Wikipedia talk:WikiProject RISC OS/Archive 2

Project scope
I'm surprised to see this project created. I didn't see anything posted at WT:COMP. Was it ever discussed at WikiProject_Council/Proposals? I'm really glad to see coordinated editing on any computing topic, but hate to see so much effort put in to infrastructure.

How many articles are estimated to be in the scope? According to the guide to WikiProjects it seems like a task force would be more appropriate.

doesn't even exist yet. That should be high on the priority list for this project. --Pnm (talk) 00:54, 3 February 2011 (UTC)


 * It's impossible to know all of this stuff in advance, until you commented I had no idea half of this documentation was even available, that half the procedures we were supposed to follow existed. I'd much rather spend my time editing articles than involved in minutia of how wikiprojects are administered, owned by other projects, task force vs project etc etc etc. It's been discussed on the most appropriate forums for locating people likely to contribute to it for the last several weeks, if we hadn't moved forward any momentum in doing this work would be lost.--Flibble (talk) 02:04, 3 February 2011 (UTC)


 * That's actually my point. Setting up and maintaining a project is a lot of work (which is somewhat lessened by leveraging the parent project). Did you read the discussion above? The documentation is linked and quoted. I'd have been happy to discuss it at WT:COMP. I urge you to create the category structure ASAP. (WP:HotCat is really helpful.) That'll give you the fastest idea of how many articles there are. --Pnm (talk) 02:56, 3 February 2011 (UTC)


 * As I mentioned below, can you point me at a project that uses the simpler one category system rather than the two category currently being used. I want to check to see if anything is lost (or gained for that matter) by changing. Incidentally I know how many pages are in scope at the moment, 37 (this is provided by the bots as currently setup). In response to question about potential size, perhaps a few hundred articles depending on how many pieces of software/games reach a level of notability or the ability to find references for. At the moment the project is (for me at least) providing the tools that I need it too, being able to track articles in scope, see their importance and quality, and it's easy to add articles and alter their quality/importance.--Flibble (talk) 04:08, 3 February 2011 (UTC)


 * I also concluded that a task force seemed appropriate. However, I noted that WikiProjects WP:Amiga and WikiProject Computer networking are actually listed as task forces. Unless I'm mistaken, haven't precedents been set? --trevj (talk) 11:04, 3 February 2011 (UTC)


 * As far as I know they've never been listed as task forces in WikiProject Computing/sidebar. If they're going to be considered task forces I think they should be moved to WikiProject Computing/Amiga task force and WikiProject Computing/RISC OS task force, for consistency with WikiProject Computing/Computer hardware task force and WikiProject Computing/Early computers task force.


 * If I were to guess, I'd say they're listed as "task forces" at WP:PROJDIR/S because they use the "task force" parameters of WPBannerMeta in WikiProject Computing (based on the mention of WP Software as "both a WikiProject and a task force"). --Pnm (talk) 15:17, 3 February 2011 (UTC)


 * This could be the fate of this project unless we recruit more members and I get my finger out and try to catch up with User:Flibble. --trevj (talk) 11:45, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

I've amended the project scope to include individuals. Project banner not yet added to such pages, in case any other considerations are voiced. --trevj (talk) 09:27, 16 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Note: Further to previous discussions, I'm taking this overdue discussion to WikiProject Council/Proposals/RISC OS. Thanks. -- Trevj (talk) 11:45, 4 May 2012 (UTC)

RISC OS assessment categories
I'd like to consolidate the RISC OS articles into and remove the subcategories of  and. It's a common way for small projects to handle their articles, and is accomplished by changing TF_10_ASSESSMENT_CAT to TF_10_MAIN_CAT in WikiProject Computing.

You can still browse articles and get statistics by quality or importance using the WP 1.0 tools. --Pnm (talk) 01:11, 3 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Can you point me at an example project that works in the way you describe, so I can check before commenting further.--Flibble (talk) 01:49, 3 February 2011 (UTC)


 * What about subcategories of the parent project? --trevj (talk) 11:49, 3 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Well on that documentation, we have the two categories in the sections "Article assessment requires a Category:Tulips articles by quality (and, optionally, a Category:Tulips articles by importance)", but not the category mention above that "Once the project begins to develop article-related processes, such as assessment or peer review, it is appropriate to create a subcategory for the various articles being tagged into them". I believe Pnm is suggesting removing the two categories currently present, and using just the one category, it's a wikiproject that uses categories in a similar manner that I wanted to see an example of before commenting further.--Flibble (talk) 13:37, 3 February 2011 (UTC)
 * I might be mistaken. There are some examples in but they all seem to have categories for articles by quality. I'll do some more research. --Pnm (talk) 15:07, 3 February 2011 (UTC)
 * A quick view through some of those task forces suggests they have quality indicators but no importance indicators. As such I wouldn't want to move to a model like that, it seems less useful.--Flibble (talk) 23:50, 9 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Not strictly assessment, but relating to categories: should we establish Category:RISC OS images (or Category:RISC OS files)? For example, File:AcornComputersLtdLogo.jpg is currently up for deletion (a vector version is now used) but it's not been flagged in the Article alerts because it's (rightly) not under Category:RISC OS articles. --trevj (talk) 06:43, 11 April 2011 (UTC)

I'm on the verge of adding Elite to the project, as a Mid-importance RISC OS item. But I don't know how it would be viewed if potentially every RISC OS game were to be added to WP:COMP, in order that they be included here in WP:RISCOS. 'Elite' is already within WP:VG, so I'm wondering if it'd be possible to do further work on the assessment categories in order that we can have a WP:RISCOS tag within WP:VG articles. I'm willing to look into this myself, if no one else has time to do so. Would we need something like Category:RISC OS games (similar to Category:Amiga games)? Flibble - if you think this is unworkable then please let me know. --Trevj (talk) 12:29, 27 April 2011 (UTC)

Free and open source software has a talk page banner for WP:WPSOFTWARE which is supported by WP:COMP so perhaps that indicates my proposal is viable. --Trevj (talk) 12:45, 27 April 2011 (UTC)


 * Does anyone have ideas for useful questions we could possibly ask at WT:CATP? I've had a brief look through the categories guidance but maybe someone reading this is more conversant than I am and would be able to suggest some pointers. Thanks. -- Trevj (talk) 08:46, 2 July 2012 (UTC)

Reference library
With more members of this project in the future, perhaps we could look at establishing a reference library - an awful lot of work and probably not something for 2011! --trevj (talk) 16:24, 9 February 2011 (UTC)

Proposed welcome template
He's a first draft. --trevj (talk) 14:55, 11 February 2011 (UTC)

It uses the safest web colors but that's probably OTT in 2011! It could probably do with toning down a little, really. A (cog?) logo can also be included in the future. --trevj (talk) 15:00, 11 February 2011 (UTC)


 * As non-free content is allowed only in articles, and a suitable licence cannot easily be arranged, perhaps it's simpler to create a derivative of File:Farm-Fresh cog.png. This could also be used in WikiProject Computing. --Trevj (talk) 08:57, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Or File:Gear 7.svg. --Trevj (talk) 07:54, 16 September 2011 (UTC)
 * This Green cogwheel will probably do for the mo. If anyone fancies tweaking it (e.g. reducing internal diameter, extending teeth) be my guest! (Use "Upload a new version of this file" link and edit the description accordingly.) --Trevj (talk) 06:00, 30 September 2011 (UTC)

In readiness for the immenent throngs of new members, WPRISCOSwelcome is now in beta release. There's a userbox at User WP RISCOS too. --Trevj (talk) 11:56, 30 September 2011 (UTC)

And an invitation template for talk pages at WPRISCOSinvite. --Trevj (talk) 13:43, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

for what?
Why does this project have Open tasks and Suggested articles on the project page? Can confuses me... mabdul 12:04, 28 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Thanks for having a look around here. Open tasks was created by the project template, WikiProject: as can be seen in the first page in the Project's history. Although not currently used, I guess that no one's commented it out, as a reminder that it's an available tool which could be used in the future - probably when more people join the project. The addition of Suggested articles is a good idea IMO, and not inconsistent with a number of other WikiProjects. Please note that this WikiProject is in its infancy. Anyway, does this make things any clearer? Thanks. --trevj (talk) 12:42, 28 February 2011 (UTC) Perhaps you're wondering why we have Suggested articles in addition to New articles, in which case you may have a point. We could consider merging them under the same heading. --trevj (talk) 13:14, 28 February 2011 (UTC)


 * I will look around here, as you can consider I add this project to my watchlist. I'm normally interested in architectures, old oses and anything related to the internet/www. I think merging is a good idea. mabdul 16:01, 28 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Regarding To do, in the longer term we may want to create a specific template, as other WikiProjects have done. --trevj (talk) 01:45, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

Games
For reference, there's this Acorn Archimedes game list. Many titles are unlikely to meet the notability requirements for dedicated articles, but the list could still be helpful here. --trevj (talk) 12:13, 28 March 2011 (UTC)

RISCOS Ltd
Now resurrected at RISCOS. Further improvements welcome. Please note the move proposal to RISCOS Ltd. --Trevj (talk) 14:24, 9 May 2011 (UTC)

Having given this a little more thought, I've decided that it might as well have a redirect from RISCOS Ltd for the moment. --Trevj (talk) 18:42, 9 May 2011 (UTC)


 * ✅ Moved. --Trevj (talk) 12:11, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

Miscellaneous red links (May 2011)
How important is it that the following red links are created? Are there a few relevant citations in each case, therefore justifying their creation under WP:NOTE? Or can their content be included within a section of a another article? (I've added a few others to Suggested articles.)

Please add to this list if you stumble across any others which you don't think should be added to the 'Suggested articles' list.


 * (not to be confused with Podule), could be included within Eurocard (printed circuit board)

ARMini, BiK
I'm not entirely sure of the ARMini and BiK pages, they are after all BeagleBoards in Boxes, would any specific content for them be better living on the Beagle Board page?--Flibble (talk) 15:41, 8 July 2011 (UTC)


 * You're right (for the moment?). I don't think that either the BiK or ARMini would currently meet the General notability guideline. Section(s) in BeagleBoard would probably be more appropriate. --Trevj (talk) 08:27, 11 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Notability is a rolling thing, if things happen in future and more refs become available, then yeah let's add them, marked as strikethrough till then.--Flibble (talk) 13:49, 11 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Not to be confused with Me and Armini or The Armini Foundation. --Trevj (talk) 08:19, 12 July 2011 (UTC)

Chris Williams (journalist born 1980s)
To quote the 'great man' himself on this idea "22:30 <@diodesign> jesus christ 22:31 <@diodesign> isn't one for drobe enough ?" --Flibble (talk) 11:20, 30 November 2011 (UTC)
 * Anyone is completely at liberty to remove the redlinks and strikethrough the proposal here. Obviously, such an article isn't a high priority - but a quick project to create the article (as a stub) is less daunting TBH than tackling issues with the existing aritcles which are lacking sources etc. (see ). Any such article would of course be subject to policies such as biographies of living persons and notability. For reference, there is a number of articles within, where such an article would probably belong. Regardless of any 'great man' opinions, if an article about a notable subject is informative to enclyopedia readers, then IMO it should be included (e.g. Amy Standen, Inkie, Denise Grey). -- Trevj (talk) 10:42, 1 December 2011 (UTC)

Article alerts
Note: This section is currently under test. --trevj (talk) 11:43, 29 March 2011 (UTC)

AFAIK, the (redlinked) page at WikiProject RISC OS/Article alerts will not be created/edited by User:AAlertBot until one of the tags listed at the AAlert specification is placed, e.g. a request to delete, move, peer review, etc. Until this happens, this section can be safely ignored. The page should not be created manually. Thanks. --trevj (talk) 10:05, 30 March 2011 (UTC)

Portal:Information_technology/WikiProjects
I add this project at Portal:Information_technology/WikiProjects. mabdul 14:15, 11 April 2011 (UTC)


 * --trevj (talk) 14:41, 11 April 2011 (UTC)

article tag
Should Psion Series 3 and Psion Series 5 be tagged with this project? I mean Acron created software at least for the Series 3. mabdul 12:01, 16 April 2011 (UTC)


 * I don't think so, as this project only covers RISC OS, just one of the operating systems that Acorn used. However the RISC OS software that handled file/other transfer to the psions/pocket books would come under the scope.--Flibble (talk) 22:53, 16 April 2011 (UTC)

Listing participants
For those wondering why alphabetical order is requested, this is to avoid newcomers feeling as though there's some sort of heirarchy according to sign-up date! This can be changed, as long as there is consensus. Thanks. --trevj (talk) 13:00, 19 April 2011 (UTC)

Peer review
I've (incorrectly) interpreted the WikiProject Computing article assessments as being WikiProject peer reviews. The requested articles were indeed assessed, i.e. given quality and importance ratings at COMP/A, although that process didn't include official reviewing. The dates of their assessment are now recorded on their respective talk pages (tagged as WikiProject peer review for the moment). This has prompted the following thoughts:
 * Once we've significantly raised the quality of the articles, we could request some true WikiProject Computing/Peer Reviews (for either Start-class or B-class articles).
 * The temptation is to do this with our Category:Top-importance RISC OS articles( s )
 * This currently only includes RISC OS, which is Start-Class and Mid-importance (within the general WikiProject Computing criteria)
 * It might give us a better feel for the quality standards (and avoid following the same review procedures more times than is necessary) by first working an article up to B-Class (presumably requiring reassessment by WP:COMP), e.g. Acorn Archimedes and Phoebe are currently C-Class, so would be likely candidates. (Note that 'Acorn Archimedes' is Mid and 'Phoebe (computer)' Low on the general scale, so perhaps assessors/reviewers with limited time are more likely to be a little more interested in commenting on the former.)
 * Of course there's also Acorn Computers, which hasn't been assessed as part of the recent work but was a former featured article.
 * Then perhaps the next stage will be this Peer review process.

What are people's thoughts? --Trevj (talk) 14:48, 26 April 2011 (UTC)


 * Both Acorn Archimedes and Acorn Computers are contained in History of Home Computers (along with some earlier Acorn comptuer articles too, but of course that's not actually RISC OS). The book has just been reviewed by NoomBot (a bot). --Trevj (talk) 18:49, 30 April 2011 (UTC)


 * Before submitting anything for peer review, we should be relatively happy with it first. For examples of what sort of things reviewers comment on, I suggest finding other articles of interest to you at WP:PR (which changes, as articles are added/reviewed/drop off the list) and following their progress. --Trevj (talk) 08:41, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

Recruitment
ChangeFSI to the rescue regarding the greyscale bitmap! However, printing (so far I've only tested via Windows) still insists on using colour unless 'Print in greyscale' is selected.

Never mind, here's a PDF of the FAQ flyer which was distibuted at Wakefield 2011. If your user group hasn't already discussed this, please feel free to print copies for distribution at meeting(s). --Trevj (talk) 19:15, 26 April 2011 (UTC)

Emulators
Excuse my ignorance, but what's the difference between a "computer system emulator" and an "OS emulator"? --Trevj (talk) 11:32, 16 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Yes, there is a difference although the naming is wrong in these lists. The first one is for woking in a virtual machine (i do think) and the second one is for emulating the apis within a operating system (no emulator of the os - emulating of the standard apis of an operating system so the started application thinks it is working under the needed os although it runs under something totally different that shouldn't work normally). mabdul 13:41, 16 May 2011 (UTC)

User talk:Svick/WikiProject cleanup listing
Maybe this is interesting for you User talk:Svick/WikiProject cleanup listing. Regards, mabdul 09:05, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the suggestion. It looks useful, e.g. WP:WPRS output. I'll request for the project to be listed in a week or two unless anyone states any good reasons why we shouldn't do so. --Trevj (talk) 12:33, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * ✅ Oops - forgot this until now! --Trevj (talk) 14:02, 30 September 2011 (UTC)
 * ✅ -- Trevj (talk) 14:47, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Set index articles
I've just read WP:SETINDEX. It might be appropriate (at some point in the future) to consider organising some articles around this idea. E.g. if/when new articles are created for notable hardware, a main article could discuss things generally. This could be a "one step at a time" proposal comprising: Possible candidates (and there could be others) are: I'm not certain about this, as a standard disambiguation page clearly wouldn't be best for readers. However, the given example at Dodge Charger and others like Iron Man (set index) may be workable. The majority of set indices in Category:Set indices probably wouldn't be good models, e.g. Animal (song). This is just something for us to think about for the future, really. --Trevj (talk) 11:06, 24 June 2011 (UTC)
 * 1) Expanding sections on individual hardware coverage;
 * 2) Proposing WP:SPINOUTs;
 * 3) WP:SETINDEX for main articles.
 * Acorn Archimedes
 * Acorn Network Computer
 * RISC OS

Popular pages statistics request
Prompted by WikiProject Video games/Popular pages, I'm putting a request in at User:Mr.Z-bot for page views stats to be collected for this project too. --Trevj (talk) 15:07, 15 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Your request has been added to the queue. The request key is e7j786k - keep this to edit or delete the request before it is accepted --Trevj (talk) 15:10, 15 July 2011 (UTC)

Pageview stats
After a recent request, I added WikiProject RISC OS to the list of projects to compile monthly pageview stats for. The data is the same used by http://stats.grok.se/en/ but the program is different, and includes the aggregate views from all redirects to each page. The stats are at WikiProject RISC OS/Popular pages.

The page will be updated monthly with new data. The edits aren't marked as bot edits, so they will show up in watchlists. You can view more results, request a new project be added to the list, or request a configuration change for this project using the toolserver tool. If you have any comments or suggestions, please let me know. Thanks! Mr.Z-man 21:15, 2 October 2011 (UTC)
 * --Trevj (talk) 08:31, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

Photos from Chris's Acorns
Note item at Batch uploading/Chris's Acorns. Thanks very much to Chris Whytehead for getting us this far. Watch this space. --Trevj (talk) 12:19, 4 October 2011 (UTC)

Acorn Archimedes/RISC OS games
You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Video games. Trevj (talk) 14:17, 4 October 2011 (UTC)

Discussion at Template talk:Acorn computers#Proposed move/new title
You are invited to join the discussion at Template talk:Acorn computers. Trevj (talk) 18:02, 18 October 2011 (UTC)

File permission problem with File:Acorn-Netstation.jpg
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 * Removed CSD tag, photo is (c) me and not a publicity shot. I have granted appropriate permission when uploading the photo.--Flibble (talk) 10:20, 31 October 2011 (UTC)

Replaceable fair use File:AcornPhoebeCase.jpg
Thanks for uploading File:AcornPhoebeCase.jpg. I noticed the description page specifies that the media is being used under a claim of fair use, but its use in Wikipedia articles fails our first non-free content criterion in that it illustrates a subject for which a freely licensed media could reasonably be found or created that provides substantially the same information or which could be adequately covered with text alone. If you believe this media is not replaceable, please remove the tag.

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Free Acorn Users (to be collected from Buckinghamshire before Saturday 12 November 2011)
You are invited to join the discussion at User talk:Trevj. -- Trevj (talk) 08:19, 8 November 2011 (UTC)

Who Wants to Be a Millionaire? graphics
You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:Who Wants to Be a Millionaire? (UK game show). -- Trevj (talk) 15:22, 11 November 2011 (UTC)

Navbox for Acorn computer magazines
There's a draft navbox at User:Trevj/Template:Acorn computer magazines. Please feel free to edit. It's probably not worth actually using until at least a couple more stub articles are available. -- Trevj (talk) 13:21, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
 * Moved to, with history showing commented out titles (for later inclusion). -- Trevj (talk) 05:20, 2 October 2012 (UTC)

Category for RISC OS
I just removed Acorn Archimedes from, where it doesn't belong. I was looking for a RISC OS category to move it to, and realize there wasn't one. Should exist as a subcategory (or parent) of ? --Pnm (talk) 21:50, 18 November 2011 (UTC)
 * It's for the talk pages, and AIUI should be handled by the Project tag. could alternatively exist as a subcategory of . IMO the parent should remain, although we've yet to actually tackle the issue of Acorn clones. Not sure how to proceed with these ATM - prob best to compare with other projects. -- Trevj (talk) 15:48, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

New Photos on Wikimedia Commons
I've uploaded a set of photos I've taken recently to wikimedia commons, now available for use in articles.--Flibble (talk) 23:08, 18 November 2011 (UTC)


 * Nice - I guess you've sorted your Commons issues! { -- Trevj (talk) 15:39, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Update: December 2011
Here are a few things (relating to the Project, rather than specifics of articles) that I think it would be helpful to address over the next month or two: What else is there (apart from recruiting more people, which will hopefully be improved by the FAQ)? -- Trevj (talk) 10:22, 1 December 2011 (UTC)
 * 1) FAQ/"How can I help?"
 * 2) Investigating how the "to do" list could work (I've seen these transcluded on talk page banners for articles within other projects)
 * 3) Clearer navigation around the project - there are a few good examples elsewhere but probably requesting some guidance from WP:COMP and WP:COUNCIL would be helpful
 * 4) Perhaps concentrating focus (say, for 1 month or so) on specified tasks/groups of articles with a common theme, e.g.
 * 5) *the OS and any related articles on its components
 * 6) *magazines/websites
 * 7) *companies
 * 8) *hardware (images from commons:category:Chris's Acorns are coming on nicely)
 * 9) *people (respecting WP:BLP and carefully putting their Acorn/RISC OS work in context per WP:NPOV and WP:UNDUE)
 * 10) *screenshots
 * 11) *applications
 * 12) *games