Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Templates/Archive 7

RfC concerning coronavirus pamdemic navbox
There is an RfC concerning pointing to the template namespace in the 2019-2020 coronavirus pandemic navbox. Please see Template talk:2019–20 coronavirus pandemic.  Bait30  Talk? 04:27, 13 March 2020 (UTC)

Template width help
Also, could someone knowledgeable in editing templates help out here.  Bait30  Talk? 04:29, 13 March 2020 (UTC)

Ridership template from GeoJSON?
A while back, I stumbled upon this set of data that lists the ridership data between 2011-2017 for all railway stations in Japan. There is a bunch of files in there, one of which is a GeoJSON file that I deciphered to contain the actual numbers. So far, I've been manually adding them into articles, but is there a way to turn this into a template like Template:TRA ridership? ◢    Ganbaruby!    (remember to ping!) 09:22, 25 March 2020 (UTC)

Three CfDs
There are three CfDs for template categories Theatre award footer templates, Current Honkbal Hoofdklasse team rosters templates, and Clock templates. —⁠andrybak (talk) 13:12, 25 March 2020 (UTC)

Navbox question
I noticed that the main heading of the navbox Template:Mausoleums in Iran is a red link. The closest page I could find that makes sense is List of tombs of Iranian people, but some of the tombs on that list are outside of Iran, so it wouldn't really make sense to use it. Does anyone here have any ideas? or should it be TfD?  Bait30  Talk? 06:39, 9 February 2020 (UTC)

Discussion at Template talk:F
You are invited to join the discussion at Template talk:F. —⁠andrybak (talk) 21:20, 26 March 2020 (UTC)

Can you help with improving the Coronavirus epidemic maps?
Hi all

The maps on the Coronavirus pandemic articles need some technical help which has been documented on phabricator, I think that some of the tasks relate to templates, so please take a look.


 * https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T248707

If you're not able to assist with any of the tasks please still subscribe to it, it will help software engineers understand there is community support for fixing these issues.

Thanks very much

John Cummings (talk) 12:20, 28 March 2020 (UTC)

Problem with #len: parser function
I'm trying to do a minor upgrade to Template:Letter other reps, and I've sandboxed a new version that calls a sub-template at Template:Letter other reps/morse that utilizes the #len: parser function as the value for a #switch:, but instead of evaluating to the length of the string being passed, it just returns the plain text. Can someone who hasn't been away from editing Wikipedia templates for the last five years take a look and see if they can see what I'm screwing up here? You can see the output I'm getting with the switch condition commented out - just evaluating the #len: parser at Template:Letter other reps/testcases. Thanks for anyone's help. VanIsaacWScont 06:38, 17 April 2020 (UTC)
 * The syntax  should be , following the examples at Module:String.   →  -- John of Reading (talk) 07:09, 17 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Ahh, thank you . Are any other parser functions deprecated now? Or is it just the string functions? VanIsaacWScont 07:12, 17 April 2020 (UTC)
 * , all available parser functions (which include Extension:StringFunctions) are listed at the bottom of Special:Version. I don't know how to look at enwiki's LocalSettings.php, but I would guess that StringFunctions are disabled. —⁠andrybak (talk) 08:23, 17 April 2020 (UTC)

Template:Moved discussion to being given an expandable bit to hold the old discussion
Hi there, I've proposed some improvements to Template:Moved discussion to so as to make it clearer what's going on with the discussion at the source page, whilst retaining the content of it there. It'd be great to get some input from anyone who has anything to contribute - I've written the details down over at Template talk:Moved discussion to :) Cheers, Naypta ☺ &#124; ✉ talk page &#124; 09:28, 27 April 2020 (UTC)

Follow-up tasks to WP:AWBREQ
For the last week, I've been using Auto-Wiki Browser to update Template documentation pages as per WP:CAT to have all template categories and interwiki links in documentation pages suppressed when transcluded into sandboxes by using. Through this project, I've seen a lot of template documentation pages, and thought of a few other maintenance tasks that I wanted to run by this WikiProject: Thanks for your feedback, and especially if anyone wants to tackle any of these projects. I've just spent the last week almost doubling my previous record for edits in an entire year, so I'm ready to peace out from any big projects like this. Thanks WikiProject Templates for your help! VanIsaacWScont 07:57, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
 * 1) Template categories are placed in /doc pages, and transcluded to the template with . Some of the template documentation pages do not currently have categories, and as such do not have the code for suppressing categories at this time. A follow-up task would be to add:
 * to the bottom of any template documentation pages that don't currently have a section for categories.
 * 1) I've noticed a pattern of template documentation pages that try to combine instructions for how to use the template with details about maintaining the template's logic, especially its subpages. I'm wondering if there is a good enough use-case for developing something like  as a subpage cohort to  that specifically focuses on technical maintenance of the template logic and information, transcluding a page like /subdoc in any subpages with maintenance or future expansion of functionality.
 * 2) I have pretty well expelled all instances of {{#ifeq:{{SUBPAGENAME}}|sandbox in favor of {{Sandbox other, but many template documentation pages had another conditional for {{#ifeq:{{SUBPAGENAME}}|testcases as well. Is there a good use-case for a  template to replace the existing logic?
 * 3)  can currently be found in many template documentation pages, and oftentimes takes up more than a majority of those /doc page files in terms of lines and bytes. I feel like that should really have its own standard subpage like /doc, and  could get them both for the main template, but not have it cloggin up /doc. Obviously that will take some consultation with the people who maintian the tools that build the templatedata, but this seems like it is only going to get worse in the future.
 * 1) I've noticed a pattern of template documentation pages that try to combine instructions for how to use the template with details about maintaining the template's logic, especially its subpages. I'm wondering if there is a good enough use-case for developing something like  as a subpage cohort to  that specifically focuses on technical maintenance of the template logic and information, transcluding a page like /subdoc in any subpages with maintenance or future expansion of functionality.
 * 2) I have pretty well expelled all instances of {{#ifeq:{{SUBPAGENAME}}|sandbox in favor of {{Sandbox other, but many template documentation pages had another conditional for {{#ifeq:{{SUBPAGENAME}}|testcases as well. Is there a good use-case for a  template to replace the existing logic?
 * 3)  can currently be found in many template documentation pages, and oftentimes takes up more than a majority of those /doc page files in terms of lines and bytes. I feel like that should really have its own standard subpage like /doc, and  could get them both for the main template, but not have it cloggin up /doc. Obviously that will take some consultation with the people who maintian the tools that build the templatedata, but this seems like it is only going to get worse in the future.
 * About your third point: there already exists template Testcases other, which is [ almost unused]. —⁠andrybak (talk) 09:23, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
 * For #2: There are several kinds of subpage templates. First is a big collection of templates with similar functionality but separated by topic/data, which are used independently of the basepage template. For example, subpages of Template:2019–20 coronavirus pandemic data are about particular countries, and are used without the main template on article's about that country; the biggest example is Template:POTD, where there exists a subpage for every day since May of 2004. The second kind are subpages, which are related templates with different functionality, like Template:Userbox, Template:Userbox/categories, and Template:Userbox/citydoc. The third kind are subpages helper templates, where basepage template's functionality is split between several templates for convenience and/or to avoid some code duplication. For example, Template:Templatesnotice has Template:Templatesnotice/inner; this is also prevalent in Module namespace to split configuration and data of modules from main functionality.
 * The big collection of templates is the easiest. Template:2019–20 coronavirus pandemic data just transcludes Special:PrefixIndex/Template:2019–20 coronavirus pandemic data—there is nothing more to say about this collection other that "there is a template for every country and territory"; POTD process is documented at WP:POTD. The second kind probably doesn't need special documentation, aside from linking in "See also" sections, maybe with small blurbs. Third kind of subpage templates are usually tightly coupled to its basepage templates, so editing a subpage usually requires also editing the basepage. —⁠andrybak (talk) 09:58, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
 * , could you please provide an example of template with subpages, which you've encountered? —⁠andrybak (talk) 10:03, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Re item 1 above, I think that would be a cosmetic change (i.e. no change to the rendered page), so adding it with AWB may be frowned upon unless there are other edits to be made at the same time.
 * Re item 4, templatedata, this is a long-standing feature request in Phabricator, . Putting the Template Data programming code, which is syntax-sensitive and affects how the template behaves when editors use the Visual Editor, was possibly not the best choice. – Jonesey95 (talk) 13:21, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Andrybak, take a look at for an example of a monster that could use subtemplate documentation.
 * Thanks Jonesy95 for letting me know the templatedata in documentation is an issue that is being addressed elsewhere.
 * isn't in the documentation for other subpage other documentation. That's probably part of the reason it isn't getting used. VanIsaacWScont 18:20, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
 * isn't in the documentation for other subpage other documentation. That's probably part of the reason it isn't getting used. VanIsaacWScont 18:20, 1 May 2020 (UTC)

Discussion at Wikipedia talk:Welcoming committee/Welcome templates
You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia talk:Welcoming committee/Welcome templates. Naypta ☺ &#124; ✉ talk page &#124; 08:07, 9 May 2020 (UTC)

Feedback requested at EditOptions
Hello, your input would be welcome at Template talk:EditOptions. Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 23:38, 13 May 2020 (UTC)

Template:DRAM (musician)
There's a redirect issue with this template: the talk page directs to Template talk:DRAM instead of Template talk:DRAM (musician) if you use the "T" at the top left of the template... it's fine if you use the "Talk" tab. Could someone fix this please, or let me know where I have to request to have it fixed? Richard3120 (talk) 20:36, 15 May 2020 (UTC)
 * , fixed: Special:Diff/956896076. Value passed to the parameter name in navboxes (Template:Navbox musical artist in this case) must be the same as the template page's name for the v · t · e links to work correctly. —⁠andrybak (talk) 22:21, 15 May 2020 (UTC)
 * thank you. Richard3120 (talk) 22:41, 15 May 2020 (UTC)

Bug in Module:Template invocation
You're invited to join the discussion at —⁠andrybak (talk) 14:27, 19 May 2020 (UTC)

Is sidebar a type of "Navigational box"?
Guideline text in WP:SIDEBAR (aka WP:NAVBOX) makes it seems that navigational boxes (navboxes for short) and sidebar templates (sidebars) are "equally ranked" kinds of navigational templates. However:


 * 1) When looking through almost all topic template categories, the first two subcategories (sorted by  ' ' ) are usually "&lt;topic&gt; infobox templates" and "&lt;topic&gt; navigational boxes". For example, in Category:Canada templates, first two are Category:Canada infobox templates‎ and Category:Canada navigational boxes‎.
 * 2) A lot of sidebar templates are categorized into "Category:&lt;topic&gt; navigational boxes". Examples:
 * 3) * over a hundred templates were recategorized in a recent AWB request
 * 4) * Economy of Canada in Category:Canada navigational boxes‎.
 * 5) At the moment, Category:Sidebar templates is a subcategory of Category:Navigational boxes.

So what is the relationship of sidebars and navboxes? Should categories "&lt;topic&gt; sidebar templates" be always categorized into "&lt;topic&gt; navbox templates"? For example, should Category:Geography and place sidebar templates be a subcategory of Category:Geography and place navigational boxes? Or: should sidebars be added to the group of subcategories sorted by ' ', to make the first group of categories: infobox, navboxes, INS and sidebars? Third alternative that I can think of would be to avoid creating the "&lt;topic&gt; sidebar templates" categories, but that would mean that all of Category:Sidebar templates needs to be merged into corresponding navbox categories. —⁠andrybak (talk) 14:45, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * OK big question here....easiest way to think about it is that data info boxes vs navigational boxes are treated differently. Data boxes have the status of being "raw content" thus are important enough to include in mobile versions of pages. Where navigation boxes are seen as link spam (not content with educational value) thus not worth of mobile view inclusion due to formatting issues and load times. If a link is important enough to include in an article it should be within the pros text or in the sea also section is  the train of thought.-- Moxy 🍁 14:54, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * , so Sidebar is desktop only, same as Navbox. I'm sorry, but I don't understand how this is relevant to the question about categorization. —⁠andrybak (talk) 15:28, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Sorry my point was not clear... they should be classed according to there function...nav or data.-- Moxy 🍁 15:34, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * , interesting. Only two of top-level categories, Category:Infobox templates and Category:Navigational boxes, are in Category:Wikipedia templates by task. But all three, including the Category:Sidebar templates are in Category:Wikipedia templates by style. The common function (i.e. task) for navboxes and sidebars is navigation. At the moment, Category:Navigational templates is a category redirect. Would it make sense to subcategorize both navboxes and sidebars in Category:Navigational templates? Which would require a third tree of "&lt;topic&gt; navigational templates" categories . —⁠andrybak (talk) 15:57, 30 May 2020 (UTC)

Removing DMCs from Template:Deprecated template
Just thought I should notify here that I proposed to remove the dated maintenance categories from deprecated template at Template talk:Deprecated template so that someone actually sees the proposal. --Trialpears (talk) 21:51, 30 June 2020 (UTC)

Accessing boilerplate in a template subpage
I want to place some boilerplate text in a Template subpage (to declutter; to make it separately editable and not template-protected; and I might need it twice) and then access it from the template, so that it works wherever it's transcluded from, and also whether we're transcluding the Template, or a sandbox copy of it, with its own subpage. Coding the full path (e.g, Template:Foo/boilerplate ) works for article transclusion, but seems inelegant, and also means the sandbox copy will have to be tweaked if we want to use its subpage. My programming mind wants me to code a relative url here, like but of course that won't work when transcluded from an article, only from the template page itself. Is there some subst-trick that will do what I want here? Or is there a better solution? Real-world example is now up at Template:Dablinks/sandbox. Ping, please. Mathglot (talk) 05:43, 15 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Are you trying to call the subpage from the mainspace, or is a parameter you're passing to the template in article space triggering the subtemplate? I guess I'm just a little confused as to what you're doing. My interpretation of it is that you've done something like AFC submission which (based on the parameters) calls one of the four subtemplates like AFC submission/pending; there's no need to ever call /pending directly, and how it's coded in the main template thus doesn't really matter. Primefac (talk) 13:48, 15 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Neither. Trying to clarify: I'm offloading some fixed, boilerplate text into a template subpage and trying to access it relatively, but that doesn't work, because the relative path is only resolved at transclusion time and by then, we're in mainspace and it's too late. It seems that for transclusions of the template to properly slurp the subpage, it has to be fully specified: ie, the template must access it as " ".  (This example may make it cleaer: When I had it coded as a relative path in my sandbox, it didn't work; when I changed it to use the full path, it did.) Probably it's a tempest in a teapot and I should just leave it, but I guess it just rankles my programmer DNA to have to fully specify the path to a subpage, when a relative reference seems like it would be more elegant. (For one thing, I couldn't have "moved" my sandbox version to Template space, due to the full path.) So I'm searching around for some trick that will allow me to specify a relative path, and to tell the transcluding software, "interpret this link relative to the Template's location not the transcluder's location", but maybe there's no reasonable way to do that.  Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 19:48, 15 July 2020 (UTC)
 * I thought I tried  first thing and it didn't work, but according to Page_name maybe I messed up and should try that again. Mathglot (talk) 20:02, 15 July 2020 (UTC) No, no luck with that.  Oh, well. Mathglot (talk) 20:07, 15 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Yeah, if you're calling a template subpage, the only place will work is on the template itself (which I completely agree is a stupid way to make things run), so any time that subpage gets called it needs the full template transclusion. I'm sure there's a phab ticket buried out there under "not important" for that issue to get fixed, but in the meantime we have to suffer through unnecessarily long template calls (like when I can't just code in a  call in this monstrously-long-named template). Primefac (talk) 22:05, 17 July 2020 (UTC)

Template:No substitution listed at Requested moves
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Template-related tools?
I would love to see a list of tools here for e.g. verifying template parameter usage, counting usages, etc. If others agree, I'll add a section as I find these tools. --Adamw (talk) 16:02, 28 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Not really sure what sort of tools you're looking for. Special:WhatLinksHere gives usage/transclusions (with WP:PETSCAN being used to fine-tune or determine multi-template usage), and TemplateData takes care of parameter usage. With the exception of petscan (which isn't really an every-day tool) most template-related tools are fairly easy to spot. Primefac (talk) 00:50, 31 July 2020 (UTC)

A little help please
Can someone help to turn the following into a template?

Thanks in advance. Aditya (talk • contribs) 02:04, 1 August 2020 (UTC)
 * , why do you need this as a template? Primefac (talk) 02:07, 1 August 2020 (UTC)
 * To make it more use friendly across topics. An ungainly annoted image may be good for one article, but any change would have to be made individually for each. Putting a v·t·e link in it woulld keep it accessible anyways. BTW, thanks for the hatting template. It took me quite some indecision to post the slightly uncomfortable image here. But since I don't know any other place to turn to... Aditya (talk • contribs) 02:25, 1 August 2020 (UTC)
 * I guess I should rephrase - this image is only used on one page - where else would it find use? For what it's worth I'm not saying it can't be a template, I just don't see the need for it (and "unneeded template" is a rather often cause for deletion). Primefac (talk) 02:31, 1 August 2020 (UTC)
 * In conjunction with Template:Breast anatomy, this would be useful for all articles on superficial anatomy of human breast - Deltoid muscle, Pectoralis major, Areola, Nipple, Areolar glands, Inframammary fold, Serratus anterior, Manubrium, Sternum, Intermammary cleft, Xyphoid process, Costal margin, and Polythelia. This could also guide to clavicles, axila and more. Even superficially human breast is a complex structure.
 * I see a problem with the NSFW image, which can be replaced with an anatomical drawing, though I think the actual anatomical object should not be a problem. It could be replaced with a male breast too, but the features are not as prominent with male breasts. I have not put it on relevant pages because putting an image instead of a template seemed ungainly, but for demonstration I can put them in the relevant articles right away. Aditya (talk • contribs) 04:48, 1 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Well, the easiest way to create a template would be to just copy the code you've used above to something like Template:Anatomy of the breasts, but I might also consider bringing the issue up (or at the very least leaving a link pointing here) at WT:MED to see if others would find it useful. Primefac (talk) 01:13, 2 August 2020 (UTC)

TFD template nominated for deletion
Template:Tfd instructions has been nominated for deletion. As it falls within the purview of this project, please consider joining in the discussion here. Primefac (talk) 20:37, 11 August 2020 (UTC)

Template:Infobox Lok Sabha Constituency
The template is returning  as default value in the infobox unless the Name= parameter is filled. I've come across several instances in articles where the parameter has been omitted. I started fixing this manually in articles (i dont' have AWB) but i thought there might be a way to deal with the root cause. I believe piping a magic word would solve this, but i'm not entirely sure how to write the syntax correctly. I'm envisioning something like. Can anyone help me with this? Thank you. Zindor (talk) 13:42, 16 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Done. For reference, you can use PAGENAMEBASE for this ProcrastinatingReader (talk) 14:16, 16 August 2020 (UTC)

Canyon Diablo Bridge - coord template problem
Two coords seem to be overwriting eachother in the top right of Canyon Diablo Bridge. --Tagishsimon (talk) 08:06, 8 September 2020 (UTC)
 * —&thinsp;JJMC89&thinsp; (T·C) 08:12, 8 September 2020 (UTC)

Renaming of Category:Country templates by topic
You are invited to join the discussion at. —⁠andrybak (talk) 21:44, 22 September 2020 (UTC)

Template:No substitution listed at Requested moves
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Technical Wishes: volunteers for “templates” usability testing needed
As part of the project Making working with templates easier, the Technical Wishes team (WMDE) is planning to make improvements to how users interact with templates in VisualEditor, including updates to TemplateData and its editor. Additionally, the team is planning to introduce changes to syntax highlighting to make working with templates written in wikitext easier.

To ensure these proposed features making improvements, we would like to get feedback by conducting usability tests. We specifically want to conduct testing with experienced editors who create and maintain templates, including TemplateData.

If this description fits you and you’re interested in contributing to the development of Wikipedia, please fill in this form! Note: this is a 45-60 minutes commitment. -- For the Technical Wishes Team: Max Klemm (WMDE) (talk) 09:29, 13 October 2020 (UTC)

A family tree template from it.wiki
I created Template:Lineage + Module:Lineage (originally it:template:discendenza) as a simpliest alternative to Template:Tree chart. Can someone verify the doc subpage? Thanks. --M.casanova (talk) 08:59, 18 October 2020 (UTC)

Please can a field for 3D model be added to Template:Infobox tool
Hi all

3D models for various tools are not becoming available on Wikimedia Commons, I'm not good with templates so can I request that someone adds a field for 3d model to Template:Infobox tool. I was thinking about adding it to the image or image2 fields but its just not correct

Thanks very much

John Cummings (talk) 15:52, 26 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Could give an example where putting it in the image field is "not correct"? Not saying we can't add something to infobox tool, just want to make sure we fix any existing errors first. Primefac (talk) 17:21, 26 October 2020 (UTC)


 * Hi, thanks for your reply, so I think there's two things here
 * Adding a 3d model to 'image' is incorrect, its not an image its a 3d file. Currently Wikipedia only accepts .stl files which only show the shape of an object, not colour or texture (have added an example).
 * Providing a 3d model is useful information that is in addition to any images (again, 3d models on Wikipedia currently only show shape).
 * As an example 3DBenchy (a 3D printing calibration tool) already has two images for it in the infobox (there are two versions of it), having a 3D model of it would be helpful additional information that cannot be provided by two photos, the shape of the model is the tool because its used for calibration.
 * Thanks again
 * John Cummings (talk) 17:32, 26 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Ah, so you're not saying that it's "not correct", but rather that you'd like to have the option to add a third image to the infobox, which would be the 3d model (the syntax is pretty much identical regardless of it's in the infobox or on the page as a [[File:...]] call). Primefac (talk) 18:15, 26 October 2020 (UTC)
 * I think that its both, its not correct to call a 3d model an image (although this feels a bit of a side issue of correct labelling), its more that a 3D model can provide information that an image cannot. I guess I see it similarly to the different between image, audio, video and map, they are different formats which are useful in different ways in an infobox and should have a field. John Cummings (talk) 18:22, 26 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Okay. So now I'm going to be pedantic, mostly because I'm trying to figure out if this parameter is really necessary. You're saying that you want the ability to have a 3d model in the infobox, but you don't want to call it image because it's not a static image, so a third parameter (e.g. 3dmodel) needs to be added to the infobox, even though it will (on the technical/backend) still be considered "an image". Does that sound about right? Primefac (talk) 19:07, 26 October 2020 (UTC)
 * yes, its a different kind of media in the same way as an audio file is different from an image. There is a also a practical issue with this template, you cannot display more than 2 'images' so if you want to show an image, a video and a 3d model, you can't. John Cummings (talk) 21:58, 26 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Okay, so you want me to add a third image. Primefac (talk) 12:18, 27 October 2020 (UTC)
 * thanks, I would like you to add a field called '3d model' that functions in the same way as the image fields do. John Cummings (talk) 12:33, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

✅. Primefac (talk) 00:25, 29 October 2020 (UTC)
 * thanks very much, but I don't see it in the list of fields, do I need to refresh something? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Infobox_tool John Cummings (talk) 09:05, 29 October 2020 (UTC)
 * I didn't update the documentation, if I get a chance later I'll do that. Primefac (talk) 22:33, 1 November 2020 (UTC)

What template/s are most appropriate for showing in an infobox total project costs, who funded or loaned money to a project?
Hi

I'm working on a number of articles related to solar power plants and other renewable energy infrastructure projects. One thing that I would really like to include in the infobox is a list of funders of each project, both investors and banks who loan money to the project, however for most infoboxes for infrastructure there are no fields to show this. I know in some articles a second infobox is added on specific aspects, is there an infobox that I could use to show things like investment and loans to a project, total project cost etc?

Thanks very much

John Cummings (talk) 23:21, 28 October 2020 (UTC)
 * I don't think we really have any templates that give that sort of information; it's usually the founders, owners, and/or parent companies. Primefac (talk) 00:26, 29 October 2020 (UTC)
 * ok thanks, is there a template that could include this kind of information that I could expand? John Cummings (talk) 09:06, 29 October 2020 (UTC)
 * You'd want to add it to whichever template you're thinking of, but I would suspect that such a request would be met with concern that the information is too much CRUFT or EXCESSDETAIL. Primefac (talk) 22:33, 1 November 2020 (UTC)

A possible error in time stamps
I dream of horses (Contribs) Please notify me after replying off my talk page. Thank you. 21:39, 4 November 2020 (UTC)

Naming of navbox categories
The top level category for navbox templates is Category:Navigational boxes. There are two issues present in a lot of template categories: Several speedy category C2C renaming submissions were opposed due to presence of parent categories which use "Foo templates" naming scheme, so I'm bringing it to a wider discussion.
 * 1) A template category named "Foo templates" is marked as navbox, even though it contains not only navboxes, but other types of templates as well.
 * 2) A template category consists only of navboxes and is a subcategory of some "Foo navigational boxes" category, but is named "Foobar templates" instead of "Foobar navigational boxes". This sometimes leads to non-navboxes being added to the category, thus introducing the issue described in the first item, which means that a non-navbox template becomes categorized under the tree of "Foo navigational boxes".

Should categories which consist exclusively of navboxes be always named "Category: Foo navigational boxes", regardless of naming schemes in parent categories? —⁠andrybak (talk) 14:25, 8 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Support as proposer. —⁠andrybak (talk) 14:25, 8 November 2020 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure about the proposed wording. If a category has a navbox parent category, but isn't itself a navbox category then something should be done - either (1) rename the category and purge or (2) remove the category from the navbox parent category (and reparent as necessary). Which is more appropriate depends on what's in the category. The type=navbox setting should match the category name. DexDor(talk) 16:36, 8 November 2020 (UTC)
 * , yes, polluted categories with "navbox" parent need to be split up. Example: subcats of Category:Language navigational boxes, which often have IPA templates, e.g. Category:Turkic languages navigational boxes needs to be split from Category:Turkic languages templates.
 * But this question is only about naming of clean navbox categories, regardless of their parent. —⁠andrybak (talk) 17:09, 8 November 2020 (UTC)
 * In regards to Issue #1, yes, the navbox type needs to be updated or removed, and non-navbox templates should be moved where appropriate. In regards to Issue #2, ideally, a category or sub-category that only has navboxes should be named as such. If the category is just "templates", then that should usually be a top category, not a sub-category. I don't see a problem with naming navbox-only template categories as "category: Foo navigational boxes. Funandtrvl (talk) 21:39, 8 November 2020 (UTC)
 * It should also be noted that WP:SIDEBAR templates are similar to navigation boxes, just vertical, instead of horizontal. Funandtrvl (talk) 21:43, 8 November 2020 (UTC)
 * , some templates can even be both a navbox and a sidebar. —⁠andrybak (talk) 22:16, 8 November 2020 (UTC)
 * , some templates can even be both a navbox and a sidebar. —⁠andrybak (talk) 22:16, 8 November 2020 (UTC)


 * I honestly think the move away (maybe it was standardization?) that occurred some years ago from foo navigation templates was the wrong direction. --Izno (talk) 16:01, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
 * , the only relevant discussion that I know of is a mass deletion of category redirects from variations of "Foo navigational boxes" to "Foo templates" in February of 2009. —⁠andrybak (talk) 16:54, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
 * , could you please clarify, which categories should be named foo navigation templates? Do you mean navboxes? Or navboxes and sidebars together? I.e. merge the trees of Category:Navigational boxes and Category:Sidebar templates into one? —⁠andrybak (talk) 19:30, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
 * My concern in all of this was that there were a select few subcategories under Category:Musician templates being requested for speedy renaming from templates to navigational boxes. Without looking at every single one within it but assuming they are all navboxes, should this category tree be renamed from templates to navigational boxes and moved from parents Category:Music templates and Category:People and person templates to Category:Music navigational boxes and Category:People and person navigational boxes? There was a CfD for the musical group equivalent 8 years ago (see CfD 2012 Dec 3). I would support the change to other trees in which all the templates are in fact navigational boxes. Star cheers peaks news lost wars Talk to me 18:09, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
 * , doing such a rename Without looking at every single one within it but assuming they are all navboxes means that we risk creating a polluted category. For example, a WP:PetScan search (intersecting with Category:Infobox templates) found Template:Infobox Bach composition in this tree, but it is in the process of being merged.
 * PetScan suggests that there are over 5000 templates in the category tree of Category:Musician templates. We could ask at WP:BOTREQ or WP:AWBREQ to check if all of those are indeed navboxes. If there not too many exceptions, we could start a CfD discussion to rename the whole tree, with the intention to move the few exceptions from "Foo navigational boxes" into newly created "Foo templates" categories.
 * Instead of doing such a big CfD discussion, I started going through these categories semi-automatically (WP:JWB+WP:Twinkle) after cleaning up Category:United Kingdom templates—that's why I started with categories for British musician templates. —⁠andrybak (talk) 19:25, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Instead of doing such a big CfD discussion, I started going through these categories semi-automatically (WP:JWB+WP:Twinkle) after cleaning up Category:United Kingdom templates—that's why I started with categories for British musician templates. —⁠andrybak (talk) 19:25, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Instead of doing such a big CfD discussion, I started going through these categories semi-automatically (WP:JWB+WP:Twinkle) after cleaning up Category:United Kingdom templates—that's why I started with categories for British musician templates. —⁠andrybak (talk) 19:25, 9 November 2020 (UTC)

Proposal to modify CSD T3
There is an RFC proposal to deprecate WP:T3 deletions of templates ("duplicate or hardcoded instances"). Your opinions are appreciated at the discussion. Primefac (talk) 15:05, 26 November 2020 (UTC)

RfC notice
Template Lead too short has an RFC for possible consensus. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments on the discussion page. Thank you. CapnZapp (talk) 11:01, 2 December 2020 (UTC)

Infobox request
Hi! I'm Dswitz10734, and I'm part of Wikiproject Star Wars. I wanted to request an infobox for a fictional people. There is already an infobox for a fictional race, but if you go to the page Mandalorian, the info box says at the top "Star Wars Race". Mandalorian is not a race, rather a people. It could have the same stats as the race infobox, but instead at the top it would say "Star Wars people". Can someone please help? Dswitz10734 (talk) 13:11, 2 December 2020 (UTC)

==Discussion at Wikipedia:Village pump (idea lab) § Thinking about a radical reduction of talk page banners== You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia:Village pump (idea lab) § Thinking about a radical reduction of talk page banners. &#123;{u&#124; Sdkb  }&#125;  talk 04:12, 6 December 2020 (UTC)

Help needed setting up assessment templates for Wikiquote
The Wikiquote community has decided to set up an assessment scheme similar to that of Wikipedia Wikiprojects. It should be pretty straightforward. There will be twelve classes into which all mainspace pages will be sorted: Unassessed, Stub-Class, Start-Class, C-Class, B-Class, A-Class, GP-Class, FP-Class, List-Class, Disambiguation-Class, Redirect-Class, and Placeholder-Class. GP and FP stand for "Good Page" or "Featured Page". There are no topical distinctions, though it would likely be useful to have a BLP parameter. Can anyone help with this? BD2412 T 21:36, 6 December 2020 (UTC)
 * So basically, you want to transfer over the guts of Template:WPBannerMeta so that you can put a "WikiProject" banner on pages? Primefac (talk) 22:50, 6 December 2020 (UTC)

Section sizes proposal
There is a discussion about a proposal to improve Template:Section sizes going on at Template talk:Section sizes. Your feedback would be appreciated. Mathglot (talk) 08:25, 12 December 2020 (UTC)

Linking to templates from tables and hatnotes
The article List of United States television stations available in Canada links to a number of templates from inside tables and from section hatnotes.

For example, in a table:

and in a section hatnote:

It seems to me that these pages in Template space are not designed to be called in this way from mainspace, and I can see no examples of such from the Help page. Furthermore, some links are piped so that a reader might expect to be linked to an article, but instead finds a Template page.

Is this use acceptable, or should the article be edited to display these templates in the way they were designed to be displayed, or at least use unpiped links. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 08:49, 9 December 2020 (UTC)


 * I can’t think of when a mainspace to templatespace wikilink would be valid? ProcrastinatingReader (talk) 10:10, 9 December 2020 (UTC)
 * We should not be linking to templates from articles. Primefac (talk) 10:45, 9 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Template:Navbar produces what are possibly the only valid wikilinks from mainspace to templatespace. —⁠andrybak (talk) 18:18, 9 December 2020 (UTC)
 * There appear to be at least 100 TV-related articles that have similar links, and another 12,000 articles that may need a look (note that some "links to templates" are inside comments, so are not a problem, but my searching skills are not that good). – Jonesey95 (talk) 19:10, 9 December 2020 (UTC)

Thank you all. A can of worms! Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 09:31, 12 December 2020 (UTC)

Requesting review of new template: Template:Renamed
Hello! I am relatively new to editing on Wikipedia but I've just created my first template, Template:Renamed. I was looking for a specific template to add to an article just after moving it to a new name but couldn't find one. So out of curiosity, I dug in and figured out how to set one up myself. The specific use case is for the article Dai (cryptocurrency) which I just moved from MakerDAO. There needs to be some changes to the article itself to match the new title, and since I probably wasn't going make all those changes in one sitting right after moving the page, it seemed a template of this sort would provide a helpful notice.

On the template itself, I believe I've done everything correctly, at least in terms of functionality. If there are any technical standards for templates that should be included, please modify it accordingly. Otherwise if there's something else wrong with it, let me know.

–Thanks  H iddenL emon  //  talk  07:48, 24 December 2020 (UTC)

Coding question: using a category sortkey within a template, on a parameter which may include a wikilink
This probably has a simple solution but I can't think of one. In Template:Certification Table Entry, the need arose to categorize with a sortkey based on region. The problem is that region may include a wikilink, e.g. Venezuela (APFV), so I can't just use, as it results with )]]. Any idea how to avoid this without much code? --Muhandes (talk) 00:43, 27 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Use as the sortkey. —&thinsp;JJMC89&thinsp; (T·C) 01:16, 27 December 2020 (UTC)
 * ^ what they said. Primefac (talk) 01:17, 27 December 2020 (UTC)
 * I knew there was a simple solution out there, thank you both. --Muhandes (talk) 01:23, 27 December 2020 (UTC)

Template:Source conflict
FYI, a new verifiability reference cleanup template has shown up. -- 70.31.205.108 (talk) 04:22, 10 January 2021 (UTC)

On requesting help to remove extra spaces and carriage returns in templates
Greetings and felicitations. I keep running into extra carriage returns and spaces in navbars and other templates, but often do not have the skill to remove them myself. An example is the Template:Young Bosnia, as in the "Nedeljko Čabrinović" article's External links section. Since many of these templates are seldom frequented by editors, pinging people who haven't seen a template in a year or more, often several, can be deemed obnoxious. Is this the place to bring these problems? —DocWatson42 (talk) 08:58, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
 * The problem wasn't the template itself but a space after the call. I have removed it.[//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Nedeljko_%C4%8Cabrinovi%C4%87&diff=997402478&oldid=997394626] Asking at Help desk was OK. I saw the question there. PrimeHunter (talk) 09:40, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Oh, bother (about the space). I think I've seen that before, and I forgot about that possibility.  As I believe that space exists in at least one more article, I need to go check all them that use that template.  (Thank you! ^_^)  While I have your attention, would you please be so kind as to fix the mistake I outline in Template_talk:Infobox_comics_organization?  (I just went through nearly a year's worth of edits looking for requests, and I think that's only resolvable one that is still unresolved.)  —DocWatson42 (talk) 12:02, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Looking again, it was actually a thin space I removed and not a normal space which wouldn't have caused the whitespace. PrimeHunter (talk) 12:32, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
 * I'd agree as well that asking here is perfectly fine. It's what we do! :-) Primefac (talk) 12:56, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

One more, here: Template talk:Service award progress. (I admit it's a unimportant template.) —DocWatson42 (talk) 12:10, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Unimportant, maybe, but still a rather interesting puzzle to solve. Primefac (talk) 02:31, 12 January 2021 (UTC)
 * My personal preference, if it can be done, would be to have the template, where applicable, display "Progress towards the next level" by time and edits in the actual totals, and percentages greater than 100% (in numeric form). E.g., "Progress towards the next level (by edits): [ 25,001 / 25,000 ]"/"100.0% completed". —DocWatson42 (talk) 10:38, 16 January 2021 (UTC)
 * That would likely make things more simple... feel free to start a thread on the template talk. Primefac (talk) 12:40, 16 January 2021 (UTC)

Problem with "Template:Infobox ship begin"
Greetings and felicitations. The documentation for Template:Infobox ship begin states

": N.B.: Infobox ship begin contains code that can automatically style a variety of ship and ship-class article titles. It adds a DISPLAYTITLE with italics unless is specified. For details see: the infobox usage guide §Title styling."

and includes the field

""

However, the title of Left Coast Lifter is not italicized, and when I tried to force the italicized title, I received an error messages. When I tried to follow the documentation I received this error message:

"Warning: Page using Template:Infobox ship image with unknown parameter 'display title' (this message is shown only in preview)."

and when I tried using Template:Italic title I received a different one. Any ideas? —DocWatson42 (talk) 18:14, 27 January 2021 (UTC)
 * I think I've fixed it - the  parameter is part of Infobox ship begin not Infobox ship image. The template didn't apply the italics automatically because the article title doesn't match one of the formats that it understands; see Template:Infobox ship begin/Usage guide. -- John of Reading (talk) 18:31, 27 January 2021 (UTC)


 * It looks good on the Left Coast Lifter page. Thank you! ^_^ —DocWatson42 (talk) 00:43, 28 January 2021 (UTC)

Extra carriage return after "Template:FM station data"
Greetings and felicitations. In WABE, Template:FM station data is generating an extra line break/carriage return after itself. Would someone please be so kind as to fix this?

Also, while this is not (I believe) part of your bailiwick, I have a comment to make about the appearance/an option of the mobile version of Wikipedia. Where should I do this? —DocWatson42 (talk) 10:29, 16 January 2021 (UTC)
 * That was odd. An extra line feed had somehow been saved at the end of the template in [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template:FM_station_data&diff=902490571&oldid=855102014] although the diff doesn't show it. I removed it in [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template:FM_station_data&diff=1000718732&oldid=902490571], also without showing in the diff. Line feeds at the end are supposed to be stripped automatically on save. If they survive for some reason then they are apparently included in transclusion but ignored in diffs. PrimeHunter (talk) 10:51, 16 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Seems like time to file a bug report at MediaWiki -- 70.31.205.108 (talk) 09:34, 18 January 2021 (UTC)


 * I just checked WABE and the problem seems to be fixed. Thank you! ^_^ —DocWatson42 (talk) 01:18, 28 January 2021 (UTC)


 * RE:DocWatson42 mobile version of Wikipedia: you could try WP:VPT -- 70.31.205.108 (talk) 09:36, 18 January 2021 (UTC)


 * Thank you ^_^—I just posted there. —DocWatson42 (talk) 01:18, 28 January 2021 (UTC)

Create template usage categories
I was thinking of cleaning up TemplateData and something that might help is if we added usage categories that indicate a template's usage class to templates.

For example, Template:Infobox would be in Category:Templates with over 1,000,000 uses.

A script could then be made that looks through templates that are in these major usage categories and sees if they also are in Category:Templates_using_TemplateData. If not, they get added to the list on TemplateData.

A bot should also handle finding the usage of each template and adding them to their appropriate usage category.

Thoughts?

--Lectrician1 (talk) 05:04, 11 February 2021 (UTC)
 * The documentation for High-use would be a good place to start, especially the "Technical details" section. It may be possible to add a usage category through this template or the module that it employs to do its work. If you wanted to look through the list only once, you could probably scrape the subpages linked from that Technical details section and pull out the high-usage templates and compare that list with the population of Category:Templates_using_TemplateData. – Jonesey95 (talk) 05:16, 11 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Indeed, I'd look to add a category via high-use, if a category is necessary. --Izno (talk) 15:53, 11 February 2021 (UTC)

Question about templates
Hey, I have, of course, a question about templates and figured this might be the place to bring it.

I've run into some problems with templates (and some userboxes) that automatically put categories on a user page. Most of the time, this is very helpful. But I'm not sure what to do when editors practice with templates on their sandboxes and their sandbox pages get placed in inappropriate categories. Today I ran into this issue with templates that are put on user pages for editors who've been banned by the community. For most of these instances, the editor has been inactive for years so I just blanked the sandbox. But, if they are new, I don't want to discourage them practicing with putting different templates on a sandbox to see what they look like. Also, with userboxes, sometimes the category that the userbox places the user page in is deleted, so we are left with a lot of red link categories. In these cases, I can edit the userbox and remove the code that places the category on the user page.

So, my question is, is there any code I could put on a page with a template that would omit the category being placed on the page? I don't want to edit the template to remove the category, like I've done with userboxes, because that would mess up all of the pages where it is being used correctly. I thought there might be some message I could put on these sandboxes that would say "no category" or something, on an individual usage of a template.

Thanks for any answers you could provide. Liz Read! Talk! 02:05, 28 February 2021 (UTC)
 * And a Quincy handoff from Liz to me to, who might have the answer. Randy Kryn (talk) 02:40, 28 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Well this newbie is just a troll who doesn't merit any special consideration. Template:Banned user could be enhanced to detect when it's used on a subpage like "/sandbox" ( !=  ) and not populate the category in those cases, if this is a significant issue taking up a lot of patrollers' time. – wbm1058 (talk) 03:32, 28 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Template:Banned user doesn't document it but the template supports  at Category suppression. Suppress categories is a general method for templates which don't support it. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:25, 28 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Indeed; most templates that set categories have (or should have) some sort of nocat parameter. Primefac (talk) 23:20, 4 March 2021 (UTC)

Hopefully super-easy Infobox fix
I noticed the Template:Infobox women by region has "out of 153" in the rank for the Global Gender Gap Index (the GGG in the template). I think that needs to be removed because the number of countries in the report can vary by year; exactly how the the GGI section accommodates for it.

I'm sorry to ask the dumb favor, but I already tried to fix it once and basically broke the whole thing. (Not a good look). I'm not sure how to better describe the issue, but I've already discussed it a bit over at the Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Women in Red. Hopefully this makes sense and someone can take that out? Cheers Estheim (talk) 20:12, 23 March 2021 (UTC)
 * I have changed the text to "about 150". A more sophisticated chunk of code could use something like report_year to generate an automatic reference and the correct number for that year. If the project wants that and can supply links to all of the relevant reference documents, I could probably code it for you. – Jonesey95 (talk) 00:38, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Well, this whole thing came about because I was updating Women in Guyana and 2015 is the last year Guyana was included in the report. The top section for the Global Inequality Index just has it so the editor fills in the complete rank info, and I want the GGG section to be like that one. Since the reports themselves provide the exact info each year, one blank field is easiest for more editors to be able to update. (I guess I invited myself to be the one to update all that manually, but I'm up for it.)


 * IMO the "women by region" template was confusing enough, since it was unclear to me what the fields were for (it's all abbreviated and code-ish). However I don't have any kind of consensus behind me to make any changes beyond removing the erroneous "out of 152". So if you can remove the "about 150" I can start doing a spot check to update the total based on the most recent GGG report? Estheim (talk) 10:25, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * +1 to including a parameter (I'd say ) that automatically: 1) generates the reference, 2) generates the right out of ... text, 3) adds the year where relevant. I see  already offered technical help. If a backup is needed, count me in. MarioGom (talk) 13:42, 24 March 2021 (UTC)
 * I have moved this discussion to Template talk:Infobox women by region. – Jonesey95 (talk) 14:33, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

Requesting help with Template:Infobox name module and Template:CJKV
Hello, I hope this is an appropriate place to ask for help making minor fixes these templates. For the first template, it is missing Chinese lang tags (see Template_talk:Infobox_name_module). You can see an example of the difference this makes on my sandbox. Essentially, the,  , and   parameters should be tagged with  ,  , and  , respectively. Currently, none of them are tagged, so they all display identically according to the system default.

For the second template, it inserts an extraneous space and semicolon when simplified Chinese is omitted. For example,  currently produces "traditional Chinese: 臺灣; ; pinyin: Táiwān". Obviously that extra ; should not be there (see Template talk:CJKV#Incorrectly adds extra semicolon and space). Thanks, ChromeGames923 (talk · contribs) 19:38, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Bugs in Template:Pin message
There are two problems in Pin message related to the next param. I don't have time to do anything about this in the foreseeable future, but there's a detailed explanation at Template talk:Pin message if anyone is interested. Mathglot (talk) 21:47, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Feedback requested at Template:Pp-vandalism
Your feedback would be appreciated at Template talk:Pp-vandalism. Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 22:59, 3 April 2021 (UTC)

Discussion at Wikipedia talk:Template namespace § Modules in namespace
You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia talk:Template namespace § Modules in namespace. --Trialpears (talk) 22:58, 18 April 2021 (UTC)

Preview warnings and hatnote TemplateStyles
Pages watchers may be interested in. Izno (talk) 01:08, 23 April 2021 (UTC)

Suggested values feature coming soon to all wikis
From April 29, it will be possible to suggest values for parameters in templates. Suggested values can be added to TemplateData and will then be shown as a drop-down list in VisualEditor. This allows template users to quickly select an appropriate value. This way, it prevents potential errors and reduces the effort needed to fill the template with values. It will still be possible to fill in values other than the suggested ones.

More information, including the supported parameter types and how to create suggested values, can be found on the TemplateData help page and the project page. Everyone is invited to test the feature, and to give feedback on this talk page. --Timur Vorkul (WMDE) (talk) 17:16, 27 April 2021 (UTC)

Proposal to merge auto archiving notice into talk header
You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2021 May 13 § Template:Auto archiving notice. &#123;{u&#124; Sdkb  }&#125;  talk 03:19, 14 May 2021 (UTC)

Template:Format price thousands behavior
Editors have been asking for more than a decade at the talk page of Format price to get it working better so that e.g. 407000 renders as 407,000 rather than 407 thousand. Would anyone be interested in taking on the project of fixing it? &#123;{u&#124; Sdkb  }&#125;  talk 00:00, 20 May 2021 (UTC)

articles tagged for "issues" over say, 5 years ago
can anyone recommend a reporting tool where I could see for example articles tagged for sorted by date? or recommend a wikip community or project for that? Incheon for example was tagged for tone almost 7 years ago. there's gotta be a better process than always adding tags and it seems like it's no one's job to conclusively do whatever cleanup is needed & remove the tags. skakEL 12:49, 14 June 2021 (UTC)


 * You could check Category:Wikipedia articles with style issues by month which pages tagged with tone are placed in. Gonnym (talk) 12:57, 14 June 2021 (UTC)

A small problem with Template:Infobox color
Greetings and felicitations. In the infobox for Lavender (color) there is a reference in the HSV field for one of the percentages. Unfortunately, as the template is currently configured, this means that the percent symbol comes after the reference link, in violation of MOS:CITEPUNCT. Would someone please be so kind as to fix this? —DocWatson42 (talk) 05:39, 16 June 2021 (UTC)
 * The source goes in source, per the documentation. I have fixed it. – Jonesey95 (talk) 13:32, 16 June 2021 (UTC)

Discussion at Template talk:Documentation
You are invited to join the discussion at Template talk:Documentation. -- Asartea   Talk  &#124;  Contribs  17:33, 26 June 2021 (UTC) --  Asartea   Talk  &#124;  Contribs  17:33, 26 June 2021 (UTC)

Rotating image
Hi, I have the image from a book below, that I want to add to Tambora language, but I need to rotate it withouth having to upload a new file. Is it possible?



Thanks. Bennylin (talk) 09:08, 28 June 2021 (UTC)


 * PS: I managed to do it with croptool.toolforge.org, in case future Wikipedian have the same problem. Bennylin (talk) 12:55, 1 October 2021 (UTC)

Cleanup of interlanguage links in templates
Most of the interlanguage links in templates have been moved to Wikidata by bots years ago. However about a thousand templates still have them per. I have started cleaning them up, anyone interested can join. Most of what I have found so far have been links to templates in other wikis that were deleted between the time of adding the link and wikidata migration bots were run. It seems bots ignored links that pointed to deleted or otherwise nonexistent targets. Such links can be removed after verifying. A few have been simply wrong, like linking to an article or a template with different function. They can be removed here and linked to correct template from wikidata. ಮಲ್ನಾಡಾಚ್ ಕೊಂಕ್ಣೊ (talk) 12:58, 8 July 2021 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Z1
All Z-number templates have been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the entry on the Templates for discussion page. Mathglot (talk) 21:36, 30 July 2021 (UTC)

Template category discussion – merge of Category:Wikipedia variable-like templates and Category:Magic word templates
Please join the discussion at. —⁠andrybak (talk) 09:31, 12 August 2021 (UTC)

Selective spelling change in court infobox template
Currently, Template:Infobox court always uses the word "Authorized" for the  parameter. It seems to me that, according to MOS:TIES, the word "Authorised" would be more appropriate for courts located in the UK, for example.

I'm not very familiar with how templates work, but I believe the least intrusive solution is to create an additional parameter that is similar to  but uses the word "Authorised" instead. Then, we would need to selectively edit the articles containing the template to change the parameter for courts located in certain countries. Unfortunately, Category:Pages using infobox court with unknown parameters alone contains 373 articles, so it is not very practical to review and edit all of these pages manually.

Any thoughts on what the best course of action here would be appreciated. RisingStar (talk) 02:24, 18 August 2021 (UTC)


 * I think we can probably do something like if the page has Use British English, use the "authorised" spelling. I'll play around with the idea later maybe. Also going to move this to WikiProject Templates. ProcrastinatingReader (talk) 15:33, 20 August 2021 (UTC)

Idaho: Massive banner template update - need help
So, a while back the WP:Idaho banner was made a WP:SUBST for the Parent WP:USA banner... I have revived the Idaho Project, but want to undo/split the template back into the project version (currently in the sandbox). Q: What "tool" would help me do this across 1000's of pages? (and is there a template expert that might help me?) Mjquinn_id (talk) 16:33, 20 August 2021 (UTC)
 * For every page with US Flag "ID=yes"
 * need to ADD the new Idaho Banner
 * I think we will leave the ID on the US banner for now (cannot get consensus from that project)
 * copy "class=*" from US banner to ID banner
 * also use existing "ID-importance" in new Idaho Banner "importance"
 * I feel like there is an existing bot that adds WikiProject templates to pages. That being said, I cannot for the life of me remember which bot or operator that is. I'll crosspost to BOTREQ and see if I can jog anyone's memories on who has it. If they're not available, I can always put in a BRFA. Primefac (talk) 14:56, 22 August 2021 (UTC)
 * maybe has one. ProcrastinatingReader (talk) 15:00, 22 August 2021 (UTC)
 * PearBOT 4 is for merging banners post-TFD. AnomieBOT has a task (WikiProjectTagger), which is what I was likely thinking of. I'm not sure if you can get quite the granularity needed here, but I think that would be the best place for to start. Primefac (talk) 15:07, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

One name, two outputs?
I have a bit of a problem. I'll give the general issue and then specifics (as sometimes they help).

General: there is a template with two inputs, which then generates a series of outputs based on those two inputs, namely, where the year is what the template iterates through based on stored values. The problem I have is that there is an instance where is used in two different year ranges. Using only these two inputs, can I distinguish between the year ranges?

Specifics: team appearances list (TAL) in its simplest form takes a team and a competition pair of parameters, then outputs the years where that team appeared at that competition. The problem I have is with the Republic of China at the Olympics. ROC pre-1950 was its own entity, and post-1950 is what we now call Chinese Taipei at the Olympics, BUT it used the name "Republic of China" in a few of the post-civil-war years. Thus, when I go to a page like the 1972 appearance, it shows the pre-1950 range rather than the post-1950 range (as seen on other pages such as the 1964 appearance).

Any ideas on how I could split it? Currently these appearances are being generated from infobox country at games, but it seems silly to throw in a parameter check in the ib (as opposed to the module) for two instances of one country at a games. Primefac (talk) 23:17, 31 August 2021 (UTC)
 * And for what it's worth, I'm fine with there being two pages out of everything else just not quite working right. Primefac (talk) 23:22, 31 August 2021 (UTC)
 * It seems you also have the current year from the article title (1972 from "Republic of China at the 1972 Summer Olympics"), and in Module:Team appearances list/data I see years are listed. If I understand correctly the issue, then you can use the current year to check if it fits the years listed in the module and use the correct team. If I can be pointed to the specific point in the code where the logic is placed I can try and give a better answer. Gonnym (talk) 23:27, 31 August 2021 (UTC)
 * I would have to rewrite TAL to take a year parameter, which is currently does not do (other than the start and end params). Line 77 of Template:Infobox_country_at_games/core is where the TAL call is made. Primefac (talk) 23:40, 31 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Well if you just want something fast and dirty then a hack can be added there where you do a:
 * That said, from skimming the module it doesn't seem you need to do a major rewrite to get the year parameter. mw.title.getCurrentTitle.text gets you the page title and then just extract the 4 year digit. You can also only do that if the team has a true flag in the /data (or again, just a hack for the specific country). Sorry if I'm way off what you are looking for, not familiar with those templates and module. Gonnym (talk) 00:10, 1 September 2021 (UTC)
 * Actually, getting the page title might work... I already have logic to tweak the output names. Thanks. Primefac (talk) 00:32, 1 September 2021 (UTC)
 * Actually, getting the page title might work... I already have logic to tweak the output names. Thanks. Primefac (talk) 00:32, 1 September 2021 (UTC)

Route diagram templates
Are RDTs too esoteric, or should they be included as a child of this project? Useddenim (talk) 02:13, 10 September 2021 (UTC)

Sort key for template R from person
Please help with guidance for sort keys in the template R from person by joining the discussion.Coastside (talk) 17:40, 26 September 2021 (UTC)

Regional user template subpages
In the past 12 years, I've created user templates and user categories for more than 400 countries, states, and provinces. Each of these regions uses five types of template subpages to synchronize their user templates and user categories. Yours aye, Buaidh  talk e-mail 12:17, 20 October 2021 (UTC)
 * 1) "Template:User region/par" are parameter subpages for a single region to be substituted into that region's "Template:User in region" and "Template:User region/doc1" pages.
 * 2) "Template:User region/doc1" are multiple user template documentation subpages for a single region.
 * 3) "Template:User region/cat" are multiple user category documentation subpages for a single region.
 * 4) "Template:User region/boxes" are documentation subpages for a single region to be used for both user templates and user categories.
 * 5) "Template:User */doc" are standard template documentation subpages for each "Template:User *" template.
 * Buaidh, now are these templates able to be deleted without causing any disruption. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 21:53, 20 October 2021 (UTC)
 * No, these template subpages are all functional. Yours aye, Buaidh  talk e-mail 01:42, 21 October 2021 (UTC)

Proposal to create a Unused Templates Task Force
Hello, everyone, this is WikiCleanerMan and I am proposing to create a task force as part of WikiProject Templates to help deal with the enormous backlog of unused templates from the Unused templates database report. Currently, the backlog extends to seventeen pages and 82,096 templates are listed as unused. The reason I am proposing this task force is because Wikipedia has an issue with templates regarding their creation and usage. Many templates are sitting around for no reason outside of creation, have been created for one purpose also known as single-use, and particularly sports-related templates that are essentially article content on a separate mainspace.

Now, this is a task that is going to require hundreds of users to deal with and the templates might need to be assessed going by page by page. Many of these templates will be subject to Tfd's which will most likely result in them being deleted.

It should be noted that some templates are in the process of being used or will be used depending on the particular circumstance. And some listed on the database are redirects to the actual template itself which can cause confusion.

Before a task force is created I propose the following name: Unused Templates Task Force as the name of this project. And I propose the following rules/guidelines of this task force:

1) A group of users to take on one page at a time. One group will handle page one of unused templates, another for page two, another for page three, and so on and so forth. Although for this, I'm still unsure if the project should tackle one page at a time or multiple. But one page at a time might be easier to do given how many are listed on one page alone. Page one for instance features 5,000 templates.

2) A group of users to tackle templates under a specific category. For instance, a group to tackle sports-related templates or politics/government templates.

3) Probably one that will be the most time consuming, a group to tackle a certain number of templates per page. Let's say, a group handles forty on page one per certain types of templates or they handle twenty at a time or thirty, etc...

4} If a template is listed as unused, but has a particular purpose, before nominating it for deletion at a Tfd, it may be best to check the purpose it was created for or to help determine a consensus with members here to avoid a potential screw up. For instance, I've created a few foreign relations templates, linked on my user page, that are listed as unused but have a particular purpose and I do intend to add them to articles in the future. So doing a Tfd for these would be counterproductive in a sense and instead, users should add it to the relevant articles. And it's also best to check if a template is part of a series of similar templates as templates under the category, Category:State Council of the People's Republic of China have two listed as unused, but others are used on the relevant articles, so nominating the two listed as unused for deletion might not help with the backlog.

5) Not all members should be notified which template from the database reports is being nominated as they were would be too many to go through. This will fall into the Canvassing policy which is not and will not be tolerated nor is part of the purpose of this task force.

If there is any objection or counterproposals, feel free to ping me as I would like to have an open discussion about this task force idea. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 01:24, 7 September 2021 (UTC)
 * I think this is a worthy project. In my experience, you will neither need nor find hundreds of editors for a project like this. You'll be lucky to gather six people who will stick with it, but a group that size can make a lot of progress. A group of just three or four editors recently took on Database reports/Transclusions of deleted templates, reducing it from tens of thousands of errors to essentially zero. Also, I strongly recommend making nominations in groups in order to avoid burning out the volunteers at TFD.


 * If you're going to take on this task, it will be worthwhile to ask for a revised report that excludes any templates that were created or edited in the last year, or some other reasonable time frame. You might also consider excluding templates with above a certain number of revisions, depending on whether your investigation finds that to be a relevant factor. Older, stale templates with only a couple of edits will be much easier to investigate.


 * Also consider removing untranscluded redirects from the report, like F.C. Groningen Squad, to templates that have transclusions. Redirects are cheap.


 * Before you gather editors, look through the report for large batches of templates that should either be deleted or excluded from the reports. Adminstats, for example, has 554 subpages, many of which appear on the report. They should probably either be deleted or excluded from the report. There are probably many similar batches (subpages of Latest stable software release, for example). – Jonesey95 (talk) 18:07, 7 September 2021 (UTC)
 * I would also exclude any templates that have Help:Interlanguage links although checking for that might be more trouble than it's worth. I personally don't see the biggest benefit/gains in deleting unused templates, with some downsides/risks of accidentally over deleting, if the TfD review is done in a haste/or more likely, overwhelmed by reports from such a task force. ~ Shushugah (he/him • talk) 18:14, 7 September 2021 (UTC)
 * It looks like 69,000 of the 82,000 items in the report are redirects, leaving only 13,000 actual pages to deal with. That is a lot more manageable. Of those, it looks like at least 1,000 are unused stub templates; consider posting at Wikipedia talk:Stub to see if there is an appetite for mass deletion of these unused stub templates. – Jonesey95 (talk) 18:46, 7 September 2021 (UTC)
 * Stub templates should be excluded from this cleanup, as they are by definition intended to be added temporarily to articles until these articles grow beyond stub status. Many of these templates will be unused at any point in time but may be needed the next day. Pam  D  23:13, 7 September 2021 (UTC)
 * Jonesey95, per your suggestions, I've started a discussion on the stub project talk page, and requested four reports to go through this database of unused templates. Thanks, these are really useful ideas. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 23:18, 7 September 2021 (UTC)


 * Jonesey95, who were the editors who took on the Transclusions of deleted templates? --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 23:42, 14 September 2021 (UTC)
 * I don't remember. Gnomes can be difficult to keep track of. – Jonesey95 (talk) 01:41, 15 September 2021 (UTC)


 * Does anyone know how long it takes for them at the database reports to get back to one's request? --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 02:01, 15 September 2021 (UTC)
 * Link to my request. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 02:03, 15 September 2021 (UTC)
 * There's an ongoing discussion at Bot requests. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 15:45, 4 October 2021 (UTC)

After digging through the database reports. Reports 1 to 3 are the ones that list templates that aren't redirects or stubs until number 12205. Starting with 12206 on page 3 everything after that is redirects of mainly/largely sports-related templates. Twelve thousand templates are easier to go through than the whole collection of redirects from near the end of page three to near the end of sixteen to seventeen which list the unused stub templates. Although, this doesn't clear the issue of some templates that are unused and if they were to be deleted could cause disruption for some basic functions such as Adminstats and Category:Parameter shared content templates. — Preceding unsigned comment added by WikiCleanerMan (talk • contribs) 15:14, 12 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Jonesey95, I asked at Village Pump regarding the Adminstats and two other admin templates, and they stated per the Tfd from February 27, 2019, that they should be kept essentially for historical record. I've asked Project AFC and Women in Red regarding their unused project templates. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 16:27, 13 October 2021 (UTC)

Jonesey95 has created a subpage that filters the unused templates removing stubs, redirects, S-line templates which he has nominated for deletion recently, pages with "testcases" or "sandbox" in its name, and templates edited in 2021. Currently stands at 6,800 unused. A lot easier now and can accomplish removing the backlog. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 14:33, 16 October 2021 (UTC)

Tagging all active members of this project as stated on the project home page to see where they stand on the task force proposal and for them to offer any other suggestions on how to deal with the backlog and the now revised version by Jonesey95: andrybak, Berrely, BrandonXLF, Buaidh, Daniel Mietchen, DannyS712, DGG, Enterprisey, Ken Tony, Kepler-1229b, Mike Peel, Mirokado, MonkeyStolen234, Mr. Guye, Northamerica1000, Paine Ellsworth, Pigsonthewing, Sdkb, SMcCandlish, Vanisaac. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 18:36, 19 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Pinging doesn't work if you don't sign your message, unfortunately. You'll have to create a new message and sign it (you can't just sign the above message; it won't ping). I think the things to do now are to identify groups of templates on the filtered report and decide what to do with them. Examples of actions include: batch TFD nomination (e.g. unused RDT templates), tagging with subst only or transclusionless if appropriate (e.g. barnstars), and filtering them out of the list (e.g. rater-data.js pages, maybe). There are probably other appropriate actions. One thing we should probably not do is flood the TFD pages with hundreds of nominations. Batch nominations and group tagging are probably better if we want to reduce the overall size of the filtered report. – Jonesey95 (talk) 17:26, 19 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Right, I agree, a lot of unused templates have similar purposes or are part of a project. The Afc, adminstats, and WikiProject Templates should stay as is otherwise it would cause disruption. But I think if users were to target in alphabetical order, one group doing templates under letter a, b, c, etc... would help ease the burdern. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 18:40, 19 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Sounds like fun. Go for it. Enterprisey (talk!) 22:39, 19 October 2021 (UTC)
 * I'll be happy to participate in the proposed Unused Templates Task Force. I've created 10,465 template pages and 87 User:UBX template pages over the past 15 years and I suspect that a number of these may no longer be in use. I can delete or redirect any of the unneeded templates I created and I can examine other unneeded templates. Yours aye, Buaidh  talk e-mail 22:19, 19 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Since you're here,, perhaps you could explain how the "Template:User */par" subpages work. See Database reports/Unused templates/2, where there are a bunch of these pages listed, starting at Template:User Abu Dhabi/par. If they are actually in use, they probably need to be excluded from the report in some way. – Jonesey95 (talk) 01:44, 20 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Certainly. I've created 479 "Template:User region/par" regional parameter subpages which will show up as unused because they are substituted into their relevant "Template:User in region" and "Template:User region/doc1" template pages. These regional parameter template subpages are used to synchronize related regional user templates. All of these "Template:User region/par" regional parameter subpages include instructions for their use. None of these "Template:User region/par" regional parameter subpages should be deleted. Yours aye, Buaidh  talk e-mail 11:05, 20 October 2021 (UTC)
 * @Buaidh a follow up question to this Template:User Abu Dhabi/par says it is used for shared data for all templates in Category:Abu Dhabi user templates, however only Template:User in Abu Dhabi uses the data with the others all being wraps of User in Abu Dhabi (such as ). Am I missing something? Gonnym (talk) 11:27, 20 October 2021 (UTC)
 * You've got it. "Template:User in region" generates the other regional user templates and "Template:User region/doc1" creates documentation for these templates and their regional user categories. See below. Yours aye,  Buaidh  talk e-mail 12:25, 20 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Why are there other regional user templates in addition to "Template:User in region"? In the past 12 years, the "Template:User in region" templates have grown to have 65 options. I've had numerous requests for simpler templates, thus the simpler templates generated from the "Template:User in region" templates. Yours aye, Buaidh  talk e-mail 12:41, 20 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Support taskforce creation. I didn't realize there were so many unused templates.&thinsp;&mdash; Mr. Guye (talk) (contribs)&thinsp; 02:27, 20 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Support taskforce. I foresee a lot of WP:TFD activity.  Please be sure a template is really unused, though. Lots of them get substituted.  And I would prioritize by length of time unused.  Something that's been unused for 10 years is more apt to be worthless junk than something unused since last week (might be a new template).  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  13:03, 20 October 2021 (UTC)

Since we now have five users, not including myself, and since five is enough to create a task force, per the guidelines. I will create the subpage in a few hours and notify the respective users and will outline the goals and scope of our project. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 15:47, 21 October 2021 (UTC)

The Task Force has been created. Feel free to join and make improvements. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 19:59, 21 October 2021 (UTC)

Announcing 'Last N contributions'
I finally got tired of having to manually construct a link to show a specific list of user contributions I wanted to highlight, such as "Jimbo's last 12 Talk page edits ending 27 September at 5:25", so I wrote a template for it:

Variously configurable; see doc. Please add bugs/suggestions to Template talk. Sandbox and testcases still tbd. Also, I seem to remember having seen a Template nav page somewhere where it could be useful to add this, but I can't remember where; can you help? Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 01:28, 23 October 2021 (UTC)
 * This will be extremely useful for bot requests. Thanks. I'm going to make some bold changes but I'll discuss there. Primefac (talk) 06:31, 23 October 2021 (UTC)

Very weird template
The article on Cannabis_(drug) contains (when you read the article) a long section on "Difference between C. indica and C. sativa", but when you try to edit it, all you see is "{ { Difference between Cannabis indica and Cannabis sativa } }" (spaces added so the text doesn't appear here). I finally figured out that this is a "template" labelled Template:Difference between Cannabis indica and Cannabis sativa that contains multiple paragraphs of text; it was created earlier this year by an editor whose behavior appears to be generally questionable based on their talk page.

I guess this is a short cut that allows including a large chunk of text in multiple articles, but it makes the section of the article virtually uneditable. Is there any justification at all for this approach? The text in the template belongs in the article, but this seems like a very messed up way to approach it. My own feeling is that the template should be removed, and the text placed back in the article. Suggestions/comments? Finney1234 (talk)

It’s got three transclusions if you check where the template is also linked in Article namespace, but I agree it makes it quite difficult for someone to improve/edit it, plus there are side effects of adding info that isn’t relevant for all three articles then ~ 🦝 Shushugah (he/him • talk) 10:38, 14 November 2021 (UTC)


 * A template should not be used to store article content. I'll be taking this template to TfD soon. Gonnym (talk) 13:32, 14 November 2021 (UTC)


 * Gonnym Thanks, I thought it was a messy approach (e.g., the detailed plant description doesn't belong in the Cannabis_(drug) article).


 * Shushugah Can you tell me exactly what do to find out what articles are currently using the template? "Article namespace" is new to me.


 * It is important that the template text (it's not perfect, but it's not bad) be placed back in the articles using it; I'll do that if/when necessary (unless someone else does it first, which would be fine with me :-) ).Finney1234 (talk) 15:45, 14 November 2021 (UTC)
 * That's not how articles should be written. Articles should not WP:CONTENTFORK each other. Write the article correctly so one builds on top of the other, not duplicates it. Gonnym (talk) 15:58, 14 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Gonnym I see that you've already done the cleanups; thanks very much. My concern was just that the textual material not completely disappear.Finney1234 (talk) 16:01, 14 November 2021 (UTC)
 * In fact, looking at your contributions, I see you've done a whole bunch of relevant changes. Even more thanks.Finney1234 (talk) 16:18, 14 November 2021 (UTC)

Looking for a template that returns a country flag for a specific year
I'm looking for a template that returns a country flag for a specific year. The way it should work is that I pass it two parameters, the country name and the year, and it returns the flag used at the time. I've looked at Flagcountry, but that doesn't do it. Anyone know any other templates? Gonnym (talk) 18:04, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
 * As long as you're looking for post-1900 and don't mind using country codes, country alias will do that (though it takes three, ). Primefac (talk) 18:08, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
 * That's a good start. If the 3 letter codes are ISO 3166 code-3 I think that could work. Is it possible to update the /data with pre-1900 values? Gonnym (talk) 18:21, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
 * The template was designed with sports in mind, specifically the Olympics, and all of the information is stored in a single /data module, so exponentially increasing its size with pre-1900 flag variants is not something I'm necessarily keen on.
 * Just to ask the stupid question that I should have asked initially, why does flag (or any of the half dozen variants) not work? Primefac (talk) 18:41, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
 * They don't work because they have very simple logic in them. For example this is what is in Template:Flag/core . So If I use this:  I get: 🇫🇷 France, which is not File:Royal flag of France during the Bourbon Restoration.svg (and I don't need an icon, but that's currently not the main issue). Gonnym (talk) 19:14, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
 * I mean, that's basically what country alias does, albeit using ranges rather than hard values. If anything, the country data system should be updated to fit this schema as well, so that if File:Royal flag of France during the Bourbon Restoration.svg is used from 1814-1830, any value passed to flag or its variants within this range would return the correct flag. Hell, a "Country data" module could do exactly that, without the need for a bazillion pages. Primefac (talk) 19:50, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Module:CountryData exists as a graft onto the current template system. Izno (talk) 19:58, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
 * What is the verdict, should I duplicate Module:Country alias? Gonnym (talk) 12:55, 18 November 2021 (UTC)
 * No, I think an expansion of the CountryData module is in order. Primefac (talk) 12:56, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

Help with broken template
Template:Citeplato has been broken for some time, with every link leading to a 503 error page at Toolforge (example). The template creator (User:Atethnekos) hasn't edited since 2014; User:Deor asked for help on the talk page in August 2020 and got no response. Does anyone here know how to fix this? Thanks. Dan from A.P. (talk) 13:21, 21 November 2021 (UTC)
 * If it's a trivial fix to get the template working again, then that should be done. If the tool is dead and there is no chance of reviving it, I would suggest manually replacing it on the six pages that use it and then nominate it for deletion. Primefac (talk) 13:39, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

Setting widths using
I've tried using Template:Col-float recently, but I want to be able to tweak the widths of the columns, as I don't need them to be 30em wide (the default used by the template). I used the width parameter, but it seems that parameter only allows the width to be increased – for instance, if I use, the width will be increased to 40em, but if I use  , the width will remain 30em. Any ideas on why this might be happening? RunningTiger123 (talk) 17:06, 8 December 2021 (UTC)

Not everything needs a template
Hi, all, I've created a user essay that I think addresses an issue we have here on Wikipedia regarding template creation. It's called Not everything needs a template. Similar to Not everything needs a navbox, but it addresses a similar issue with navboxes but also infoboxes and sidebars. Feel free to edit or add to the essay or make suggestions on the talk page of the user essay. I do believe it's an essay we need. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 22:16, 10 December 2021 (UTC)

Template:Chembox has an RFC
Template:Chembox has an RFC for possible consensus. A discussion is taking place. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments on the discussion page. Thank you. DePiep (talk) 09:49, 16 December 2021 (UTC)

Update documentation for Template:Gallery
Hi, can someone please look into the documentation of Gallery and update it accordingly, so that editors don't face the issues that were raised at (raised on 13th January '21). Thanks! ---CX Zoom(he/him) (let's talk&#124;contribs) 10:25, 14 January 2022 (UTC)
 * I'll be honest, I'm not entirely sure what needs updating - it's pretty clear that it goes Filename/alt/caption in that order and named as indicated in the example. If you're copy/pasting the code (or even just manually emulating it) there shouldn't be an issue? Primefac (talk) 10:52, 14 January 2022 (UTC)
 * In a typical template, say for example Shading PVI, one can use or  and get the same result if done in correct order. But in the case of Gallery, the parameters not explicitly mentioned something like ,, etc. are assumed to be alternating for a file and it's caption. The sequence in template documentation provides for a pattern of parameters: file1, alt1, cap1, file2, alt2, cap2, .... Here, altn is always a named parameter whenever used, but a person accustomed with a typical template (like the one who asked for help at help desk) might not understand that and assume that merely following the sequence without explicitly naming the parameters would work as is the case with Shading PVI above. But it doesn't work out as intended causing confusion on the part of the editor. ---CX Zoom(he/him) (let's talk&#124;contribs) 12:37, 14 January 2022 (UTC)
 * I'll give it another read, but if a template doesn't explicitly state that any parameter can be in any order, named or not, then chances should be pretty good that you need to name the named parameters and not-name the positional parameters. That being said, the order of named/unnamed doesn't matter (e.g. is the same as ), but

| alt1= | Write a caption here
 * File:
 * should not give anyone ideas that the alt1 para is an optionally-named parameter.
 * In fact, upon re-reading the /doc, it's actually quite explicit that the alts are named (alt1 for the first image, alt2 for the second image, etc). Primefac (talk) 14:07, 14 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Also, I just realised that most of my comment comes across as me being annoyed or otherwise yelling at you for being an idiot, but I am honestly not trying to sound that way, just not sure how best to get my point across any other way. It's a perfectly legitimate request/discussion topic, I just personally don't see any way to really improve the documentation as it currently reads. Primefac (talk) 14:08, 14 January 2022 (UTC)
 * That documentation was more confusing than it needed to be. I have unconfused it a bit. – Jonesey95 (talk) 17:40, 14 January 2022 (UTC)
 * A good change. Benefits of a collaborative project. Thanks. Primefac (talk) 18:14, 14 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks . Thanks . Both of your response is highly appreciated. ---CX Zoom(he/him) (let's talk&#124;contribs) 20:12, 14 January 2022 (UTC)

Discussion at Template talk:Table cell templates § Color change in "Nominated"
You are invited to join the discussion at Template talk:Table cell templates § Color change in "Nominated". RunningTiger123 (talk) 03:33, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

About Template:Hebrew month and Template:Hijri month
I noticed that due to the construction of Template:Hebrew month and Template:Hijri month, which are structured as infoboxes but constructed as tables, sometimes the text gets REALLY close to the template, like sometimes touching it, bc I presume there isn't adequate padding. Examples, though you might have to adjust your browser window size to see how close it gets: Shevat, Rajab (which also just... has a whole situation). I feel like they might be better structured to use Template:Infobox, but I am not well versed in templates and their construction. At minimum, it warrants some sort of fix about the padding? ~Cheers, Ten  Ton  Parasol  02:09, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
 * ✅, though I suspect you'll need to start flipping template orders around so the infobox actually appears first. Primefac (talk) 11:24, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

Shared/Dynamic IP templates
The URLs used by Dynamic IP, Shared IP etc. don't work. I corrected one URL and then realized that every template uses different URLs and none of them works. Thoughts on how to solve it once and for all? Maybe some joined code? --Muhandes (talk) 10:24, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

Template suppressing display of stub tag? - discussion elsewhere
Something weird seems to happen with Medical resources: it appears to suppress the display of a stub tag appearing after it. I've asked at Template_talk:Medical_resources, but then thought someone here might be able to help. Please have a look and comment there if you have any idea what's happening. Thanks. Pam D  12:58, 19 January 2022 (UTC)
 * I've replied there to avoid decentralised discussion. Primefac (talk) 13:20, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

Naval templates
Hey, I don't know if this is the right forum, but there is an issue that I hope you guys might be able to help with.

A few days ago, something changed, which broke the, and I don't know what.

Previously, the and  worked exactly the same. However, now the navy one don't work anymore.

Example:
 * Navy:
 * Naval:

Anyone know what happened, or what can be done to fix it? Thanks Skjoldbro (talk) 08:57, 23 January 2022 (UTC)
 * The functionality was changed as a result of the discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Flag Template. I suggest you ask for help there. -- John of Reading (talk) 09:05, 23 January 2022 (UTC)

Editintros marker?
Is there a banner to mark an editintro template? Something like subst only or preloaded template, to show that this template may be transclusionless, but is loaded by some other processes. Or do these use transclusionless ? -- 65.92.246.142 (talk) 00:25, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Transclusionless, with a custom reason that links to the template that uses it, is usually helpful. Many of these template pages are missing documentation, so I have a copy-paste block of text that looks like this:


 * I paste some or all of it and then modify it as needed. Make sure that the first noinclude tag is immediately after the last character of the template code, not on a new line, to avoid excess whitespace when the template is used. – Jonesey95 (talk) 18:46, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

LUA loaded marker?
Is there a banner to mark a template that is called from LUA? Something like preloaded template, to show that this template may be transclusionless, but is loaded by a LUA module, thus does not appear on the transclusion count. Or do these use transclusionless ? -- 65.92.246.142 (talk) 00:25, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
 * See answer above. Use reason as needed to provide information about which template or module uses the template page, so that people do not have to hunt around. – Jonesey95 (talk) 18:48, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Is there a way to allow people to click on a country to access a link on Template:Graph:Highlighted_world_map_by_country?
Hi all

I'm building some documentation using Template:Graph:Highlighted_world_map_by_country, does anyone know if its possible to add links in to individual countries so people could click the links to access other pages?

Thanks

John Cummings (talk) 20:20, 7 February 2022 (UTC)

Use of named section headers instead of "convenience templates"
I see that at eg Ice hockey at the 2022 Winter Olympics – Men's team rosters we're using section headers and then at Canada at the 2022 Winter Olympics they can use to get the content there. Seems a vastly better approach than the misnamed "convenience templates". Probably I've missed lots of discussion about this but I'm assuming I can wade in and change over to this new improved style. Curling is still using 2022 Winter Olympics curling convenience template navbox and I note we already have blank "convenience templates" at Category:2022 Commonwealth Games convenience templates for two sports which need deleting, I assume. Nigej (talk) 16:50, 6 February 2022 (UTC)
 * , in 2020 the Olympics project determined that we weren't going to use convenience templates going forward, and all but one (which I handled about an hour ago) were deleted at TFD. I believe that consensus still holds, so if you want to make a list of those convenience templates I can delete them (assuming they haven't already been nominated for deletion...). Primefac (talk) 10:13, 10 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Cheers. I'm keeping an eye out for newly created ones. We have 2022 Winter Olympics mixed doubles curling draw 11 sheet B etc but I was planning to convert these after it's all over. That's the only 2022 Winter Olympic event using the old style. I think it's worth converting because most of the editors who create these things start off by copying old ones. I'll let you know when I have a "set" that's unused. Nigej (talk) 10:26, 10 February 2022 (UTC)

Template for sockpuppet votes/cmts
Hi everyone, I recently created a template that can be used to mark votes/comments cast by sockpuppets. The template is Sock vote. I didn't spent a lot of time to create this and it may require some modification. Please feel free to review and modify the template as appropriate and then use it! Thanks! ---CX Zoom(he/him) (let's talk&#124;contribs) 14:26, 28 February 2022 (UTC)

Template:Medal Display/ZAR / Template:Medal Display
Medal Display is messed up, it lumps all "other" into "South Africa" (ZAR). It seems to me that all non-South African medals should be stripped off and placed in a "default" subtomplate, and ZAR should actually function like its name implies, for South Africa. -- 65.92.246.142 (talk) 22:19, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
 * That is... odd, to say the least. As a very short-term, it's-10pm-and-I-want-to-sleep fix, I've moved the page to Template:Medal Display/other; the code and display will work exactly as before, and for the moment ZAR will still return the proper results. As soon as I'm more awake (and find some time) I'll split the ZAR medals back to the /ZAR subtemplate. That being said, if someone wants to deal with it first, by all means go for it. Primefac (talk) 22:25, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
 * This is my template. The reason it's all under ZAR is not "odd" it's because I developed it for ZAR and there was almost no other info available on anything else. I'm happy to have assistance in restructuring the pages around it if that is something that gains consensus, but I think that making a decision and implementing it six minutes after it's made without waiting for anyone else to weigh in is a little... arrogant?
 * BoonDock (talk) 23:17, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
 * It's not really "your" template, though it's always nice to have the template creator around during the process of restructuring. It's also not arrogant for someone to fix an obvious issue. My change was a) simple, b) easily reversible, and most important c) does not leave the template pretending it's not something it is. Half of the medals in the /ZAR (now /other) subtemplate were not South African in nature, so calling them that was problematic on a number of levels. I get the intention, having written or modified hundreds of templates, and know how easy it is to have something that works "well enough", but when someone comes along and indicates what needs fixing, if it's an easy fix it should be done. Primefac (talk) 08:43, 28 February 2022 (UTC)


 * Primefac, it is debatable about the use of other vs ZAR in terms of content, as almost all the ones listed there have been earned by South Africans at various times.
 * I grant you that my many hours of work on this template have been given into the public domain, but that doesn't change ownership. BoonDock (talk) 12:23, 28 February 2022 (UTC)
 * I rather find there to be zero debate needed - one ideally shouldn't be storing UK, US, and China values (among others) under the ZAR code, because they are not ZAR. I have no issue with a "no code given" option for the primary template, but the subtemplate it uses should reflect that and not just be an arbitrary country picked out of the list. Primefac (talk) 12:57, 28 February 2022 (UTC)
 * @BoonDock, please see Ownership of content. Gonnym (talk) 13:19, 28 February 2022 (UTC)
 * To get back to the question at hand (and I'm keeping this here mostly because there are more watchers) I see two options. Right now there are only two transclusions of the UK subpage, and only ten transclusions of the US subpage:
 * Option 1, have a single subpage with every country/medal option and getting rid of the "country" parameter. This would affect the aforementioned 12 pages.
 * Option 2, we split out every country into its own subtemplate and then mandate the use of country. This would return ZAR values back to its base and mean updating the 182 pages that are currently calling Medal Display/other.
 * Anyone who knows anything about me knows that I prefer the simplest option with the least disruption, and given that the /other template isn't huge (yet) I think it makes the most sense to go with Option 1. If the #switch gets too large, we can re-add a country parameter and make that a top-level switch (i.e. we check country, then check code). Thoughts? Primefac (talk) 13:20, 1 March 2022 (UTC)

Template for User's name
Hi, we have some amazing template like If IP, If autoconfirmed, etc. These return a value based on the status of the user. Can someone direct me to, or make a template that returns us the username or IP address of the user? I want to use it with   such that, when returned username is equal to REVISIONUSER, we get a message that should otherwise not be shown to anyone else. Thanks! ---CX Zoom(he/him) (let's talk&#124;contribs) 10:43, 2 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Does Help:Magic words respond in some way to your request? – Jonesey95 (talk) 19:33, 3 March 2022 (UTC)

Subpage sandbox tagging?
Is there a way to mark a page as a template sandbox if it is a template subpage's sandbox version? doesn't seem to support such functionality.

For instance, with this template page set

If I were to use it would not work, if I were to use , the sandbox notice assumes that this is the sandbox for  instead of. It seems there should be a way to indicate the template page this is the sandbox to, and possibly indicate it as a template subpage's sandbox -- 65.92.246.142 (talk) 13:17, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
 * I think you've got the right idea, but you've got the subpage order mixed up. I don't think you would want to have, but rather as the sandbox of the   subpage. Primefac (talk) 13:26, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Though that wouldn't work if the subpage is accessed using relative paths, the sandboxed version of the main template would need to be different from the coding of the unsandboxed version. -- 65.92.246.142 (talk) 19:03, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Ideally relative paths shouldn't be used because they'll only work on that specific page; calling from this page would mean calling, which is what would happen if  calls the subtemplate like that and it were transcluded here. You will always need to have the /sandbox version of a template calling the /sandbox version of any subpages or likewise, unless you're developing a new subtemplate and thus can do all of your sandboxing on that page directly. That being said, I'm pretty sure if you include a documentation page, it will correctly identify which sandbox the page is for. Primefac (talk) 19:32, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
 * TemplateStyles pages are named as the "I don't think" case. No comment on whether that matters substantively. Izno (talk) 21:20, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
 * That would be one of the cases I was referring to - 65.92.246.142 (talk) 22:25, 19 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Example of correct order for subtemplates:
 * WPBannerMeta + WPBannerMeta/core
 * WPBannerMeta/sandbox + WPBannerMeta/core/sandbox
 * —⁠andrybak (talk) 02:15, 13 March 2022 (UTC)

Template limits listed at Requested moves
A requested move discussion has been initiated for Template limits to be moved to Help:Template limits. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 01:33, 20 March 2022 (UTC)
 * To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude, or set up Article alerts for this WikiProject.

There is a proposal at WP:VPPR that may be of interest
Hi, I recently opened a proposal at, which might be of interest to participants of this WikiProject. Please feel free to join the discussion, if you desire to. Thanks! ---CX Zoom(he/him) (let's talk&#124;contribs) 12:17, 27 March 2022 (UTC)

Template:Nom has an RFC
Template:Nom has an RFC for possible consensus. A discussion is taking place. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments on the discussion page. Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ftrebien (talk • contribs) 21:43, 23 January 2022 (UTC)

Usage versus use
I don't know why we use the word "usage" to head the template documentation section on how to use a template rather than the more readily understood word "use". The term "usage" is always a noun, while "use" can be either a noun or verb, but used as a section heading, it clearly is a noun. The term "usage" implies that this is the proper use of a template, white the more general term "use" implies that this is a merely a guide on how to use the template. I vote for "use". Your aye, Buaidh  talk e-mail 02:24, 17 May 2022 (UTC)
 * The first definition of "usage" at m-w.com is "firmly established and generally accepted practice or procedure". The third definition is "the way in which words and phrases are actually used (as in a particular form or sense) in a language community". Those are the meanings we intend with this word, AFAICT. "Use" has many more meanings and serves as multiple parts of speech, so employing it as a heading would be more ambiguous. – Jonesey95 (talk) 16:26, 17 May 2022 (UTC)
 * But it is the proper use of the template and not merely a guide. You cannot invent new parameters not listed in the the documentation and expect it to work. Gonnym (talk) 17:09, 17 May 2022 (UTC)

Template:Information styling
Page watchers may be interested in Template talk:Information. Please leave any comments there. Izno (talk) 03:53, 18 May 2022 (UTC)

Paid contributions template query
Hi all. I'm here with a question about the wording in one specific template. As some relevant background, I work for CME Group and have a conflict of interest, and I've been making some requests to fix issues on CME Group CEO Terrence A. Duffy's page. Editors have been very helpful with their feedback, and the page is in a much better place. The editor who helped complete some of the updates added the Paid contributions template to the page so that it's clear to readers that there has been involvement from an editor with a financial conflict. However, I wanted to reach out here as they were not sure if it is possible to amend the template to reflect that the page does not need cleanup. I discussed it with the editor and they said the page is in great shape (they even noted this in their edit summary about the template). However, the template says that cleanup may be needed.

Is there an alternative template to flag the paid contributions but not indicate that the page still needs work? Or is there a way to amend the template in this type of case?

Thank you, Lbischel (talk) 20:22, 20 May 2022 (UTC)


 * That tag should be added to articles only if those articles do need cleanup. It is not supposed to be a permanent stamp of paid contributions. There are other sufficient mechanisms for that as discussed in WP:PAID/WP:COI. Izno (talk) 21:18, 20 May 2022 (UTC)
 * The template has been removed per discussion at Talk:Terrence A. Duffy. —⁠andrybak (talk) 22:19, 20 May 2022 (UTC)

Flex columns template adjustment
Page watchers may be interested in. Please leave any comments there. Izno (talk) 01:22, 21 May 2022 (UTC)

Category:Flag template shorthands has an RFC
Category:Flag template shorthands has an RFC for possible consensus. A discussion is taking place. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments on the discussion page. Thank you. Fernando Trebien (talk) 20:19, 3 June 2022 (UTC)