Talk:28 Liberty Street

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Untitled[edit]

This article says:

One Chase Manhattan Plaza is currently occupied by the successor to the "Rockefeller Bank", JPMorgan Chase & Co.

but the article for JPMorgan Chase & Co says:

Although Chase Manhattan Bank's headquarters were once located at the One Chase Manhattan Plaza building in downtown Manhattan, the current world headquarters for JPMorgan Chase & Co. are located at 270 Park Avenue.

Rsquid 23:06, 2 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified[edit]

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Main photo[edit]

Hi i'm not good at editing wikipedia so don't know how to do this but i think the main photo in the article is the wrong building. 28 Liberty is white with columns. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Codebook44 (talk • contribs) 17:30, 28 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hello Codebook44. This picture is indeed of One Chase Manhattan Plaza, though it was taken in 2006, so some of the exterior appearance may have changed since then. Here is a recent Google Street View from this viewpoint at Nassau and Cedar Streets, looking east. epicgenius (talk) 20:26, 2 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review[edit]

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Reviewing
This review is transcluded from Talk:28 Liberty Street/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: CaroleHenson (talk · contribs) 01:12, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]


Hello epicgenius, I am looking forward to reviewing this article. Thanks for your efforts to create good articles about NYC architecture!–CaroleHenson (talk) 01:12, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Introduction[edit]

  • I see that the infobox says that there are six below grade floors and the intro says that there is a ground level concourse and five basement levels. I see from looking at google maps that there is a person would need to descend a flight of stairs to get down to the plaza (across what was Cedar Street). Is there a way to summarize that?
Struck out verbiage that is confusing.–CaroleHenson (talk) 18:19, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Ahhh. It's coming together more with The concourse, directly below the lobby, was accessed from Liberty Street.[19][29] from the Interior spaces section.
So, it seems, there are 60 floors, the first floor is the lobby. Below that is a concourse, which is partially underground due to the slope of the land and has an entrance at Liberty Street. There are five floors below the concourse. Is that right?–CaroleHenson (talk) 02:37, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, that is correct. epicgenius (talk) 15:39, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
How about if the note at the infobox - and perhaps added to the intro - says something like:
There are 60 above-ground floors, the first floor is the lobby, which is entered from the south side of the building. Below that is a concourse, which is partially underground due to the slope of the land and has an entrance on the north side of the building at Liberty Street. There are five floors below the concourse. The plaza, on the south side of the building, is located at the lobby level between Pine Street and the skyscraper, and has six basement levels.–CaroleHenson (talk) 18:44, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I just saw your edit to the Site section which clarifies this. Looks good!–CaroleHenson (talk) 18:50, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Also, are there five or six basement floors? Or, perhaps six below the skyscraper and five below the plaza?
    • Five below Liberty Street, but six below the plaza, since the plaza is one floor above Liberty Street.
  • In what way did "its opening signified the start of an era of new office construction in the Financial District."?
    • Removed.
  • The intro summarizes the Site and Planning and construction sections. It would be great to round out the intro with information between completion of the construction and then becoming a landmark. Are there other notable comments? Notable tenants?–CaroleHenson (talk) 02:01, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

This section is  Done.–CaroleHenson (talk) 18:54, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Site[edit]

  • Referring to the first bullet of the Introduction, is there a way to describe that there is a flight of stairs from the ground level of skyscraper that leads to the plaza in this sentence The site slopes down to the north, so that the plaza is at the elevation of Pine Street, while Liberty Street is one story beneath the plaza.[4]?
    •  Done
  • And, if warranted, describe the five or six basements?
    • I think this is covered below. Five basements, plus a ground level below the plaza. epicgenius (talk) 18:45, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Otherwise, looks good!–CaroleHenson (talk) 02:03, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Design[edit]

  • Please change "is" to "was" in "28 Liberty Street is designed".
    •  Done
  • What does Bunshaft, who was tasked with the building's general design, passed the duty to Roy O. Allen and Jacques E. Guiton.[6][9] mean? Did the three other general partners no longer play a part in the design? Why did he pass the duty to Allen and Guiton? When?
    • Bunshaft was involved in several other projects at the time and subcontracted most of the planning to Allen and Guiton. The sources don't mention when. epicgenius (talk) 18:45, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Could you rephrase on the of the first sentences in the first and second paragraphs so that it doesn't start with "28 Liberty Street"?
    •  Done
  • Same issue as before for 28 Liberty Street comprises a 60-story tower atop a base composed of five basement stories and the ground floor on Liberty Street.[5] vs. six basement floors.
    •  Done Mentioned above.
  • In the Interior spaces section, floor is mentioned three times All above-ground floors measure 280 by 106 feet (85 by 32 m), giving each floor nearly 30,000 square feet (2,800 m2) of floor area.[14][18][c] perhaps "giving each floor" could be reworded to "with" so that it reads:
All above-ground floors measure 280 by 106 feet (85 by 32 m), with nearly 30,000 square feet (2,800 m2) of floor area.[14][18][c]–CaroleHenson (talk) 02:34, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
 Done

History[edit]

  • I made a few minor edits here. Feel free to change as you wish.
  • 21st century section: Regarding The same month, the public plaza around One Chase Manhattan Plaza was renamed for David Rockefeller.[35] - I am confused about "the public plaza around One Chase Manhattan Plaza" - perhaps around the skyscraper? And, what was it named?–CaroleHenson (talk) 19:27, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • The plaza was actually just Chase Manhattan Plaza, before it became known as the David Rockefeller Plaza. I reworded this. epicgenius (talk) 19:38, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
      • Great! And, I see that it was called the David Rockefeller Plaza in the Plaza section.–CaroleHenson (talk) 20:00, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Tenants[edit]

  • I added  before the citations. Without punctuation, it made it a bit crowded. Feel free to revert if you disagree.–CaroleHenson (talk) 19:33, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Critical reception[edit]

GA criteria[edit]

GA review
(see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)
  1. It is reasonably well written.
    a (prose, spelling, and grammar):
    b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):
  2. It is factually accurate and verifiable.
    a (references):
    b (citations to reliable sources):
    c (OR):
    d (copyvio and plagiarism):
  3. It is broad in its coverage.
    a (major aspects):
    b (focused):
  4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.
    Fair representation without bias:
  5. It is stable.
    No edit wars, etc.:
  6. It is illustrated by images, where possible and appropriate.
    a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales):
    b (appropriate use with suitable captions):

Overall:
Pass/Fail:

· · ·


Comments[edit]

  • Another great job! The article is well-written, conforms to MOS guidelines, is neutral, stable, covers the content appropriately, has appropriate and relevant images. There is no evidence of original research and there are no copyvio issues.–CaroleHenson (talk) 19:52, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
epicgenius, if you have seen my minor edits to the History and Tenants sections and are ok with them and/or have tweaked them, then I am ready to pass the article.–CaroleHenson (talk) 20:02, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
CaroleHenson, thanks for the review. I have seen the edits and think they are fine. epicgenius (talk) 20:20, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Ok, great!–CaroleHenson (talk) 20:51, 17 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Did you know nomination[edit]

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Yoninah (talk) 16:52, 17 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(
)

Improved to Good Article status by Epicgenius (talk). Self-nominated at 03:13, 18 May 2020 (UTC).[reply]


General: Article is new enough and long enough
Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems
Hook: Hook has been verified by provided inline citation
QPQ: Done.

Overall: Good to go. ~~ CAPTAIN MEDUSAtalk 09:48, 22 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • ALT3:... that 28 Liberty Street's sunken rock garden had a pool of goldfish, which was removed after the fish died of copper poisoning when people threw pennies into the pool?
  • ALT4:... that adjoining 28 Liberty Street is a public sculpture that was once New York City's largest?
  • ALT5:... that 28 Liberty Street has a football-field-sized bank vault that couldcan store up to $35 billion in securities?
  • ALT6:... that 28 Liberty Street's construction took advantage of a zoning law that allowed buildings of unlimited height to rise on 25% of the plot?
  • ALT7:... that after 28 Liberty Street's private plaza was fenced off for construction during the Occupy Wall Street protests, people sued to reopen the plaza, claiming it violated freedom-of-speech laws?
  • @Epicgenius: Now you're talking. ALT5 seems the hookiest in terms of length, but why are you saying "had"? Isn't it still there? ALT3 and ALT7 are also good. All three are verified and cited inline. Yoninah (talk) 19:20, 9 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Thank you. Replacing tick for ALT3, 5, or 7, with preference for ALT5. Rest of review per CAPTAIN MEDUSA. Good to go. Yoninah (talk) 19:39, 9 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • ALT5 pulled from queue. Some concerns were raised at ERRORS about ALT7. Let's come up with another hook. Thanks, Yoninah (talk) 18:23, 16 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • ALT8:... that after 28 Liberty Street's private plaza was fenced off during the Occupy Wall Street protests, people sued to reopen the plaza, claiming it violated freedom-of-speech laws?
  • @Epicgenius: I find the wording in ALT3 a bit convoluted. How about this tweak of ALT8:
  • ALT8a: ... that after 28 Liberty Street's private plaza was fenced off during the Occupy Wall Street protests, people sued to reopen the plaza, claiming the barriers violated freedom-of-speech laws? Yoninah (talk) 16:38, 17 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Why weren't you allowed to divulge whether this building is office, hotel, or residential?[edit]

I've searched the article for "apartment", "condo", "co-op", "coop", and "hotel", and they occur only in references to what the building USED to be and to what it was thought the building MIGHT BECOME as of 2013. If you tell us what the building is being used for NOW, will you go to prison for divulging classified information?. Are you not even allowed to tell us WHY it's a State Secret?

Also, the part with the heading "Reception" is at the end, WELL out of chronological order, so that upon first reading I had no idea that this isn't about 28 Liberty since its repurposing but, rather, is about Chase Plaza back in the 1960s, when it first opened. It doesn't make it easier when you refer to this building not as "Chase Plaza" but as 28 Liberty even though you're writing about the ORIGINAL critical reception, not the critics' reception of the repurposed building NOW named 28 Liberty. You should move this "Reception" bit into chronological order, right after the "Construction" part, and change the "28 Liberty" to "One Chase Manhattan Plaza" (or whatever its name when it was built and when the critics were responding).2600:1700:6759:B000:85EE:8E2E:C493:FEDB (talk) 09:26, 26 October 2023 (UTC)Christopher Lawrence Simpson[reply]
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