Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Numismatics/Archive 7

Currencies called gulden
Is there any logical reason that some of the currencies here are called 'gulden' and others 'guilder'. I guess they should all be called 'guilder', as this is the English name for the currency. The primary distinction appears to be that currencies that are commonly spoken of in English, e.g., 'the Dutch guilder' are Anglicised, whereas the more esoteric retain their foreign name. I don't see any basis for this. Anyone disagree that they should all be moved to 'guilder'? Sumbuddi (talk) 01:49, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

47 Prefecture Coin Program
This was a surprise to me-I just saw a ¥500 coin, brass on the outer ring, nickel on the inside, with "Hokkaido-47 Prefecture Coin Program" on it. To me this sounds like the 50 State Quarters program, but there's nothing on the 'pedia. Anyone? Chris (クリス • フィッチ) (talk) 13:21, 12 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Japan will issue over the next few years, as your described, around four 500 yen coin per year, one per prefecture. Hokkaido was one of the firsts.  It is not clear to me if they will be issued for circulation like the state quarters.  I will look for information and will update wiki if I can.  Thanks, Miguel.mateo (talk) 02:59, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

File:Zimbabwe $2 1980 Obverse.jpg at IfD
The image of this Zimbabwean banknote has been nominated for deletion on the grounds that an article on banknotes of a country should "use one or two non-free images", and not present a systematic survey.

It seems to me that a systematic survey is exactly what should be presented in an article on the historical banknotes pf a country -- such a survey is exactly what is appropriate for an encyclopedic article. But project members may wish to present their own views, at the IfD (which has already been running 10 days, so could close any time). Jheald (talk) 22:14, 21 January 2009 (UTC)


 * It has been marked as public domain now. The nominator was simply wrong and didn't get any agreement. Currency images are legitimate (and you can take them from other sites, because a simple scan is not a derivative creative work) for fair use, the problem is the 'fair use bot' will delete it automatically after seven days if you don't provide a rationale using the correct tag (a note on the page is not enough, you have to use the correct marku[). I had to bulk add rationales a while ago, ended up writing a bot to do it. Sumbuddi (talk) 04:09, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

Dinar, Gold Dinar, Islamic gold dinar
Members of this project ought to be aware that there are two articles covering the Islamic gold coin known as the dinar. Gold Dinar and Islamic gold dinar cover essentially the same material. A third article, Dinar, addresses modern currencies. My preference would be that all three articles be merged under Dinar. I defer to members of this group to decide. Aramgar (talk) 03:02, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

Milestone Announcements
I thought this WikiProject might be interested. Ping me with any specific queries or leave them on the page linked to above. Thanks! - Jarry1250 (t, c) 22:11, 1 February 2009 (UTC)

How do i centre whole columns in a table?
Is this possible? Thanks, IAmTheCoinMan (talk) 15:05, 14 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Put me some samples and I might be able to help. Tell me what are you trying to do in what section of what article.  Thanks, Miguel.mateo (talk) 02:55, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

Boy Scouts of America Silver Dollar Centennial Commemorative Coin
Please help deorphan this. Chris (クリス • フィッチュ) (talk) 05:54, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

Coordinators' working group
Hi! I'd like to draw your attention to the new WikiProject coordinators' working group, an effort to bring both official and unofficial WikiProject coordinators together so that the projects can more easily develop consensus and collaborate. This group has been created after discussion regarding possible changes to the A-Class review system, and that may be one of the first things discussed by interested coordinators.

All designated project coordinators are invited to join this working group. If your project hasn't formally designated any editors as coordinators, but you are someone who regularly deals with coordination tasks in the project, please feel free to join as well. &mdash; Delievered by §hepBot  ( Disable )  on behalf of the WikiProject coordinators' working group at 06:12, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Fractions of a penny
This question is not specifically about this project, but I hope someone here can help me with this. I am looking at where taxation rates for malt in the UK, c.1770 are quoted in some rather odd fractions, such as 9 1/4 2/21d. and 9 1/2 4/5d.. The halfpenny and farthing I am ok with, but can anyone explain the /21 and /5? Is this maybe just an accounting term, or were there coins of this denomination? --Derek Andrews (talk) 13:14, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

Article alerts
This is a notice to let you know about Article alerts, a fully-automated subscription-based news delivery system designed to notify WikiProjects and Taskforces when articles are entering Articles for deletion, Requests for comment, Peer review and other workflows (full list). The reports are updated on a daily basis, and provide brief summaries of what happened, with relevant links to discussion or results when possible. A certain degree of customization is available; WikiProjects and Taskforces can choose which workflows to include, have individual reports generated for each workflow, have deletion discussion transcluded on the reports, and so on. An example of a customized report can be found here.

If you are already subscribed to Article Alerts, it is now easier to report bugs and request new features. We are also in the process of implementing a "news system", which would let projects know about ongoing discussions on a wikipedia-wide level, and other things of interest. The developers also note that some subscribing WikiProjects and Taskforces use the  parameter, but forget to give a link to their alert page. Your alert page should be located at "Wikipedia:PROJECT-OR-TASKFORCE-HOMEPAGE/Article alerts". Questions and feedback should be left at Wikipedia talk:Article alerts.

Message sent by User:Addbot to all active wiki projects per request, Comments on the message and bot are welcome here.

Thanks. — Headbomb {{{sup|ταλκ}}κοντριβς – WP Physics} 09:30, 15 March, 2009 (UTC)

Azerbaijani banknotes depicting instruments
Is the fact that certain musical instruments are depicted on Azerbaijani banknotes worthy of mention in the articles dealing with the instruments themselves ? – Please, provide your imput at:


 * Talk:Daf.
 * Talk:Kamancheh.
 * Talk:Tar (lute).

Thank you already. - Regards, Ev (talk) 18:54, 25 March 2009 (UTC)

"The Omega Man" Counterfeiter $20 Gold 1907. Would like to hear from others interested. Ever seen one? Is there a group of holders? (Glennstin (talk) 14:10, 18 April 2009 (UTC))

Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Glennstin" (Glennstin (talk) 23:35, 1 May 2009 (UTC))

Market prices in coinage articles/lists
Hey project: I recently removed some market prices from an article on collectable coinage, based on the language from the WP:NOT policy that "articles discussing products currently on sale should not quote street prices," (full disclosure: language that I recently tweaked, but in a change that stood without any opposition) but then I realized that this was far more prevalent in articles falling within the scope of this Wikiproject than I had first realized. So before I went forward with revising many, many articles, I wanted to raise the issue here: is there any justification for having the information in these articles that is contrary to Wikipedia policy? UnitedStatesian (talk) 05:58, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Hearing no objections, I am going to move forward with cleaning up the lists. UnitedStatesian (talk) 17:53, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Title
Shouldn't the title for Apsar be changed into Abkhasian aspar to fit the usual article naming? (212.247.11.156 (talk) 20:47, 14 May 2009 (UTC))
 * And: Should the currency appear on the "Currencies of Europe/Asia" templates too? (212.247.11.156 (talk) 20:49, 14 May 2009 (UTC))

Pageview stats
After a recent request on my talk page, I added WikiProject Numismatics to the list of projects to compile monthly pageview stats for. The data is the same used by http://stats.grok.se/en/ but the program is different, and includes the aggregate views from all redirects to each page. The stats are at WikiProject Numismatics/Popular pages.

The page will be updated monthly with new data. The edits aren't marked as bot edits, so they will show up in watchlists. I can also get provide the full data for any project covered by the bot if requested, though I normally don't keep it for much longer than a couple weeks after the list is generated. If you have any comments or suggestions, please let me know. Thanks! Mr.Z-man 04:28, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

Kedah has issued its own gold and silver coins
The Malaysian state of Kedah has become the second state after Kelantan to issue its own coins. Unlike the Kelantanese dinar, which were struck only in gold,the Kedahan dinar also has silver coins denominated in Dirhams, with the smallest denomination being 5 Dirhams and the highest denomination being 20 Dinars. They are commemorative medal-coins that commemorate the Golden Jubilee of the Sultan of Kedah. - 203.211.72.242 (talk) 07:45, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

Deleting Representative money article
This unsourced article is basically WP:original research and all its examples either commodity or credit money. Until mainstream sources willing to acknowledge this as a separate category, this should be eliminated. I'll AfD it if no one else wants to. CarolMooreDC (talk) 15:43, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Numismaticnotice → WikiProject Numismatics?
Most WikiProjects' Banners follow this unofficial naming convention. What about WikiProject Numismatics? SkyBonTalk\Contributions 15:54, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Request for reviews--Numismatics-related Boulton article at FA
Matthew Boulton is currently a Featured Article Candidate here and it contains a large numismatics element and would be only the fifth article from this WikiProject to be an FA. I'd be grateful for reviews and comments at the FAC, reached through the above link! Thanks.--Wehwalt (talk) 15:27, 24 June 2009 (UTC)

Changes to popular pages lists
There are a few important changes to the popular pages system. A quick summary: -- Mr.Z-man 00:23, 12 July 2009 (UTC)
 * The "importance" ranking (for projects that use it) will be included in the lists along with assessment.
 * The default list size has been lowered to 500 entries (from 1000)
 * I've set up a project on the Toolserver for the popular pages - ~alexz/pop/.
 * This includes a page to view the results for projects, including the in-progress results from the current month. Currently this can only show the results from a single project in one month. Features to see multiple projects or multiple months may be added later.
 * This includes a new interface for making requests to add a new project to the list.
 * There is also a form to request a change to the configuration for a project. Currently the configurable options are the size of the on-wiki list and the project subpage used for the list.
 * The on-wiki list should be generated and posted in a more timely and consistent manner than before.
 * The data is now retained indefinitely.
 * The script used to generate the pages has changed. The output should be the same. Please report any apparent inconsistencies (see below).
 * Bugs and feature requests should be reported using the Toolserver's bug tracker for "alexz's tools" -

Are there enough articles on Wikipedia to justify an Outline of numismatics?
Here's a discussion about subject development you might find interesting.

The Transhumanist 23:35, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

GA reassessment of Peace Dollar
I have conducted a reassessment of the above article as part of the GA Sweeps process. I have found some concerns with the referencing which you can see at Talk:Peace Dollar/GA1. I have placed the article on hold whilst these are fixed. You are being informed as this project's banner is on the article talk page. Thanks. Jezhotwells (talk) 22:59, 9 August 2009 (UTC)

Excessive non-free images in articles
Database_reports/Pages_containing_an_unusually_high_number_of_non-free_files may be of interest. Whilst it is accepted that currency articles may contain a higher than normal number of non-free images due to their content, many of these articles contain very excessive numbers. Thoughts would be welcome. Black Kite 08:08, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Category:PD US money
Is there any reason why Category:PD US money (which has 373 members) has not been created? I thought I'd ask before just going ahead and creating it, in case there was some history of which I was unaware. Thanks. DH85868993 (talk) 05:51, 29 August 2009 (UTC)
 * It's been created now (by someone else). DH85868993 (talk) 08:18, 2 October 2009 (UTC)

Different currencies
Is it possible to create a method of converting currencies in an article. For example, if it is written 100 Rand (250 USD), the latter could be automatically translated from the former and adjusted according to user settings, so in Europe it would read 100 Rand (200 euro)? We have this for measurements, so surely all that is needed is a way to automatically update the exchange rates at regular intervals to provide the conversion calculations with data and perhaps fix those rates to a particular data where the data is date specific: 100 dollars (200 in todays money).- J.Logan`t : 15:32, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Pics
Selected pictures 2 & 5 (Portal:Numismatics/Selected picture) were deleted by CommonsDelinker.

--Carlo Morino aka zi' Carlo 14:16, 7 September 2009 (UTC)

Currency in Dumas' Musketeer novels
The AfD discussion for this article would benefit from some expert input. ChildofMidnight (talk) 23:10, 19 October 2009 (UTC)

Value of coins?
Hey project, just wondering if there is a resource, which can be used as a reliable source, which gives current values of coins. Just doing some research on some coins at moment for articles, and am having trouble finding the answer to this question. --Russavia I'm chanting as we speak 22:17, 24 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Is it a modern coin? If it is you can use any currency converting Web site like xe.com. – Zntrip 22:32, 24 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Modern coins, but commemoratives. For example, one coin has a nominal value of approx US$850, but is made of gold with a 12cm diametre and weights approx 3kg, and only 50 were minted. Obviously, such a coin would be worth a lot more than its approx US$850 face value. I know that there are catalogues for things like stamps. Is there such a thing for coins? --Russavia I'm chanting as we speak 22:40, 24 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes, Krause published a Standard Catalog of World Coins, that is your best bet. There are also single nation guides for some countries by other publishers.  I won't post links, just google.--Wehwalt (talk) 23:19, 24 October 2009 (UTC)
 * You can find a number of coin catalogues and old auction catalogues free on Google Books. These are a good bet. Just type in the specific coin or nation you're looking for. There's also this site, that carries the value for nearly every circulating world coin.  Quite a feat, really, but don't know if I'd call it 100% reliable or authoritative. Finally, if you can't find it in any of those resources, look it up on a large, reliable retailer's site and quote their retail price, making sure to reference it as such. This gives a good idea of what the market will bear. --Whoosit (talk) 13:42, 25 October 2009 (UTC)
 * or search ebay listings, including closed ones. With a mintage so low, there may not be one, but who knows?--Wehwalt (talk) 12:28, 26 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Wehwalt, thanks for the Krause reference. I googled it and managed to find the 2010 edition; it's a great help for some lists I am working on. --Russavia I'm chanting as we speak 07:13, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

Dime
I have concerns that Dime (United States coin) is woefully short of FA status, and would suggest that any editor take a good look at it. Ten Pound Hammer, his otters and a clue-bat • (Many otters • One bat • One hammer) 15:21, 7 November 2009 (UTC)


 * I'm not a fairly active coin collector anymore but I'll at least have a look at it. As I have no reference works, though, I'm not sure what I can do to help.--Wehwalt (talk) 15:59, 7 November 2009 (UTC)

FAR
nominated Dime (United States coin) for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Remove" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Ten Pound Hammer, his otters and a clue-bat • (Many otters • One bat • One hammer) 20:50, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

The sources can't agree on the location of the event
I've gotten into a dispute with W Nowicki over the Hawaii overprint note. Originally, when I wrote the article, I had two sources that agreed on what type of facility burnt the notes first (a crematorium) but couldn't agree on the exact location. I noted this discrepancy and made a note mark to explain should someone do a factcheck. W Nowicki edited the article and made a direct link to Oahu Cemetery. I went back and reverted it, because my two sources couldn't agree on the exact site, only what type of facility burned the notes first. He then complained and questioned my revert, noting that Oahu cemetery is known as Nu'uanu/is in Nu'uanu, so it matches (from what I can infer). I tried to explain that my sources couldn't agree who burnt what and that it would create a potential verifiability problem. I then noticed in the Oahu cemetery article that one of his references specifically states Nu'uanu cemetery, not Oahu Cemetery in relation to a passage on the notes.

So I have 2 sources that say Oahu Cemetery, and 2 that say Nu'uanu Cemetery/Crematorium. Do I just keep the note mark intact because nobody can ID locations accurately, or just make the change to Oahu cemetery and completely ignore the other two references? --293.xx.xxx.xx (talk) 01:06, 21 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Let me try another example. Let us say a book says something happened in "The United States of America", while a newspaper article quotes someone saying it happened in "America". Would you think that it would require a footnote indicating that those two sources "did not agree"? "America" is a similar shorthand that people would be quoted using,and even though experts would say that "America" really includes Canada and Mexico at least, someone could fairly easily answer the question by following the link. You removed the link, so someone would instead be confused into thinking there were two places involved.


 * The archived web site that you gave me, here does not seem to support your claim either that there are two crematories involved. It says the "Nuuanu Memorial Park" was founded in 1949. So even if it had another crematory, how could it have been involved in an event that is documented as happening in 1942?


 * Also to be precise, "mortuary" is a business that provides funeral services. The Nuuanu Mortuary would be a businiess, not a crematory, which is a building. Note also the address given on the web page you supplied is only one block away from the one given for Oahu Cemetery. Why in the world would you claim that someone would light a fire of cash in the middle of a funeral home, instead of at the cremation facility that is across the street? Anyway, I need to move on. Sounds like mediation is the only solution? W Nowicki (talk) 03:49, 21 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Howabout you cool your horses and allow other editors to offer their opinions first? The issue at hand is how come two sources have a completely different location than the other two sources? I got one with the questionable location, you got one as well. It begs to ask and review why we have the discrepancy in the first place! --293.xx.xxx.xx (talk) 09:24, 21 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Wow, I was the one that tried to start a discussion instead of doing a total revert. Yes, please, that is what I was suggesting. That someone actually do the "verifying". The address of the Oahu cemetery office is at "2162 Nuuanu Avenue, Honolulu, HI" phone (808) 538-1538. The web site on archive.org gives the address of the Nuuanu Mortuary funeral home as "2233 Nuuanu Avenue" Honolulu, Hawaii", phone  (808) 537-5255. They both say they are located in the Nuuanu Valley. Best of course would be for someone to visit the site and get some pictures of the crematory, or buy the book that the cemetery published. Or just do what I did, look up those addresses on a physical paper map or map service of your choice. Pull them both up on your screen side by side. Then give your opinion as to if they are "completely different location[s]".


 * While there, could someone verify that both of those (and the Aiea, Hawaii linked in the article) are on the island of Oahu? Esteemed colleague 293 took out the category "History of Oahu". Can you verify that neither of these are on Oahu? The link to crematory (which describes the facility) was also changed to cremation (which describes the funeral process). Can you verify that the link to the facility is not relevant?


 * Another example, recently I ran across an old source that mentioned "Canton China", while a more modern one called it "Guangzhou". Now if someone changed a wikilink to Guangzhou instead to a footnote indicating there was a "discrepancy", would this be an "improvement"? The article clearly states the two names. It would be misleading to call it a "discrepancy" when the facts indicated they are alternate names for the same place. W Nowicki (talk) 17:38, 21 November 2009 (UTC)


 * We have four sources with two different locations. As much as a local aspect would say otherwise, Verifiability will cause someone to question why two of the sources says one location and why two other sources says another. As the page states: The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth—that is, whether readers are able to check that material added to Wikipedia has already been published by a reliable source, not whether we think it is true. So the main issue right now is, what should be done in this situation. Does the sources need to go thru a potential Original Research route, or does this require some other outlet of resolution?--293.xx.xxx.xx (talk) 18:07, 21 November 2009 (UTC)
 * I will be in Honolulu in early January, if I can help.--Wehwalt (talk) 18:09, 21 November 2009 (UTC)


 * It's a bit confusing because several cemeteries run into each other along Nuuanu Ave: Oahu Cemetery at 2162 Nuuanu Avenue (on the left side of Nuuanu Ave, facing uphill), Nuuanu Memorial Park & Mortuary at 2233 Nuuanu Ave (one block mauka on the other side of Nuuanu Ave), Honolulu Memorial Park at 22 Craigside Place (across Nuuanu Ave from Oahu Cemetery), and the Royal Mausoleum State Monument at 2261 Nuuanu Ave (at the mauka end of Nuuanu Memorial Park). Oahu Cemetery had the first crematorium on Oahu, designed by Oliver G. Traphagen in 1906. I uploaded the crematory photo to Wikimedia Commons and have more photos from Oahu Cemetery and Kyoto Gardens of Honolulu Memorial Park on my Flickr site Joel Abroad. I'd be happy to upload them to the Commons, if anyone needs them. I think Oahu Cemetery is the only one with a crematory, although there are now at least two other crematories on Oahu (including one for pets!). (BTW, Aiea, Hawaii is on Oahu, next to Pearl Harbor.) Joel (talk) 00:24, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

Yes, the rules of verifiability mean the burden of proof is now on you to show that these two places are "completely different" in your words. I gave ways to verify that they are the same place. We are certainly allowed to do "research", just not "original". I would be happy to go there myself if you send a ticket, but that would be "original research" :-) Thousands of people have gone there to visit the famous grave sites, so seeing the two across the street from each other can hardly be called "original". Get any decent guidebook to Honolulu. The Royal Mausoleum and Buddhist temples at the cemetery are on the NRHP, so they are also well visited. But I had to settle for looking them up on a map. If you do not trust on-line maps, get a paper one, or an atlas from a library. Maps should be considered reliable sources, since they are generally better researched than newspaper articles. Your claim that they are "completely different" sounds "original" to me. You are the first person so say that, which is what "original" means. Original research does not belong on Wikipedia; please give verifiable soruces that back up your claim that they are  "completely different".

There also might be (I hope unintentional) racist point of view: that Hawaiians are not be trusted since they make things up. Is that what you were implying by removing the "History of Oahu" category? Wikipedia requires a neutral point of view. So at least mention the possibility that a local newspaper article might use a nearby modern landmark to describe something that happened in the past, or you are presenting only a biased point of view. Also to be precise, the newspaper article does not say it was burned "in" the mortuary, but the money was "taken to" the mortuary and burned in "the crematory there". Medcalf is an expert in Numismatics (he has written a book), not on funerary practices, so he deserves presumption of good faith that he did not know the mortuary did not open until 1949. How about, as a compromise, a note that says something like:


 * Simpson notes Oahu Cemetery as the first burn site;[3] however, in a local newspaper[4] Medcalf mentions Nuuanu Mortuary, a Funeral Home that opened in 1949 across the street from the original 1844 cemetery.

My sources: Mortuary opened in 1949 — — and —

Early history of the 1844 founding of Oahu Cemetery and later expansion:

Source indicating two names used:

Source (better researched than local newspaper?) that the Oahu Cemetery crematory was used:

More sources that a crematory was used instead of a funeral home for actual burning: —

A perhaps morbid source that shows the cremation price of the funeral home across the street from the crematory to be the same:


 * Let's try to avoid this deteriorating further. Is it possible to get business directories/telephone books from that era?  Would that resolve it?  What if someone were to submit a FOIA request to the Department of the Treasury?--Wehwalt (talk) 19:41, 22 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Several mortuaries offer Cremation Services in the 2009 Yellow Pages, among them Nuuanu Memorial Park and Mortuary, but not Oahu Cemetery, which actually has its own crematory and still provides cremation services for other mortuaries. Most mortuaries subcontract cremation services. The operative question is how many crematories, not how many different mortuaries there are/were in Nuuanu. The main branch of the Hawaii State Library has old telephone directories in its Hawaii & Pacific section, but they may not have them going that far back. Hours and telephone numbers are at the link. If they were open on Sunday I would have already called them. They would love this kind of question. Joel (talk) 00:16, 23 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Call them tomorrow, then. Let's see if we can resolve this.--Wehwalt (talk) 00:34, 23 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Linda Sueyoshi at the Hawaii State Library Hawaii & Pacific section was kind enough to look in the Polk City Directory from 1941-42, where she found only two crematories listed on Oahu: Oahu Cemetery on Nuuanu Ave and Honolulu Crematory on Puuhale Road. (In the 1940-41 directory, the latter is called the Japanese Crematory, but probably changed its name after war with Japan broke out.) Joel (talk) 21:10, 23 November 2009 (UTC)

Breaches of Etiquette and No personal attacks notwithstanding, I appreciate the fact that saner heads have come in and at least offered some help in this matter. But it still doesn't alleviate the concern that someone is gonna come in, look at the references, and upon abit of digging, finds out that "Hey, how come we have two locations?". I'm seriously doubtful they'll dig THAT deep, but if I made the mistake, someone else could make it as well. I did seek advice independently, but it's abit more confusing than it's worth.--293.xx.xxx.xx (talk) 11:03, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

Sorry if you considered my bringing up the rules of evidence as a "personal attack", if you did, that it was not intentional on my part, sorry. I was just wondering why you did not assume good faith and discuss instead of reverting. My assumption was that someone who cared would follow the wikilink, instead of the "under construction" one. Now back to the article: exactly what part of my proposed compromise do the editors here feel is not verifiable? W Nowicki (talk) 18:35, 26 November 2009 (UTC)


 * It's more than that. You've mentioned "take it to mediation" twice before you went thru the process first, your tone of writing indicates to me that your trying to egg me into doing or saying something to escalate it into forced mediation, you've accused me of racism (even putting the disclaimer "unintentionally" doesn't absolve the fact that your still accusing me), you have not adequately addressed the possible original research implications of just "ignoring" or "go with local knowledge" of the locations, and I might be forgetting other things. I've been patient with you up until the racism jab. I think at this point I have just cause to throw out good faith.--293.xx.xxx.xx (talk) 22:08, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

Well perhaps to late, but I am also sorry if I misunderstood the exact process terminology; my fault there. What I meant was waiting for the opinions of others before reverting. I was trying to say above that I could understand an original author interested in the Numismatic aspects of the event might put in such a note. But with an article that explains the historic and geographic aspects, that a link to such an article with sources explaining its names would be reasonable. And I thought there were enough verifiable sources saying it did happen on Oahu, which was why I added the category. I was trying to get the rticle to present a neutral point of view, not "egg" anybody. And I still do not understand the "original" question: I have never been there myself, based the change on only published sources. It seemed to me that claiming they were "completely different" without even allowing the opposite point of view was at least "original". I did not "accuse" any specific person of anything except reverting, I was talking about the article. If the consensus is still that they are "completeley different" despite the evidence, I can live with the consenus. Peace. W Nowicki (talk) 03:13, 27 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Look, i'm willing to compromise with you. A note mark in both articles to at least mention the location discrepancy in the references. That way, at least it's mentioned and someone won't nick the articles with a Reference violation mark of sorts. I'll restore the category thing I removed as well. --293.xx.xxx.xx (talk) 17:39, 28 November 2009 (UTC)

Yes, thank you for your patience. Reading my question about Neutral Point of View, it would have been totally out of line if aimed personally. It was meant for the group as a whole about the article. The Hawaii project has many cases of vandalism from people who think articles have a point of view they disagree with, so we need to be overly careful as we collaborate. I still think the Hawaii overprint note article should at least admit a possibility that the two are different descriptions of the same place, since we have not seen one bit of evidence they are different places, and many that use the names interchangably. And would prefer a link to Oahu Cemetery so readers (who care about the historical and geographic details) could decide based on all the evidence we have uncovered, but this not worth world war III.

Are we allowed to cite the phone book mentioned above, from the the "Polk City Directory"? A few other articles cite them. I did try to explain the naming confusion in Oahu Cemetery but can work on it some more. The other possibility is that a top-secret crematory was built named for the valley and street where the 1906 one was located, in order to confuse Wikipedia editors. :-) Aloha. W Nowicki (talk) 18:25, 28 November 2009 (UTC)

Article naming
A while ago, Shilling (British coin) was moved to British shilling coin. I disagree with this move, which also seems inconsistent with other article names, and would like to see it put back. What do you guys here think? 81.152.168.199 (talk) 14:42, 21 November 2009 (UTC).

Which Æthelred?
Can you help with identifying a coin? commons:File:Ethelred coin.gif is noted on the description page as being a penny of Æthelred of Wessex (Æthelred I). I don't have anything better to consult than a PDF of Grueber's Handbook of coins ... in the British Museum. But looking at that, it does look much more likely that this is a coin of Æthelred the Unready (Æthelred II}. Can anyone confirm or deny this? Many thanks in advance, Angus McLellan (Talk) 00:54, 30 November 2009 (UTC)

washington quater;
i was looking through my pocket change as i do on a regular basis,and found a 1984 denver mint washington quarter,on the reverse side the [ A ] in quarter dollar is missing that struck me as being odd,i checked my red book and they made a change in the dies for that year so that the strike would be low relief,but i guess something happened in the striking of this quater for there to be no A i havent found another one as of yet,has anyone else found one,and could this be constitued as an error coin and if it does what kind of value would be placed on it, thanks, [ ]  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Countrydanny (talk • contribs) 19:11, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

Userbox
I have created a userbox for this project. What do you all think of it? -- NerdyScienceDude :)  (click here to talk to me) 15:44, 27 December 2009 (UTC)