Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Japan/Archive/February 2018

Article naming discussion
Discussion is here: Village pump (policy) - Knowledgekid87 (talk) 05:20, 1 February 2018 (UTC)

Is the figurative meaning of 萬/万 ("a great many") WP:BLUE?
I've been working on a new article at Interpretation of the title of the Man'yōshū (once it's "complete" I'll move onto the next sub-topic, then summarize all of them in the main Man'yōshū hub article, which I think is how everything on Wikipedia probably should work), but my Japanese sources (which work with Chinese sources because Nara period) don't really come out and say "ten thousand really just means a whole lot" as often as I would like, presumably because it's implied.

Does this seem like the kind of thing an English Wikipedia could include in an uncited footnote along the lines of The character literally means ten thousand but figuratively means "a great many", similar to the English myriad.?

Posting this as well on WT:CHINA since the question is kinda relevant to both and I have no idea which venue would welcome the most input.

Hijiri 88 ( 聖やや ) 10:31, 6 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Every J-E dictionary I've looked in has "many" as one of the meanings of 万 or 萬, so you could simply look it up in one or two and include a ref to a dictionary. ··· 日本穣 ·  投稿  · Talk to Nihonjoe ·  Join WP Japan ! 22:52, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

Yama, Hoko, Yatai, float festivals in Japan
There are supposedly 33 festivals in the UNESCO Intangible Cultural Heritage Yama, Hoko, Yatai, float festivals in Japan, however I am unable to find a list of which festivals are included here. Anybody knows of such list? bamse (talk) 21:37, 8 February 2018 (UTC)
 * I found ja:山・鉾・屋台行事 over on jawp. It lists 33 festivals. ··· 日本穣 ·  投稿  · Talk to Nihonjoe ·  Join WP Japan ! 22:47, 8 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks. That jawp article brought me to the reliable source . Still strange that UNESCO does not list them (as far as I can see). bamse (talk) 23:18, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

Article on a relatively low-vis Japanese topic assuming prior knowledge of the sakoku period?
Hey, I'm in the early stages of a massive expansion of our Man'yōshū article, and out of vanity (or perhaps shame) I just now checked if I had a hand in what's already there, and apparently four years ago I did this, something 2018 Hijiri is not especially proud of for its being more interested in poking fun at a 19th-century orientalist than in actually summarizing the history of MYS translation into other languages.

But a thought occurred to me while reading it: Keene obviously assumed his readers would know that in the 1830s, the only Japanese sources Klaproth could have consulted without extremely high-level diplomatic and commercial ties would have been castaways, but can we assume the same knowledge on the part of our readers? If the article on the history of Japan didn't specifically mention that Japan was closed off to Europe during this period but did mention a random castaway, that would be really weird, but the MYS article is relatively "obscure", so should we just assume it is "behind" to the history of Japan article?

Hijiri 88 ( 聖やや ) 12:19, 31 January 2018 (UTC)


 * To be honest, I don't think sakoku is important to the passage in question. The way I read it, there was a German guy traveling east. In Siberia, while looking for various different languages, he came across some Japanese guys, who helped him translate some Japanese text. That it was impossible for Klaproth to enter Japan at the time is irrelevant to the fact that he produced a poor translation whilst in Siberia. AtHomeIn神戸 (talk) 06:14, 13 February 2018 (UTC)

Please join the discussion at Mottainai
There is a discussion at Talk:Mottainai regarding how well the article represents usage of the word and the appropriate use of sources. Please join in. Curly "JFC" Turkey 🍁 ¡gobble! 00:07, 26 February 2018 (UTC)

Shogi vs. shōgi
There seems to be a possible edit warring brewing over at Shogi ( or Shōgi) about the use of the macron. Shogi seems to be westernized enough that the macron is almost always no longer used when term is used in English in newspapers and books per MOS:JAPAN. It's not really the just the main article that this is affecting because other related articles such as Japan Shogi Association, etc. as well as various category pages, etc. were also moved to the macron version. I understand that shogi is of Japanese origin, but like many Japanese words in has been commonly used in English to some degree. It might have reached level as sushi, anime, manga, karaoke, etc., but it does now seem to be more commonly used instead of the translation "Japanese chess". Anyway, in the past year and a half especially, first with Karolina Styczyńska and then with Sōta Fujii, the game has seen an increase in coverage by non-Japanese media outlets, and these all (as far as I can tell) don't use the macron. FWIW, if the macron is needed then that's fine, but I think it needs to be discussed since it affects so many pages. I was thinking about starting a discussion about it on Talk:Shogi unless there's a better place to do so. -- Marchjuly (talk) 13:29, 28 February 2018 (UTC)
 * See Talk:Shōgi for relevant discussion. -- Marchjuly (talk) 14:31, 28 February 2018 (UTC)