Talk:From a Page

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Progressive Rock

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EP or Album?[edit]

While official promotions clearly push the box set (which contains both this release and the previously-released live album), it's clear that From A Page is its own work, (as it's also available outside of the box set in the vinyl version), and it's that release that's the primary topic of this article. While official promotional language doesn't name it as either an EP or an album, it's clearly one or the other simply by definition. In the US, RIAA standards put 30 minutes as the benchmark to be an album, whereas UK chart standards place the line at 25 min, so if the single edit counts, then it qualifies as an album in either case, and since it's a UK release anyway, it seems clear to me that "album" is the proper term here. Curious why other editors noted it as an "EP"? —Shada Ng (talk | contribs) 16:50, 6 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Here's the resource for the UK's Official Charts rules (what qualifies a release such as From A Page to show up on the UK "Album" charts.): https://www.officialcharts.com/media/656891/official-uk-album-chart-rules-july-2019.pdf —Shada Ng (talk | contribs) 19:31, 6 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

In my opinion we must stick to what the band's official website states: From a Page is a box set, the release was not advertised either as a studio album or as an EP. The vinyl edition with only the studio tracks is just an "alternative" and "reduced" version of the box set. We can't "fabricate" that FaP is a studio album or an EP. --L'Eremita (Il Romitorio) 20:34, 6 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The band's official site is a promotional tool, not an unbiased resource, and if they choose to highlight the box set for whatever commercial reason, that's their prerogative. That doesn't mean it's a verifiable fact that the release is a box set only. In fact, it's available outside of the box set as well, so it's not factually accurate to say that it *is* a box set; that would be illogical (a thing cannot contain itself). The box set on the cover actually has a longer title (From A Page Studio Tracks Plus In the Present Live From Lyon) that refers to the fact that From A Page is a component within it, and that's how the article currently refers to disc 1 in the track listing. —Shada Ng (talk | contribs) 21:51, 6 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Marketing for the release has tended to talk about a box set and a vinyl release, not just a box set.

But WP:SECONDARY say we should look to what secondary sources say over and above a primary source. Bondegezou (talk) 22:42, 6 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Anyway, it seems there are no sources saying From a Page is the new studio album by Yes, except for Progarchives (not reliable). Maybe "extended play" could be a more fitting definition for the studio track disc, even though LP and EP are different formats. --L'Eremita (Il Romitorio) 08:55, 7 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The most fitting definition is Mini-LP, that is a format similar to EP. --L'Eremita (Il Romitorio) 14:03, 7 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I'd say mini-album is a better descriptor, and linking to the same mini-LP article, as it shows it as synonymous, and this would avoid confusion over format (as LP sometimes is synonymous with album, but often is conflated with the vinyl format). There are several secondary sources that refer to it as an "album" if a source were necessary, such as: https://www.loudersound.com/news/yes-revisit-2010-recordings-for-new-album-from-a-page —Shada Ng (talk | contribs) 21:39, 7 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

So be it. However, Loudersound refers to FaP both as an "album" and as a "mini box set". --L'Eremita (Il Romitorio) 08:12, 8 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, because the (mini-) album is also sold as a component of a box set :P —Shada Ng (talk | contribs) 16:58, 8 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

As for secondary sources, here it is showing up on the official UK Rock "Album" Charts (debuting at #23): https://www.officialcharts.com/charts/rock-and-metal-albums-chart/20191101/112/ —Shada Ng (talk | contribs) 00:29, 9 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Previous consensus here landed at this being considered a "mini album" (which is defined as a kind of "album") but the Yes Discography page shows it as a "compilation album". The latter category seems odd to me, as it contains new studio material, and none that had been previously released. Per previous discussion, I believe that considering it among studio releases is appropriate, but we should be consistent at least. Thoughts? —Shada Ng (talk | contribs) 16:07, 2 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It's a studio EP + a live album packaged together. I can never decide whether it should be listed as an EP or listed as a live album. It is, indeed, not a compilation album. Bondegezou (talk) 16:47, 2 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Where we landed previously is that it's a mini-album, which is defined as:

"…a short vinyl record album or LP, usually retailing at a lower price than an album that would be considered full-length. It is distinct from an EP due to containing more tracks and a slightly longer running length."

So, it's neither an EP nor a compilation, and though some editions are packaged with the previously-released live album, others aren't – there were two editions of it, one was simply From A Page (available on both black and light blue vinyl, according to Discogs) while the other was From A Page packaged with In the Present (Live From Lyon). In either case, it's From A Page we're talking about here (regardless of what it's sometimes packaged together with), and it's a studio (mini) album. —Shada Ng (talk | contribs) 17:51, 2 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Here's the Discogs listing, and an image of the back of the LP sleeve, for reference. —Shada Ng (talk | contribs) 17:57, 2 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

OK, fine with "mini-album". Bondegezou (talk) 18:49, 2 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You guys have a problem here, because the TYPE field in the album infobox requires pre-coded terms and "mini-album" is not one of them. See Section 2.2 at Template:Infobox album. Using any other term in that field causes the article to be reported at Category:Album articles with non-standard infoboxes, indicating an article that needs to be fixed in some fashion. Simply deciding here to call it a "mini album" is not sufficient and the issue will have to be decided in a more technical fashion elsewhere, perhaps at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Albums. ---DOOMSDAYER520 (TALK|CONTRIBS) 13:19, 4 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I will support your actions to fix the issue with the infobox template. —Shada Ng (talk | contribs) 21:25, 5 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

See my recent change; it might be simpler to add the "longtype" field here rather than alter the template. Thoughts? —Shada Ng (talk | contribs) 22:32, 6 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]