Talk:Colin Mochrie

POV

Chill out, gang. The guy is wicked funny. How about "one of the best improv artists in the world"? Or, how about "with Ryan Stiles, one of the best improv artists, best known for their work on the long-running television show, Who's Line Is It, Anyway"?

Widely believed to be the best improv artist in the world? That's funny because I've never heard of the guy. And nine hugely successful years by who's standards? Foofy 17:53, 13 November 2005 (UTC)

out it goes! Gzuckier 20:57, 16 November 2005 (UTC)

"Already one of the most highly visible actors in North American television". No, don't think so. Perhaps the author of this article should consider removing this statemtent?

Yeah.. This article probably needs to be de-POV'd. While he a certainly has a fan following, I have never once heard him referred to as the best improv artist in the world. He is a good improv artist, but is little known outside of Whose Line is it Anyway, at least in the US. I added a bit, but there's no POV there really.--Vercalos 06:12, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

Well he does do those kids' snack commercials and I could swear I've seen him doing some other commercials as well. But yeah, this entry does seem to have a bit of a breathless, defensive, ColinMochrieIsMuchBetterThanRyanStiles.com webmaster quality to it. --Wikitoddia 17:56, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

6'2" < 6'6". Yeah we all agree on that so whay have a sentence about it?

I changed the wording about his co-hosting (with Rosie O'Donnell (what a coup)) an introduction to the bakery @ Disney's California adventure. --Wikitoddia 17:34, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Animutation

"The reason he is in (almost) every Animutation is because Neil Cicierega one way or another placed Colin in almost every Animutation he made, making the inclusion of him in Animutation somewhat of a running gag." Putting aside the word choice (the reason is because--should be the reason is that), this sentence doesn't make sense. He's in every Animutation because he was placed in every Animutation. I don't know enough to fix this--I came to this article to learn about Mochrie, knowing nothing about him--but someone who does should fix it so that it isn't just a tautology.71.77.12.236 03:12, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

"It's pretty cool, but you've got to admit, it's pretty weird." This quote is nowhere to be found on the Ask Colin site. As far as i can remember, it's from the Colin vs Jesus H Christ trilogy - part 3 (Andrew Kepple). I don't know if Colin actually ever said that. I'm going to replace it with a quote that IS on colinmochrie.com. --130.89.168.222 08:53, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

Ryan Stiles "Best Friend"

this page doesnt cover anything about how ryan got him REALLY into improv, and also got him on the show. they were even in toronto together if i remember correctly. one of the best friendships i know, and it's not mentioned? shame shame.

• There is a revert war going on. Mochrie's relationship with Stiles is documented, so it can and should be mentioned- "close friends". On the other hand it would be un-encyclopedia-ish and very Myspace-ish to put that they are "best" friends. As we know from kindergarden, best friends come and go (just try following who Paris Hilton's best friend is. Clerks 13:41, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

Left Handed

Is there any real reason the article suddenly ends with "Colin is left handed." ? It seems pretty out of place.

Canada Apologizes?

I came here hoping to find information verifying that Colin Mochrie did in fact perform the monologue "Canada Apologizes" often attributed to Rick Mercer, or was it really Rick Mercer?

I think you are right

Based on circumstantial information.

• My Google searches reveal that any blog comments made after seeing the video, which appears to have been removed from YouTube and from the CBC website- give credit to Colin.
• While only typed out versions of the apology give credit to Rick.
• Wikipedia credits Colin 2002-03

Unfortunately I can't find the original video to confirm 100%.Clerks 18:04, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

Found the video MRoberts <> 21:23, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

Thanks again. From the video and although blurry it does look very much like Colin Mochrie. It certainly doesn't look like Rick Mercer. -- Horkana 22:12, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

It's obviously Colin Mochrie - I know this sketch (it's on youtube) I'm puzzled that this is even a query. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.183.57.148 (talk) 03:41, 27 February 2012 (UTC)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1ZSHulmerE (labelled Colin Mochrie apology) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.183.57.148 (talk) 03:52, 27 February 2012 (UTC)

Luke, I'm your father

• I'm not sure of Mochrie's son birth year (Luke). The first time I came to this article it was given as 1992. Recently [User:Beadyeyes16] changed it to 1990, without a reference. This article says 1991, so I'm changing it to match. If anyone has a better reference, please add it. Clerks 19:24, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

Chicago project

Low importance, if any at all. Mochrie has little to do with Chicago's history. Clerks. 12:40, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Image

Are there no Free images of him? I see the last one was deleted.. any sources where we can find one.. this article really looks incomplete without an image. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.162.137.130 (talk) 04:20, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

About his wife

"…in the Second City 40th Anniversary Retrospective, that at one point, Stiles made Colin's wife (Deb McGrath) laugh so much, that she peed her pants." --his wife has somewhat 3 senteces in the article and this is one of them. Is this information (or gossip) that "substantial" to be there? --81.201.48.25 (talk) 13:06, 30 July 2008 (UTC)

About Colin's appearance in Whose Line

It seems he first appeared in the 3rd series (I guess it could be december 1990 or january 1991) in episode 3x05 (correct me if I'm wrong). As written on his pages, he almost didn't do such an impression to be given a second chance, but he was, eventually. (I just wanted to say that if someone wants to use it in the article.) --81.201.48.25 (talk) 14:12, 30 July 2008 (UTC)

Colin mochries DEATH?

any citations on this? I can find no mention of his death anywhere but here.... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.203.37.41 (talk) 02:48, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

I think the fact that someone just overwrote the Kelsey Grammar page with this info proves it is something dodgy to the likes of vandalism Jwoodger (talk) 06:15, 1 August 2009 (UTC)

There is also the fact that he is currently on tv on the new Whose line is it anyway... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.170.228.91 (talk) 21:57, 9 September 2013 (UTC)

Nationality

Looking at the 'Scottish Canadian' article, it claims that this is an ethnic group; which poses the question of what is his nationailty. Is he British or Canadian? Or does he hold duel-cizternship?--EnigmaMcmxc (talk) 19:30, 17 September 2009 (UTC)

editsemiprotected to add an interview

I'd like to add an entry to the interview section on this page, however it's protected. So I need someone's help with an {{editsemiprotected}} . The most recent interview with Colin was released today. Can someone please add: TempoToronto - Colin Mochrie: Improv Master January 6th, 2009 Thanks, Tina Tempo Toronto (talk) 21:29, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Not done: I understand you found an interesting source. Although, I would ask you to clearly tell want you want to add and were. For what I understand, you only want the interview added... how? As a source to something? As en external link? Please tell exactly what you want so an other contributor can add it even though they have no knowledge of the article. Thanks. --Stroppolo^talk 23:59, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

I put it in as an external link. I'll read it over later and see if there's anything good to source. Wizardman _{Operation Big Bear} 01:03, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

Luke

In the personal life section, shouldn't there be a blurb about the fact that his son's on That Guy With The Glasses? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 137.216.160.232 (talk) 01:47, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

• Done. ~ Felcis (talk) 17:26, 28 June 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from Stelly1, 30 March 2011

He met fellow improv comedian Ryan Stiles during this time. He was visiting a mutual friend in New Zealand when Stiles was doing comedy at Punchlines. should be He met fellow improv comedian Ryan Stiles when Stiles was doing comedy at Punchlines. - Colin was not visiting a friend in New Zealand at this time, according to the interview from 2007 he talks about a guy from NZ he *just* visited for the first time.

Stelly1 (talk) 11:40, 30 March 2011 (UTC)

Not done: in the very first response from Mochrie in the interview he says, "I visited a friend." And later in the interview after being asked if that was where he met Stiles, he says, "Yes. Actually, through a mutual friend." — Bility (talk) 16:24, 30 March 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from 98.92.193.238, 28 May 2011

In the article of Colin's time on Whose Line is it Anyway it states that he was on the show until the final episode in 2006. But reading back onto the Whose Line is it Anyway page it states that the finale was in the year 2004, and I requested this change because it may cause confusion to others. Thank you.

98.92.193.238 (talk) 08:55, 28 May 2011 (UTC)

Not done: show was on ABC until 2004, then on ABC Family until the end. - Happysailor ^(Talk) 13:14, 30 May 2011 (UTC)

almost heroes

He is now appearing on the Showcase show, Almost Heroes http://www.showcase.ca/shows/showspage.aspx?Root_Title_Id=261164& http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1893438/ 38.99.136.166 (talk) 14:41, 23 June 2011 (UTC)

Edit request on 25 September 2013

Replace: Mochrie will be returning for the upcoming revival of Whose Line Is It Anyway? in Summer of 2013. with: Mochrie returned for the revived Whose Line Is It Anyway? in the Summer if 2013. Tron855 (talk) 03:58, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

 Done Thank you :) – Kerαunoςcopia^◁_galaxies 05:13, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

filmography and television list

He should have one..list of all the shows and films he's been in. Virtually every other big-ish actor/ess has them. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Thedeanjones01 (talk • contribs) 06:18, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

Feel free to make it so. Ckruschke (talk) 16:34, 14 November 2013 (UTC)Ckruschke

Semi-protected edit request on 20 December 2014

Maybe include a mention somewhere that he guest starred on the YouTube show Space Janitors on Season 3 Ep. 5 which airs on the Geek & Sundry YouTube channel. The channel is run by Felicia Day who has her own Wiki page. I haven't watch the episode myself but I did notice it on the channel while watching other shows. Here is the link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIQDIdgEdUg

27.4.8.39 (talk) 10:59, 20 December 2014 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. -Anupmehra -Let's talk! 11:28, 20 December 2014 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to one external link on Colin Mochrie. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/20090314174952/http://colinmochrie.com:80/askcolin2.cfm to http://colinmochrie.com/askcolin2.cfm

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 18 January 2022).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers. —^{cyberbot II}_{Talk to my owner:Online} 12:29, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 4 June 2016

Please change Colin's child's name from "Luke" to "Hannah", and "son" to "daughter" as she has openly transitioned to the gender identity of female and the name of Hannah. Luke is now a dead name. Source is her Facebook. SOURCE: https://www.facebook.com/luke.mochrie?fref=ts Asecooper88 (talk) 18:49, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. — JJMC89 (T·C) 21:51, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request Inconsistent Child Information

I noticed that the information pertaining to Colin's child is inconsistent between the "Personal Life" section near the bottom of the page which reads "Hannah", and the summary in the top right which reads "Luke". I haven't found a lot of information that nails down this information since most sites seem to just copy wikipedia. But the last edit to the article changed the "Personal Life" section and not the summary thus creating an inconsistency. Madetofall (talk) 05:59, 18 December 2016 (UTC)

 Done as neither of them are sourced, and in order to protect minors, I have removed both - Arjayay (talk) 13:58, 18 December 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 1 April 2017

Proposal: Change mentions of having a son based on new information that his child is a trans woman.

Change:

1. "had a son, Luke" to "had a child, Kinley" 2. "his son Luke co-starred" to "his daughter Kinley co-starred"

Sources: http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/line-star-colin-mochrie-defends-transgender-daughter-article-1.2947244 (present as footnote #24) http://jackontheweb.cbslocal.com/2017/01/18/whose-line-star-colin-mochrie-opens-up-about-transgender-daughter/ Skanderm (talk) 01:55, 1 April 2017 (UTC)

Done AntiCompositeNumber (Leave a message) 14:50, 29 May 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 3 August 2017

Spelling error in the intro paragraph. Should be "improvisation show" not "improvization show". Neither American nor British English spells this word with a Z. Source: http://grammarist.com/spelling/improvise-vs-improvize/ 2601:200:C002:16A0:88CE:A334:7360:B258 (talk) 02:50, 3 August 2017 (UTC)

Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit semi-protected}} template. jd22292 (Jalen D. Folf) (talk) 03:17, 3 August 2017 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Colin Mochrie. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110402044954/http://www.etonline.com/tv/109254_Charlie_Sheen_s_Impromptu_Improv_with_Drew_Carey/index.html to http://www.etonline.com/tv/109254_Charlie_Sheen_s_Impromptu_Improv_with_Drew_Carey/index.html

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 18 January 2022).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 04:08, 29 November 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 20 March 2018

Addition: Colin Mochrie appeared in the film "After the Ball" (2015), playing Frost, the arch-nemesis fashion designer. 47.17.38.216 (talk) 01:03, 20 March 2018 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 15:39, 20 March 2018 (UTC)

Edit request for grammar correction on 21 September 2018

In the third paragraph under the 1988-1998 section, the first sentence needs to be changed from "Mochrie's co-stars on the show would frequently mock him for being Canada" to "being Canadian." I agree he is a talented Canuck, but I don't think he's expanded himself to become the entire country... yet. 2606:A000:9FC0:4B:45FA:B588:3FAF:F0BE (talk) 08:36, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

Edit request (Personal life) October 30 2020

Can Colin's daughter's deadname (birth name) please be removed from the Personal Life section? It's unnecessary to include it since most people are not familiar with Kinley Mochrie pre-transition like they were with Caitlyn Jenner or Chaz Bono.

Stating that Kinley "was originally male" and "later transitioned" is also unnecessary and redundant. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 156.34.40.73 (talk) 18:41, 30 October 2020 (UTC)

Agreed! I came to the Talk page to say that! It's super disrespectful, not to mention irrelevant, to deadname her like that. --2600:1700:94C0:8460:D599:1265:BF7:7D0 (talk) 00:36, 15 December 2020 (UTC)

I just removed it. --WhyBeNormal? ^{c · t · m} 00:42, 15 December 2020 (UTC)

This is for anybody who wants to remove valid information. Colin's daughter's birth name is valid information. You don't remove valid information from an article because you feel it shouldn't be there. That's not how Wikipedia works. It can be and was sourced. I found one. Removing something like that is a controversial change. I didn't happen to see the initial edit request. Regardless. The information is to be left on the article. If you think feel strongly about this, you go to WP:RFC and request a comment. Mr. C.C.^{Hey yo!}_{I didn't do it!} 21:24, 15 December 2020 (UTC)

I think the (admittedly tentative and ongoing) consensus reached at MOS:DEADNAME unambiguously applies here. I think it applies here even more than it applies for, just for example, Laverne Cox, Natalie Wynn, or Sarah McBride among many other articles. Those women I mentioned are all more notable than Colin's daughter and none of those articles include their birth names (known as deadnames among trans people). I think the guidelines at WP:TRANSNAME would also be interpreted to leave out her deadname. But ok, you're right, I'll insert an RfC here. --User:WhyBeNormal 22:36, 15 December 2020 (UTC)

@WhyBeNormal: If you look at the Natalie Wynn article, it states that she transitioned in 2017. So she was notable long before transitioning. That's not a good example. Mr. C.C.^{Hey yo!}_{I didn't do it!} 02:50, 16 December 2020 (UTC)

@Fishhead2100: Ok, fair, she began really gaining popularity like a year before transitioning. Regardless, her deadname isn't mentioned. And that's my point: that it appears to already be the normal style convention on Wikipedia that the privacy of trans people should be respected with regard to deadnames unless circumstances are particularly notable. This is evidenced by looking around the articles in Category:Transgender_and_transsexual_women and Category:Transgender_and_transsexual_men. --WhyBeNormal (talk) 03:12, 16 December 2020 (UTC)

@WhyBeNormal: Wynn was doing videos for nine-years prior to her transitioning. Anything prior to her transition, she set all those videos to private. Most of the them are in transcripts on her website. The point still stands that she was notable prior to transitioning. Having read the section about all of this, you can include the birth name in the intro to the article since notability was already established. Mr. C.C.^{Hey yo!}_{I didn't do it!} 03:31, 16 December 2020 (UTC)

@Fishhead2100:Right, she was doing videos but she didn't actually gain popularity until starting her ContraPoints channel in 2016. A year prior to transitioning. Her old channel wasn't popular. You can feel free to try to make the case for pre-transition notability if you can find any contemporaneous reliable news articles about her from prior to her transition. Good luck. They don't exist because she wasn't well known. And, again, that's a bit beside the point here. My point is that the style convention on Wikipedia already strongly errs on the side of privacy for trans people. (Because, fyi, people use intentional deadnaming to harass people and it makes obvious sense to err on the side off privacy for marginalized minorities.) --WhyBeNormal (talk) 03:48, 16 December 2020 (UTC)

@Fishhead2100: I just realized something. My linking to WP:RS above might've seemed patronizing or something. My bad. You've been on here for quite long enough - I know you know about reliability. What I should've said is that you can obviously find mention of Natalie's previous content online but I don't think you could find a good contemporaneous source that could meet the guidelines at WP:NOTE. --WhyBeNormal (talk) 22:37, 16 December 2020 (UTC)

@WhyBeNormal: Have you even checked to see if such sources don't exist? Or are you assuming so you don't have to actually look? Regardless, I am not going to lose sleep if there is not. Mr. C.C.^{Hey yo!}_{I didn't do it!} 06:43, 17 December 2020 (UTC)

@Fishhead2100:Yes, I've checked. I just checked again for you right now. I do happen to know what her deadname is, so I just googled it. All that came up was hateful trash like Kiwi Farms - no news articles. And once again, this tangent about Natalie is quite beside the point here, innit? To wit: the specific section of MOS:DEADNAME that is relevant to the discussion here is a settled and accepted part of the Wikipedia Manual of Style. --WhyBeNormal (talk) 19:55, 17 December 2020 (UTC)

RfC on including his daughter's deadname

The following discussion is an archived record of a request for comment. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

Clear consensus not to include the deadname in this article. (non-admin closure) (t · c) buidhe 05:08, 5 January 2021 (UTC)

---

Should Colin Mochrie's daughter's deadname be included in this article? --User:WhyBeNormal 22:39, 15 December 2020 (UTC)

• Remove: MOS:DEADNAME, MOS:GENDERID, and WP:BLPNAME together make it absolutely clear that her deadname should not be included in the article and we shouldn't even mention the addition detail of "was originally male" and "later transitioned," but we might want to still leave in that she is trans.

BLPNAME: The names of any immediate, former, or significant family members or any significant relationship of the subject of a BLP may be part of an article, if reliably sourced, subject to editorial discretion that such information is relevant to a reader's complete understanding of the subject.

DEADNAME: If such a subject was not notable under their former name, it usually should not be included in that or any other article, even if some reliable sourcing exists for it. Treat the pre-notability name as a privacy interest separate from (and often greater than) the person's current name.

GENDERID: Use context to determine which name or names to provide on a case-by-case basis. Generally, do not go into detail over changes in name or gender presentation unless they are relevant to the passage in which the person is mentioned.

Gbear605 (talk) 01:12, 16 December 2020 (UTC)

• Remove per the policies cited by Gbear above. There is a strong presumption of privacy for non-notable family members of an article's subject, and no suggestion that it is met or overcome here.--Trystan (talk) 02:47, 16 December 2020 (UTC)

I also don't see the date of birth given in any of the sources. It should be removed per WP:BLPPRIVACY.--Trystan (talk) 03:02, 16 December 2020 (UTC)

Trystan, thanks for pointing it out, I just removed it and the birth location (which is less important to remove, but I don't see a strong argument for inclusion either). Gbear605 (talk) 04:07, 16 December 2020 (UTC)

• Remove: MOS:DEADNAME makes it clear a deadname should not be included in any article unless the subject was notable under it. Colin Mochrie's daughter isn't notable under any name, never mind her deadname. Per WP:ONUS (The onus to achieve consensus for inclusion is on those seeking to include disputed content.), I've removed the deadname from the article while this RFC is ongoing (it should only be added back if consensus is achieved to include it). I agree with Gbear605 that the wording of the rest of the passage should also be improved. GreenComputer (talk) 03:05, 16 December 2020 (UTC)
• Remove per MOS:DEADNAME, which would indicate the name should be included only if she were notable under that name, which she is not. Armadillopteryx 07:14, 16 December 2020 (UTC)
• Remove per MOS:DEADNAME. His daughter isn't notable in her own right at all, even under her current name, so there's no important public service being served by publishing her deadname in her father's BLP. Bearcat (talk) 18:19, 21 December 2020 (UTC)
• Remove per reasons provided by editors above. Idealigic (talk) 14:06, 30 December 2020 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Murdoch Mysteries

Colin has actually been in 5 episodes of Murdoch Mysteries not 3 77.111.23.21 (talk) 22:19, 26 January 2022 (UTC)

It's need to be updated. But it's four episodes not five. Mr. C.C.^{Hey yo!}_{I didn't do it!} 07:34, 27 January 2022 (UTC)

Addition to Colin Mochrie Page

• Change the line: "Mochrie co-stars as the improvisational comedian in Hyprov, a comedy show that is a fusion of stage hypnosis and improvisation" to "Mochrie co-created Hyprov, a comedy show that is a fusion of stage hypnosis and improvisation alongside hypnotist Asad Mecci and often co-stars as the improvisational comedian":
• The above change is the more accurate representation of Colin Mochrie's involvement in Hyprov and it should be reflected appropriately:
• https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/15/theater/hyprov-comedy.html https://hyprov.com/about:

2600:8801:3687:9600:B4EF:8AC5:3B00:622F (talk) 05:59, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

References

 Done Lewcm Talk to me! 10:22, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

Missing film credit

Can someone please add the upcoming film Magnetosphere in which he plays Gil? Nrdirects (talk) 22:34, 24 December 2023 (UTC)