known cause problems like this. (Time to file another bug report)
 * -- 65.94.76.126 (talk) 06:02, 14 May 2013 (UTC)

File:Auburn statue.jpg
File:Auburn statue.jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 65.94.76.126 (talk) 06:07, 14 May 2013 (UTC)

Faye Wong's Restless (Faye Wong album)
See talk:Restless (Faye Wong album) where this is again up for renaming -- 65.94.76.126 (talk) 11:47, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

Manchukuo
It's currently being disputed whether Manchukuo was a puppet state or not. At the moment, I'm trying to compile a list of books and academic papers that refer to Manchukuo as a "puppet state". If anyone would like to help with expanding the list, please add a few more sources to the list at Talk:Manchukuo. Thanks. --  李博杰  &#124; —Talk contribs email 02:35, 18 May 2013 (UTC)

List of cities in China by population
A bit of an emergency: An IP in these edits changed all the figures without providing a reference. Plus, there are all these photos I want to add to the table. Wholesale revert? I posted at article talk 23:29, 15 May 2013 but still no response. The page gets 1,000 hits a day, so I want to fix this problem fast. Please advise. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 00:11, 18 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Sourced info trumps unsourced info, right? Just find a source and change it.Ferox Seneca (talk) 05:05, 18 May 2013 (UTC)


 * I just can't find sources. I don't want to move the images into the table until this is resolved. How long should I wait for the IP to return and source his changes? Anna Frodesiak (talk) 06:17, 18 May 2013 (UTC)


 * I found a source here on the 2010 population of every city over 2 million people in China. It sources its information from the UN, and specifies exactly what definition of "city" the figures refer to. I can't find any more recent census data online. I think that if an IP adds something unsourced that you think is questionable and doesn't respond to requests to discuss the edit after 2-3 days, you are justified in reverting. If they disagree and want to discuss it, you can go from there.Ferox Seneca (talk) 18:04, 18 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Thanks for that.


 * I started a thread here: User talk:Qwyrxian, but Q is very busy, so maybe we should centralize the discussion here, or (heaven forbid), ANI. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 21:01, 18 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Per your revert at Yangzhou, Jiangsu, Anna Frodesiak, if no one else objects, I will go through all the prefecture-level and county-level cities and mass revert. GotR Talk 22:00, 18 May 2013 (UTC)

As he is persisting against community consensus, please, let's please centralize discussions at the IP's talk page from now on. Many thanks, Anna Frodesiak (talk) 01:48, 19 May 2013 (UTC)

GotR: Yes, fine by me. Revert as you see fit, but give this a read first in case it makes you change your mind: Talk:List of cities in China by population. Cheers, Anna Frodesiak (talk) 11:00, 19 May 2013 (UTC)