Talk:2008 Pittsburgh Steelers season

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Good article2008 Pittsburgh Steelers season has been listed as one of the Sports and recreation good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
Article milestones
DateProcessResult
April 11, 2009Good article nomineeListed

SOS[edit]

You need a source stating that the Steelers have the toughest schedule--and even then you should probably qualify it to indicate how that judgment is reached. Samer (talk) 16:57, 26 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I figured that it meant that the teams they play in '08 had the highest combined winning percentage in '07; higher than any other team's '08 opponents that is. Blackngold29 (talk) 19:05, 26 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

It was on SportsCenter today. I added the citation, but do not have the season or episode as SportsCenter doesn't really have them (that I can find). The episode aired at 8 AM EST. If anyone knows how to find this info please add it. Blackngold29 (talk) 13:00, 15 April 2008 (UTC) Another citation has been added, that should suffice. Blackngold29 03:56, 26 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I found the page on the NFL Website that listed the teams by their strength of schedule, showing the Steelers opponents with a winning percentage of .598 in 2007, 12 teams with +.500 record in 2007, and 8 teams that were in the playoffs in 2007.Terry Chapman (talk) 06:31, 7 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Dates in game heading[edit]

Would there be any opposition to removing the date from each week's heading? I think it would look better if it was just "Week One: Houston Texans". We can include the date right above the "Game time" and it is still in the Schedule at the top. I think that it is more important to put the emphisis on the team played instead of the date, because when all is said and done it's the opponent, not the date that counts. Thanks! Blackngold29 06:20, 2 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Article length[edit]

I have been working to keep this article updated and in top form for a few months now—including altering a few things from past seasons as well as developing new features in search of that "perfect season artcle". For better or worse, in that time it has grown to 67 kilobytes in length after only the first week of regular season play. The prose recap for game one was nearly 3,500 bytes in itself. I have realized that, due to the guidelines of article size, we must take action to prevent it from becoming too long. I've considered removing the "Ownership restructure" section as it is identical to the paragraph on the franchise article. I feel that we should concentrate primarily on the team's on-field play, though as of now I would like to keep the "Off field activity" of the offseason. If I make any changes or large removals from the article, please do not hesitate to contact me here or my talk page with any concerns that you may have. Thank you. Blackngold29 14:57, 8 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hey Blakngold, I'll do a thorough copy-edit when I get a chance. Hopefully we can get that source count down. Grsz11 →Review! 17:43, 10 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I really don't see a reason to reduce the number of cites. Citations do not count as article length, and I always think it's better to have too many souces than not enough. There's some here and there which repeat themselves that could probably go, but I don't think we should remove them just to remove them. I think the copy edit is a good idea, but try to keep everything about the same length (game summaries are about 200 words). Blackngold29 19:42, 10 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Ya, what I meant was consolitading two cites that may say the same thing, or like I did in the draft: instead of citing an article once for 5 consecutive sentences, it only needs cited once at the end. Grsz11 →Review! 20:36, 10 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Scoring summaries[edit]

I developed the weekly scoring summaries and the statistics leaders to try to find something new for the article, but I didn't anticipate that it would increase the length as much as they have. I estimate each week's summary at around 1,500 bytes and if they are put on every week the article length will near around 150,000 bytes which is a little too big per the guidelines of article size. I think that by eliminating the scoring recap and leaders each week we could save a significant amount of space. I would like to leave some info, like time, referee, link to NFL.com recap, and attendance. In place of this, I would like to create a statistics section similar to that of NHL season articles; which would also be something new to NFL season articles. I hope to start the transition over the next few days, unless somebody has another idea. I have tried to trim the weekly prose recaps to 250–300 words, which I think is a good length, I think the emphisis should be on the prose rather than the scoring. Pending a playoff run, I would love to bring the summaries back for those games. Thanks! Blackngold29 17:49, 26 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Harrison[edit]

I can't find where it's mentioned that Harrison is Defensive MVP, but he's the first undrafted player to do so per [1]. Grsz11 19:51, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Good info. It's right under the "Regular season" heading. Added. Thanks. blackngold29 21:19, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The article announcing James Harrison as Defensive Player of the Year was at NFL.com, here it is: http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d80de6f94&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true

I added the reference to the article behind the quote about Harrison. Terry Chapman (talk) 06:49, 7 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

writing style, GA, etc[edit]

Okay: I saw this article at GAN, and as a long-time Steelers fan myself, thought I might consider reviewing it, but when I read through it I saw that the writing is pretty spotty, flat in some places and awkward in others, not really GA-level in my opinion -- so I thought I would be able to contribute more by helping out with a writing tune-up. I started by reworking the lede yesterday, but today I am discouraged to see that the edit has been reverted with an edit summary of "Changes were too specific and POV". I sort of understand where the "POV" part is coming from, but I don't really understand what "too specific" means, and more importantly, I am wondering whether it makes sense to stick around. Regards, Looie496 (talk) 22:22, 16 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I reverted those edits because basically the lead should be general as it has to cover the whole article and shouldn't be too long. I have found sports to be a unique topic to write about on WP because of the NPOV policies, whereas the sports section in any newspaper (most of which also try to be NPOV) is full of POVs that most people probably don't even recognize at first glance. Keep in mind that as WP writers we don't have any obligation to make the articles fun or exciting to read—it's about the info not entertainment. There are only two other season article GAs, and neither is from a recent year, so there is little to base this on. I can see where you are coming from, but I have been working on this article for over a year and feel that it is up to GA quality at this point. blackngold29 03:20, 18 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I like many of the edits made by Looie496. It seems a bit heavy-handed to simply revert them completely. -- Deejayk (talk) 21:18, 18 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Things that are cited in the article's body do not also need cited in the lead, that one should probably be reverted back. The wording (try to improve vs. coming off...) is fine with me. blackngold29 22:49, 18 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I wouldn't pass this article as GA for one reason: too long. I suggest trying to snip away at some of the details in the week-by-week parts. --Midnightdreary (talk) 17:51, 5 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Considering prose this article is not that long, and prose is all that counts for WP:LENGTH. When you add up multiple schedules, draft selection list, and over two hundred citations with templates it adds a lot of empty size. I could have easily made this article four times as long; I was concious of length from the beginning (see the "Article length" section above for more). blackngold29 20:50, 5 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
This is the sort of thing where we should look for precedents. A couple pre-existing GA status football season articles: 1986 New York Giants season and 1990 New York Giants season - they both still easily fall below the 50k recommended limit. Even with the tables, references, etc., this article is huge. I'm not trying to be critical or argumentative, but that's my two cents. --Midnightdreary (talk) 04:29, 6 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The tables in those articles are much simpler because they don't include TV info, etc. Also the articles do not include the week-by-week info and links because they don't exist for those seasons. There are about one quarter number of the citations in this article (remember how template "size" adds up when you have 200). Those two articles were approved nearly two years ago and criteria changes, entire sections are lacking citations that should be there. I understand that we should follow precedents, but not at the expense of quality, and I feel the quality of this article is higher than those. blackngold29 21:43, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

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