Talk:Gilles (stock character)

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Gilles (stock character) article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Fictional characters

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Fictional characters, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of fictional characters on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Fictional charactersWikipedia:WikiProject Fictional charactersTemplate:WikiProject Fictional charactersfictional character articles

France Low‑importance

	France portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject France, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of France on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.FranceWikipedia:WikiProject FranceTemplate:WikiProject FranceFrance articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Theatre Low‑importance

	Theatre portal This article is part of WikiProject Theatre, a WikiProject dedicated to coverage of theatre on Wikipedia. To participate: Feel free to edit the article attached to this page, join up at the project page, or contribute to the project discussion.TheatreWikipedia:WikiProject TheatreTemplate:WikiProject TheatreTheatre articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Articles for creation

	This article was reviewed by member(s) of WikiProject Articles for creation. The project works to allow users to contribute quality articles and media files to the encyclopedia and track their progress as they are developed. To participate, please visit the project page for more information.Articles for creationWikipedia:WikiProject Articles for creationTemplate:WikiProject Articles for creationAfC articles
	This article was accepted on 21 February 2012 by reviewer Chiswick Chap (talk · contribs).

A fact from Gilles (stock character) appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 7 March 2012 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that the Gilles of Watteau's poignant portrait (pictured) was a lewd and credulous clown who starred in The Shit Merchant?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2012/March. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Gilles (stock character).

Wikipedia

Problems[edit]

As currently noted at Wikipedia talk:Did you know, this article, and the DYK hook, have serious problems. I will post an adapted version of what I wrote there.

This article contains didactic adjectives, with an editorial voice and WP:SYNTH present throughout the article. Consider:

As for the Watteau portrait, it should be clear by these observations that a "definitive" identification of its subject—as either Pierrot or Gilles—is not possible. As Francis Haskell has pointed out (and the remarks above imply), not only did Gilles "wear the same costume" as Pierrot, but both generally "had the same character" throughout the 18th century: Pierrot, like Gilles, "was a farcical creature, not a tragic or sensitive one".[35] (Pierrot will become tearful and tragic only in the middle of the 19th century, in the hands of Paul Legrand.)[36] The conclusion is irresistible: that "the consumptive Watteau has invested the figure of Gilles with some degree of self-identification, and Mrs. Panofsky has also pointed out that on many other occasions when painting Pierrot figures Watteau not only gave them a predominance which was absolutely not justified by the nature of the parts they were called upon to act, but may even have hinted at something Christ-like in their role."[35] The quibbling over the identity of the figure in Watteau's portrait (encountered everywhere in related sites on the internet)[37] is, in short, misguided [note: there is no citation for who finds it "misguided", and note 37 is entirely WP:OR: it states the wikipedia editor's own cursory search through a site that disagrees with their opinion, and disagreeing with the editorial voice is, of course, "quibbling"!].

The contributor did a decent job at writing an article, but not by wikipedia standards. This needs to be addressed in future edits, preferable sooner rather than later. Dahn (talk) 21:32, 6 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Problems addressed[edit]

I have negotiated with Dahn over the necessary changes (see my talk page under DYK nomination of Gilles (stock character)), have made the changes, and have removed his tags with his permission. Beebuk 14:09, 7 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Footnote 17[edit]

I would like to remove the error tag from this note, but I don't know what is wrong, exactly. (I've gone to the help page in question and left an explanation in defense of my multiple uses of the note, but I've had no reply): apparently I don't understand the problem. Can anyone help me out with this? Many thanks. Beebuk 09:39, 18 January 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Problem solved. Beebuk 14:17, 21 January 2016 (UTC)[reply]