Talk:Here's to Never Growing Up

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Cover "controversy"[edit]

The references in this section all point to blogs and twitter accounts. The only source I might think is "credible" is Perez Hilton, but only because I'm unsure if he's still considered a blogger or not (I haven't ever gone to his website), or a somewhat legitimate "journalist", since he continues to get somewhat meaningful interviews. Is there really a controversy at all outside random fans complaining on Twitter, etc?

Furthermore, am I the only one that is just now noticing that she looks nude? I'm pretty sure she's at least wearing a shirt (but with her constant hair color variatinos, who knows!). I don't want to cause a "controversy" here on Wiki, I was just pointing out that it didn't immediately look to me like she was nude, so it doesn't seem like a big deal, and no major sources (I haven't looked myself) are listed in the article. Thoughts? ~ [ Scott M. Howard ] ~ [ Talk ]:[ Contribs ] ~ 23:34, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think she's nude at all—and with that kind of overexposure that photoshoots seem to do these days, you can't see any details anyway. But the media is just being the media, and while I'm sure omg,yahoo isn't the best of sources, there're plenty of others to choose from, including Daily Mail, E! Online, msn.com, DigitalSpy, and half a dozen other websites I don't care to open. Is it a controversy? Not really. Is the media fapping to Lavigne's image (er, I mean, overreacting)? Definitely. Has Lavigne made a statement yet? I doubt she's hating the press. Not much we can do on our end, I don't think. – Kerαunoςcopia◁galaxies 00:12, 6 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Ah, ok. At least there are some real sources out there. So whatever. There's plenty worse art for other albums out there, and Avril Lavigne isn't a 16 year old wreaking havoc in malls with power wheels anymore, so what is the public supposed to expect? Ah, well. (Random off topic: What's with the hair? Is it a "flipped" image, or is she wearing extensions, cause having long hair myself, there's no way it grew back that fast) ~ [ Scott M. Howard ] ~ [ Talk ]:[ Contribs ] ~ 00:21, 6 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I told myself to not get too involved with this article and her fifth album article—just basic oversight. So that's why I haven't replaced some of the sillier (though reluctantly acceptable) sources with somewhat more reliable ones. I didn't even mean to resize the cover image, for example, but dammit if I didn't get a little excited. As for her hair—it looks like her part is simply higher on her head. You can see here her hair would flip back down fairly easily. Smart move on her part; and I'd quite forgotten about it. – Kerαunoςcopia◁galaxies 00:28, 6 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
By the way, in Part 2 of her Seacrest interview today, Lavigne does say she's partially nude... "or nude", I think she says. So she's aware of the press, but she did admit "partially nude" at first. – Kerαunoςcopia◁galaxies 02:51, 10 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Reception[edit]

Current article claims the song received positive reviews, but the Toronto Star claims it's receiving "mixed reviews".)(source) So which is it? Andrzejbanas (talk) 01:46, 10 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

That can be a sort of WP:OR quandary, I think. I would go with "mixed reviews" because the Toronto Star can be cited. Otherwise, it's original research. Editors should, in good faith, find reviews that span both positive and negative, unless an overwhelming number truly are positive. Avril Lavigne is music that the media either loves to love or loves to hate. So "mixed" makes more sense to me (and that, right there, is original research). – Kerαunoςcopia◁galaxies 02:49, 10 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]


Chart Performance[edit]

Can somebody please add the chart performance section on the page? I don't know why this page doesn't have one and its very common on other "song" pages. User:Smarty9108 (talk) 7:17, 17 May 2013 (UTC)

You mean this? Or am I missing something? o.O ~ [ Scott M. Howard ] ~ [ Talk ]:[ Contribs ] ~ 00:37, 18 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Usually, we put how it performed on the charts worldwide in a summary, for example; did it fall off from its high peak or did it rise to another position on the chart, here is a meek example, go look at the Chart Performance.User:Smarty9108 (talk) 11:15, 23 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Okay, I meant Commercial performance. User:Smarty9108 (talk) 1:40, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

Which one is the TRUE lead single[edit]

Based on these sources, "Here's to Never Growing Up" and "Rock N' Roll" were released as the first and second singles from the Avril Lavigne studio album:

"...her fifth album will also feature the singer's brand of bratty pop anthems, like audacious lead single "Here's to Never Growing Up" (1 million downloads sold) and the sneering follow-up "Rock N Roll."

Lipshutz, Jason (September 3, 2013). "Avril Lavigne, 'Avril Lavigne': Fall Music Preview 2013". Billboard. Prometheus Global Media. Retrieved October 11, 2013.

""Rock N Roll" is the second single from Lavigne's self-titled fifth studio album, due out this fall on Epic Records. Its predecessor, "Here's To Never Growing Up," has sold 1 million downloads since its release earlier this year, according to Nielsen SoundScan."

Lipshutz, Jason (August 20, 2013). "Avril Lavigne Battles Comic-Book Scum in 'Rock N Roll' Video: Watch". Billboard. Prometheus Global Media. Retrieved October 11, 2013.

"The single ("Here's To Never Growing Up") comes from her as-yet-untitled fifth album, which is expected to surface some time this summer. The single will be on iTunes on Tuesday, but it snuck onto the Internet a little early."

Anderson, Kyle (April 8, 2013). "Avril Lavigne releases new single 'Here's to Never Growing Up': Hear it here!". Entertainment Weekly. Time Inc. Retrieved October 11, 2013.

""Here's to Never Growing Up" is the first single off Lavigne's as-yet untitled and undated new album. The song is available on iTunes right now."

Rosen, Christopher (April 9, 2013). "Avril Lavigne's 'Here's To Never Growing Up': It's Complicated (AUDIO)". The Huffington Post. AOL Inc. Retrieved October 11, 2013.


YET these sources from "Let Me Go" claim that the song is the first single from the Avril Lavigne album:

"Chadvil are back with a new track, a somber duet titled 'Let Me Go'. Though the song is about heartbreak, Avril was very excited to release the song as the first single from her upcoming self-titled album."

"Avril Lavigne And Chad Kroeger Drop First Chavril Duet 'Let Me Go'". The Huffington Post. AOL Inc. October 8, 2013. Retrieved October 11, 2013.

"The singer and Nickleback star Chad Kroeger collaborate on a ballad called Let Me Go, the first single to be released from her self-titled album."

"Avril: Music gave me a husband". Yahoo!. October 9, 2013. Retrieved October 11, 2013.

"The singer and Nickleback star Chad Kroeger collaborate on a ballad called Let Me Go, the first single to be released from her self-titled album."

Levack, Chandler (October 7, 2013). "Listen To Avril Lavigne And Chad Kroeger Duet On New Song 'Let Me Go'". Entertainment Tonight. Canada: Shaw Media Inc. Retrieved October 11, 2013.


This article's title even says "Avril Lavigne Talks Upcoming Album As First Single, "Rock N Roll," Drops Today", even though its write up says:

"The album’s first single, "Here’s To Never Growing Up," debuted in April at #1 in 22 different countries, letting her know that she was still in demand by her fans. The album’s second single, "Rock N Roll," is available on iTunes today."

"Avril Lavigne Talks Upcoming Album As First Single, "Rock N Roll," Drops Today". WOMX-FM. Orlando, Florida: CBS Local Media. August 27, 2013. Retrieved October 11, 2013. {{cite web}}: Italic or bold markup not allowed in: |work= (help)


Case in point: Avril's fellow Epic Records artist Ciara released the singles "Sorry" and "Got Me Good" in 2012 as lead singles from her fifth studio album when the it was then titled One Woman Army. But then in 2013, she claimed that "Body Party" is the lead single from her fifth studio album which was now officially titled as Ciara. Both the songs "Sorry" and "Got Me Good" were nowhere to be found on the Ciara track listing, which makes them quite illegitimate as singles from Ciara. Same cannot be said for Avril's singles "Here's to Never Growing Up" and "Rock N' Roll", which were included in the Avril Lavigne track listing and were issued to promote the album. I feel like this is conflicting because every time Avril Lavigne is releasing a new single, it's always the lead single.


My question is: Are the singles "Here's to Never Growing Up" and "Rock N' Roll" similar to other singles such as "A Moment Like This" which were released on its own and were just included to an album? I feel like this needs to be discussed to avoid potential edit warring. Chihciboy (talk) 14:46, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

First of all let me say, Epic is a f mess! However, "Here's to Never Growing Up" and "Rock N Roll" are indeed the lead and the second single respectively. We have thousands of sources confirming that, + we have the release radio and digital download dates. There is no other need of confirmation. If they decide to remove them from the track listing, then they will be a separate singles, but not promo singles. — Tomíca(T2ME) 15:16, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
This is NOTHING like "A Moment Like This". It was recorded as her winning song on American Idol and was later remixed and included on her debut album. As for everything else, Tomica covered it. — Status (talk · contribs) 17:34, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

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