Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Novels/Rick Riordan task force/Archive 4

New task force logo?
Hello, all. I was working on a bit of graphic design recently, got sidetracked (naturally), and ended up creating a new logo for the task force. I have no plans to implement it right now, as is working just fine, but I'd love to hear your opinions of it. This is and this is. I am completely open to opinions and suggestions, both positive and negative, here or on my talk page.

In case you're wondering what the logo is supposed to represent, it contains letters/glyphs/runes from the languages used by each culture Rick Riordan has written about in his works of fiction (those would be America, Rome, Greece, Scandinavia, and Egypt). They are all symbols for the letter/sound R, because "RR" is both our task-force's and Rick Riordan's initials. The words below (in Version 1) are written in Centaur font, which is the font most of Rick Riordan's English works have been published in. So, it's a very symbolic logo, though it might not look very appealing, which is my main concern.

If anyone besides myself likes it, I hope to use Version 2 in a userbox for the task force. (I've also been working on some other potential userboxes, but that's a subject for another post.) (Update: The userbox is now operational.) Thanks for reading! -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 00:59, 20 December 2015 (UTC)
 * I like your idea of using Centaur, since it was used in a lot of Riordan's books. →The Pancake of Heaven! (T &bull;&#32; C  &bull;&#32; E) 14:54, 6 April 2016 (UTC)

Userboxes
Hello again, all. I have drafted some userboxes, which can be viewed at this page: WikiProject Novels/Rick Riordan Task Force/Outreach. The purpose of these userboxes is threefold: There're a lot of them, but that's just to explore the options. Most of them deal with member specialties, though there is a generic one which incorporates the logo I discuss in this forum post. (This may also be a good time to mention that I've also considered creating a topicon, such as this one.) Any and all comments are welcomed. Thanks! -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 03:30, 20 December 2015 (UTC)
 * 1) To provide a way for WP:RRTF members to specialize, without creating separate taskforces
 * 2) To entertain potential members (to help with recruitment)
 * 3) To put some color into our pages and entertain current members (to help with editor retention)
 * I especially like the PJO userbox. The only comment I have is that maybe we should change the font of the final userbox. Zussman1 (talk) 02:07, 8 January 2016 (UTC)
 * Those are fine with me. I'd like to start using some of them (the ones that pertain to me). Methychroma (talk) 18:37, 23 January 2016 (UTC)
 * @Methychroma -- Ok, let me know which those might be, and I'll figure out whether they should be put into project space or my userspace, get them their own pages, and check for issues. I'll let you know when they should be good to go. -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 20:41, 23 January 2016 (UTC)
 * 2ReinreB2-- I'm mainly doing Percy Jackson editing, with some Magnus Chase and Kane Chronicles editing. Maybe I can get these three userboxes? Methychroma (talk) 00:28, 24 January 2016 (UTC)
 * @Methychroma -- OK, sounds good. I'm deciding whether they ought to go in the Template space or my userspace, then I'll update this page with instructions on how to add them to a userpage. Thanks for letting me know which you'd like; I'm taking it slow so we don't end up with tons of pages no one can keep up with. -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 00:32, 24 January 2016 (UTC)
 * Why don't you go ahead and add them to the Template space? Methychroma (talk) 01:35, 24 January 2016 (UTC)
 * Okay, Methychroma, those three are now working. Check out RRTF Outreach for info on how to implement them. I was actually able to find a short way to "publish" them in our project space. Let me know if there are any problems getting them to work. -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 03:44, 24 January 2016 (UTC)


 * The alternate-logo box is now operational, and in use on my user page . Like Zussman1 mentioned above, I'm a little sketchy about the font, but it'll do for now. -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 18:44, 6 March 2016 (UTC)
 * The "user maintenance" box is now operational. One thing I have noticed is that these boxes aren't very compatible with mobile browsers. While it's more likely that userpages get edited on laptops/desktops, I'd still welcome any suggestions to fix this. -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 17:46, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

On Book:Percy Jackson & the Olympians
Nothing's really been done with this book in a substantial amount of time. Should we expand to cover all of Riordan's mythology novels? Should we create Kane and Magnus books? What sorts of improvements can we make to it, as it stands now? Some questions to think on. -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 06:43, 14 January 2016 (UTC)
 * You do know that Riordan's about to launch another Greco-Roman mythological series, The Trials Of Apollo, with the first volume, The Hidden Oracle, scheduled to come out in May? And also the three PJ/Kane crossover stories are supposed to come out as a compilation in April. The Magnus Chase series just got started. So maybe we can keep this page as it is, for now. It's a distinct category. Methychroma (talk) 18:42, 23 January 2016 (UTC)

too too too too
...  ...  is too big here. --P64 (talk) 22:13, 12 February 2016 (UTC)


 * @P64 -- ?? Not sure of the meaning of your comment/question. Could you provide a little more context? -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 04:58, 13 February 2016 (UTC)


 * Visiting this page in a desktop window probably close to 8-1/2 x 11 inches in size (standard typewriter/printer paper in the U.S.) I see
 * [trident symbol]
 * Welcome to
 * R •
 * Project page!
 * On this wide screen, about 18 inches, a full window displays "R • R • T".
 * With default settings at this library station "R • R • T • F" is about two feet long and the entire banner would be more than three feet long.
 * If I count correctly, four tags precede the trident (with no effect on its display); four more (total 8) precede "Welcome" and three more (total 11) precede "R •". With two, two, and two such tags the appearance is
 * [Trident] Welcome to the R • R • T • F
 * Project Page! [Trident]
 * Meanwhile at these settings and window size, the page body display is just wide enough that the two boxes "This is a task force" and "Rick Riordan Task Force // Alerts" appear side by side, which seem about right to me.

(:BTW, the "Contents" box seems to be double-spaced which is a waste of vertical space to me.) --P64 (talk) 17:00, 13 February 2016 (UTC)


 * @P64 -- Ah, ok, I see what you mean. As to the banner size, please, go right ahead and change it if you can! I don't have issues with viewing it personally, but I usually edit on a computer with an oddly-shaped screen, so I'm hardly one to judge. As to the contents box, yes, I see, and it has been bothering me since it started doing that a couple of months ago. At one point I think I even tracked down the edit that made the change but I can't for the life of me figure out what piece of code is the culprit. If you can, again, please change it! -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 18:02, 14 February 2016 (UTC)
 * @P64, @2ReinreB2, I believe I just fixed the ToC spacing issue. I also don't have any problem with the banner, so I don't know what to fix :-). Zussman1 (talk) 21:43, 15 February 2016 (UTC)
 * Good show.
 * I stripped 4 of 11 tags. --P64 (talk) 17:56, 16 February 2016 (UTC)

The 39 Clues coverage
I was just going over our pages looking for name-change-related problems, and I was reminded of our decision not to cover the 39 Clues, because of WP:39's existence. However, WP:39 is defunct, and seems to be staying that way. Not sure we factored that in when we decided before. What does everyone think now? -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 22:16, 6 March 2016 (UTC)
 * I still think that we shouldn't. Rick Riordan hasn't really had any involvement with the series since The Maze of Bones, and we already have enough to cover. Zussman1 (talk) 18:05, 16 March 2016 (UTC)

Carter Kane up for deletion
I just discovered that the article Carter Kane is up for deletion. The proposer's reasoning centers around the fact that the article has a "lack of independent reliable sources." -- i.e., that it violates Notability. In 7 days (04:47, 20 April 2016 (UTC)), it may be deleted. So: Should we fight for this article? If anyone in WP:RRTF (or any editor, for that matter) objects, we may remove the tag for deletion and start a discussion. This does not guarantee that the proposer won't nominate it again.

Here are the facts :
 * 1) Reason for deletion: WP:Notability states that "The absence of sources or citations in an article (as distinct from the non-existence of sources) does not indicate that a subject is not notable. Notability requires only the existence of suitable independent, reliable sources, not their immediate presence or citation in an article."
 * And WP:AFD says that one should "search for additional sources, if the main concern is notability", and that "if you find that adequate sources do appear to exist, the fact that they are not yet present in the article is not a proper basis for a nomination... The minimum search expected is a Google Books search, a Google News search, and a Google News archive search."

Please voice your opinion below. Use,  ,  , or   before your comment to summarize your message. -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 21:57, 13 April 2016 (UTC)
 * 1) Our chances: Our last attempt to stop an AFD discussion, on List of Percy Jackson & the Olympians terms, was not successful. It centered on a claim that the page was  unencyclopedic listcruft.
 * 2) Our other interests: The article Percy Jackson currently exists and is of a very similar style/quality, but is of arguably greater notability.
 * 3) Importance: Carter Kane the character is described elsewhere. Carter Kane the article gets about 900 views a month. It is rated Mid-importance start-class for RRTF, Low-importance for both WP:NV and the fantasy task force.
 * I do think we could save it, but only if other members are willing to combine forces to do so. Might not be easy, but enough sources exist. (One suggestion: if we expanded it to cover both Carter and Sadie Kane, we might find sources on Sadie, or about the two of them as twins. It wouldn't have to rely on just Carter's importance.) I don't think it would hurt the encyclopedia if we lost it, but I am concerned about setting a precedent for RRTF giving up on AFD discussions. -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 22:27, 13 April 2016 (UTC)
 * On a brief search for sources, just to see where we stand, I encountered this: "Rick Riordan cheers end of book covers that 'whitewash' his black hero". -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 16:13, 14 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Now that we've (sort-of) decided to proceed with saving the article, I went ahead and fixed the in-universe problem. Zussman1 has largely fixed the referencing problem. I left a brief note on the talk page about what I believe should still be done. I've essentially hit my limit for the moment, however. -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 01:37, 17 April 2016 (UTC)


 * I think that there's certainly more that could be added (i.e. Egyptian-Greek crossovers, Kane Chronicles Survival Guide). I don't think that we should make it about both Carter and Sadie, as they're two very different characters. Personally, I think that this page can be saved, but I will only be able to do a small amount of the editing, due to school related matters. Zussman1 (talk) 23:28, 13 April 2016 (UTC)
 * I used the source that @2ReinreB2 linked to above and a few others to add a cover art controversy section. I think that the next step would be to add information from The Son of Sobek and The Crown of Ptolemy and check whether Riordan ever posted anything about Carter's development/inspiration. I'm going to remove the deletion tag on the grounds that I improved it by adding references and real world material. Zussman1 (talk) 21:47, 15 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Thanks, @Zussman1, for taking the initiative. On the article's talk page I placed a list of sources I compiled yesterday while it was still up for deletion, if anyone else wants to jump on. I will certainly help, but I'd really like to not be the only substantial contributor. -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 22:32, 15 April 2016 (UTC)


 * I agree with the above. If we remove the PROD tag, it will probably go to AFD, and if we want to save it we'll have to find some better refs. Omni Flames   let's talk about it  21:39, 14 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Carter and Sadie as twins? Perhaps you mean, but those are not fictional, so.
 * The trilogy is very popular judged from sales or from my niece. Perhaps it has been covered critically in children's literature or schoolteacher journals. Does anyone here have access? --P64 (talk) 21:25, 16 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Ah, yeah, "twins" was a typo. I meant siblings who operate like foils for each other. On your other note, @P64, I have access to the series and companion novels, but not to any journals. I suspect that the only scholarly sources for the series would be librarian's magazines; I'll see if I can find a way to view some. Unfortunately, most of the news on this series was probably generated several years ago and librarians are less likely to have those lying around. It'll have to be online. -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 21:34, 16 April 2016 (UTC)

Category up for deletion
Category:Rick Riordan task force collaborations is currently nominated for deletion because it is currently empty (i.e. the nominator believes it meets these criteria). Any editor with an interest in either saving or condemning it should post their opinions on this page. Discussion about how useful it is to this project should be here, on the RRTF forums.

I personally believe that it is worth saving (and being tagged with Empty category). As the creator of the category, however, I can only comment on the discussion, so it's up to RRTF to decide whether it gets saved. Not really a major loss either way, I think. -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 16:01, 7 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Update: Category was deleted. -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 01:45, 16 May 2016 (UTC)

New article about The Hidden Oracle
I just created a draft article about The Hidden Oracle. If anybody wants to help me write it, you're welcome to. Here's the page. Methychroma (talk) 19:22, 25 May 2016 (UTC)
 * The link you posted above leads to a dead end, here's the draft ;) Click here to help! →The Pancake of Heaven! (T &bull;&#32; C  &bull;&#32; E) 13:51, 26 May 2016 (UTC)
 * I fixed my link. Thanks. Methychroma (talk) 21:31, 30 May 2016 (UTC)
 * I've gone back to work on my draft. I'd appreciate some help in completing it so it can be submitted. Methychroma (talk) 04:54, 6 September 2016 (UTC)

Draft article of The Sword of Summer
Maybe we can start working on this article again and get it submitted? (I'm following my own suggestion, BTW). Methychroma (talk) 19:32, 25 May 2016 (UTC)
 * I finished the plot section a while back, but didn't have time to continue working on it. I think all it needs is some revision/editing/updating and then we can submit it. I don't have a lot of time these next few weeks, but I can definitely work on it afterwards. Zussman1 (talk) 03:30, 26 May 2016 (UTC)
 * This draft has now been effectively merged with The Sword of Summer (formerly "The Sword of Summer (novel)"). If you wish to help with this project, please improve The Sword of Summer directly, rather than the draft. The draft is non-current, but will not be deleted unless Zussman1 chooses to do so. Thank you to all who've helped! -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 00:03, 23 October 2016 (UTC)

Percy Jackson Coloring Book and more
Just wanted to let you know that there's a Percy Jackson Coloring Book on the way (here), Camp Half-Blood Confidential (here), and Hotel Valhalla: Guide to the Norse Worlds (here and here). I currently put the two companion books as companion books for their respective series, but was wondering about what to do with the coloring book. If anyone has any ideas, that would be great. Zussman1 (talk) 03:35, 26 May 2016 (UTC)

List of characters in mythology novels by Rick Riordan
The List of characters in mythology novels by Rick Riordan urgently has to be updated. Reyna's story is only up to when she tells her story of dispelling her father's ghost. Also, anyone else to purchased The Trials of Apollo: The Hidden Oracle needs to help out with this page. I did update some information but I do need some help. @ @ →The Pancake of Heaven! (T &bull;&#32; C  &bull;&#32; E) 13:49, 26 May 2016 (UTC)

New Sword of Summer article
A user, not part of RRTF, has just created The Sword of Summer (novel). As we already have Draft:The Sword of Summer in progress (by Zussman1 and Methychroma, primarily), we now need to decide what to do with this page. The Sword of Summer also already exists, currently as a redirect to Magnus Chase and the Gods of Asgard, so that should also be considered.

I would classify the new article as only about a stub, because though it is fairly large, it has no article image or any references, and was not created through Articles for creation. In its current state, it seems likely that a speedy deletion patroller might tag it. Because of this, if we want to save it or any part of it, we will need to take action within the next week. Comments are appreciated below.


 * I think we could let it be deleted and then submit our version of the page to AfC, since it's nearly completed (thanks to 2ReinreB2. However, we could also finish our page and paste it into the namespace, effectively replacing the article, and then request an evaluation of content. Zussman1 (talk) 18:03, 30 June 2016 (UTC)


 * It looks like it might have been approved already. Maybe it could be merged with our draft? Methychroma (talk) 04:52, 6 September 2016 (UTC)
 * See . Please do not improve Draft:The Sword of Summer -- work directly on The Sword of Summer. Thanks! -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 00:04, 23 October 2016 (UTC)

Annual roll-call: August 2016
This roll-call is now closed. Congratulations on nine months of active status! Since our last role call at the end of last July, RRTF's membership has been almost completely redone. Only one active member remains of the original seven, and we can now boast an impressive fifteen total members. Not only that, but we have a new name and a new scope -- a lot has happened in just one year! It's time to check back in again.


 * If you wish to remain in the project: List your name below along with the status in which you would like to be placed --,  , or  . Don't forget to use   to leave a timestamp. Feel free to list your name in the appropriate section yourself, being sure to remove it from its previous location (if applicable). An active RRTF member will take care of any leftover or misplaced names at the end of the role-call.
 * If you wish to leave the project: List your name below with the words, then remove your name form the appropriate member listing. Don't forget to use   to leave a timestamp.

Editors have until the end of September to respond to this role-call, at which time all non-respondents will be listed as "Unknown". -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 21:57, 18 September 2016 (UTC)
 * 2ReinreB2 (talk) 00:08, 4 August 2016 (UTC) - Active
 * Rtkat3 (talk) 00:53, 4 August 2016 (UTC) - Active
 * Gonzales John (talk) 05:12, 4 August 2016 (UTC)-Active
 *  Wiki Pancake  ✉ 📖 12:59, 4 August 2016 (UTC)-Active
 * Zussman1 (talk) 15:59, 4 August 2016 (UTC) - Active
 * SirePyro (talk) SirePyro (talk) 02:39, 8 August 2016 (UTC) - Active
 * Rajan51 (talk) 12:27, 8 August 2016 (UTC) - Active
 * KangisLOL (talk) 16:32, 16 August 2016 (UTC) - Active
 * FiendYT  ★  21:16, 17 August 2016 (UTC) - Active
 * Yaohuijiang (talk) 22:23, 1 September 2016 (UTC) - Active
 * Methychroma (talk) 04:09, 6 September 2016 (UTC) - Active
 * Spike789 18 September 2016 - Inactive (per action, verified?)

This roll-call is now closed.

New Trials of Apollo article
A new article, The Trials of Apollo (series), was recently created by a non-RRTF member, and requires a review. See the above post for more information; I'd say both articles are of identical quality, though we do not have a draft in progress for this one. -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 20:20, 6 August 2016 (UTC)

Should we mention this book?
Just discovered this unofficial Magnus companion. Should we mention or otherwise cover it, and if so, where? I doubt its notable enough for its own page, based on the fact that I have heard nothing about it until now. -- 2ReinreB2 (talk) 19:45, 13 September 2016 (UTC)