Talk:2022 Philippine presidential election/Archive 1

Archive 1

In danger of deletion

Based on the recent precedent at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/2022 in the Philippines, and that apparently consensus has in fact changed, this article could be deleted. I can't begin to state how categorically I disagree with this change in consensus, but it is what it is. Bearian (talk) 01:19, 7 February 2020 (UTC)

Per WP:CRYSTAL, this will definitely not gonna be deleted since this is a very notable and important upcoming election in the country, it is also almost certain to take place. PyroFloe (talk) 00:26, 4 January 2021 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

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A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion

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• Dr. Willie Ong, COMELEC main office.jpg

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Inclusion of PLM candidates in the infobox

There had been reversions on this recently. Personally, if we'd be including candidates, it'll either be 2, 3, 4 or 6, and nothing more. We'd only list five if there are exactly five candidates running. In 2016, Santiago won less than 5% of the vote and is still in the infobox. The guidelines for inclusion in the infobox isn't particularly followed in Philippine elections: it states that if a party/coalition won no seats, you won't include them, but we include Otso Diretso in 2019 (that seems to assume seats are based on proportional representation, but the Philippines doesn't do that).

Now, since the template clearly has options to include a sixth candidate, an empty cell is ugly, infobox cells are cheap, and we don't usually "the rules," I'd be okay on including the sixth most popular candidate, whoever that may be, how small its polling numbers are, unless you guys want to include just four. Howard the Duck (talk) 18:22, 26 January 2022 (UTC)

Kinda iffy on including them, considering that a) they don't meet the 5% threshold and b) they're not really notable compared to the other candidates. Otso Diretso at least met both of those criteria (although as you have stated, we don't do PR-based seats). I think we can reduce the candidates to four and remove Lacson instead. Itsquietuptown ✉️📜 06:31, 28 January 2022 (UTC)

Again, we include Santiago and 3%+ of her voters in the 2016 infobox. An infobox is meant to be a summary, and Lacson has been sufficiently covered by WP:RS to merit inclusion. Ka Leody is not as covered as the first five, but very much more so than the remaining ones. The infobox can show six, it's petty if we're showing 5 when we can make room for 6. Howard the Duck (talk) 12:06, 28 January 2022 (UTC)

FWIW, we also have an article for Ka Leody's campaign, something that's absent to the other four. Howard the Duck (talk) 12:59, 28 January 2022 (UTC)

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Debates, forums and interviews

The wikipedia page dedicated for the 2016 Philippine Presidential Election have a short summary about the 2016 debates. Should we add a short summary about the 2022 presidential debates, forums and interviews as well? Arslan - Euphemia (talk) 02:53, 2 May 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 10 May 2022

Can you change the color of Ferdinand Marcos to Red and Sara Duterte into Green to have accurate representation of votes in maps. 112.198.127.211 (talk) 20:29, 10 May 2022 (UTC)

The colors we use are the colors that are assigned to the Partido Federal ng Pilipinas (dark green) and Lakas-CMD (sky blue). We only use different colors if one ran as an independent. Howard the Duck (talk) 02:27, 11 May 2022 (UTC)

Concessions

Should we add a brief summary of the concession speeches of the candidates in the Aftermath section? Arslan - Euphemia (talk) 05:11, 14 May 2022 (UTC)

Use of real name or nickname

I have tried to replace the epithet "Bongbong" by Mr Marcos's real name - Ferdinand Romualdez Marcos Jr. - but this has been prevented by another writer. My opinion is that Wikipedia's requirement of factual information requires us to use any person's real name, not a nickname - even if they use it themselves in their campaigning. This does not mean that we cannot mention the use of a nickname somewhere within the article, but the main references should be to the real name, unless or until Marcos formally changes his legal name to "Bongbong" and gives up the legal right to "Ferdinand Romualdez". This applies both to the present article and to the biographical one on Marcos himself. I invite other contributors' opinions, and if necessary a formal decision on this point. Rif Winfield (talk) 06:27, 14 May 2022 (UTC)

@Rif Winfield: I don't see any reason why we should veer from WP:COMMONNAME and use his complete name over the nickname. The nickname is way more recognizable in the Philippines, is what's used by secondary sources to refer to him, and acts as a disambiguator between him and his father (who bears the same name and is also widely known). It's the same way we don't use "Joseph Biden" instead of Joe Biden or "William Clinton" instead of Bill Clinton. Chlod (say hi!) 06:33, 14 May 2022 (UTC)

In the case of Joe Biden or Bill Clinton, the use of abbreviated first names is a common practice, whereas "Bongbong" is not a recognised foreshortening of the name "Ferdinand"; and you will note that in the articles on these two Presidents the very first words of the opening paragraphs give their full name, highlighted accordingly; thereafter throughout their articles the surname is generally used rather than their first name (except where necessary to distinguish them from other family members sharing the same surname). We don't call them simply "Joe" or "Bill" alone throughout their articles. I would suggest that we should follow the same practice with President-elect Marcos. Rif Winfield (talk) 06:55, 14 May 2022 (UTC)

Your proposal would require an RM. Bongbong Marcos is at that title because of the consensus of a previous RM. ― Tartan357 ^Talk 06:58, 14 May 2022 (UTC)

Just as you've observed from the articles of Joe Biden and Bill Clinton, the article on Bongbong Marcos includes his name, in full and in bold. The rest of the article also calls him "Marcos" and not "Bongbong" (when possible, as many paragraphs refer to either him or his father), with only two instances of him being called by nickname than first name. On the topic of elections, on 2020 United States presidential election, we call Biden "Joe Biden", not "Joseph Biden", further cementing the use of the common name over official name. Chlod (say hi!) 07:15, 14 May 2022 (UTC)

Do an RM on Bongbong Marcos. The "Bongbong Marcos" name, although in use ever since was a child (also refer to Imee), was a successful rebrand from "Ferdinand Marcos Jr." This doesn't mean the name "Bongbong Marcos" ever faded from public memory, as contemporary newspaper articles in 1995 also referred to him as such when he ran for a Senate seat and lost.

"Bong" and its derivatives are popular names in the Philippines. Two current senators are named "Bong", Revilla and Go, and in the case of the latter, very few know his birth name. Howard the Duck (talk) 09:39, 14 May 2022 (UTC)

Referring to Sara Duterte as "Sara"

Recently, Itsquietuptown changed instances of "mayor Duterte" to "Sara". We don't do this to other people -- although Sara's father is the sitting president and must be distinguished from her -- I see this "we're only doing this to women." We don't call Marcos "Bongbong" even if the article mentions Imee Marcos. For encyclopedic writing, we use surnames to refer people after the first reference to them. I propose on having "mayor Duterte" back. Howard the Duck (talk) 21:24, 15 January 2022 (UTC)

For reference, Sara's article uses "Duterte-Carpio" instead or, if it's not too confusing, we use just "Duterte" to refer to Sara and "President Duterte" for her father instead. It's fine if "mayor Duterte" is used (although it's too tedious to always write it when referring to her, imo). Itsquietuptown ✉️📜 09:12, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

Our article for her is at "Sara Duterte". It'll cause more confusion if we refer to her as "Duterte-Carpio", unless that article is renamed to "Sara Duterte-Carpio". "Mayor Duterte" is appropriate for her; we refer to her father as "president Duterte" and that's 4 character longer, and her opponent is "Pangilinan" (we're never calling him as "Kiko") is three characters shorter. Howard the Duck (talk) 16:01, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

Sadly, Howard, you are incorrect in saying that we don't call Marcos "Bongbong", since this nickname has been used instead of his legal name throughout this article (and in the relevant biographical article on Marcos). I think you will share my view that this is wrong, as I have said below. As regards Sara Duterte, referring to her as "Sara" when we refer to male persons by their surname is a widespread sexist practice which conflicts with Wikipedia's operating procedures and mores.Rif Winfield (talk) 06:40, 14 May 2022 (UTC)

We call Marcos "Bongbong", but for this article, we don't call him solely that in prose (i.e. "Marcos won the election", instead of "Bongbong won the election") unless we have to distinguish him with any of the Marcoses. That statement was on using "Sara" throughout the article to refer to Sara Duterte (i.e. "Duterte founded the Hugpong ng Pagbabago", instead of "Sara founded the Hugpong ng Pagbabago"), and not just "Duterte", again except on instances we'd have to distinguish her from any of the Dutertes.

Now, if we have to list these people in tables, or we'd have to refer them on their full names (such as first usage in a section), we'd use the article name, unless there's a parathentical disambiguation; on that case, we'd omit that.

In everyday discussion, these people are first name basis for most Filipinos. Howard the Duck (talk) 21:07, 14 May 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 29 April 2022

Change from "Therefore, this election will determine the 17th president and the 16th vice president." to "Therefore, this election will determine the 17th president and 15th vice president.". Robredo is the 14th vp of ph 120.29.76.251 (talk) 13:55, 29 April 2022 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 14:04, 29 April 2022 (UTC)

Are you guys crazy? Robredo is the 14th VP of Philippines until June 30 of this year. Then the result will be decline, please check her article stating that she is 14th. 120.29.76.251 (talk) 05:25, 30 April 2022 (UTC)

Apparently this has been done. There's some dispute on who the vice presidents were, but for the current numbering, the next will indeed be the 15th. Howard the Duck (talk) 18:15, 5 May 2022 (UTC)

edit okay 👌 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 120.29.78.77 (talk) 08:22, 8 May 2022 (UTC)

 Already done jcgoble3 (talk) 00:54, 19 May 2022 (UTC)