Talk:Ciabatta

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I ate ciabatta while staying in Urbino in 1967 as a student of Italian. It was explained to me at the time that its name was derived from the fact that it resembled a slipper. Avvocato Michele Ambrosini can verify this!

IPA pronunciation[edit]

Doesn’t the second syllable begin with the ‘b’? —Ian Spackman 10:42, 2 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Additionally, can someone verify the "carpet slipper" statement? Is this really an Italian word? If so, we need Italian IPA. ALTON .ıl 05:55, 6 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I confirm it, but can’t do the IPA ;) —Ian Spackman 13:48, 6 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Several editors have tried to get the pronunciation into the article; others keep removing it. I've added what I hope can be accepted as a compromise. We do need a guide to pronunciation, as many people don't know either the correct or the common pronunciation. Elphion (talk) 02:58, 11 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The pronunciation ([tSa"bat:a]) is certainly correct in Italian, but I contend that no native English-speaker pronounces it this way, in the same way than no one would say ["pid:za] for "pizza" or ["spa"get:i] for "spaghetti". We need an Anglicised pronunciation. I think the point the article is making when it says "correct" is that the first three letters are one syllable (tSa), not two (%tSia). One possibility is [tS@"b{t@], as vowels in unstressed syllables tend to become [@] or [I]. The online Compact Oxford English Dictionary has [tS@bA:t@], but I'm not sure I've ever heard anyone, in the UK at least, use this pronunciation. — Paul G (talk) 16:10, 28 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I, on the other hand, would have to say I've never heard anyone in the United States say it any other way than [tS@bA:t@] or [tSa"bat:a] (IMHO in English it doesn't do well to be overly precise about vowels, since all dialects are pretty mushy about them). Pronouncing the i would be unheard of. Haikupoet (talk) 06:38, 11 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Well, not exactly unheard of. My pronunciation is roughly /tʃaˈbaːta/ (no ə), but I am practically a minority of one in my area (also in US), where everyone says /ˌsiəˈbatə/ or even /ˌsɪəˈbætə/. I'm not sure how to word this. If we say "correctly", I'm not happy with using ə; but I would like some way of steering people away from the four-syllable version. Trying to do this in a non-prescriptive way is very tricky :-) Elphion (talk) 07:07, 11 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Just as a data point, I've never heard anyone in the UK use more than three syllables, and a short "-batta" is the normal ending, "-baahta" would be considered rather pretentious in my circles, possibly a bit Loyd Grossman. But one thing I've learnt is that North American pronunciations of Italian words can differ wildly from British pronunciations, let alone Italian pronunciations, so it might need two pronunciations in the article? FlagSteward (talk) 11:40, 9 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

There are a lot of words in Italian starting with 'cia' or 'cio', and I have never heard anyone here (Italy) pronounce it without the 'i'. I mean it's /tʃiaˈbatta/, the pronunciation listed on the article is wrong, since it states 'Italian pronunciation'. Maybe it's pronounced /tʃaˈbatta/ in English-speaking countries, but definitely not in Italy. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.197.250.91 (talk) 17:51, 27 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

this needs completely revised[edit]

grammar is poor, no citations and irrelevant information on which american food outlets use ciabatta loves.

Yeah, the detailed listing of products from various fast-food chains seems completely out of place; I feel like I'm reading an advertisement! (Is there some kind of policy about such things? Maybe it's useful to know that this bread is sometimes used in such places, but I don't think the actual details are relevant or appropriate) Snogglethorpe (talk) 03:09, 16 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Talking of poor grammar, it's "this needs to be completely revised", or "this needs complete revising". I assume you meant loaves not loves, and that you consider capitalisation optional. It's a classic faux pas to use poor grammar when bitching about other people's grammar ;)

Gymnophoria (talk) 13:45, 2 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

You might have a very big problem here. According to the english version there is no olive oil in the recipe. im german an the german wiki states olive oil as one of the ingredients but much more importantly, so does the italian site http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ciabatta_%28pane%29. ... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.91.226.63 (talk) 12:10, 2 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Recipe ?[edit]

It would be nice if when someone comes to Wikipedia from a search for a bakery item, a range of typical Baker's Percentages values were given for a basic recipe as part of the general information imparted.64.149.106.245 (talk) 03:19, 30 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Re-Invented in the 1980's?[edit]

Secret Life of Ciabatta This linked article suggests that Ciabatta was a creation of the 1980's to counter the increased use of babuettes in Rome. Although there may be traditional Ciabatta recipes in Italy the ciabatta in your local sandwich bar was designed for the modern market. Should this be mentioned? --Alchemist Jack (talk) 21:32, 27 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

there seems to be disagreement about that eg see [1] but I think we need to write something about it. It seems unclear if there were similar breads before, or whether the name was new and there was a specifc (wetter?) recipe. Did try drafting something but it really needs a fair amount of rewrite as the current (unsourced) article just states some 'facts' that may have to go. Justinc (talk) 09:49, 28 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Because of the present "Gluten Craze" it would be very interesting to discuss if the 24 hour fermentation digests the gluten, my understanding is that sourdough does have this ability to digest gluten , making sourdough the most digestible bread there is. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.199.125.229 (talk) 19:21, 8 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

history[edit]

why does the "history" always have to start with some entrepreneurial individual on Wikipedia? There were very powerful capitalist monopoly, investor, food industrial tycoons interests going on here. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:7:8500:982:E8FB:C63A:79BC:9183 (talk) 23:16, 26 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Place of origin[edit]

Isle of Man ? Is there any reliable source of this assertion? I think Italian bread is found in Italy, isn't it? 92.194.19.215 (talk) 21:17, 19 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Italian pronunciation: [tʃiaˈbatta] ?!?[edit]

This current claim does not match my experiences. The Italian Wiktionary is also of a different opinion: Pronuncia IPA: /ʧa'batta/. (https://it.wiktionary.org/wiki/ciabatta)

A similar topic is discussed above, but is irrelevant since it refers to the anglicized pronunciation. 80.226.24.9 (talk) 18:31, 27 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, the pronunciation in the article is clearly supposed to be the Italian (as opposed to English) pronunciation. And the Italian pronunciation is [tʃa-], not [tʃia-]. An i following a c and preceding a vowel is always silent in Italian; it only signifies that the preceding c is to be pronunced [tʃ] rather than [k]. 87.13.197.199 (talk) 10:09, 30 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified[edit]

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Date[edit]

Was this created 1976 or 1982? The article gives both dates.Royalcourtier (talk) 06:44, 7 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I ate ciabatta in 1967![edit]

I was attending a summer course at the University of Urbino and ate ciabatta in the house where I was lodging. It was explained to me at the time that it was so called because of its resemblance to a slipper - just like the one my landlady was wearing. (Avvocato Michele Ambrosini may have been there!) 146.90.68.63 (talk) 07:29, 1 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]