Talk:Democratic Coalition (Hungary)

The Democratic Coalition ideological problems

So I would like to say that most of the ideology that I see about the party is real, but left-wing populism, and indeed populism itself, is not at all characteristic of the Democratic Coalition. I looked at the source that led you to believe that, and well, as you say, it didn't seem credible. But I looked at the party's president, Ferenc Gyurcsány, in his annual assessment on 5 February, and he said that populism is the Democratic Coalition's greatest enemy. I don't know why that article was credible, but I think that we should not define a party by the opinion of articles, but look at the party's own opinion. Because ok Fidesz is populist, but they don't deny this info. Nor do they deny that Mi Hazánk is, because that is what these parties really represent. And the ideology itself is absolutely not typical of the Democratic Coalition's politics. I have not heard them criticise American capitalism, I have only heard them criticise the Orbán regime. So that is what I would like to start a debate on. Thank you in advance for your response. HuefaDK (talk) 09:07, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Opposition. Cases of populists who deny themselves being populists are very common. Populist status is not defined by the party itself. That should be done entirely by external assessment. Mureungdowon (talk) 10:19, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Okay, I get that, but why are there no ideologies that characterise the party, such as feminism, green politics, the third way or perhaps social democracy? Because okay. Let's call it populist, but then why doesn't the party qualify as one of the four ideologies, which I think you can see from the outside. Because I have seen from the outside opinions that justify these ideologies and you should look at their actions. Because it is fine to need outside observation, but that does not answer why the Democratic Coalition is populist. What is the reason and what is the reason why it does not represent the others? And if this is how the Democratic Coalition is seen from the outside, then the Hungarian Socialist Party must now be classified as a neoliberal technocratic party because of the measures taken by the Horn government in 1994-1998. And then Fidesz would have to represent an authoritarian ideology, since the European Union itself has recognised that Hungary is an electoral autocracy. So why exactly is it that only the Democratic Coalition is seen in this way by the outside world? HuefaDK (talk) 10:36, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Left-wing

Do we really have to call them that way? The party was founded by Gyurcsány who was a notorious Third Wayer and we call MSZP just centre-left Braganza (talk) 08:31, 5 March 2023 (UTC)

Isn't DK more culturally progressive than MSZP? Of course, DK would be more moderate economically than MSZP, but so DK's ideology has been described as 'Social liberalism', not 'Social democracy', so there is no need to remove "left-wing" from its political position. Just as conservative-liberal parties are sometimes considered more right-wing than liberal-conservative parties, social-liberal parties can be considered more left-wing than social-democratic parties. Mureungdowon (talk) 08:49, 5 March 2023 (UTC)

i highly doubt that MSZP is socially conservative/more conservative than DK, MSZP has a far better relationship to Párbeszéd. DK is just Gyurcsány personal vehicle Braganza (talk) 09:00, 5 March 2023 (UTC)

I neither support nor oppose you changing the political position of infobox. You can edit the change political position you want in this article. Mureungdowon (talk) 09:13, 5 March 2023 (UTC)

I would leave just “centre-left” in the Infobox, and any other descriptions in the article body. DK is by all accounts a very moderate, centrist-leaning party. Most of the references for “left wing” are journalistic in nature and therefore by design not exactly watertight in terms of technical accuracy from an academic point of view…-- Autospark (talk) 09:45, 5 March 2023 (UTC)

All things considered, I would also have just "centre-left" in the infobox. --Checco (talk) 13:14, 5 March 2023 (UTC)

Academic sources describing the party as left-wing:

• Barna, Ildikó; Knap, Árpád (16 May 2022). "Analysis of the Thematic Structure and Discursive Framing in Articles about Trianon and the Holocaust in the Online Hungarian Press Using LDA Topic Modelling" (PDF). Nationalities Papers. 51 (3). Cambridge University Press: 618. doi:10.1017/nps.2021.67. ISSN 1465-3923. Retrieved 24 December 2023. László is the mayor of Budapest's District XI, from the left-wing Democratic Coalition (DK) party
• Csehi, Robert (31 August 2021). "Eurosceptic populism in Hungary after 2010". The Politics of Populism in Hungary. Routledge Studies in Anti-Politics and Democratic Crisis (1st ed.). London and New York: Routledge. p. 133. doi:10.4324/9781003035862. ISBN 978-1-003-03586-2. LCCN 2021013624. Retrieved 24 December 2023. p. 133: As far as the salience of European integration is concerned, Figure 6.7 shows that Fidesz (along with the left-wing DK) has increased the relevance of the topic considerably (there was only a slight shift in Jobbik's stance).
• H. Szilágyi, István; Kelemen, László; Gilchrist Hall, Sam (26 May 2021). "Survey findings". Changing Legal and Civic Culture in an Illiberal Democracy: A Social Psychological Survey of the Hungarian Legal System. Translated by Juhász, Tamás (1st ed.). London and New York: Routledge. p. 58. doi:10.4324/9781003188926. ISBN 978-1-003-18892-6. Retrieved 24 December 2023. p. 58: This coalition is followed by the far-right Jobbik (8%) and MSZP (5%) and then, even further behind, the left-wing DK and LMP.
• Kákai, László; Pálné Kovács, Ilona (11 December 2020). "Counties in a vacuum: The electoral consequences of a declining meso-tier in Hungary". Election Reports. Regional & Federal Studies. 31 (3). Routledge: 412. doi:10.1080/13597566.2020.1855148. ISSN 1743-9434. Retrieved 25 December 2023. The party winning the second highest number of mandates was the left-wing Democratic Coalition (headed by the pre-2010 Prime Minister), drawing up an individual list for 17 counties and winning 33 seats
• Koller, Boglárka (30 December 2016). "European and National Agendas in the 2014 EP Elections in Hungary". In Boicu, Ruxandra; Branea, Silvia; Ștefănel, Adriana (eds.). Political Communication and European Parliamentary Elections in Times of Crisis: Perspectives from Central and South-Eastern Europe. Political Campaigning and Communication (1st ed.). London: Palgrave Macmillan. p. 173. doi:10.1057/978-1-137-58591-2. eISSN 2662-5903. ISBN 978-1-137-58591-2. ISSN 2662-589X. LCCN 2016956670. Retrieved 25 December 2023. p. 173: The programme of the left-wing Democratic Coalition tried to reflect the government's national election campaign which was titled 'Hungary performs better', but the DK turned it into 'Europe performs better'.
• Koller, Boglárka (15 September 2022). "Re-nationalization or de-Europeanization? Collective identities and identity politics in contemporary Hungary". In Kukovič, Simona; Just, Petr (eds.). The Rise of Populism in Central and Eastern Europe. Cheltenham and Northampton, MA: Edward Elgar Publishing. p. 77. doi:10.4337/9781802205534. ISBN 978-1-80220-553-4. LCCN 2022941194. Retrieved 25 December 2023. p. 77: In the program of the left-wing Democratic Coalition everything was about 'Europe': the 'European' adjective is associated with almost every program element, such as European family allowance, European minimum wage, European health care, European pension, and so on.
• Krekó, Péter; Molnár, Csaba; Juhász, Attila; Kucharczyk, Jacek; Pazderski, Filip (31 July 2018), Rasmi, Farah; Szicherle, Patrik; Wessenauer, Veszna (eds.), Beyond Populism: Tribalism in Poland and Hungary (PDF), Political Capital, p. 24, retrieved 24 December 2023, The second highest level of Manichean thinking was among voters of the Democratic Coalition, a left-wing party led by former PM Ferenc Gyurcsány
• Levy, Katja; Révész, Ágota (7 December 2021). "No Common Ground: A Spatial-Relational Analysis of EU-China Relations" (PDF). Journal of Chinese Political Science. 27 (3). Springer: 486. doi:10.1007/s11366-021-09769-w. ISSN 1874-6357. PMC 8650739. PMID 34898975. Retrieved 24 December 2023. Anett Bősz, MP for the left-wing Democratic Coalition, addressed State Secretary Miklós Soltész
• Naxera, Vladimír; Glied, Viktor; Filipec, Ondřej; Kaczorowska, Małgorzata (October 2020). ""To protect national sovereignty from the EU?" The 2019 EP elections and populist parties in V4 countries". UNISCI Journal (54). UNISCI: 94. doi:10.31439/UNISCI-98. ISSN 2386-9453. Retrieved 25 December 2023. The left-wing Democratic Coalition (DK) earned 16.05% (4 seats), significantly improving their percentage of 5.37% the year before
• Patey, Mariusz (June 2022). "What Can We Expect from Hungary's Elections? Conflicts and Difficulties of Hungarian Politics" (PDF). Hungarian Politics. The Warsaw Institute Review (21): 43. ISSN 2543-9839. Retrieved 25 December 2023. Apart from the governing coalition, the election threshold was to be crossed by the united opposition alliance, comprising the left-wing Democratic Coalition

– Zsovar3 (talk) 04:15, 25 December 2023 (UTC)