Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Church of the Nazarene/Archive 2

WikiProject Religion
The group indicated above was recently revitalized for, among other things, the purpose of working on those articles whose content is such that the article does not fall within the scope of any particular denomination. To most effectively do this, however, we would benefit greatly if there were at least one member from this Project working on those articles. On that basis, I would encourage and welcome any member of this Project willing to work on those articles to join the Religion WikiProject. Thank you. Badbilltucker 14:49, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Jesus nominated for Article Improvement Drive
I recently found that our article on Jesus is the first page that appears when anyone does a Google search of the subject. It is currently, regrettably, only at GA status. On that basis, I would request any individuals who might be interested in helping to bring this article up to FA status to indicate their support for the article being chosen as the AID article at Article Creation and Improvement Drive. Thank you for your attention. Badbilltucker 18:02, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

New project proposal
There is a new WikiProject task force proposal at WikiProject Council/Proposals that is being proposed to deal specifically with articles whose content relates to several religious traditions. Any editors interested in joining such a group would be more than welcome to indicate their interest there. John Carter 15:09, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Philadelphia: Help requested
I'm working on articles for churches in Philadelphia. This post is to ask for help from anyone willing to write articles about Nazarene churches in Philadelphia. You're the first denomination project that I've solicited for assistance. So any feed back you can give would be greatly appreciated. i.e. Would it be helpful if there was a list of Nazarene churches in Philadelphia for folks to start on? Are there other ides for how to structure this project? Waarmstr 23:37, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

vote for Moses to become a featured article vote
Vote at Featured article candidates/Moses so as too get Moses into a featured article Java7837 23:07, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

What "stories" of the Bible merit separate articles?
There has recently been some discussion regarding which "stories" or portions of the Bible merit having their own articles. For the purposes of centralized discussion, please make any comments at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Bible. Thank you. John Carter 13:42, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Shouldn't that be under another wikiproject? While Nazarenes are Christian, and do hold the Bible in high regard, any here interested in that might do it under other, more ecumenical, auspices. Did you just go around commenting on random denominations' project pages? Aepoutre 14:04, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Not "random" projects. I did however leave this message on the talk pages of all the Christian and Jewish projects, considering that the discussion was sparked by an article about the Bible created by a member of the Jehovah's Witnesses WikiProject about a verse of the Bible they find particularly relevant, so it seemed reasonable to advise any projects which might be interested in creating similar articles of the discussion. John Carter 14:09, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Good call, I suppose. Like I said, if we were more ecumenical in our focus, you'd want to hear from Nazarenes, Baptists, &c. in addition to hearing JW input. Is there a broader wikiproject for this? Just between you and me (obviously a joke, since this is a talk page, haha), I don't know if the naz wikiproject is organized enough to make it an initiative, but I hope someone here picks up on your proposal. So what's this discussion about? Aepoutre 16:21, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Basically, an editor created an article about Psalm 83:18 on the basis of that verse being a "proof text" for the JW's about the name of Jehovah. If we had had an article about Psalm 83 already, I don't doubt it would have been added to that page. We didn't. So far as I can see, we actually don't have separate articles on most of the major stories of the Bible, although we clearly could. I posted it on the talk page of the WikiProject Bible partially in an attempt to get a bit more interest in that project, and in it's work of creating articles about the Bible. I hope that the discussion might prompt the creation of a few such articles, maybe getting a few more members there, and in establishing at least a basic guideline on what sort of articles should exist. John Carter 16:43, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

WikiProject COTN tag
I propose that we change the image in the tag from Bresee to the COTN seal. Seems less idolatrous and more appropriate for an accross-the-board COTN. Bresee isn't the only contributor to the COTN, founder or not, and the Seal/symbol was created to represent the COTN in the first place. Please weigh in. Aepoutre 17:28, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

I make a similar proposal for the UserBox. Perhaps then I'll add it to my userpage. Aepoutre 17:42, 8 August 2007 (UTC)


 * No objections, if we have the required public domain copy of the seal available. John Carter 18:57, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Nazarene.org has pages filled with logos for download (http://www.nazarene.org/churchresources/display.aspx), but I'm not quite sure how to get my hands on a public domain copy. Aepoutre 20:30, 8 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Has anyone else made any progress? Is this deemed important enough? Aepoutre 18:45, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

Well, the number to headquarters is (816)333-7000, I'd imagine that someone with time from 7am to 5pm(HQ uses flex scheduling) could call and ask. (that's GMT -0600 by the way.) (69.76.197.156 23:04, 29 August 2007 (UTC))


 * Hm, well there are those logos for download. I wonder if that's an open offer for their use...? Aepoutre 03:51, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

How about this:


 * Not good. Please see Non-free content criteria exemptions. According to that page, non-free content, including low-res reproductions of copyrighted images, are "never to be used on templates". That's why I specified only free images could be used. John Carter 00:06, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

Gotcha. Thanks for the explanation! How would I know an image is copyrighted or not? And of what significance is it that the COTN website has a list of all these seals for download? None, perhaps, though I know little about the matter. Thanks again. Aepoutre 00:18, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Basically, the best way to know if an image is copyrighted is to click on the image and see if the image page indicates that it has a copyright or not. And there's a big difference between making an image available and having it copyrighted, unfortunately. If they have a copyright, it might just mean for purposes of ensuring that noone misuses the image. Unforunately, our own policies demand that they be public domain images. That's why I think maybe an image of the founder, or maybe of the church HQ(?), might be about the only other kind of image we could use. John Carter 01:13, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

Nazarene Publishing House has a "clip art" section see FAQ http://www.nph.com/nphweb/html/nph/FAQ.jsp?faqsection=CLIPS&faqsection2=NPH-TOP I'd say that constitutes permission. (65.66.146.33 15:33, 14 September 2007 (UTC))


 * Waiting for a response atWikipedia talk:Public domain image resources. My guess is that the statements there are sufficient, but I want some sort of semi-official indication before we go ahead with using them. Good work finding the page. John Carter 18:57, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

Class-importance rating glitch
I would like to express concern that our rating/importance statistics table does not display low-importance articles. Furthermore, articles with low-priority are filed under unknown-importance rather than low-importance. Something is rather wrong with the system here, if this is taking place. I am unaware as to who might fix the problem, but I want to call attention to it, so as to see it corrected. Aepoutre 18:44, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
 * If you are aware of any articles where this rating has been assigned, I could try to solve the matter there. John Carter 20:14, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

If you go to the category for nazarene articles of unknown-importance, or even the assessment page for editorial board and look at the stats to use that link for "none" in reference to importance assessment, you can just check the talk pages for articles with importance ratings that still show up as unknown in the stats table and the category for unknown. Aepoutre 21:14, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I just did on Aguiar Valvassoura. It should be noted that this banner doesn't use "priority=", but "importance=". That article had priority, and it has been replaced. I'll work on the others now as well. John Carter 21:20, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

Goodlettsville Church of the Nazarene, Goodlettsville, Tennessee
The above article has been prodded on the basis of lack of declaration of notability. Anyone who can indicate whether the subject does meet notability requirements is encouraged to do so. Thank you. John Carter 23:46, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

naz school template
{Navbox }
 * Name = Nazarene liberal arts colleges and regions
 * Title = Nazarene liberal arts colleges regions
 * List1 = Ambrose (Canada) • Eastern Nazarene (Eastern USA) • MidAmerican Nazarene (North Central USA) • Mount Vernon (East Central USA) • Northwest Nazarene (Northwest USA) • Olivet Nazarene (Central USA) • Point Loma Nazarene (Southwest USA) • Southern Nazarene (South Central USA) • Trevecca Nazarene (Southeastern USA)
 * Category = Category:Education navigational templates Category:Nazarene Higher Education

Do we like? I'm not sure how to officially create it... Aepoutre 04:30, 25 September 2007 (UTC)
 * The thing to do is to find any other existing similar template, copy it onto a blank page, and then replace the existing text with the text you want. That's what I basically did with Template:COTN schools. I know it can use some additional work, particularly regarding the image, but it's the best I can come up with quickly. I will try to add an extra image though. John Carter 22:05, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

I see. No offence, but I like my idea more. Bias, maybe, yours is more like the large side boxes for series on religion, and mine is more like the Annapolis Group or Ivy League templates that you put at the bottom. I suppose I could just paste it, but I suppose it's just that I don't know how to make it a Template rather than an article... If it's okay with you, we might change what you have to this, but use the same page? Aepoutre 14:50, 27 September 2007 (UTC)
 * The only qualm I have about the proposed box is that it in virtually every school name refers to some entirity (East Central Province) for instance, seems to point toward a subsection of the article Nazarene International Education Association regarding the "regions" designated to each of these schools. Those regions are not specifically defined anywhere that I can see, making the addition of the "regions" sections potentially problematic. If information is included which cannot be currently explained to the general reader by current content, then it would at the very least be potentially seen as as being contrary to the guideline of Explain jargon, by placing such prominence on things which are not currently explained anywhere in wikipedia. Now, were there some content anywhere which defined those regions, and made it clearer why they are important, that would be different. Also, given the existing content indicating that these regions are basically seemingly only relevant to recruitment, there could be some concerns that such a template might be seen as being questionable under WP:ADVERT. I could try to structue a box similar to the one you proposed, but I regret to say that the Template:Arianism, which I copied to create the template above, is the only other one I have ever been involved in, and so I'm not real sure of my own abilities in this regard. John Carter 15:10, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

Very good points. Yes, we need an article on Naz Higher Ed or something, and a piece on what exactly the regions mean. They only involve recruitment because its part of the hierarchical structure of the church, and therefore the association (with affects funds, students, and various events) between the church and its regional institution. There are local churches, zones, districts, and regions. There are Pastors, District Superintendents, General Superintendents, etc. So it's not ADVERT issues, because it has more to do with structure than advertising, but there are coloured maps of the regional breakdowns everytime I've mentioned a region in an article, and there is a section in each school article on the boundaries of its region and the districts it includes. There is only one article thus far on a Nazarene district and I'd like to keep it, though I'd delete any individual church that had an article, because no one church is that notable. I hope this explains somewhat. I initially thought of it because I wanted the title of the template to have a wikilink for the "regions" but there was no article for it as yet. And I'll have to get around to it, if no one else does. In fact, I'm not sure where I'd find detailed sources other than the maps that I have and my own knowledge of the system. To be honest, while I grew up Nazarene, remain Nazarene, and commend the church for its desire to establish structure, portions of the church have always been more congregationalist (almost anti-federalist) and so structure isn't always easy to define though it certainly exists. Aepoutre 15:19, 27 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Right now, I'm kind of pushing myself in a couple of areas, but I intend to spend most of the weekend looking for info on the Arians and a few other subjects, and I can check to see if there are any books relating to the regions which I can use as a source for an article on the subject. It may not be much of an article, but it would at least have subsections for each reason which could be linked to in the template, and that would probably be enough to qualify in anyone's eyes. John Carter 15:31, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

Hey, I also forgot to mention that the regions are specific to the liberal arts schools. The seminaries and bible colleges aren't associated with regions. They get funds from the general church, I believe. The Nazarene system just affiliations in name like I've seen in most Christian colleges. They are intended to be part of the Nazarene structure and, education being as important an initiative in the church as it is, that's why schools receive funds (kind of the like state providing state funds for state schools, or offering state tuition/scholarships for in-state students). Thanks. I don't know when I can get to it, as I'm traveling right now, but I'll try. Aepoutre 15:37, 27 September 2007 (UTC)