Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Pokémon/Archive 4

Next Pokémon Creature Article

 * Blaziken looks like it needs some help. Alvin6226 03:31, 24 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Hm, it is the weakest out of the Torchic line, but I'll probably clean up Combusken first. H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 06:55, 24 May 2006 (UTC)


 * Houndoom is utterly riddled with POV. It does have a nice line of Dobermann lighting effects though ; ) H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 13:06, 28 May 2006 (UTC)


 * !!! I was adding the tcg scans to each Pokémon when I came across Venonat. It looks horrible! Alvin6226 16:39, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
 * All the information is there, it's mostly formatting. I may pick one of these after I'm done with Combusken (haha it took a day, we just can't nominate for FA.. ever) so I'll move on. H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 16:51, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
 * It's not horrid anymore, right? Erik the Appreciator 19:38, 16 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Makuhita This has been redone by myself and others. Erik the Appreciator 19:38, 16 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Shuppet H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 08:01, 29 May 2006 (UTC)
 * This I have revised as well. Erik the Appreciator 19:38, 16 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Something inside me really wants to see Plusle become a good article. Perhaps it's the . (But it would be alanis if Minun became good first.) --Damian Yerrick (☎) 22:51, 9 June 2006 (UTC)
 * They should both be good articles, it would be strange if one was good and the other wasn't.  Minun   (talk) 17:18, 30 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Mew (Pokémon)--The Raven's Apprentice (Call) 15:36, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Sure, just point out any problems with this article and I'll help you fix them.  Minun   (talk) 15:41, 30 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Treecko-Compared to Mudkip and Torchic, It's fellow Hoenn starters it is horrible!-- A c1983fan  ( talk  •  contribs ) 00:10, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Someone write an anime section and it'll be a GA within a week, we just lift the text from Torchic and Mudkip and changes a word here and there. ;) H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 15:45, 26 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Okay, the anime needs cleaning and the manga needs written, but it's good people. H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 19:50, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
 * the anime section has already been written, do you think its good enough for GA yet, if not, please suggest improvements.  Minun   (talk) 15:12, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes, write one. Ash has one, I think we pull out more than one sentence. And Wally has a Treecko in Pokémon Adventures, write about that. H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 15:22, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Rapidash needs a little love. H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 15:44, 26 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Sure, just point out any problems in this article  Minun   (talk) 15:25, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Merge "Appearance" with intro, cleanup the videogames, prose TCG, expand anime. If you check Eevee, a Rapidash appears in the same manga chapter, it has the same plot has the Rapidash race. Yeah, H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 15:30, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * I've managed to do most of it, but there was a few parts I had trobule with. I hope my editing helps.  Minun   (talk) 15:40, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Linoone: Yikes, what the hell happened here!? Better check it out, folks. Erik the Appreciator 19:47, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
 * It's certainly interesting vandalism... H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 19:51, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Reverted, it's been sitting like that a week. The IP's been doing it to various articles, but he got reverted. But never warned. He is now the owner of a final warning, since I'm not in the charitable mood. H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 19:57, 29 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Zigzagoon - has good anime, pokédex and videogames, lacks TCG or manga. H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 15:33, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * I don't know much about the manga, but I would be happy to help with the TCG section.  Minun   (talk) 15:44, 30 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Paras (Pokémon) *faints* H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 16:33, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Sure, just point out any problems again.  Minun   (talk) 17:14, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * I've noticed that page had a rather small amount of content. I'm improving parts of it, but I need help on the sections focusing on Paras' role in the Pokémon things I'm not into(the anime, manga, and card game) --RandomOrca2 04:07, 6 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Cleffa
 * Clefable H ig hway Batman! 20:55, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Ivysaur
 * Poliwhirl
 * Politoed
 * Poliwag H ig hway Batman! 20:58, 3 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Bagon, lacking everything, including an image. H ig hway Batman! 23:41, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

Next Miscellaneous Article
''I reommend choosing Max as the next focus article. Thoughts? The Raven's Apprentice (Call) 11:25, 17 May 2006 (UTC)'' Other Mishaps? This article might need some help. Alvin6226 02:30, 18 May 2006 (UTC)


 * By the way, that's Max (Pokémon) (obviously). And come to think of it, even Poké Ball and Team Aqua and Team Magma need help. Thoughts?? The Raven's Apprentice (Call) 07:27, 19 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Max (Pokémon) needs the borrowed Pokémon section removed, and lots more cleanup, so it would thus be good as a miscellena next article--XenoN e on (converse) 11:23, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Make sure the ugly table of Pokémon is replaced with prose! Please! - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 05:56, 24 May 2006 (UTC)
 * The Pokémon character articls are now being taken care of by WP:PAC2, so we should be taking a non-character article. How about Poké Ball or Glitch City?? The Raven's Apprentice (Call) 07:43, 7 June 2006 (UTC)
 * I think that Pokemon Ranger should be our next focus.-- A c1983fan  ( talk  •  contribs ) 23:43, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Let's not do a speculative article if we can at all avoid it. Poké Ball needs a lot of love, Max (Pokémon) needs work despite the presence of WP:PAC2. and all of the glitches still need to be collapsed into a single article. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 00:19, 9 June 2006 (UTC)
 * WHAT?! If the glitches are merged, we need to transwiki the original articles somewhere else. Okay, so they don't belong in an encyclopedia, but they're very informative for people who want to exploit the glitches. And they're much better than their Bulbapedia counterparts. The Raven's Apprentice (Call) 06:10, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

Even Pokémon trainer needs a lot of work. The Raven's Apprentice (Call) 15:11, 16 June 2006 (UTC) The aforementioned article just needs some heavyhanded deletion. The Raven's Apprentice (Call) 11:43, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Right, lets just all point out all the problems with the article, this way we can find out which is most important, and we can help fix the article.  Minun   (talk) 17:03, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

Pokémon Episodes
I think we should create articles about Pokémon episodes, because List_of_Pokémon_episodes links to articles about individual Pokémon episodes. The articles seems to be abandones, so we should help create them. COmments will be appreciated, thanks --Pokesaur 15:45, 28 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I also have a few tips on what we can have:
 * An events section, a list of main events in the episode
 * A characters section, a list of the main characters in the episode
 * A storyline, the main part, what happens in the episode Pokesaur 19:33, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

No, no, no, no, NO! Episode guides are non-encyclopedaic, trivial and worthless. While Wiki is not paper, they waste disk space and slow the servers. It's unnecessary and futile. Please, please don't create these articles. Thanks! &mdash;Cel es tianpower háblame 19:39, 28 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Im just saying because there are existing Pokémon episodes created by other users at Category:Pokémon episodes, should we delete those? Pokesaur 19:42, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
 * If I had my way, we would, but AfD is getting lighter and lighter these days. They have to stay or be merged but 2 wrongs don't make a right. &mdash;Cel es tianpower háblame 19:46, 28 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Many The Simpsons, Family Guy, South Park, and Arrested Development pages have their own, separate episode articles. You're swimming against the tide of these articles. Hbdragon88 01:11, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * They mostly have these articles because the support for them is unified and the opposition is not, plus it's a lot harder to stop something from being added or delete it after the fact than it is to ignore it. I'm willing to set a precedent by saying, "No, this isn't appropriate for Wikipedia, starting with the Pokémon anime," but I don't have to, since they're all copyvio anyway and can be deleted at my leisure. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 01:14, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

I am deleting, as blatant copyvio, any episode pages that are blatantly copied from Bulbapedia. This has gone on long enough, and Bulbapedia has asked us to remove them, repeatedly. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 01:00, 30 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I've taken to mass-tagging the episode articles as copyvio. Can anyone help me with that? The Raven's Apprentice  (Talk 15:37, 1 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Just make sure it is a copyvio before you tag it.-- A c1983fan  ( talk  •  contribs ) 15:41, 1 July 2006 (UTC)


 * I am doing that, or there wouldn't be any articles still left in Category:Pokémon episodes. The Raven's Apprentice  (Talk 16:08, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

July roll call
The list of members on the front page is getting REALLY long, so let's weed it a little. It's time for a roll call. If you're still interested in working on this project's articles (even if you're not doing so right now; I'm just removing people who aren't active on WP or aren't interested any more), please sign below.

# ~


 * 1) - A Man In Bl♟ck  (conspire | past ops) 00:41, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * 2) - Erik the Appreciator 00:44, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * 3) - Toastypk 01:01, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * 4) - Hbdragon88 01:14, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * 5) -  PCEevee   talk  01:30, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * 6) - T e tsuya-san (talk : contribs) 02:29, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * 7) - H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 08:24, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * 8) &mdash;Cel es tianpower háblame 09:56, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * 9)   Minun   (talk)
 * 10) The Raven's Apprentice (Call) 15:00, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * 11) Alvin6226 talk 05:34, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
 * 12) XenoN e on (converse)
 * 13)  A  c1983fan  ( talk  •  contribs ) 15:30, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
 * 14) smurrayinch  e  ster( User ), ( Talk ) 05:52, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
 * 15) Shadoom1
 * 16) GangstaEB
 * 17) いかづち(ikadzuchi)-Squeak 14:24, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
 * 18) Zappernapper 02:17, 11 July 2006 (UTC)
 * 19) RandomOrca2 03:17, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

Pokémon Ranger?
The game is out already but the article has little to no information about it. I know I have no right to ask anything of you guys but I think you should make it your next project. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.65.44.127 (talk • contribs)
 * It has only been released in Japan... Alvin6226 talk 05:47, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
 * We need to move the box art to the infobox, and create a gallery for the screenshots. H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 10:23, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I'll give that, and some actual updates in the game, a shot. - T e tsuya-san (talk : contribs) 11:45, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Did some re-arranging, the links need to be turned into refs. H ig hway Batman! 11:56, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Yikes, you're doing reference things too? Well, I'll let you do it since I'm fidgety with them. I did some reorganisation of the pictures and headers and such, but I'll leave you to some cleanup if needed since I'm kinda out of time. - T e tsuya-san (talk : contribs) 12:27, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Just point out any problems with this article :)  Minun   (talk) 15:15, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Needs cleanup, destubbificational processation; should be next focus article and a priority --XenoN e on (converse) 06:38, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

Article start template
Since, with the release of D&P later this year (at least in Japan), a lot of new pokemon species articles will be created. so, I propose we have a template that provides the bare backbone for the species articles. I have a working version at my userspace, feel free to edit it as you see fit. So... any comments?-- A c19  83fan  21:07, 2 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree, cheers  Minun   (talk) 15:36, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the suggestion, its been created, its at Template:Pokestart, cheers  Minun   (talk) 15:38, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

Portal:Pokémon/Featured article
The portal has been updated again, we are now showcasing Eevee. Future candidates can be nominated here, please nominate varied articles, if Umbreon and Eevee have both been showcased recently, don't nominate Flareon. Cheers, H ig hway Batman! 21:44, 2 July 2006 (UTC)

Celadon Mansion
Can someone take a look at Celadon Mansion and clean it up/wikify it? I'm not familiar with the subject matter but just stumbled upon it, so figured I'd bring it here. Metros232 03:57, 3 July 2006 (UTC)


 * I've had a go at cleaning it up; it seemed to be almost entirely a history of Bill in the Pokémon anime, which is odd since I don't think Bill ever even lived there... smurrayinch e  ster( User ), ( Talk ) 06:14, 3 July 2006 (UTC)


 * I think the woman was Bill's grandmother. Anyway, should this just be merged into Celadon City, which already has a transcript of the dimploma?   PCEevee   talk  18:33, 6 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes. Celadon City is just about worthy enough of an article (although in the long run should probably be merged into a list). Celadon Mansion can easily be covered in it - it's certainly not too long and I hope it never will be. &mdash;Cel es tianpower háblame 15:51, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I've performed the merge; I agree that it probably shouldn't have had its own article. smurrayinch e  ster( User ), ( Talk ) 17:15, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

Pokemon cloning
The article about pokemon cloning/duplicating (in gold and silver) isn't very informative about what it is, its more like a "how to do" guide, could someong fix it or delete it, I'm not very good at fixing whole articles.Shadoom1 07:08, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
 * The link to the article in question is Pokémon cloning. Personally, I think any actual information should just be merged into Pokémon Red and Blue or Pokémon Gold and Silver.  I also would be slightly supportive if somebody proposed that this article should just be deleted.   PCEevee   talk  18:32, 6 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I'd transwiki it to StrategyWiki or similar. smurrayinch e  ster( User ), ( Talk ) 21:56, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

Featured articles
I'd suggest that we work on a couple of our good articles and promote them to featured status, a list of articles can be found on the project page, cheers  Minun   (talk) 18:35, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Pokémon Trading Card Game is now on peer review, please write comments on its subpage, cheers again  Minun   (talk) 18:50, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

POV rampant
several, several articles are out there with POV like "this pokemon is favored" or "a (any adjective) moveset would be..." and other ridiculous things that should NOT be included in an encyclopeadic (sp) entry on a particular pokemon, that kind of stuff is best left for forums and serebii.net. i think we really need to make a concentrated effort on all the articles to remove POV statements, helping to elevate the project as a whole. is anyone else in favor of this? we could start a new section on the project page listing the NPOV pages and those that still need to be changed (for those uncomfortable with making edits). i'm willing to go ahead an start, but the project is daunting and i'd like to make sure others out there are interested in this too. Zappernapper 20:54, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I noticed the statements you made at Talk:Umbreon, and I'll use that article and your arguments as examples. I think there's a flaw in your reasoning.  However, I could be wrong; somebody else should correct me if I am.  Whichever way, I think it's great that you read about Wikipedia's policies; many new editors don't do that.


 * According to the official WP:NPOV policy, the NPOV is "not the absence or elimination of viewpoints". In the example you presented at Umbreon, both a positive and a negative statement about Umbreon's use in battle were presented, which creates balance and presents both viewpoints as objectively as possible.  The NPOV policy continues by saying that "Background is provided on who believes what and why, and which view is more popular."  Therefore, it is also alright to say how popular Umbreon is among trainers.


 * In conclusion, the article is allowed to say whether people think Umbreon is great for battle or not, but it's not allowed to simply say whether the article thinks Umbreon should be used in battle.  PCEevee   talk  01:48, 10 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Just list a couple of articles that you need help with, cheers  Minun   (talk) 10:25, 10 July 2006 (UTC)


 * perhaps more what i'm quibbling over isn't so much whether or not the articles are allowed to discuss popularity of a pokemon among players, but rather the way it's being discussed. To quote from Umbreon itself, "Umbreon is perhaps the most un-used of the Eeveelutions... due to the fact it can't learn any powerful Dark-type moves such as Crunch, players preferring...."  a statement like this is pure specualation without any reference given to even an internet poll on a heavily used fan-site, adding "perhaps" is just weasely.  Opinion and speculation are not suitable in an encyclopedia.  maybe removing that specific statement entirely (unless it can be backed by some factual data) and then reworking the sentence that later comes up discussing Umbreon's strengths to include its weaknesses as well. Like -
 * Umbreon's movepool works in tandem with his above average defenses, including moves like confuse ray, mean look, snatch, and moonlight. This of course means that he doesn't learn very many strong attacks, namely crunch, because of his low special and physical attack stats.  Other alternatives for more "aggressive" movesets would be Houndoom or Tyranitar.
 * It's kinda wordy and not the best written but i think you get my point. Also we need to remember that not everyone is always up on the lingo, so using jargon like "tank" and "annoyer" should be avoided unless it's briefly explained. Or better yet, linked to a page detailing what this terminology means *winks*
 * Zappernapper 02:13, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

Things to do
I've picked up a few tips on how to improve an article:


 * Determine if conversions are included
 * Determine if standard abbreviations are used for conversions
 * Determine if units are spelled out in text
 * Determine if last few sections (see also, references, notes, external links) follow WP:GTL
 * Determine if extraneous bolding is used
 * Determine if categories and interlanguage links are alphabetized
 * Determine if quotes have sources
 * Show that all fair use images have proper fair use rationales
 * Determine if all images have captions
 * Find out the number of sections
 * Determine if sections or paragraphs are too short
 * Determine if a list is used
 * Determine if footnote spacing standards are used (as in WP:FOOTNOTE)
 * Find common redunancies
 * Time/future issues
 * Check w/ U:SUGG to see if any other things are missing
 * Improving efficiency

Please put them into good user, cheers  Minun   (talk) 14:55, 10 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Isn't this all covered in the style guide? H ig hway Batman! 15:19, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Pretty much all of it IIRC --XenoN e on (converse) 19:56, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Charizard
According to Charizard's peer review, the article Charizard needs references. It has been suggest we search for a reference on the internet that fits the ifnroamtion thats given, and then use it, cheers  Minun   (talk) 18:06, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
 * The new "In other media" section needs expansion and copy-editing, any volunteers  Minun   (talk) 10:50, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

More G/S Glitch City info
I just did some "experiments" on my Gold with the Gold/Silver glitch city and I put a whole lot of info in the disscussion bit, could some one put it in the article in a more Wikipedia-like format than its currently in. Shadoom1 03:43, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

Category:Pokémon lead images
First of all, can an admin dig out Image:16pidgey.png? I have a source, but I never knew it was up for deletion. Second of all, can I ask people to implement Template:Pli, a template that provides a source and a fair use rationale? For instructions on how to use it, see Template talk:Pli. Cheers, H ig hway Batman! 10:24, 11 July 2006 (UTC)
 * If you have a source, why can't you reupload it? That mystery aside, it has been restored. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 10:36, 11 July 2006 (UTC)
 * It's easier to restore it that than reupload it. Thank you, H ig hway Batman! 10:49, 11 July 2006 (UTC)