Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Irish republicanism/Archive 1

Failte! Welcome!
Alright, everyone. I asked for it, and recieved enough support that I believe this project is worth it. Come out ye Fennians all! Let us do or die!  Erin Go Bragh  08:58, 4 February 2007 (UTC)
 * I thought this group was about writing articles on the IRA, not supporting it. Logoistic 00:42, 5 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Your thoughts were correct. I use quite a bit of fanciful language like that, out of habit. I do refrain from it in articles, though. [[Image:NonFreeImageRemoved.svg|20 px]] Erin Go Bragh  03:08, 5 February 2007 (UTC)
 * By which, I mean of course, adding ourselves to the Participants list, and start collaborating! [[Image:NonFreeImageRemoved.svg|20 px]] Erin Go Bragh  03:09, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

Banner
As you can see, I've been bold and used Image:NonFreeImageRemoved.svg for out Banner. I love the flag, and would propose it as sort of an official image for out WikiProject.  Erin Go Bragh  09:18, 4 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Might I suggest an alternative image, namely [[Image:Ie pres.png|100px]] ? This flag symbolises Irish republicanism and is an "official" flag, as opposed to the current flag, which feels something like a caricature.  gaillimh  Conas tá tú? 23:51, 4 February 2007 (UTC)
 * I think the symbol we already have symbolises Irish republicanism and nationalism more than the one suggested by Galway.--Vintagekits 23:57, 4 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I don't think the President's personal standard really represents Irish republicanism. I just plain like the one we're using; it's got lots of symbolism in it, and it has my name! ; ) [[Image:NonFreeImageRemoved.svg|20 px]] Erin Go Bragh  02:59, 5 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I'm not quite sure how your name is relevant to the discussion. While we're on the topic however, it might be of interest for you to know that Swift's parents were English-born and he had actually spoken out against the idea of a united Ireland.  That is to say, he was most certainly not a nationalist.  Back to the subject at hand however, the flag is most definitely a symbol of republicanism.  If you prefer, the Leinster flag would work just as well (it looks a bit like your favoured flag). In as far as having "Erin Go Bragh" included on the banner, I'd have to be opposed to that, as the phrase itself is not used in Ireland and is a caricature created by Irish-Americans.   gaillimh  Conas tá tú? 03:50, 5 February 2007 (UTC)


 * My name fits into the discussion as a bit of light-heartedness, trying to keep goodwill among us through the use of humour. Aside from that, and Swift (who's name I've always admired, both from how it rolls off, and because of the man's literature, and willingness to point out absurdities in the society around him, regardless of how he acted/his politics), and Swift's English parents, my impression of the phrase is that it's used by Irish Nationalists in many places, regardless of where they live. I do recall the tale of several Irish regiments in the U.S. Civil War who fought and died under the banner of Erin Go Bragh, because their families were starving in Ireland and they had to come over to America. The same tale goes on to mention quite a bit of a plan thought out by one of the U.S. generals, who decided he was going to raise a Fenian Army from the American Irish, and go and liberate his homeland. Unfortunately, not many people supported his idea. But, I digress.


 * You mentioned on my talk page that you'd not label yourself an active participant, but your opinion is still, of course, just as valid. I really like the sybolism contained in the Erin Go Bragh flag. It is distinctly representative of Irish Nationalism. The Leinster flag is representative of Leinster, as well as Ireland as a whole sometimes, while the Presidential standard is representative of the Irish government. Since we're focusing on a non-governmental movement, that's been outlawed by said government, I think it illogical to use the latter, while for the former, the Erin Go Bragh flag simply has more to it. Again, just my thoughts.  Erin Go Bragh talk 08:44, 5 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I think the Erin Go Bragh flag, Leinster flag or any of these:
 * [[Image:Flag_of_Ireland.svg|50px]] - [[Image:Arklowflag.svg|50px]] - Bad Title Example.png - [[Image:CIAFLAG2.jpg|50px]] - [[Image:StarryPlough.svg|50px]]
 * Would be good choices. I don't agree with the presidential flag though, largely as the presidents of the republic haven't ever really been republican. -- Pauric ( talk-contributions ) 18:11, 5 February 2007 (UTC)


 * The fragmented flag from the first republic was actually the other one I considered when making the banner. I would've put it all up to a vote/consent/discussion in the first place, but everyone who mentioned an interest in the thing to me said that they'd like to take part if such a Projet were set up, so I went ahead and did what I thought was involved in doing such a thing. Getting things moving and all that! If the flag's really a big problem, I don't care as much about that as actually forming a group of editors interested in writing about the IRA and Irish nationalism.  Erin Go Bragh talk 00:14, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't really mind which flag we use, put my personal preference would be the flag of the 1st republic. Derry Boi 19:58, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
 * As the scope of the project remains that of the IRA, I have gone ahead and changed the banner image to reflect the IRA a bit more. Using the Leinster flag with an Irish-American phrase is not only a misuse of the Leinster flag and what the province stands for, but also the image itself did not at all reflect the IRA, especially given the "Erin go Bragh" business.    gaillimh  Conas tá tú? 22:47, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Dont like it - I propose this - Bad Title Example.png - thoughts?--Vintagekits 22:49, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Please see WP:IDONTLIKEIT  gaillimh  Conas tá tú? 22:51, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
 * I like the poster and its not a case of WP:IDONTLIKEIT, I just think the Bad Title Example.png would be more apt and represents what this project is about a lot more. Sligeach abú!!!--Vintagekits 22:54, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
 * the Erin go Bragh flag is differnt from the flag of Leinster read this and the IRA picture is more assocaited with the modern IRA -- Barry    talk  22:56, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
 * The flag over the GPO was the culmination of the hundreds of years of resistance and republicanism since then see's itself by and large as a jumping off point from that day. Thats the only reason I suggest the GPO flag, its kinds of a point that draws everything together. However, I am happy for Galways poster to remain until the name of this project is changed from IRA to Irish republicanism--Vintagekits 22:59, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
 * As mentioned to Vintagekits on our respective talk pages, I'd be happy with the 1916 flag if/when the scope of the project expands a bit to include the broader ideal of republicanism.   gaillimh  Conas tá tú? 23:04, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
 * mibees ya shud make yer mark her den!--Vintagekits 23:08, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Ah, thanks! I wasn't sure if it would have been redundant, as I made the original suggestion.  There it is though.  Cheers   gaillimh  Conas tá tú? 23:12, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

Hello everyone. I have some concerns about the banner. Would'nt the flag of the first republic, however battered, be much more approprite? The words Eirn go Bragh on it comes across as a dated Americanism. It was a phrase used on flags carried by Irish regiments in the service of the USA (and sometimes the CSA) during their civil war. And as such, had noting to do with the Irish republican movement beyond that its bearers were Irish. Also the first republic flag actually has the approprite words on it.
 * Moved this up from a discussion from below -

Also: the banner is not only the arms of Leinster, it is the coat of arms of the head of the MacMurrogh-Kavanagh clan. As such it is personal property and cannot be used in the present context. Fergananim 14:06, 15 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I agree. The Erin go Bragh thing gives me bad flashbacks to Boston St. Patrick's Day violence and the awful dying of the Chicago River (*cringe*). I support changing the banner. Also, it's looking like consensus is leaning clearly towards changing the name.  Given this, I would also prefer the 1916 flag.  I think it's inclusive and won't set people off the way some of the other options obviously do.  ~ Kathryn NicDhàna  ♫ ♦ ♫ 00:12, 16 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Right I am going to be bold then and drop the axe!--Vintagekits 00:18, 16 February 2007 (UTC)
 * I've amended the userbox, though I think it still needs to be renamed or moved, and I forget what has to happen with the category. I'll look into it a bit later if no one else gets to it first.  ~ Kathryn NicDhàna  ♫ ♦ ♫ 00:43, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Hi all, Ive just created 2 pages, one on Seamus Clarke and one on Marion Coyle. I am only new to this site so if you have any ways of improving these articles or advice it would be much appreciated Cheers.--MarkyMarkDCU 19:11, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

INLA
Do groups such as the Irpies, or the political groups fall under this scope? -- Pauric ( talk-contributions ) 21:57, 4 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I'd say yes to the INLA. They're an armed republican group in Ireland. As for political groups, like the "political wings" of the various IRAs, I'm not sure. I'd venture to say "Yes, why not?", but it does take some consideration, I guess. [[Image:NonFreeImageRemoved.svg|20 px]] Erin Go Bragh  02:57, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

Change of name and of focus
Hi there! I'd love to collaborate with some of you on writing articles pertaining to Irish nationalism. However, to avoid some potential conflict down the road, might I humbly suggest changing the name of the WikiProject to WikiProject Irish Nationalism, WikiProject Irish Republicanism, or a similar derivitave. The IRA, while an important and necessary part of Irish nationalism, does not encapsulate the entire ideal, and might appear contentious, especially given the recent steps towards peace. A less contentious name might attract more users to participate, as well! Just a thought. Sláinte! gaillimh Conas tá tú? 22:01, 4 February 2007 (UTC)
 * I'd like to suggest that this project change to being Wikiproject Irish Republicanism, and make sure that all people with an interest in the subject take part. There's a danger with projects like these that they become perceived as an organisation to put forward an Irish Republican point of view; because of neutral point of view that often results in someone stepping up to close the whole thing down. Sam Blacketer 23:18, 4 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Probably a good idea, just IRA to limiting imo.--Vintagekits 23:47, 4 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I started the project to collaborate on articles directly related to the IRA. While I'd love to see collaboration on other aspects or Irish nationalism and republicanism, I must stress that the initial objective of the project was to collaborate on articles related to the Irish Republican Army. As I mentioned when Gaillimh brought up the same thing on my own talk page:


 * The lines I added to the page about including broader topics such as Irish Nationalism and Irish Republicanism were much more of an afterthought. I'd love to see people working on other aspects of Irish Nationalism, but I'd really like to use this WikiProject to focus on the IRA. If the project does widen a bit, I don't quite see why the name would have to change. I wouldn't say no outright, but I really feel like WP:IRA is an excellent title! It's short, catchy, easy to remember, and it's got such a nice shortcut!


 * I don't quite understand the motivation for a change in name. Does it really matter that much? If some of us feel like we want to use this space to collaborate on other aspects of Irish nationalism & Irish republicanism, does that really require us to change the name of our project?  Erin Go Bragh  03:19, 5 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Yes, I think it does require that. With a name like this it looks like we're just a bunch of fenians writing propoganda about a pile o' terrorists. Whereas if it's nationalism/republicanism it still allows us to write indepth about about all the same topics, but not looking so concenrated and biased towards the RA. -- Pauric ( talk-contributions ) 18:38, 5 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I still don't understand how devotion to an ideal seems less bias/crazy than to a group of organizations, but I'll stop blocking consensus here. It seems everyone else is in favor of changing the name, and so be it. Let us put it to consensus, for the record.  Erin Go Bragh talk 00:24, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

Support

 * 1) Of course this is what I'd prefer. But if it comes to it, I won't block consensus. I'd prefer Republicanism over Nationalism.  Erin Go Bragh talk 00:24, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
 * 2) I would cautiously support this original name in what could be a minefield of pro and anti POV. Is this project going to focus on 1798, 1916 (and the intervening time), Civil war, Emergency and the Early PIRA and the "troubles"? Or, is it going to be concentrating on the more recent Organised crime disguised as Political activism aspect? Wholeheartedly support the first but not the last. Brendandh 19:16, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

Support

 * 1)  ~ Kathryn NicDhàna  ♫ ♦ ♫ 06:44, 7 February 2007 (UTC) - From the discussion above, and the discussion on the MfD page, I'd say this option is the one most likely to gain consensus acceptance.  While I am fine with the project having "IRA" in the title, I can understand the concerns that have been raised.  I would be happy with this name as an alternative.
 * Comment/Updating - If we are now expanding the scope of the project: We do need to broaden the name.  ~ Kathryn NicDhàna  ♫ ♦ ♫ 00:29, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
 * 1) --Vintagekits 10:02, 7 February 2007 (UTC), I also am fine with all, however, this title gives it a more inclusive and wide scope to bring in related articles.
 * 2) -- Pauric ( talk-contributions ) 18:40, 7 February 2007 (UTC) Agree with vintagekits and Kathryn, already voiced my opinions on this above on page.
 * 3) -- One Night In Hackney 06:56, 11 February 2007 (UTC) Will probably cause less problems in the long run, and also allows us to claim more articles under our scope.
 * 4) -- Fergananim 14:19, 15 February 2007 (UTC) Something of this size and scope with IRA in the title is both limiting (which is why I did'nt sign up) and would cause long-term trouble. While I understand Eire's points, it must be understood that such words, images and symbols will have very different and immediate effect on those of us here in Ireland. Which is why I welcome his consensual approach. By the way, the banner is actally the flag of Lenister and the coat of arms of the head of the Clan MacMurrough-Kavanagh, and as such the above use is a violation of civic and personal property.
 * 5) --  gaillimh  Conas tá tú? 23:11, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

Collaboration
So, assuming that some more of these expected people are coming into this Project, how about that Collaboration? WikiProject Ireland has a collaboration article for every week/month something like that. It seems like a good idea to me! If anyone else is interested, I'd like to start a similar collaborative effort for this WikiProject. I've nominated Michael Collins for collaboration on our Project Page, whatever that may mean.  Erin Go Bragh talk 09:06, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

Template :IRAs
I've been trying to get some input over at Template talk:IRAs, as to whether the template should be inclusive of groups such as the new ONH and the INLA, who, like CIRA and RIRA (already listed on the template), are "splinter" groups descended from other IRA organizations, and are armed Irish republican groups with quite similar goals, if they do disagree on the means to the end. Anyway, I finally got one response, and I'd appreciate it some others would give their input; two people can argue forever without coming to a conclusion, you know.  Erin Go Bragh talk 00:19, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

MfD Explanation
Hi again, fellows! After some initial discussion and further thought, I feel as though a WikiProject about such a contentious subject as the IRA does not conform to WP:NPOV. Please feel free to weigh in here. Thanks  gaillimh  Conas tá tú? 03:32, 6 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Agreed. David Lauder 18:52, 9 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Agreed. I'm into the history but it's too easy for POV disputes to flare up. You spend all day adding a paragraph with refs and then someone removes it or the whole page is locked. If Erin go Bragh wants a web page on this subject, it doesn't necessarily belong on wikipedia; hope to be proved wrong there anyways. Many of these groups in 2007 are tiny and family-based and unpopular. Would you list all the militia groups in the USA or yardie groups in Jamaica on wikipedia?86.42.202.31 19:07, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

Volunteer (Irish republican)
There's quite a bit of an argument going on over at Talk:Volunteer (Irish republican), and I can't really make heads or tails of it. But it sure could use some attention.  Erin Go Bragh talk 10:13, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

Campaign - Other
Added 2 articles I wrote on the Northern Campaign 1942-45 & IRA Nazi links 1938-44. There are also around 15+? articles detailing Abwehr spy missions to Ireland that had involvement with anti-treaty IRA or figures to a greater or lesser extent. There are also a few articles on the activities of notable IRA figures in Nazi Germany or those with linkage to IRA. Again, written from scratch just like the 2 articles already appearing in the list- on the Green Book & the S-Plan. Nobody claiming expertise on the organisation or period (1 self announced expert from Galway) had done any work on them but thats self appointed experts for you :) Might join the group to complete some more articles on IRA Nazi links, and activity of Nazi spy in Ireland. Fluffy999 13:40, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

Martin McCaughey and Fergal O'Hanlon
Perhaps members of the project could have a look at these two articles, which I have tagged for notability, and if they agree, then nominate the articles for AfD. There obviously cannot be notability claimed for someone just because they were killed, unless mainstream sources validate notability. Tyrenius 05:08, 8 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Imagine trying to delete these articles? Well there are the usual anti-republican campaigners that would like to. Please feel free to add to the article and improved it as there is a lot of information out there that could be added.--Vintagekits 19:58, 8 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Fergal was working with Seán South, who's relatively famous in Irish Rebel music (The Wolfe Tones wrote a song about him, called "Sean South of Garryowen). There's a standing marble monument to the both of them. So I guess that could make him notable by association? As for McCaughey, Vintagekits listed a number of things at the AfD that make him seem notable enough to me.  Erin Go Bragh talk 08:24, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Actually, looking at the Sean South article, it seems that Dominic Behan wrote a song, The Patriot Game, about Fergal as well. So that's a song about him, another about his leader, and a monument to the both of them.  Erin Go Bragh talk 08:26, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

Irish language activists
Hi, a lot of people concerned with Irish republicans were/are Irish lanugage activists. If you know that a particular person is, then be sure to add the category Category:Irish-language activists to their article. Thanks. Derry Boi 20:09, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

Emily Brogan
Hello, I though the project might be interested to know the article of a Provisional IRA member, Emily Brogan, has been tagged as non-notible and might be deleted in the near future. MadMax 21:36, 9 February 2007 (UTC)


 * That one's a real tuffy. I think maybe we should get together and talk about what makes an IRA member notable. Because there're thousands to write about, but we obviously can't do that.  Erin Go Bragh talk 08:12, 10 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Perhaps a solution would be to create a "Notable members..." page, linking to those who merit substantial articles of their own, or having brief details for those who don't? That would be a way of "saving" pages like that of Emily Brogan, which otherwise stand to be lost altogether. Nick Cooper 13:39, 13 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I think this is a good idea. ~ Kathryn NicDhàna  ♫ ♦ ♫ 22:13, 13 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I've recently created a List of members of the Irish Republican Army if thet's any help. Although it's still largly incomplete, it might serve useful as a wanted list for the project. MadMax 06:54, 17 February 2007 (UTC)
 * MadMax, well done, that was a great idea.--Vintagekits 10:54, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Óglaigh na hÉireann (CIRA splinter group)
Please see Articles for deletion/Óglaigh na hÉireann (CIRA splinter group). Óglaigh na hÉireann (CIRA splinter group) has been nominated for deletion. User:Astrotrain seems to be blind, ignoring that all statements in the article are sourced from the IMC. Please go make and your voice heard.  Erin Go Bragh talk 23:55, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Advocacy of this kind and attacking other editors who disagree with your point of view is the quickest way to ensure the demise of your project, which must make sure to promote neutrality and wiki policies scrupulously at all times. I suggest an apology and a withdrawal of your remark. Tyrenius 01:10, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
 * I thought I was just stating fact. Sources are in the article. Astrotrain said the article was unsourced. I assume he missed them. I did phrase it in a negative way, but it was a statement of fact. I must ask the question, however: How is my asking people to speak their mind on an open forum advocacy?  Erin Go Bragh talk 08:08, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Because you have already stated a negative view of the nom, so the implication is that you are urging others to follow suit. I have created a sub page for AfD which simply allows them to be listed with a space for the result. This will be a useful record for assessing how the community responds to such subjects, so that future articles can be created (or not) with that in mind. It is a page that can be watch listed by all interested in the subject. Link is: WikiProject Irish Republican Army/AfD It can also be stated on the AfD page that it has been listed on the sub page, with a link. Tyrenius 18:53, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

Establishing Notability for IRA Volunteers.
Several IRA volunteer articles have been nominated for deletion as of late. This is going to continue to happen. Obviously, not all IRA volunteers are notable enough for inclusion in Wikipedia. However, there've got to be many that are (the Chiefs of Staff, for example). I think we should establish some kind of criteria for IRA volunteers.  Erin Go Bragh talk 08:26, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

Criteria

 * Are there any existing Wikipedia notability criteria which apply here?

From WP:BIO - Persons achieving renown or notoriety for playing a major role in a event receiving major news and media coverage (e.g., orchestrating and engaging a famous crime spree or a widely known heroic event) sounds reasonable enough to me? One Night In Hackney 10:39, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

Sandbox?
Rather than have the current problem of unsourced stubs being sent to Afd by the usual suspects shortly after creation, would we be better off creating them here in a sandbox? Then when the articles are sourced and referenced move them to mainspace. Any attempt to send a sourced article which meets notability guidelines to Afd would then be instantly recognised as a bad faith nomination, instead of us having to fight to improve the article while Afd is ongoing. I'd generally expect an article to be in the sandbox for around a couple of days maximum, as I'm not talking about getting the articles up to featured article standard or anything. Thoughts? One Night In Hackney 07:03, 11 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Good idea! ~ Kathryn NicDhàna  ♫ ♦ ♫ 22:13, 13 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I really like this idea. I could create it right now!  Erin Go Bragh talk 23:48, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

Republicanism template
I placed the template up by the Project name discussion, as I thought it might be useful, but please remove it if it's not. This is the code for it:

Tyrenius 03:36, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

1980 in the Irish Republican Army
Also see 1981, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1987 and 1988. 1980 is particularly bad, as most of the small amount of information doesn't even concern the IRA.

Does anyone think these article are worth salvaging and improving? If the answer to that question is yes, are we going to create articles for the many years we don't have at present? One Night In Hackney 22:41, 23 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I don't know if we should document every single little attack the IRAs ever took part in, and categorize them personally. -- Pauric ( talk-contributions ) 23:42, 23 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Me neither, especially as we have this article - Chronology of Provisional IRA actions. So unless there's any objections I'll prod the other articles? One Night In Hackney 12:44, 24 February 2007 (UTC)
 * What he said! Chronology of Provisional IRA actions is surely enough.--Vintagekits 12:51, 24 February 2007 (UTC)


 * This timeline was originally created to transfer the IRA-related events from the deleted Timeline of terrorism, one of the more specific related timelines I'd been transfering events to (ex. List of skyjackings, List of bombings, etc.). Unfortunatly, as I've been busy assisting the WikiProject Crime and WikiProject British crime (as well as being in the middle of a college semester), I've had little time to work on any other projects.
 * The timeline itself was idealy for listing activities of all Irish nationalist movements possibly as far back as the United Irishmen, Young Ireland movement and similar organizations. While I am aware of more specific timelines, I felt this would cover a more broader range on organizations which would either have a significantly smaller entry using existing formats or an unmanigable amount. I also realize the title itself is misleading, however I certainly welcome any suggestions for alternate names. The "final" changes would hopefully look something along the lines of, for example, 1880 in organized crime or 2006 in organized crime. MadMax 21:28, 26 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I've no objections to the articles, they did seem slightly redundant as they stood though, especially with the large number of missing years. You'll need to de-prod them, including the timeline page. One Night In Hackney 21:34, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

Template:IR-stub
Template:IR-stub is broken. It should have a Category:Irish Republicanism stubs to go with it. As I understand it, and it all seems rather bureaucratic and unwiki, new stubs should be proposed at Wikipedia:WikiProject Stub sorting/Proposals where the great and the good of WP:WPSS will consider your humble petition. Angus McLellan (Talk) 19:54, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

Georgina Etheridge
Can I bring this article to the project's attention. If she is notable and it can be verified then please do so, if she isn't or can't then the article should be nominated for deletion.--Jackyd101 00:14, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
 * I've done some research and can't find much/anything, I've prodded it myself. One Night In Hackney 303 22:14, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
 * One also added to Emily Brogan‎ for the same reason.--Vintagekits 22:25, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Indeed. Just a quick note for any concerned parties, both those articles were created by Whatkindofthing and pre-date this project, please don't blame us for them!  One Night In Hackney 303 22:28, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

No referencing/footnote on nearly all Irish republicanism history articles.
There is a real problem with most of the articles based on Irish republicanism history, in that they don't include references/footnotes throughout the articles. I realise that there are sources that are mentioned at the bottom of each article, but they should be referenced in the article at the appropriate places. I have noticed this for a while now, but wasn't sure where to mention it - but here seems as good a place as any.--Macca7174 22:12, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Can you point out any specific articles please, so I know where to make a start? Thanks. One Night In Hackney 303 22:13, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Macca, have you got an example of what you want it to look like and an current example of what articles should/could be improved. Always keen to learn. regards--Vintagekits 22:16, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
 * If you take a look at Colombia Three you'll get a decent idea. When I first saw the article it looked like this, it had one source that was a reference for the entire article, and it didn't even reference a lot of information in the article either. One Night In Hackney 303 17:12, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

This might come in useful for newer Project members: for a simple guide to using references, place (including brackets) on your user or talk page. Tyrenius 03:27, 6 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Hello all, I think Macca, is quite right about the referencing on the Irish History articles it is deplorable. While general users may not be familiar with revisionist writing, I certainly am. I would be more than willing to lend a hand if that is ok. The period of history I am most familiar with is from the Act of Union to founding of the Fenian’s by the remnants of the Young Irelanders. If you need help with referencing, the books on the Young Ireland page that I supplied are my own. I have a large selection of Republican history also. Take care, Regards --Domer48 20:51, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Tasks/Grading/etc
Firstly I've created a tasks template, which is transcluded on the main project page here. I mostly put some articles in there from the project page, I'll work out which ones really need to go in there later. If anyone else wants to edit the tasks you need to edit Irish Republicanism tasks, or if you click on the edit button in the tasks box some instructions are there as well.

Secondly I've added the grading system to the WP:IR template, and creating all the necessary categories to go with it. I still need to create the pages on the Version 1.0 Editorial Team section, and try and assess the articles as best I can in terms of quality and importance. Any help would be welcome with this naturally. All the relevant categories are listed below:

Category:Irish Republicanism articles by importance

Category:Irish Republicanism articles by quality

Category:Irish Republicanism articles with comments

Category:Unassessed-Class Irish Republicanism-related articles

Category:Stub-Class Irish Republicanism-related articles

Category:Start-Class Irish Republicanism-related articles

Category:B-Class Irish Republicanism-related articles

Category:GA-Class Irish Republicanism-related articles

Category:FA-Class Irish Republicanism-related articles

Category:Unknown-importance Irish Republicanism-related articles

Category:Low-importance Irish Republicanism-related articles

Category:Mid-importance Irish Republicanism-related articles

Category:High-importance Irish Republicanism-related articles

Category:Top-importance Irish Republicanism-related articles

Please note you don't add these categories to articles or the talk pages, you edit the WP:IR template on the talk page to include the information. Any questions just ask, thanks. One Night In Hackney 303 09:19, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Bobby Sands
I have started a discussion over the use of a contentious flag in his article, it is located here. One Night In Hackney 303 23:11, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Peaceful Irish republicans
There are many more of us peaceful than violent republicans here in Ireland, and always have been. The impression I get here is a focus on violent republicans? Balance, please.Red Hurley 18:40, 23 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Six edits in to your wiki career! interesting, very interesting - if you want to write an article on "non violent republicans" - then go ahead, I am sure I could lend a hand. regards--Vintagekits 11:39, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Restructuring Project Page
So our project page could do with some restructuring, I think. Originally, I just sort of filled out the base project page with what I thought was what should be there, but the thing as a whole isn't nearly as useful as it should be, looking at some of the other project pages. Our "Open Tasks" section is a glaring exaple of this.  Erin Go Bragh talk 08:34, 30 March 2007 (UTC)


 * What information should be readily availabe on the WikiProject Page?
 * List of participants
 * List of applicable categories of articles
 * Everything currently in the "Articles" section
 * Keep adding things to this list...


 * I only put some (mostly) random articles in the Open Tasks box to make sure it worked properly, I was kind of hoping some people might add/change some but project activity has been lacking recently.... One Night In Hackney 303 10:01, 30 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm sorry Hackney, I didn't mean to comment on your doing! It's great that you've taken that initiative! I was more talking about the section as a whole. What constitutes an open task, etc.?  Erin Go Bragh talk 19:58, 30 March 2007 (UTC)
 * No problem. I'm not entirely sure myself, but I've got some ideas. Basically it's easy enough to see the importance or class of an article now the categories are set up, well once I've finished classifying all the articles anyway! I was basically thinking of picking some articles of high/top priority and/or stub/start class which can be improved. Basically there's not much point including stubs of recently elected MLAs where there's not much source material available at present, a task should be an article which can be significantly improved. It would probably be better if we picked articles covering a broad spectrum of Republicanism, for example I tend to edit the more modern end of things as that's what I've got plenty of books on and there's generally some information available online, whereas anything from say early-mid 1900s I don't have that much information on and online information is scarce at best. But other people have different interests and areas of expertise, so we're probably better off including some tasks for everyone? One Night In Hackney 303 20:06, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Expanding Template:IRAs
I've created an expanded template, that's more up to date with Template customs (uses the standard navbox template) an is a more complete navigational box for Armed Irish Republican groups. It can be found for now at . I'd like to replace the current  with it, or with a template with similar comprehensiveness. Please see Template talk:IRAs and voice your opinions.  Erin Go Bragh talk 09:39, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Template:IrishR & Template:IR topics
The IrishR template has become somewhat bloated. I've started work on  to potentially replace it. The "Topics on..." style of template has several advantages, one being that it doesn't conflict with an infobox, that it sits at the bottom of the page with all the other navigational templates, and especially in this case, that it is a lot more organized. Please join me in discussing the matter at Template talk:IrishR.  Erin Go Bragh talk 02:33, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

More eyes needed
Assuming people aren't too busy for Easter, more input here would be helpful. One Night In Hackney 303 17:22, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Flute Bands
Didnt see any articles on these, so got the ball rolling Éire Nua Republican Flute Band. Listed as start class. Fluffy999 19:51, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Not a big fan of flute bands myself and also I am not sure many of them are notable either. Eire Nua Abu!! p.s. good luck with it however--Vintagekits 19:53, 8 April 2007 (UTC)


 * Oh they're all pretty notable, or at least i'd like to see someone claim they weren't. Vol. Sean Mcilevenná Republican Flute Band is another of the most famous ones. Fluffy999 11:30, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I think you are going to have to show references to them in the press or by other WP:RS. --Vintagekits 12:10, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I will leave word on sources noting each band on each talkpage. This leaves a record of how they pass WP:N. I'm not big into bands but their role in Republicanism was explained to me in detail recently and its not a role appearing on wikia so far. Fluffy999 19:15, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I'd be very interested to read your findings - good luck with it!--Vintagekits 19:18, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Oops a unionist editor nominated them both for deletion while I was involved with reality. Funny how it was almost predicted lol. He claimed that he was going to write a "flute bands" article, ive little faith that will happen so will look into that myself. Unfortunately, the flawed model of wikipedia, a system "gamed" so easily, makes it less and less pleasant to edit. Fluffy999 18:44, 10 May 2007 (UTC)
 * To be fair you were contacted (albeit you were busy) and the references in the articles were poor.--Vintagekits 15:00, 14 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I would like to get them both resurrected, can you advise on how to do this? Im not happy to see two articles on two famous bands railroaded by someone with an obvious axe to grind. If it really were a question of notability then fine, but that can be demonstrated via a google, and through pages of Anderstown News on the Easter Rising commemorations. See also  Mural 2373   Fluffy999 20:56, 19 May 2007 (UTC)

Prison Ships

 * HMS Argenta - 1920s
 * HMS Al Rawdah (1911) - 1940s
 * HMS Maidstone (1937) - 1970s

Listed as start class Fluffy999 11:03, 9 April 2007 (UTC)


 * They don't really fall under the project's scope and I've removed the template accordingly. They were briefly used to house prisoners of war, but that's the limit of their importance in relation to the project. One Night In Hackney 303 07:51, 15 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I readded the template to each. Please give your rationale as to why Internment of generations of republicans falls outside the scope of the project. By the way, use of the term POW is inaccurate, where did you get that idea? Civil Authorities (Special Powers) Act 1922 didnt have a lot to do with POW's as its name might imply to those unfamiliar with it, nor did courts of summary jurisdiction.


 * These ships were used to imprison hundreds of republicans, combatants and non combatants as well as those unconnected to republicanism. Internment being a large part of republican lore not only in the early 1900s but past the last round in the 1970s. An inspiration to thousands of republicans, illustrating exactly what they were fighting against. No detail on Civil Authorities (Special Powers) Act 1922 either, nor an article on internment of Irish republicans through the decades. Fluffy999 22:20, 19 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Perhaps because I understand why project templates should be added? They should be added to articles that the project can improve. The only tangential relationship to Irish republicanism is that prisoners were held on them, which is about as much as can be said. As for you classing them top priority, I rest my case..... One Night In Hackney 303 22:28, 19 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Did you state a case for removing the articles from the project? I missed it. I did see an ill thought out objection and unfamiliarity with key concepts/Republican history however.


 * Speaking about early land based sites McGuffin states: "The camps became hotbeds of 'sedition', political education centres and training grounds for resistance fighters, the foremost of all being Michael Collins. In each of the camps, prisoners elected their own commandants (a practice always followed in the future) and established a chain of command with group and hut leaders." And examples of the same from the 1940s, and later can also be produced to testify to why the sites are important in Republicanism. Setting their function as training and centers of learning and indoctrination aside; i'd like to know whether, in your view, the internment of Republicans is with the scope of the Republican project? If it is, it follows that the sites where internment took place are also part of the project.


 * Irish Republicans are schooled in the significance of internment and the sites where it happened. Articles on the sites are going to be able to contain a lot more detail than "this site held detainees". When did it hold detainees, how many, who staffed it, who died there, etc. I suggest you familiarize yourself with the subject matter. When you've done that you really will be better placed to offer comment on it. Fluffy999 00:05, 20 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Yes I did thanks, obviously you didn't read it properly. I'm more than familiar with the subject matter. You're talking about general concepts, not what can be added to specific articles about each ship apart from unencyclopedic trivia. I'll be happy to keep removing the templates ad infinitum, good day to you. One Night In Hackney 303 00:08, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I reverted your changes. Suggest you come up with something more substantial than "I know better than you". Unencyclopedic trivia? Facts some are ignorant of perhaps, that doesn't make it trivia. As sites where Republicans were interned, the articles belong in the project. You need to stop acting in a unilateral manner and discuss this sensibly. Fluffy999 00:13, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Sorry, you mean like you did in the first place? When you've actually got an article that makes sense having the project template on, come back then. Until then, end of discussion. Oh, and if you put them as top importance again, the template will be removed without a second thought. One Night In Hackney 303 00:14, 20 May 2007 (UTC)


 * lol I just create articles and edit them. Administrative stuff I leave to those most suited to the tasks involved, but I think that discussion can solve problems. However, this particular problem is not being discussed as you implied. To try and defuse anger at the addition of articles about internment sites to the project ive asked others to comment/advise on what can be done. If the "top" status is whats really objectionable to you then go ahead and set a level that isn't. I took no notice of the setting on the panel since the assessment process is not an activity I involve myself in. Fluffy999 00:39, 20 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Discussion can solve problems, but your attitude isn't helpful. Internment is an important concept with regards to Irish republicanism, however the venues at which it was carried out aren't necessarily so. You can canvas other editors as much as you want, it won't make those articles important to this project unless you can demonstrate that they can be as requested above. I spent quite a while removing articles that weren't really within the project's scope for improvement, as improvement is what the template are put on the articles for. One Night In Hackney 303 08:50, 20 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Disregarding the claim that i'm avoiding discussion lol, i've three questions:
 * What is project scope with regard to internment?
 * Can you identify internment sites which are in project scope?
 * Can you identify the criteria used to exclude sites from project scope?
 * If you can address these questions with direct answers then working out your objection to inclusion of the ship sites which "aren't necessarily" in project scope can take place. By the way did you record the criteria you used to previously exclude articles from the project anywhere? I'd like to read them. Fluffy999 10:26, 20 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Internment is within the project scope. However sites where internment happened aren't necessarily within the project scope. The site where internment occurred isn't necessarily important, just the fact that people were interned. Obviously the Maze is one obvious exception to this, but simply adding a lengthy history of the Irish republican aspect of the prison leaves the article unbalanced.


 * See here for a discussion regarding general project scope, in particular comments of of So basically, even if it can fall within a project, we should consider "does it help to put this under this project" and The tagging should be picking out the articles that the WikiProject can usefully spend time assessing and writing/improving. So bearing that in mind, spend a couple of hours looking at all the project articles and see how much work needs doing on them, and then consider whether it's a worthwhile use of proect time adding "When did it hold detainees, how many, who staffed it, who died there, etc" to articles about three ships that, to most casual readers about Irish republicanism, will be of little interest. There's nothing to stop you working on them or anyone else, but all I can see is very unbalanced articles being produced as in an ideal world you'd also need more information about what the ship was used for prior to being a prison ship.


 * For articles I excluded, see here. I got rid of many "The Troubles in..." articles because they were basically stubs copied and pasted from CAIN, and there's that many of them they are unmanageable especially for a new project.


 * As I said above, show me that those ships can be good articles, rather than (as they are at present) having a brief mention of Irish republicanism. One Night In Hackney 303 10:43, 20 May 2007 (UTC)


 * "However sites where internment happened aren't necessarily within the project scope" then what is the criteria for including some and not others? What is your criteria for including some and excluding othes? Why is Long Kesh "obviously" going to be included but prison ships aren't? This is not about reading discussions on talkpages its a direct question to you asking what criteria you are basing your opposition on. Can you address that please? Fluffy999 10:57, 20 May 2007 (UTC)


 * If you read what I said above, it's quite clear why the ships were excluded. Also I think you'll find the Maze isn't a project article, and never has been to the best of my knowledge. One Night In Hackney 303 11:01, 20 May 2007 (UTC)


 * lol your comments aren't clear on the subject at all. You are continuing to fail at articulating the criteria you have used to arrive at your judgments. What are they?
 * For the benefit of readers lets sum up my understanding of this project so far; there is a non transparent system of dictat locked up in one editors mind. This hidden system is apparently beyond interrogation/reproach and entirely unrecorded. This system decides what does and does not get included in the project. Does any of that sound opposed to the wikipedia model? Is that a robust system to operate a project by?
 * While I don't want to begin calling your qualifications for making such judgments into question, its going to save you a lot of future embarrassment if you can work out guidelines for gathering consensus prior to making your judgments. That way lapses in the judgment of a single editor aren't replicated in the project so easily. Fluffy999 11:46, 20 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Hmm, let's see...I asked you to do the following:
 * Spend a couple of hours checking the current state of all the project articles.
 * Read the discussion on the project page I linked to.
 * Show me that the ships can be good articles.
 * So I suggest you stop trolling me because it really isn't going to accomplish anything, and come back and carry on this discussion when you've done all those things. One Night In Hackney 303 11:50, 20 May 2007 (UTC)


 * lol im not trolling. I'm simply asking you how you arrive at your judgments and you are unable to articulate how. I'm happy to wait for comment from others on the project scope of internment- something else you neglect to articulate. I examined the talk you linked to but after reading it, noticed that it didn't explain the criteria you're using either. Where is your criteria recorded? I'm also more than familiar with the project since i've generated plenty of complete articles appearing in it. Great work on identifying some of them. But why did only some IRA concerned articles that I authored make the project? Oh thats right, they fulfilled your secret criteria.


 * The problem remains; even when others do comment, nobody except you knows what criteria (you claim) articles must meet to be included in the project. Nobody knows what you think makes an article "good" either- something else you have yet to articulate criteria for. A secret judgment call system.. Not good, and Not wikipedia. Now I will keep an eye open for comment. Fluffy999 12:42, 20 May 2007 (UTC)


 * You mistakenly assume I tagged all the articles, and that the list of articles is complete. In fact if you'd taken the time to read this whole page you'd have seen that I specificially stated there's plenty of articles that still need tagging.


 * Take a look at the participants on the main page. Take a look at how many are particularly active (or active at all) improving project articles. Consider whether adding more "low priority" articles that the project doesn't have time to improve in addition to the couple of hundred there are already makes any sense at all. Consider whether having only articles that the project has time to improve is a more worthwhile use of the project template. Is it better to have 1,000 articles tagged with the template, and nobody knows where to make a start? Or is it better to have 300 articles tagged with the template, and add more once those 300 are in an acceptable state? One Night In Hackney 303 13:00, 20 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Well I left it 7 days to see other comments. Not a lot of Republicans working this project? Suppose its up to me to get this matter looked into. Just don't trust the judgment behind the current process, its infallible, non-transparent, and by dictat. That is not the wikipedia way. Although it may explain why this project appears moribund.


 * The standard and project scope have yet to be set out. Thats the real problem here. The rest is just waffle from one person scrabbling around for any argument that fits the original flawed judgment call. One person with gaps in their knowledge should not have a stranglehold on a project. Important matters will appear trivial to them simply because they have no understanding of or background in the subject. Input from qualified editors really would settle this matter, hopefully as I finish off what im writing some will come forward. Fluffy999 14:10, 27 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Perhaps you should have used those seven days to improve the articles as I suggested, then this whole discussion would be moot? One Night In Hackney  303  14:12, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

Irish Socialist Volunteers in the Spanish Civil War
Added some detail on prominent IRA who were in the SCW, there is an article titled Ireland and the Spanish Civil War but its just a ripoff of detail I put in Frank Ryan (Irish republican) and should be deleted imo. If the blueshirts get their own article then I think this project can support an article on IRA and Unionist who went willing to fight under their command to Spain. Fluffy999 14:42, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Tasks
Irish Republicanism tasks is updated, and includes what needs doing. Anything else feel free to add naturally. One Night In Hackney 303 04:36, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

List of members of the Irish Republican Army
Afternoon, folks. You may be interested in a recent discussion: Talk:List_of_members_of_the_Irish_Republican_Army. I proposed 3 suggestions there back on the 17th April, and as no alternatives were forthcoming, I implemented the second one today - redlinks were moved to a new page, WikiProject_Irish_Republican_Army/Preparation/List members of PIRA 1969 to present, which is now up for speedy deletion. Bastun BaStun not BaTsun 13:12, 21 April 2007 (UTC)


 * Yes, and it's now been moved to a sub-page of your userspace. One Night In Hackney 303 13:15, 21 April 2007 (UTC)


 * Entirely out of process. List is currently here if anyone's interested. Bastun BaStun not BaTsun 13:51, 21 April 2007 (UTC)


 * Not out of process at all. A non-project member created a page in projectspace that isn't wanted by the project, so it was moved to that editor's userspace accordingly. One Night In Hackney 303 13:53, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

Article assessment
After what seems like an eternity, every article in Category:WikiProject Irish Republicanism articles is now rated by importance and quality. I'm not exactly an expert on either so if anyone disagrees feel free to change anything. I know there's some articles that don't have the project template added as well, so if you see any please make sure to add WP:IR to the talk page. Thanks. One Night In Hackney 303 20:26, 28 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I think you got the rating wrong on over 50% of the articles!--Vintagekits 20:42, 28 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I didn't see you rating any articles ;) One Night In Hackney 303 20:43, 28 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm busting yer chops cos it looked like such a ball ache of a job to do and I would rather argue with people!!!--Vintagekits 21:01, 28 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Aye, you're not wrong. Up until earlier this evening we didn't even have a project template on the Easter Rising! One Night In Hackney 303 21:11, 28 April 2007 (UTC)

James Mac Guill
Does anyone know anything about this guy? I moved it into projectspace from mainspace to save it from imminent deletion, but I'm suspicious. I've yet to check any books I have, but I don't have many that cover the relevant time period at present anyway. The only source is a slightly dubious site, but I can't find any record of the guy on any other sites at all, unless I'm going completely mad of course.... One Night In Hackney 303 22:43, 5 May 2007 (UTC)

Generic welcome message
Created here, just copy and paste it to the talk pages of any new members. One Night In Hackney 303 10:12, 20 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Also there's this for advertising. Just type on someone's talk page.  One Night In Hackney  303  20:19, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

Easter Rising template
Thought Easter Rising would come in handy. If anyone wants to expand it so it's similar to 1981 Hunger Strike I've got no objections. One Night In Hackney 303  16:45, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

Moving the Proclamation
I am proposing to move Easter Proclamation to Proclamation of the Irish Republic. Apparently, Easter Proclamation is the name of a hymn. Anyway, I've always thought the name was wrong — Easter Rising, but Proclamation of the Republic. The discussion (if there is any) is here. Scolaire 08:00, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

Done. Thank you for your comments. Scolaire 10:58, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Use of "People imprisoned for terrorism" category
Found this popping up on various Republican's biography pages. Strikes me as being a highly POV category which adds nothing to the article. Thoughts?GiollaUidir 23:21, 6 June 2007 (UTC)


 * They were, simple fact. Attempting to remove it won't do the project any favours, as all it will do is attract more POV warriors to all the articles, which have been by and large relatively stable recently. One Night In Hackney  303  23:23, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

One Night In Hackney
One Night In Hackney has been deleted at his own request. This is a very sad loss as he was bringing a lot of articles on Irish Republicanism up to Good Article status. Scolaire 10:54, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

Tom Clarke and Seán MacDermott
I am proposing to move Thomas Clarke (Irish republican) and Seán Mac Diarmada back to their original names of Tom Clarke (Irish republican) and Seán MacDermott, for reasons that I have set out in Talk:Thomas Clarke (Irish republican),Talk:Seán Mac Diarmada and Template talk:Easter Rising. Scolaire 15:20, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

List of members of the Irish Republican Army
This article seems incorrect to me, as the Officials are in the same section as all post-1922 members. This is not correct, it gives undue prominence to the Officials. After the GAC and Ard Fheis in September and October 1970 respectively, the Provisional Army Council ceased to be Provisional and became the legitimate Army Council of Óglaigh na hÉireann following the recognition by Tom Maguire. Official IRA members should be in a different section because of this. Brixton Busters 08:23, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

Poll on Flag options in Northern Ireland infobox
There is a straw poll under way on having flag in the infobox of the Northern Ireland article.

There are four Options available choose either


 * Yes / No / Don't care for each Option.--padraig 00:03, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I've voted, but it looks infested with socks! --Vintagekits 18:48, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Categorising prisoners from The Troubles
Further to the numerous discussions, largely on Wikipedia talk:Irish Wikipedians' notice board, a proposal has been made attempt to neutrally categorise individuals imprisoned during The Troubles. Your comments are welcomed at:


 * Wikipedia talk:Categories for discussion
 * Categories for discussion/Log/2007 August 14

Thanks. Rockpock e  t  00:46, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Republican Movement (Ireland)
Republican Movement (Ireland) is being considered for deletion for lack of content and sources. I have added some content and sources, and would be interested in people's opinion on whether it is now worth keeping. The discussion is here: Articles for deletion/Republican Movement (Ireland). Scolaire 22:51, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

WP:IRA
I am removing (and nominating for deletion) the WP:IRA redirect to this page for a number of reasons: Rockpock e  t  19:35, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
 * It is not an abbreviation of the wikiproject title.
 * Having a wikiproject represented by the moniker for a paramilitary organisation is not conducive to harmonious editing. It has been used to promote an atmosphere of incivility and partisanship between conflicting groups of editors, that is entirely at odds with the spirit of the project. Moreover, it has political implications for the project that are counter to WP:NPOV
 * WP:IR is perfectly sufficient.


 * That came about when someone wanted to create an WikiProject Irish Republican Army this was rejected and the links to that where reverted to this project. The WP:IRA shortcut should have been deleted but must have been missed.--padraig 20:04, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks, padraig. I does look like a simple good faith oversight (see here) if you wish to comment. Rockpock  e  t  20:15, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I seen that and voted to delete the redirected links, which should have been done in the first place.--padraig 20:22, 20 August 2007 (UTC)


 * The archived talk pages seem to have disppeared, but as I recall there was some chortling among members about being able to use WP:IRA. Seems appropriate, seeing as the vast majority of the project's work seems to be about glorifying Provisional IRA members and attacks and removing anything that might show them in bad light.  Rather than past republicanism and nationalism and current constitutional republicanism and nationalism. Bastun BaStun not BaTsun 20:29, 20 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Here is where the idea was first suggested .--padraig 20:37, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Irish hunger strike featured article candidate
While I'm (briefly!) back, 1981 Irish hunger strike is a current Featured Article Candidate, the discussion is at Featured article candidates/1981 Irish hunger strike. One Night In Hackney 303  14:43, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Now a featured article. One Night In Hackney  303  23:24, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

John Kelly expanded
I've added to John_Kelly_%28Sinn_Féin_politician%29, a bit surprised at how little you all had done. Just 12 lines was a bit slim on a volunteer of over 40 years, and a former founding leader of the Provos, involved in international negotiations, etc....? Rather a key man??Red Hurley 12:04, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

Active Service Unit
There's an article for this now, so if you see anywhere it needs linking please do so. I've added a few myself, but there might be some more. One Night In Hackney 303  08:47, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Dr. Padraig Quinn
Anyone got any more information on him to expand the article? It's likely he's covered more in offline sources, but it isn't really my area of expertise. One Night In Hackney 303  06:36, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

Spam, or valuable resource?
User:Rathingle has added a plethora of links to the same site, http://martindardis.com/, to various articles about Irish Music and related subjects. Normally, I would class these all as WP:LINKSPAM and delete them. However, they seem to be relevant, providing lyrics and chords that may not appear in the article. Can someone else look at these article and give a second opinion? Thanks.--SarekOfVulcan 18:14, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I'd say the best place for it is say a link in say Irish rebel music, not scattered across many articles. I was tempted to revert them all myself, but I'm caught in two minds like yourself. One Night In Hackney  303  18:16, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

Politics of Northern Ireland WikiProject
I have created a proposal for a WikiProject on the Politics of Northern Ireland. Please have a look and comment; if you are interested in participating, please add your name! Warofdreams talk 19:38, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

Question concerning nationality
I was looking at the article Ruairí Ó Brádaigh, and would like to stimulate a general discussion regarding nationality, not specifically about this article.

The nationality is listed as [[Republic of Ireland| Irish]]. My understanding would be that a significant proportion of individuals that call themselves republican, would consider each of the two Irish states as illigitimate as each other, and therefore not consider either to provide nationality. I was wondering how should one go about determining nationality, and making the choice between Irish, Irish, Irish, or even Irish. Fasach Nua 14:17, 27 October 2007 (UTC)


 * We attribute one's nationality to the state, recognized by the rest of the world, of one's birth or citizenship. I presume he holds a passport from the Republic of Ireland and hence is Irish (for our purposes), whether he claims to recognize the state or not (and, something I've always wondered is, if he doesn't recognize it, why would he travel under its sovereignty?) I note that his place of birth is listed as Ireland (the island, rather than the state), though, which I imagine is some nod to his beliefs. This appears to be counter to what is preferred at Manual of Style (Ireland-related articles). Rockpock  e  t  01:51, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Presumtion is unworthy of an encyclopedia! However your passport point is taken as a rule of thumb. What would be the situation if someone held no travel documents, as I would imagine would not have been uncommon in the early 20th Century? Fasach Nua 20:35, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
 * My point is, with a lack of verifiable information stating that he revoked citizenship of the country of his birth, or actively gained that of another state, we presume that is his nationality. We generally don't require evidence of any documentation proving nationality unless it deviates from a verified place of birth. However, technically speaking he wasn't born in the ROI, but the Irish Free State (perhaps we should list that under birth country). But since the ROI followed the Free State without any geographical changes, its safe to assume that the citizens of one country became the citizens of that which followed it. Rockpock  e  t  20:54, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
 * What you are talking about is eligibility, which can come from place of birth, parents, or other more proactive means. I would imagine (unencyclopedic) until recently almost everyone in the RoI had one grandparent who was a British citizen (born pre 1922), and the individual had the choice to take either British/Irish, or both. How would one quantify this choice? Fasach Nua 21:03, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Again, as far as I am aware, we typically assign the nationality of any individual to their state of birth, unless there is evidence that they elected to become a national of another state (of which they are eligible). In the case of Republicans this isn't even a major concern, because they state they would presumably choose (a united Ireland) doesn't actually exist in any legal sense, and therefore they couldn't become a legal citizen of that (hypothetical) state. Rockpock  e  t  21:50, 28 October 2007 (UTC)


 * When it comes to "Nationality" it's generally never been included on any article I've seen (obviously there's the odd exception like above). Place of birth is all that's required, as it doesn't involve any controversy. Now can I direct you both to a semi-related discussion here? One Night In Hackney  303  21:59, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't know about that. In many article we say "X is a Irish runner...", this surely indicates nationality? Rockpock  e  t  01:37, 29 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Yes, but do you really think it's appropriate to say "X is a British member" about Irish republicans? It's asking for trouble, when all that's needed is a place of birth. One Night In Hackney  303  01:45, 29 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Just to be clear, my earlier comment was related to articles about Irish republicans only, not Irish biographical articles in general. One Night In Hackney  303  01:52, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Do you mean in circumstances where Irish Republicans were born in Ireland while it was part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland? In that case, if a nationality was required for whatever reason, then I would probably use "X is an Irish member..." or simply "X is an Irish member..." If you mean in circumstances where Irish Republicans were born in Northern Ireland, then I would probably use "X is an Northern Irish member..." My understanding of the original question, however, was the concern that Irish Republicans born in the ROI after 1937 do not even recognize the ROI as a state, and hence we should not refer to them as Irish . I don't agree with that.  Rockpock  e  t  03:41, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
 * There is no such thing as northern Irish, Northern Ireland is not a country, it is a British controlled province, therefore under the GFA its population are either Irish, British or have duel nationality.--Padraig 12:22, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Europe is not a country yet one could be described as European, Lancaster is not a country yet one could be described as Lancastrian. There is nothing wrong with describing someone as Northern Irish if they were born in Northern Ireland. Rockpock  e  t  16:41, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
 * There is plenty wrong with it, it is a Unionist attempt to promote the idea that those Born in Northern Ireland are seperate from the Irish race, and I was born in Northern Ireland and I am Irish, I also have the option of British citizenship or duel nationality, but there is no option for northern Irish.--Padraig 16:50, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't believe anyone else was discussing race, we were discussing place of birth. Rockpock  e  t  17:02, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Well place of birth is Northern Ireland is this case, so where is northern Irish coming from, I was born in Northern Ireland I wasn't born in northern Irish.--Padraig 17:10, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

(reset indent) Its semantics. I was born in "Europe", not "European". So what? I am still European. The point was that if there is verifiable information what one is of a different nationality than the place of birth then we can use that (in your case, you say you are Irish, so we would call you Irish) However, lacking that verifiable information, if one is required to use the phrasing "X is a Y-ish Z" then I would use "Northern Irish" if its a verified fact you were born in Northern Ireland. It would be but a guess to call you Irish or British in that situation. Rockpock e  t  17:20, 29 October 2007 (UTC)


 * That's why we don't tend to use it. Describing an Irish republican (from Northern Ireland) as British is contentious, and without verifiable information that they hold Irish nationality we don't tend to call them Irish. So it's safer all round just to say, for example, "born in Belfast, Northern Ireland". Nothing contentious, no POV, no labels the subject would object to, no verifiability problems. One Night In Hackney  303  05:23, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

Easter Rising
There is some controversy about aspects of the Easter Rising article. Could some members of this project look into it in an attempt to settle differences? Most of it is covered in the final section of the talk page ("Objectives"), though there are some other minor points to be addressed as well. Thanks. -R. fiend (talk) 16:37, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

Template transclusion problem
There seems to have been some minor change to the code that has wreaked havoc with some WP:IR article talk pages, because WP:IR began to transclude the project page (i.e., WP:IR) instead of the template of the same name. User:Gimmetrow did a fix by renaming the template WP IR and that has solved the problem - but this new template name will have to be added to all the article talk pages, I suspect. See this edit as an example that seemed to work - I simply removed the colon from the template name. Someone with WP:AWB could probably make the necessary edits pretty quickly. I have to do other things now in the real world, so I can't do it, but if someone from this project could do it I think we'd all appreciate it. Unless someone knows another way? Cheers, Walkerma (talk) 06:34, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

Category:People of the Irish War of Independence
I just created Category:People of the Irish War of Independence, which needs more rticles.

I made Category:Irish Republican Army members 1917-1922 a subcat of Category:People of the Irish War of Independence, and I'm now not so sure that was the right thing to do. I have no strong views either way, so just thought I'd raise it here as something which members of this project may want to consider.

Hope this helps. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 22:09, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

Heavy gang
I was just tidying up the rather stubby article on Patrick Cooney, and hoped to link to the heavy gang, but its a redlink :(

Does anyone here have any sources to allow them to write an article on that subject? I think it's much-needed. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 00:56, 9 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Most of the sources I've seen are of questionable neutrality, and while an article (or at least the bones of one) could be written from them I'd not be willing to vouch for its neutrality. One Night In Hackney  303  11:27, 20 March 2008 (UTC)


 * They were heavily involved in the Sallins train robbery case where Nicky Kelly was wrongly convicted, he was eventualy aquitted and won a case for wrongful conviction.--Padraig (talk) 13:37, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

TG4 had a programme all about Osgur Breatnach, and the work of the Heavy gang. I'll try track down a copy? --Domer48 (talk) 14:14, 20 March 2008 (UTC)


 * There was also a book written about the Sallins robbery, and their convictions, can't remember the name of the title.--Padraig (talk) 15:47, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

I find it. --Domer48 (talk) 22:45, 21 March 2008 (UTC)


 * While Justice Slept: The True Story of Nicky Kelly and the Sallins Robbery? One Night In Hackney  303  18:20, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Sinn Féin politician categories
These categories need some sorting out to account for the complex history of Sinn Féin &mdash; ee the discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Ireland.

Any suggestions? --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 17:06, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

Omagh bombing
The article is currently at 'start' class and at 'mid' importance, which does not seem right. 24.32.208.58 (talk) 18:04, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

Irish version of personal names
There's a discussion ongoing at Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style (Ireland-related articles) about when and how to include Irish versions of names of Irish people. jnestorius(talk) 21:16, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

Fenians
I'll start to reference the Fenian articles, and try pull them all together. It will take a while as I will include the Bio's. --Domer48 (talk) 22:47, 21 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Fair dues to you, Domer! It's a major task, but well worth doing.  Bail ó Dhia ar an obair.  Scolaire (talk) 15:49, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Its only 150 years of history LOL. --Domer48 (talk) 18:57, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

AfD Fergus O' Hare
Hi all, there's a Afd discussion here for the article on Fergus O' Hare. As the article states that he was involved in the Civil Rights Movement, I was wondering if there was anyone here who knows of any more info to support for or against the article--Starrycupz (talk) 14:10, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

Eamon Martin
Eamon Martin is currently unreferenced and appears to be of marginal notability, Can anyone improve the article? -- Brown HairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 01:44, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

White Cross, anyone?
I'm surprised not to see a page on the White Cross relief organization active during the Anglo-Irish war and funded by Sinn Fein from America. I know that Quakers were involved, and it was non-violent, which perhaps rules it out of interest to WP:IR, but someone should start it.86.42.197.145 (talk) 14:21, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Operation Taurus
The stub article Operation Taurus is currently unreferenced, asserting that it was the name of planned RUC prosecution of Martin McGuinness. I know nothing about it all, and I don't know if it unsubstantiated gossip, a hoax, or a genuine story which could be sourced and turned into a real article (even if was a short one). Can anyone on this project help? -- Brown HairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 01:05, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

Assessment statistics
There is a problem with [[Wikipedia:Version 1.0 Editorial Team|Irish Republicanism articles by quality statistics
 * the statistics]]. Even though the articles listed as unassessed have actually been assessed as "list-class" but still appear as unassessed in the category. I am not sure how to fix it but there does not seem to be a list-class parameter or the page for them to appear in. Cheers ww2censor (talk) 03:27, 9 June 2008 (UTC)

Changes to the WP:1.0 assessment scheme
As you may have heard, we at the Wikipedia 1.0 Editorial Team recently made some changes to the assessment scale, including the addition of a new level. The new description is available at WP:ASSESS.
 * The new C-Class represents articles that are beyond the basic Start-Class, but which need additional references or cleanup to meet the standards for B-Class.
 * The criteria for B-Class have been tightened up with the addition of a rubric, and are now more in line with the stricter standards already used at some projects.
 * A-Class article reviews will now need more than one person, as described here.

Each WikiProject should already have a new C-Class category at Category:C-Class_articles. If your project elects not to use the new level, you can simply delete your WikiProject's C-Class category and clarify any amendments on your project's assessment/discussion pages. The bot is already finding and listing C-Class articles.

Please leave a message with us if you have any queries regarding the introduction of the revised scheme. This scheme should allow the team to start producing offline selections for your project and the wider community within the next year. Thanks for using the Wikipedia 1.0 scheme! For the 1.0 Editorial Team, §hepBot  ( Disable )  21:40, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Articles flagged for cleanup
Currently, 563 articles are assigned to this project, of which 193, or 34.3%, are flagged for cleanup of some sort. (Data as of 2008-07-14.) Are you interested in finding out more? I am offering to generate cleanup to-do lists on a project or work group level. See User:B. Wolterding/Cleanup listings for details. More than 150 projects and work groups have already subscribed, and adding a subscription for yours is easy - just place a template on your project page.

If you want to respond to this canned message, please do so at my user talk page; I'm not watching this page. --B. Wolterding (talk) 17:10, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

new article (Irish Republican Liberation Army)
Just got this up and running on the Irish Republican Liberation Army. Its obviously not much just yet, just got the 2 sources. But others can add to this as well. Lihaas (talk) 13:25, 25 August 2008 (UTC)

Wikipedia 0.7 articles have been selected for Irish Republicanism
Wikipedia 0.7 is a collection of English Wikipedia articles due to be released on DVD, and available for free download, later this year. The Version 1.0 Editorial Team has made an automated selection of articles for Version 0.7.

We would like to ask you to review the articles selected from this project. These were chosen from the articles with this project's talk page tag, based on the rated importance and quality. If there are any specific articles that should be removed, please let us know at Wikipedia talk:Version 0.7. You can also nominate additional articles for release, following the procedure at Release Version Nominations.

A list of selected articles with cleanup tags, sorted by project, is available. The list is automatically updated each hour when it is loaded. Please try to fix any urgent problems in the selected articles. A team of copyeditors has agreed to help with copyediting requests, although you should try to fix simple issues on your own if possible.

We would also appreciate your help in identifying the version of each article that you think we should use, to help avoid vandalism or POV issues. These versions can be recorded at this project's subpage of User:SelectionBot/0.7. We are planning to release the selection for the holiday season, so we ask you to select the revisions before October 20. At that time, we will use an automatic process to identify which version of each article to release, if no version has been manually selected. Thanks! For the Wikipedia 1.0 Editorial team, SelectionBot 23:22, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

Final remedies for AE case
What's gone on here is all too common among the areas fraught with ethnic strife on wiki. Two or more sides who have been feuding in real life for decades, centuries, or even thousands of years bring their world view to wiki and wiki becomes an extension of their real world problems. Someone makes a change. A person from the other side sees it as "misinformation" and we all know the rest of the story. Any admin trying to solve these ongoing wiki strifes should be commended for bravery as most admins won't go near these topics. Yet what happens all too often? They get attacked by both sides because these cases are prime examples of the fact that you can't make everyone happy. I've spent quite a bit of time looking at this thread and am proposing a modification of Tznkai's proposal as I don't see admin consensus for support of it, though I can see why he made the proposals he made. If remedies don't have the support of the admin community, they are largely ineffective. Ideally, peaceful cooperation would fall upon all of wiki and the energy spent on matters like arbitration would get spent on article building, but we're not there yet. -- — Rlevse  •  Talk  • 18:02, 5 October 2008 (UTC)
 * blocked for 72 hours for gross incivility and disruptive editing. NOTE: already served
 * placed under indefinite probation under discretionary sanctions prescribed in Requests for arbitration/The Troubles, because of disruptive edit warring and inability to compromise and cooperate instead of edit warring.
 * is advised he is skating on very thin ice. His conduct and statements in this AE case was far less than desirable, especially those directed at neutral admins who were merely trying to help--notably User:Black Kite and User:Spartaz.
 * , as she herself stated, is under civility parole and reminded of that. She is most strongly advised to tone it down.
 * All editors on Troubles related articles are directed to get the advice of neutral parties via means such as outside opinions.
 * All articles related to The Troubles, defined as: any article that could be reasonably construed as being related to The Troubles, Irish nationalism, the Baronetcies, and British nationalism in relation to Ireland falls under 1RR. When in doubt, assume it is related.
 * Clear vandalism may be reverted without penalty
 * Blocks may be up to 1 week for first offense, 1 month after the first 1 week block, and then ban options may be considered.
 * As there are hundreds of articles potentially subject to this, I leave it to the community to tag the talk pages of the articles and to decide how to go about that. Code for a template that can be used for that is here:
 * These final remedies have been linked to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Irish Republicanism and Requests_for_arbitration/The_Troubles


 * This is being appealed and the Admin has been asked to rescue themselves because of such a bad descision. -- Domer48 'fenian'  19:41, 5 October 2008 (UTC)

Requested move on the Flag of Ireland
Having read over the discussion on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Ireland on the recent move and the concerns expressed, I have begun a move request on the flag. Your comments would be welcome here.-- Domer48 'fenian'  18:22, 22 October 2008 (UTC)

New Ireland project
Hi all, I've started a new Ireland related project which I hope will bridge a gap I feel exists between the two Wiki community's with an interest in Ireland related matters. The project has just started but I hope it will allow us to work together at first on uncontroversial articles such as Sports in Ireland and if successful I hope will allow for a more constructive and friendly approach to the controversial issues. Gnevin (talk) 17:08, 31 October 2008 (UTC)

Society of the Friends of Ireland of all Religious Persuasions
I have posted a question concerning the "Society of the Friends of Ireland of all Religious Persuasions" in Talk:Repeal Association. Maybe one of you guys can help me confirm this? Thanks! -- Mathieugp (talk) 19:05, 1 November 2008 (UTC)


 * Replyed on Talk:Repeal Association. -- Domer48 'fenian'  20:08, 1 November 2008 (UTC)

Milestone Announcements
I thought this WikiProject might be interested. Ping me with any specific queries or leave them on the page linked to above. Thanks! - Jarry1250 (t, c) 21:58, 1 February 2009 (UTC)

Question
INTERNATIONAL ASPECTS North America - 1800's ?? Re: Jose Marti & meetings with International Republicans (including IRB & other European representatives). I was once told of a meeting held (apart from the 1st American Conference) of International Republicans in North America, at which Jose Marti, Irish Republicans and others met. Does anyone have any details ?

See also: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:First_International_Conference_of_American_States —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 81.151.60.200 (talk • contribs).

Coordinators' working group
Hi! I'd like to draw your attention to the new WikiProject coordinators' working group, an effort to bring both official and unofficial WikiProject coordinators together so that the projects can more easily develop consensus and collaborate. This group has been created after discussion regarding possible changes to the A-Class review system, and that may be one of the first things discussed by interested coordinators.

All designated project coordinators are invited to join this working group. If your project hasn't formally designated any editors as coordinators, but you are someone who regularly deals with coordination tasks in the project, please feel free to join as well. &mdash; Delievered by §hepBot  ( Disable )  on behalf of the WikiProject coordinators' working group at 05:43, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Article alerts
This is a notice to let you know about Article alerts, a fully-automated subscription-based news delivery system designed to notify WikiProjects and Taskforces when articles are entering Articles for deletion, Requests for comment, Peer review and other workflows (full list). The reports are updated on a daily basis, and provide brief summaries of what happened, with relevant links to discussion or results when possible. A certain degree of customization is available; WikiProjects and Taskforces can choose which workflows to include, have individual reports generated for each workflow, have deletion discussion transcluded on the reports, and so on. An example of a customized report can be found here.

If you are already subscribed to Article Alerts, it is now easier to report bugs and request new features. We are also in the process of implementing a "news system", which would let projects know about ongoing discussions on a wikipedia-wide level, and other things of interest. The developers also note that some subscribing WikiProjects and Taskforces use the  parameter, but forget to give a link to their alert page. Your alert page should be located at "Wikipedia:PROJECT-OR-TASKFORCE-HOMEPAGE/Article alerts". Questions and feedback should be left at Wikipedia talk:Article alerts.

Message sent by User:Addbot to all active wiki projects per request, Comments on the message and bot are welcome here.

Thanks. — Headbomb {{{sup|ταλκ}}κοντριβς – WP Physics} 09:17, 15 March, 2009 (UTC)

Vote on British Isles
A poll is on at the BI-taskforce to see whether a compromise can be reached over the usage of the term "British Isles", at British_Isles_Terminology_task_force. Just incase you're interested. FF3000 (talk) 22:20, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

Requests_for_comment/User_names
Just drawing attention to this... apparently all nationalists are Nazis ~ R.T.G 00:44, 15 November 2009 (UTC)

Martin McGuinness dispute
I would like to invite anyone reading this to participate in a discussion over whether to use "deputy First Minister of Northern Ireland" or "Deputy First Minister of Northern Ireland" in the infobox on Martin McGuinness. The discussion can be found here: Talk:Martin McGuinness. HonouraryMix (talk) 15:35, 11 January 2010 (UTC)

Fenian dynamite campaign
Fenian dynamite campaign is a recently created article. It's a worthwhile article but it has copyvio issues (see the talk page). If anybody is interested they might knock it into shape. Scolaire (talk) 12:08, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Articles for deletion/Dissident Republican Attacks
FYI. Location (talk) 05:38, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

37 million deaths in British India
I proposed the addition of some content relating to famines in India to FA India. It's been stripped down for various reasons and the current statement reads something like:

Famines in India before the arrival of the British were few and local and they affected comparatively a small number of people, for example, from the 11th century to the 18the century, there were only 18 famines in India. Under British rule, a total of 31 famines were recorded for the 100 years between 1800-1900 with a death toll of about 37 million, primarily due to starvation. India continued to suffer from famines under the British Crown, right up to independence in 1947 after which they vanished with the establishment of representative democracy and a free press."

We are looking to form a consensus on whether and how this content can be included in India. If you have an interest, please participate in the discussion at Talk:India and other relevant sections on the same page. Thanks. Zuggernaut (talk) 18:37, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

British Empire
Featured article British Empire has a British_Empire section but it does not contain the Indian view point the the empire was generally despised in India. It there are sources stating that the situation was similar in other parts of the world, like Ireland, I would like to add a tag to the article's Legacy section. Please point to sources per WP:Sources if you are aware of any. Thanks. Zuggernaut (talk) 18:42, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

Irish Republicanism articles have been selected for the Wikipedia 0.8 release
Version 0.8 is a collection of Wikipedia articles selected by the Wikipedia 1.0 team for offline release on USB key, DVD and mobile phone. Articles were selected based on their assessed importance and quality, then article versions (revisionIDs) were chosen for trustworthiness (freedom from vandalism) using an adaptation of the WikiTrust algorithm.

We would like to ask you to review the Irish Republicanism articles and revisionIDs we have chosen. Selected articles are marked with a diamond symbol (&diams;) to the right of each article, and this symbol links to the selected version of each article. If you believe we have included or excluded articles inappropriately, please contact us at Wikipedia talk:Version 0.8 with the details. You may wish to look at your WikiProject's articles with cleanup tags and try to improve any that need work; if you do, please give us the new revisionID at Wikipedia talk:Version 0.8. We would like to complete this consultation period by midnight UTC on Monday, October 11th.

We have greatly streamlined the process since the Version 0.7 release, so we aim to have the collection ready for distribution by the end of October, 2010. As a result, we are planning to distribute the collection much more widely, while continuing to work with groups such as One Laptop per Child and Wikipedia for Schools to extend the reach of Wikipedia worldwide. Please help us, with your WikiProject's feedback!

For the Wikipedia 1.0 editorial team, SelectionBot 23:11, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

Aengus Ó Snodaigh
There appears to be a lack of review on the page Aengus Ó Snodaigh causing some contentious material to be included that does not appear directly related to Aengus Ó Snodaigh (as well as not well sourced, just the independent newspaper). IRWolfie- (talk) 00:41, 24 February 2011 (UTC)

2011?
Please join the discussion at Talk:The Troubles in Omagh --Hroðulf (or Hrothulf) (Talk) 09:56, 26 April 2011 (UTC)

A pre-War of Independence skirmish
Should an ambush of RIC men in Co. Cork in July 1918 be mentioned in Timeline of the Irish War of Independence? See Talk:Timeline of the Irish War of Independence. Fences &amp;  Windows  09:25, 19 June 2011 (UTC)

Open Ireland page move discussion
After a two-year ban imposed by Arbcom, a page move discussion for the Republic of Ireland can be entertained.
 * (Discuss)–Republic of Ireland →Kauffner (talk) 08:08, 23 October 2011 (UTC)

Relatives ?
Anybody here know if Frank Flood and John Joe Flood where related ? DjlnDjln (talk) 11:34, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

Amendment requested for 'The Troubles' Arbitration remedies; input welcome
Hi all,

Interested editors are invited to review and comment on a request for amendment to the discretionary sanctions remedy (R5) of the The Troubles Arbitration case.

Regards, Daniel (talk) 04:15, 19 August 2012 (UTC)

Arbitration motion regarding Requests for arbitration/The Troubles
Resolved by motion at Arbitration/Requests/Clarification and Amendment that:

Remedy 5 (Standard discretionary sanctions) of Requests for arbitration/The Troubles is amended as follows: The words "and British baronets" are stricken from this remedy. The Committee reserves the right to restore sanctions to this area by motion, should a pattern of editing problems re-emerge. Existing sanctions which were placed prior to this amendment remain in effect (and unmodified) until they expire or are lifted via the normal appeals process.

For the Arbitration Committee, -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  20:01, 8 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Discuss this

Erin gobragh
Can somebeody answer here?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Erin_go_bragh#United_Ireland — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.3.76.133 (talk) 11:00, 6 October 2012 (UTC)

File:DermO'N.jpg
File:DermO'N.jpg has been nominated for deletion -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 03:53, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

Neutral eyes requested
Hi folks, I'd really appreciate it if any of you could spare the time to take a look over Operation Flavius and offer some comments at WikiProject Military history/Assessment/Operation Flavius. I've recently re-vamped the article and I'm hoping to take it to FAC. I think it's a neutral summary of the available material, but it's a controversial subject, so I'd welcome any good-faith suggestions for improvements. Thanks, HJ Mitchell  &#124;  Penny for your thoughts?  20:51, 30 January 2014 (UTC)


 * I hope you're not expecting a rush. If you look above you might notice that there was a total of three posts to this page in 2012, and one in 2013, none of which was answered. I'll have a quick look myself, but I don't imagine I'll have time for a detailed critique. You might be better to ask at WikiProject Ireland (though it's not at its most lively at the moment, either). --Scolaire (talk) 09:11, 31 January 2014 (UTC)

Disappeared (Northern Ireland)
I have just started a new article on Disappeared (Northern Ireland), which might be of interest to this WikiProject. GiantSnowman 18:42, 10 April 2014 (UTC)

Abandoned project pages
WikiProject_Irish_Republican_Army/Preparation. In case any one wants to put them up for deletion. The old project redirects to this one. Carolmooredc (Talkie-Talkie) 01:17, 22 May 2014 (UTC)

Comment on the WikiProject X proposal
Hello there! As you may already know, most WikiProjects here on Wikipedia struggle to stay active after they've been founded. I believe there is a lot of potential for WikiProjects to facilitate collaboration across subject areas, so I have submitted a grant proposal with the Wikimedia Foundation for the "WikiProject X" project. WikiProject X will study what makes WikiProjects succeed in retaining editors and then design a prototype WikiProject system that will recruit contributors to WikiProjects and help them run effectively. Please review the proposal here and leave feedback. If you have any questions, you can ask on the proposal page or leave a message on my talk page. Thank you for your time! (Also, sorry about the posting mistake earlier. If someone already moved my message to the talk page, feel free to remove this posting.) Harej (talk) 22:47, 1 October 2014 (UTC)

WikiProject X is live!


Hello everyone!

You may have received a message from me earlier asking you to comment on my WikiProject X proposal. The good news is that WikiProject X is now live! In our first phase, we are focusing on research. At this time, we are looking for people to share their experiences with WikiProjects: good, bad, or neutral. We are also looking for WikiProjects that may be interested in trying out new tools and layouts that will make participating easier and projects easier to maintain. If you or your WikiProject are interested, check us out! Note that this is an opt-in program; no WikiProject will be required to change anything against its wishes. Please let me know if you have any questions. Thank you!

Note: To receive additional notifications about WikiProject X on this talk page, please add this page to WikiProject X/Newsletter. Otherwise, this will be the last notification sent about WikiProject X.

Harej (talk) 16:57, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

Cork republican silver
I've just created Cork republican silver and would be grateful if someone familiar with that period of history would cast an eye over it. Andy Mabbett ( Pigsonthewing ); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 20:39, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

AfC submission
See Draft:Frank Byrne, Irish Nationalist. Thank you, FoCuS contribs ;  talk to me!  22:49, 28 December 2015 (UTC)

Were the Troubles a colonial conflict?
Something of an impasse in this discussion Template talk:British colonial campaigns between me and about whether or not the Troubles should be listed on a template of British colonial campaigns. A few more opinions on the matter would be most welcome! Gerrynobody (talk) 14:52, 15 March 2016 (UTC)

Neutral eyes requested (2)
There has recently been an influx of fans at this article who have engaged in concentrated blanking of content. Additional eyes would be appreciated. LavaBaron (talk) 06:02, 21 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Magical eyes are apparently wanted, to know what article you are talking about. I can't see any article relating to Irish republicanism in your contributions. Scolaire (talk) 13:02, 21 April 2016 (UTC)

Ballymurphy Massacre listed at Requested moves
A requested move discussion has been initiated for Ballymurphy Massacre to be moved to Ballymurphy massacre. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 18:00, 4 May 2016 (UTC)
 * To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude, or set up Article alerts for this WikiProject.

Martin Doherty listed at Requested moves
A requested move discussion has been initiated for Martin Doherty to be moved to Martin Doherty (Irish republican). This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 18:30, 23 June 2016 (UTC)
 * To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude, or set up Article alerts for this WikiProject.

Thomas Murphy (Irish criminal) listed at Requested moves
A requested move discussion has been initiated for Thomas Murphy (Irish criminal) to be moved to Thomas Murphy (Irish republican). This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 20:44, 24 June 2016 (UTC)
 * To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude, or set up Article alerts for this WikiProject.

List of Provisional IRA dead
List of Provisional IRA dead is currently listed for deletion at Articles for deletion/List of Provisional IRA dead. Participation welcomed. Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 21:49, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

Real Irish Republican Army listed at Requested moves
A requested move discussion has been initiated for Real Irish Republican Army to be moved to New Irish Republican Army. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 18:15, 20 May 2018 (UTC)
 * To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude, or set up Article alerts for this WikiProject.

Sinn Féin Republican Youth listed at Requested moves
A requested move discussion has been initiated for Sinn Féin Republican Youth to be moved to Ógra Shinn Féin. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 19:02, 18 August 2018 (UTC)
 * To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude, or set up Article alerts for this WikiProject.

Volunteer/member
I have some serious doubts about a large number of edits in which "Volunteer" was changed into "member", like here. The response from on User talk:Alekksandr made me think of a potential clash. That is why I request to review his recent edits. The Banner talk 19:39, 1 September 2018 (UTC)


 * I have responded at Alekksandr's talk page. You should go ahead and revert. Scolaire (talk) 17:03, 5 September 2018 (UTC)
 * ✅ Thank you, done by me and The Banner  talk</i> 18:24, 5 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I was tempted to hit "rollback all". That was a lot of edits and I could only look at and tackle a few. Drmies (talk) 20:39, 5 September 2018 (UTC)

Séumus Robinson (Irish republican) listed at Requested moves
A requested move discussion has been initiated for Séumus Robinson (Irish republican) to be moved to Séumas Robinson (Irish republican). This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 08:01, 22 January 2019 (UTC)
 * To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude, or set up Article alerts for this WikiProject.

James Carey listed at Requested moves
A requested move discussion has been initiated for James Carey to be moved to James Carey (Fenian). This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 07:01, 14 February 2019 (UTC)
 * To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude, or set up Article alerts for this WikiProject.

The Troubles listed at Requested moves
A requested move discussion has been initiated for The Troubles to be moved to Northern Ireland conflict. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 01:14, 13 April 2019 (UTC)
 * To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude, or set up Article alerts for this WikiProject.

1992 London Bridge bombing listed at Requested moves
A requested move discussion has been initiated for 1992 London Bridge bombing to be moved to London Bridge station bombing. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 22:03, 8 May 2019 (UTC)
 * To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude, or set up Article alerts for this WikiProject.

South Derry Independent Republican Unit
I have nominated this article for deletion, the discussion can be found at Articles for deletion/South Derry Independent Republican Unit. Mountain Battles (talk) 16:32, 21 May 2019 (UTC)

AfC review of Draft:John Joseph Davis, Irish Volunteer
Hi. Are there any AfC reviewers here that could review Draft:John Joseph Davis? Alternatively, could someone advise me on whether he meets the notability requirements, in which case I'll accept? Curb Safe Charmer (talk) 10:21, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

Request for information on WP1.0 web tool
Hello and greetings from the maintainers of the WP 1.0 Bot! As you may or may not know, we are currently involved in an overhaul of the bot, in order to make it more modern and maintainable. As part of this process, we will be rewriting the web tool that is part of the project. You might have noticed this tool if you click through the links on the project assessment summary tables.

We'd like to collect information on how the current tool is used by....you! How do you yourself and the other maintainers of your project use the web tool? Which of its features do you need? How frequently do you use these features? And what features is the tool missing that would be useful to you? We have collected all of these questions at this Google form where you can leave your response. Walkerma (talk) 04:24, 27 October 2019 (UTC)

Requested move on two Troubles related articles
See Talk:Timeline of the Northern Ireland Troubles and peace process. Thank you. FDW777 (talk) 21:21, 21 January 2020 (UTC)

1975 Manchester bombing listed at articles for deletion
See Articles for deletion/1975 Manchester bombing, thank you. FDW777 (talk) 11:56, 21 April 2020 (UTC)

Burning of the Burning Embers pub
I have nominated this article for deletion. The discussion is at Articles for deletion/Burning of the Burning Embers pub. Thank you. FDW777 (talk) 22:09, 10 June 2020 (UTC)

Reliability of An Phoblacht
There is a discussion at Reliable sources/Noticeboard. Thank you. FDW777 (talk) 18:24, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

Bloody Sunday (1920) listed at Requested moves
A requested move discussion has been initiated for Bloody Sunday (1920) to be moved to Croke Park massacre. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 08:45, 30 July 2020 (UTC)
 * To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude, or set up Article alerts for this WikiProject.

Requested move for Operation Demetrius
Please see Talk:Operation Demetrius. Thank you. FDW777 (talk) 14:27, 9 August 2020 (UTC)

Operation Demetrius listed at Requested moves
A requested move discussion has been initiated for Operation Demetrius to be moved to Internment during the Troubles. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 14:46, 9 August 2020 (UTC)
 * To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude, or set up Article alerts for this WikiProject.

United Ireland listed at Requested moves
A requested move discussion has been initiated for United Ireland to be moved to Irish reunification. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 01:31, 3 February 2021 (UTC)
 * To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude, or set up Article alerts for this WikiProject.

New IRA
I've recently created a article draft for the New IRA. Feel free to contribute to it. Charles Essie (talk) 19:38, 29 April 2021 (UTC)

Merger proposal
Received request to merge the Connolly Column article into the Irish socialist volunteers in the Spanish Civil War article on 13 May 2021. Reason: <I>text</I>. Discuss it >>>HERE<<<. Input welcome. Thank you,  GenQuest  "scribble" 14:13, 31 May 2021 (UTC)

Marian Price RfC
Please provide your views at Talk:Marian Price. thanks Mztourist (talk) 03:21, 21 June 2021 (UTC)

Saoradh
Could we get some more input at Saoradh? There's some content that seems very unbalanced to me. Bondegezou (talk) 08:35, 19 October 2021 (UTC)

Ernie O'Malley
Hello everybody. The above article has been nominated for GA assessment, should anyone here be interested in doing so or helping with it. Thank you, Billsmith60 (talk) 19:08, 29 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Apologies,, for not getting to the Sjafruddin Prawiranegara FAC today, should be able to look in tomorrow though.  SN54129  20:29, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

Republic of Ireland listed at Requested moves
A requested move discussion has been initiated for Republic of Ireland to be moved to Ireland (country). This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 15:20, 22 March 2022 (UTC)
 * To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude, or set up Article alerts for this WikiProject.

Bloody Sunday (1972) listed at Requested moves
A requested move discussion has been initiated for Bloody Sunday (1972) to be moved to Bloody Sunday. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 17:17, 3 July 2022 (UTC)
 * To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude, or set up Article alerts for this WikiProject.

RfC about naming "Soldier F" in the Bloody Sunday (1972) article
An RfC about naming "Soldier F" in the Bloody Sunday (1972) article is open here. <span style="font-family:Verdana, sans-serif">Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 17:29, 7 October 2022 (UTC)

Workers' Party of Ireland listed at Requested moves
A requested move discussion has been initiated for Workers' Party of Ireland to be moved to Workers' Party (Ireland). This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 14:31, 10 January 2023 (UTC)
 * To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude, or set up Article alerts for this WikiProject.

Workers' Party of Ireland listed at Requested moves
A requested move discussion has been initiated for Workers' Party of Ireland to be moved to Workers' Party (Ireland). This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 18:46, 10 January 2023 (UTC)
 * To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude, or set up Article alerts for this WikiProject.

Project-independent quality assessments
Quality assessments by Wikipedia editors rate articles in terms of completeness, organization, prose quality, sourcing, etc. Most wikiprojects follow the general guidelines at Content assessment, but some have specialized assessment guidelines. A recent Village pump proposal was approved and has been implemented to add a class parameter to WikiProject banner shell, which can display a general quality assessment for an article, and to let project banner templates "inherit" this assessment.

No action is required if your wikiproject follows the standard assessment approach. Over time, quality assessments will be migrated up to WikiProject banner shell, and your project banner will automatically "inherit" any changes to the general assessments for the purpose of assigning categories.

However, if your project has decided to "opt out" and follow a non-standard quality assessment approach, all you have to do is modify your wikiproject banner template to pass WPBannerMeta a new custom parameter. If this is done, changes to the general quality assessment will be ignored, and your project-level assessment will be displayed and used to create categories, as at present. Aymatth2 (talk) 15:56, 11 April 2023 (UTC)

Ernie O'Malley
Can someone add the above into the summary table at GA mid-importance? Thanks Billsmith60 (talk) 20:22, 2 May 2023 (UTC)

Nomination of Northern Irish nationalism for deletion
A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Northern Irish nationalism is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Articles for deletion/Northern Irish nationalism until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article until the discussion has finished. Kpratter (talk) 07:07, 11 September 2023 (UTC)