Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Templates/Archive 1

Scope?
Is this a wikiproject on templates, or a template for future wikiprojects? It certainly looks like the latter. Radiant_* 15:19, May 11, 2005 (UTC)
 * Okay, I'm convinced the new version is the former :) sounds like a good plan, I'll consider to join, time permitting. Radiant_ &gt;|&lt; July 5, 2005 14:03 (UTC)

Documentation standards
Although I see documentation of user warning templates (among others) as an issue, I didn't want to expand the WikiProject on User Warnings too far beyond its primary goals. This WikiProject states better documentation as one of its goals, so that's... rather convenient. &gt;_&gt;; I'd like to find or develop a standard example of template documentation that would be applied throughout the template namespace. Anyone interested, or shall I freelance a proposal for later comment? // Pathoschild 16:08, 1 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Late comment &mdash; we always have doctl → Aza Toth 02:59, 26 January 2006 (UTC)
 * I have always wondered why we put the usage notes on the talk page at all. Wouldn't it make more sense to have them displayed on the template page and leave the talk page for discussions? That makes it easier to find the instructions and also helps to remind people to update them when they make changes to the template. If the template code is placed within tags, or tags with tags around everything else, then only that section gets used when the template is transcluded and everything else just displays on the local page. If we have an example of the template in use (automatic from the code for most templates) followed by instructions right on the template page then people following links to the template will usually get all the info they need right there. --CBD &#x260E; &#x2709; 12:42, 26 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Editing a popular template, even for usage info, is something to be avoided. Even though we have the ability to do it with noinclude, we should make it standard to have documentation on Talk. -- Netoholic @ 03:10, 27 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Again I say, "why"? Page cache invalidation? It hasn't been shown to be a significant issue, and even if it were... the documentation is seldom going to be updated unless the template itself is - which would invalidate the caches anyway. Right now we have a mix - some templates put documentation on the template page, some on the talk page, and some have it split up on both. I think we should definitely try to standardize this, but I don't see any real advantages to using the talk page. --CBD &#x260E; &#x2709; 12:20, 27 January 2006 (UTC)

Potentially very useful project
Heh, I was thinking that we needed a wikiproject to provide help for people in setting up templates and standards... typed in a name to set up a new one and surprise, it's already here. Think we need to advertise a bit more though. --CBD &#x260E; &#x2709; 00:04, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

expert attention
I don't know what happened in Cumberland Valley High School it seems that someone did a wierd cut and paste instead of a subst. I would fix it but I don't know how. Jon513 22:36, 12 March 2006 (UTC)
 * I converted it to a call to 'Infobox School'. --CBDunkerson 00:49, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

Template:Information appliance
Could someone take a look at Template:Information appliance? For some reason when instances do not call one of the optional parameters there is a large white space above the article. I can't figure out why. Thanks! jaco ♫ plane 04:49, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Just Joined Project
Hi, I have just joined the project, and [apart from the collaborative tasks on the main page], I am unsure of what I can do to help! If anyone has anything template-related that they would like me to look into then just add it here or put it on my talk page --Richard0612 19:18, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

Jewish history template
Hello. I hope you do not mind me coming here for a little help. I recently created a project banner template, Template:WikiProject Jewish history, and I seem to have messed up the coding somewhere. I admittedly copied the template from another WikiProject, and tried my best to leave the coding alone while simply changing all "Japan" references to "Jewish history." But evidently I messed up, because now anything coded/written on the page after my project banner will not show up. Thank you for any help you can offer. LordAmeth 00:40, 31 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I don't know much about the coding for Templates, but maybe you want to look at Template:Stargateproject? It already has a drop-down box, so all you'd have to do is modify the code, not come up with it.  --Tim4christ17 12:19, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

Request!
Template:Infobox_Hospital could use some parserfunctions and cleanup, I tried to use it in Townsville General Hospital but apart from displaying empty parameters, the content was pushed to the right... Maybe it could resemble our great Template:Infobox Disease?--Steven Fruitsmaak (Reply) 20:01, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

Project directory
Hello. The WikiProject Council has recently updated the WikiProject Council/Directory. This new directory includes a variety of categories and subcategories which will, with luck, potentially draw new members to the projects who are interested in those specific subjects. Please review the directory and make any changes to the entries for your project that you see fit. There is also a directory of portals, at User:B2T2/Portal, listing all the existing portals. Feel free to add any of them to the portals or comments section of your entries in the directory. The three columns regarding assessment, peer review, and collaboration are included in the directory for both the use of the projects themselves and for that of others. Having such departments will allow a project to more quickly and easily identify its most important articles and its articles in greatest need of improvement. If you have not already done so, please consider whether your project would benefit from having departments which deal in these matters. It is my hope that all the changes to the directory can be finished by the first of next month. Please feel free to make any changes you see fit to the entries for your project before then. If you should have any questions regarding this matter, please do not hesitate to contact me. Thank you. B2T2 14:22, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Generic WikiProject template
Hey folks. Is there any interest in making a meta-template to standardize the WikiProject templates? Someone recently asked for some additions to WikiProject California and WikiProject Southern California based on features they saw in TrainsWikiProject. While making the changes, I was thinking how lame it was that I needed to make them twice. I don't forsee this being the end-all, be-all solution to creating all WikiProject banners, but I think it could give a lot of power to the majority of WikiProjects without duplicating effort editing esoteric templates. I started a prototype at User:Mike Dillon/WikiProject banner that is minimally demostrated at User:Mike Dillon/Sandbox. I purposely avoided demostrating anything that would include my sandbox in an inappropriate category, but I have tested that the category functionality works using "Show preview". Let me know what you all think. If such a template is desired, I think it should be called WikiProject banner. It would be used by transclusion in the project-specific template with the "project_*" params specified, leaving the secondary template call to the project-specific template to fill in the usual WikiProject banner params like "class" and "importance". Also, is this the right place to bring this up, or should I go to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Council? Mike Dillon 06:56, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Nice work! --ChoChoPK (球球PK) (talk | contrib) 06:59, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedia Day Awards
Hello, all. It was initially my hope to try to have this done as part of Esperanza's proposal for an appreciation week to end on Wikipedia Day, January 15. However, several people have once again proposed the entirety of Esperanza for deletion, so that might not work. It was the intention of the Appreciation Week proposal to set aside a given time when the various individuals who have made significant, valuable contributions to the encyclopedia would be recognized and honored. I believe that, with some effort, this could still be done. My proposal is to, with luck, try to organize the various WikiProjects and other entities of wikipedia to take part in a larger celebrartion of its contributors to take place in January, probably beginning January 15, 2007. I have created yet another new subpage for myself (a weakness of mine, I'm afraid) at User talk:Badbilltucker/Appreciation Week where I would greatly appreciate any indications from the members of this project as to whether and how they might be willing and/or able to assist in recognizing the contributions of our editors. Thank you for your attention. Badbilltucker 19:34, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

Things look a little somnolent herein
This is just a heads up about changes proposed regarding template deletion (speedy) processes and procedures. See Wikipedia talk:Proposed deletion Regards // Fra nkB 15:20, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

Proposed rearrange of Category:Wikipedia templates
I've put forward a proposed rearrange of the top-most template category at Category talk:Wikipedia templates. Please drop by and make suggestions / comments. Thanks. Mike Peel 17:31, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

Icon templates instead of large boxes at the top of pages
See this discussion here. Some icons have already been created; see my user page. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by HisSpaceResearch (talk • contribs) 11:01, 21 February 2007 (UTC).

Talk templates on main article space.
I have noticed a couple of templates intended for talk space only have meen misused on the mainspace. A WP:Self problem. To solve it I have modified Template:ACIDnom and Template:Cleanup taskforce notice with the following code.

If the template is inserted in the main namespace the page will be categorised into Category:Misplaced Templates and the following will be visible. '''Warning. This template should only be used on discussion pages. Please it move to talk:.''' This may be of use on other templates. GameKeeper 21:00, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

"WikiProject Banners"
If anyone is interested I have proposed "WikiProject Banners", a WikiProject to set standards for, and help projects with, WikiProject banners at Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Proposals.— miketm - Queen WikiProject - 11:06, 24 February 2007 (UTC)

WikiProject Microformats
Anyone interested in microformats (or metadata in general) and the deployment - via templates - of microformats on Wikipedia, might like to be aware of, or even join, WikiProject Microformats. Andy Mabbett 09:03, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Proposal
Hello Wikipeidians. I have made a proposal that would take care of the userbos issues and the general clutter of the Template namespace. Please see it here and make comments conserning it. Thank you for your time. SadanYagci 14:50, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

Template infobox width
Suggest a uniform maximum width for infoboxes: Preferably at 50% of the body column, otherwise at 22 or 23 em. This is due to the recurring problem of excessively wide templates. -Stevertigo 20:29, 8 April 2007 (UTC)
 * If done, percentages only, please - with an over-riding minimum set in Em. 22 em is about an eight of my monitor; 50% may be 8 characters wide on a mobile device. Andy Mabbett 10:19, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Templates - a right mess
I'm in the process of adding hCard microformat mark-up to a large number of biography and place- related templates, as part of the microformats project. It has become clear, as I've edited so many similar templates, that there is a lot of redundancy (very similar templates, where one, with optional components could be used) and a lack of standardisation (fields named "name" vs. "subject_name" vs. "playername"; or "url" vs. "homepage", for instance. I'm new to the templates project, but is this being addressed anywhere? Andy Mabbett 10:03, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm also finding several biography templates )e.g. Former F1 driver) with no birth/ death date fields! Andy Mabbett 12:17, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Category:Deprecated templates
I have put forward a proposal to rename (and repurpose) this category to a temporary holding category; please see Categories for discussion/Log/2007 May 7 for the full details and to leave comments. Thanks. Mike Peel 11:39, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

substring extraction in templates?
I have a couple of templates (such as StatcanProfile2006) which currently take two parameters, such as 6106023 and 61. The second parameter is just the first two characters of the first parameter. Is there any way to extract this from the first parameter in the current template syntax? I found the StringFunctions routines, but they apparently aren't incorporated into the Wikimedia code as of yet, otherwise "#sub:" would be the way to go. If there is a better hangout of template gurus to post this, just let me know. - David Oberst 02:25, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
 * It is not possible, but the template can be modified to require instead of , i.e., no duplication.--Patrick 13:21, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Messing things up
I've little experience with Templates, but by carefully and unashamedly cribbing a similar template, I devised Template:Norwich City F.C.. It's not a bad start, but: Yours hopelessly, --Dweller 14:41, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
 * 1) In the title bar, I can't get the font colour the correct shade of dark green. It seems black to me. Is that my eyesight, or am I doing something wrong?
 * 2) How do you make the article name appear bold if that's the article you're looking at?
 * 3) What a horrible mess it's made at The Nest (football ground). What did I do wrong?
 * Two of the three fixed. Any advice on number 1? --Dweller 19:21, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I see you have manage to change from black to green since then. But I took the liberty to slightly modify the colours to those used for the official logo on the official web page. (Not the faulty colours used in the logo in the article.) I hope you like it. --David Göthberg 00:55, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Test case pattern
FYI: Template test cases --ChoChoPK (球球PK) (talk | contrib) 10:17, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Avoid template creep
FYI, a statement regarding a problem that will hopefully largely heal itself: Avoid template creep. Cheers, heqs ·:. 23:20, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Motorsport template mergers - help./ opinions needed
the possible merger of several templates is being discussed at Project Motorsport. Some concerns about the practicalities have been raised, and I think additional opinions, and expertise, would be useful. Andy Mabbett | Talk to Andy Mabbett 14:45, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Standardization of message boxes
Hello fellow template people! If you're not already aware of it, there is an effort underway to standardize the appearance of the "message box" templates which are used in articles, and possibly elsewhere as well. If you are interested, please check out Template standardisation, and join the discussion. — DragonHawk (talk|hist) 19:31, 2 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Is this another harmonization project ... ? --Kralizec! (talk) 15:17, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

Another template project request
See request here. Thank.↔NMajdan &bull;talk 15:10, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

Template example template?
Hello there. Just joined this project. It doesn't seem very active, I hope that's not the case and I just caught you at a slow time. Anyway, the first thing I was going to do is help fix the issue of templates adding pages to bogus categories because there's an example of the template on that page. I was wondering if there's a way (e.g. a template, like tlrow) that will just add an example without the category add. Or does each template need to be changed. If so, what do you change? Rocket000 18:22, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Nevermind. I made a template to do this. Rocket000 02:43, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Template help
I need some help with a table problem from someone who's more knowledgeable about templates than I am. The list of MPPs on Legislative Assembly of Ontario is coded as a "wikitable sortable", but in actual practice the page shows up on the article as a non-bordered and non-sortable list. Meanwhile, the list of MNAs on 38th National Assembly of Quebec shows up correctly as a sortable table, and i can't find any difference in the way the two are coded. Can anybody help me locate the problem in the Ontario list? Thanks. Bearcat 23:21, 11 October 2007 (UTC)
 * It appears that fixed it  by commenting out the HTML table and replacing it with an image.  Specifically, it looks like there was an extraneous    after the  , which is what broke the wikitable.  --Kralizec! (talk) 02:47, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

More template help
Hi. Can anyone help me figure out why a fail is reported at Template:Infobox Album/color/doc at "video". Thanks in advance. --PEJL 11:11, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Just taking a stab at it, but this is the only one that uses a numerical value to define the color, as well as &lt;nowiki&gt; tags. *shrug* JPG-GR 01:03, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes, I've guessed as much. The question is why  fails, or even better how to fix it so it doesn't? It does so here as well:  --PEJL 06:07, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

Marian Engel Award Winners
I need some help with this navbox. It currently forces the most recent winner onto her own separate line instead of directly after the previous winner, but I can't figure out how to fix this. Thanks. Bearcat 17:44, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Never mind, found the problem. The closing  tag was in the wrong place. Bearcat 18:32, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Infobox Canadian provincial riding
If no filename is included in the image field on this infobox, then the map slot actually displays the text   when the template is used (e.g. at Fredericton-Silverwood.) Can somebody help me recode the template to hide the text if the field is left empty? Thanks. Bearcat 20:53, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Fixed! Just needed an "if". --Brian Olsen (talk) 20:19, 11 January 2008 (UTC)

New Member XD
Hello, I have just joined this project and need to know what you want me to do if anything, I have a very good example of my work, a template using complex parser functions which I created, it looks simple but is effective I'm probably best at creating a template from scratch, than editing one I know nothing about. If you want me to join in head first then I will throw myself :-) PhilB   ~ T/C 23:04, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

Slideshow template testing help and comments needed
Hello collaborators on WikiProject Templates. I need the assistance of some experienced souls to evaluate and comment on a proposal to add a Slideshow template for convenient display of multiple images. The template would require addition of a couple of JavaScript functions to Common.js, so it's not something I can do alone. I've kicked off the discussion at Village pump (proposals). Anyone with suggestions or comments on this is welcome to join the discussion there. In particular, I am looking for Wikipedia users to help test the template's browser compatibility, and for input from anyone with knowledge of s or JavaScript, who can help analyze what's happening with this template in IE7. Thanks! Rupert Clayton (talk) 23:20, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

Template producing odd display
The template Vojvodina-geo-stub looks strange on the pages where it is transcluded, for example Orešac. The template looks fine on its own page, but it balloons with white space in the articles. I wish I knew how to fix it myself, but...I leave it in your capable hands. (If there is a better way to report problems like this, should I discover any in the future, please let me know.) -- Shelf Skewed  Talk  18:10, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Fixed! None of the table fields (  . Did something change since you asked? Does it work for you now? MrKIA11 (talk) 18:07, 21 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Not that I can think of, but it is indeed working now. Yay! Now to go fix the FAs to FLs on our lists.AnmaFinotera (talk) 18:16, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

New template for possibly derivative works
I am unsure if there is a forum for announcing new templates, but I have created derivative to flag user-created derivative works of copyrighted content. As I am an expert on neither copyright or templates, I would appreciate if a Project member might have a look over it and make corrections/suggestions if necessary. Thanks in advance, Skomorokh  15:48, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Message box standardisation
To standardise the look of message boxes in image space and category space we have now coded up some suggestions. See the new meta-templates imbox and cmbox and discuss the design for them at their talk pages. --David Göthberg (talk) 13:07, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

Prose exception
I've read the history and debates on prose transclusion through template use, but noting the rule that Templates should not normally'' be used...", I believe I've found a suitable exception where this is necessary - and other editors in the field seem to agree. The issue is with Guantanamo detainees - we have ~900 articles on detainees held in Guantanamo Bay detention camps, and as these have chiefly been written by a single author, they do often face criticism for WP:NPOV and WP:COATRACK issues over their "shared" sections. As founder of WikiProject Terrorism, I've just started collecting a task-force to help settle some issues in the articles - but the chief problem right now is that when a user sees a problem in "Ahmed Raja Abdullah Rafiq"'s article and changes it to more neutral wording, the offending section still exists in 900 other articles that have identical wording. Something like WikiProject Terrorism/Templates/CSRT allows us to use consensus to build that section in a neutral fashion and deploy it across all 900 pages simultaneously. If a user in the future believes that the wording should be changed, again, it can be updated to the more neutral/comprehensive/verifiable wording instantly across 900 articles - rather than simple in a single detainee's article. I was hoping to get a few voices of approval, and perhaps advice, before I actually create new templates for the issue however. But I think 900 WP articles that all share identically-worded paragraphs to introduce a subject, is a "special circumstance" that really is unique to the project. Sherurcij (Speaker for the Dead) 08:57, 13 May 2008 (UTC)
 * I had a quick look, and this seems exactly what a template is for: i.e. to standardise across multiple articles and make the content easily changable. I can see no problems, but I would wait and see what others think before going ahead [there are, as you say, 900 articles affected by this].  RichardΩ612  Ɣ ɸ 13:48, May 17, 2008 (UTC)

Proposal - make templates for wikiprojects to encourage inter-project collaboration
It's hard to jump between wiki projects - you have to go to the main article page, scroll down to figure out where in their project page they put links to related wikiprojects ... and then those links are outdated or people have thought of various connections, etc. It would be EXTREMELY useful to have a series of templates which helped to bettern Inter-Link wikiprojects. Thoughts?? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.174.42.22 (talk) 01:32, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh, we already have a solution for that: The category system! Look at the very bottom of any WikiProject main page. There you will see the link to that WikiProject's own category. From there you can navigate up and down the category system to find other related WikiProjects. Or you can of course start at the top category for WikiProjects: Category:WikiProjects.
 * --David Göthberg (talk) 16:40, 29 August 2008 (UTC)

Navboxes, infoboxes, sidebars...
Hi. Now and then, templates like Infobox Jews and Infobox Olympics Lithuania remind me that I'm not clear on what the distinctions between navboxes, infoboxes and sidebars really are. As a rule of thumb, I'd say navboxes are horizontally aligned and tend to be placed at the ends of articles, while infoboxes and sidebars are vertically alinged and appear beside article text, usually at the starts of articles. Infoboxes, however, are metatemplates, templates that expect parameters to be supplied, whereas sidebars aren't; sidebars are, in effect, vertically-aligned navboxes. Arguably, however, the two examples above (and others like them) contradict this. Both are examples of instantiated infoboxes -- if that's the correct description -- i.e. templates that use infoboxes (in this case, Infobox Ethnic group and Infobox Country Olympics) rather than "being" infoboxes. So, should they and templates like them more accurately be named "X sidebar"s, where X = "Jews", "Olympics Lithuania", etc? Or are they still "infoboxes" even if they don't use an infobox or even if they don't handle any parameters? I guess what I'm driving it is whether or not the description "Infobox" should be reserved for those vertically-aligned templates whose content is wholly parameter-based (i.e. vertically-aligned metatemplates) and, if so, that there's an agreed statement to this effect somewhere. If all this already exists and has been sorted out somewhere, please direct me to it! Sardanaphalus (talk) 17:49, 30 August 2008 (UTC)

Templates needing documentation
I've just looked at a few of the lunar eclipse templates (e.g. Lunarsaros133 db, Lunarsaros125 db others in Category:Lunar eclipses), none of which have documentation. Is there a cleanup template and/ or a category, which can be used to highlight this short-coming? Andy Mabbett (aka Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy Mabbett; Andy Mabbett's contributions 22:04, 3 September 2008 (UTC)
 * ugh. complex templates with limited usage.  it might just be best to drop a line on the talk page of the author (who seems to be user:SockPuppetForTomruen) and see if you can get him to whip up a quick, generic doc file that can be added to all the templates.
 * you might also suggest to him that he has missed the concept of a template. there should only be 1 template that takes different parameters to produce different results, not 30 some templates that are each only used on one page.  I'dd merge them myself, but I'm not sure I understand what the important lunar factors are. if he wants to drop a note here, maybe we can work it out. -- Ludwigs 2  19:49, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

New template idea/does it exist already?
I am planning a hatnote template for use on animal articles. The purpose of this template would be to list common English names for the same species (with refs), something like:   This idea is from a page like Micrurus fulvius (notice at the top). Does anyone know if a current template can fill this niche already? See my sandbox. Thanks! StevePrutz (talk) 16:17, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * have you looked at the template on that page - taxobox or the related biota? they are fairly general templates, and if they don't quite work for what you want it might be easier to edit them than make a new one. also check the categories they are included in... -- Ludwigs 2  19:37, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * See also discussion on my talk page. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 23:39, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

Bot help?
WikiProject Orienteering is using Template:Orienteering as a redirect to Template:WikiProject Orienteering. There are over 100 talk pages linking to each. We would like to move all current links from the former to the latter, so that the former can be used as a navbox. What is the best way to do this? If I move Template:Orienteering to Template:WPO, can (will?) a bot fix all the redirects? --Una Smith (talk) 15:19, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I think you'd have to write a bot specifically for this purpose. that shouldn't be too difficult, and I'm happy to help you write one if you need assistance.  let me know.  -- Ludwigs 2  19:32, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I don't want to get into running bots myself, and the majority of the articles involved need assessment anyway, so I will do it by hand. Thanks, though.  --Una Smith (talk) 00:06, 9 October 2008 (UTC)

Is it required that a template link to an article?

 * Explanation: Americasroof is talking about navigation boxes (navboxes). --David Göthberg (talk) 11:42, 18 October 2008 (UTC)

I often see articles loaded with templates that do not link to the article (e.g., church articles, a fishing article (which I'm catching heat on now), etc.) Common sense would seem to dictate that a template on an article should link to it rather than just being an "advertisement" for other articles. I catch a lot of blowback when I remove the non-linking templates. Is there a policy out there somewhere that I can point to or do I just have to grit my teeth and let the template creep continue willy nilly.Americasroof (talk) 20:10, 17 October 2008 (UTC)
 * why remove the template when you can link it yourself?   I'm trying to picture what you mean - I can imagine a functional template that has no links, so I'm hesitant to say anything about all templates.  can you give an example of what you're seeing?  -- Ludwigs 2  22:00, 17 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Here's an example. The fishing template is on a museum about fishing however the fishing template does not link to the article.  While I of course can add the page to the template, the template is quite broad and so is  not really practical.  Another place where this is common is on church templates.  There will be articles on individual church congregations/buildings and a broad template (e.g., Methodists) will be applied to each article.  Clearly the template would be overwhelmed if you included every congregation in the Methodist Church. I often also see this on city pages where bars, etc., will have a city template on them.Americasroof (talk) 22:19, 17 October 2008 (UTC)
 * ah, ok. well, an info template like this could easily show up on a lot of pages that aren't linked to directly by the template itself.  really, what you have here is a problem of structure and organization that's not really handled well.  an info template should provide links to (a) general-topic articles that provide broad information about the topic, and (b) categories of things that are related.  for instance, this particular template should probably have a link to a category page called 'fishing recreation' which includes museums like the Catskill Fly Fishing Museum as well as the Angling, Game Fishing, and Fly Fishing pages.  A lot of the things that are listed as individual links on this page would probably be better as category pages (e.g. the Tackle and Techniques lists could be reduced to single links that point to category pages).  this whole template could probably be reduced in size by 1/3 or 1/2, though it would take some grunt-work setting up the categories.
 * That being said, I'd take it up in talk on the template page before you go and rework the entire template (assuming you might do that). -- Ludwigs 2  22:55, 17 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your response. Apparently I'm not being clear.  Here's another example. There are 25 linked articles on Template:Baptist. By clicking on the "What links here" tab you will see that the template appears on perhaps 1,000 different articles.  My question is should that template APPEAR ONLY ON THE 25 LINKED ARTICLES and NOT ON THE 1,000 UNLINKED ARTICLES?  To me it's Avoid template creep and articles that are not linked should not have the template on them.  However, I can't find a policy per se on this and am asking if there is a policy. Americasroof (talk) 23:26, 17 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I know exactly what you mean. Template:UFOs is all over the place (over 250 pgs if you look at Special:WhatLinksHere), but has only a handful of general links on the navbox. I think the templates should be expanded, or removed from the inappropriate article. StevePrutz (talk) 23:32, 17 October 2008 (UTC)
 * No, you're being clear, but I guess I'm not.   the answer is: of course templates can be on pages that they don't link to.  just for a quick example using Template:Baptist. if I'm writing an article about some Baptist congregation in Akron Ohio, I would certainly consider putting Template:Baptist on that article as general background for people who want to know more about the Baptist faith, but there's no reason that this little Akron Ohio congregation should get special mention in the template.  or if I'm writing an article about Bottlenosed Dolphins in sea-parks, then I'd probably put an 'aquatic mammals' template on the page, but there's no reason why the aquatic mammals template should mention the sea-park article explicitly. Info templates are supposed to be general overviews of a topic, and they can't normally include everything that's covered by the topic.
 * there's a separate issue about whether a particular template belongs on a given page - a template ought to provide information for readers so that they can easily find information related to the page that they are viewing. but that's something that ought to be assessed on a page-by-page basis. -- Ludwigs 2  00:26, 18 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Americasroof : I see that you are talking about navigation boxes. Navboxes are used as a convenient way to package the links that otherwise would have to manually be placed in the "See also" section. If you link from the "see also" section of one article to another article, then there is no demand that the other article links back. And the same goes for navboxes, you can place a navbox on an article even if the navbox has no link to the article itself.
 * --David Göthberg (talk) 11:42, 18 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Apparently the answer to my question is that there is no guideline for a link here even though I think there should be. To use the Baptist example, I do not see why in telling the story of an individual church would need to be encumbered with the equivalent links of 25 see also links on church history when a simple click on Baptist Church would get you into the macro level.  If the church is on the national register of historic places, a template with a whole batch of links to the structure of national register could be attached even though none of them link.  And it's conceivable that a city template with a whole bunch of links could be attached.  It's Avoid template creep at its worst.  There needs to be a guideline. Americasroof (talk) 15:01, 18 October 2008 (UTC)
 * we also want to avoid rule creep as well. believe me, I'm not at all disagreeing with your assessment, but to my mind what needs to be done is to fix the templates so that they reflect a better hierarchical structure, and to remove unneeded templates.  it's not something you can really make an abstract rule about, because mostly it's a judgment call about what content is needed and what is excessive.
 * that being said, if you're having an issue with a particular page or set of pages, give me a link and I'll go take a look. I'm happy to help restructure things so that the page reads better.  -- Ludwigs 2  18:23, 18 October 2008 (UTC)

Expertise
I could use some help with Template:Infobox Tennis biography; I need certain sections (like Doubles and Mixed) to not appear at ALL if the first field either does not exist or is empty? See Chanda Rubin as a example. -- Mjquin_id (talk) 17:50, 30 November 2008 (UTC)

ExpertList
I also wonder if some people on the Participant list could label themselves as experts or rate on a scale of 1 to 5? (I would represent a one; User, but not a builder) -- Mjquin_id (talk) 17:50, 30 November 2008 (UTC)

Java script template tools.
I have been using User:S/tags to add templates to pages. It is now out of date and not being maintained. Another one is User:LilDice/Flexitags but I have no idea of how to configure it. Anyone got ideas about semi-automated adding of tags? -- Alan Liefting (talk) - 04:46, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Problem with Template:US county navigation box layout
See "Template talk:US county navigation box#"view • talk • edit" screws up centering in title" for details on a centering problem with a commonly-used template that could be fixed by someone with template expertise. Thanks. 67.100.125.237 (talk) 03:13, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

Proposed unification of deadend and internal links
There is a discussion here on the subject of merging two templates that have nearly identical goals but wildly varying levels of quality in their doc pages, their category assignments, etc. I believe the change to be a non-controversial one, but I'm not bringing in a changerequest just yet/might as well give it a day and see if anyone sees a reason I haven't predicted to block a merge. Thanks! MrZaius talk  02:13, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

suggestion for improvement of nofootnotes and morefootnotes templates
In nofootnotes the template text mentions "Please improve this article by introducing more precise citations where appropriate" but it doesn't mention how to do this. I think it would help the editor to include a link within the template text to "Links to full references" (or WP:CITEX) which shows the editor a quick and easy way how to create inline citations from the existing list of full references. Maybe something along the lines of.. "For help on how to do this, see WP:CITEX" or something like that. OlEnglish (talk) 01:52, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

Inline templates for the names of people
I'm trying to locate templates for the inline (i.e. not infoboxes)) representation of the names of people, so that I can make them emit hCard microformats. So far, I know of Player, Soccer Player and, more generically, Sortname. Are there others? Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 13:12, 4 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Check over at WikiProject_Inline_Templates. -- Ludwigs 2  04:25, 15 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Thank you. Will do. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 23:10, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

Request for comment on use of team colors in sports infoboxes
Please stop by and voice your opinion in the ongoing discussion on the use of team colors in sports infoboxes.-- 2008 Olym pian chit chat 06:17, 14 February 2009 (UTC)

Could somebody take a look...?
The talkpage banner for WikiProject Christian music (Christianmusic) has a markup error when "nested" with WPBS - there's a stray "colspan" in the template title, as seen here. Could somebody take a look and try to fix this error? I noticed this recently, and now I'm finally getting around to asking some template experts, who know more than I do. ;-) I haven't taken a close look through this recent edit, but I'm guessing that the problem lies there (the nested template used to be normal beforehand). TIA,  Jamie ☆ S93  17:18, 14 February 2009 (UTC)
 * as far as I can tell, someone just dropped a pipe divider. I think it's fixed now; let me know if you see any new problems.  -- Ludwigs 2  21:09, 14 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Great, it looks like that was it; a missing pipe makes sense, and everything looks fine now with the template. Thanks,  Jamie ☆ S93  03:44, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

Category:New templates
Self explanatory. Actually there's a header that explains it. I've come up with a few new template forms for particular issues. For one, Template:Standard simplifies the transclusion of a standard topicbox. A few others are there. Comments are essential. -Stevertigo 05:35, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

Parameter sanity checking
Although a number of templates check the parameters they are passed, historically it appears each template author does it differently and the vast majority of templates have taken a GIGO approach. I recently created Category:Wikipedia template parameter issues in an effort to see what is out there. I am using the talk page as a workspace for this project. My goal is to standardize, document, and encourage the use of parameter sanity checking. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. --Pascal666 (talk) 13:17, 21 February 2009 (UTC)

Not sure what's wrong?
Something is a bit off in the newly created navigation template for Japanese era names. I've summarized the problems as simply as possible at Template talk:Japanese era name. I want to try to understand what I might have done differently so that
 * a. I'll might be able to avoid similar mistakes in the future ... and
 * b. I can be better able to figure out how to fix my own mistakes. --Tenmei (talk) 00:02, 24 February 2009 (UTC)
 * I fixed it. The name argument was pointing to another (non-existent) template. Bendono (talk) 00:27, 24 February 2009 (UTC)

WikiProject Coordinators' working group
Hi! I'd like to draw your attention to the new WikiProject coordinators' working group, an effort to bring both official and unofficial WikiProject coordinators together so that the projects can more easily develop consensus and collaborate. This group has been created after discussion regarding possible changes to the A-Class review system, and that may be one of the first things discussed by interested coordinators. All designated project coordinators are invited to join this working group. If your project hasn't formally designated any editors as coordinators, but you are someone who regularly deals with coordination tasks in the project, please feel free to join as well. -Drilnoth (talk) 00:40, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

Continental templates
I am looking for some technical expertise. I have been attempting to create continental navboxes like Template:Africa topic and Template:Europe topic which would customizably add prefixes and suffixes to national demonyms rather than country names. I made this attempt by creating Template:African topic, Template:European topic, and Template:South American topic. Unfortunately, I do not know enough about wikitext in order to make them work properly. I created them primarily by copying and pasting the content of the existing continental templates and then replacing the country names with their corresponding demonyms. Right now, these templates I've created link to the demonyms properly, but cannot accept prefixes and suffixes. These templates should be able to link to such articles as Brazilian cuisine and South African poetry. Does anyone know how to accomplish this? Neelix (talk) 18:30, 1 March 2009 (UTC)

il, li, fl , lf
Hello, I was wondering if someone could help make the image and file linkage templates match the ones for articles (la & al) and templates (lt & tl)? Right now, half these work just like those, the other half works for equations and flags, neither of which are highly used (I think the euqation one is used on one article in that manner, and several for mistakenly linking to images) Particularly, files should have such a template, because simply linking to it via xx.ext  embeds an image. This would require renaming the equation and flag templates... 76.66.193.90 (talk) 05:58, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't fully understand what you want. But one thing you should know is that you can link to images simply by adding a colon ":", like this:
 * Which renders as:
 * File:Example.png
 * The same works if you want to link to a category, like this:
 * Which doesn't categorise this page into "Category:Example", but instead renders a link to that category:
 * Category:Example
 * I hope that solves some of your problems?
 * --David Göthberg (talk) 09:51, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
 * I was actually wondering if it wouldn't be better to make it consistent, since several people have already mistakenly used the equation template for linking to images. 76.66.193.90 (talk) 06:53, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
 * --David Göthberg (talk) 09:51, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
 * I was actually wondering if it wouldn't be better to make it consistent, since several people have already mistakenly used the equation template for linking to images. 76.66.193.90 (talk) 06:53, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

Question about this project's categories
Just wondering, when you add this project's template to a talk page, there is no sorting or categorizing implemented in the banner. Is the purpose just to notify readers of this project? Wouldn't it be better to add at least a main cat to the banner template? Thanks for your help in understanding this! --Funandtrvl (talk) 18:02, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
 * that's easily fixed, I think. let me check it out, and I'll edit it in.  -- Ludwigs 2  22:42, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
 * I just looked at the categorization for this project, and realized that it wasn't done properly (due to a change by an annonymous editor a year ago). The category for this project is Category:WikiProject Templates.  However, there also exists Category:WikiProject templates, which contains categories of templates used by other WikiProject.  The category for this project had been redirected to the other category, which I have fixed.  I agree that there should be a category just for pages tagged with WikiProject Templates.  The standard for other projects is usually "Category:WikiProject X articles", but this project mostly tags templates - not articles.  "Category:WikiProject Templates templates" isn't really appropriate either, since this scheme is usually used for templates used by the project itself, and not templates it supports...and it is really awkward.  Any suggestions for a good title?  --Scott Alter 23:48, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Thank you both!! I saw those 2 categories and the redirect the other day and couldn't figure out why it was set up that way. At least I know I'm not going batty!! (then again, maybe I am??!!) As for the main cat name, I agree that: "Category:WikiProject Templates articles" may be a little confusing, but it would be consistent with all the other WP's; however, an alternative would be: "Category:WikiProject Templates pages"?? We do need to keep it simple and it would be nice to have a cat that would show all the templates that are tagged with the project's talk page banner. Let me know what you think! --Funandtrvl (talk) 00:33, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
 * I like consistency and would go with "Category:WikiProject Templates articles". But I'd like to see some more members of this project weigh in.  --Scott Alter 00:44, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
 * how about being literal and using "Category:WikiProject Template transclusions"? or would that confuse people more?  --76.167.248.70 (talk) 05:05, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
 * --We are trying to "KISS"; doubt that most people could spell "transclusions". --Funandtrvl (talk) 08:42, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Good idea! If you want a laugh for today, the "navigation templates" link was piped to "Northern Territory"! (No kidding, just look at the history page!) --Funandtrvl (talk) 01:11, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

Question on Template:WP Disney
I didn't want to mess with the template and screw it up but it is for some reason showing   on all the pages that ot is on. see here. It is under the template. Can that be fixed. -- Gman 124 talk 14:59, 9 March 2009 (UTC)
 * actually it is on all the templates for some reason. -- Gman 124 talk 15:04, 9 March 2009 (UTC)


 * I'm not seeing this effect - do you still see it? -- Ludwigs 2  15:58, 9 March 2009 (UTC)
 * This has been fixed, see Template_talk:WPBannerMeta. Borgarde (talk) 12:29, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

Improve Category Template
I'm creating a new template to add to articles whose categories need improvement in some way. I'm still discussing this template at WikiProject Categories but I came here to ask for some help as I've never created a template before. The template is in my user space here so feel free to make improvements. Ol Yeller '''Talktome 00:27, 29 March 2009(UTC)
 * I'm going to be moving this template into the mainspace soon. Please take a look here and let me or if there are any changes that need to be made or go ahead and make them yourself.  Ol Yeller  '''Talktome 19:54, 3 April 2009 (UTC)

Square bracket template
Is there a template that produces a square bracket, similar to what, , etc. do? -- Amalthea 12:50, 31 March 2009 (UTC)


 * I am not aware of any such templates, and I can't come up with good names for them if we want to make them. But I know two ways you can make square brackets that don't get interpreted by the parser:

&lt;nowiki>[ ]&lt;/nowiki> = Easy to remember. &amp;#91; &amp;#93; = Compact, nice for template code.
 * [ ]


 * &#91; &#93;
 * When I need the code for a character I simply look up its Wikipedia article, since we usually have the character code there or at least its Unicode value. See for instance Bracket for the Unicode value. And any other more complete character article to see how to encode such values as HTML entities, for instance Space (punctuation).
 * --David Göthberg (talk) 13:43, 31 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks, David. I had already tried &amp;#91;, but it doesn't work in the following context:
 *  → 
 *  → 
 * However, if I use a template that evaluates to a square bracket (I've just created and  for that reason, but am open for suggestions of a better name), it works:
 *  → 
 * Amalthea 14:32, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

← Background, if anyone is interested: I've just created a first version of Template:Image that accepts all kinds of parameters ("Image.png", "File:Image.png", " " and displays an image with it. This is probably useful in a lot of places, infoboxes in particular, and was of current use at  where the image parameter was changed a couple of weeks ago from taking the filename to taking an image in proper syntax. Improvements are of course welcome, I'm sure this can be done more elegantly and made more robust.  Amalthea  16:08, 31 March 2009 (UTC)


 * Ah, I see. Yes, if you want to use square brackets in an ifeq comparison then you need a template like !(. And I think that name is fairly okay. Well, calling it square bracket left would probably be more clear, but a tad long. I don't mind long template names, but I know most other template coders here don't like long names. I think square ( would be a good name, not too long but still clear. And I just have to show a funny one I just thought of: (²
 * I took a look a your new template image, very elegant. The usual way we do such a check is by using #ifexist. In this case I think ifexist would be more server efficient, since I think doing an ifexist probably is more efficient than loading and parsing two templates. But the string handling template you are using there is very efficient, so no problem. Your solution is more elegant since you will show a proper red image link if the image doesn't exist. While when we use ifexist we end up showing just the image name without a link when the image doesn't exist.
 * You probably should copy this discussion to the talk page of image, since it might be nice as a future reference there.
 * --David Göthberg (talk) 20:21, 31 March 2009 (UTC)


 * Feel free to move (or delete) the square bracket template at your leisure: I just noticed that I don't need that template at all (as long as I only check for "[", not for "[[" ):
 *  → 
 * I didn't even try that. So it's down to one template inclusion, compared to two s otherwise where each would cause a database query and count as an "expensive parser function". I'm not sure which is better. Good point about an ifexist version not showing a proper red link, I didn't even think about that. Cheers,  Amalthea  21:52, 31 March 2009 (UTC)


 * I'll leave !( & co where they are for now. But I'll think about their naming. And very nice that you don't need a template when comparing a single bracket.
 * And just for fun, since I can't stop myself: You only need one ifexist, something like this should work (haven't tested the code):


 * And I think just checking that something exist (ifexist), must be much cheaper than actually fetching a template and parse it. But I just mentioned the efficiency matter since many users think that all string handling templates are very heavy, which is not true. str left is probably very lightweight since it only uses one parser function. (I assume you already know that, I am stating this for anyone else that will read this.) So your code is very efficient too, and gives nice output, so I say stick with your code. Or rather, here is how I would code your solution:


 * Okay, I am a geek. :))
 * --David Göthberg (talk) 03:04, 1 April 2009 (UTC)

Template Image Size
The image on the template:river was changed after the following request was made: "Please could the direct link in this template to Image:River_gambia_Niokolokoba_National_Park.gif be removed. The image is the full-size version and is 215 kB in size! This is wholly inappropriate for a mere Talk page template (with 70px icon) and causes excessive cost to people using mobile data services." Is this a correct interpretation? I thought the thumbnailing was done server-side. Is there any guidelines for this issue? I expected to find something about it here but didn't notice anything. Rmhermen (talk) 18:37, 8 April 2009 (UTC)


 * Thumbnailing is currently disabled for .gif images, so yes, in this case it was very much appropriate to switch to a .jpg which, thumbnailed, is only 2.56 KB large. -- Amalthea 18:50, 8 April 2009 (UTC)
 * I see. I didn't realize we still allowed GIF images. Rmhermen (talk) 19:12, 8 April 2009 (UTC)

Template:Vertical images list
Hello. I just created a testing version of the template Template:Vertical images list on a subpage of my user page User:Tlustulimu/Template:Vertical images list. The testing version has a new parameter background color and works very well. What do you think? Could I copy the added code into the template Template:Vertical images list and its documentation? Than the English version would be the sixth template in the interwiki list with the adding. Greetings --Tlustulimu (talk) 19:22, 13 April 2009 (UTC)
 * (+) I tested this adding in the most of the translated versions of this template and not found a problem. It only works a little bit tricky. Greetings --Tlustulimu (talk) 19:24, 13 April 2009 (UTC)

Question about the show/hide on templates
I wanted to know how to implement the show/hide tab that you see on the right side of template on title bars. I had translated Template:Punjab (India) from this wiki into this onto Punjabi wiki. But the show/hide tab doesn't show up. I would really like to know how that would be done. Thank You. Gman 124 talk 13:53, 17 April 2009 (UTC)


 * Never mind, it's already fixed now. -- Gman 124 talk 16:10, 23 April 2009 (UTC)