Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Horse racing/Archive 13

Robin des Champs
The article for Robin des Champs is the subject of a deletion discussion, if anyone wants to comment.--Bcp67 (talk) 06:46, 5 December 2018 (UTC)

2019
As I'll be having a break from editing for a few days, I'd like to wish everyone on the horse racing project a Happy New Year and a good 2019 - if you're a punter, may it bring you many winners at fancy prices, and if you aren't, hopefully an enjoyable year following the sport! --Bcp67 (talk) 12:36, 27 December 2018 (UTC)

Wikipedia result of Google search
I did a Google search: for Cudgel and got this: Cudgel Horse Description Cudgel was an American two-time Champion Thoroughbred racehorse. Owned by J. K. L. Ross and trained by future U.S. Racing Hall of Fame inductee H. Guy Bedwell, Cudgel is probably best remembered for ... Wikipedia Born: 1914, United States of America Species: Equus caballus Children: Fluvanna Trainer: H. Guy Bedwell Parents: Broomstick Sex: Stallion Breeder: Harry Payne Whitney

I have no idea how or who provides the info, but "Children" instead of Progeny needs to be fixed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Stretchrunner (talk • contribs) 16:05, 2 January 2019 (UTC)
 * What makes you think that it comes from Wikipedia? Our article Cudgel (horse) has "Foaled" instead of "Born"; "United States" instead of "United States of America"; "Sire" and "Dam" instead of "Parents"; and does not mention either "Species", "Equus caballus" or "Children" at all. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 00:10, 3 January 2019 (UTC)
 * That's a weird Google script that translates Wikipedia's designation "offspring" into children. There's nothing we can do on this end. Froggerlaura  ribbit |undefined 02:24, 3 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Redrose, what you got is the standard google info on the left of the search page but on the right, a box appears as I described with "Children" and with "Wikipedia" as a link which does take you to the Cudgel (horse) page at Wikipedia. Every Wikipedia horse related page has this type of box on the right of the Google result, i.e. Zenyatta, Justify (horse), Eddie Arcaro and on and on. I have to wonder why a third party would spend big bucks to give only a link to Wikipedia? Stretchrunner (talk) 15:34, 3 January 2019 (UTC)

Gun Runner GA review
The article Gun Runner (horse) was nominated for a GA last year. I reviewed it a few months ago, but the nominator seems to have disappeared. Would anyone be interested in working on it? Most of the changes I suggested were not too major, aside from adding a statistics chart. Thanks! Sportsfan77777 (talk) 06:29, 21 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Sure, I'll look into it. Jlvsclrk (talk) 04:12, 22 January 2019 (UTC)

A new newsletter directory is out!
A new Newsletter directory has been created to replace the old, out-of-date one. If your WikiProject and its taskforces have newsletters (even inactive ones), or if you know of a missing newsletter (including from sister projects like WikiSpecies), please include it in the directory! The template can be a bit tricky, so if you need help, just post the newsletter on the template's talk page and someone will add it for you.
 * – Sent on behalf of Headbomb. 03:11, 11 April 2019 (UTC)

Category:Equestrian museums has been nominated for discussion
Category:Equestrian museums, which is within the scope of this WikiProject, has been nominated for renaming to Equestrian museums and halls of fame. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. RevelationDirect (talk) 02:28, 12 April 2019 (UTC)

Senior Senator
I don't know how many of you follow timber racing here in the U.S. Senior Senator, who was on 60 Minutes a couple years ago, just won his third Maryland Hunt Cup about two hours ago, only one of eight horses to do so. He's tied with Jay Trump now and has won one more than Ben Nevis (horse). He also won his third Grand National in Maryland on the 20th. I'd say it is pretty notable. Quite a journey from failure on flat racing to such success in timber racing. dawnleelynn(talk) 21:16, 27 April 2019 (UTC)


 * Results and pictures:


 * Heads up, CBS is airing a special on timber racing tomorrow night. dawnleelynn(talk) 06:23, 28 April 2019 (UTC)


 * Sorry, CBS pulled the segment that night due to important news on the border control issues. They do that a lot.dawnleelynn(talk) 20:06, 30 April 2019 (UTC)


 * The latest news on Senior Senator was published on June 20, 2019. The "9-year-old's connections are considering shipping the American steeplechase champion to race next season in England." in this article: . Senior Senator may go for a fourth Maryland Hunt Cup next summer, and if he wins he would be the first. "Senior Senator won his third Maryland Hunt Cup this spring, retiring the Challenge Cup for owner Skip Crawford." Senior Senator is only one of six horses in the history of the race to win it three times including Jay Trump. Ben Nevis is also an undefeated winner of the race. dawnleelynn(talk) 18:04, 6 July 2019 (UTC)


 * I forgot to mention he has also won the Grand National Timber Stakes three times as well. dawnleelynn(talk) 19:01, 11 July 2019 (UTC)

Peter Miller (trainer)
Is it okay to use this non-specific title instead of horse trainer? Stretchrunner (talk) 22:45, 29 April 2019 (UTC)


 * I would use horse trainer myself....William, is the complaint department really on the roof? 22:49, 29 April 2019 (UTC)
 * I would use trainer unless there was a diambiguation issue. In the UK it's "trainer" or possibly "racehorse trainer", but rarely "horse trainer".  Tigerboy1966  21:14, 30 April 2019 (UTC)
 * The trouble with that is there are many different types of trainers....William, is the complaint department really on the roof? 12:48, 1 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Few that use the title, though. Montanabw (talk) 02:26, 8 May 2019 (UTC)

Horse halls of fame category deletion
There is a movement to delete most, if not all, hall of fame inductee categories underway. Currently, there is a category discussion going on regarding the AQHA and NHCA categories here: Categories for discussion/Log/2019 April 27. I have located at least six more horse halls of fame including one for Thoroughbreds that could come up for delete/listify in the future. You are welcome to comment here. However, more importantly is the discussion of the halls of fame in general that was opened up here recently: Wikipedia talk:Categories for discussion. — Preceding unsigned comment added by dawnleelynn (talk • contribs)
 * Update: The categories were saved the other day, and the CfDs were closed. dawnleelynn(talk) 17:53, 6 July 2019 (UTC)

2019 Kentucky Derby
With Omaha Beach's scratch, there's only one horse in the Derby with an article: Game Winner. We might have to scramble to get the winner's article up - I've got a funny feeling the string of favorite's winning is about to be broken. Anyways, if anyone wants to get something going in advance, the remaining favorites are:
 * Roadster - G1 with the Santa Anita Derby
 * Improbable - G1 with the Los Al Futurity
 * Maximum Security - G1 with the Florida Derby
 * Tacitus - G2 with the Wood Memorial and Risen Star
 * Vekoma - G2 with the Blue Grass Jlvsclrk (talk) 01:57, 2 May 2019 (UTC)

Important CfD discussion
Up for deletion: Categories_for_discussion/Log/2019_May_5. Project members may wish to weigh in on this discussion. Montanabw (talk) 02:26, 8 May 2019 (UTC)

Rachael Blackmore
When a horse racing/jockey article is requested is there a notification here? Rachael Blackmore has been requested with a couple of sources. She has rode grade 1 winners at Cheltenham (Minella Indo), Fairyhouse (Honeysuckle) & Punchestown (Minella Indo). She came 2nd to Paul Townend in the Irish National Hunt Jockey Championship with 90 winners from 615 races in the 2018/19 season. She also rode 2 winners at the Cheltenham Festival earlier this year. (78.17.116.81 (talk) 16:24, 14 May 2019 (UTC))
 * I don't think there is a notification here for requested new articles, but she is well worth an article, definitely. Should be plenty of sources about her as well, a good deal of media coverage. I think she is notably the first female professional jump jockey in Ireland as well.--Bcp67 (talk) 20:03, 14 May 2019 (UTC)

Policy: use of foreign language accents in English Wikipedia article titles
Jockey Jacinto Vasquez was moved to Jacinto Vásquez. This resulted in 3 or 4 articles properly linked but dozens more are redirects. This also happened with José A. Vélez Jr. For editors like me it certainly slows things down while yielding no apparent benefit. If this is allowed, then there will be hundreds of thousands of people/places/things affected in multiple languages. I couldn't find what the English Wikipedia policy is on this. Stretchrunner (talk) 10:23, 22 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Slows what things down? The presence of a diacritic in the title of an article has an infinitesimally small effect on the time it takes to retrieve the page, it's one or two more bytes out of several thousand. If diacritics created any sort of problem there would be a policy against them, but there isn't (see MOS:DIACRITICS); hence we have articles like Elemér Berkessy, Slaven Bilić, Ramón Díaz, Sven-Göran Eriksson, Quique Sánchez Flores, Rémi Garde, José Manuel Gomes, José Mourinho or Arsène Wenger. But see WP:CHEAP, WP:NOTBROKEN and WP:DWAP. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 13:05, 22 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Sorry, if I didn't make myself clear: it slows the editor down who, in most cases, has done an enormous amount of research before creating an article. I do not want to be obligated to check names of anyone who might not be "English", there are just too many. Example, just in North America are the Louisiana French who have a large number here at Wikipedia including horse racing, plus the influx over the decades of those from South America. Exactly how would a unilingual English speaker know which accent to insert in the name when searching if 1) there is no existing article, or 2) the article was created with an accent but no English redirect was done? I speak/read French, but 99.99999% of English-speakers worldwide do not. What happens if someone unknowingly posts a name without a link and without an accent and does it in 20-30 horse races (or whatever) and then someone creates an article with the accent included? They then have to start searching for all the possible English files. Article titles, in my opinion, should only be in English. The first line of the article should show the accented name. Hence, we avoid long frustrating delays. Note what I said about the Jacinto Vásquez article, the person who changed it to having an accent didn't bother to fix all the links. Yet, when I did a name change I got a message from someone telling me I must change all the links. I did and almost daily I fix other peoples links. Just look at my contributions. But what happens if they don't follow the message guideline to fix links? It is not insulting to anyone if their accent isn't in the article name, simple courtesy says put it in the article. Thanks for your input. Stretchrunner (talk) 15:59, 22 May 2019 (UTC)
 * You don't need to fix links, see WP:NOTBROKEN. But if you want to create a policy against diacritics in article titles, it could not be restricted to horse racing (see WP:LOCALCONSENSUS) and since it would affect everything, the place to propose it would be WP:VPP. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 18:14, 22 May 2019 (UTC)
 * This was left on my Talk page:
 * There should be no links to disambiguation pages, so now that you made Clyde Phillips a dab page, would you please follow up and fix all the incoming links? (Dabfix and Dabsolver are helpful.) Thanks. — Gorthian (talk) 20:44, 9 August 2018 (UTC)


 * I'd be glad to. Can you tell me how I find them? Stretchrunner (talk) 02:19, 10 August 2018 (UTC)


 * Just go to the page and use the “what links here” link (under “Tools”) on the left side to find out what links to it. Then plug each page into Dabsolver to find and fix the link. (Dabfix won’t help until about a day after your edits.)And just for future reference, don’t post the same thing in more than one place. Usually when I leave a message on someone’s talk page, I’ve also put that page on my watchlist, so I will notice when an answer is posted. — Gorthian (talk) 03:53, 10 August 2018 (UTC)
 * --- Stretchrunner (talk) 20:50, 22 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Dab pages are not redirects. When a page has a title without diacritics, and it is moved to a name that does have diacritics, a redirect is left behind at the old name. If a page has links to the old name, they will continue to work because of that redirect. Linking to a redirect is valid; linking to a dab page normally is not valid. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 22:39, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

Question - technical stuff
I use this in a race table but would like to use it in sentences but when I do 1 $1/16$ it is all shrunk. Is there way to end the font size after the fraction? Thanks. Stretchrunner (talk) 16:17, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
 * 1 $1/16$ works — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jlvsclrk (talk • contribs)
 * Much appreciated.Stretchrunner (talk) 23:59, 7 July 2019 (UTC)

Upgrading Native Dancer
I'm starting an upgrade to Native Dancer (rather shockingly brief right now) and invite everyone to join in. I'm going through the New York Times archives for racing details, then I can move on to his influence as a stallion via American Classic Pedigrees and the Bloodhorse. As the grandsire of both Mr. P and Northern Dancer (as broodmare sire), I dare say he's just about ubiquitous. If you've got any angles you think should be specifically covered and/or any cool sources, let me know! Jlvsclrk (talk) 23:28, 18 July 2019 (UTC)
 * I've done my bit with the Dancer - anyone care to give it a good copy edit? Thanks in advance. Jlvsclrk (talk) 22:24, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

Infobox - "Jockey" to be removed
The Infobox in the General Duke (horse) article has a place to insert a "Jockey" which I think should not be used as it is misleading and could be 99% incorrect. The number of times (even 100 years ago when stable owners bought & sold a jockey's contract) is extremely rare when a horse had one person as its only rider. Owners/trainers alternate jockeys for "best fit", etc. plus change jockey due to suspension, injury, poor performance etc. of a jockey. Example: Citation's regular jockey was Albert Snider who was scheduled to ride him in the Triple Crown races. Snider's death opened the door to Calumet's then second-string rider Eddie Arcaro. (Note that in a newspaper interview trainer Jimmy Jones said Snider was "a great rider, just as good as Eddie Arcaro." Stretchrunner (talk) 14:34, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

Covfefe
Covfefe (horse) earned her G1 today in the Test today, beating Kentucky Oaks winner Serengeti Empress. Cleverly named filly by Into Mischief out of Antics. Brilliantly fast - set a track record at Pimlico a few months back. Can't decide though if she's article worthy yet: G1 seems like a lower threshold in America than Europe sometimes. Jlvsclrk (talk) 21:36, 3 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Late to the party, the BC win cinched it. But for future reference, I’d say the backstory on her name also contributes to meeting WP:GNG, which “trumps” (cough) our NHORSERACING guidelines.   Montanabw (talk) 21:56, 16 November 2019 (UTC)

Input please - proposed subsections for Category: National Museum of Racing and Hall of Fame
Currently people and horses are all in the single category. Should we consider two categories for horses & persons or even several categories from those in the Contents section on the National Museum of Racing and Hall of Fame page? 15:35, 18 October 2019 (UTC)


 * Probably should be handled like other hall of fame lists and each award in a separate subsection.  Montanabw (talk) 21:53, 16 November 2019 (UTC)

Request for information on WP1.0 web tool
Hello and greetings from the maintainers of the WP 1.0 Bot! As you may or may not know, we are currently involved in an overhaul of the bot, in order to make it more modern and maintainable. As part of this process, we will be rewriting the web tool that is part of the project. You might have noticed this tool if you click through the links on the project assessment summary tables.

We'd like to collect information on how the current tool is used by....you! How do you yourself and the other maintainers of your project use the web tool? Which of its features do you need? How frequently do you use these features? And what features is the tool missing that would be useful to you? We have collected all of these questions at this Google form where you can leave your response. Walkerma (talk) 04:24, 27 October 2019 (UTC)

Project member input, please
I rarely AfD anything, but I did for this: Articles for deletion/Terje Dahl. Would value input from other project members. Montanabw (talk) 22:44, 16 November 2019 (UTC)