Talk:Joe Frazier

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Comment[edit]

Born and raised[edit]

I couldn't find any information on where he was born, grew up etc. Info on where he was born, Beaufort, South Carolina, and when he moved to Philadelphia should be added.

Dont ADD Rubish[edit]

There's all this stuff about Eddie Futch through the 1970's and Yhanzee Durham dieing in Frazier's early professional career section. This information should be interspersed through the article in the relevent areas. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.77.165.103 (talk) 00:56, 19 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

This paragraph in particular needs some work: (Joe's second contest was of interest in that he was decked in the first round. Mike Bruce in only his 5th contest himself had won 3 of his previous 4 - Ring Encyclopedia informs. He would go on to a long career. For information, by the close of 1970 Bruce had won only 7 of his 37 fights and 1 draw but he kept going. Bruce fought Jack O'halloran twice. Perhaps surprisingly, several other name fighters would later still battle with Bruce in the middle of their careers. Just shows that not everyone can be a world champion. But Mike Bruce at least decked a future world champ to be. Frazier here got a 3rd round stoppage.) Does anyone have a problem with condensing it and leaving in only what pertains to Frazier? It is an interesting fact, but I'm not sure it belongs here. Thanks Welby99 13:44, 28 September 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Welby99 (talk • contribs) Over the past few weeks, I have worked on this article to correct grammar and spelling issues, while keeping in mind some quotes may be from an autobiography, although quotation marks are lacking in some cases. At any rate, I have done my best to not change any of the original intent. With that in mind, I am going to leave the paragraph pertaining to Mike Bruce (referred to in my above question) as it is for a month or so, and if no one objects, then remove some of the content pertaining exclusively to Bruce. Does that sound reasonable to everyone? The facts relating to Mike Bruce are certainly interesting, but perhaps they belong in another place? If Mike Bruce doesn't warrant an article, maybe under boxing in general? I certainly think a great champion like Mr. Frazier deserves a well written article, such as Ali, Norton, Foreman and other boxers in Wikipedia, and towards that end I have worked to "clean" it up to the best of my limited ability. Help or thoughts anyone? Welby99 18:56, 5 October 2011 (UTC) 10/05/11 Removed some of the information that applied only to Mike Bruce, and added source. Welby99 22:05, 3 November 2011 (UTC) (BTW: Keep you chin up, it makes a better target! cheers) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Welby99 (talk • contribs) [reply]

minor fix[edit]

partially blind in one eye doesnt = he fought with partial sight

Acutally that's exactly what it means, partial = part of the whole = incomplete. Although partial sight might suggest he is more sight impaired than he was. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.77.165.103 (talk) 12:00, 18 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

No style?[edit]

theres nothing here talking about Joes style of boxing, he fought low with his head down much like the boxers did back in the 30's and 20's and before that. It was very different style and technique than what people were doing at the time.

Joe never beat a big puncher he couldn't duck; he finally had to fight the big fella, but futch and durham kept joe away from a lot of hard-hitting scamboogahs. People need to bear that in mind when saying he was a better man, or more courageous, than Ali

No, he wasn't. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.158.71.50 (talk) 00:41, 9 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

picture?[edit]

This article could use an image of Frazier. Neilc 21:55, 13 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Why is the picture from Joe Fraziers mugshot? He was arrested on suspicion of assult, his wife rang up the police claiming he hit her. The mugshot picture was taken later. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.141.60.219 (talk) 03:25, 16 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

this article is shit. no structure, no talk of anything worthwhile, no boxing discussion. This man is one of boxings greatest ever, the only man to every legitamately beat Ali. Surely he deserves a decent article.


Edited discussion of boxing match with mayor - this is an encyclopedia, not a gossip rag.

No this is wikipedia, a bias nonsense gossip webpage. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.77.165.103 (talk) 12:09, 18 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

two edits[edit]

Ali was not knocked down in the 11th round of the first fight, it was a slip and was ruled a slip by the referee. Frazier spent considerably more time in the hospital than Ali did after this fight; the article made it sound like it was the other way around. In both the first and third fights the winner spent more time in the hospital than the loser.

Yeah, right. As Ali eventually admitted, "I slipped over that left hook." Ali was in shape, he had several easy bouts prior to this to get in shape, and he was in his prime. Frazier beat him fair and square. Ali's constant cheap insults and teasing of Frazier will follow him to his grave.

Your response has nothing to do with the edits, and is a POV statement regardless. But, for the record, Ali was rarely fatigued after only 6 rounds of fighting... he was in Ali-Frazier I, and it wasn't because of anything Frazier did.-2/7/06

Yeh right, you mean the constant pressure that wore down most of Frazier's opponents had nothing to do with Ali being tired it just happened on it's own. As for hospital Joe Frazier spent time in hospital regularly because he had eye problems, diabetes and high blood pressure. The physical exertion of the match and Frazier's aforementioned constant pressure excacerbated his medical issues. It wasn't because Ali threw effective punches and Frazier was damaged. The media were also aware of this, before his bout with Joe Bugner Frazier was asked in the pre fight interview whether he was a well man because of his extended hospital visits. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.176.95.205 (talk) 04:06, 12 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Editing References?[edit]

I just wanted to change Fraizer to Frazier in a couple references, but when I try to edit that section, I see a virtually blank edit page. I guess it's "outsourced" to some other file, like CSS or something? tharsaile 17:42, 19 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

First paragraph[edit]

I'm considering to edit the following:

  • Frazier was known for a driving, relentless pursuit of opponents from all angles across the ring, using a chugging locomotion reminiscent of a train's advance up a hill. The contrast with Ali's dancing, non-linear style could not have been greater.

What does it mean? Is it referring to Fraziers forward bobbing and weaving fighting style compared to Ali's backward reflex-oriented style? Or his it referring to Fraziers relentless attack compared to Ali's pop and jab style? And I'm surprised there is no mention of his vicious left hook, which is considered one of the best in boxing history. Maya Levy 04:48, 25 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think it's a very cohesive sentence anyway. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.77.165.103 (talk) 12:08, 18 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Uncle Tom[edit]

Ali called Frazier an "Uncle Tom" in the buildup to the first fight, not the third fight.-2/17/07

Why is this not mentioned in the article? Ali's racist taunting of Frazier during the build-up to all three fights has cast a shadow over Frazier's entire boxing career. This article also fails to mention how Frazier helped Ali get his boxing licence back and gave him money before the fights. This is important (and undisputed) information which changes the whole tone of the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.177.142.138 (talk) 12:16, 12 November 2008 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.180.188.5 (talk) [reply]

First American Heavyweight to win an Olympic Gold Medal?[edit]

That must be news to Sam Berger, Ed Sanders and Pete Rademacher —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.7.223.111 (talk) 05:46, August 28, 2007 (UTC)

Ok, I fixed it. I rewrote the sentence to reflect that Joe Frazier was the first American boxer to win the Olympic gold medal in the heavyweight division and the world title in the heavyweight division. I believe that was the intent of the original author. --DreamsAreMadeOf 17:56, 28 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
That's correct. Many fans forget that Ali won his gold medal in 1960 as a light-heavyweight. --NameThatWorks 17:21, 19 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I think it should be added that Joe only went to the Olympics because Buster Mathis was injured and he was the only man in the American boxing team to win the gold. He also won the fight with a broken thumb that he kept hidden to avoid being disqualified. This was on the HBO special about Joe Frazier. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.77.165.103 (talk) 00:52, 19 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Box Like the Pros[edit]

Joe Frazier wrote a book called "Box Like the Pros" where should we mention this. The K.O. King (talk) 17:56, 2 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

In my opinion in de section "1990s to present." -- Iterator12n Talk 20:33, 2 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Too much about Ali in the introduction[edit]

The introduction makes it seem like Ali's taunts was Frazier's claim to fame--like half of the intro is on that! This article is about Joe Frazier and Ali's taunts doesn't show much about him. I am moving them to their own section for now just to get them out of the intro, but they should be interspersed throughout the article. Madridrealy (talk) 05:03, 24 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Frazier's losses[edit]

Must mention Frazier's 2 losses to Ali and 2 losses to George —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.199.102.218 (talk) 01:21, 8 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Check this fact[edit]

Frazier never spoke with Futch again.[3] Frazier was just on Stern, and when stern asked about the guy, Frazier didn't seem mad at him at all, and talked in a manner about him that really makes me question this. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.198.57.217 (talk) 03:04, 9 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

WTH??????????[edit]

Didn't Ali win the 14-round match, not Frazier????????? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Minimal man (talk • contribs) 01:42, 12 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Health[edit]

He reportedly has cancer per ESPN (http://espn.go.com/boxing/story/_/id/7193707/joe-frazier-former-heavyweight-champ-seriously-ill-cancer) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.215.82.73 (talk) 19:32, 5 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Frazier not dead (yet)[edit]

Apparently another "famous" Joe Frazier (the former manager of the New York Mets) passed away today... Who's the tool who pronounced Smokin' Joe dead without indicating a source for his information???Dukdukgoose (talk) 03:46, 7 November 2011 (UTC)dukdukgoose[reply]

That Joe Frazier died in February: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Frazier_(baseball) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.245.201.94 (talk) 04:38, 8 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

He died tonight (Monday Nov 8) - source is http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/08/sports/joe-frazier-ex-heavyweight-champ-dies-at-67.html --Txvoodoo (talk) 05:40, 8 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Error in the 60's section[edit]

In the section on the 1960's it says Frazier had 14 wins in Feb. 67 all by KO when the previous paragraph stated he had a tough decision win versus Bonavaro. The fight record reflects a decision as well. I have never edited and am not sure how, but could someone correct the discrepancy. Peegee626 (talk) 23:25, 7 November 2011 (UTC) I removed "all by KO" Welby99 15:22, 10 November 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Welby99 (talk • contribs) [reply]

Died[edit]

Just died a few minutes ago 24.114.229.1 (talk) 04:00, 8 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Too many "Joes" on the page[edit]

The are over 50 "Joes on the page where it should say "Frazier", especially in the "Early life", "Amateur career" and "Olympics" sections. Could a registered editor fix this, or unprotect the page and I'll do it! Regards, 220.101.30 talk\edits(aka 220.101) 09:43, 8 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The entire "early life" seems largely anecdotal and reads like something out of a biography (word by word). Most of it adds nothing encyclopedic, except perhaps the information on his arm injury. Who whipped who with a belt and what emotional state a former employer may or may not have been in it hardly relevant information. The Early Life segment can be easily cut in half.--Nwinther (talk) 15:29, 9 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The article claims Clay/Ali was "anti-war," but there's really nothing to suggest Ali was any student of international diplomacy or foreign affairs. It would be more accurate to state Ali resented being drafted along with millions of others and having to live on less than $100 per month when Ali had been used to living in luxury making millions to box. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.97.69.229 (talk) 01:42, 9 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

This article really needs work[edit]

The early life section provides a lot of information but it's not NPOV, even some of the general langauge used could be cleaned up, Frazier is a legend and his page should be up there with Ali's as in terms of it being neat. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kentpaulgta (talk • contribs) 01:08, 10 November 2011 (UTC) I agree. I have worked on the page cleaning up grammer,spelling etc. but have been uncomfortable in removing content. It would be nice if someone with more talent than me would do an entire rewrite. Welby99 15:26, 10 November 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Welby99 (talk • contribs) [reply]

Hospice/hospital[edit]

In the lead, it says he was admitted to "hospice care", but in the death section, it says he was admitted to "hospital care". These are not at all the same thing; can someone familiar with the sources correct the one that is in error? siafu (talk) 04:08, 10 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

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